UPS recommendation

[Andras Gaal]

While selecting the power supply for my setup, one of the vendors called my attention on the type of UPS. He mentioned I would need a true sine UPS. Now this got me wondered. What should I keep an eye on when selecting a UPS for powering Loxone components and a limited selection of my LED's (hooked up to a dedicated power supply)?

[Andrew B]

This is definitely an important consideration. I bought both my PSUs and UPS before realizing it was an issue. Fortunately, I got lucky. Meanwell told me that the PSU model I had chosen could handle modified square wave as long as it met a certain parameter (sorry, would need to dig up the details). My UPS, selected primarily for maximizing ampere-hours, met that requirement handily. The system has weathered a dozen outages over the past two years with no problems, even ones which drain the battery and result in the system losing power (about half an hour).

So, don’t do like me, check with your PSU maker for their requirements before buying your UPS!

[Rob_in]

Hi,

Why not go with a DC UPS like the Meanwell DR-UPS40?

We don't have one and I don't think we really need a UPS, but if we did... In our installation we have 1 x Meanwell 24v transformer driving the Miniserver, etc. and 2 x Meanwell 24v transformers driving the lighting. In this scenario I would much rather add 3 x DC UPS. This allows the battery capacity to be specified differently for Miniserver (ie. doesn't need much) and lighting.

YMMV but sounds like a better idea to me.

Robin

[Tico]

Another consideration is the ability to integrate UPS data into Loxone. The data port on the UPS plugs into a Loxberry that provides a data-stream to the Miniserver via UDP. There's a Loxberry Plugin that supports APC branded UPS. 

I'm using the feature to command a graceful shutdown of some household devices if the UPS is approaching exhaustion.

[Aaron]

May I ask what batteries are used with the Meanwell UPS mentioned please? Are they din mounted along side the PSU/UPS or separate from the cabinet?

Excuse my ignorance (I'm more software rather than hardware orientated) but could a 24v PSU be used to charge a large 24v battery which individual circuits are then run from; similar to a alternator continuously charging a car battery or the 24v version of a tesla power wall?

I'm currently running a APC UPS as have yet to build a cabinet and they prove cost effective but I'm looking for something more integrated for when I do.

cheers

Aaron

[Rob_in]

On Thursday, 19 July 2018 21:19:18 UTC+2, Aaron wrote:

May I ask what batteries are used with the Meanwell UPS mentioned please? Are they din mounted along side the PSU/UPS or separate from the cabinet?

From what I can tell, they were using standard SLA batteries in the demo I saw on YouTube. I guess compatibility details would be in the manual.

If I was going to install something like this would put the batteries in a nearby cabinet connected via some very heavy gauge wire (along the lines of what your car battery is connected with) to avoid voltage drops.

Robin

[RSinn]

I read somewhere that people use 2 car batteries in series. 12v+12v gives 24v.

[Jedi Tek'Unum]

Another option is one of the many products available from Altronix (look under "Power Supplies" category). They have enclosures and chargers (either 120VAC or 240VAC) for 24VDC (or 12VDC) at various current ratings. Enclosures can hold SLA batteries that are typically used in alarm panels (such as Power-Sonic). I recently looked at model AL400ULX for an alarm panel.

[Kops]

I am using Weidmueller's DC UPS 24V 20A/10A. It's one of the few that has independent circuits for main output and batteries, so that you can have exact 24VDC for Loxone, while the batteries are charging at ~27VDC. Works very well and the status can be read through 3 digital outputs. 

[cvdk]

What do you think about using Meanwell DRC-100B? I plan to use it but i am not sure about the capacity. Is 2.5A enough for miniserver, some extensions, wifi router and maybe electric door opener?
I would like 1 hour of no-break for theses.

[Aaron]

Presumably the length of run time is based upon the size of the batteries connected to the ups?

If it helps, I'm using a basic apc ups of 700VA and that happily runs my temporary loxone setup and adsl modem for over an hour. It's called into action several times a day thanks to some soon to be replaced 1950s wiring!

[Aaron]

There appears to be two preferences for ups.

1. Standalone UPS outside cabinet (APC) which supplies transformers in the cabinet at 230v.

2. Integrated with the 24v power supplies (meanwell / weidmüller) supplying either din rail or external batteries arranged at 24v.

Option 1 appears the simpler, especially if wanting ups over multiple 24v supplies but option 2 appears more efficient and potentially cheaper to achieve more ah/va using standard sla batteries. Presumably separate batteries and chargers would be needed for each circuit which gets a little messy.

If I've got this right, I'm leaning towards option 1 despite a preference for the flexibility of option 2. Have I misunderstood anything?

Cheers

[Tico]

One aspect you might consider is that some 230V appliances don’t have externally accessible transformers. My network switch, for example, only has a Mains plug. So the APC variant provides a bit more flexibility to back up the whole network.

230 to 12V for router,
230 to something for the switch,
230 to 24V for Miniserver
etc...

[DavidL]

Thats the same for me too.

I use one APC UPS to power Loxone, Virgin Media router, PoE switch for CCTV, a network hard drive, and various other network components.

Whichever route you take, a UPS is advisable to protect against surges, over voltages and under voltages. I'd say approximately 2-3 times a month my house supply goes under voltage to 0 volts for a number of seconds.

[Skarsol]

I use two Phoenix Step Power supplies (https://www.phoenixcontact.com/online/portal/us/?uri=pxc-oc-itemdetail:pid=2868677) feeding into a diode for redundancy (https://www.phoenixcontact.com/online/portal/us/?uri=pxc-oc-itemdetail:pid=2868606) feeding into a 24V UPS (https://www.phoenixcontact.com/online/portal/us?uri=pxc-oc-itemdetail:pid=2868703). Keeps everything contained in the cabinet.