I added a LooL section to my Wordpress site...
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Essobi
Jul 7, 2012, 3:30:20 AM7/7/12
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Ben Hibben
Jul 7, 2012, 9:32:44 AM7/7/12
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Very nice.
Question: What's the thinking behind keeping out for-profit individuals? Not that I'm planning on that myself, mind you (I charge for computer-related services, mostly programming, social media, etc.) but I'm not sure why that has to be a "no no" and I'm curious as to the reasoning.
Blenster
Question: What's the thinking behind keeping out for-profit individuals? Not that I'm planning on that myself, mind you (I charge for computer-related services, mostly programming, social media, etc.) but I'm not sure why that has to be a "no no" and I'm curious as to the reasoning.
Blenster
On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 3:30 AM, Essobi <ess...@gmail.com> wrote:
Code of Conduct is on here.. Read it, know it.
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Essobi
Jul 7, 2012, 11:14:05 AM7/7/12
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Oh they can be for profit... They shouldn't represent themselves solely as LooL member and nothing else in that case. The other locksports carry a rule as such it sounded reasonable to me. Non-profit is fine. Help a school, help a church...
Likely it's in the event that should the groups popularity grow wild (Lulz Ikr?) someone won't start a locksmith service with our name/logo plastered all over it.
Essobi
Essobi
joe
Jul 7, 2012, 11:19:55 AM7/7/12
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Neato ,
i see you like voip also , me too one skill that has improved my life an my friends an familly's screw ma bell :)
dosman
Jul 7, 2012, 12:14:05 PM7/7/12
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I can't speak for other groups, but I can speak for FOOLS. I'm not one for arbitrary rules myself, however this one has a reasonable purpose which sometimes isn't immediately obvious.
First, just knowing how to pick a lock doesn't make one a locksmith. If a beginner is unaware of what they are getting into they can cause damage and then the person they are "helping" has to hire a real locksmith to do the repair work. Albeit, 90% of the time this will not happen, but eventually you WILL break a lock by picking or manipulating it. It's knowing how to recover after that happens that counts.
Second, some states have laws where doing for-profit locksmithing without being licensed or working for a licensed company is a criminal act (this is separate from the issue of possession of picks being illegal). The idea is to protect the public from sloppy/faulty workmanship, however the side effect is it justifies ALOA staying in business and being the top dog in locksmithing associations (it looks like they penned most of the laws which are in effect in the US).
Third, this type of rule will protect members from accidentally "helping" a real criminal. It's easy to get caught up in the thought of helping a stranger get back into their car or house and forget to check if they really should be getting this access. In addition, occasionally at LPvillages at various hacker cons you will get people asking for help getting back into their cars and the like. Just don't take the chance, refer them to a real locksmith. All of the above reasons could happen to you, leaving you in a mess having to explain to the authority what happened, or worse.
Of course, you can help your friends and family out and there's nothing wrong with that (sometimes called the six-pack lockout). If you know you can trust them then it's cool (both that they need access and that they won't sue you if you break something).
I hope this helps.
-dosman
First, just knowing how to pick a lock doesn't make one a locksmith. If a beginner is unaware of what they are getting into they can cause damage and then the person they are "helping" has to hire a real locksmith to do the repair work. Albeit, 90% of the time this will not happen, but eventually you WILL break a lock by picking or manipulating it. It's knowing how to recover after that happens that counts.
Second, some states have laws where doing for-profit locksmithing without being licensed or working for a licensed company is a criminal act (this is separate from the issue of possession of picks being illegal). The idea is to protect the public from sloppy/faulty workmanship, however the side effect is it justifies ALOA staying in business and being the top dog in locksmithing associations (it looks like they penned most of the laws which are in effect in the US).
Third, this type of rule will protect members from accidentally "helping" a real criminal. It's easy to get caught up in the thought of helping a stranger get back into their car or house and forget to check if they really should be getting this access. In addition, occasionally at LPvillages at various hacker cons you will get people asking for help getting back into their cars and the like. Just don't take the chance, refer them to a real locksmith. All of the above reasons could happen to you, leaving you in a mess having to explain to the authority what happened, or worse.
Of course, you can help your friends and family out and there's nothing wrong with that (sometimes called the six-pack lockout). If you know you can trust them then it's cool (both that they need access and that they won't sue you if you break something).
I hope this helps.
-dosman
joe
Jul 7, 2012, 1:24:09 PM7/7/12
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yeah , personally allways been worried to show someone any of this stuff even though i like to learn ive never really shown anyone , makes me worry they may do something they shouldnt then blame me for teaching them or someone else blame me ,, :(
On the not breaking locks i agree also when ive used any of my picking tools it was so i could then replace the lock with a new lock after i opened it .
in the alarm biz very rarely did i come across some lock that was either to arm/disarm or id need to gain access to its old panels but on those occasions id have replacement locks or complete systems .
On the not breaking locks i agree also when ive used any of my picking tools it was so i could then replace the lock with a new lock after i opened it .
in the alarm biz very rarely did i come across some lock that was either to arm/disarm or id need to gain access to its old panels but on those occasions id have replacement locks or complete systems .
Essobi
Jul 7, 2012, 2:16:46 PM7/7/12
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Heh.. It's ultimately saying you and you alone are responsible for your actions. You break it, you buy it. :D
Essobi
Essobi
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Ben Hibben
Jul 7, 2012, 11:18:56 PM7/7/12
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I just didn't want it to exclude anyone who's a professional locksmith from joining... :-) I figure they can teach a lot.
Blenster
Blenster
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