Designing and making products

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phil jones

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Jan 20, 2012, 9:24:37 PM1/20/12
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I know some people around the hackspace (Martin Klang, the drone
people) have had circuit-boards and other products made by commercial
manufacturers.

This is something I'd like to know more about, and I'm wondering if
there's a group of people here who'd like to take something from
conception / design to production. I have a couple of ideas, but I'm
not so focused on a particular thing at this point as I am in
accompanying a process and sharing the cost of the learning exercise
with a couple of similarly minded people.

Anyone else interested?

phil

Martin Klang

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Jan 21, 2012, 9:40:28 AM1/21/12
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I have a couple of designs on the drawing board, and used a few different fab houses in the past.
Happy to share what I know.

I'm also interested in figuring out what we can do as a group to make it easier and cheaper for us to get boards done.
Some sort of order pooling, bulk discount or panelling should be possible to arrange.

Meanwhile, have a look at seeedstudio's [1] offers (HK) and search eBay for Spirit Electronics (UK), to see if you find anything that suits.

/m

[1] http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/fusion-pcb-service-p-835.html

Martin Klang

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Jan 21, 2012, 9:35:41 AM1/21/12
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I have a couple of designs on the drawing board, and used a few different fab houses in the past.
Happy to share what I know.

I'm also interested in figuring out what we can do as a group to make it easier and cheaper for us to get boards done.
Some sort of order pooling, bulk discount or panelling should be possible to arrange.

Meanwhile, have a look at seeedstudio's [1] offers (HK) and search eBay for Spirit Electronics (UK), to see if you find anything that suits.

/m

[1] http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/fusion-pcb-service-p-835.html

On 21 Jan 2012, at 02:24, phil jones wrote:

Sci

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Jan 21, 2012, 12:18:32 PM1/21/12
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I'm interested. I'm already self-employed, a few of my recent ideas
involve electronics and would probably be greatly improved by learning
about the commercial manufacture services available. Most of my current
stuff has been casting & crafting related.

Sci

Nigel Worsley

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Jan 21, 2012, 12:27:31 PM1/21/12
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> have a look at seeedstudio's [1] offers (HK) and search eBay for Spirit Electronics (UK

Spirit stopped doing their cheap boards through ebay a while back, their standard service is now
way too expensive to be worth considering.

Most cheap PCB manufacrurers won't let you pannelise multiple designs, so pooling projects is
unlikely to be feasible. For small production run quantities these people look worth a try:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/250408720546?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649
I haven't used them yet, so no idea what the quality is like.

For work stuff I have used www.pcbcart.com a fair bit, very nice quality and no extras charge for gold plated
finish, which can be handy if some of the boards aren't going to be soldered up for a few months (or years!).

Unless you are doing surface mount with screened solder paste and using all the boards immediately after opening
the sealed pack then avoid silver plated boards, they tarnish almost instantly and are a pig to hand solder. I hate
them!

Nigle

Mike Harrison

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Jan 21, 2012, 12:34:40 PM1/21/12
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On Sat, 21 Jan 2012 17:27:31 -0000, you wrote:

>> have a look at seeedstudio's [1] offers (HK) and search eBay for Spirit Electronics (UK
>
>Spirit stopped doing their cheap boards through ebay a while back, their standard service is now
>way too expensive to be worth considering.

Spirit's cheap service was taken over by a company run by their MD's daughter :
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/stickleback_manufacturing/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686


Billy

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Jan 21, 2012, 1:26:34 PM1/21/12
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Try asking Ken Boak.

He's been getting quotes from different manufacturers for the Nanodes,
so his knowledge is the most current i can think of...
> Spirit's cheap service was taken over by a company run by their MD's daughter :http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/stickleback_manufacturing/m.html?_nkw=&_arm...

Tim Burrell-Saward

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Jan 21, 2012, 1:48:22 PM1/21/12
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Hi guys,

I'm a three-dimensional designer (BSc Product Design) and am more than
happy to help out with the physical design end of things (3D
modelling, prototyping, materials, manufacture, etc).

This is me: www.timburrellsaward.com

Tim

Roowilliams

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Jan 21, 2012, 5:31:22 PM1/21/12
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I too am interested in this - currently snowed under in my third year
of BA Product Design at Central Saint Martins, but when I have some
free time.

Tim - like the look of the projects on your site, would be good to
meet at some point!

I am blogging updates on my current project now, there's quite an
ambiguous description of it scattered between a few posts, but there
will be a proper write up when the project has materialised.

http://www.roowilliams.com

- Andrew

On Jan 21, 1:48 pm, Tim Burrell-Saward <t...@timburrellsaward.com>
wrote:

Tim Burrell-Saward

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Jan 23, 2012, 4:59:47 AM1/23/12
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Hi Andrew,

Thanks a lot. Am always up for a pint. Keep meaning to show my face at
more social nights, but damn work always gets in the way :(

phil jones

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Jan 23, 2012, 8:37:38 AM1/23/12
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Thanks for the replies.

Is there enough interest here for a meetup at the space one evening /
weekend to talk further?

phil

On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 9:59 AM, Tim Burrell-Saward

matthew venn

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Jan 23, 2012, 5:56:32 PM1/23/12
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I've had good, cheap results from stickleback on a number of
occasions.

On Jan 21, 5:34 pm, Mike Harrison <m...@whitewing.co.uk> wrote:
> Spirit's cheap service was taken over by a company run by their MD's daughter :http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/stickleback_manufacturing/m.html?_nkw=&_arm...

Jakob

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Jan 23, 2012, 6:10:30 PM1/23/12
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Hi all,

I am hanging around in hack-space from time to time. I am trained as a
designer (industrial design /design thinking), I am currently setting
up small scale production on some things I designed/invented www.jakobuhlin.com
is a place I show some things I worked on :)
I have experience from a broad field of design and will be happy to
discuss collaborations, freelance contract or just give some feedback
if anyone wants to take things further.

Jakob

Yuan

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Jan 24, 2012, 9:16:52 AM1/24/12
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I'd be happy to chat about how we took our drones from concept to
product if you bump into me at some point, I'm not based in London so
it is often difficult for me to come to the space for a meeting, but
if I'm in the area t the time your meeting is on, I'd be glad to drop
by. I'd definitely also like to hear other people's experiences on
manufacturing as well, we're doing what we've learned through trial
and error, and it would be nice to see if other people have found the
same experiences, and if there are other lessons to be learned.

Yuan

Charles Yarnold

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Jan 24, 2012, 7:44:38 PM1/24/12
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Is there still interest in doing this at the hackspace? I see there is now a meetup going on ouside of this thread, would be fab to one one at the space too.

Sol

phil jones

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Jan 24, 2012, 10:37:41 PM1/24/12
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Charles.

If you're referring to the Future Manufacturing meetup in London which
I'm also organising, I see the two as slightly different although
there are obvious overlaps in interest and attendees. FM is a more
general networking event to bring designers and artists together with
people running 3D printers, laser cutters, cnc-machines and maybe even
real engineering companies in London.

I'd love to bring some of those people to the hackspace too at some
point if such a thing would be welcome. (Of course, some are already
members here.)

With this thread I was looking to explore something slightly
different. Starting a group inside the hackspace to share experience
and experiments with having electronic designs fabricated by third
parties. And learning more about product design in general.

phil

Steve M0BPQ

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Jan 24, 2012, 5:45:19 PM1/24/12
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Hi Folks,

New to the list this evening so hope no-one minds me leaping in.

I have used http://www.farcircuits.net/ quite a lot to produce custom
PCBs. Cheap and cheerful, providing you don't anything multi-layered
or thru hole plated.

Cheers
Steve

Charles Yarnold

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Jan 25, 2012, 6:57:38 AM1/25/12
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Ah great, I couldn't find much info on the meetup (mostly down to meetup confusing me in general) so wasn't sure if this meant this was the event you had talked about, thanks for clearing that up!

I would love to see this meeting happen, so I have added a doodle here:http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgk to see what night it would be best to hold a meeting next week.

Sol

phil jones

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Jan 25, 2012, 7:14:42 AM1/25/12
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Thanks Charles.

Cool. Added to the Doodle.

phil

rob farr

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Jan 30, 2012, 6:56:57 AM1/30/12
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Hi,

I'm been making my own lighting designs over the last few months and would be really interested in meeting up to learn more about product design, can you let me know when you'll be meeting up please?

Cheers,

Rob 

Tim Burrell-Saward

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Jan 30, 2012, 10:43:24 AM1/30/12
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Hi Rob,

I worked in lighting design for five years so am happy to help if I
can.

Everyone - How do dates for these kinds of things usually get
suggested? I might be free tomorrow night and it would be great to
meet some people if anyone's planning to go to the social night?

Tim

On Jan 30, 11:56 am, rob farr <rob.far...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'm been making my own lighting designs over the last few months and would
> be really interested in meeting up to learn more about product design, can
> you let me know when you'll be meeting up please?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rob
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 12:14 PM, phil jones <inters...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks Charles.
>
> > Cool. Added to the Doodle.
>
> > phil
>
> > On 25 January 2012 11:57, Charles Yarnold <charlesyarn...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > Ah great, I couldn't find much info on the meetup (mostly down to meetup
> > > confusing me in general) so wasn't sure if this meant this was the event
> > you
> > > had talked about, thanks for clearing that up!
>
> > > I would love to see this meeting happen, so I have added a doodle
> > > here:http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgkto see what night it would
> > be
> > > best to hold a meeting next week.
>
> > > Sol
>
> > > On 25 January 2012 03:37, phil jones <inters...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > >> Charles.
>
> > >> If you're referring to the Future Manufacturing meetup in London which
> > >> I'm also organising, I see the two as slightly different although
> > >> there are obvious overlaps in interest and attendees. FM is a more
> > >> general networking event to bring designers and artists together with
> > >> people running 3D printers, laser cutters, cnc-machines and maybe even
> > >> real engineering companies in London.
>
> > >> I'd love to bring some of those people to the hackspace too at some
> > >> point if such a thing would be welcome. (Of course, some are already
> > >> members here.)
>
> > >> With this thread I was looking to explore something slightly
> > >> different. Starting a group inside the hackspace to share experience
> > >> and experiments with having electronic designs fabricated by third
> > >> parties. And learning more about product design in general.
>
> > >> phil
>
> > >> On 25 January 2012 00:44, Charles Yarnold <charlesyarn...@gmail.com>

phil jones

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Jan 30, 2012, 10:52:42 AM1/30/12
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We normally use a Doodle to decide this :
http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgk

I suggest Wednesday evening. (I can't do tomorrow). Billy and
Selexious seem up for that too.

What does everyone else reckon?

phil

ps : I intended to do music hackspace on Thursday. But if there's
nothing specific planned there I could do this then too.

Charles Yarnold

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Jan 30, 2012, 11:50:25 AM1/30/12
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How about Wednesday at 7? Won't clash with the mind hackers this week.

Sol

Matt Peperell

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Jan 30, 2012, 11:54:36 AM1/30/12
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T'is what the poll says. +1 from me.

--
Regards,

Matt Peperell
Tel: +44 (0) 7951 092 890
Skype: mattpep

Ken Boak

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Jan 30, 2012, 11:59:55 AM1/30/12
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Spirit abandoned their cheap service - but the MD's daughter (@Stickleback_UK on Twit) offers a good low cost pcb service for 2 layers PTH provided that you don't want less than an 0.6mm hole size and an 0.2mm wide track or feature.

She's also drumming for business - judging from her tweets

If you want 500 boards or more done - I have a god friend in China that does them for me.


Ken

phil jones

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Jan 30, 2012, 1:35:17 PM1/30/12
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Ken. Friends who are gods are always useful :-)

7pm Wednesday works for me. Let's do it.

See you all then.

phil

Ken Boak

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Jan 30, 2012, 1:39:57 PM1/30/12
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And friends who can't type without accidental comic effect?

What's on Wednesday - I am at monkigras


Ken

phil jones

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Jan 30, 2012, 3:34:09 PM1/30/12
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Exactly. Cheap joke, but it made me laugh for about 30 seconds.

Wednesday is going to be a get together for hackspacers interested in
getting things made. Knowledge sharing, potential collaboration
discussions etc.

phil

Tim Burrell-Saward

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Jan 31, 2012, 3:53:16 AM1/31/12
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I can do tomorrow at 7pm. Looking forward to meeting you all.

Tim

On Jan 30, 4:59 pm, Ken Boak <ken.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Spirit abandoned their cheap service - but the MD's daughter
> (@Stickleback_UK on Twit) offers a good low cost pcb service for 2 layers
> PTH provided that you don't want less than an 0.6mm hole size and an 0.2mm
> wide track or feature.
>
> She's also drumming for business - judging from her tweets
>
> If you want 500 boards or more done - I have a god friend in China that
> does them for me.
>
> Ken
>
> On 21 January 2012 17:34, Mike Harrison <m...@whitewing.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sat, 21 Jan 2012 17:27:31 -0000, you wrote:
>
> > >> have a look at seeedstudio's [1] offers (HK) and search eBay for Spirit
> > Electronics (UK
>
> > >Spirit stopped doing their cheap boards through ebay a while back, their
> > standard service is now
> > >way too expensive to be worth considering.
>
> > Spirit's cheap service was taken over by a company run by their MD's
> > daughter :
>
> >http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/stickleback_manufacturing/m.html?_nkw=&_arm...

Roowilliams

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Jan 31, 2012, 6:30:04 AM1/31/12
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I have my presentation on my final project on Thursday so I'll come
for a couple of hours. It would be helpful if maybe I could try
explaining my project to you guys as it is a self-initiated project I
have designed and built over the past 7 months. In a nutshell it is a
product designed for the home-working creative entrepreneur; a
productivity companion that uses flow principles and gamification
techniques to develop the users motivation and concentration.

On Jan 30, 4:50 pm, Charles Yarnold <charlesyarn...@gmail.com> wrote:
> How about Wednesday at 7? Won't clash with the mind hackers this week.
>
> Sol
> > >> > > here:http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgktosee what night it

Charles Yarnold

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Feb 1, 2012, 9:30:16 AM2/1/12
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Sadly i'm down for the count with a bug so sadly won't be able to make it to the space tonight :(

phil jones

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Feb 1, 2012, 9:33:51 AM2/1/12
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OK. Who's definitely going to be at the space tonight (7pm)?

phil

Matt Peperell

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Feb 1, 2012, 12:38:16 PM2/1/12
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I shall be.

Roowilliams

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Feb 1, 2012, 12:39:45 PM2/1/12
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Moi.

On Feb 1, 2:33 pm, phil jones <inters...@gmail.com> wrote:
> OK. Who's definitely going to be at the space tonight (7pm)?
>
> phil
>
> On 1 February 2012 14:30, Charles Yarnold <charlesyarn...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Sadly i'm down for the count with a bug so sadly won't be able to make it to
> > the space tonight :(
>
> >> > > >> > > here:http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgktoseewhat night it

Roowilliams

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Feb 1, 2012, 12:40:04 PM2/1/12
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Possible +1 too
> > >> > > >> > > here:http://www.doodle.com/g3zeb7tc46n33kgktoseewhatnight it

rob farr

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Feb 1, 2012, 12:45:58 PM2/1/12
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moi aussi

Tim Burrell-Saward

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Feb 1, 2012, 1:01:47 PM2/1/12
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Yup, will be there for 7ish.

Tim

On Feb 1, 5:45 pm, rob farr <rob.far...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> moi aussi
>

Martin Klang

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Feb 1, 2012, 1:01:58 PM2/1/12
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me.

phil jones

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Feb 1, 2012, 2:08:55 PM2/1/12
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I'm here now drinking coffee in the main room and showing my
furniture-making friend around. Who else is here?

phil

Martin Klang

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Feb 1, 2012, 2:37:33 PM2/1/12
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we're meeting upstairs in unit 30!

/m

Billy

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Feb 2, 2012, 1:58:18 AM2/2/12
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Sorry i couldn't make it in early enough to catch this.

How did it go?

phil jones

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Feb 2, 2012, 8:18:54 AM2/2/12
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Hi Billy,

shame you couldn't make it. Yes, it was pretty good, I thought. A
wider range of interests and experience than I expected, including
some professional industrial product designers which was good.

Everyone,

I made a wiki page :
http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Product_Design_And_Manufacturing
so we can start sharing information and contacts.

What about next meeting on Wed 15th Feb?

phil

phil jones

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Feb 2, 2012, 9:11:58 AM2/2/12
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BTW : here's my entry for the crowdsourced ideas / voted making part
of SeeedStudios : http://www.seeedstudio.com/wish/?p=1054

phil

Roowilliams

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Feb 2, 2012, 9:37:16 AM2/2/12
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Very enjoyable - definitely something I will look forward to to every
fortnight.

For those who knew - my presentation went well. I managed to get it
down to 14:30 (turned out we had 15 minutes!) and told the whole story
and showed the working prototype. It didn't work at first... something
along the lines of 'and then it will raise it's head like *this*'
*nothing... tumbleweed as I fumbled trying to get it working, a wire
had popped out of the pins. Eventually got it there and at the end of
the presentation, although they aren't allowed to give anything away
as I was being shown out the tutor said 'I need to talk to you, not
now, but soon - I REALLY like this' which was an amazing
boost. :D :D :D

Thanks again for putting up with me and thanks for the feedbaack,
Phil: I made a point of covering the internalisation of extrinsic
motivation which sealed the gaping hole in the story so thank you.

Look forward to meeting next week

- Roo

On Feb 2, 1:18 pm, phil jones <inters...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Billy,
>
> shame you couldn't make it. Yes, it was pretty good, I thought. A
> wider range of interests and experience than I expected, including
> some professional industrial product designers which was good.
>
> Everyone,
>
> I made a wiki page :http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Product_Design_And_Manufactu...

Roowilliams

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Feb 2, 2012, 9:37:40 AM2/2/12
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In the next two weeks**

phil jones

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Feb 2, 2012, 9:45:26 AM2/2/12
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Roo,

great! Glad it went well. Look forward to seeing cute security dogs on
people's desktops soon. :-)

Though they need to be made to understand that pacing around the room
talking to myself IS work, damnit!

phil

rob farr

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Feb 2, 2012, 2:15:01 PM2/2/12
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Good news Roo, sounds really promising.

it was good to meet everyone last night, look forward to the next meeting

Rob
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