A Foundation for the promotion of Computer Science in education

[Sam Cook]

Thought this[1] might be relevant to our interests: Dr Sue Black is setting up the <goto> foundation with the aim of promoting computer science. 

There's not tons of information just yet (I think it's being officially launched soon) I was wondering if this is something that the 'space might want to consider working with semi-officially? 

Anyway more information at the link and it certainly looks interesting. 

S

[1] drblack.posterous.com/the-foundation

[tom]

hey this sounds interesting, have you contacted them at all?

On Nov 30, 6:11 pm, Sam Cook <sam.lindenrat...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thought this <http://drblack.posterous.com/the-foundation>[1] might be

[Sam Cook]

I left a message on the blog (about 10 minutes ago) suggesting that she/they contact us. It certainly looks relevant to many of our interests/activities (eg young hackspace etc) I'll keep an eye on what's happening with it. 

As I said I don't think it's been officially launched yet and it seems that they're mainly after cash/advice at the moment but hopefully we'll be able to input some advice at least. 

S

[Yuan]

Her email address is on her Google+ page which is accessible from the
blog's homepage should you want to contact her directly; I've just
sent her an email letting her know that my company (Universal Air
Ltd.) would like to support her foundation.

[giagia]

I know Sue. I sent her a link to this thread (Hi, Sue!)... I think
it's a brilliant idea. And also know that there's a lot of goodwill
floating around that will help it succeed.

Also, I know Maggie Philbin (oooo! Look at me...) who runs Tech Teen
http://www.teentechevent.com/ I've got a meeting with Maggie next week
to talk about Tech Teen stuff. Have a look at the site and if you have
any thoughts or want to get involved in anyway, send me an email and
I'll pass it onto Maggie. I rather like the idea of TechTeen getting a
bit "dirtier" - less shiny, corporate, clean, happy tech and more...
'hacking is the new rock n roll'... and won't be satisfied until there
is a live hacking stage show that sells out the Hammersmith Apollo...
or something.

-g

[Sue Black]

Hi Gia, Hi all,

Thanks Gia for bringing me here and thanks so much everyone for your
support for <goto> I'm so glad you like the idea :))

I would really love to come and talk to you, find out more about what
you do and get any advice feedback that you might have on what I'm
doing and how we can work together.

Could I come down next week sometime and see you all?

Sue

On Dec 1, 8:35 am, giagia <gia...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know Sue. I sent her a link to this thread (Hi, Sue!)... I think
> it's a brilliant idea. And also know that there's a lot of goodwill
> floating around that will help it succeed.
>

> Also, I know Maggie Philbin (oooo! Look at me...) who runs Tech Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I've got a meeting with Maggie next week

[Will Pearson]

Hi Sue,

I'm guessing the best bet would be to come in on Tuesday evening. It
will be tricky to have a large scale discussion (it is our normal
social evening), but you can at least meet some people and perhaps get
some on-line collaboration venues set up.

Will

On Dec 1, 12:22 pm, Sue Black <suebl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Gia, Hi all,
>
> Thanks Gia for bringing me here and thanks so much everyone for your
> support for <goto> I'm so glad you like the idea :))
>
> I would really love to come and talk to you, find out more about what
> you do and get any advice feedback that you might have on what I'm
> doing and how we can work together.
>
> Could I come down next week sometime and see you all?
>
> Sue
>
> On Dec 1, 8:35 am, giagia <gia...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > I know Sue. I sent her a link to this thread (Hi, Sue!)... I think
> > it's a brilliant idea. And also know that there's a lot of goodwill
> > floating around that will help it succeed.
>

> > Also, I know Maggie Philbin (oooo! Look at me...) who runs Tech Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegot a meeting with Maggie next week

[tom]

plus theres pizza. Sometimes

On Dec 1, 1:12 pm, Will Pearson <wil.pear...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Sue,
>
> I'm guessing the best bet would be to come in on Tuesday evening. It
> will be tricky to have a large scale discussion (it is our normal
> social evening), but you can at least meet some people and perhaps get
> some on-line collaboration venues set up.
>
>   Will
>
> On Dec 1, 12:22 pm, Sue Black <suebl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi Gia, Hi all,
>
> > Thanks Gia for bringing me here and thanks so much everyone for your
> > support for <goto> I'm so glad you like the idea :))
>
> > I would really love to come and talk to you, find out more about what
> > you do and get any advice feedback that you might have on what I'm
> > doing and how we can work together.
>
> > Could I come down next week sometime and see you all?
>
> > Sue
>
> > On Dec 1, 8:35 am, giagia <gia...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I know Sue. I sent her a link to this thread (Hi, Sue!)... I think
> > > it's a brilliant idea. And also know that there's a lot of goodwill
> > > floating around that will help it succeed.
>

> > > Also, I know Maggie Philbin (oooo! Look at me...) who runs Tech Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegota meeting with Maggie next week

[Sam Cook]

Hi Sue, 

As Will say Tuesdays are best but there are normally a few people kicking around everyday. 

If you want to specifically organise a meet and chat feel free to start a new thread on this list and something can be sorted out. It's probably a good idea to check out the wiki (try our 'GettingStarted' page[1]) which should give you a good idea how we operate. 

Hope this helps

S

[1] http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Guides/GettingStarted

[tom]

If we do organise a meeting then can we make sure its a weekend or
evening for maximum accessibility for those of us that work? :)

On Dec 2, 11:32 am, Sam Cook <sam.lindenrat...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Sue,
>
> As Will say Tuesdays are best but there are normally a few people kicking
> around everyday.
>
> If you want to specifically organise a meet and chat feel free to start a
> new thread on this list and something can be sorted out. It's probably a
> good idea to check out the wiki (try our 'GettingStarted'

> page<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Guides/GettingStarted>[1])

> which should give you a good idea how we operate.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> S
>
> [1]http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Guides/GettingStarted
>

> On 1 December 2011 12:22, Sue Black <suebl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi Gia, Hi all,
>
> > Thanks Gia for bringing me here and thanks so much everyone for your
> > support for <goto> I'm so glad you like the idea :))
>
> > I would really love to come and talk to you, find out more about what
> > you do and get any advice feedback that you might have on what I'm
> > doing and how we can work together.
>
> > Could I come down next week sometime and see you all?
>
> > Sue
>
> > On Dec 1, 8:35 am, giagia <gia...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I know Sue. I sent her a link to this thread (Hi, Sue!)... I think
> > > it's a brilliant idea. And also know that there's a lot of goodwill
> > > floating around that will help it succeed.
>
> > > Also, I know Maggie Philbin (oooo! Look at me...) who runs Tech

> > Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegot a meeting with Maggie next week

[Tim Storey]

+1 to that

[Sue Black]

Hi all,

Thanks for that :))

Would it be possible to have an event that kids could come to on a Saturday afternoon for example?

Sue

--
Dr Sue Black

http://about.me/sueblack

[Billy]

Yes, we've done this before.

http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Project:Young_Hackspace

This was organised for a group of Home-Educating families, as well as
anyone else with munchkins that wanted to come by.

Contact Martin Dittus, and he'll be able to tell you about the
practicalities of running this sort of event in the hackspace.

On Dec 2, 5:39 pm, Sue Black <suebl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Thanks for that :))
>
> Would it be possible to have an event that kids could come to on a Saturday
> afternoon for example?
>
> Sue
>

> > >>> Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegota meeting with Maggie next

[Sue Black]

Thanks, sounds good. How do I contact Martin?

Sue

[Martin Dittus]

I'm here.

*waves*

m.

[tom]

we succesfully attached a serial connection to the roomba last night.
First plan: Getting it hooked up to some sort of Logo-like system :)

> > > > >>> Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegotameeting with Maggie next

[Benjamin Blundell]

Its funny really. We had a set of drawing robots at CSM that use the
propellor stuff. I've been asked to make it better! Seems that good
logo/turtle bots are in demand! :)

On 4 December 2011 15:04, Ben Blundell <o...@section9.co.uk> wrote:
> Its funny really. We had a set of drawing robots at CSM that use the
> propellor stuff. I've been asked to make it better! Seems that good
> logo/turtle bots are in demand! :)
>
> Ben

> --
> --
> (>) SECTION9 * Benjamin Blundell * Digital Creative * London Hackspace * Hoxton
> (>) o...@section9.co.uk * www.section9.co.uk
> (>) www.twitter.com/secti0n9 * http://vimeo.com/channels/section9

--
--
(>) SECTION9 * Benjamin Blundell * Digital Creative * London & Manchester
(>) o...@section9.co.uk * www.section9.co.uk
(>) www.twitter.com/secti0n9 * www.flickr.com/photos/section9

[Dr Sue Black]

Hi Martin! :))

Would you be up for organising a family hackday?

Sue

Apologies for typos etc. sent from my iPhone

--
Dr Sue Black

http://about.me/sueblack

[Martin Dittus]

Hey.

Yeah sure, let's talk. I'm busier than I was earlier this year, but happy to see where I can help out, and happy to help you get connected to others.

Are you coming on Tuesday? I'll be there from 7pm.

m.

[Jonty Wareing]

Just had this shoved at me, thought it might be relevant to the ongoing
conversation:

http://www.simpl.co/interactivism/YP

I won't be present on Tuesday night, but the <goto> cause is close to my
heart and I'd love to be involved.

--jonty

[tom]

Ditto! the one thing i enjoyed from the last Young Hackspace was being
pitched questions about things that made me think. Having to explain
why a digital camera cant take Vector formatted pictures tested my
brain :D

Do you think we could build a simple CPU but with each role (ALU,
cache, registers etc) being filled by a person? It'd be need to show
how a number of simple processes can lead to some amazing complexity.
Even if were just using it to add 2 numbers together it'd be a more
interesting demo than looking at a byte-adder built out of some fairly
anonymous components

On Dec 5, 11:25 am, Jonty Wareing <jo...@jonty.co.uk> wrote:
> Just had this shoved at me, thought it might be relevant to the ongoing
> conversation:
>
> http://www.simpl.co/interactivism/YP
>
> I won't be present on Tuesday night, but the <goto> cause is close to my
> heart and I'd love to be involved.
>
> --jonty
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Dec 04, 2011 at 09:26:49PM +0000, Martin Dittus wrote:
> > Hey.
>
> > Yeah sure, let's talk. I'm busier than I was earlier this year, but happy to see where I can help out, and happy to help you get connected to others.
>
> > Are you coming on Tuesday? I'll be there from 7pm.
>
> > m.
>
> > On 4 Dec 2011, at 17:23, Dr Sue Black wrote:
>
> > > Hi Martin! :))
>
> > > Would you be up for organising a family hackday?
>
> > > Sue
>
> > > Apologies for typos etc. sent from my iPhone
>
> > > --
> > > Dr Sue Black
>
> > >http://about.me/sueblack
>

> > >>>>>>>> Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegotameeting with Maggie next

[Sam Cook]

I don't know it depends how you build the adder - mechanical ones can be really interesting. I know Antonio(Olfin) has a mechanical counter implemented in Little big planet - we could easily make a mechanical version of it. Could be fun to make some simple systems that can be plugged together. 

S

[Benjamin Blundell]

Trying to teach programming to artists at CSM has been a similar
challenge. A few students were really involved with our turtle robots,
the ones parallax sell but the barrier is pretty high and language is
limiting which put a few people off I think. In addition, I've had
students who are dyslexic and have a lot of trouble remembering the
syntax but they are mega keen. Im wondering if a turtle version of
scratch is a good idea?

Ben

--

[Benjamin Blundell]

Although its more visual (which is great for me, I admit) this is a
great thing for kids:

http://www.cs.manchester.ac.uk/Animation11/

Again, I know a lot of CS people were involved in making this happen
(head of CS at Leeds was very keen). The only thing is it begins to
focus more on the art and narrative. I think if we had something
physical to control but using a similar, visual language that teaches
loops, functions, etc, that might be a good start. I suppose this is
being done in a sense with mindstorms and similar. Not sure where we'd
fit.

Ben

[Ken Boak]

Ben

This was precisely why I developed the Nanode - a small physical platform aimed at monitoring and control

http://sustburbia.blogspot.com/2011/12/building-blocks-for-internet-of-things.html

http://sustburbia.blogspot.com/2011/11/teaching-kids-to-code-and-build.html


Admittedly it's not Raspberry- Pi, but is a 32 bit ARM the best platform to get a 12 year old to flash LEDs with?



Ken

[Benjamin Blundell]

I was very keen on the nanode, yes! I've CC'd in our course leader who
is keen on getting something better for next time. I think, with a
pretty nifty interface, it'd be much better than our existing robots.
I know Jonty and a few others are working on this right now. Could be
good to get them down tomorrow?

Ben

[Sam Cook]

I guess a lot of this depends on what we want to teach and to whom. Obviously teaching 5 year olds binary mathematics should be doable with basic adding machines and is an excellent way of introducing bases (which I think is a serious barrier for a lot of people the idea of counting in anything other than base 10). 

Again physical systems are nice way of introducing the concepts of programming and are excellent way of making it natural, I help run a 3rd year programming course for physicists (using JAVA) and it's amazing how many struggle with the constructs of the language (i.e they really don't seem to *get* loops).

I guess the real question is this: Sue, what is the best thing we can do for you and what does <goto> really need right now? 

S

[tom]

and I've done similar stupid things in garrysmod, building a simple
printer with a jeep, lots of logic gates and an addon that sprays
birdshit on surfaces when triggered :)
Along the physical lines, what about something similar to Jims steam-
powered turing machine? Or writing a simple state-machine for the
roomba? perhaps a competition to clean the floor the fastest using
simple coding?

On Dec 5, 12:45 pm, Sam Cook <sam.lindenrat...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't know it depends how you build the adder - mechanical ones can be
> really interesting. I know Antonio(Olfin) has a mechanical counter
> implemented in Little big planet - we could easily make a mechanical
> version of it. Could be fun to make some simple systems that can be plugged
> together.
>
> S
>

> > > > >>>>>>>> Teenhttp://www.teentechevent.com/I'vegotameetingwith Maggie

[Jonty Wareing]

On Mon, Dec 05, 2011 at 06:41:12AM -0800, tom wrote:
> Or writing a simple state-machine for the roomba? perhaps a
> competition to clean the floor the fastest using simple coding?

This is actually a (dormant) project of mine that I wanted to get kids
playing with at Maker Faire, using my Roomba in a sandbox (an actual box
with sand in). I got bored after causing the Roomba to drive around my
flat and repeatedly bump into Kates feet.

If someone else is interested, I'd love to collaborate on it.

--jonty

PS. FORWARD 100; LEFT 20; SUCK

[Sam Cook]

I'd be interested. The problem with Jim's turing engine is that it's not intuitive what it's doing. The counter that I was talking about was really simple - balls went in and triggered a series of toggles the deposited the balls into the appropriate bin. Reading the toggles then gave you a binary result, if we could make similar things for counting and similar would be a really nice clear way of seeing how binary works as well as giving a reasonable motivation for why you use binary. 

S

[tom]

replace "toggles" with "row of people given a simple if-this-then-that
instruction" :)

and jonty: I started work on the roomba in the space, it has a serial
port now :)

[Jim MacArthur]

I agree, it also took a year to build and is mind-numbingly slow and unreliable. There are plenty of more practical things you can do if you use some electronics rather than being all mechanical. I've been thinking recently about making a train set with instructions on the rails and real branches to illustrate control flow.

[Sam Cook]

I love the mechanical nature of it - in a way I prefer it because you can see what's happening rather than things getting abstracted to "the magic of electricity" it's more that with you're engine it's not very clear what exactly it's calculating ;) 

I'll try to come down this week and see if I can mock up some simple mechanical counters, adders (and if I'm feeling brave) some basic swapable gates. Would be fun to give kids lego-logic (true plug and play ;) )

S

[Will Pearson]

Last I heard from Sue is that she couldn't make it on Tuesdays before
Christmas.

Musings:

There are a few different possible threads that <goto> could follow.

1) Explaining the fundamentals of computing [1] . Other people have
covered this well.

2) Empowering young people to take control of the computers (or make
new ones) around them.

I personally got interested in computers because of the latter. I
needed to know what hi-mem was and the internals of a computer were so
that I could make my own computer for cheap. Now fewer people are
using computers for gaming (xbox, ps3, ipads and phones), so there is
less need.

The new computers everyone is carrying is mobile phones (and to a
lesser extent tablets), so perhaps we can get kids/teens to program
them? Scripting language 4 android (SL4A) seems like something fun we
could get teens coding that

a) doesn't cost them anything (if they have an android phone)
b) can expose them to the web .
c) exposes them to scripting languages (python, javascript) that are
used elsewhere

Arduino stuff has a large barrier to entry if you want to do anything
more interesting than blink an LED (multimeter, components, more
components to replace the ones you blow, etc)

Will

[1] I should make a set of alligator eggs http://worrydream.com/AlligatorEggs/
for understanding lambda calculus. That may interest people if you
want to get ultra-theoretical?

[tom]

i just read that and I still have no idea what lambda calculus is :)

> [1] I should make a set of alligator eggshttp://worrydream.com/AlligatorEggs/

[Yuan]

I think tom's suggestion of using people instead of logic gates would
be an interesting exercise. Build a full adder circuit out of five
people! Then string them together and see if they'll add two numbers
together.

[Adrian Godwin]

Sounds great fun but remember the kids will have to understand binary
in order to accept that it's actually doing arithmetic.

[tom]

anyone that can grasp Hundreds-Tens-and-Units can get binary, we could
teach that easily enough with the "write the powers of two on your
fingers" approach. Finger up = that value, finger down = no value. Add
up all the values and voila!

[Russ Garrett]

On 5 December 2011 16:44, Adrian Godwin <artg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sounds great fun but remember the kids will have to understand binary
> in order to accept that it's actually doing arithmetic.

Relevant: http://www.garlikov.com/Soc_Meth.html

--
Russ Garrett
ru...@garrett.co.uk

[Adrian Godwin]

Or maybe implement a binary-to-decimal decoder using some more kids as
combinational logic ?

[Sue Black]

Hi all,

Thanks very much for all the comments and suggestions :))

Are you all going to meet on Tues 20th? If so I can try doubling up events and come over to hackspace for a bit. I think if we have a chat we will work out what it is best to do. You are all experts with great ideas. I'd really like to get a feeling for the space and how it all works and then perhaps we could sort out a family hack day and whatever else comes out of our meeting. 

Does that sound OK?

Sue

[Will Pearson]

LMWTFY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambda_calculus

TL;DR it is one of the theoretical foundations of computing (with the
Turing machine) and is the ancestor of lisp and is used in hardcore
stuff like proving programs have certain properties.

The Alligator Eggs page by itself is not sufficient to understand
lambda calculus, but the game helps to show it is all symbol
manipulation and to memorise the rules. You can do stuff like
arithematic with it, using the Peano axioms (0 and S() and all that
jazz).

Will

[Mark Steward]

Aww, and here's me thinking it was something exciting about alligators devouring each other :(

[tom]

perhaps..... roombas devouring each other?

[Ken Boak]

There was a group at New York Maker Fair - from Evil Mad Scientist's Lab who had a ball bearing computer - milled out of plywood.

Called Digi-Comp 11

Think of it like a really elaborate bagatellle table - based on a 1965 product - aimed at teaching computer arithmetic to Kids!  http://digicompii.com/

It pulled a big crowd - as it was very visual with ball bearings taking different routes to  the bottom depending on the programmed settings.


Link Here

http://www.evilmadscientist.com/index.php?page=3



Ken

[Sam Cook]

There's a meeting every Tuesday so I don't see why that would be an exception. That being said there was a proposal for the Christmas dinner then but the thread[1] seems to suggest the Wednesday (21st) be used so as to not clash with the social? There's nothing in the calendar[2] to confirm either way. 

Should I add both events (chat re <goto> on the Tues and the dinner on the 21st?) 

S

[1] http://groups.google.com/group/london-hack-space/browse_thread/thread/194d3242038a5000/53ef81d65f96c2dd

[2] https://london.hackspace.org.uk/events/

[Mark Steward]

Pretty sure this was clarified as being Tuesday 20th.

[Martin Dittus]

Sue,

provided the Christmas dinner is indeed on the 20th (as Mark suggests) then the alternative is simply that you tell us a date and time when you're free, and whoever is available meets up with you at the Hackspace.

Most of the active posters in this thread have been involved with the Young Hackspace in some way, we all have ideas for kid-friendly projects, we all know the Hackspace very well, and quite a few of us have organised events here.

I.e., if you can suggest a reasonable time (evenings are probably preferred by most) then you'll have no problem meeting up with good people.

Or you could doodle it.
http://www.doodle.com/

m.

[Sue Black]

Thanks Martin,

My diary is crazy before Christmas, it's probably best to do it in January. Why don't I come along on the evening of Tuesday 10th? 

Sue

[Martin Dittus]

Ok, I'll put it in my calendar.

m.

[Dr Sue Black]

Great! I look forward to meeting everyone who can make it on 10th Jan :))

Have a great weekend.

Sue

Apologies for typos etc. sent from my iPhone

--
Dr Sue Black

http://about.me/sueblack

[Amran]

you're forgetting TRTL http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/Project:TRTL

 

--jonty

PS. FORWARD 100; LEFT 20; SUCK

how rude!

[Sue Black]

Looking forward to meeting up with you guys this evening :))

See you later

Sue

--
Dr Sue Black

Founder: The <goto> Foundation

Homepage: www.sueblack.co.uk