Kitchen Kapers

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cepm...@yahoo.co.uk

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Apr 12, 2011, 4:51:09 AM4/12/11
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Dear all

The carpet has now been removed clearing the way to Paint/Tile/Lino the
floor. A carcase has been made for the oven and the work tops have been
cut and placed on temporary supports pending the availability of the
cupboards. The tops are 100mm higher than standard following favourable
comments by members, if this proves unpopular it can be lowered.
Observations are invited on other aspects... It`s your kitchen so let`s
hear it!

Phil

Earthshine

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Apr 12, 2011, 7:08:54 AM4/12/11
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Does this mean the kitchen is not ready for tonights party?

Martin Dittus

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Apr 12, 2011, 7:18:22 AM4/12/11
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I assume you mean 10mm, i.e., 1cm?

(100mm is 1m, approx. 3 foot. Your note in the kitchen makes the same statement, but I forgot to bring it up when I saw you.)

Catherine Flick

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Apr 12, 2011, 7:19:26 AM4/12/11
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Isn't 100mm 10cm? >_>

Clare Greenhalgh

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Apr 12, 2011, 7:21:44 AM4/12/11
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That is what I thought Catherine....
--

Sam Cook

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Apr 12, 2011, 7:22:53 AM4/12/11
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isn't 10cm the difference between the worktops and the standard workspace height (what ever that is)? =P 

As an actual comment the only problem I see with the higher worktops is that we will have to mess about to get any standard units to fit rather than just plug and play.

S

On 12 April 2011 12:19, Catherine Flick <lie...@gmail.com> wrote:

Martin Klang

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Apr 12, 2011, 8:07:26 AM4/12/11
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in other words:
the proposed worktop height is roughly 4 inches higher than normal.

Or to use Phil's more precise measurements: 10cm, 100mm, 10^9 ångström, 0.98 hands...

To fit standard-height kitchen units you could just add 100mm stand-offs.
But I assume we roll our own?

/m

Nigel Worsley

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Apr 12, 2011, 8:10:01 AM4/12/11
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> Or to use Phil's more precise measurements: 10cm, 100mm, 10^9
�ngstr�m, 0.98 hands...

Half a millifurlong.

Nigle

Russ Garrett

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Apr 12, 2011, 8:43:17 AM4/12/11
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On 12 April 2011 12:08, Earthshine <mike...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Does this mean the kitchen is not ready for tonights party?

It's a lot more ready than it was before, that's for sure. Thanks Phil!

--
Russ Garrett
ru...@garrett.co.uk

Martin Dittus

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Apr 12, 2011, 8:46:04 AM4/12/11
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Woops. Yes. Carry on.

/me postpones his carpentry career and goes back to measuring school

m.

cepm...@yahoo.co.uk

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Apr 12, 2011, 10:26:10 PM4/12/11
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> 100mm is 1m, approx. 3 foot

Only if you use a rubber ruler :-)

The tops are approx 1000mm high which is 100mm above standard height.

The carcase for the oven is home produced and other cupboards that are not
made on site will be supported on 100mm bearers to facilitate cleaning and
to keep the chipboard off the floor which I suspect will be frequently wet.

We need to decide on and source suitable flooring materials. Russ, were
you going to look into this? I have 5 litres of "Tile Red" floor paint but
this is probably not the optimum.

Russ Garrett

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Apr 13, 2011, 7:44:52 AM4/13/11
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Incidentally I'm not sold on the high work surface - I think it'll
make chopping things hard work, and I'd prefer having at least part of
the surface at the standard height.

On 13 April 2011 03:26, <cepm...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> We need to decide on and source suitable flooring materials. Russ, were you
> going to look into this? I have 5 litres of "Tile Red" floor paint but this
> is probably not the optimum.

Quick estimate for the size of the floor (excluding under the units)
is about 6.5 sq m. I think we can probably tile that for under £100.
Someone needs to drop into Homebase and pick up some cheap tiles.

--
Russ Garrett
ru...@garrett.co.uk

Sam Cook

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Apr 13, 2011, 11:44:45 AM4/13/11
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Having gone in and had a poke I agree that at least some of the work surfaces should lower, as Russ says for things like chopping you want a work surface at a height such that your arms are parallel to the floor and your shoulders relaxed; for me the current height would mean I'd be hunched up.....

Other than that it all seems pretty good!

S

Charles Yarnold

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Apr 13, 2011, 11:54:59 AM4/13/11
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I was hoping that some of the shorter members of the space that have spoken to me about the height would have posted by now, but failing that:

We have had some comments that with the height as it is now, some shorter members would have a tough time using them well without using a step.

Sol

Mark Steward

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Apr 13, 2011, 12:18:02 PM4/13/11
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On Wed, Apr 13, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Sam Cook <sc...@hep.ucl.ac.uk> wrote:
Having gone in and had a poke I agree that at least some of the work surfaces should lower, as Russ says for things like chopping you want a work surface at a height such that your arms are parallel to the floor and your shoulders relaxed; for me the current height would mean I'd be hunched up.....

Other than that it all seems pretty good!


I brought this up a couple of times, as I'm among the shorter crowd, and the answer has always been "stand on an orange box" because tall people can't deal with a low sideboard.  Is this true?  Will lowering the surface make it awkward for a different subset of the space?

While I'd prefer to use the standard height (principle of least surprise), it's easier to lower it later than raise it.


Mark

Mark Steward

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Apr 13, 2011, 12:22:58 PM4/13/11
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On Wed, Apr 13, 2011 at 5:18 PM, Mark Steward <marks...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Apr 13, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Sam Cook <sc...@hep.ucl.ac.uk> wrote:
Having gone in and had a poke I agree that at least some of the work surfaces should lower, as Russ says for things like chopping you want a work surface at a height such that your arms are parallel to the floor and your shoulders relaxed; for me the current height would mean I'd be hunched up.....

Other than that it all seems pretty good!


I brought this up a couple of times, as I'm among the shorter crowd, and the answer has always been "stand on an orange box" because tall people can't deal with a low sideboard.  Is this true?  Will lowering the surface make it awkward for a different subset of the space?

Actually, thinking about it, steps or stands are the last thing we want in a kitchen where there will be knives and hot things.  It's going to be easier to raise the side with a wooden block than make all the short people stand.


Mark

Sam Cook

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Apr 13, 2011, 12:22:42 PM4/13/11
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I think the simpler option will be to have some of the surfaces at one height and some at the other; boxes are not an option: in an environment with hot things, sharp things and sometimes hot sharp things things on the floor = people on floor with hot sharp things. 

To be fair the higher portions will probably be useful for certain jobs but certainly for chopping you don't want to be hunched up. 

S

Sam Cook

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Apr 13, 2011, 12:57:13 PM4/13/11
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it might be possible to make the worktops adjustable height; possibly by having ratchets on each side or screw threads or similar?

S

Adrian Godwin

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Apr 13, 2011, 2:35:36 PM4/13/11
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Probably easier to have a spare worktop on blocks that you can just place on the counter for anyone who finds the counter unusably low.

-adrian

Charles Yarnold

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Apr 13, 2011, 2:36:49 PM4/13/11
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Great idea!

TonyP

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Apr 14, 2011, 10:39:28 AM4/14/11
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I've got bits and pieces of flooring and can check tonight but I've
very probably got 6.5 sq m of tiles that would do the exposed area.
When are they need?

Tony

TonyP

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Apr 15, 2011, 6:40:31 AM4/15/11
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I've checked and I've got some ceramic floor tiles but also an
adequate amount of vinyl strip planking which is bathroom/kitchen
proof. Vinyl stuff is easy to clean and would need some hardboard or
similar on the floor before it's laid but this might be easier to work
around than leaving tile adhesive and grouting to go off if ceramic is
used.

I can dig these out if they'd be suitable - if so, somebody let me
know and I'll drop them in.

Tony

cepm...@yahoo.co.uk

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Apr 21, 2011, 12:08:39 PM4/21/11
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Dear all

The kitchen now has three cupboards and the worktops are nearly finished
:-) with a bit of luck three more cupboard doors will appear across the
road otherwise I shall make some.

Sadly, no substantial further progress is likely until the floor is
finished, this is a skill that is outwith my competence.

If some kind soul can sort out the floor then the end is near.

Phil

Charles Yarnold

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Apr 21, 2011, 12:28:58 PM4/21/11
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Just to add we also need plumbing and electric in, preferably before the rest of the kitchen is installed.

Anyone got the skills / relevant electrical qualifications to check over the work done?

Sol

Charles Yarnold

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Apr 21, 2011, 12:29:03 PM4/21/11
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e

On 21 April 2011 17:08, <cepm...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Martin Klang

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Apr 21, 2011, 12:44:24 PM4/21/11
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+1

cepm...@yahoo.co.uk

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Apr 21, 2011, 2:30:36 PM4/21/11
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Water/ waste will enter below work surface level from the quiet room,
power will drop down inside the stud wall from above the ceiling and
emerge below worksurface so no problems there.

Plumbing I can do to an acceptable standard, Power likewise but will need
some one with the relevant paperwork to sign it off. I would suggest that
a separate ring cct. be installed for the kitchen and the existing sockets
be removed (this is a trivial task). The space will need to pay for
materials. :-)

Charles Yarnold

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Apr 21, 2011, 2:56:27 PM4/21/11
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On 21 April 2011 19:30, <cepm...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Water/ waste will enter below work surface level from the quiet room, power will drop down inside the stud wall from above the ceiling and emerge below worksurface so no problems there.

The water enters from above, not from 23. 

Plumbing I can do to an acceptable standard, Power likewise but will need some one with the relevant paperwork to sign it off. I would suggest that a separate ring cct. be installed for the kitchen and the existing sockets be removed (this is a trivial task). The space will need to pay for materials. :-)

I can also do this work, it was more hoping someone with the relevent paperwork could preform it.

Sol 

Adrian Godwin

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Apr 21, 2011, 3:15:44 PM4/21/11
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On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 7:56 PM, Charles Yarnold <charles...@gmail.com> wrote:
On 21 April 2011 19:30, <cepm...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Water/ waste will enter below work surface level from the quiet room, power will drop down inside the stud wall from above the ceiling and emerge below worksurface so no problems there.


Yebbut it's easier to do it if the carcases are unfixed - saves having to crawl around the back.
 
The water enters from above, not from 23. 

Plumbing I can do to an acceptable standard, Power likewise but will need some one with the relevant paperwork to sign it off. I would suggest that a separate ring cct. be installed for the kitchen and the existing sockets be removed (this is a trivial task). The space will need to pay for materials. :-)

I can also do this work, it was more hoping someone with the relevent paperwork could preform it.

Sol 


We do seem to be stuck on this. It might be desirable, if expensive, to have it done professionally, but I can't see it happening in a hurry.

How about we do the work, then get the whole space checked out ? An electrical company is less likely to be awkward if they think they're just doing an annual check rather than losing a job, and we know we can do it adequately - we're just trying to follow best practice by having it professionally approved.

I'm up for a water-and-wiring party if anyone else wants to pile in.

-adrian

Russ Garrett

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Apr 21, 2011, 4:31:51 PM4/21/11
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On 21 April 2011 20:15, Adrian Godwin <artg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> We do seem to be stuck on this. It might be desirable, if expensive, to have
> it done professionally, but I can't see it happening in a hurry.
>
> How about we do the work, then get the whole space checked out ?

That's what we've always intended to do. What's currently blocking us
is the floor.

--
Russ Garrett
ru...@garrett.co.uk

Russ Garrett

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Apr 21, 2011, 4:42:43 PM4/21/11
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On 21 April 2011 21:31, Russ Garrett <ru...@garrett.co.uk> wrote:
> That's what we've always intended to do. What's currently blocking us
> is the floor.

Further to this I'll see if I can get the electrics stuff ordered this weekend.

--
Russ Garrett
ru...@garrett.co.uk

Adrian Godwin

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Apr 22, 2011, 2:47:37 AM4/22/11
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On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 9:42 PM, Russ Garrett <ru...@garrett.co.uk> wrote:
On 21 April 2011 21:31, Russ Garrett <ru...@garrett.co.uk> wrote:
> That's what we've always intended to do. What's currently blocking us
> is the floor.

Further to this I'll see if I can get the electrics stuff ordered this weekend.


Do look at ebay - some stuff, such as part-used reels of heavy cable, can be a great deal cheaper than the local trade supplier. 20m of 10 sq. mil. is going to cost a fair bit otherwise.

-adrian

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