CLL, chapter 19, examples

[Frank]

coi

Should examples 10.3 & 10.4 in this chapter begin with "?" characters?

mi'e xuinkrbin.

[Jonathan Jones]

No. That looks like a typographic error.


That text (CLL.19.10) should also be updated to reflect the existence of {zo'oi}.

"It should be noted particularly that “zoi” quotation is the only way to quote rafsi...." {zo'oi.tce.} is a valid method for quoting the rafsi "tce".

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--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

[selpa'i]

la .frank. cu cusku di'e

> coi
>
> Should examples 10.3 & 10.4 in this chapter begin with "?" characters?

Yes.

It is common practice in linguistics to mark questionable sentences
(that is, sentences for which it is not clear whether they are
grammatical) with a question mark in front. Similarly, ungrammatical
sentences are marked with an asterisc.

mu'o mi'e la selpa'i

[Jonathan Jones]

They aren't questionable sentences. We know that they are (un)grammatical. The first is grammatical if spoken and not if written, the second is the reverse.

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[Robin Lee Powell]

Whatever comes out of this discussion, please make sure it gets to
http://www.lojban.org/tiki/CLL,+aka+Reference+Grammar,+Errata

-Robin

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http://intelligence.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future.
.i ko na cpedu lo nu stidi vau loi jbopre .i danfu lu na go'i li'u .e
lu go'i li'u .i ji'a go'i lu na'e go'i li'u .e lu go'i na'i li'u .e
lu no'e go'i li'u .e lu to'e go'i li'u .e lu lo mamta be do cu sofybakni li'u

[Jorge Llambías]

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 7:56 PM, Jonathan Jones <eye...@gmail.com> wrote:

They aren't questionable sentences. We know that they are (un)grammatical. The first is grammatical if spoken and not if written, the second is the reverse.

It should be pointed out that both examples are grammatical, both in writen and spoken form, with the camxes grammar. While the issue that these examples are meant to illustrate still exists for camxes, these examples do not suffer from it,

An example that would suffer from it might be "lo glico valsi po'u zoi mi me mi"/"lo glico valsi po'u zoi me me me".

mu'o mi'e xorxes  

[Ian Johnson]

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 5:56 PM, Jonathan Jones <eye...@gmail.com> wrote:

"It should be noted particularly that “zoi” quotation is the only way to quote rafsi...." {zo'oi.tce.} is a valid method for quoting the rafsi "tce".

This is generally discouraged now, with {ra'oi} (of the same selma'o) being encouraged for the same purpose.

mi'e la latro'a mu'o

[Jonathan Jones]

Which means there are now three ways to quote rafsi. I was not aware of ra'oi. I assume it doesn't need denpa bu delimitation like zo'oi does, then?

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[Frank]

So, on the original question, is the answer go'i or nago'i?

[Ian Johnson]

Same selma'o, so it still needs denpa bu. It's just explicitly for rafsi and not foreign quotes. When this was coined (I think xalbo actually coined this) the idea was that rafsi aren't actually foreign, so it seems weird to "foreign quote" them, even though they aren't speakable under the morphology.

mi'e la latro'a mu'o

[Jonathan Jones]

I say nago'i.

On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 10:04 AM, Frank <frankdm...@gmail.com> wrote:

So, on the original question, is the answer go'i or nago'i?

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