Does {na nei} work like that?

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ianek

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Nov 20, 2010, 4:06:36 PM11/20/10
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coi
{na nei} should work like {na go'i}. According to LLC 15.9, {na}
replaces previous negation, not negates it. Just like this:
A: i le vi karce na crino
B: i na go'i

A: this car isn't green
B: it isn't

So {na nei} should mean "this negative statement is indeed true", or
I'm awfully wrong.

mu'o mi'e ianek

Pierre Abbat

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Nov 21, 2010, 1:17:39 PM11/21/10
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That's what I think too. What happens, though, when you have several {na} or
{ja'a} in front of a selbri?

I think the right way to say "this statement is false" is "dei jitfa".

Pierre
--
I believe in Yellow when I'm in Sweden and in Black when I'm in Wales.

Jonathan Jones

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Nov 21, 2010, 3:13:08 PM11/21/10
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From Robin Lee Powell's signature:
 
Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false" is "na nei".

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

Robin Lee Powell

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Nov 21, 2010, 3:19:51 PM11/21/10
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On Sun, Nov 21, 2010 at 01:13:08PM -0700, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 21, 2010 at 11:17 AM, Pierre Abbat <ph...@phma.optus.nu> wrote:
>
> > On Saturday 20 November 2010 16:06:36 ianek wrote:
> > > coi
> > > {na nei} should work like {na go'i}. According to LLC 15.9, {na}
> > > replaces previous negation, not negates it. Just like this:
> > > A: i le vi karce na crino
> > > B: i na go'i
> > >
> > > A: this car isn't green
> > > B: it isn't
> > >
> > > So {na nei} should mean "this negative statement is indeed true", or
> > > I'm awfully wrong.
> >
> > That's what I think too. What happens, though, when you have
> > several {na} or {ja'a} in front of a selbri?
> >
> > I think the right way to say "this statement is false" is "dei
> > jitfa".
>
>
> From Robin Lee Powell's signature:
>
> Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this
> parrot is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", *but "this sentence
> is false" is "na nei".*

Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they were replying to.

They're point is that {na nei} means something like "this negated
statement is true", which isn't a contradiction the way "this
statement is false" is. It's more like " "not this statement" is
false", which is trivially true.

{la'e dei jitfa}, surely?

That has the profound disadvantage of not being *nearly* as funny.
Wholesale replacements welcome.

-Robin

--
http://singinst.org/ : Our last, best hope for a fantastic future.


Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot
is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false"

is "na nei". My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/

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