Younger sister and older brother. Any lujvo suggestions ?

[gleki]

In some languages there are specific words for younger sister, older sister.

This is the problem I faced in Tatoeba when translating some sentences.

I believe we need lujvo for such words.

{citmau} or {citno} {mensi} are ambiguous.

[MorphemeAddict]

Why do you need lujvo for such words? I suggest trying it with tanru first, then if the need (or desire) is great enough, create a lujvo. 

stevo

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[gleki]

So {citmau mensi} ?

Several languages in Tatoeba look like they have separate words for older and younger sister.

On Sunday, March 25, 2012 5:17:29 PM UTC+4, stevo wrote:

Why do you need lujvo for such words? I suggest trying it with tanru first, then if the need (or desire) is great enough, create a lujvo. 

stevo

On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 3:53 AM, gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:

In some languages there are specific words for younger sister, older sister.

This is the problem I faced in Tatoeba when translating some sentences.

I believe we need lujvo for such words.

{citmau} or {citno} {mensi} are ambiguous.

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[MorphemeAddict]

An older/younger sibling is older/younger relative to the person whose sibling they are. E.g., My younger brother is younger than *I* am. 

I've had a problem all my life with describing my brother who is a year younger than I am. I've called him my older brother, because he's the older of my two brothers, but he's still younger than I am. OTOH, calling him my older brother implies that he is older than I am. (Now I just don't talk about him.) 

So the seltau {citmau} may not be the best word to use for the meaning you want. 

stevo

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[gleki]

I wonder how Asian languages work then

[Sebastian Fröjd]

But the lujvo definition doesn't have to be identical with the tanru counterpart. I think the most useful definition should be used as the lujvo definition. My proposal:

citme'i: x₁ is a little sister of/sororal to x₂ [younger than x2] by bond/tie/standard/parent(s) x₃; [not necessarily biological].
tolcitme'i: x1 is a big sister of/sororal to x₂ [older than x2] by bond/tie/standard/parent(s) x₃; [not necessarily biological].

In this way you could make distinctions with tanru like:

ri cu  citrai/citno/-/tolcitno/tolcitrai  citme'i/tolcitme'i/mensi/bruna/citybu'a/tolcitybu'a  mi

30 different kind of brothers and sisters including the elliptical/unspecified alternatives.

mu'omi'e jongausib

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[Michael Turniansky]

  But don't forget, MA, that a tanru can include interposed arguments.  I.E. "citmau be mi mensi"

          --gejyspa