Milton Group 6: Katharine Mikula, Emma Taline Noradounkian, Debra Bruman, Joshua Indig, Cindy Yang
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William Shakespeare
Apr 10, 2012, 9:46:21 PM4/10/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
To illustrate a written text is to offer an interpretation of it.
Through this forum, consider how one or both of the two illustrations
below read Milton’s poem. Your first post, which may be independent
of or in dialogue with another student’s post, is due on Sunday April
15th at midnight. Your second post, which must be in dialogue with
another post, is due on Friday April 20th at midnight. Additional
posts are welcome! Posts that do not satisfactorily meet assignment
criteria and/or are put up after the deadlines will receive a zero.
Please be respectful of your classmates – do not post anything that is
offensive or insensitive. When disagreeing with someone else, be
courteous and keep your comments focused on the other students’
writing/ideas.
The illustrations (http://www.christs.cam.ac.uk/darknessvisible/
illlustration/index.html#)
- William Blake Pic #2: “Satan, Sin, and Death: 'Whence and what art
thou, execrable shape ... ?' (II.681)” (Sin interposing herself
between Satan and Death)
- William Strang Pic #3: “Book II. Sin and Death at the Gates of Hell”
Here are some questions that you might consider:
- What do the illustrations emphasize/de-emphasize in the poem?
- How do the illustrations differ from the poem?
- What additions do the illustrations make to the poem?
- How do the illustrations differ from each other and what is the
significance of those differences?
- What do you think about the appropriateness of each illustration as
a companion to the poem? Is one illustration more appropriate than
the other? Why?
In answering questions like those above, you might consider one or
more of the following topics:
- Characterization, both in terms of individuals and relationships
between individuals
- Setting (i.e. Hell as a place)
- Plot
- Sexuality
- Gender
- Morality
- Pleasure/pain
- Strength
- Power
- Evocations of specific cultural/historical moments
- Anthropomorphism (i.e. depicting the non-human as human)
- Theology
- England prior to the poem’s composition: politics, war, social
structure, etc.
- Formal elements: style, use of light and darkness, degree of
realism, spatial organization, closeness/distance, the absence of
colour, the use of colour, etc.
Through this forum, consider how one or both of the two illustrations
below read Milton’s poem. Your first post, which may be independent
of or in dialogue with another student’s post, is due on Sunday April
15th at midnight. Your second post, which must be in dialogue with
another post, is due on Friday April 20th at midnight. Additional
posts are welcome! Posts that do not satisfactorily meet assignment
criteria and/or are put up after the deadlines will receive a zero.
Please be respectful of your classmates – do not post anything that is
offensive or insensitive. When disagreeing with someone else, be
courteous and keep your comments focused on the other students’
writing/ideas.
The illustrations (http://www.christs.cam.ac.uk/darknessvisible/
illlustration/index.html#)
- William Blake Pic #2: “Satan, Sin, and Death: 'Whence and what art
thou, execrable shape ... ?' (II.681)” (Sin interposing herself
between Satan and Death)
- William Strang Pic #3: “Book II. Sin and Death at the Gates of Hell”
Here are some questions that you might consider:
- What do the illustrations emphasize/de-emphasize in the poem?
- How do the illustrations differ from the poem?
- What additions do the illustrations make to the poem?
- How do the illustrations differ from each other and what is the
significance of those differences?
- What do you think about the appropriateness of each illustration as
a companion to the poem? Is one illustration more appropriate than
the other? Why?
In answering questions like those above, you might consider one or
more of the following topics:
- Characterization, both in terms of individuals and relationships
between individuals
- Setting (i.e. Hell as a place)
- Plot
- Sexuality
- Gender
- Morality
- Pleasure/pain
- Strength
- Power
- Evocations of specific cultural/historical moments
- Anthropomorphism (i.e. depicting the non-human as human)
- Theology
- England prior to the poem’s composition: politics, war, social
structure, etc.
- Formal elements: style, use of light and darkness, degree of
realism, spatial organization, closeness/distance, the absence of
colour, the use of colour, etc.
Debra Bruman
Apr 12, 2012, 8:52:46 PM4/12/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
William Blake’s picture of Satan, Sin, and Death emphasizes Sin’s
action to stop Satan and Death from arguing. Blake’s picture is fairly
accurate to the description of Sin (he includes the snake’s tail and
the dogs, and includes the key Sin carries that opens Hell’s gates).
Blake chooses to emphasize the physical nature of a fight rather than
the verbal nature of the fight. Blake takes some liberties with some
elements in the picture: for example, Sin’s dogs have horns on them,
something that is not described in Milton’s poem. Horns have demonic
associations, which may be why Blake included this element. The gates
of Hell are also only depicted as one large gate, possibly to save
space, whereas in Milton’s poem it is nine gates made of three
different substances.
William Strang’s picture of Sin and Death does not include the action,
and instead focuses on the characterization of Sin and Death as
entities guarding the gates of Hell. Strang’s picture has Death with a
skull’s head and wearing a crown, which is not described in Milton’s
poem. Strang’s version of Sin and Death are mostly a liberal
interpretation of their physical characteristics, minus the snake tail
of Sin, because Sin and Death are not fully described (old, young,
etc.) other than their abnormal physical characteristics, such as the
tail and the dogs. Strang’s version of Sin and Death is more of a
study of characteristics associated with Sin and Death (ex: the skull
is symbolic of death, but not described in Milton’s poem) than
illustrating the actual subject.
I think William Blake’s picture is more appropriate as a companion to
the poem in comparison to William Strang’s picture because Blake’s
picture is more accurate in depicting the descriptions of the
characters. Blake’s picture includes the dogs and the key to the gates
of Hell that Strang’s picture does not, and it emphasizes an event in
the story that Strang’s illustration does not.
On Apr 10, 9:46 pm, William Shakespeare <andrewelbur...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
action to stop Satan and Death from arguing. Blake’s picture is fairly
accurate to the description of Sin (he includes the snake’s tail and
the dogs, and includes the key Sin carries that opens Hell’s gates).
Blake chooses to emphasize the physical nature of a fight rather than
the verbal nature of the fight. Blake takes some liberties with some
elements in the picture: for example, Sin’s dogs have horns on them,
something that is not described in Milton’s poem. Horns have demonic
associations, which may be why Blake included this element. The gates
of Hell are also only depicted as one large gate, possibly to save
space, whereas in Milton’s poem it is nine gates made of three
different substances.
William Strang’s picture of Sin and Death does not include the action,
and instead focuses on the characterization of Sin and Death as
entities guarding the gates of Hell. Strang’s picture has Death with a
skull’s head and wearing a crown, which is not described in Milton’s
poem. Strang’s version of Sin and Death are mostly a liberal
interpretation of their physical characteristics, minus the snake tail
of Sin, because Sin and Death are not fully described (old, young,
etc.) other than their abnormal physical characteristics, such as the
tail and the dogs. Strang’s version of Sin and Death is more of a
study of characteristics associated with Sin and Death (ex: the skull
is symbolic of death, but not described in Milton’s poem) than
illustrating the actual subject.
I think William Blake’s picture is more appropriate as a companion to
the poem in comparison to William Strang’s picture because Blake’s
picture is more accurate in depicting the descriptions of the
characters. Blake’s picture includes the dogs and the key to the gates
of Hell that Strang’s picture does not, and it emphasizes an event in
the story that Strang’s illustration does not.
On Apr 10, 9:46 pm, William Shakespeare <andrewelbur...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Emma Taline Noradounkian
Apr 13, 2012, 5:51:35 PM4/13/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
William Blake’s “Satan, Sin, and Death” emphasizes an action that is
taking place between all three characters mentioned in the
illustration’s title. Sin rushes between Satan and Death and she
cries, explaining to Satan about who she and Death are and their
origins. Sin is touching both Satan and Death, either depicting her
connection with both of them (Satan and Death both rapped her, and
Death is her son) or simply using some sort of strength to separate
them. Her depiction in Blake’s work is very accurate to the poem’s
description. She is half woman-half serpent with Hell-Hounds around
her waist (Milton, 2.652-654). Another significant similarity between
the illustration and the poem is Satan who is burning like a comet
(2.708). In a black and white image, the use of red for the fire
surrounding Satan really stands out. He seems to be taking up almost
three-quarters of the space that is devoted to Blake’s illustration,
possibly suggesting his power and wrathfulness. However, Lucifer is
supposed to have wings, as Milton writes in line 2.631, and he is to
join Death in “their dark encounter in mid-air” (2.718). Moreover,
William Blake anthropomorphized Death—he did the same with Satan and
Sin— who is described as something intangible, a shadow with no
distinguishable shape, in the poem, rather than human-like Blake's
image (666-667). This is another difference with Blake’s and Milton’s
works.
taking place between all three characters mentioned in the
illustration’s title. Sin rushes between Satan and Death and she
cries, explaining to Satan about who she and Death are and their
origins. Sin is touching both Satan and Death, either depicting her
connection with both of them (Satan and Death both rapped her, and
Death is her son) or simply using some sort of strength to separate
them. Her depiction in Blake’s work is very accurate to the poem’s
description. She is half woman-half serpent with Hell-Hounds around
her waist (Milton, 2.652-654). Another significant similarity between
the illustration and the poem is Satan who is burning like a comet
(2.708). In a black and white image, the use of red for the fire
surrounding Satan really stands out. He seems to be taking up almost
three-quarters of the space that is devoted to Blake’s illustration,
possibly suggesting his power and wrathfulness. However, Lucifer is
supposed to have wings, as Milton writes in line 2.631, and he is to
join Death in “their dark encounter in mid-air” (2.718). Moreover,
William Blake anthropomorphized Death—he did the same with Satan and
Sin— who is described as something intangible, a shadow with no
distinguishable shape, in the poem, rather than human-like Blake's
image (666-667). This is another difference with Blake’s and Milton’s
works.
Josh Indig
Apr 15, 2012, 2:30:51 PM4/15/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
Blake's illustration of Satan, Sin and Death at the gates of hell
emphasizes a more traditionally Christian depiction of Hell, Death's
human physical attributes and the three character's symbiotic
relationship. In Book II, Milton describes the setting of hell to be
somewhat similar to earth, referring specifically to a landscape with
many mountains and lakes. In contrast, Blake's stresses the
differences between Earth and Hell through his use of unnatural
colours (Sin's red hair), animals (the dogs) and Sin's anthropomorphic
body. Blake also uses very vibrant shades of red to highlight the
flames and gates of Hell in order to convey the great heat and
suffering that characterize the Christian depiction of Hell.
Moreover, Blake emphasizes Death's human traits by illustrating his
physical strength, musculature and facial structure with great detail.
In stark contrast, Milton's poem and Strang's illustration of the same
scene portray Death as a ghostly and sub-human figure. Blake also
depicts Satan as translucent, less muscular and with features
distinctly less human compared to Death. The juxtaposition between
their figures underlines Death's humanity.
Additionally, Blake demonstrates the character's symbiotic
relationship by drawing Sin's snake body wrapped fully around Satan
and Death's legs, and placing their legs in the same place where Sin's
legs should be. These details perpetuate the perverse, incestuous
relationship that Milton describes between these three characters,
while simultaneously subverting their independent existence. Blake's
illustration of the three characters seems a more appropriate
companion to the poem than Strang's illustration, as it more richly
interprets Milton's concept of the symbiotic relationship Satan, Sin
and Death.
emphasizes a more traditionally Christian depiction of Hell, Death's
human physical attributes and the three character's symbiotic
relationship. In Book II, Milton describes the setting of hell to be
somewhat similar to earth, referring specifically to a landscape with
many mountains and lakes. In contrast, Blake's stresses the
differences between Earth and Hell through his use of unnatural
colours (Sin's red hair), animals (the dogs) and Sin's anthropomorphic
body. Blake also uses very vibrant shades of red to highlight the
flames and gates of Hell in order to convey the great heat and
suffering that characterize the Christian depiction of Hell.
Moreover, Blake emphasizes Death's human traits by illustrating his
physical strength, musculature and facial structure with great detail.
In stark contrast, Milton's poem and Strang's illustration of the same
scene portray Death as a ghostly and sub-human figure. Blake also
depicts Satan as translucent, less muscular and with features
distinctly less human compared to Death. The juxtaposition between
their figures underlines Death's humanity.
Additionally, Blake demonstrates the character's symbiotic
relationship by drawing Sin's snake body wrapped fully around Satan
and Death's legs, and placing their legs in the same place where Sin's
legs should be. These details perpetuate the perverse, incestuous
relationship that Milton describes between these three characters,
while simultaneously subverting their independent existence. Blake's
illustration of the three characters seems a more appropriate
companion to the poem than Strang's illustration, as it more richly
interprets Milton's concept of the symbiotic relationship Satan, Sin
and Death.
Josh Indig
Apr 15, 2012, 4:33:58 PM4/15/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
What part of this action is most emphasized in Blake's illustration
and it not present in the original poem? In comparison to Strang's
illustration, it might be significant that Sin's actions seem to be
the most dynamic part of the scene. The point you make about Sin
touching both Satan and Death is valid, but you might also want to
interpret the significance of the Hell-hounds and snake tails touching
them as wel. These details may imply something about the nature of the
character's relationship. Your comments on the description of Satan
and Sin are accurate and well-put. Its true that the red colour of
Satan makes him stand out, but how does that necessarily demonstrate
his power and wrathfulness. In fact, Satan's lack of wings seem to
contradict that argument by suggesting that he is less powerful than
Death. You could also elaborate on how Blake anthropomorphized the
characters differently in order contrast their traits. Your argument
on how Death is anthropomorphized is still well-supported by your
citation of the text.
On Apr 13, 5:51 pm, Emma Taline Noradounkian
and it not present in the original poem? In comparison to Strang's
illustration, it might be significant that Sin's actions seem to be
the most dynamic part of the scene. The point you make about Sin
touching both Satan and Death is valid, but you might also want to
interpret the significance of the Hell-hounds and snake tails touching
them as wel. These details may imply something about the nature of the
character's relationship. Your comments on the description of Satan
and Sin are accurate and well-put. Its true that the red colour of
Satan makes him stand out, but how does that necessarily demonstrate
his power and wrathfulness. In fact, Satan's lack of wings seem to
contradict that argument by suggesting that he is less powerful than
Death. You could also elaborate on how Blake anthropomorphized the
characters differently in order contrast their traits. Your argument
on how Death is anthropomorphized is still well-supported by your
citation of the text.
On Apr 13, 5:51 pm, Emma Taline Noradounkian
Debra Bruman
Apr 15, 2012, 5:59:55 PM4/15/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
I disagree on your point that states Blake portrays Satan as less
human compared to Death. Satan is the figure on the left and is
depicted as a figure with solidity and he appears like he could
actually be standing on the ground due to the shadows his feet cast on
the ground. On the other hand, Death’s figure is transparent and he
appears to be floating slightly above the ground because he doesn't
cast a shadow on the ground like Satan does (although his figure has
cast shadows, paradoxically). Within the picture, Satan appears more
lifelike than Death because he is not transparent. Death is the figure
with the crown on its head and transparent, like Strang’s illustration
and Milton’s description. While Death is not as sub-human as Strang’s
illustration, Death is less of an entity in itself (because of his
lack of substance) than Satan, who has substance and is depicted as
more muscular than Death.
I agree on your point that Sin’s snake body wrapped around Satan and
Death’s legs symbolize the relationships between the three characters.
I also agree that Blake tries to underline the differences between
Heaven and Hell through the use of colour, the dogs, and Sin’s
anthropomorphic body. I never noticed these details, but now that
you’ve pointed them out, I agree with you!
One other difference between Blake and Milton’s description is that
Hell is supposed to be so frozen in certain places it is as if it were
burning, whereas Blake’s environment is fiery with no trace of ice.
human compared to Death. Satan is the figure on the left and is
depicted as a figure with solidity and he appears like he could
actually be standing on the ground due to the shadows his feet cast on
the ground. On the other hand, Death’s figure is transparent and he
appears to be floating slightly above the ground because he doesn't
cast a shadow on the ground like Satan does (although his figure has
cast shadows, paradoxically). Within the picture, Satan appears more
lifelike than Death because he is not transparent. Death is the figure
with the crown on its head and transparent, like Strang’s illustration
and Milton’s description. While Death is not as sub-human as Strang’s
illustration, Death is less of an entity in itself (because of his
lack of substance) than Satan, who has substance and is depicted as
more muscular than Death.
I agree on your point that Sin’s snake body wrapped around Satan and
Death’s legs symbolize the relationships between the three characters.
I also agree that Blake tries to underline the differences between
Heaven and Hell through the use of colour, the dogs, and Sin’s
anthropomorphic body. I never noticed these details, but now that
you’ve pointed them out, I agree with you!
One other difference between Blake and Milton’s description is that
Hell is supposed to be so frozen in certain places it is as if it were
burning, whereas Blake’s environment is fiery with no trace of ice.
Cindy Yang
Apr 15, 2012, 10:12:04 PM4/15/12
to literary-surv...@googlegroups.com
In “Satan, Sin, and Death: 'Whence and what art thou, execrable shape ... ?' (II.681)”, William Blake depicts Satan and Death about to battle and Sin interposing herself between them to stop them. Blake's illustration is appropriate to the text because first of all the setting is appropriate. The characters are next to a gate which represents the gate of Hell. There are different shades of red all over the illustration, representing the fire in Hell. Also, Satan is described to have "head flames thick" (II.744) which are also presented in the illustration. Furthermore, in the text, Sin is described as a beautiful woman up until her waist. Barking "hell-hounds" surround her waist and her lower body is consisted of a serpent. In the illustration, she is depicted the same way, however instead of her lower body being a single serpent, it is consisted of two serpents. Moreover, in the book, Death is described as an intangible "shadow" wearing a crown. In the illustration, Blake conveys this intangibility through the transparency of the Death's anthropomorphic figure.
While William Blake's interpretation of Paradise Lost is more faithful to the text, William Strang's interpretation has a more preaching end because first of all, he depicts Sin as an old and unattractive figure hence suggesting that sinning is undesired. Also, his portrayal of the intangible Death is a figure in a black cloak whose face is a human skull. Strang is suggesting that death is directly concerned with humans and that sinners will die and end up Hell.
Emma Taline Noradounkian
Apr 20, 2012, 1:31:57 PM4/20/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
I agree on all of the points that you brought up concerning Strang's
illustration. I may add that the portrayal of Sin as old and
unattractive is possibly due to Satan's disgust of her in Hell, as
seen in line 2.748. Satan thought of her to be "fair" in Heaven, but
he is repulsed by her in Hell. This suggests that Strang has depicted
Sin through Satan's eyes.
As for “Satan, Sin, and Death: 'Whence and what art thou, execrable
shape ...
?' (II.681)”, although I agree on the points about the shades of red
and Sin's depiction,
I do not share the same opinion about the setting of the scene. It is
apparent that it is Hell, but some key elements from the narrative of
Milton are not accurately illustrated in Blake's work. The gate of
Hell is seen to be
massive, made of three different metals, in "Paradise Lost", but the
artist chose to ignore this detail. Instead, the setting of the
illustration is used to put a lot of emphasis on the action itself,
especially on Satan who is the most prominent figure. He takes up more
than half of the scene as I had mentioned in my first post.
Having brought up the transparency of Death in order to convey his
intangibility is a very good point. I can't believe that I had
overlooked it while observing the image.
> > illlustration/index.html#<http://www.christs.cam.ac.uk/darknessvisible/illlustration/index.html#>)
illustration. I may add that the portrayal of Sin as old and
unattractive is possibly due to Satan's disgust of her in Hell, as
seen in line 2.748. Satan thought of her to be "fair" in Heaven, but
he is repulsed by her in Hell. This suggests that Strang has depicted
Sin through Satan's eyes.
As for “Satan, Sin, and Death: 'Whence and what art thou, execrable
shape ...
?' (II.681)”, although I agree on the points about the shades of red
and Sin's depiction,
I do not share the same opinion about the setting of the scene. It is
apparent that it is Hell, but some key elements from the narrative of
Milton are not accurately illustrated in Blake's work. The gate of
Hell is seen to be
massive, made of three different metals, in "Paradise Lost", but the
artist chose to ignore this detail. Instead, the setting of the
illustration is used to put a lot of emphasis on the action itself,
especially on Satan who is the most prominent figure. He takes up more
than half of the scene as I had mentioned in my first post.
Having brought up the transparency of Death in order to convey his
intangibility is a very good point. I can't believe that I had
overlooked it while observing the image.
Cindy Yang
Apr 20, 2012, 3:42:44 PM4/20/12
to Literary Survey Section 73
I agree with your analysis of these two illustrations. However I do
not think that William Strang's picture of Sin and Death does not
include action. On the one hand, Death is holding his spear up and
looks as if he is about to attack someone in front of him. On the
other hand, Sin seems distraught: her hands are in the air (as if she
were terrified), her mouth is open suggesting that she is about to
speak or shout and her hair is big and voluminous and looks thrown
back suggesting movement. This illustration describes the scene when
Sin is about to interrupt Death and Satan who are about to battle. I
believe that Strang purposely chose to crop out Satan to emphasize the
introduction of these two characters.
not think that William Strang's picture of Sin and Death does not
include action. On the one hand, Death is holding his spear up and
looks as if he is about to attack someone in front of him. On the
other hand, Sin seems distraught: her hands are in the air (as if she
were terrified), her mouth is open suggesting that she is about to
speak or shout and her hair is big and voluminous and looks thrown
back suggesting movement. This illustration describes the scene when
Sin is about to interrupt Death and Satan who are about to battle. I
believe that Strang purposely chose to crop out Satan to emphasize the
introduction of these two characters.
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