Recap of your meeting with Interlisp

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways - Documentation organization and updates need attention; an issue will be created to address this - Several PRs were reviewed and approved, including fixes for system external format and T-edit improvements - Progress made on font metrics, HTML stream generation, and refactoring T-edit code - Discussion on reviving and modernizing the "Talk" collaborative editing feature Topics Documentation Organization - Current state of documentation is scattered across different repos and versions - Need to decide how to handle old (Medley 1.0, 2.0) vs. new (Medley 3.5) documentation - Proposal to create an issue for organizing documentation and soliciting ideas for improvement - Suggestion to document new changes in a single, easily findable location PR Reviews and Approvals - PR 2096 (Master Scope improvements) and 2089 (Get Funds fix) were approved - Discussion on system external format issues and potential fixes - Agreed to create a prominent guide for setting up EOL conventions when cloning the repo Font Metrics and HTML Stream Generation - Herb generated numerous font metrics files, considering how to package for easy installation - HTML stream generation progressing well, pending documentation and testing - Discussed potential for adding color support to T-edit in the future T-edit Refactoring and Improvements - Ron worked on refactoring T-edit code to improve structure and reduce potential for bugs - Implemented new actions for parentheses and quotes insertion - Discussed the need for approving PRs sequentially to avoid conflicts "Talk" Feature Revival - Examined old "Talk" collaborative editing feature code - Discussed challenges in modernizing the feature, including outdated TCP/IP implementations - Agreed to organize and compile the code, possibly documenting its intent for future reference Next Steps - Create an issue for documentation organization and improvement - Update contributor guidelines to include documentation requirements for PRs - Herb to push HTML stream generation code to his repo and send a note - Ron to organize and compile "Talk" feature code for further examination - Approve and merge discussed PRs (2096, 2089) - Create a guide for setting up EOL conventions when cloning the repo

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly April 07, 2025  •  140 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Document care name function in T edit release notes file Ron Kaplan Create GitHub issue re organizing documentation. Outline current state, solicit proposals to fix. Include decisions needed. Frank Halasz Add instructions to repo README/contrib guide re setting EOL convention in Git to LF when cloning repo on Mac/Windows Larry Masinter-lisp Push HTML stream implementation to personal GitHub repo, send note about it Herb Jellinek Retrieve talk-related files from obsolete dir, rename w/ hyphen convention, organize in talk subdir Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways Documentation organization and updates need attention; an issue will be created to address this Several PRs were reviewed and approved, including fixes for system external format and T-edit improvements Progress made on font metrics, HTML stream generation, and refactoring T-edit code Discussion on reviving and modernizing the "Talk" collaborative editing feature Topics Documentation Organization Current state of documentation is scattered across different repos and versions Need to decide how to handle old (Medley 1.0, 2.0) vs. new (Medley 3.5) documentation Proposal to create an issue for organizing documentation and soliciting ideas for improvement Suggestion to document new changes in a single, easily findable location PR Reviews and Approvals PR 2096 (Master Scope improvements) and 2089 (Get Funds fix) were approved Discussion on system external format issues and potential fixes Agreed to create a prominent guide for setting up EOL conventions when cloning the repo Font Metrics and HTML Stream Generation Herb generated numerous font metrics files, considering how to package for easy installation HTML stream generation progressing well, pending documentation and testing Discussed potential for adding color support to T-edit in the future T-edit Refactoring and Improvements Ron worked on refactoring T-edit code to improve structure and reduce potential for bugs Implemented new actions for parentheses and quotes insertion Discussed the need for approving PRs sequentially to avoid conflicts "Talk" Feature Revival Examined old "Talk" collaborative editing feature code Discussed challenges in modernizing the feature, including outdated TCP/IP implementations Agreed to organize and compile the code, possibly documenting its intent for future reference Next Steps Create an issue for documentation organization and improvement Update contributor guidelines to include documentation requirements for PRs Herb to push HTML stream generation code to his repo and send a note Ron to organize and compile "Talk" feature code for further examination Approve and merge discussed PRs (2096, 2089) Create a guide for setting up EOL conventions when cloning the repo View Meeting → Ask Fathom! Ask our AI Assistant for answers and insights. It's ChatGPT for your meetings! Try Ask Fathom → Never take notes again. Sign up for Free 🎁 Referral bonus: Sign up now and unlock a free month of Premium for you and Larry

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and ongoing development efforts. Key Takeaways - Bibliography management: Agreed to upload original documents to Internet Archive for permanent storage and linking - Font handling improvements discussed, including potential on-the-fly conversion of system fonts - Several technical issues raised around compilation, loading, and debugging that need further investigation - Progress made on AI-assisted search functionality for the Interlisp website Topics Bibliography Document Storage - Issue: How to handle documents not already on the web when adding to Zotero bibliography - Solution: Upload original documents to Internet Archive for permanent URL and storage - Action: Update bibliography intake guide to include this process - Benefit: Provides stable links while keeping documents publicly accessible Font Handling Improvements - Discussed potential for on-the-fly conversion of system fonts to Interlisp format - Challenges: Memory usage, processing time for large Unicode fonts - Possible approach: Cache converted fonts locally after first use - Next steps: Create list of common fonts to add through manual conversion process Technical Issues - Stephen reported problems with load function not printing expressions as expected - Herb encountered compilation issues related to cleanup options - Matt noted ongoing font-related errors in TEdit and DInfo - Action: Create GitHub issues to track and investigate these problems AI-Assisted Search Progress - Bill demonstrated prototype of Gemini AI integration for Interlisp.org search - Challenge: Securely handling API credentials for static site - Next steps: Explore proxy server approach to manage authentication Graph Library Package - Stephen's student nearing completion of ~35 function graph library - Written in combination of Interlisp and Common Lisp - Plan to submit to Interlisp Users repository after documentation Next Steps - Paolo to review and update glossary with recently discussed terminology - Create GitHub issue for bibliography page-per-item project - Investigate and document technical issues around load, compilation, and font errors - Continue development of AI-assisted search, focusing on secure credential handling - Submit completed graph library package to Interlisp Users repository

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 09, 2025  •  123 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and ongoing development efforts. Key Takeaways Bibliography management: Agreed to upload original documents to Internet Archive for permanent storage and linking Font handling improvements discussed, including potential on-the-fly conversion of system fonts Several technical issues raised around compilation, loading, and debugging that need further investigation Progress made on AI-assisted search functionality for the Interlisp website Topics Bibliography Document Storage Issue: How to handle documents not already on the web when adding to Zotero bibliography Solution: Upload original documents to Internet Archive for permanent URL and storage Action: Update bibliography intake guide to include this process Benefit: Provides stable links while keeping documents publicly accessible Font Handling Improvements Discussed potential for on-the-fly conversion of system fonts to Interlisp format Challenges: Memory usage, processing time for large Unicode fonts Possible approach: Cache converted fonts locally after first use Next steps: Create list of common fonts to add through manual conversion process Technical Issues Stephen reported problems with load function not printing expressions as expected Herb encountered compilation issues related to cleanup options Matt noted ongoing font-related errors in TEdit and DInfo Action: Create GitHub issues to track and investigate these problems AI-Assisted Search Progress Bill demonstrated prototype of Gemini AI integration for Interlisp.org search Challenge: Securely handling API credentials for static site Next steps: Explore proxy server approach to manage authentication Graph Library Package Stephen's student nearing completion of ~35 function graph library Written in combination of Interlisp and Common Lisp Plan to submit to Interlisp Users repository after documentation Next Steps Paolo to review and update glossary with recently discussed terminology Create GitHub issue for bibliography page-per-item project Investigate and document technical issues around load, compilation, and font errors Continue development of AI-assisted search, focusing on secure credential handling Submit completed graph library package to Interlisp Users repository

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Font handling improvements progressing, with new BDF font generation capabilities - Ongoing work on window splitting and text selection behavior in TEdit - Need to improve documentation and decide on approach for bibliography page generation - Received CVs from potential grad student assistants to review Topics IntelliJ License Renewal - Subscription active until April 4, 2026 - Calendar reminder set for March 4, 2025 to renew free JetBrains licenses Load Up Issues - Larry experiencing problems with load up after running HC files - Frank working on improving load up process, hopes to finish in next few days Font Handling Improvements - Matt implemented BDF font generation from OTF/TTF fonts - Allows creation of new sizes/variants of existing fonts - Some concerns about potential copyright issues, but likely okay for raster fonts - Need to document process and consider adding warnings about memory usage TEdit Enhancements - Ron working on improving window splitting behavior - Considering changes to text selection protocol to match other editors - Simplified some formatting code by pre-computing character properties Bibliography Page Generation - Need to convert single large HTML page to individual pages per document - Challenges with Hugo static site generator - may need pre-processing step - Matt to investigate potential approaches, possibly writing custom tool Potential Student Assistants - Received CVs from computer science grad students - Need to review and match to potential projects Next Steps - Matt to retry font generation and document process/issues - Frank to finish load up improvements - Ron to continue work on TEdit enhancements - Matt to investigate bibliography page generation options - Larry and Herb to review student CVs and discuss potential projects - Consider adding warnings/documentation around font generation memory usage

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly April 14, 2025  •  118 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Finish implementation of load up changes to match documentation; prepare PR Frank Halasz Retry and document stack overflow issue when Adobe Reader locks PDF file; write up GitHub issue with details Matt Heffron Continue debugging split window display update issue; focus on paragraph overlap case Ron Kaplan Review CVs of potential computer science grad student assistants; discuss with Herb via Discord Larry Masinter-lisp Review CVs of potential computer science grad student assistants; discuss with Larry via Discord Herb Jellinek Investigate pre-processing approach for Hugo to generate individual bibliography pages; test locally Matt Heffron Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Font handling improvements progressing, with new BDF font generation capabilities Ongoing work on window splitting and text selection behavior in TEdit Need to improve documentation and decide on approach for bibliography page generation Received CVs from potential grad student assistants to review Topics IntelliJ License Renewal Subscription active until April 4, 2026 Calendar reminder set for March 4, 2025 to renew free JetBrains licenses Load Up Issues Larry experiencing problems with load up after running HC files Frank working on improving load up process, hopes to finish in next few days Font Handling Improvements Matt implemented BDF font generation from OTF/TTF fonts Allows creation of new sizes/variants of existing fonts Some concerns about potential copyright issues, but likely okay for raster fonts Need to document process and consider adding warnings about memory usage TEdit Enhancements Ron working on improving window splitting behavior Considering changes to text selection protocol to match other editors Simplified some formatting code by pre-computing character properties Bibliography Page Generation Need to convert single large HTML page to individual pages per document Challenges with Hugo static site generator - may need pre-processing step Matt to investigate potential approaches, possibly writing custom tool Potential Student Assistants Received CVs from computer science grad students Need to review and match to potential projects Next Steps Matt to retry font generation and document process/issues Frank to finish load up improvements Ron to continue work on TEdit enhancements Matt to investigate bibliography page generation options Larry and Herb to review student CVs and discuss potential projects Consider adding warnings/documentation around font generation memory usage

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Medley Interlisp project updates, developments, and related topics. Key Takeaways - New LinkedIn group created for Interlisp community engagement (60+ potential members identified) - Progress on bibliography work, including web page generation and metadata formatting - Ongoing development of color support and window pane coordination in Interlisp - Interesting discussion on historical programming language features (mixins, object systems) with guest Shardul Chiplunkar Topics LinkedIn Group and Community Engagement - Larry created an Interlisp LinkedIn group to connect with 60+ identified potential members - Discussed strategies for populating group info and inviting members - Considered automatic cross-posting from Mastodon to LinkedIn Bibliography and Documentation Work - Ellie continuing work on bibliographic intake guide, refining and adding content - Matt developing code to generate individual web pages for bibliography entries - Discussed including microformat metadata in pages for tools like Zotero - Herb considering creation of an Interlisp collection on archive.org for non-PARC materials Programming Language History and Features - Guest Shardul Chiplunkar discussed his research on mixins and syntax diagrams - Group shared insights on historical object systems (LOOPS, Flavors, CLOS) - Ron Kaplan offered to share materials on Lexical Functional Grammar tools Interlisp Development Updates - Larry identified issue with font preloading and HTML files in directories - Ron working on color support infrastructure and window pane coordination - Herb made progress on generating HTML from HC files Historical Software Preservation - Steve Kaisler working on loading and annotating historical systems (URISCO, STRADS) - Discussed challenges of running old systems and finding documentation Computer History Museums - Paolo planning visit to large computer museum in Biella, Italy - Group discussed various computer history museums and preservation efforts globally Next Steps - Larry to finish setting up LinkedIn group and consider cross-posting strategy - Ellie to complete bibliography guide updates by Friday for broader review next week - Matt to continue work on bibliography web page generation - Ron to further develop color support and window pane coordination - Herb to progress on HC file HTML output - Paolo to visit computer museum and share findings with the group

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 16, 2025  •  116 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting

Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Medley Interlisp project updates, developments, and related topics. Key Takeaways New LinkedIn group created for Interlisp community engagement (60+ potential members identified) Progress on bibliography work, including web page generation and metadata formatting Ongoing development of color support and window pane coordination in Interlisp Interesting discussion on historical programming language features (mixins, object systems) with guest Shardul Chiplunkar Topics LinkedIn Group and Community Engagement Larry created an Interlisp LinkedIn group to connect with 60+ identified potential members Discussed strategies for populating group info and inviting members Considered automatic cross-posting from Mastodon to LinkedIn Bibliography and Documentation Work Ellie continuing work on bibliographic intake guide, refining and adding content Matt developing code to generate individual web pages for bibliography entries Discussed including microformat metadata in pages for tools like Zotero Herb considering creation of an Interlisp collection on archive.org for non-PARC materials Programming Language History and Features Guest Shardul Chiplunkar discussed his research on mixins and syntax diagrams Group shared insights on historical object systems (LOOPS, Flavors, CLOS) Ron Kaplan offered to share materials on Lexical Functional Grammar tools Interlisp Development Updates Larry identified issue with font preloading and HTML files in directories Ron working on color support infrastructure and window pane coordination Herb made progress on generating HTML from HC files Historical Software Preservation Steve Kaisler working on loading and annotating historical systems (URISCO, STRADS) Discussed challenges of running old systems and finding documentation Computer History Museums Paolo planning visit to large computer museum in Biella, Italy Group discussed various computer history museums and preservation efforts globally Next Steps Larry to finish setting up LinkedIn group and consider cross-posting strategy Ellie to complete bibliography guide updates by Friday for broader review next week Matt to continue work on bibliography web page generation Ron to further develop color support and window pane coordination Herb to progress on HC file HTML output Paolo to visit computer museum and share findings with the group View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Several PRs and issues discussed, including font handling improvements and UI library development - Ongoing challenges with student recruitment for internships/research assistants - Progress made on screen updating and window management, but some complex issues remain - Need for further investigation into CLOS browser errors and compatibility Topics PR and Issue Updates - PR #2111 approved but needs revision to address list users package and care names functionality - PR #2108 approved, addressing encoding of -1 as replacement for slug in fonts - Issue #2109 identified, related to zero-width characters and bitmaps in fonts - PR #2112 discussed, regarding handling of nil in 'where is' function Font Handling Improvements - Matt working on fixing issues with PDF generation from TTF files on Mac - Discussed potential changes to strike file format to better handle zero-width glyphs - Considerations for PostScript output and embedding fonts for non-standard characters UI Library Development (Paolo) - Presented "Dandagui" library for simplifying text and graphics output in Medley - Demonstrated creation of windows, text streams, and basic output functionality - Plans to add rich text support, graphics capabilities, and managed windows Screen Updating and Window Management (Ron) - Resolved issues with split windows and screen updating optimization - Improved window deactivation and closing behavior - Investigating complexities of maintaining text stream and window relationships - Considering changes to external format handling and character code mappings Student Recruitment - Interviewed two graduate student candidates from University of Alberta - Challenges in finding candidates with Lisp knowledge or broad programming language experience - Considering expanding search to computer engineering department CLOS Browser Issues - User-visible error in CLOS browser when package name is missing - Difficulty in diagnosing issue due to complexity of CLOS implementation - Potential discrepancy between versions of CLOS files in the system Next Steps - Ron to update PR #2111 with changes and close the issue - Matt to continue work on font handling issues, particularly zero-width characters - Herb to follow up on student recruitment, potentially expanding search criteria - Further investigation needed for CLOS browser errors and version compatibility - Consider creating separate, more user-friendly functions for 'where is' functionality

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly April 21, 2025  •  126 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Several PRs and issues discussed, including font handling improvements and UI library development Ongoing challenges with student recruitment for internships/research assistants Progress made on screen updating and window management, but some complex issues remain Need for further investigation into CLOS browser errors and compatibility Topics PR and Issue Updates PR #2111 approved but needs revision to address list users package and care names functionality PR #2108 approved, addressing encoding of -1 as replacement for slug in fonts Issue #2109 identified, related to zero-width characters and bitmaps in fonts PR #2112 discussed, regarding handling of nil in 'where is' function Font Handling Improvements Matt working on fixing issues with PDF generation from TTF files on Mac Discussed potential changes to strike file format to better handle zero-width glyphs Considerations for PostScript output and embedding fonts for non-standard characters UI Library Development (Paolo) Presented "Dandagui" library for simplifying text and graphics output in Medley Demonstrated creation of windows, text streams, and basic output functionality Plans to add rich text support, graphics capabilities, and managed windows Screen Updating and Window Management (Ron) Resolved issues with split windows and screen updating optimization Improved window deactivation and closing behavior Investigating complexities of maintaining text stream and window relationships Considering changes to external format handling and character code mappings Student Recruitment Interviewed two graduate student candidates from University of Alberta Challenges in finding candidates with Lisp knowledge or broad programming language experience Considering expanding search to computer engineering department CLOS Browser Issues User-visible error in CLOS browser when package name is missing Difficulty in diagnosing issue due to complexity of CLOS implementation Potential discrepancy between versions of CLOS files in the system Next Steps Ron to update PR #2111 with changes and close the issue Matt to continue work on font handling issues, particularly zero-width characters Herb to follow up on student recruitment, potentially expanding search criteria Further investigation needed for CLOS browser errors and version compatibility Consider creating separate, more user-friendly functions for 'where is' functionality View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss progress and updates on the Interlisp project. Key Takeaways - Abhik is finishing the Interlisp primer, with only two chapters left - The team is working on improving bibliography management and intake processes - There are ongoing efforts to refine font handling and character encoding in Interlisp - The group discussed potential collaboration with the new Computer History Museum CEO Topics Interlisp Primer Progress - Abhik is close to completing the primer, with only two introductory chapters left - The primer is being published on GitBook for easy access and collaboration - Eleanor has been reviewing and testing the new primer content Bibliography Management - Eleanor is developing a Google Form for easier bibliography entry submission - The team discussed how to handle collections and metadata for bibliography entries in Zotero - There are ongoing efforts to improve the presentation of the bibliography on the website Font Handling and Character Encoding - Matt is working on improving BDF font reading and conversion - The team discussed challenges with character encoding, including XCCS vs. Medley encoding - Ron is refining T-edit to handle color support and improve text stream handling Computer History Museum Collaboration - The new CEO of the Computer History Museum has a background in NASA and lunar systems - The team is considering reaching out to explore potential collaboration opportunities - There was discussion about simulating historical networks like ARPANET using modern hardware Historical Documents - Paolo found interesting historical reports about Interlisp development in a military database - These reports provide valuable insights into the project's history and development milestones Next Steps - Continue refining the Interlisp primer and gather feedback - Implement improvements to bibliography management and intake processes - Address font handling and character encoding issues in the codebase - Explore potential collaboration with the Computer History Museum - Review and potentially incorporate historical information from newly discovered documents

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 23, 2025  •  121 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss progress and updates on the Interlisp project. Key Takeaways Abhik is finishing the Interlisp primer, with only two chapters left The team is working on improving bibliography management and intake processes There are ongoing efforts to refine font handling and character encoding in Interlisp The group discussed potential collaboration with the new Computer History Museum CEO Topics Interlisp Primer Progress Abhik is close to completing the primer, with only two introductory chapters left The primer is being published on GitBook for easy access and collaboration Eleanor has been reviewing and testing the new primer content Bibliography Management Eleanor is developing a Google Form for easier bibliography entry submission The team discussed how to handle collections and metadata for bibliography entries in Zotero There are ongoing efforts to improve the presentation of the bibliography on the website Font Handling and Character Encoding Matt is working on improving BDF font reading and conversion The team discussed challenges with character encoding, including XCCS vs. Medley encoding Ron is refining T-edit to handle color support and improve text stream handling Computer History Museum Collaboration The new CEO of the Computer History Museum has a background in NASA and lunar systems The team is considering reaching out to explore potential collaboration opportunities There was discussion about simulating historical networks like ARPANET using modern hardware Historical Documents Paolo found interesting historical reports about Interlisp development in a military database These reports provide valuable insights into the project's history and development milestones Next Steps Continue refining the Interlisp primer and gather feedback Implement improvements to bibliography management and intake processes Address font handling and character encoding issues in the codebase Explore potential collaboration with the Computer History Museum Review and potentially incorporate historical information from newly discovered documents View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development, issues, and pull requests. Key Takeaways - Progress made on font handling, color support, and Unicode implementation - Several pull requests reviewed and merged, addressing various bugs and improvements - Ongoing challenges with Common Lisp loop macro compatibility and file package versioning Topics Font and Color Handling - Matt is close to adding color support back into PostScript stream - Discovered issues with RGB vs. grayscale color handling in PostScript-to-PDF conversion - Discussed potential improvements for BDF font handling and PostScript file embedding - Herb is nearing release of HTML stream implementation Unicode and Character Encoding - Ron implemented MCCS (Modified Character Code Standard) up to, but not including, moving glyphs in terminal and XCCS fonts - Discussed challenges with underscore and caret character handling in MCCS - Ongoing work to ensure consistent behavior across different font families and encoding schemes Common Lisp Compatibility - Identified issues with CL loop macro compatibility in some files - Discussed potential causes, including changes in loop macro implementation and compiler differences - Action item to investigate and resolve loop macro compatibility issues Pull Request Reviews - Reviewed and approved several PRs, including improvements to pointless encoding handling and edit callers functionality - Discussed ongoing work on PR #2119, addressing window closing and pane management issues - Approved PR for improved color name and RGB triple handling Development Environment - Frank implemented a fix for LDE path issues, improving consistency in development environments - Discussed challenges with Git functions and symbolic link handling Next Steps - Ron to investigate and resolve remaining issues with PR #2119 before merging - Matt to continue work on color support in PostScript stream - Investigate and resolve Common Lisp loop macro compatibility issues - Review and potentially revert changes to edit callers function that may have introduced unintended behavior - Continue testing and refinement of font handling and Unicode support

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly April 28, 2025  •  123 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development, issues, and pull requests. Key Takeaways Progress made on font handling, color support, and Unicode implementation Several pull requests reviewed and merged, addressing various bugs and improvements Ongoing challenges with Common Lisp loop macro compatibility and file package versioning Topics Font and Color Handling Matt is close to adding color support back into PostScript stream Discovered issues with RGB vs. grayscale color handling in PostScript-to-PDF conversion Discussed potential improvements for BDF font handling and PostScript file embedding Herb is nearing release of HTML stream implementation Unicode and Character Encoding Ron implemented MCCS (Modified Character Code Standard) up to, but not including, moving glyphs in terminal and XCCS fonts Discussed challenges with underscore and caret character handling in MCCS Ongoing work to ensure consistent behavior across different font families and encoding schemes Common Lisp Compatibility Identified issues with CL loop macro compatibility in some files Discussed potential causes, including changes in loop macro implementation and compiler differences Action item to investigate and resolve loop macro compatibility issues Pull Request Reviews Reviewed and approved several PRs, including improvements to pointless encoding handling and edit callers functionality Discussed ongoing work on PR #2119, addressing window closing and pane management issues Approved PR for improved color name and RGB triple handling Development Environment Frank implemented a fix for LDE path issues, improving consistency in development environments Discussed challenges with Git functions and symbolic link handling Next Steps Ron to investigate and resolve remaining issues with PR #2119 before merging Matt to continue work on color support in PostScript stream Investigate and resolve Common Lisp loop macro compatibility issues Review and potentially revert changes to edit callers function that may have introduced unintended behavior Continue testing and refinement of font handling and Unicode support View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates and technical topics Key Takeaways - Eleanor is working on bibliography style guidelines and namespace consistency for the Interlisp project - The team discussed font handling improvements and new font options being added to Medley - There were updates on social media presence, particularly regarding the Faustodon Mastodon instance - Paolo shared new functions added to his Dandy Guy library for working with T-Edit windows Topics Bibliography Style and Namespace Consistency - Eleanor is researching bibliography style guidelines for computer science/Interlisp project - Challenges with divergent author names and information fields across sources - Considering using document-specific naming vs. normalized names - Potential to write a paper on bibliographic control issues for digital humanities Gitbook and New Primer Draft - Some users experiencing login/stability issues with Gitbook - Draft primer content needs refinement, especially on technical details - Team discussing best approach for reviewing and improving the primer Faustodon/Mastodon Update - Faustodon (Mastodon instance) undergoing administrative changes - Team deciding to maintain Interlisp account on Faustodon for now - Discussing potential for cross-posting to other platforms to increase reach Font Handling Improvements - Matt documented process for generating display font files from TTF - New font options being added, including Source Code Pro - Challenges with font conversion, printing, and maintaining consistency across systems - Team considering focusing on one font to establish full workflow before expanding T-Edit Window Functions - Paolo added new functions to Dandy Guy library for clearing windows and printing messages - Discussion on appropriate level of abstraction vs. direct API usage Next Steps - Eleanor to draft initial style guidelines for bibliography for team review - Continue refining primer draft, focusing on accuracy and appropriate level of detail - Matt to identify a single font to establish full workflow from display to printing - Team to consider strategy for introducing new fonts while maintaining backwards compatibility

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 30, 2025  •  132 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates and technical topics Key Takeaways Eleanor is working on bibliography style guidelines and namespace consistency for the Interlisp project The team discussed font handling improvements and new font options being added to Medley There were updates on social media presence, particularly regarding the Faustodon Mastodon instance Paolo shared new functions added to his Dandy Guy library for working with T-Edit windows Topics Bibliography Style and Namespace Consistency Eleanor is researching bibliography style guidelines for computer science/Interlisp project Challenges with divergent author names and information fields across sources Considering using document-specific naming vs. normalized names Potential to write a paper on bibliographic control issues for digital humanities Gitbook and New Primer Draft Some users experiencing login/stability issues with Gitbook Draft primer content needs refinement, especially on technical details Team discussing best approach for reviewing and improving the primer Faustodon/Mastodon Update Faustodon (Mastodon instance) undergoing administrative changes Team deciding to maintain Interlisp account on Faustodon for now Discussing potential for cross-posting to other platforms to increase reach Font Handling Improvements Matt documented process for generating display font files from TTF New font options being added, including Source Code Pro Challenges with font conversion, printing, and maintaining consistency across systems Team considering focusing on one font to establish full workflow before expanding T-Edit Window Functions Paolo added new functions to Dandy Guy library for clearing windows and printing messages Discussion on appropriate level of abstraction vs. direct API usage Next Steps Eleanor to draft initial style guidelines for bibliography for team review Continue refining primer draft, focusing on accuracy and appropriate level of detail Matt to identify a single font to establish full workflow from display to printing Team to consider strategy for introducing new fonts while maintaining backwards compatibility View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development issues and progress. Key Takeaways - Font handling and display issues remain a significant challenge, particularly for high-resolution displays and DINFO windows - JSON parsing and string handling need refinement, especially for pasting large JSON strings - Storage analysis tools like SPY could be improved to track memory allocation - Mouse process handling in certain UI interactions (e.g. editor invocation) needs improvement for better user experience Topics Font Handling and Display Issues - Discussion on improving font display for high-resolution screens, particularly for DINFO windows - Proposal to create new "Medley fonts" that are easier to manipulate and extend - Consideration of using function keys for special characters (e.g. underscore, caret) in MCCS encoding - Need to ensure consistent handling of character encodings across different contexts (e.g. shell commands, file I/O) JSON Parsing and String Handling - Challenges with pasting large JSON strings containing quotes into the Lisp environment - Suggestion to use file input or custom test functions to avoid clipboard/pasting issues - Potential improvements to JSON library to handle file/stream input directly Storage Analysis and Performance Tools - Interest in developing SPY-like tool for analyzing storage consumption - Discussion on potential methods to track memory allocation, possibly by modifying SPY or using breakdown system - Note that breakdown system currently has issues and needs investigation Mouse Process and UI Interaction - Identified issue where editor invocation can lock up mouse input - Discussion on proper use of spawn-mouse and when it should be automatically applied - Agreement to create new issue ticket to track and address this problem Next Steps - Investigate and implement solution for scaling fonts in DINFO windows (Issue #116) - Explore improvements to JSON parsing library, particularly for file/stream input - Research breakdown system and potential improvements to storage analysis tools - Create issue ticket for mouse process locking during editor invocation - Larry to look into breakdown system notes from Medley release - Herb to open tickets for identified UI/UX issues - Consider reaching out to original Interlisp developers (e.g. Vannelli, Masinter) for insight on certain historical design decisions

Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly May 05, 2025  •  141 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Experiment with using function keys for underscore/caret in MCCS; assess impact on existing functionality Larry Masinter-lisp Investigate BREAKDOWN system changes in Medley release notes for potential storage consumption tracking Larry Masinter-lisp Test HTMLStream alpha version sent by Herb; provide feedback Matt Heffron Test HTMLStream alpha version sent by Herb; provide feedback Ron Kaplan Open GitHub issue re BREAKDOWN function not working as expected Herb Jellinek Open GitHub issue re mouse getting stuck when Display Edit triggers BREAK Herb Jellinek Plan group lunch; cross-reference availabilities including Matt's 5/18-5/24 trip Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development issues and progress. Key Takeaways Font handling and display issues remain a significant challenge, particularly for high-resolution displays and DINFO windows JSON parsing and string handling need refinement, especially for pasting large JSON strings Storage analysis tools like SPY could be improved to track memory allocation Mouse process handling in certain UI interactions (e.g. editor invocation) needs improvement for better user experience Topics Font Handling and Display Issues Discussion on improving font display for high-resolution screens, particularly for DINFO windows Proposal to create new "Medley fonts" that are easier to manipulate and extend Consideration of using function keys for special characters (e.g. underscore, caret) in MCCS encoding Need to ensure consistent handling of character encodings across different contexts (e.g. shell commands, file I/O) JSON Parsing and String Handling Challenges with pasting large JSON strings containing quotes into the Lisp environment Suggestion to use file input or custom test functions to avoid clipboard/pasting issues Potential improvements to JSON library to handle file/stream input directly Storage Analysis and Performance Tools Interest in developing SPY-like tool for analyzing storage consumption Discussion on potential methods to track memory allocation, possibly by modifying SPY or using breakdown system Note that breakdown system currently has issues and needs investigation Mouse Process and UI Interaction Identified issue where editor invocation can lock up mouse input Discussion on proper use of spawn-mouse and when it should be automatically applied Agreement to create new issue ticket to track and address this problem Next Steps Investigate and implement solution for scaling fonts in DINFO windows (Issue #116) Explore improvements to JSON parsing library, particularly for file/stream input Research breakdown system and potential improvements to storage analysis tools Create issue ticket for mouse process locking during editor invocation Larry to look into breakdown system notes from Medley release Herb to open tickets for identified UI/UX issues Consider reaching out to original Interlisp developers (e.g. Vannelli, Masinter) for insight on certain historical design decisions

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp External meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and upcoming opportunities. Key Takeaways - Ellie's IEEE paper was accepted; revisions requested to add section on Alberta team's involvement - Steve is preparing a paper for HICSS conference on Interlisp history; deadline June 15th - Ron is working on font handling improvements to support high-resolution displays - Paolo experimented with new JSON parsing capabilities in Medley Topics Conference Papers and Presentations - Ellie's IEEE paper accepted for Canadian Computer Engineering Conference (May 26-29) - Minor revisions requested, including section on Alberta team's involvement - Hotel booked; flights still need scheduling - Steve preparing paper for HICSS conference on Interlisp history - Deadline June 15th, decision by August 1st - Focusing on programming languages topic - May add 1-2 more authors; currently at ~9.5 pages (10 page limit) - Opportunity to present Medley at Software Preservation Network event (May 14th) - 15-20 minute slot available - Ellie or Larry could potentially present Technical Updates - Ron working on font handling improvements: - Aiming to support high-resolution displays - Considering approach for handling multiple screen resolutions - Working on MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) implementation - Paolo experimenting with JSON parsing in Medley: - Successfully used curl to call external API from Medley - Discussed potential improvements to JSON handling functions Documentation and Preservation - Discussed approach for documenting undocumented Lisp Users modules - Considering opening issues for individual modules needing documentation - May tag as "good first issues" for newcomers - Explored possibility of acquiring early 1970s Interlisp sources for BBN computers - Team interested in gathering historical artifacts if available Administrative - Larry working on tax filings for Interlisp organization - Discussed need to improve tracking and acknowledgment of donors Next Steps - Ellie to add section on Alberta team's involvement to IEEE paper - Steve to continue work on HICSS paper, potentially adding 1-2 more authors - Ron to continue work on font handling improvements and MCCS implementation - Team to consider approach for improving donor tracking and acknowledgment - Paolo to further explore JSON capabilities in Medley - Consider creating issues for documenting undocumented Lisp Users modules

Get your own FREE AI Meeting Assistant Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly May 07, 2025  •  134 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Write paragraph on Datum for HICSS paper Stephen Kaisler Contact Bill Yeager for more advice on HICSS paper submission requirements Paolo Amoroso Write paragraph on SpinPro for HICSS paper Matt Heffron Incorporate feedback from Ellie, Paolo, Nick into next HICSS paper draft Stephen Kaisler Add section to IEEE paper on Alberta team's involvement with Interlisp project Eleanor Young Create issue about improving tracking/acknowledgment of project donors Larry Masinter-lisp Test mouse middle-button issue with 3-button USB mouse Nick Briggs Extend JSON-GET to handle array indexing for integers in path Ron Kaplan Work on font issues - implement reading/writing of character set infos and fonts Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp External meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and upcoming opportunities. Key Takeaways Ellie's IEEE paper was accepted; revisions requested to add section on Alberta team's involvement Steve is preparing a paper for HICSS conference on Interlisp history; deadline June 15th Ron is working on font handling improvements to support high-resolution displays Paolo experimented with new JSON parsing capabilities in Medley Topics Conference Papers and Presentations Ellie's IEEE paper accepted for Canadian Computer Engineering Conference (May 26-29) Minor revisions requested, including section on Alberta team's involvement Hotel booked; flights still need scheduling Steve preparing paper for HICSS conference on Interlisp history Deadline June 15th, decision by August 1st Focusing on programming languages topic May add 1-2 more authors; currently at ~9.5 pages (10 page limit) Opportunity to present Medley at Software Preservation Network event (May 14th) 15-20 minute slot available Ellie or Larry could potentially present Technical Updates Ron working on font handling improvements: Aiming to support high-resolution displays Considering approach for handling multiple screen resolutions Working on MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) implementation Paolo experimenting with JSON parsing in Medley: Successfully used curl to call external API from Medley Discussed potential improvements to JSON handling functions Documentation and Preservation Discussed approach for documenting undocumented Lisp Users modules Considering opening issues for individual modules needing documentation May tag as "good first issues" for newcomers Explored possibility of acquiring early 1970s Interlisp sources for BBN computers Team interested in gathering historical artifacts if available Administrative Larry working on tax filings for Interlisp organization Discussed need to improve tracking and acknowledgment of donors Next Steps Ellie to add section on Alberta team's involvement to IEEE paper Steve to continue work on HICSS paper, potentially adding 1-2 more authors Ron to continue work on font handling improvements and MCCS implementation Team to consider approach for improving donor tracking and acknowledgment Paolo to further explore JSON capabilities in Medley Consider creating issues for documenting undocumented Lisp Users modules

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues Key Takeaways - Font handling in Medley is complex with multiple layers of abstraction; efforts ongoing to simplify and standardize - Work continues on reconstructing and updating the Interlisp Reference Manual from existing T-Edit files - Several open PRs ready for review/merge, with focus on PR #2119 which has significant changes - Next meeting canceled due to planned lunch event; some members have conflicts Topics Font Handling Complexity - Multiple layers of abstraction: font profiles, font sets, font classes, font devices - Ron working on standardizing font format and offline font processing to simplify - Herb implementing HTML font output using substitution A-list for common font names - Discussion on balancing backward compatibility with simplification efforts Interlisp Reference Manual Reconstruction - Frank working on rebuilding from existing T-Edit files - Original .im source files missing, working with later T-Edit versions - Challenges with automated chapter numbering and table of contents generation - Goal to produce updated manual that can be printed without major errors Version Management and Debugging - Ron demonstrated tools for examining function changes across multiple versions - Tools allow granular comparison of function definitions, helpful for debugging - Discussion on limitations of Git for tracking Medley file changes due to internal file metadata Open Pull Requests - Several PRs ready for review, including JSON enhancements and cleanup efforts - Focus on PR #2119 which has significant changes but appears to not break builds - Larry encountered an error when merging all open PRs, needs further investigation Miscellaneous Updates - Paolo working on rich text output for Windows in Dandy Guy library - Nick looking into Mako file handling and investigating a new user issue on WSL-1 - Matt collaborating with Steve on paper-related work - Frank receiving volunteer award, will miss Wednesday meeting Next Steps - Review and merge non-controversial PRs (JSON, cleanup efforts) - Further testing of PR #2119 to ensure it doesn't break builds - Frank to update load-up scripts to move dribble files to main directory and add lock override option - Nick to make edits to shared paper version based on his previous feedback - Herb to follow up with John Cowan regarding his contributions to the paper

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly May 12, 2025  •  118 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Investigate D-Info image object errors in Section 10.3 Function Evaluation Ron Kaplan Modify load-up script to move dribble files to load-ups directory Frank Halasz Add prompt to override lock file when running load-up script if lock file exists Frank Halasz Apply previously suggested edits to shared version of ACCS paper Nick Briggs Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues Key Takeaways Font handling in Medley is complex with multiple layers of abstraction; efforts ongoing to simplify and standardize Work continues on reconstructing and updating the Interlisp Reference Manual from existing T-Edit files Several open PRs ready for review/merge, with focus on PR #2119 which has significant changes Next meeting canceled due to planned lunch event; some members have conflicts Topics Font Handling Complexity Multiple layers of abstraction: font profiles, font sets, font classes, font devices Ron working on standardizing font format and offline font processing to simplify Herb implementing HTML font output using substitution A-list for common font names Discussion on balancing backward compatibility with simplification efforts Interlisp Reference Manual Reconstruction Frank working on rebuilding from existing T-Edit files Original .im source files missing, working with later T-Edit versions Challenges with automated chapter numbering and table of contents generation Goal to produce updated manual that can be printed without major errors Version Management and Debugging Ron demonstrated tools for examining function changes across multiple versions Tools allow granular comparison of function definitions, helpful for debugging Discussion on limitations of Git for tracking Medley file changes due to internal file metadata Open Pull Requests Several PRs ready for review, including JSON enhancements and cleanup efforts Focus on PR #2119 which has significant changes but appears to not break builds Larry encountered an error when merging all open PRs, needs further investigation Miscellaneous Updates Paolo working on rich text output for Windows in Dandy Guy library Nick looking into Mako file handling and investigating a new user issue on WSL-1 Matt collaborating with Steve on paper-related work Frank receiving volunteer award, will miss Wednesday meeting Next Steps Review and merge non-controversial PRs (JSON, cleanup efforts) Further testing of PR #2119 to ensure it doesn't break builds Frank to update load-up scripts to move dribble files to main directory and add lock override option Nick to make edits to shared paper version based on his previous feedback Herb to follow up with John Cowan regarding his contributions to the paper

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Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Interlisp project progress, challenges, and next steps Key Takeaways - Hicks paper draft expanded to 10 pages; comments incorporated from 4 reviewers - Font infrastructure improvements progressing; need user input on aesthetics/defaults - GitHub project tagging for issues needs renewed focus to aid organization - Ongoing work on URISCO, PostScript fonts, and resolving a load-up bug Topics Hicks Paper Progress - Draft expanded to 10 pages after incorporating comments from 4 reviewers - Ellie to create account on hicks.hawaii.edu for paper submission - Some discussion on collaborative editing challenges using Google Docs vs. other methods IEEE Conference Preparation - Ellie awaiting official feedback on History of Technology track paper (conference in 12 days) - Suggestion to prepare demo of networking capabilities (e.g. loops) for presentation - Potential to visit local computer history museum in Vancouver during conference New Interlisp Primer Review - Expanded scope now includes Lisp primer in addition to Medley-specific content - PDF version to be shared on Lisp Core for easier access/review Font Improvements - Infrastructure for converting to better fonts progressing - Need user input on aesthetics, defaults, and sample font sets - Goal: Improve readability of DINFO on high-res displays as priority GitHub Project Management - Reminder to set project field when submitting new issues - Larry to review untagged issues and assign projects Social Media Updates - Mastodon and BlueSky accounts growing steadily (about 400 followers combined) - These platforms allowing more user interaction than broadcast-only options - Suggestion to use social accounts to request user feedback on specific topics Bitsavers Uploads - Alksova continues uploading Xerox documents, including Smalltalk and printer documentation - Discussion on potential sources of additional Interlisp-specific historical documents Technical Issues and Development - Ron working on new font file format and integration - Herb encountering symbol issues when processing CLTL2 directory - Matt investigating embedding PostScript fonts in print streams - Larry debugging load-up issue related to HC files and T-Edit Next Steps - Ellie to create hicks.hawaii.edu account for paper submission - Review and provide feedback on new Interlisp primer - Users to provide input on font aesthetics and defaults - Renew focus on tagging GitHub issues with appropriate projects - Investigate and resolve load-up bug encountered during HC files processing - Continue development work on fonts, PostScript integration, and URISCO

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly May 14, 2025  •  116 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Create account on hicks.hawaii.edu for paper submission Eleanor Young Check out Vancouver computer history museum mentioned in email Eleanor Young Share PDF of new primer on Lisp Core Paolo Amoroso Review GitHub issues, set project field where missing Larry Masinter-lisp Post call on social media for font selection feedback/volunteers Paolo Amoroso Update website/docs to direct communication to Mastodon/Blue Sky instead of email Paolo Amoroso Review Matt's Hugo draft for website, provide feedback Bill Stumbo Investigate T-Edit failure in HC files process on merged open PRs branch Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Interlisp project progress, challenges, and next steps Key Takeaways Hicks paper draft expanded to 10 pages; comments incorporated from 4 reviewers Font infrastructure improvements progressing; need user input on aesthetics/defaults GitHub project tagging for issues needs renewed focus to aid organization Ongoing work on URISCO, PostScript fonts, and resolving a load-up bug Topics Hicks Paper Progress Draft expanded to 10 pages after incorporating comments from 4 reviewers Ellie to create account on hicks.hawaii.edu for paper submission Some discussion on collaborative editing challenges using Google Docs vs. other methods IEEE Conference Preparation Ellie awaiting official feedback on History of Technology track paper (conference in 12 days) Suggestion to prepare demo of networking capabilities (e.g. loops) for presentation Potential to visit local computer history museum in Vancouver during conference New Interlisp Primer Review Expanded scope now includes Lisp primer in addition to Medley-specific content PDF version to be shared on Lisp Core for easier access/review Font Improvements Infrastructure for converting to better fonts progressing Need user input on aesthetics, defaults, and sample font sets Goal: Improve readability of DINFO on high-res displays as priority GitHub Project Management Reminder to set project field when submitting new issues Larry to review untagged issues and assign projects Social Media Updates Mastodon and BlueSky accounts growing steadily (about 400 followers combined) These platforms allowing more user interaction than broadcast-only options Suggestion to use social accounts to request user feedback on specific topics Bitsavers Uploads Alksova continues uploading Xerox documents, including Smalltalk and printer documentation Discussion on potential sources of additional Interlisp-specific historical documents Technical Issues and Development Ron working on new font file format and integration Herb encountering symbol issues when processing CLTL2 directory Matt investigating embedding PostScript fonts in print streams Larry debugging load-up issue related to HC files and T-Edit Next Steps Ellie to create hicks.hawaii.edu account for paper submission Review and provide feedback on new Interlisp primer Users to provide input on font aesthetics and defaults Renew focus on tagging GitHub issues with appropriate projects Investigate and resolve load-up bug encountered during HC files processing Continue development work on fonts, PostScript integration, and URISCO

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Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Medley Interlisp project progress and updates Key Takeaways - Paper on Interlisp history nearing completion; final review and edits underway before June submission - Ongoing work to improve bibliography presentation on website and enable better searchability - Exploring options for making older Medley versions accessible online (e.g. DOS emulation) - Careful review needed of Envos archive materials before broader sharing due to privacy concerns Topics Paper on Interlisp History - Stephen and Eleanor finalizing 10-page double-column paper for June submission - Larry Masinter to be added as co-author for additional gravitas - One more round of group review planned before submission in ~24 days Medley Primer Development - Abhik working on next chapter after addressing recent comments - Discussion on appropriate length - aiming for concise 30-40 pages vs. original 123 pages - Considering brief Lisp intro and focusing on core "getting started" content Bibliography and Website Improvements - Bill and Matt exploring options to create individual pages for bibliography entries - Goals: Improve search engine optimization and enable better filtering/sorting - Considering using Hugo taxonomies or custom page types - Need to balance detail with efficient presentation and linking to source documents Envos Archive Materials - Paolo exploring materials; found valuable historical info on Medley/Interlisp development - Caution needed regarding personal/private information before broader sharing - Herb to assist with careful review process and potential use of archival tools Online Access to Older Medley Versions - Discussing options like Docker containers or JavaScript emulators (e.g. PCJS) - Concerns about performance of browser-based emulation - Need to clearly indicate these are for historical reference, not active development Miscellaneous Updates - LinkedIn group growing (21 members) - Paolo to add logo/branding - Ron continuing work on font handling improvements - Stephen making progress debugging/updating Urisko system Next Steps - Larry to send out latest paper draft for final group review - Bill to put bibliography sample page on staging site for feedback - Herb to investigate tools/best practices for reviewing archive materials - Paolo to add branding to LinkedIn group - Continue individual work on assigned tasks (primer, bibliography, font handling, etc.)

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly

May 21, 2025  •  95 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Send updated Hicks paper draft to group for final review. Add Larry as author. Stephen Kaisler Review latest Hicks paper draft. Provide feedback to Stephen. Eleanor Young Address all comments on primer draft within 1 week. Focus on clarifying confusing parts. Abhik Hasnain Upload Interlisp logo + cover image to LinkedIn group. Use same as other socials. Paolo Amoroso Review Envos repo content w/ automation. Focus on identifying private info needing redaction. Herb Jellinek Follow up w/ George Blood re QIC tape restoration if no reply in few days. Ask about return if no progress. Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss Medley Interlisp project progress and updates Key Takeaways Paper on Interlisp history nearing completion; final review and edits underway before June submission Ongoing work to improve bibliography presentation on website and enable better searchability Exploring options for making older Medley versions accessible online (e.g. DOS emulation) Careful review needed of Envos archive materials before broader sharing due to privacy concerns Topics Paper on Interlisp History Stephen and Eleanor finalizing 10-page double-column paper for June submission Larry Masinter to be added as co-author for additional gravitas One more round of group review planned before submission in ~24 days Medley Primer Development Abhik working on next chapter after addressing recent comments Discussion on appropriate length - aiming for concise 30-40 pages vs. original 123 pages Considering brief Lisp intro and focusing on core "getting started" content Bibliography and Website Improvements Bill and Matt exploring options to create individual pages for bibliography entries Goals: Improve search engine optimization and enable better filtering/sorting Considering using Hugo taxonomies or custom page types Need to balance detail with efficient presentation and linking to source documents Envos Archive Materials Paolo exploring materials; found valuable historical info on Medley/Interlisp development Caution needed regarding personal/private information before broader sharing Herb to assist with careful review process and potential use of archival tools Online Access to Older Medley Versions Discussing options like Docker containers or JavaScript emulators (e.g. PCJS) Concerns about performance of browser-based emulation Need to clearly indicate these are for historical reference, not active development Miscellaneous Updates LinkedIn group growing (21 members) - Paolo to add logo/branding Ron continuing work on font handling improvements Stephen making progress debugging/updating Urisko system Next Steps Larry to send out latest paper draft for final group review Bill to put bibliography sample page on staging site for feedback Herb to investigate tools/best practices for reviewing archive materials Paolo to add branding to LinkedIn group Continue individual work on assigned tasks (primer, bibliography, font handling, etc.)

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Frank fixed a WSL issue reported by an external user and is investigating another WSL1-related freeze - Ron is working on font handling improvements, including consolidating character sets and clarifying encoding transformations - Paolo discovered and demonstrated a working spreadsheet program called Intercalc in the Envos sysout - The team discussed file naming conventions, Unicode handling, and potential improvements to the GitHub issue tracking process Topics WSL Bug Fixes and Investigations - Frank fixed a timing issue in the medley script to resolve a WSL problem reported by an external user - Investigating another issue where WSL1 freezes when using certain mouse functions or typing "get region" - The freeze appears to be caused by a tight loop calling getmouse repeatedly - Frank will continue investigating why this only occurs with one specific X server Font Handling Improvements - Ron is working on consolidating character sets into single files to reduce complexity - Developing tools and documentation to clarify font encoding transformations - Aiming to normalize everything to MCCS encoding internally - Discussing potential changes to how font coercions are specified - Considering how to handle Unicode and UTF-8 encodings consistently Intercalc Spreadsheet Discovery - Paolo found a working spreadsheet program called Intercalc in the Envos sysout - Originally developed around 1982-1984 by Dan Russell and later modified by Szybalski - Uses Lisp syntax for formulas and includes business graphics capabilities - Some rendering issues exist but core functionality appears to work - Historically significant as one of the earliest spreadsheet programs after VisiCalc File Naming and Path Handling - Discussed complexities around file naming conventions across different operating systems - Herb raised a question about changes to Common Lisp pathname handling that may have regressed - Considered potential improvements to directory listing and file enumeration functions - Explored options for accessing remote file systems like CHM archives through FUSE or WebDAV GitHub Issue Management - Team has 522 open issues, which is considered excessive - Many issues may be fixed but not properly closed out - Discussed having a dedicated meeting to review and triage open issues - Considered ways to improve issue categorization and closure processes Next Steps - Frank to continue investigating WSL1 freeze issue - Ron to document font handling changes and prepare for code review - Review and potentially merge Frank's WSL-related pull requests (2163 and 2160) - Consider scheduling a dedicated meeting for project/issue review and triage - Explore options for improving remote file system access (e.g. FUSE, WebDAV) - Investigate potential regression in Common Lisp pathname handling

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly May 26, 2025  •  146 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Frank fixed a WSL issue reported by an external user and is investigating another WSL1-related freeze Ron is working on font handling improvements, including consolidating character sets and clarifying encoding transformations Paolo discovered and demonstrated a working spreadsheet program called Intercalc in the Envos sysout The team discussed file naming conventions, Unicode handling, and potential improvements to the GitHub issue tracking process Topics WSL Bug Fixes and Investigations Frank fixed a timing issue in the medley script to resolve a WSL problem reported by an external user Investigating another issue where WSL1 freezes when using certain mouse functions or typing "get region" The freeze appears to be caused by a tight loop calling getmouse repeatedly Frank will continue investigating why this only occurs with one specific X server Font Handling Improvements Ron is working on consolidating character sets into single files to reduce complexity Developing tools and documentation to clarify font encoding transformations Aiming to normalize everything to MCCS encoding internally Discussing potential changes to how font coercions are specified Considering how to handle Unicode and UTF-8 encodings consistently Intercalc Spreadsheet Discovery Paolo found a working spreadsheet program called Intercalc in the Envos sysout Originally developed around 1982-1984 by Dan Russell and later modified by Szybalski Uses Lisp syntax for formulas and includes business graphics capabilities Some rendering issues exist but core functionality appears to work Historically significant as one of the earliest spreadsheet programs after VisiCalc File Naming and Path Handling Discussed complexities around file naming conventions across different operating systems Herb raised a question about changes to Common Lisp pathname handling that may have regressed Considered potential improvements to directory listing and file enumeration functions Explored options for accessing remote file systems like CHM archives through FUSE or WebDAV GitHub Issue Management Team has 522 open issues, which is considered excessive Many issues may be fixed but not properly closed out Discussed having a dedicated meeting to review and triage open issues Considered ways to improve issue categorization and closure processes Next Steps Frank to continue investigating WSL1 freeze issue Ron to document font handling changes and prepare for code review Review and potentially merge Frank's WSL-related pull requests (2163 and 2160) Consider scheduling a dedicated meeting for project/issue review and triage Explore options for improving remote file system access (e.g. FUSE, WebDAV) Investigate potential regression in Common Lisp pathname handling View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - New participant Michael Belanger introduced; writing book on 1970s symbolic AI - Copyright considerations discussed for IEEE paper and project documentation - Social media strategy reviewed; LinkedIn group growing successfully - Ongoing work on bibliography, documentation, font handling, and T-Edit improvements - Paolo demoed graphical output progress in Dandy Guy implementation Topics Project Introduction for New Participant - Michael Belanger writing historical book on 1970s symbolic AI, focusing on concepts and human cognition - Team members introduced backgrounds: Xerox PARC, Interlisp development, AI/NLP research, current revival efforts - Discussed Interlisp's integrated development environment, graphics capabilities, Common Lisp compatibility Copyright and Documentation - IEEE paper: Can post preprint, not camera-ready version; considering where to solicit feedback - ACS aggressively enforces copyright; Matt's SpinPro paper preprint can be shared, not published version - Exploring DOIs and ORCID for project publications and author identification - Challenges locating/accessing original IM files for documentation; likely abandoned for T-Edit format Social Media and Outreach - LinkedIn group growing successfully, now 63 members - Monitoring official profiles on Mastodon, BlueSky, LinkedIn - Considering Google Alerts for broader coverage of mentions - Stack Overflow declining in relevance Bibliography and Search Functionality - Bill exploring tools to generate single-page bibliography from Zotero data - Investigating why GitHub repos not appearing in custom Google search results - May need to harvest GitHub content to make searchable on interlisp.org Ongoing Development Work - Frank: WSL1 timer support, documentation conversion challenges - Herb: HTML Stream documentation, font metric discussions - Ron: Font format documentation, investigating T-Edit crashes - Larry: Coordinating with Internet Archive on video digitization - Paolo: Implementing graphical output in Dandy Guy, demoed triangle pattern Next Steps - Ellie to prepare preprint version of IEEE paper for sharing - Bill to continue exploring bibliography generation tools - Frank to resolve WSL1 timer implementation with Nick - Ron to investigate T-Edit scrolling performance for sketch objects - Team to test RMK-88 branch for T-Edit improvements - Paolo to experiment with inserting sketch objects into T-Edit windows

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly May 28, 2025  •  127 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways New participant Michael Belanger introduced; writing book on 1970s symbolic AI Copyright considerations discussed for IEEE paper and project documentation Social media strategy reviewed; LinkedIn group growing successfully Ongoing work on bibliography, documentation, font handling, and T-Edit improvements Paolo demoed graphical output progress in Dandy Guy implementation Topics Project Introduction for New Participant Michael Belanger writing historical book on 1970s symbolic AI, focusing on concepts and human cognition Team members introduced backgrounds: Xerox PARC, Interlisp development, AI/NLP research, current revival efforts Discussed Interlisp's integrated development environment, graphics capabilities, Common Lisp compatibility Copyright and Documentation IEEE paper: Can post preprint, not camera-ready version; considering where to solicit feedback ACS aggressively enforces copyright; Matt's SpinPro paper preprint can be shared, not published version Exploring DOIs and ORCID for project publications and author identification Challenges locating/accessing original IM files for documentation; likely abandoned for T-Edit format Social Media and Outreach LinkedIn group growing successfully, now 63 members Monitoring official profiles on Mastodon, BlueSky, LinkedIn Considering Google Alerts for broader coverage of mentions Stack Overflow declining in relevance Bibliography and Search Functionality Bill exploring tools to generate single-page bibliography from Zotero data Investigating why GitHub repos not appearing in custom Google search results May need to harvest GitHub content to make searchable on interlisp.org Ongoing Development Work Frank: WSL1 timer support, documentation conversion challenges Herb: HTML Stream documentation, font metric discussions Ron: Font format documentation, investigating T-Edit crashes Larry: Coordinating with Internet Archive on video digitization Paolo: Implementing graphical output in Dandy Guy, demoed triangle pattern Next Steps Ellie to prepare preprint version of IEEE paper for sharing Bill to continue exploring bibliography generation tools Frank to resolve WSL1 timer implementation with Nick Ron to investigate T-Edit scrolling performance for sketch objects Team to test RMK-88 branch for T-Edit improvements Paolo to experiment with inserting sketch objects into T-Edit windows View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Ongoing debugging of memory/array space issues in T-Edit and hardcopy functionality - Font handling improvements being made, including new font format work - Several pull requests reviewed, with decisions made on approvals and further work needed - Discussions on potential future directions like integrating with SBCL or reviving XMAS code Topics T-Edit and Hardcopy Debugging - Ron is investigating memory/array space issues causing crashes in T-Edit and hardcopy functionality - Problem occurs more quickly in PR 2119 than in master branch - Debugging strategy involves narrowing down where issue first appears (opening files, display, etc.) - Suggestion to try disabling garbage collection to isolate if that's related - Discussion of potential causes like freelist corruption Font Handling Improvements - Ron working on new font format that results in much smaller file sizes (60K -> 6K gzipped) - Discussions on how different systems (T-Edit, Postscript, etc.) handle fonts and character encodings - Plans to clean up display fonts, HTML fonts, and BDF fonts to pre-compute data - Considerations for handling ligatures and other special character cases Pull Request Reviews - PR 2119 (T-Edit changes): On hold due to master branch issues - PR 2146 (DINFO graph): Approved after clarifying intended fix - PR 2160 (TALK documentation): Approved, needs merging - PR 2177 (Postscript color issue): Marked as draft, needs further investigation Future Directions - Larry proposed idea of integrating Medley with SBCL using foreign function calls or inter-process communication - Discussion of potentially reviving XMAS code for native X Windows display - Paolo found interesting historical materials in Envos repo, including documentation sources and demo files Next Steps - Ron to continue debugging T-Edit/hardcopy issues, try disabling GC - Investigate Postscript color handling (issue with color values 0 and 7) - Merge approved PRs - Paolo to make list of interesting materials found in Envos repo - Consider creating separate repo for XMAS code - Explore potential SBCL integration approaches

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly June 02, 2025  •  145 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Update PR 2177 documentation re: Postscript color handling, mark as draft Ron Kaplan Investigate Postscript handling of color values 0 and 7 in outchar function Matt Heffron Create list of interesting docs/software found in Envos repo for potential inclusion in other repos Paolo Amoroso Publish reproducible test case for T-Edit memory error in master branch Ron Kaplan Test memory error with GC disabled using disableGC function Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Ongoing debugging of memory/array space issues in T-Edit and hardcopy functionality Font handling improvements being made, including new font format work Several pull requests reviewed, with decisions made on approvals and further work needed Discussions on potential future directions like integrating with SBCL or reviving XMAS code Topics T-Edit and Hardcopy Debugging Ron is investigating memory/array space issues causing crashes in T-Edit and hardcopy functionality Problem occurs more quickly in PR 2119 than in master branch Debugging strategy involves narrowing down where issue first appears (opening files, display, etc.) Suggestion to try disabling garbage collection to isolate if that's related Discussion of potential causes like freelist corruption Font Handling Improvements Ron working on new font format that results in much smaller file sizes (60K -> 6K gzipped) Discussions on how different systems (T-Edit, Postscript, etc.) handle fonts and character encodings Plans to clean up display fonts, HTML fonts, and BDF fonts to pre-compute data Considerations for handling ligatures and other special character cases Pull Request Reviews PR 2119 (T-Edit changes): On hold due to master branch issues PR 2146 (DINFO graph): Approved after clarifying intended fix PR 2160 (TALK documentation): Approved, needs merging PR 2177 (Postscript color issue): Marked as draft, needs further investigation Future Directions Larry proposed idea of integrating Medley with SBCL using foreign function calls or inter-process communication Discussion of potentially reviving XMAS code for native X Windows display Paolo found interesting historical materials in Envos repo, including documentation sources and demo files Next Steps Ron to continue debugging T-Edit/hardcopy issues, try disabling GC Investigate Postscript color handling (issue with color values 0 and 7) Merge approved PRs Paolo to make list of interesting materials found in Envos repo Consider creating separate repo for XMAS code Explore potential SBCL integration approaches

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly update on Medley Interlisp project progress and discussion of technical issues Key Takeaways - Ellie presented at IEEE conference, receiving positive feedback on Medley modernization efforts - Ron investigating T-Edit crash issue, possibly related to pseudohost interaction - Herb working on email archiving tool and HTML Stream release - Matt exploring PostScript font handling improvements for Unicode support - Team discussing strategies for improving documentation and code management Topics IEEE Conference Presentation - Ellie presented paper on Medley modernization, well-received by audience - Highlighted importance of preserving historical context while making Medley usable today - Notable talks on laser history and computing lab recreations (e.g. Waterloo's "Red Room") T-Edit Crash Investigation - Ron investigating crash in T-Edit stress test - Issue may be related to pseudohost interaction or premature freeing of data - Exploring differences in behavior across environments (Mac M2 vs Intel, WSL) - Considering creation of more consistent, non-random stress test Google Search Console Setup - Bill and Herb successfully added DNS entries for Google to verify ownership of interlisp.org - Google now indexing files.interlisp.medley and online.interlisp.org PostScript Font Handling - Matt investigating PostScript driver's handling of characters outside Charset Zero - Clever code (possibly by RMK in '93) computes widths for unmapped characters - Exploring potential for using Type 0 PostScript fonts to support 64K glyphs - Considering mapping from Xerox MCCS codes to Unicode for improved handling Email Archiving Tool - Herb exploring ePAD tool from Stanford for email archiving and discovery - Investigating Lafitte mailbox format and potential need for custom parsing HTML Stream Release - Herb planning to release HTML Stream package - Added support for draw arc and color in draw curve - Considering timing of release before upcoming travel Documentation and Code Management - Discussing strategies for managing historical vs. modern documents - Considering version numbering and repository organization for evolving codebase Next Steps - Ron to continue investigating T-Edit crash, comparing environments with Nick - Herb to release HTML Stream package and explore email archiving tool further - Matt to continue exploring PostScript font improvements - Steve to finalize and submit Interlisp paper for upcoming conference - Team to review and discuss documentation management strategies

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly June 04, 2025  •  95 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Email IEEE conference name to Stephen K Eleanor Young Incorporate Ellie's edits into paper, send to Larry/Ellie for review Stephen Kaisler Open GitHub issue - list manuals to move from Envos to main Medley repo Paolo Amoroso Release HTML Stream on LispCore Herb Jellinek Set up new dev machine, build environment Bill Stumbo Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly update on Medley Interlisp project progress and discussion of technical issues Key Takeaways Ellie presented at IEEE conference, receiving positive feedback on Medley modernization efforts Ron investigating T-Edit crash issue, possibly related to pseudohost interaction Herb working on email archiving tool and HTML Stream release Matt exploring PostScript font handling improvements for Unicode support Team discussing strategies for improving documentation and code management Topics IEEE Conference Presentation Ellie presented paper on Medley modernization, well-received by audience Highlighted importance of preserving historical context while making Medley usable today Notable talks on laser history and computing lab recreations (e.g. Waterloo's "Red Room") T-Edit Crash Investigation Ron investigating crash in T-Edit stress test Issue may be related to pseudohost interaction or premature freeing of data Exploring differences in behavior across environments (Mac M2 vs Intel, WSL) Considering creation of more consistent, non-random stress test Google Search Console Setup Bill and Herb successfully added DNS entries for Google to verify ownership of interlisp.org Google now indexing files.interlisp.medley and online.interlisp.org PostScript Font Handling Matt investigating PostScript driver's handling of characters outside Charset Zero Clever code (possibly by RMK in '93) computes widths for unmapped characters Exploring potential for using Type 0 PostScript fonts to support 64K glyphs Considering mapping from Xerox MCCS codes to Unicode for improved handling Email Archiving Tool Herb exploring ePAD tool from Stanford for email archiving and discovery Investigating Lafitte mailbox format and potential need for custom parsing HTML Stream Release Herb planning to release HTML Stream package Added support for draw arc and color in draw curve Considering timing of release before upcoming travel Documentation and Code Management Discussing strategies for managing historical vs. modern documents Considering version numbering and repository organization for evolving codebase Next Steps Ron to continue investigating T-Edit crash, comparing environments with Nick Herb to release HTML Stream package and explore email archiving tool further Matt to continue exploring PostScript font improvements Steve to finalize and submit Interlisp paper for upcoming conference Team to review and discuss documentation management strategies

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways - WSL1 support implementation nearing completion with PRs ready for review - Ongoing investigation into array block corruption issue, with potential fixes discussed - Color handling improvements for PostScript output proposed and under review - Documentation efforts continuing, with focus on organizing newly discovered files Topics DOS Distribution Repository - Runes has original DOS distribution files not in current repo - Agreed to create a "Release" directory in DOS repo for these files - Will clean out unnecessary/inappropriate content from existing repo AAAI Demo Files - Runes has AAAI demo files from ~1992 not currently in repos - Decided to place these in "internal" directory of Medley repo Array Block Corruption Issue - Nick investigating corruption where small block appears inside larger block - Discussed potential causes, including issues with freeing and merging blocks - Proposed adding debugging features to detect improper access to freed blocks Font Handling Improvements - Ron working on improving font completion and character set handling - Encountering issues with RADOM during load-up process - Aiming to reduce font completion time from overnight to minutes WSL1 Support Implementation - Frank completed PRs for WSL1 support across multiple repos - Includes changes to Mako, Medley, and documentation - PRs ready for review, with specific merge order required PostScript Color Handling - Matt proposed fix for handling odd color values in PostScript output - Approach aligns with Interpress behavior, ignoring complex color maps - PR ready for review and testing Documentation Organization - Paolo completed initial review of MWOS repo for documentation - Identified various demo files and other potentially useful content - Darun expected to contribute additional files to MED repo Next Steps - Review and merge WSL1 support PRs in correct order - Test PostScript color handling fix with various sketch files - Continue investigation of array block corruption issue - Implement proposed debugging features for array space management - Review and organize newly discovered documentation and demo files

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly June 09, 2025  •  102 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Create 'Release' directory in DOS repo, add customer-facing DOS distribution files, clean out unnecessary files Runes Add AAAI demo files to 'internal' directory in medley repo Runes Modify stress test to disable explicit calls to check array space/parse arrays, keep array block checking flag on Ron Kaplan Complete documentation update for WSL1 support Frank Halasz Review PR #2177 (PostScript color handling), test with various Sketch files Matt Heffron Create feature request for new hardcopy behavior (PDF generation, viewer opening) Larry Masinter-lisp Test if array block issue persists with checkarrays=nil and array block checking=T Nick Briggs Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways WSL1 support implementation nearing completion with PRs ready for review Ongoing investigation into array block corruption issue, with potential fixes discussed Color handling improvements for PostScript output proposed and under review Documentation efforts continuing, with focus on organizing newly discovered files Topics DOS Distribution Repository Runes has original DOS distribution files not in current repo Agreed to create a "Release" directory in DOS repo for these files Will clean out unnecessary/inappropriate content from existing repo AAAI Demo Files Runes has AAAI demo files from ~1992 not currently in repos Decided to place these in "internal" directory of Medley repo Array Block Corruption Issue Nick investigating corruption where small block appears inside larger block Discussed potential causes, including issues with freeing and merging blocks Proposed adding debugging features to detect improper access to freed blocks Font Handling Improvements Ron working on improving font completion and character set handling Encountering issues with RADOM during load-up process Aiming to reduce font completion time from overnight to minutes WSL1 Support Implementation Frank completed PRs for WSL1 support across multiple repos Includes changes to Mako, Medley, and documentation PRs ready for review, with specific merge order required PostScript Color Handling Matt proposed fix for handling odd color values in PostScript output Approach aligns with Interpress behavior, ignoring complex color maps PR ready for review and testing Documentation Organization Paolo completed initial review of MWOS repo for documentation Identified various demo files and other potentially useful content Darun expected to contribute additional files to MED repo Next Steps Review and merge WSL1 support PRs in correct order Test PostScript color handling fix with various sketch files Continue investigation of array block corruption issue Implement proposed debugging features for array space management Review and organize newly discovered documentation and demo files

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[Paolo Amoroso]

AAAI Demo Files

• Runes has AAAI demo files from ~1992 not currently in repos

Fathom got this wrong. Arun has an IEEE demo from the late 1980s.

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Paolo Amoroso | Blog | Mastodon

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing Medley Interlisp development efforts and address technical issues. Key Takeaways - Progress made on Interlisp primer, Hicks paper, and exploring MBROS repo extensions - Font cleanup and consolidation needed to streamline Medley's font system - Scaling/readability issues on modern displays remain an open challenge - Debugging session resolved issues integrating Intercalc spreadsheets with Notecards Topics Interlisp Primer Progress - New chapter added on saving work - Discussion on origin of "Interlisp" name - likely about integrating different Lisp variants, not "interactive" - Decided to focus on makefiles for beginners, mentioning cleanup function later Hicks Paper Updates - Minor wording tweaks discussed for historical accuracy - Paper nearly complete at 9.75 pages, final formatting in progress - Submission expected around August 1st, with ~3 weeks for revisions after Display Scaling Challenges - No simple solution yet for scaling Medley on modern high-res displays - VNC scaling works on Windows but has issues on Linux - Possible workarounds: lower monitor resolution, use older monitors, or integer pixel scaling (limited usefulness) Font System Cleanup - Many duplicate/obsolete font files identified - Plan to consolidate into single canonical file per font/size - Will move source files out of runtime/load-up directories MBROS Repo Exploration - Debugged integration of Intercalc spreadsheets with Notecards - Resolved issues with function redefinitions and missing hooks - Extensions appear to be alpha quality from 1992, requiring further work Urisco Development - Progress on documenting and improving Urisco discovery system - Ran successfully to 11,000+ tasks, beyond original capabilities - Plans to make it more general-purpose beyond AM mathematics domain Next Steps - Continue font cleanup and consolidation efforts - Further debug and improve MBROS repo extensions (Intercalc + Notecards) - Finalize and submit Hicks paper - Explore potential solutions for display scaling issues - Add screenshots page or link to GitHub discussion on project website

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly June 11, 2025  •  121 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨

No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing Medley Interlisp development efforts and address technical issues. Key Takeaways Progress made on Interlisp primer, Hicks paper, and exploring MBROS repo extensions Font cleanup and consolidation needed to streamline Medley's font system Scaling/readability issues on modern displays remain an open challenge Debugging session resolved issues integrating Intercalc spreadsheets with Notecards Topics Interlisp Primer Progress New chapter added on saving work Discussion on origin of "Interlisp" name - likely about integrating different Lisp variants, not "interactive" Decided to focus on makefiles for beginners, mentioning cleanup function later Hicks Paper Updates Minor wording tweaks discussed for historical accuracy Paper nearly complete at 9.75 pages, final formatting in progress Submission expected around August 1st, with ~3 weeks for revisions after Display Scaling Challenges No simple solution yet for scaling Medley on modern high-res displays VNC scaling works on Windows but has issues on Linux Possible workarounds: lower monitor resolution, use older monitors, or integer pixel scaling (limited usefulness) Font System Cleanup Many duplicate/obsolete font files identified Plan to consolidate into single canonical file per font/size Will move source files out of runtime/load-up directories MBROS Repo Exploration Debugged integration of Intercalc spreadsheets with Notecards Resolved issues with function redefinitions and missing hooks Extensions appear to be alpha quality from 1992, requiring further work Urisco Development Progress on documenting and improving Urisco discovery system Ran successfully to 11,000+ tasks, beyond original capabilities Plans to make it more general-purpose beyond AM mathematics domain Next Steps Continue font cleanup and consolidation efforts Further debug and improve MBROS repo extensions (Intercalc + Notecards) Finalize and submit Hicks paper Explore potential solutions for display scaling issues Add screenshots page or link to GitHub discussion on project website

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation team meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Ron is working on rationalizing and simplifying the font system, aiming to reduce coercions and create a more consistent font file format - Nick is investigating array block allocation issues causing crashes in T-Edit stress tests - The team discussed potential approaches for improving font handling, including using FreeType library - Several PRs were reviewed and approved for merging, with a focus on WSL1-related changes Topics Font System Improvements - Ron is working on simplifying font creation and coercion logic - Aiming to create a single Medley font file format containing all character sets - Discussed potential use of FreeType library for TrueType font rendering - Considering creating a hash file (fonts.hash) to replace directory-based font lookups - Goal is to have BDF fonts as the canonical source for display fonts Array Block Allocation Issues - Nick investigating crashes in T-Edit stress tests related to array block allocation - Problem occurs after processing many files (300-400) - Discussed potential causes, including X-pointer issues and string manipulation - Ron will look more closely at T-Edit insertion code PR Reviews and Merging - Reviewed and approved several PRs: 2163, 2180, 2181, 2182 - These PRs relate to WSL1 improvements and GitHub Actions updates - Frank will merge them in the correct order due to dependencies Historical Magazine References - Paolo found interesting references to Xerox systems and Interlisp in old micro-mini-systems magazine - Mentioned collaboration with Lucid for Common Lisp implementation, though Larry believes this was likely just marketing Big Bitmap Support - Discussed challenges in implementing big bitmap support for displays - Need to modify SDL and X code to handle larger bitmap descriptors Next Steps - Ron to separate Medley font format changes into a new PR - Matt to clarify documentation in PR 2177 regarding color/texture specifications - Frank to merge approved PRs in correct order (2163, 2180, 2181, 2182) - Continue investigation of array block allocation issues in T-Edit - Explore potential use of FreeType library for font rendering

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly June 16, 2025  •  119 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation team meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Ron is working on rationalizing and simplifying the font system, aiming to reduce coercions and create a more consistent font file format Nick is investigating array block allocation issues causing crashes in T-Edit stress tests The team discussed potential approaches for improving font handling, including using FreeType library Several PRs were reviewed and approved for merging, with a focus on WSL1-related changes Topics Font System Improvements Ron is working on simplifying font creation and coercion logic Aiming to create a single Medley font file format containing all character sets Discussed potential use of FreeType library for TrueType font rendering Considering creating a hash file (fonts.hash) to replace directory-based font lookups Goal is to have BDF fonts as the canonical source for display fonts Array Block Allocation Issues Nick investigating crashes in T-Edit stress tests related to array block allocation Problem occurs after processing many files (300-400) Discussed potential causes, including X-pointer issues and string manipulation Ron will look more closely at T-Edit insertion code PR Reviews and Merging Reviewed and approved several PRs: 2163, 2180, 2181, 2182 These PRs relate to WSL1 improvements and GitHub Actions updates Frank will merge them in the correct order due to dependencies Historical Magazine References Paolo found interesting references to Xerox systems and Interlisp in old micro-mini-systems magazine Mentioned collaboration with Lucid for Common Lisp implementation, though Larry believes this was likely just marketing Big Bitmap Support Discussed challenges in implementing big bitmap support for displays Need to modify SDL and X code to handle larger bitmap descriptors Next Steps Ron to separate Medley font format changes into a new PR Matt to clarify documentation in PR 2177 regarding color/texture specifications Frank to merge approved PRs in correct order (2163, 2180, 2181, 2182) Continue investigation of array block allocation issues in T-Edit Explore potential use of FreeType library for font rendering View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Herb's HTML stream library is ready but needs further testing before public release - Ron is working on font completion and character-level transformations - The team is considering adding .medley file extensions to Interlisp source files for better compatibility - Paolo found new documents on expert systems written in Interlisp Topics Conference Paper Submissions - Stephen Kaisler's paper submission for HICSS (with Ellie and Larry) should hear back by August 1st - Uncertainty about acceptance due to high volume of AI/ML papers this year - Stephen's long-running mini-tracks at HICSS may be ending after 20+ years HTML Stream Library - Herb's HTML stream library is ready but needs more testing before public release - Suggestions for improvements: - Add demo functions creating sample HTML pages - Save demo pages to repo for easy viewing - Discussion on whether to move it to the main library or keep in Herb's repo for now Arun's Data Tapes Recovery - 4 QIC data tapes sent to George Blood, LP for recovery - Tapes need repair and "baking" process to reattach magnetic coating - Recovery process has started after delays; Herb will follow up for updates Font Completion and Transformations - Ron working on font completion down to character level - Implementing logic for algorithmic bold/italic when actual glyphs don't exist - Skipping transformations for Japanese characters - Discussing performance optimizations and potential issues with automatic transformations File Extensions for Interlisp Sources - Team considering adding .medley extension to Interlisp source files - Benefits: easier recognition by GitHub, CodeBerg, and other platforms - Challenges: - Updating existing files and references - Handling compiled files (LCOM, DFASL) that reference source names - Next steps: Experiment with renaming test set and identify necessary changes Interlisp Documentation and Research - Paolo found documents on expert systems written in Interlisp - Matt found a book with references to Interlisp and Xerox Next Steps - Herb to create demo functions and pages for HTML stream library - Larry to open GitHub issue for YouTube channel development - Paolo to implement link to screenshot discussions on website - Team to experiment with adding .medley extensions to test files - Continue research and documentation of Interlisp history and applications

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly June 18, 2025  •  66 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Herb's HTML stream library is ready but needs further testing before public release Ron is working on font completion and character-level transformations The team is considering adding .medley file extensions to Interlisp source files for better compatibility Paolo found new documents on expert systems written in Interlisp Topics Conference Paper Submissions Stephen Kaisler's paper submission for HICSS (with Ellie and Larry) should hear back by August 1st Uncertainty about acceptance due to high volume of AI/ML papers this year Stephen's long-running mini-tracks at HICSS may be ending after 20+ years HTML Stream Library Herb's HTML stream library is ready but needs more testing before public release Suggestions for improvements: Add demo functions creating sample HTML pages Save demo pages to repo for easy viewing Discussion on whether to move it to the main library or keep in Herb's repo for now Arun's Data Tapes Recovery 4 QIC data tapes sent to George Blood, LP for recovery Tapes need repair and "baking" process to reattach magnetic coating Recovery process has started after delays; Herb will follow up for updates Font Completion and Transformations Ron working on font completion down to character level Implementing logic for algorithmic bold/italic when actual glyphs don't exist Skipping transformations for Japanese characters Discussing performance optimizations and potential issues with automatic transformations File Extensions for Interlisp Sources Team considering adding .medley extension to Interlisp source files Benefits: easier recognition by GitHub, CodeBerg, and other platforms Challenges: Updating existing files and references Handling compiled files (LCOM, DFASL) that reference source names Next steps: Experiment with renaming test set and identify necessary changes Interlisp Documentation and Research Paolo found documents on expert systems written in Interlisp Matt found a book with references to Interlisp and Xerox Next Steps Herb to create demo functions and pages for HTML stream library Larry to open GitHub issue for YouTube channel development Paolo to implement link to screenshot discussions on website Team to experiment with adding .medley extensions to test files Continue research and documentation of Interlisp history and applications View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Paolo is updating the Lisp Users modules spreadsheet, reviewing and categorizing packages - Discussion on how to organize and categorize Lisp Users packages, including potential searchable interface - Unboxed Ops package functionality and implementation explored, appears to work but needs further investigation - T-Edit recompilation resolved some issues, but array block errors persist Topics Lisp Users Package Organization - Paolo updating spreadsheet of Lisp Users modules, currently up to letter D - Considering categories: modern contributions, legacy (90s Medley, PARC), obsolete - Discussed need for searchable interface and metadata/documentation for packages - Some packages (e.g. WhoLine) should be moved from Lisp Users to Library if used in load-up T-Edit Recompilation - Ron recompiled T-Edit, resolving some crashes but not all array block errors - Suggestion to create a separate PR with only T-Edit recompilation for testing - Discussion on constraints for init files (e.g. cannot use 'files' command) Unboxed Ops Package - Package for fast arithmetic operations, potentially useful for IDL implementation - Appears to be implemented in C (edf2.c file) - Initial tests show it's functional, but timing measurements need refinement - Further investigation needed to understand full capabilities and limitations HTML Stream and Links - Herb working on HTML Stream based on feedback - Discussed approaches for implementing links in T-Edit and handling through device-independent graphics layer - Considered adding DSP-link operation to image stream for device-independent link handling Next Steps - Paolo to continue updating Lisp Users spreadsheet and raise any questions - Ron to create separate PR for T-Edit recompilation - Further investigation of Unboxed Ops package functionality and potential uses - Herb to continue work on HTML Stream and link implementation in T-Edit - Larry to follow up on getting Ellie's paper posted on the website with proper copyright notice

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly June 23, 2025  •  81 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Paolo is updating the Lisp Users modules spreadsheet, reviewing and categorizing packages Discussion on how to organize and categorize Lisp Users packages, including potential searchable interface Unboxed Ops package functionality and implementation explored, appears to work but needs further investigation T-Edit recompilation resolved some issues, but array block errors persist Topics Lisp Users Package Organization Paolo updating spreadsheet of Lisp Users modules, currently up to letter D Considering categories: modern contributions, legacy (90s Medley, PARC), obsolete Discussed need for searchable interface and metadata/documentation for packages Some packages (e.g. WhoLine) should be moved from Lisp Users to Library if used in load-up T-Edit Recompilation Ron recompiled T-Edit, resolving some crashes but not all array block errors Suggestion to create a separate PR with only T-Edit recompilation for testing Discussion on constraints for init files (e.g. cannot use 'files' command) Unboxed Ops Package Package for fast arithmetic operations, potentially useful for IDL implementation Appears to be implemented in C (edf2.c file) Initial tests show it's functional, but timing measurements need refinement Further investigation needed to understand full capabilities and limitations HTML Stream and Links Herb working on HTML Stream based on feedback Discussed approaches for implementing links in T-Edit and handling through device-independent graphics layer Considered adding DSP-link operation to image stream for device-independent link handling Next Steps Paolo to continue updating Lisp Users spreadsheet and raise any questions Ron to create separate PR for T-Edit recompilation Further investigation of Unboxed Ops package functionality and potential uses Herb to continue work on HTML Stream and link implementation in T-Edit Larry to follow up on getting Ellie's paper posted on the website with proper copyright notice View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss progress and updates on the Medley Interlisp project. Key Takeaways - Ellie is uploading Interlisp-related videos from the Xerox PARC Archive to YouTube, adding chapter markers for easier navigation - The IEEE paper on Interlisp has been completed and will be posted to the project website, with plans to announce it on social media - Several team members are working on debugging and improving various aspects of Medley, including font handling, documentation, and specific applications - The team discussed strategies for version control and rolling back changes when working on Medley code Topics Video Archive Uploads - Ellie has started uploading Interlisp-related videos from the Xerox PARC Archive to YouTube - One full 59-minute video on Interlisp-D applications from 1981 was uploaded - Discussion on adding chapter markers to long videos for easier navigation - Suggestion to use YouTube Studio's chapter marking feature IEEE Paper Publication - The final version of the IEEE paper preprint is ready - Plans to post the paper on the project website and announce it on social media - Discussion on IEEE's policies for publishing preprints - Suggestion to reach out to Computer History Museum curators about the paper Medley Development Updates - Ron is working on font cleanup and investigating crashes in Medley - Herb is looking into generating RTF from Medley - Stephen is debugging issues with Truckin and Urisco applications - Frank is working on WSL documentation and reinventing the Table of Contents generator for the IRM Version Control and Debugging Strategies - Discussion on using Git for version control when working on Medley code - Suggestion to use Medley's built-in version files for rolling back changes - Advice on rebuilding sysouts when upgrading to new Medley releases Miscellaneous Updates - Stephen is working on proofs for his second British computer systems book - Larry mentioned that Richard Burton is starting to work on Medley - Paolo is refreshing his knowledge of LOOPS and continuing work on Lispusers cleanup Next Steps - Ellie to submit a PR for adding the IEEE paper to the website - Larry to reach out to Hanson Tsu at the Computer History Museum about the paper - Stephen to contact Michael L. Bellinger about potential collaboration on AI history book - Team members to continue their respective development and documentation tasks - Consider adding documentation about rebuilding sysouts after Medley upgrades

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly June 25, 2025  •  101 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss progress and updates on the Medley Interlisp project. Key Takeaways Ellie is uploading Interlisp-related videos from the Xerox PARC Archive to YouTube, adding chapter markers for easier navigation The IEEE paper on Interlisp has been completed and will be posted to the project website, with plans to announce it on social media Several team members are working on debugging and improving various aspects of Medley, including font handling, documentation, and specific applications The team discussed strategies for version control and rolling back changes when working on Medley code Topics Video Archive Uploads Ellie has started uploading Interlisp-related videos from the Xerox PARC Archive to YouTube One full 59-minute video on Interlisp-D applications from 1981 was uploaded Discussion on adding chapter markers to long videos for easier navigation Suggestion to use YouTube Studio's chapter marking feature IEEE Paper Publication The final version of the IEEE paper preprint is ready Plans to post the paper on the project website and announce it on social media Discussion on IEEE's policies for publishing preprints Suggestion to reach out to Computer History Museum curators about the paper Medley Development Updates Ron is working on font cleanup and investigating crashes in Medley Herb is looking into generating RTF from Medley Stephen is debugging issues with Truckin and Urisco applications Frank is working on WSL documentation and reinventing the Table of Contents generator for the IRM Version Control and Debugging Strategies Discussion on using Git for version control when working on Medley code Suggestion to use Medley's built-in version files for rolling back changes Advice on rebuilding sysouts when upgrading to new Medley releases Miscellaneous Updates Stephen is working on proofs for his second British computer systems book Larry mentioned that Richard Burton is starting to work on Medley Paolo is refreshing his knowledge of LOOPS and continuing work on Lispusers cleanup Next Steps Ellie to submit a PR for adding the IEEE paper to the website Larry to reach out to Hanson Tsu at the Computer History Museum about the paper Stephen to contact Michael L. Bellinger about potential collaboration on AI history book Team members to continue their respective development and documentation tasks Consider adding documentation about rebuilding sysouts after Medley upgrades View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Array block checking issues in T-Edit (RMK-88) appear resolved, pending final verification - Font handling and organization improvements are ongoing, with discussions on storage efficiency and runtime loading - Progress made on cleaning up duplicate font files and comparing font variations - Discussions on improving build processes, including branch-specific loadup directories Topics Array Block Checking Issues - RMK-88 T-Edit issue appears resolved after turning off check-arrays and enabling array block checking flag - Nick to review check array code for potential improvements to prevent allocation during checks - Discussion on the nature of the bug being an "anti-Heisenberg" issue - problem only appears when looking for it Font Handling Improvements - Ron working on consolidating font files, removing duplicates, and comparing variations - Discussions on storage efficiency vs. runtime flexibility for font loading - Considerations for separating fonts into a distinct repository - Exploration of web font stack model for potential application to Interlisp font handling Build Process Improvements - Frank to implement branch-specific loadup directories - New command-line option to be added to Medley script for specifying branch for loadup - Default behavior will use current Git branch, with option to specify a different branch LOTS (Logistics Over the Shore) System - Paolo discovered well-documented Loops-based Navy logistics system in EMBOS repo - System currently broken but offers potential for study of large Loops application - Includes rare examples of multi-column T-Edit files and custom documentation tools Miscellaneous - Discussion on natural language processing applications in finance - Brief mention of Richard Burton's issues with ARM package on x86 - Consideration for improving compiled file difference checking Next Steps - Nick to verify RMK-88 fix and review array block checking code - Ron to continue work on font consolidation and format improvements - Frank to implement branch-specific loadup directories and update Medley script - Larry to write up ideas for improved checking of compiled file differences - Team to consider approach for separating fonts into a distinct repository

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly June 30, 2025  •  104 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Array block checking issues in T-Edit (RMK-88) appear resolved, pending final verification Font handling and organization improvements are ongoing, with discussions on storage efficiency and runtime loading Progress made on cleaning up duplicate font files and comparing font variations Discussions on improving build processes, including branch-specific loadup directories Topics Array Block Checking Issues RMK-88 T-Edit issue appears resolved after turning off check-arrays and enabling array block checking flag Nick to review check array code for potential improvements to prevent allocation during checks Discussion on the nature of the bug being an "anti-Heisenberg" issue - problem only appears when looking for it Font Handling Improvements Ron working on consolidating font files, removing duplicates, and comparing variations Discussions on storage efficiency vs. runtime flexibility for font loading Considerations for separating fonts into a distinct repository Exploration of web font stack model for potential application to Interlisp font handling Build Process Improvements Frank to implement branch-specific loadup directories New command-line option to be added to Medley script for specifying branch for loadup Default behavior will use current Git branch, with option to specify a different branch LOTS (Logistics Over the Shore) System Paolo discovered well-documented Loops-based Navy logistics system in EMBOS repo System currently broken but offers potential for study of large Loops application Includes rare examples of multi-column T-Edit files and custom documentation tools Miscellaneous Discussion on natural language processing applications in finance Brief mention of Richard Burton's issues with ARM package on x86 Consideration for improving compiled file difference checking Next Steps Nick to verify RMK-88 fix and review array block checking code Ron to continue work on font consolidation and format improvements Frank to implement branch-specific loadup directories and update Medley script Larry to write up ideas for improved checking of compiled file differences Team to consider approach for separating fonts into a distinct repository View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose To discuss upcoming events, papers, and coordination for the Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group presentation. Key Takeaways - Planning an online event about Interlisp for fall 2025 to maximize attendance and preparation time - Recent paper generated significant interest; another paper for Hicks conference pending acceptance - Eleanor Young to present at Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group on Tuesday, focusing on IEEE paper and potential collaboration Topics Fall 2025 Online Interlisp Event - Proposed timing: Fall 2025 to avoid summer attention lapse and allow more preparation time - Format: Virtual event with talks and open discussions about various aspects of Interlisp - Potential for high interest, even from non-users curious about Interlisp's history - Opportunity to leverage recent paper's success and ongoing interest in Lisp machines and software environments Upcoming Papers and Presentations - Recent paper showed significant interest in Lisp machine topics and software environments - Pending paper for Hicks conference by Eleanor, Larry, and Stephen; final version due September 2025 - If accepted, can be shared after final submission Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group Presentation - Eleanor Young presenting on Tuesday at their community call - Main focus: Discuss IEEE paper content - Additional goal: Explore potential collaboration on metadata-related tasks - Larry's input: - Suggest review of existing metadata guidelines for bibliography additions - SPN primarily focused on gaming preservation; opportunity to broaden their scope - Action item: Larry and Eleanor to coordinate on specific talking points before the presentation Metadata Collaboration Opportunities - Potential areas for SPN assistance: - Review existing metadata guidelines for bibliography - Identify gaps or areas for expansion in current metadata approach - Challenge: SPN's current focus on gaming preservation may require effort to redirect attention Next Steps - Eleanor and Larry to finalize talking points for Tuesday's SPN Metadata Working Group presentation - Continue preparations for fall 2025 online Interlisp event - Await decision on Hicks conference paper submission - Follow up with SPN after Tuesday's presentation to explore concrete collaboration opportunities

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly July 02, 2025  •  5 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Review metadata guidelines for bibliography additions. Present to Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group. Ask for their review/input. Discuss potential expansion of their focus beyond gaming. Eleanor Young Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose To discuss upcoming events, papers, and coordination for the Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group presentation. Key Takeaways Planning an online event about Interlisp for fall 2025 to maximize attendance and preparation time Recent paper generated significant interest; another paper for Hicks conference pending acceptance Eleanor Young to present at Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group on Tuesday, focusing on IEEE paper and potential collaboration Topics Fall 2025 Online Interlisp Event Proposed timing: Fall 2025 to avoid summer attention lapse and allow more preparation time Format: Virtual event with talks and open discussions about various aspects of Interlisp Potential for high interest, even from non-users curious about Interlisp's history Opportunity to leverage recent paper's success and ongoing interest in Lisp machines and software environments Upcoming Papers and Presentations Recent paper showed significant interest in Lisp machine topics and software environments Pending paper for Hicks conference by Eleanor, Larry, and Stephen; final version due September 2025 If accepted, can be shared after final submission Software Preservation Network Metadata Working Group Presentation Eleanor Young presenting on Tuesday at their community call Main focus: Discuss IEEE paper content Additional goal: Explore potential collaboration on metadata-related tasks Larry's input: Suggest review of existing metadata guidelines for bibliography additions SPN primarily focused on gaming preservation; opportunity to broaden their scope Action item: Larry and Eleanor to coordinate on specific talking points before the presentation Metadata Collaboration Opportunities Potential areas for SPN assistance: Review existing metadata guidelines for bibliography Identify gaps or areas for expansion in current metadata approach Challenge: SPN's current focus on gaming preservation may require effort to redirect attention Next Steps Eleanor and Larry to finalize talking points for Tuesday's SPN Metadata Working Group presentation Continue preparations for fall 2025 online Interlisp event Await decision on Hicks conference paper submission Follow up with SPN after Tuesday's presentation to explore concrete collaboration opportunities

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[Paolo Amoroso]

The links I shared in the meeting:

• first GitHub activity of the Medley project
• first Lispcore post
• Repaint of ADDMENU menus in windows
• LOOPS method Window.ItemMenu

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project update and discussion Key Takeaways - Progress on documentation: Primer chapters, T-Edit docs, bibliography updates - XNS/Dodo exploration ongoing; challenges with documentation and setup - New contributors working on ports/packaging (e.g. Guix) - Historical Interlisp release info uncovered; needs incorporation into project docs Topics Documentation Updates - Abhik wrote new Primer chapters on T-Edit and Loops/Conditionals - T-Edit documentation scattered; needs consolidation/updating - Bill working on revamping bibliography structure - Larry found historical Interlisp release info (1982-1985) to be incorporated XNS and Dodo Exploration - Paolo seeking user-oriented XNS setup docs for Medley - Challenges: XNS was largely automatic, Dodo simulates but doesn't fully implement - Dodo has documentation but requires XNS knowledge; setup is tricky - Potential to invite Dodo author (Dev Hawala) to a meeting External Contributions and Ports - New contributor working on Guix package for Medley - Discussion on how to incorporate/link to external ports/packages - Need process to keep external packages updated with Medley releases Miscellaneous Updates - Ellie gave talk to Software Preservation Network; potential for collaboration on metadata - YouTube channel updates: new videos, proposed name/description changes - PERQ workstation emulator project discovered (running Spice Lisp) Next Steps - Ron and Larry to meet at 1 PM to discuss font subproject setup - Update project history/glossary with newly uncovered release info - Consider adding pointers to related projects (e.g. PERQ emulator) in docs - Explore potential collaboration with Software Preservation Network on metadata - Continue XNS/Dodo exploration; consider reaching out to Dev Hawala

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly

July 09, 2025  •  97 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Send T-Edit chapter to mailing list for review. Update Primer w/ current T-Edit doc reference. Abhik Hasnain Update GitHub issue w/ link to T-Edit manual on Google Drive. Review Dodo docs/examples for XNS setup. Paolo Amoroso Email Diane/Claire re: facilitating metadata working group meeting Eleanor Young Remove index.html files from font dirs. Add pointers to related projects (e.g. Perq emulator) in project docs. Larry Masinter-lisp Update GitHub issue w/ link to T-Edit manual on Google Drive. Review Dodo docs/examples for XNS setup. Paolo Amoroso Remove index.html files from font dirs. Add pointers to related projects (e.g. Perq emulator) in project docs. Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project update and discussion Key Takeaways Progress on documentation: Primer chapters, T-Edit docs, bibliography updates XNS/Dodo exploration ongoing; challenges with documentation and setup New contributors working on ports/packaging (e.g. Guix) Historical Interlisp release info uncovered; needs incorporation into project docs Topics Documentation Updates Abhik wrote new Primer chapters on T-Edit and Loops/Conditionals T-Edit documentation scattered; needs consolidation/updating Bill working on revamping bibliography structure Larry found historical Interlisp release info (1982-1985) to be incorporated XNS and Dodo Exploration Paolo seeking user-oriented XNS setup docs for Medley Challenges: XNS was largely automatic, Dodo simulates but doesn't fully implement Dodo has documentation but requires XNS knowledge; setup is tricky Potential to invite Dodo author (Dev Hawala) to a meeting External Contributions and Ports New contributor working on Guix package for Medley Discussion on how to incorporate/link to external ports/packages Need process to keep external packages updated with Medley releases Miscellaneous Updates Ellie gave talk to Software Preservation Network; potential for collaboration on metadata YouTube channel updates: new videos, proposed name/description changes PERQ workstation emulator project discovered (running Spice Lisp) Next Steps Ron and Larry to meet at 1 PM to discuss font subproject setup Update project history/glossary with newly uncovered release info Consider adding pointers to related projects (e.g. PERQ emulator) in docs Explore potential collaboration with Software Preservation Network on metadata Continue XNS/Dodo exploration; consider reaching out to Dev Hawala

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Font management and cleanup efforts ongoing, with discussions on legacy naming conventions and potential submodule usage - Load-up functionality improvements implemented, including branch naming and GitInfo file creation - Discussions on improving system architecture, including potential use of Git submodules for better version control Topics Font Management and Cleanup - Ron working on cleaning up font directories and normalizing naming conventions - Discussions on legacy font naming and coercion mappings, considering removal of unused code - Potential use of Git submodules for font management discussed Load-up Functionality Improvements - Frank implemented changes to load-up process, including: - Branch names now appear in window titles - GitInfo file created during load-up, storing branch, commit, and git status information - Merged Matt's PR for load-up window title changes System Architecture and Git Submodules - Larry proposed using Git submodules for certain components (e.g., fonts, Mako, note cards) - Benefits discussed: better version control, easier management of dependencies - Concerns raised about potential complexity and build script adaptations needed Miscellaneous Development Updates - Herb fixed justification bug in HTML stream code related to space factor implementation - Nick working on renaming in Mako code for better clarity and correspondence with Lisp code - Paolo progressing on Lisp users cleanup, noting modules with loading/compiling issues Next Steps - Ron to review and potentially merge font-related PRs - Frank's load-up changes to be reviewed and merged - Further investigation into Git submodule implementation and necessary system adaptations - Continue ongoing development efforts (font management, Mako improvements, Lisp users cleanup) - Revisit macOS versions supported by GitHub actions for builds

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly July 14, 2025  •  103 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Approve & merge Frank's PR #2200 (load-up changes) Ron Kaplan Review & approve Ron's PR #2203 (display font cleanup) Matt Heffron Consider tagging current master pre-font changes, decide whether to implement Ron Kaplan Review own PR #2203 (display font cleanup), decide on squash & merge, clean up commit msg if needed Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Font management and cleanup efforts ongoing, with discussions on legacy naming conventions and potential submodule usage Load-up functionality improvements implemented, including branch naming and GitInfo file creation Discussions on improving system architecture, including potential use of Git submodules for better version control Topics Font Management and Cleanup Ron working on cleaning up font directories and normalizing naming conventions Discussions on legacy font naming and coercion mappings, considering removal of unused code Potential use of Git submodules for font management discussed Load-up Functionality Improvements Frank implemented changes to load-up process, including: Branch names now appear in window titles GitInfo file created during load-up, storing branch, commit, and git status information Merged Matt's PR for load-up window title changes System Architecture and Git Submodules Larry proposed using Git submodules for certain components (e.g., fonts, Mako, note cards) Benefits discussed: better version control, easier management of dependencies Concerns raised about potential complexity and build script adaptations needed Miscellaneous Development Updates Herb fixed justification bug in HTML stream code related to space factor implementation Nick working on renaming in Mako code for better clarity and correspondence with Lisp code Paolo progressing on Lisp users cleanup, noting modules with loading/compiling issues Next Steps Ron to review and potentially merge font-related PRs Frank's load-up changes to be reviewed and merged Further investigation into Git submodule implementation and necessary system adaptations Continue ongoing development efforts (font management, Mako improvements, Lisp users cleanup) Revisit macOS versions supported by GitHub actions for builds

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing Interlisp development efforts and project updates Key Takeaways - Ron Kaplan submitted a PR with font work checkpoint; testers needed to verify loadups succeed - Larry Masinter working on submodule support and documentation projects - Bill Stumbo fixing broken links on website; bibliography work ongoing - Paolo Amoroso researching early copy-paste functionality in Interlisp-D for social media discussion Topics Debugging and Break Package - Frank noted break package documentation in IRM is outdated; needs updating - Larry explained heuristics for break triggering: stack depth and time elapsed - Team agreed break package is critical and should be included in primer - Abhik to email list for clarification on break package functionality Bibliography and Website Updates - Herb spoke with Abe about Zotero questions: - Recommended using "extra" field for custom metadata - Suggested ISO 8601 for dates where possible - Advised generating Hugo input from bibliography data - Bill working on: - New "publication" document type in Hugo - CSS/HTML for sorting/filtering bibliography entries - Fixing broken links found by W3C link checker Font Work Progress - Ron submitted PR with font work checkpoint: - Rearranged files and sequences - Eliminated unbounded recursions - Added 2 new font format files for testing - Documentation added on changes and new file structure - Next phase: MCCS encoding and Unicode mapping work Historical Research - Paolo researching early copy-paste functionality in Interlisp-D (early 1980s) - Team discussed evolution from shift-select to clipboard model - Original Interlisp Primer rediscovered - much more extensive than current version Miscellaneous Updates - Larry working on submodule support in codebase - Herb contacted Stanford about e-pad email archival tool extension mechanism - Paolo shared Italian comedy clip related to beanbag chairs at PARC Next Steps - Test Ron's font PR, especially with BravoX files - Update IRM with new break package documentation - Continue work on bibliography page generation - Research and document early Interlisp-D UI features for social media - Follow up with Stanford on e-pad extension mechanism

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly July 16, 2025  •  74 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Contact Dev Hawala re Rodo via GitHub discussion, tag @Adzai Paolo Amoroso Add "Books and Publications" section to "What People Are Saying" page Paolo Amoroso Post follower Qs: 1) What did you discover later wish knew earlier? 2) Preferred Interlisp src file extension? Paolo Amoroso Continue MCCS encoding/recoding of Unicode mapping for font files Ron Kaplan PR fix broken links (esp. Educopia) + Hugo redirections from W3 link checker results Bill Stumbo Send Trillium video link to PARC alumni list Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing Interlisp development efforts and project updates Key Takeaways Ron Kaplan submitted a PR with font work checkpoint; testers needed to verify loadups succeed Larry Masinter working on submodule support and documentation projects Bill Stumbo fixing broken links on website; bibliography work ongoing Paolo Amoroso researching early copy-paste functionality in Interlisp-D for social media discussion Topics Debugging and Break Package Frank noted break package documentation in IRM is outdated; needs updating Larry explained heuristics for break triggering: stack depth and time elapsed Team agreed break package is critical and should be included in primer Abhik to email list for clarification on break package functionality Bibliography and Website Updates Herb spoke with Abe about Zotero questions: Recommended using "extra" field for custom metadata Suggested ISO 8601 for dates where possible Advised generating Hugo input from bibliography data Bill working on: New "publication" document type in Hugo CSS/HTML for sorting/filtering bibliography entries Fixing broken links found by W3C link checker Font Work Progress Ron submitted PR with font work checkpoint: Rearranged files and sequences Eliminated unbounded recursions Added 2 new font format files for testing Documentation added on changes and new file structure Next phase: MCCS encoding and Unicode mapping work Historical Research Paolo researching early copy-paste functionality in Interlisp-D (early 1980s) Team discussed evolution from shift-select to clipboard model Original Interlisp Primer rediscovered - much more extensive than current version Miscellaneous Updates Larry working on submodule support in codebase Herb contacted Stanford about e-pad email archival tool extension mechanism Paolo shared Italian comedy clip related to beanbag chairs at PARC Next Steps Test Ron's font PR, especially with BravoX files Update IRM with new break package documentation Continue work on bibliography page generation Research and document early Interlisp-D UI features for social media Follow up with Stanford on e-pad extension mechanism

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues Key Takeaways - Character encoding and font handling issues are being addressed, with ongoing work to standardize on MCCS encoding - Code cleanup efforts continue, particularly in the Mako/GC code - T-Edit and Inspect Code functionality issues were identified and discussed - Work continues on cataloging and evaluating Lisp Users modules and other legacy code Topics Character Encoding and Font Handling - Ron is working on standardizing character encoding, proposing MCCS as the internal standard - Fonts now know their character encoding, helping identify mismatches - Discussions on handling different encodings for source files, T-Edit files, and programmatic output - Proposal to use MCCS for internal representation while maintaining compatibility with legacy encodings Code Cleanup and Refactoring - Nick has been cleaning up Mako/GC code, focusing on: - Removing magic numbers - Consistent naming conventions - Restructuring nested conditionals for readability - Changing global variables to static - Total changes: ~294 lines added, 188 lines removed across multiple small commits - Suggestion to create a PR for wider review, despite minimal functional changes T-Edit and Inspect Code Issues - Bug identified in Inspect Code functionality: - Scrolling stops working after clicking in the window - Window title changes unexpectedly - Process appears to come and go - Ron provided context on recent changes to edit session handling that may be related - Further investigation needed to resolve the issue Lisp Users Module Evaluation - Paolo completed first pass of Lisp Users module evaluation - Common issue: record path errors in modules that don't compile - Suggestion to add a "Does it work?" column to the spreadsheet - Discussion on how to handle and document module functionality issues Legacy Code Evaluation - Ongoing efforts to evaluate and categorize files in the "internal" directory - Mix of utilities, debugging tools, and miscellaneous code identified - Some files (e.g., T-Edit Color) may require significant work to integrate or update Next Steps - Nick to create a PR for the Mako/GC code changes for wider review - Paolo to add a "Does it work?" column to the Lisp Users module spreadsheet - Continue investigation into T-Edit and Inspect Code functionality issues - Further evaluate and categorize legacy code in the "internal" directory - Consider creating a modern "briefing blurb" to help new contributors get up to speed - Explore options for finding interns to assist with various tasks

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly July 21, 2025  •  105 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting

Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues

Key Takeaways Character encoding and font handling issues are being addressed, with ongoing work to standardize on MCCS encoding Code cleanup efforts continue, particularly in the Mako/GC code T-Edit and Inspect Code functionality issues were identified and discussed Work continues on cataloging and evaluating Lisp Users modules and other legacy code Topics Character Encoding and Font Handling Ron is working on standardizing character encoding, proposing MCCS as the internal standard Fonts now know their character encoding, helping identify mismatches Discussions on handling different encodings for source files, T-Edit files, and programmatic output Proposal to use MCCS for internal representation while maintaining compatibility with legacy encodings Code Cleanup and Refactoring Nick has been cleaning up Mako/GC code, focusing on: Removing magic numbers Consistent naming conventions Restructuring nested conditionals for readability Changing global variables to static Total changes: ~294 lines added, 188 lines removed across multiple small commits Suggestion to create a PR for wider review, despite minimal functional changes T-Edit and Inspect Code Issues Bug identified in Inspect Code functionality: Scrolling stops working after clicking in the window Window title changes unexpectedly Process appears to come and go Ron provided context on recent changes to edit session handling that may be related Further investigation needed to resolve the issue Lisp Users Module Evaluation Paolo completed first pass of Lisp Users module evaluation Common issue: record path errors in modules that don't compile Suggestion to add a "Does it work?" column to the spreadsheet Discussion on how to handle and document module functionality issues Legacy Code Evaluation Ongoing efforts to evaluate and categorize files in the "internal" directory Mix of utilities, debugging tools, and miscellaneous code identified Some files (e.g., T-Edit Color) may require significant work to integrate or update Next Steps Nick to create a PR for the Mako/GC code changes for wider review Paolo to add a "Does it work?" column to the Lisp Users module spreadsheet Continue investigation into T-Edit and Inspect Code functionality issues Further evaluate and categorize legacy code in the "internal" directory Consider creating a modern "briefing blurb" to help new contributors get up to speed Explore options for finding interns to assist with various tasks View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and coordination among team members. Key Takeaways - Richard Burton, former Interlisp-D team member, joined the meeting and shared his background in educational software development - Team discussed ongoing work on font handling, bibliography management, and various technical improvements to Medley - Challenges with getting started using Medley were highlighted, prompting discussion on improving documentation and onboarding Topics New Team Member Introduction - Richard Burton introduced himself as former Interlisp-D team member (1978-1989) - Worked on window package, sketch tool, and educational software at Xerox PARC - Developed systems like SOFI, Buggy, and a 16-week Navy training course Medley Technical Updates - Nick fixed issues with find-first/find-last-set functions for Linux compatibility - Ron working on Interpress font machinery and display font interfaces - Matt scanned original e-mice manual (60MB PDF) - Ongoing efforts to support Unicode and improve font handling Documentation and Onboarding - Ellie working on bibliography intake guide and uploading historical videos to YouTube - Discussion on improving primer and documentation for new users - Richard highlighted difficulties getting started with Medley, prompting team to consider improvements Project Infrastructure - Debate on rethinking two-level directory convention due to inconsistent implementation - Discussion on packaging Medley for FreeBSD ports system - Consideration of creating an easier "Interlisp mode" startup option Community Engagement - Paolo shared social media updates, including interest from FreeBSD community - Team discussed potential for packaging Medley for easier installation on FreeBSD Next Steps - Ron to send Richard a simple init file example for getting started - Bill to add screenshots of bibliography examples to GitHub issue #2104 - Larry to update FreeBSD wiki entry with link to GitHub repo - Team to consider improvements to documentation and onboarding process - Explore packaging Medley for FreeBSD ports system

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly July 23, 2025  •  104 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp meeting to discuss project updates, technical issues, and coordination among team members. Key Takeaways Richard Burton, former Interlisp-D team member, joined the meeting and shared his background in educational software development Team discussed ongoing work on font handling, bibliography management, and various technical improvements to Medley Challenges with getting started using Medley were highlighted, prompting discussion on improving documentation and onboarding Topics New Team Member Introduction Richard Burton introduced himself as former Interlisp-D team member (1978-1989) Worked on window package, sketch tool, and educational software at Xerox PARC Developed systems like SOFI, Buggy, and a 16-week Navy training course Medley Technical Updates Nick fixed issues with find-first/find-last-set functions for Linux compatibility Ron working on Interpress font machinery and display font interfaces Matt scanned original e-mice manual (60MB PDF) Ongoing efforts to support Unicode and improve font handling Documentation and Onboarding Ellie working on bibliography intake guide and uploading historical videos to YouTube Discussion on improving primer and documentation for new users Richard highlighted difficulties getting started with Medley, prompting team to consider improvements Project Infrastructure Debate on rethinking two-level directory convention due to inconsistent implementation Discussion on packaging Medley for FreeBSD ports system Consideration of creating an easier "Interlisp mode" startup option Community Engagement Paolo shared social media updates, including interest from FreeBSD community Team discussed potential for packaging Medley for easier installation on FreeBSD Next Steps Ron to send Richard a simple init file example for getting started Bill to add screenshots of bibliography examples to GitHub issue #2104 Larry to update FreeBSD wiki entry with link to GitHub repo Team to consider improvements to documentation and onboarding process Explore packaging Medley for FreeBSD ports system View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues Key Takeaways - HTML stream implementation is close to being ready for inclusion in loadups, but some font-related changes are still needed - There are 540 open GitHub issues, many of which may be resolved but not closed - team should review and close resolved issues - Significant ongoing work on font handling, character encodings, and file name representations to improve Unicode support - Discussions on how to improve documentation and explanations of complex topics like character encoding for new contributors Topics HTML Stream Implementation - Herb has made progress on HTML stream implementation, close to being ready for inclusion in loadups - Some font-related changes still needed, including updating calls to use new font create function with stream device argument - Larry wants to get HTML stream into loadups soon, even if some open issues remain T-Edit and Paragraph Formatting Issues - Herb investigating issues with T-Edit paragraph formatting and indentation - Ron explained some historical quirks with T-Edit's handling of paragraph looks and page numbers - Discussed potential fixes for issues like incorrect indentation of first line when printing GitHub Issue Management - 540 open issues, ~100 from this year - many likely resolved but not closed - Team should review their own issues and close any that have been resolved - Discussed process for verifying and closing issues, including linking PRs to issues Font Handling and Character Encoding - Ron working on improving font infrastructure, especially for handling different character encodings - Aiming to establish MCCS (extended GOTCHA) as standard internal encoding, with mappings to other encodings - Challenges discussed around handling file names with Unicode characters across different OS encodings - Goal is to improve system to be more understandable for new contributors Interpress Font Work - Ron cleaned up Interpress code for handling fonts with different character mappings - Working on establishing consistent naming and functions for character mapping/translation File System and Unicode Handling - Discussed challenges of handling Unicode file names across different operating systems - Debated whether to handle encoding conversion in Lisp or C code - Considered trade-offs of different approaches for representing file names internally Open Pull Requests - Discussed PR #2216 for font infrastructure changes - PR #107 for modernizing button event handling ready for approval - Team encouraged to test changes, especially font-related ones, before next meeting Next Steps - Team members to review their open GitHub issues and close any that are resolved - Ron to continue work on font handling and character encoding improvements - Nick to investigate and potentially fix Lafitte mail file repair UI issues - Team to test PR #2216 (font changes) thoroughly before next meeting - Larry to review HC files results with merged open PRs

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly July 28, 2025  •  124 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues Key Takeaways HTML stream implementation is close to being ready for inclusion in loadups, but some font-related changes are still needed There are 540 open GitHub issues, many of which may be resolved but not closed - team should review and close resolved issues Significant ongoing work on font handling, character encodings, and file name representations to improve Unicode support Discussions on how to improve documentation and explanations of complex topics like character encoding for new contributors Topics HTML Stream Implementation Herb has made progress on HTML stream implementation, close to being ready for inclusion in loadups Some font-related changes still needed, including updating calls to use new font create function with stream device argument Larry wants to get HTML stream into loadups soon, even if some open issues remain T-Edit and Paragraph Formatting Issues Herb investigating issues with T-Edit paragraph formatting and indentation Ron explained some historical quirks with T-Edit's handling of paragraph looks and page numbers Discussed potential fixes for issues like incorrect indentation of first line when printing GitHub Issue Management 540 open issues, ~100 from this year - many likely resolved but not closed Team should review their own issues and close any that have been resolved Discussed process for verifying and closing issues, including linking PRs to issues Font Handling and Character Encoding Ron working on improving font infrastructure, especially for handling different character encodings Aiming to establish MCCS (extended GOTCHA) as standard internal encoding, with mappings to other encodings Challenges discussed around handling file names with Unicode characters across different OS encodings Goal is to improve system to be more understandable for new contributors Interpress Font Work Ron cleaned up Interpress code for handling fonts with different character mappings Working on establishing consistent naming and functions for character mapping/translation File System and Unicode Handling Discussed challenges of handling Unicode file names across different operating systems Debated whether to handle encoding conversion in Lisp or C code Considered trade-offs of different approaches for representing file names internally Open Pull Requests Discussed PR #2216 for font infrastructure changes PR #107 for modernizing button event handling ready for approval Team encouraged to test changes, especially font-related ones, before next meeting Next Steps Team members to review their open GitHub issues and close any that are resolved Ron to continue work on font handling and character encoding improvements Nick to investigate and potentially fix Lafitte mail file repair UI issues Team to test PR #2216 (font changes) thoroughly before next meeting Larry to review HC files results with merged open PRs View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly update on Medley Interlisp external development progress and discussions Key Takeaways - Bibliography intake process being refined and tested by Paolo and Ellie - Several legacy programs (URISCO, Truckin') being investigated for compatibility with modern Medley - Ongoing cleanup of LispUsers and open issues in the project Topics Bibliography Updates - Ellie working on bibliography intake process and YouTube video uploads - Bill shared update on landing pages for bibliography entries with new sorting/grouping options - Paolo to test bibliography entry process as both internal and external contributor Website Cleanup - Get Involved page to be updated, including clarification on external community platforms - Weird behavior with U-Block Origin hiding "socials" section to be investigated Legacy Program Compatibility - Stephen working on getting URISCO and Truckin' running in modern Medley - Challenges with read tables and environment differences between original and current systems - Nick able to get URISCO partially running after some variable adjustments MasterScope Modernization - Discussion on improving MasterScope's ability to analyze Common Lisp code - Current "basic" Common Lisp support may not cover all needed use cases (e.g. finding SETF calls) - Larry mentioned previous unfinished work to improve MasterScope/Common Lisp integration Ongoing Cleanup Efforts - Matt working on resolving warnings and errors in system load process - Paolo continuing second pass of LispUsers cleanup - Several open issues identified as potentially closeable with some work Next Steps - Paolo to submit PR for Get Involved page cleanup - Paolo and Matt to test bibliography entry process using Ellie's instructions - Stephen to continue investigating/documenting URISCO and Truckin' compatibility - Herb to open feature request for improved MasterScope Common Lisp analysis - Team to continue addressing open issues and LispUsers cleanup

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly July 30, 2025  •  91 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly update on Medley Interlisp external development progress and discussions Key Takeaways Bibliography intake process being refined and tested by Paolo and Ellie Several legacy programs (URISCO, Truckin') being investigated for compatibility with modern Medley Ongoing cleanup of LispUsers and open issues in the project Topics Bibliography Updates Ellie working on bibliography intake process and YouTube video uploads Bill shared update on landing pages for bibliography entries with new sorting/grouping options Paolo to test bibliography entry process as both internal and external contributor Website Cleanup Get Involved page to be updated, including clarification on external community platforms Weird behavior with U-Block Origin hiding "socials" section to be investigated Legacy Program Compatibility Stephen working on getting URISCO and Truckin' running in modern Medley Challenges with read tables and environment differences between original and current systems Nick able to get URISCO partially running after some variable adjustments MasterScope Modernization Discussion on improving MasterScope's ability to analyze Common Lisp code Current "basic" Common Lisp support may not cover all needed use cases (e.g. finding SETF calls) Larry mentioned previous unfinished work to improve MasterScope/Common Lisp integration Ongoing Cleanup Efforts Matt working on resolving warnings and errors in system load process Paolo continuing second pass of LispUsers cleanup Several open issues identified as potentially closeable with some work Next Steps Paolo to submit PR for Get Involved page cleanup Paolo and Matt to test bibliography entry process using Ellie's instructions Stephen to continue investigating/documenting URISCO and Truckin' compatibility Herb to open feature request for improved MasterScope Common Lisp analysis Team to continue addressing open issues and LispUsers cleanup View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly implementation meeting for Medley Interlisp project Key Takeaways - Discussed font handling improvements, including ligatures and diacritics - Reviewed progress on HTML stream and file output capabilities - Addressed challenges with preserving legacy fonts and character encodings - Planned next steps for documentation updates and code cleanup Topics Font Handling Improvements - Ron proposed making all text fonts use MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) for consistency - Discussed handling of ligatures and diacritics, potentially at T-Edit level rather than in fonts - Explored options for preserving legacy fonts while improving Unicode compatibility - Matt found BDF versions of some Xerox fonts from 1991 that could help fill gaps HTML Output Enhancements - Herb working on fixes for HTML stream to improve page layout handling - Goal is to generate HTML, PostScript and PDF outputs from same source - Discussed adding HTML output for additional file types like font samples Documentation Updates - Need to expand glossary with Interlisp-specific terms and jargon - Considering different "trails" through primer for users with varied backgrounds - Will add explanations of debugging concepts, relating to modern tools Code Cleanup and Maintenance - Matt improved error handling in "where is" command - Frank has scripts to "thin" old versions of files in build directories - Discussed process for reviewing and merging pending pull requests Vintage Computer Fair Report - Larry attended briefly, made contacts with Lisp machine enthusiasts - Potential to collaborate with Interim Computer Museum on virtual exhibits Next Steps - Herb to finish testing and release HTML stream improvements - Ron to continue work on EditFont capabilities - Expand documentation glossary and primer content - Review and merge pending pull requests - Follow up with Interim Computer Museum on potential collaboration

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly August 04, 2025  •  331 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Review Matt's changes to "where is" function in loadout box Frank Halasz Test HTML stream, push new version, notify team Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly implementation meeting for Medley Interlisp project Key Takeaways Discussed font handling improvements, including ligatures and diacritics Reviewed progress on HTML stream and file output capabilities Addressed challenges with preserving legacy fonts and character encodings Planned next steps for documentation updates and code cleanup Topics Font Handling Improvements Ron proposed making all text fonts use MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) for consistency Discussed handling of ligatures and diacritics, potentially at T-Edit level rather than in fonts Explored options for preserving legacy fonts while improving Unicode compatibility Matt found BDF versions of some Xerox fonts from 1991 that could help fill gaps HTML Output Enhancements Herb working on fixes for HTML stream to improve page layout handling Goal is to generate HTML, PostScript and PDF outputs from same source Discussed adding HTML output for additional file types like font samples Documentation Updates Need to expand glossary with Interlisp-specific terms and jargon Considering different "trails" through primer for users with varied backgrounds Will add explanations of debugging concepts, relating to modern tools Code Cleanup and Maintenance Matt improved error handling in "where is" command Frank has scripts to "thin" old versions of files in build directories Discussed process for reviewing and merging pending pull requests Vintage Computer Fair Report Larry attended briefly, made contacts with Lisp machine enthusiasts Potential to collaborate with Interim Computer Museum on virtual exhibits Next Steps Herb to finish testing and release HTML stream improvements Ron to continue work on EditFont capabilities Expand documentation glossary and primer content Review and merge pending pull requests Follow up with Interim Computer Museum on potential collaboration

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp project progress and issues Key Takeaways - Website redesign needed to better highlight news/updates; considering hiring a designer - Ongoing work on file naming conventions, package conflicts, and bibliography integration - Progress on PDF output improvements and exploring PDF vs PostScript capabilities - Continued efforts on documentation, debugging, and running legacy Interlisp programs Topics Website Design and News Updates - Current homepage design makes it difficult to highlight news/updates - Considering hiring a designer to improve layout and user experience - Matt's daughter (UI/UX background) may be able to provide a quote - Goal is to keep Hugo framework but improve element arrangement File Naming and Organization - Ongoing discussion about renaming files with extensions (e.g. .medley, .interlisp, .il) - Concerns raised about breaking historical context by renaming - Proposal to use subdirectories instead of renaming, update whereis database - Package conflicts remain an issue when files have same names in different directories Bibliography and Documentation - New bibliography entries added (e.g. E-Mycin manual, Essential Lisp book) - Bill working on simplified version of bibliography integration - Herb helping new user (Abic) document common Interlisp pitfalls for primer - Steve continuing work on URISCO, Trucking, STRADS documentation PDF and PostScript Improvements - Matt investigating PDF standard, found ways to handle ligatures and improve searchability - PDF uses quadratic curves vs PostScript's cubic splines, may require conversion - Potential to embed OpenType fonts directly in PDF output Legacy Program Debugging - Steve encountering URAID debugger issues with STRADS program - Ron provided guidance on useful URAID commands (LU, H) for debugging Miscellaneous Updates - Frank improving load-up thinning functionality, renaming "branch" to avoid Git confusion - Larry attended Vintage Computer Festival, made contacts for potential collaboration - Paolo completed second pass of Lisp Users cleanup review, to be discussed next meeting Next Steps - Matt to ask his daughter for website redesign quote - Paolo to submit PR for adding recent YouTube videos to news page - Investigate RSS feed issues on website - Continue discussions on file naming/organization approach - Review Lisp Users cleanup findings at next Monday's meeting - Ongoing work on documentation, debugging, and legacy program restoration

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly August 06, 2025  •  108 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Submit PR to add YouTube video links since May to news/status page Paolo Amoroso Ask daughter to review Interlisp.org site design, provide quote Matt Heffron Review new Notecards manual v2, consider adding to repo Frank Halasz Investigate why RSS feed not updating, fix if broken Bill Stumbo Rename 'branch' to 'tag' or similar in load up commands Frank Halasz Implement simple version of bibliography with individual markdown files Bill Stumbo Investigate feasibility of converting PostScript stream to PDF stream Matt Heffron Discuss Lisp users' cleanup review data next Monday Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp project progress and issues Key Takeaways Website redesign needed to better highlight news/updates; considering hiring a designer Ongoing work on file naming conventions, package conflicts, and bibliography integration Progress on PDF output improvements and exploring PDF vs PostScript capabilities Continued efforts on documentation, debugging, and running legacy Interlisp programs Topics Website Design and News Updates Current homepage design makes it difficult to highlight news/updates Considering hiring a designer to improve layout and user experience Matt's daughter (UI/UX background) may be able to provide a quote Goal is to keep Hugo framework but improve element arrangement File Naming and Organization Ongoing discussion about renaming files with extensions (e.g. .medley, .interlisp, .il) Concerns raised about breaking historical context by renaming Proposal to use subdirectories instead of renaming, update whereis database Package conflicts remain an issue when files have same names in different directories Bibliography and Documentation New bibliography entries added (e.g. E-Mycin manual, Essential Lisp book) Bill working on simplified version of bibliography integration Herb helping new user (Abic) document common Interlisp pitfalls for primer Steve continuing work on URISCO, Trucking, STRADS documentation PDF and PostScript Improvements Matt investigating PDF standard, found ways to handle ligatures and improve searchability PDF uses quadratic curves vs PostScript's cubic splines, may require conversion Potential to embed OpenType fonts directly in PDF output Legacy Program Debugging Steve encountering URAID debugger issues with STRADS program Ron provided guidance on useful URAID commands (LU, H) for debugging Miscellaneous Updates Frank improving load-up thinning functionality, renaming "branch" to avoid Git confusion Larry attended Vintage Computer Festival, made contacts for potential collaboration Paolo completed second pass of Lisp Users cleanup review, to be discussed next meeting Next Steps Matt to ask his daughter for website redesign quote Paolo to submit PR for adding recent YouTube videos to news page Investigate RSS feed issues on website Continue discussions on file naming/organization approach Review Lisp Users cleanup findings at next Monday's meeting Ongoing work on documentation, debugging, and legacy program restoration

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation team meeting to discuss ongoing development work and issues. Key Takeaways - RMK 103 PR (font interface changes) approved for merge after resolving a compilation issue - New loadup script with "tag" terminology and "thin" command approved (PR 2249) - Ongoing work on font handling, PostScript/PDF output, and potential color display support - Need to carefully review files not in loadup to determine if they should be moved/obsoleted Topics RMK 103 PR Review and Merge - Large PR with 52 files changed, focused on font interface updates and load sequence changes - Initially had a compilation issue with PLUX undefined function, resolved by pushing updated t-edit-looks files - Approved for merge after fixing and testing Loadup Script Updates - Frank's PR (2249) changes "branch" terminology to "tag" for consistency - New "thin" command added to clean up both working directory and loadups directory - "thin plus" option added to completely delete a tagged loadup - Approved for merge Font and Character Set Handling - Ron working on device-independent font handling improvements - Discussions around character set coercion and handling of non-existent characters - Plans to move coercion functions out of Interpress into new MCCS (Unicode-related) file PostScript/PDF Output Improvements - Matt investigating using standard PostScript glyphs for ligatures/fractions instead of custom drawing - Considering direct PDF generation, optimizing glyph usage across document Potential Color Display Support - Nick considering resurrecting color display support as separate X window - Would expose more Medley code (color blitz, colorized fonts, etc.) - Simpler than expanding main display bitmap size Review of Unused Source Files - Discussed files in sources not used by any loadup - Need to carefully evaluate each for potential move to library, internal, or obsolete - Japanese character encoding file should be moved to library, not obsoleted Next Steps - Merge approved PRs (RMK 103, loadup script updates) - Continue work on font/character set improvements - Investigate color display resurrection - Review unused source files for appropriate categorization - Matt to be less available due to family situation

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly August 11, 2025  •  135 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Continue list users cleanup, extend to library & sources dirs Paolo Amoroso Investigate & fix PLUX undefined function error in RMK 103 PR Ron Kaplan Review & test Frank's loadup script PR (2249) Nick Briggs Update loadup script PR - add --help, -h aliases for man page, implement 'Z+' option to bypass pager Frank Halasz Test RMK 103 PR after Ron's fix, merge if no issues Nick Briggs Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation team meeting to discuss ongoing development work and issues. Key Takeaways RMK 103 PR (font interface changes) approved for merge after resolving a compilation issue New loadup script with "tag" terminology and "thin" command approved (PR 2249) Ongoing work on font handling, PostScript/PDF output, and potential color display support Need to carefully review files not in loadup to determine if they should be moved/obsoleted Topics RMK 103 PR Review and Merge Large PR with 52 files changed, focused on font interface updates and load sequence changes Initially had a compilation issue with PLUX undefined function, resolved by pushing updated t-edit-looks files Approved for merge after fixing and testing Loadup Script Updates Frank's PR (2249) changes "branch" terminology to "tag" for consistency New "thin" command added to clean up both working directory and loadups directory "thin plus" option added to completely delete a tagged loadup Approved for merge Font and Character Set Handling Ron working on device-independent font handling improvements Discussions around character set coercion and handling of non-existent characters Plans to move coercion functions out of Interpress into new MCCS (Unicode-related) file PostScript/PDF Output Improvements Matt investigating using standard PostScript glyphs for ligatures/fractions instead of custom drawing Considering direct PDF generation, optimizing glyph usage across document Potential Color Display Support Nick considering resurrecting color display support as separate X window Would expose more Medley code (color blitz, colorized fonts, etc.) Simpler than expanding main display bitmap size Review of Unused Source Files Discussed files in sources not used by any loadup Need to carefully evaluate each for potential move to library, internal, or obsolete Japanese character encoding file should be moved to library, not obsoleted Next Steps Merge approved PRs (RMK 103, loadup script updates) Continue work on font/character set improvements Investigate color display resurrection Review unused source files for appropriate categorization Matt to be less available due to family situation

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp External meeting to discuss ongoing development and issues Key Takeaways - MCCS character encoding defined as XCCS with 3 key swaps: underscore/left arrow, circumflex/up arrow, currency/dollar sign - RSS feed not updating for changes to index.md files, needs investigation - File naming and Unicode handling challenges identified, especially for non-ASCII characters Topics Video Documentation Updates - Eleanor uploaded remaining InterlispD-tagged videos to YouTube channel - Paper converted to single-column format, to be shared later - Discussed reviewing email archives for historical information Open Documentation Issues - Issue #2063: Typo in Medley script man page to be fixed - Issue #2017: Copy scanned manuals (T-Edit, Sketch, Medley for DOS) to main repo Glossary Additions - New entries to be added: break package, briefing blurb, display (as in display-oriented editor) - Suggestion to link to original jargon file (Paul Durish's version) RSS Feed Issues - RSS not detecting changes to index.md files, including news/status page - Bill investigating underlying issues with feed generation MCCS Character Encoding Definition - Defined MCCS as XCCS with three key character swaps: 1. Underscore and left arrow 2. Circumflex and up arrow 3. Currency symbol and dollar sign - Discussed implications for legacy data and potential issues with searching/displaying certain characters File Naming and Unicode Handling - Identified challenges with handling non-ASCII characters in filenames - Discussed potential solutions: - Creating a ":filename" external format - Implementing translation functions in MAKO or Lisp side - Considering normalization of Unicode characters for consistent file naming Font and Character Representation - Discussed handling of emojis and other Unicode characters not in original XCCS - Considered mapping strategies for extended character sets - Debated representation of control characters and potential font requirements Next Steps - Eleanor to coordinate with Paolo on reviewing email archives - Paolo to submit PR for new glossary entries - Bill to investigate RSS feed issues further - Ron to implement agreed-upon MCCS definition in code - Team to consider implementation of filename handling and Unicode support in MAKO/Lisp interface

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly August 13, 2025  •  132 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Fix typo in Medley.1.md man page (geometry misspelling) and run publishing steps Larry Masinter-lisp Review and attach missing PDFs to Zotero entries for 3 documents (Notes on Medley test, automated test harness interfaces, XAIS testing directory structure) Eleanor Young Submit PR for new glossary entries (break package, briefing blurb, display) + link to original jargon file Paolo Amoroso Investigate why RSS feed not updating for index.md changes (e.g. YouTube videos, IEEE paper additions) Bill Stumbo Implement MCCS definition (XCCS with 3 swaps - underscore/left arrow, circumflex/up arrow, currency/dollar sign) Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp External meeting to discuss ongoing development and issues Key Takeaways MCCS character encoding defined as XCCS with 3 key swaps: underscore/left arrow, circumflex/up arrow, currency/dollar sign RSS feed not updating for changes to index.md files, needs investigation File naming and Unicode handling challenges identified, especially for non-ASCII characters Topics Video Documentation Updates Eleanor uploaded remaining InterlispD-tagged videos to YouTube channel Paper converted to single-column format, to be shared later Discussed reviewing email archives for historical information Open Documentation Issues Issue #2063: Typo in Medley script man page to be fixed Issue #2017: Copy scanned manuals (T-Edit, Sketch, Medley for DOS) to main repo Glossary Additions New entries to be added: break package, briefing blurb, display (as in display-oriented editor) Suggestion to link to original jargon file (Paul Durish's version) RSS Feed Issues RSS not detecting changes to index.md files, including news/status page Bill investigating underlying issues with feed generation MCCS Character Encoding Definition Defined MCCS as XCCS with three key character swaps: Underscore and left arrow Circumflex and up arrow Currency symbol and dollar sign Discussed implications for legacy data and potential issues with searching/displaying certain characters File Naming and Unicode Handling Identified challenges with handling non-ASCII characters in filenames Discussed potential solutions: Creating a ":filename" external format Implementing translation functions in MAKO or Lisp side Considering normalization of Unicode characters for consistent file naming Font and Character Representation Discussed handling of emojis and other Unicode characters not in original XCCS Considered mapping strategies for extended character sets Debated representation of control characters and potential font requirements Next Steps Eleanor to coordinate with Paolo on reviewing email archives Paolo to submit PR for new glossary entries Bill to investigate RSS feed issues further Ron to implement agreed-upon MCCS definition in code Team to consider implementation of filename handling and Unicode support in MAKO/Lisp interface

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Online Interlisp (OIO) server was down but has been restarted and is now functioning - Ron is working on font handling improvements, encountering some challenges with compile-time constants - Nick is close to having a PR ready for Mako file system code changes - Matt's daughter may be able to assist with website improvements Topics OIO Server Issues - Frank restarted the OIO web server after it was found to be down - Both main and dev systems were affected, reason unknown - Logs will be examined to determine the cause of the outage Font Handling Improvements - Ron is working on creating a cleaner interface for manipulating glyphs, widths, and font coercion - Introduced concept of "font spec" as an abstraction for font properties - Encountering issues with compile-time constants, specifically MAX-CHARSET - Discussed potential impacts on Mako code and T-Edit display handling Mako File System Changes - Nick is close to having a PR ready for Mako file system code changes - Will try to have something available for experimentation while he's away for 4 weeks Website Improvements - Matt's daughter may be able to assist with website improvements - She needs additional clients to set up an LLC, so could potentially work for minimal compensation - Further discussion needed to determine availability and scheduling Miscellaneous Updates - Larry tested positive for COVID but is feeling better - Ryan Burnside will join a future meeting when available - Google Meet introduced a new full-screen layout for shared screens Next Steps - Frank to investigate logs for cause of OIO server outage - Ron to continue work on font handling improvements, addressing compile-time constant issues - Nick to prepare PR for Mako file system changes before his trip - Matt to coordinate with his daughter regarding potential website work - Schedule meeting with Matt's daughter to discuss website improvement needs

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly August 18, 2025  •  88 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting

Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Online Interlisp (OIO) server was down but has been restarted and is now functioning Ron is working on font handling improvements, encountering some challenges with compile-time constants Nick is close to having a PR ready for Mako file system code changes Matt's daughter may be able to assist with website improvements Topics OIO Server Issues Frank restarted the OIO web server after it was found to be down Both main and dev systems were affected, reason unknown Logs will be examined to determine the cause of the outage Font Handling Improvements Ron is working on creating a cleaner interface for manipulating glyphs, widths, and font coercion Introduced concept of "font spec" as an abstraction for font properties Encountering issues with compile-time constants, specifically MAX-CHARSET Discussed potential impacts on Mako code and T-Edit display handling Mako File System Changes Nick is close to having a PR ready for Mako file system code changes Will try to have something available for experimentation while he's away for 4 weeks Website Improvements Matt's daughter may be able to assist with website improvements She needs additional clients to set up an LLC, so could potentially work for minimal compensation Further discussion needed to determine availability and scheduling Miscellaneous Updates Larry tested positive for COVID but is feeling better Ryan Burnside will join a future meeting when available Google Meet introduced a new full-screen layout for shared screens Next Steps Frank to investigate logs for cause of OIO server outage Ron to continue work on font handling improvements, addressing compile-time constant issues Nick to prepare PR for Mako file system changes before his trip Matt to coordinate with his daughter regarding potential website work Schedule meeting with Matt's daughter to discuss website improvement needs View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways - Font code refactoring underway to improve device independence and consistency - Issues with HC files and WHEREIS database functionality identified - Historical insights on Interlisp name origin and early development shared - Interim Computer Museum planning Interlisp exhibit Topics Health and Personal Updates - Larry and Herb recovered from recent illnesses - Matt's mother passed away recently; condolences expressed Font System Refactoring - Ron working on making font interfaces more device-independent - Cleaning up inconsistencies in font specification methods - Goal: Simplify font handling across different output devices (display, PostScript, etc.) - Addressing challenges with "slug" characters and font inheritance HC Files and WHEREIS Issues - Problems identified with HC files functionality and WHEREIS database - Specific error occurring when trying to locate image objects (e.g., hrule.getfun) - Frank investigating discrepancies between local and GitHub Actions behavior Interlisp History - Paolo found 1978 IRM reference to Interlisp name origin (emphasizing "interactive" aspect) - Discussion on multiple potential meanings of "Inter" in Interlisp (interactive, inter-machine, etc.) - Recollections of early Interlisp development at PARC and BBN (circa 1971-1973) Interim Computer Museum Exhibit - Larry made donation for Interlisp exhibit development - Museum planning dedicated workstation to run Medley and host documentation - Potential to showcase early Interlisp on PDP-10 systems Online Interlisp (OIO) Updates - Frank addressing issues with direct URL access - Build problems related to Cloud9 IDE integration; may remove it from dev version Miscellaneous - Nick reported display glitches during Medley load-up (not replicated by others) - Historical anecdote about first IP packet transmission from Rosati's Alpine Inn ("Zott's") Next Steps - Ron to continue font system refactoring and documentation - Frank to investigate HC files and WHEREIS database issues offline - Larry and Herb to discuss Ellie's tasks through December - Team to keep an eye out for load-up display glitches reported by Nick - Consider developing API for better error handling and reporting in Interlisp

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

August 25, 2025  •  81 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps Key Takeaways Font code refactoring underway to improve device independence and consistency Issues with HC files and WHEREIS database functionality identified Historical insights on Interlisp name origin and early development shared Interim Computer Museum planning Interlisp exhibit Topics Health and Personal Updates Larry and Herb recovered from recent illnesses Matt's mother passed away recently; condolences expressed Font System Refactoring Ron working on making font interfaces more device-independent Cleaning up inconsistencies in font specification methods Goal: Simplify font handling across different output devices (display, PostScript, etc.) Addressing challenges with "slug" characters and font inheritance HC Files and WHEREIS Issues Problems identified with HC files functionality and WHEREIS database Specific error occurring when trying to locate image objects (e.g., hrule.getfun) Frank investigating discrepancies between local and GitHub Actions behavior Interlisp History Paolo found 1978 IRM reference to Interlisp name origin (emphasizing "interactive" aspect) Discussion on multiple potential meanings of "Inter" in Interlisp (interactive, inter-machine, etc.) Recollections of early Interlisp development at PARC and BBN (circa 1971-1973) Interim Computer Museum Exhibit Larry made donation for Interlisp exhibit development Museum planning dedicated workstation to run Medley and host documentation Potential to showcase early Interlisp on PDP-10 systems Online Interlisp (OIO) Updates Frank addressing issues with direct URL access Build problems related to Cloud9 IDE integration; may remove it from dev version Miscellaneous Nick reported display glitches during Medley load-up (not replicated by others) Historical anecdote about first IP packet transmission from Rosati's Alpine Inn ("Zott's") Next Steps Ron to continue font system refactoring and documentation Frank to investigate HC files and WHEREIS database issues offline Larry and Herb to discuss Ellie's tasks through December Team to keep an eye out for load-up display glitches reported by Nick Consider developing API for better error handling and reporting in Interlisp View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss updates and progress on the Medley Interlisp project Key Takeaways - New contributor Ryan Burnside joined, having created an Interlisp game for a game jam - Bill submitted a PR for a new approach to the bibliography page on the website - The project reached 400 followers on Mastodon, a social media milestone - Work continues on documentation, including a Medley Primer and efforts to resurrect old Interlisp programs Topics New Contributor Introduction - Ryan Burnside created a Sliding 15 puzzle game in Interlisp for a game jam - Discussed potential improvements to make Medley more approachable for new users - Ryan appreciated the depth of knowledge and history in the project Bibliography Page Update - Bill submitted a PR with a new approach for the bibliography page - Mock-up available in staging environment - Feedback: Some inconsistent formatting noted, but overall positive reception Documentation Updates - PR submitted to add link to HC Files website on documentation page - Issue noted that CONTRIBUTING.md file is out of date with broken links - Abic finishing Medley Primer, will send for feedback soon Social Media Milestone - Reached 400 followers on Mastodon - Current stats: 404 Mastodon followers, 118 YouTube subscribers, 78 LinkedIn group members, 46 BlueSky followers Interlisp History Discussion - Discussed potential Interlisp exhibit for Interim Computer Museum - Talked about early history of Interlisp, BBN, and PDP-10 systems - Paolo experimenting with Interlisp-10 on TwinX.org system Ongoing Development Work - Ron continuing work on fonts and modernization - Stephen working on getting old programs like URISCO running in modern Medley - Larry prioritizing getting HTML output from Herb's project into AC files Next Steps - Leave feedback on Bill's bibliography page PR - Review and update CONTRIBUTING.md file - Provide fresh feedback on Medley Primer when Abic sends it out - Explore options for Interlisp exhibit at Interim Computer Museum - Continue efforts to get old Interlisp programs running in modern Medley

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly August 27, 2025  •  74 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly external meeting to discuss updates and progress on the Medley Interlisp project Key Takeaways New contributor Ryan Burnside joined, having created an Interlisp game for a game jam Bill submitted a PR for a new approach to the bibliography page on the website The project reached 400 followers on Mastodon, a social media milestone Work continues on documentation, including a Medley Primer and efforts to resurrect old Interlisp programs Topics New Contributor Introduction Ryan Burnside created a Sliding 15 puzzle game in Interlisp for a game jam Discussed potential improvements to make Medley more approachable for new users Ryan appreciated the depth of knowledge and history in the project Bibliography Page Update Bill submitted a PR with a new approach for the bibliography page Mock-up available in staging environment Feedback: Some inconsistent formatting noted, but overall positive reception Documentation Updates PR submitted to add link to HC Files website on documentation page Issue noted that CONTRIBUTING.md file is out of date with broken links Abic finishing Medley Primer, will send for feedback soon Social Media Milestone Reached 400 followers on Mastodon Current stats: 404 Mastodon followers, 118 YouTube subscribers, 78 LinkedIn group members, 46 BlueSky followers Interlisp History Discussion Discussed potential Interlisp exhibit for Interim Computer Museum Talked about early history of Interlisp, BBN, and PDP-10 systems Paolo experimenting with Interlisp-10 on TwinX.org system Ongoing Development Work Ron continuing work on fonts and modernization Stephen working on getting old programs like URISCO running in modern Medley Larry prioritizing getting HTML output from Herb's project into AC files Next Steps Leave feedback on Bill's bibliography page PR Review and update CONTRIBUTING.md file Provide fresh feedback on Medley Primer when Abic sends it out Explore options for Interlisp exhibit at Interim Computer Museum Continue efforts to get old Interlisp programs running in modern Medley View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development work and issues. Key Takeaways - Ron is working on font cleanup and standardization across Interlisp, aiming to deploy new MCCS-compliant fonts - Discussions around backward compatibility and deployment strategy for font/encoding changes - Plans to update T-Edit to version 4 with property list support - Efforts to remove or obsolete outdated code like PRESS format support Topics Font Standardization and MCCS Compliance - Ron has constructed MCCS-compliant fonts for basic families (Gacha, Helvetica, Classic, etc.) - Strategy: Preserve original glyphs where possible, inherit from other fonts to fill gaps - Goal: Consistent character display across fonts, matching MCCS encoding - Challenges with character positioning (e.g. underscore, caret) between old and new fonts T-Edit and File Format Updates - Plans to upgrade T-Edit to version 4 - Add property list support for metadata like dates - Considering strategies for backward compatibility: - Introduce new reader first, delay new writer - Use version detection to handle old/new formats - Discussions on handling undo history and potential memory issues Code Cleanup and Obsolescence - Efforts to remove or obsolete PRESS format support - Keeping bitmap reading functionality while removing unnecessary PRESS code - Discussions on cleaning up other outdated code areas Deployment Strategy - Phased approach proposed: 1. Release new fonts 2. Update keyboard mapping 3. Modify Bravo/T-Edit readers for character code switching 4. Write files in new MCCS format - Concerns about backwards compatibility and transition period Miscellaneous Development Items - Discussions on Sketch application and potential updates needed - Plans to update documentation on font changes - Considerations for future Unicode support Next Steps - Ron to create PR for removing PRESS support while retaining bitmap functionality - Finalize and distribute updated MCCS-compliant fonts - Develop concrete plan for phased deployment of font/encoding changes - Update T-Edit to version 4 with property list support - Review and update Sketch application for compatibility - Document font changes and update relevant guides

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly September 01, 2025  •  448 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development work and issues. Key Takeaways Ron is working on font cleanup and standardization across Interlisp, aiming to deploy new MCCS-compliant fonts Discussions around backward compatibility and deployment strategy for font/encoding changes Plans to update T-Edit to version 4 with property list support Efforts to remove or obsolete outdated code like PRESS format support Topics Font Standardization and MCCS Compliance Ron has constructed MCCS-compliant fonts for basic families (Gacha, Helvetica, Classic, etc.) Strategy: Preserve original glyphs where possible, inherit from other fonts to fill gaps Goal: Consistent character display across fonts, matching MCCS encoding Challenges with character positioning (e.g. underscore, caret) between old and new fonts T-Edit and File Format Updates Plans to upgrade T-Edit to version 4 Add property list support for metadata like dates Considering strategies for backward compatibility: Introduce new reader first, delay new writer Use version detection to handle old/new formats Discussions on handling undo history and potential memory issues Code Cleanup and Obsolescence Efforts to remove or obsolete PRESS format support Keeping bitmap reading functionality while removing unnecessary PRESS code Discussions on cleaning up other outdated code areas Deployment Strategy Phased approach proposed: Release new fonts Update keyboard mapping Modify Bravo/T-Edit readers for character code switching Write files in new MCCS format Concerns about backwards compatibility and transition period Miscellaneous Development Items Discussions on Sketch application and potential updates needed Plans to update documentation on font changes Considerations for future Unicode support Next Steps Ron to create PR for removing PRESS support while retaining bitmap functionality Finalize and distribute updated MCCS-compliant fonts Develop concrete plan for phased deployment of font/encoding changes Update T-Edit to version 4 with property list support Review and update Sketch application for compatibility Document font changes and update relevant guides

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and plans. Key Takeaways - Ellie made progress on cataloging Richard Burton's papers and got e-pad working - Frank encountered challenges updating online to Ubuntu 24.04, reverted to 20.04 - Ron is working on documentation for new font functionality and preparing code for push - 24 newly rediscovered Xerox PARC videos, including Dandelion microcode series, added to archive Topics Richard Burton Papers and E-pad Progress - Ellie cataloged Richard Burton's Interlisp-related papers in Zotero (in "In Progress" category) - Some papers couldn't be found; Ellie will email Richard for copies - E-pad now functional on Ellie's desktop after installing JDK11 Video Archive Updates - Herb discovered 24 misclassified Xerox PARC videos in Internet Archive - Videos moved to PARC Archive collection, including full Dandelion microcode series - Some videos' relevance to Interlisp unclear; team input needed for assessment Online System Update Challenges - Frank attempted to update online system to Ubuntu 24.04 - Encountered significant issues; reverted to 20.04 - Merging of March PR for direct URL access to online completed - Major task ahead to update all systems and eliminate bit rot Font Documentation and Code Push - Ron working on documentation for new font functionality - Preparing code for push, organizing and verifying files - Discussing strategies for transitioning fonts to MCCS with font-specific encodings Dandelion Emulator Project - Potential student project to emulate Dandelion using FPGAs - Discussion of Dandelion vs. Dolphin architecture and microcode differences - Historical context of Xerox machines (Dandelion, Daybreak, Dandy Tiger) shared NASA Lunar Rock Search Engine - Paolo found NASA article about Ron's 1970s project for lunar rock sample database - Natural language interface for searching Apollo rock samples - Collaboration with Bill Woods and Bonnie Nash-Weber; Joe Becker involved in database management Next Steps - Ellie to finish cataloging Richard Burton's papers and upload new videos - Frank to investigate build failure issue and track down HG files problem - Ron to continue font documentation and code preparation - Team to provide input on relevance of newly discovered videos to Interlisp - Stephen to follow up with grad student on graph analytics package documentation

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly September 03, 2025  •  91 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Email Richard Burton re missing papers; request copies Eleanor Young Finish verifying/tagging Burton papers in Zotero; move out of "In Progress" Eleanor Young Upload edited/spliced video on runes to appropriate platform Eleanor Young Send Frank screenshots + description of Norton Ultimate issue w/ SIGWIN release Stephen Kaisler Investigate cause of build failure in latest release; resolve issue Frank Halasz Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and plans. Key Takeaways Ellie made progress on cataloging Richard Burton's papers and got e-pad working Frank encountered challenges updating online to Ubuntu 24.04, reverted to 20.04 Ron is working on documentation for new font functionality and preparing code for push 24 newly rediscovered Xerox PARC videos, including Dandelion microcode series, added to archive Topics Richard Burton Papers and E-pad Progress Ellie cataloged Richard Burton's Interlisp-related papers in Zotero (in "In Progress" category) Some papers couldn't be found; Ellie will email Richard for copies E-pad now functional on Ellie's desktop after installing JDK11 Video Archive Updates Herb discovered 24 misclassified Xerox PARC videos in Internet Archive Videos moved to PARC Archive collection, including full Dandelion microcode series Some videos' relevance to Interlisp unclear; team input needed for assessment Online System Update Challenges Frank attempted to update online system to Ubuntu 24.04 Encountered significant issues; reverted to 20.04 Merging of March PR for direct URL access to online completed Major task ahead to update all systems and eliminate bit rot Font Documentation and Code Push Ron working on documentation for new font functionality Preparing code for push, organizing and verifying files Discussing strategies for transitioning fonts to MCCS with font-specific encodings Dandelion Emulator Project Potential student project to emulate Dandelion using FPGAs Discussion of Dandelion vs. Dolphin architecture and microcode differences Historical context of Xerox machines (Dandelion, Daybreak, Dandy Tiger) shared NASA Lunar Rock Search Engine Paolo found NASA article about Ron's 1970s project for lunar rock sample database Natural language interface for searching Apollo rock samples Collaboration with Bill Woods and Bonnie Nash-Weber; Joe Becker involved in database management Next Steps Ellie to finish cataloging Richard Burton's papers and upload new videos Frank to investigate build failure issue and track down HG files problem Ron to continue font documentation and code preparation Team to provide input on relevance of newly discovered videos to Interlisp Stephen to follow up with grad student on graph analytics package documentation

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing development efforts, particularly font handling improvements and backward compatibility challenges. Key Takeaways - Ron Kaplan has made significant progress on font handling, creating a new architecture with improved consistency and flexibility - Frank Halasz identified critical bugs in Unix process handling code that are causing silent failures in online builds - The team is grappling with backward compatibility challenges, particularly for T-Edit files and font encodings - Paolo Amoroso's recent Interlisp-10 blog post is gaining traction on Hacker News, driving increased interest Topics Font Handling Improvements - Ron has developed a new font architecture using "priority union" to combine glyphs from multiple fonts - Medley font files now act as a projection of constituent fonts, filling in missing glyphs intelligently - New coercion lists allow for flexible font substitution and character set mapping - The system aims to normalize everything to MCCS (Modified Character Code Standard) encoding - Challenges remain in handling backward compatibility for files using old encodings Unix Process Handling Bugs - Frank discovered critical bugs in Unix process communication code - Issues stem from using signed bytes to pass file descriptors, leading to failures after descriptor 128 - T-Edit files are not being closed properly, causing a buildup of open file descriptors - These bugs are causing silent failures in online builds, leaving blank or incomplete output Backward Compatibility Challenges - The team is struggling with how to handle T-Edit files created with new encodings when viewed by old code - Options discussed include hiding metadata in file creation dates or adding explicit markers - Larry Masinter suggested developing a clear backward compatibility policy to guide these decisions - The team recognized the need to balance maintaining old functionality with enabling new features Interlisp-10 Blog Post Traction - Paolo's recent blog post about Interlisp-10 is performing well on Hacker News - The post received 46 votes and a comment from notable Lisper Mark Watson - Unusually, view counts are increasing days after the initial posting, reaching about 900 views - This traction is driving increased interest in Interlisp and Medley Miscellaneous Updates - Herb developed a converter from Laurel/Lafite email format to MBOX for archival purposes - The team briefly discussed reaching out to computer history organizations (Digibarn, Computer History Museum) - Several team members shared personal updates on upcoming cataract surgeries and vision improvements Next Steps - Ron to continue refining font handling implementation and documentation - Frank to create detailed bug reports for Unix process handling issues and work on fixes - Larry to draft a 1-3 paragraph backward compatibility policy as a starting point for discussion - Herb to check in the Laurel-to-MBOX converter code to the appropriate repository - Team to review Ron's font handling documentation in the pending pull request

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly September 08, 2025  •  121 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Send Ron list of files causing issues in HC files Frank Halasz Write up description of Myco bugs as GitHub issue Frank Halasz Fix do-hc files to detect errors, prevent online system mess-up Frank Halasz Check in Laurel-to-MBOX converter code to medley repo Herb Jellinek Write 1-3 paragraph compatibility policy draft Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing development efforts, particularly font handling improvements and backward compatibility challenges. Key Takeaways Ron Kaplan has made significant progress on font handling, creating a new architecture with improved consistency and flexibility Frank Halasz identified critical bugs in Unix process handling code that are causing silent failures in online builds The team is grappling with backward compatibility challenges, particularly for T-Edit files and font encodings Paolo Amoroso's recent Interlisp-10 blog post is gaining traction on Hacker News, driving increased interest Topics Font Handling Improvements Ron has developed a new font architecture using "priority union" to combine glyphs from multiple fonts Medley font files now act as a projection of constituent fonts, filling in missing glyphs intelligently New coercion lists allow for flexible font substitution and character set mapping The system aims to normalize everything to MCCS (Modified Character Code Standard) encoding Challenges remain in handling backward compatibility for files using old encodings Unix Process Handling Bugs Frank discovered critical bugs in Unix process communication code Issues stem from using signed bytes to pass file descriptors, leading to failures after descriptor 128 T-Edit files are not being closed properly, causing a buildup of open file descriptors These bugs are causing silent failures in online builds, leaving blank or incomplete output Backward Compatibility Challenges The team is struggling with how to handle T-Edit files created with new encodings when viewed by old code Options discussed include hiding metadata in file creation dates or adding explicit markers Larry Masinter suggested developing a clear backward compatibility policy to guide these decisions The team recognized the need to balance maintaining old functionality with enabling new features Interlisp-10 Blog Post Traction Paolo's recent blog post about Interlisp-10 is performing well on Hacker News The post received 46 votes and a comment from notable Lisper Mark Watson Unusually, view counts are increasing days after the initial posting, reaching about 900 views This traction is driving increased interest in Interlisp and Medley Miscellaneous Updates Herb developed a converter from Laurel/Lafite email format to MBOX for archival purposes The team briefly discussed reaching out to computer history organizations (Digibarn, Computer History Museum) Several team members shared personal updates on upcoming cataract surgeries and vision improvements Next Steps Ron to continue refining font handling implementation and documentation Frank to create detailed bug reports for Unix process handling issues and work on fixes Larry to draft a 1-3 paragraph backward compatibility policy as a starting point for discussion Herb to check in the Laurel-to-MBOX converter code to the appropriate repository Team to review Ron's font handling documentation in the pending pull request

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Ryan created an exploratory video on building a simple data-plotting program in Interlisp, sparking discussion on documentation improvements and user experience - Progress made on various documentation efforts, including library cleanup, project page updates, and application revival efforts - Technical issues addressed, including PDF export functionality and T-Edit file conversion challenges - New contributor Bob Bain (CLTL-2 author) may join the project, potentially aiding with Common Lisp integration Topics Ryan's Exploratory Video on Data Plotting - Ryan created a screencast showing how to build a simple GUI data-plotting tool in Interlisp - Video highlighted some UI quirks and documentation gaps, sparking discussion on potential improvements - Team appreciated Ryan's approach and pacing, seeing value in the "newcomer perspective" - Discussed strategies for addressing surprises/inconsistencies discovered during video creation Documentation and Website Updates - Paolo completed spreadsheet listing details of every Lisp Users module - Planning similar effort for Library modules - PR #297 submitted with project page updates, including examples of Interlisp applications for revival - Discussed potential reorganization of Lisp Users and Library directories - Considering creation of "grad student projects" list on website Technical Issues and Fixes - Addressed PDF export functionality issue in online.interlisp.org - Ron implemented T-Edit document property storage for MCCS conversion tracking - Ongoing work to resolve T-Edit file conversion challenges and error reporting - Discussion on improving HC Files script output for better error parsing Application Revival Efforts - Stephen working on documenting and debugging URISCO, AM, Strads, and DADM - Discussed licensing considerations for various legacy applications - Exploring ways to support revival efforts while managing expectations New Contributor Potential - Bob Bain, author of CLTL-2 files, may join the project - Could provide valuable insights on post-Xerox PARC developments and Common Lisp integration Next Steps - Ryan to incorporate feedback into future video content, possibly re-shooting parts of existing video - Paolo to proceed with Library module documentation effort - Frank to address PDF converter installation for online.interlisp.org - Ron to continue investigating T-Edit file conversion issues using updated error lists - Team to refine messaging around application revival efforts on project page - Explore onboarding process for Bob Bain and potential contributions

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly September 10, 2025  •  109 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Create new spreadsheet for library, similar to Lisp users one. Copy/adapt structure, go through modules alphabetically, fill details Paolo Amoroso Submit changes discussed for PR #297 on project page. Update wording re supporting revival of systems, remove licensing mentions Paolo Amoroso Coordinate w/ Ryan re getting his video onto interlisp.org YouTube channel Eleanor Young Open ticket for PS to PDF converter issue on online.interlisp.org. Error: "Can't find a PostScript to PDF converter" Paolo Amoroso Check if PS2PDF converter installed w/ Medli on Windows 11 (SIGWIN). May need to update Sigwin installer to include GoScript Frank Halasz Push Laurel to Mbox converter code (Java, ~160 lines) as new sub-repo of Interlisp. Include license file Herb Jellinek Update online repo w/ notes about git-lfs requirement for cloning. Add to README or relevant docs Frank Halasz Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly external Medley Interlisp project meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Ryan created an exploratory video on building a simple data-plotting program in Interlisp, sparking discussion on documentation improvements and user experience Progress made on various documentation efforts, including library cleanup, project page updates, and application revival efforts Technical issues addressed, including PDF export functionality and T-Edit file conversion challenges New contributor Bob Bain (CLTL-2 author) may join the project, potentially aiding with Common Lisp integration Topics Ryan's Exploratory Video on Data Plotting Ryan created a screencast showing how to build a simple GUI data-plotting tool in Interlisp Video highlighted some UI quirks and documentation gaps, sparking discussion on potential improvements Team appreciated Ryan's approach and pacing, seeing value in the "newcomer perspective" Discussed strategies for addressing surprises/inconsistencies discovered during video creation Documentation and Website Updates Paolo completed spreadsheet listing details of every Lisp Users module Planning similar effort for Library modules PR #297 submitted with project page updates, including examples of Interlisp applications for revival Discussed potential reorganization of Lisp Users and Library directories Considering creation of "grad student projects" list on website Technical Issues and Fixes Addressed PDF export functionality issue in online.interlisp.org Ron implemented T-Edit document property storage for MCCS conversion tracking Ongoing work to resolve T-Edit file conversion challenges and error reporting Discussion on improving HC Files script output for better error parsing Application Revival Efforts Stephen working on documenting and debugging URISCO, AM, Strads, and DADM Discussed licensing considerations for various legacy applications Exploring ways to support revival efforts while managing expectations New Contributor Potential Bob Bain, author of CLTL-2 files, may join the project Could provide valuable insights on post-Xerox PARC developments and Common Lisp integration Next Steps Ryan to incorporate feedback into future video content, possibly re-shooting parts of existing video Paolo to proceed with Library module documentation effort Frank to address PDF converter installation for online.interlisp.org Ron to continue investigating T-Edit file conversion issues using updated error lists Team to refine messaging around application revival efforts on project page Explore onboarding process for Bob Bain and potential contributions

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss development progress and issues. Key Takeaways - Ron is working on refactoring and improving the printing/file conversion system, which has become complex and outdated over time - There are ongoing challenges with file type conversions, printer support, and handling different output formats across platforms - The team is exploring ways to streamline workflows and improve documentation for developers Topics Printing and File Conversion Refactoring - Ron has been working on untangling the complex printing and file conversion logic - Current system assumes printer output, which is outdated for modern use cases - Goal is to separate conversion logic from printer-specific code - Challenges include handling different file types, conversions between formats (e.g. PostScript to PDF), and cross-platform compatibility - Exploring options like streaming data instead of creating temporary files Workflow Documentation - Discussion about creating short instructional videos or documentation on common workflows - Suggested topics: setting up Medley for development, making changes to system files, recompilation process - Need to balance documenting current quirks vs. fixing underlying issues Common Lisp Integration - Some Common Lisp features are not fully integrated with the file package system - This can cause issues with recompilation and cleanup functions - Team discussed potential fixes, like automatically detecting Common Lisp constructs and adjusting file types PDF Generation and Viewing - Issues with PDF generation on different platforms (Mac, Linux, online version) - Exploring ways to improve error messages and provide clearer instructions for missing dependencies - Considering adding a URL to error messages pointing to more detailed troubleshooting information Font and Character Issues - Ron mentioned potential character swapping issues with recent changes - New fonts are coming to fix these issues, but not yet released (about 300 files) Next Steps - Team members to test Ron's recent code changes (PR #122) - Frank to investigate piping options for shell commands to improve file conversion process - Consider creating short instructional videos or documentation for common development workflows - Continue work on refactoring printing and file conversion system - Improve error messages and user guidance for PDF generation across platforms

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly September 15, 2025  •  78 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss development progress and issues. Key Takeaways Ron is working on refactoring and improving the printing/file conversion system, which has become complex and outdated over time There are ongoing challenges with file type conversions, printer support, and handling different output formats across platforms The team is exploring ways to streamline workflows and improve documentation for developers Topics Printing and File Conversion Refactoring Ron has been working on untangling the complex printing and file conversion logic Current system assumes printer output, which is outdated for modern use cases Goal is to separate conversion logic from printer-specific code Challenges include handling different file types, conversions between formats (e.g. PostScript to PDF), and cross-platform compatibility Exploring options like streaming data instead of creating temporary files Workflow Documentation Discussion about creating short instructional videos or documentation on common workflows Suggested topics: setting up Medley for development, making changes to system files, recompilation process Need to balance documenting current quirks vs. fixing underlying issues Common Lisp Integration Some Common Lisp features are not fully integrated with the file package system This can cause issues with recompilation and cleanup functions Team discussed potential fixes, like automatically detecting Common Lisp constructs and adjusting file types PDF Generation and Viewing Issues with PDF generation on different platforms (Mac, Linux, online version) Exploring ways to improve error messages and provide clearer instructions for missing dependencies Considering adding a URL to error messages pointing to more detailed troubleshooting information Font and Character Issues Ron mentioned potential character swapping issues with recent changes New fonts are coming to fix these issues, but not yet released (about 300 files) Next Steps Team members to test Ron's recent code changes (PR #122) Frank to investigate piping options for shell commands to improve file conversion process Consider creating short instructional videos or documentation for common development workflows Continue work on refactoring printing and file conversion system Improve error messages and user guidance for PDF generation across platforms View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways - Search functionality on the website has significantly improved, now returning relevant results for most queries - Ongoing work to improve font handling, screen scaling, and Common Lisp integration in Medley - Need to document recommended compiler settings and workflows for new developers - Opportunities identified to modernize UI elements and improve usability Topics Website Search Improvements - Search now returns relevant results for previously problematic queries like "clipboard" and "Smalltalk" - Some search categories (e.g. GitHub issues, mailing list) still not functional - Suggestion to hide non-functional search categories for now - Bill to look into 404 errors from appending "_print" to URLs Screen Scaling and Font Handling - Ongoing work to improve support for larger screens and font scaling - Current max screen size limited to 2^22 bits due to 16-bit field in bitmap table - SDL may provide better scaling options than X Windows - Suggestion to document current options for making text/windows bigger in FAQ Common Lisp Integration - Discussion on best practices for mixing Common Lisp and Interlisp code - Recommendation to set default-cleanup-compiler to CL-compile-file for most development - Need to document compiler settings and potential issues for new developers - Opportunity identified to improve CLTL2 support Trademark and Legal Matters - "Interlisp-D" trademark owned by Xerox is defunct/abandoned - Computer History Museum very cautious about potential copyright issues - Internet Archive settled lawsuit over digitizing 78 RPM records Development Workflows - Various approaches shared for working on Medley codebase - Some use branches in main repo, others keep separate working directory - Suggestion to document recommended workflow for new contributors Image Import/Export - Frank has code to import PNG files as Interlisp bitmaps - Andrew Sengel wrote a PBM format importer - Opportunity to improve image handling capabilities Next Steps - Bill to investigate 404 errors from "_print" URLs - Document recommended compiler settings for new developers - Create shared document for Ryan to note unexpected behaviors/issues - Frank to share PNG import code - Larry to set up 1-on-1 debugging session with Ryan - Continue improving documentation and onboarding for new contributors

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly September 17, 2025  •  130 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways Search functionality on the website has significantly improved, now returning relevant results for most queries Ongoing work to improve font handling, screen scaling, and Common Lisp integration in Medley Need to document recommended compiler settings and workflows for new developers Opportunities identified to modernize UI elements and improve usability Topics Website Search Improvements Search now returns relevant results for previously problematic queries like "clipboard" and "Smalltalk" Some search categories (e.g. GitHub issues, mailing list) still not functional Suggestion to hide non-functional search categories for now Bill to look into 404 errors from appending "_print" to URLs Screen Scaling and Font Handling Ongoing work to improve support for larger screens and font scaling Current max screen size limited to 2^22 bits due to 16-bit field in bitmap table SDL may provide better scaling options than X Windows Suggestion to document current options for making text/windows bigger in FAQ Common Lisp Integration Discussion on best practices for mixing Common Lisp and Interlisp code Recommendation to set default-cleanup-compiler to CL-compile-file for most development Need to document compiler settings and potential issues for new developers Opportunity identified to improve CLTL2 support Trademark and Legal Matters "Interlisp-D" trademark owned by Xerox is defunct/abandoned Computer History Museum very cautious about potential copyright issues Internet Archive settled lawsuit over digitizing 78 RPM records Development Workflows Various approaches shared for working on Medley codebase Some use branches in main repo, others keep separate working directory Suggestion to document recommended workflow for new contributors Image Import/Export Frank has code to import PNG files as Interlisp bitmaps Andrew Sengel wrote a PBM format importer Opportunity to improve image handling capabilities Next Steps Bill to investigate 404 errors from "_print" URLs Document recommended compiler settings for new developers Create shared document for Ryan to note unexpected behaviors/issues Frank to share PNG import code Larry to set up 1-on-1 debugging session with Ryan Continue improving documentation and onboarding for new contributors View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development, issues, and project updates. Key Takeaways - ICM (Interim Computer Museum) reached out about an Interlisp exhibition; Larry will invite them to a meeting for brainstorming - Ron's font PR (#122) is ready for review and testing, with 300 additional Medley format font files added - Discussions around creating a separate repo for fonts as a submodule to improve organization and distribution - Ongoing work on improving image file printing architecture and GitFunds functionality Topics ICM Interlisp Exhibition - Paolo reported that ICM contacted the team about an Interlisp exhibition - Larry will email Stephen Jones to invite ICM representatives to a Wednesday meeting - Team will brainstorm ideas for the exhibition, potentially including interactive demos and QR codes for visitors to try Medley Font System Updates - Ron moved PR #122 from draft to official, including 300 additional Medley format font files - Discussed potential creation of a separate repo for fonts as a Git submodule - Ron working on integrating HTML fonts and completing the font set with BDF glyphs - Team to consider creating a "cheat sheet" for Git submodule commands if implemented Image File Printing Architecture - Ron reworking the architecture to disentangle image file creation from printing - New functions introduced: PS to PDF, t-edit to image file, send file to printer - Changes aim to clean up and simplify the process, avoiding conflicts with PDF simulation GitFunds Improvements - Ron noticed issues with GitFunds running out of space when handling large PRs - Considering changes to use Unix temp files instead of storing files in core - Discussed potential improvements for handling file renaming and directory creation Interlisp History and Archives - Larry discovered Lisp ARs (Action Requests) in the Park CHM collection, potential source for regression testing - Discussed the absence of Richard's early 70s files in the Computer History Museum archives - Team considering ways to improve searchability of various Interlisp-related resources (bibliography, mailing lists, GitHub issues) Miscellaneous Development Topics - Discussed potential bug in regions/flood fill implementation - Ryan interested in implementing 3D graphics demos and exploring brush/texture capabilities - Herb working on Lafitte and Laurel to Mbox converter, seeking insights on t-edit formatted files in Lafitte mail Next Steps - Larry to email Stephen Jones about ICM joining a Wednesday meeting for exhibition brainstorming - Team to review and test Ron's font PR (#122) - Consider implementing a separate repo for fonts as a Git submodule - Ron to continue work on image file printing architecture improvements - Investigate and potentially implement improvements to GitFunds for handling large PRs - Explore ways to improve searchability of Interlisp-related resources - Herb to send a message in Discord chat to schedule meeting with Eric and Ellie

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly September 22, 2025  •  126 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development, issues, and project updates. Key Takeaways ICM (Interim Computer Museum) reached out about an Interlisp exhibition; Larry will invite them to a meeting for brainstorming Ron's font PR (#122) is ready for review and testing, with 300 additional Medley format font files added Discussions around creating a separate repo for fonts as a submodule to improve organization and distribution Ongoing work on improving image file printing architecture and GitFunds functionality Topics ICM Interlisp Exhibition Paolo reported that ICM contacted the team about an Interlisp exhibition Larry will email Stephen Jones to invite ICM representatives to a Wednesday meeting Team will brainstorm ideas for the exhibition, potentially including interactive demos and QR codes for visitors to try Medley Font System Updates Ron moved PR #122 from draft to official, including 300 additional Medley format font files Discussed potential creation of a separate repo for fonts as a Git submodule Ron working on integrating HTML fonts and completing the font set with BDF glyphs Team to consider creating a "cheat sheet" for Git submodule commands if implemented Image File Printing Architecture Ron reworking the architecture to disentangle image file creation from printing New functions introduced: PS to PDF, t-edit to image file, send file to printer Changes aim to clean up and simplify the process, avoiding conflicts with PDF simulation GitFunds Improvements Ron noticed issues with GitFunds running out of space when handling large PRs Considering changes to use Unix temp files instead of storing files in core Discussed potential improvements for handling file renaming and directory creation Interlisp History and Archives Larry discovered Lisp ARs (Action Requests) in the Park CHM collection, potential source for regression testing Discussed the absence of Richard's early 70s files in the Computer History Museum archives Team considering ways to improve searchability of various Interlisp-related resources (bibliography, mailing lists, GitHub issues) Miscellaneous Development Topics Discussed potential bug in regions/flood fill implementation Ryan interested in implementing 3D graphics demos and exploring brush/texture capabilities Herb working on Lafitte and Laurel to Mbox converter, seeking insights on t-edit formatted files in Lafitte mail Next Steps Larry to email Stephen Jones about ICM joining a Wednesday meeting for exhibition brainstorming Team to review and test Ron's font PR (#122) Consider implementing a separate repo for fonts as a Git submodule Ron to continue work on image file printing architecture improvements Investigate and potentially implement improvements to GitFunds for handling large PRs Explore ways to improve searchability of Interlisp-related resources Herb to send a message in Discord chat to schedule meeting with Eric and Ellie View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways - Ongoing work on HTML generation, file compilation, and UI improvements - Challenges with clipboard functionality and cross-platform compatibility - Interest in reviving networking capabilities, particularly XNS and PUP protocols - Discussion on potential use of submodules for managing fonts and other components Topics HTML Generation Issues - Herb and Ron investigating problems with HTMLStream creating hard copies of T-Edit documents - Possible issues with lexical variable naming and compilation - Suggestion to document these types of system programming gotchas on GitHub Recompilation Efforts - Frank working on a pull request to recompile all source files - Challenges with determining correct compilation order and dependencies - Discussion on improving file type properties for easier compilation UI and Graphics Improvements - Ryan working on optimizing drawing performance for game implementation - Suggestions to use pre-rendered bitmaps and double buffering for faster graphics Clipboard Functionality - Issues with XClipboard implementation on Linux - Discussions on best practices for interfacing with system clipboards across platforms Networking Capabilities - Interest in reviving TCP/IP, XNS, and PUP networking protocols - Potential use of PCAP library for machine-independent raw Ethernet access - Discussion on security considerations for older networking implementations Code Style and Compatibility - Discussions on preferred coding style for new Interlisp implementations - Balancing historical Interlisp conventions with modern Common Lisp practices Project Management - Consideration of using Git submodules for managing fonts and other components - Discussion on best practices for merging and managing branches Next Steps - Continue investigating HTML generation issues and document findings - Refine recompilation efforts, focusing on correct file ordering and dependencies - Optimize graphics performance in game implementations - Further investigate and resolve clipboard functionality issues - Explore options for reviving networking capabilities, possibly as a grad student project - Consider implementing Git submodules for better component management - Review and update coding style guidelines for new implementations

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

September 29, 2025  •  106 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, issues, and next steps. Key Takeaways Ongoing work on HTML generation, file compilation, and UI improvements Challenges with clipboard functionality and cross-platform compatibility Interest in reviving networking capabilities, particularly XNS and PUP protocols Discussion on potential use of submodules for managing fonts and other components Topics HTML Generation Issues Herb and Ron investigating problems with HTMLStream creating hard copies of T-Edit documents Possible issues with lexical variable naming and compilation Suggestion to document these types of system programming gotchas on GitHub Recompilation Efforts Frank working on a pull request to recompile all source files Challenges with determining correct compilation order and dependencies Discussion on improving file type properties for easier compilation UI and Graphics Improvements Ryan working on optimizing drawing performance for game implementation Suggestions to use pre-rendered bitmaps and double buffering for faster graphics Clipboard Functionality Issues with XClipboard implementation on Linux Discussions on best practices for interfacing with system clipboards across platforms Networking Capabilities Interest in reviving TCP/IP, XNS, and PUP networking protocols Potential use of PCAP library for machine-independent raw Ethernet access Discussion on security considerations for older networking implementations Code Style and Compatibility Discussions on preferred coding style for new Interlisp implementations Balancing historical Interlisp conventions with modern Common Lisp practices Project Management Consideration of using Git submodules for managing fonts and other components Discussion on best practices for merging and managing branches Next Steps Continue investigating HTML generation issues and document findings Refine recompilation efforts, focusing on correct file ordering and dependencies Optimize graphics performance in game implementations Further investigate and resolve clipboard functionality issues Explore options for reviving networking capabilities, possibly as a grad student project Consider implementing Git submodules for better component management Review and update coding style guidelines for new implementations View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways - Several PRs were reviewed and approved, including font changes (PR 2280) and clipboard functionality (PR 2297) - Ongoing work on compiling and loading up Medley from source, with some remaining issues to resolve - Discussion of potential submodule structure for the project repositories - Need to clean up null files and address some longstanding load-up errors Topics Font and Character Encoding Updates - PR 2280 approved, implementing next round of font and MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) changes - Goal is to standardize character encoding across fonts and improve display consistency - Some challenges remain with certain fonts like Palatino and handling of special characters - Plan to use BDF fonts as background for display fonts to fill out missing glyphs Compilation and Load-up Progress - Frank working on compiling everything from source - Most files compile cleanly except for LL Timer (unsafe-to-modify-funds violation) - Can load up to init, but fails on init to mid - investigating the cause - Need to verify functionality after recompilation Repository Structure and Submodules - Discussing potential use of Git submodules to better manage dependencies between repositories - Would allow synchronizing specific versions of components like Maiko with Medley - Considering making components like Online and Notecards submodules of the main Medley repo Ongoing Issues and Cleanup - Some files still contain null characters, affecting whereis.hash generation - Several load-up errors from July (issues 2230-2233) need investigation - PR 2056 identifies unused files in sources that can be ignored during compilation Video Enhancement Project - Matt to experiment with AI-based video enhancement on archive.org videos - Focus on older, lower quality recordings like the Raphael Bobrow video from 1973 - Will report back on results for potential upload of improved versions Next Steps - Herb to review and test Ron's changes to the ED command (PR 2301) - Frank to continue work on manual updates - Matt to attempt video enhancement on older Interlisp videos - Nick to add comment on issue 2236 regarding remaining null files - Continue investigation and resolution of load-up errors - Further discussion needed on implementing submodule structure

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

October 06, 2025  •  89 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss ongoing development efforts and issues. Key Takeaways Several PRs were reviewed and approved, including font changes (PR 2280) and clipboard functionality (PR 2297) Ongoing work on compiling and loading up Medley from source, with some remaining issues to resolve Discussion of potential submodule structure for the project repositories Need to clean up null files and address some longstanding load-up errors Topics Font and Character Encoding Updates PR 2280 approved, implementing next round of font and MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) changes Goal is to standardize character encoding across fonts and improve display consistency Some challenges remain with certain fonts like Palatino and handling of special characters Plan to use BDF fonts as background for display fonts to fill out missing glyphs Compilation and Load-up Progress Frank working on compiling everything from source Most files compile cleanly except for LL Timer (unsafe-to-modify-funds violation) Can load up to init, but fails on init to mid - investigating the cause Need to verify functionality after recompilation Repository Structure and Submodules Discussing potential use of Git submodules to better manage dependencies between repositories Would allow synchronizing specific versions of components like Maiko with Medley Considering making components like Online and Notecards submodules of the main Medley repo Ongoing Issues and Cleanup Some files still contain null characters, affecting whereis.hash generation Several load-up errors from July (issues 2230-2233) need investigation PR 2056 identifies unused files in sources that can be ignored during compilation Video Enhancement Project Matt to experiment with AI-based video enhancement on archive.org videos Focus on older, lower quality recordings like the Raphael Bobrow video from 1973 Will report back on results for potential upload of improved versions Next Steps Herb to review and test Ron's changes to the ED command (PR 2301) Frank to continue work on manual updates Matt to attempt video enhancement on older Interlisp videos Nick to add comment on issue 2236 regarding remaining null files Continue investigation and resolution of load-up errors Further discussion needed on implementing submodule structure

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing development work on the Medley Interlisp implementation, focusing on font handling changes and other issues. Key Takeaways - PR #2280 with major font handling changes needs further testing before approval - Issues with fixed-width fonts and character encoding need to be resolved - IRM documentation files not loading properly due to font changes - Team exploring ways to improve CommonLisp compatibility and testing Topics Font Handling Changes (PR #2280) - PR #2280 makes major changes to font handling, with 400 files changed across 42 commits - Concerns raised about backward compatibility and potential issues with fixed-width fonts - Team debated how to handle underscore/left arrow character mapping - Decision made to test PR #2280 further before approving on Wednesday Fixed-Width Font Issues - Discussion on ensuring fixed-width fonts remain fixed-width when adding new characters - Proposal to create separate "fixed" versions of fonts like Gotcha and Terminal - Need to align widths and heights when filling in characters from other fonts Character Encoding and Keyboard Mapping - Debate on how to map underscore key to left arrow in certain contexts - Suggestion to use meta-shift-minus for left arrow, meta-underscore for underscore - Virtual Keyboards package may need updating to reflect any changes IRM Documentation Loading Issue - IRM T-edit files no longer loading properly since PR #2203 - Issue traced to changes in font handling, specifically Coerced Font Desk function - Frank able to load files in PR #2280 branch but not in master CommonLisp Compatibility - Ryan discussed potential use of SICL project code to improve CommonLisp compatibility - Suggestion to run ANSI CommonLisp compliance suite to identify implemented/missing features - Noted challenges with package naming differences between CommonLisp versions Bibliography Work - Matt made fixes to Bill's bibliography implementation, addressing HTML entity issues - Discussion on improving abstract display and linking in bibliography Next Steps - Larry to test PR #2280 further and aim to approve by Wednesday - Herb to write up remaining tasks for font changes and check with Arun/Bob Bain on Fasload behavior - Frank to continue work on IRM documentation loading issue - Ryan to explore running CommonLisp compliance tests on Medley - Team to continue refining bibliography implementation

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

October 13, 2025  •  126 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Generate BDF files for fixed-pitch fonts in bold style using FontForge Matt Heffron Update virtual keyboards package to map F10 key to underscore character Ron Kaplan Add subtask to existing Primer issue for hosting new Primer on Interlisp website Larry Masinter-lisp Send note to Lispcore mailing list asking about rationale for Fasload binding file package flags to nil Herb Jellinek Investigate changing Fasload to not rebind file package flags; create PR within a week Herb Jellinek Approve PR-2280 after running/testing it for a while Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Discuss ongoing development work on the Medley Interlisp implementation, focusing on font handling changes and other issues. Key Takeaways PR #2280 with major font handling changes needs further testing before approval Issues with fixed-width fonts and character encoding need to be resolved IRM documentation files not loading properly due to font changes Team exploring ways to improve CommonLisp compatibility and testing Topics Font Handling Changes (PR #2280) PR #2280 makes major changes to font handling, with 400 files changed across 42 commits Concerns raised about backward compatibility and potential issues with fixed-width fonts Team debated how to handle underscore/left arrow character mapping Decision made to test PR #2280 further before approving on Wednesday Fixed-Width Font Issues Discussion on ensuring fixed-width fonts remain fixed-width when adding new characters Proposal to create separate "fixed" versions of fonts like Gotcha and Terminal Need to align widths and heights when filling in characters from other fonts Character Encoding and Keyboard Mapping Debate on how to map underscore key to left arrow in certain contexts Suggestion to use meta-shift-minus for left arrow, meta-underscore for underscore Virtual Keyboards package may need updating to reflect any changes IRM Documentation Loading Issue IRM T-edit files no longer loading properly since PR #2203 Issue traced to changes in font handling, specifically Coerced Font Desk function Frank able to load files in PR #2280 branch but not in master CommonLisp Compatibility Ryan discussed potential use of SICL project code to improve CommonLisp compatibility Suggestion to run ANSI CommonLisp compliance suite to identify implemented/missing features Noted challenges with package naming differences between CommonLisp versions Bibliography Work Matt made fixes to Bill's bibliography implementation, addressing HTML entity issues Discussion on improving abstract display and linking in bibliography Next Steps Larry to test PR #2280 further and aim to approve by Wednesday Herb to write up remaining tasks for font changes and check with Arun/Bob Bain on Fasload behavior Frank to continue work on IRM documentation loading issue Ryan to explore running CommonLisp compliance tests on Medley Team to continue refining bibliography implementation

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp development Key Takeaways - New Primer chapters added on file browser and variable bindings/scope - Bibliography work progressing well on staging site - File system/naming issues being investigated, particularly for Unicode support - Clipboard functionality on online.interlisp.org may need re-testing Topics Primer Updates - Abhik added new chapters on file browser and variable bindings/scope - Considering adding historical photos to humanize the content - Need to figure out Gitbook setup for publication - Planning to use primer.interlisp.org subdomain Key Bindings Documentation - Suggestion to add basic key binding cheat sheet, possibly as T-Edit document - Larry has spreadsheet comparing key bindings across systems - Need to balance providing useful defaults vs. context-specific bindings Bibliography Progress - Bill made updates to author formatting on staging site - Considering what additional metadata to include (tags, publication info) - Herb submitted new 1186 advertising flyer to be added File System/Naming Work - Ron investigating interfaces between Medley and Unix file systems - Challenges with Unicode support, particularly for emoji - Need to test both Interlisp and Common Lisp file operations Notecards Manual - Frank moved V2 manual into Notecards directory - All T-Edit files working in V2, obsolete 1.2 files can be ignored - Frank testing Notecards functionality in latest PR Online Clipboard Issue - Reports of clipboard issues on online.interlisp.org a few weeks ago - Latest build (Oct 8) may have fixed it, but needs re-testing - VNC clipboard interaction may complicate things Next Steps - Abhik to prepare Primer for next week, investigate Gitbook setup - Bill to continue bibliography refinements on staging site - Ron to continue file system investigations, test Common Lisp side - Frank to work on table of contents generation for IRM files - Ryan to re-test clipboard functionality on online.interlisp.org

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly October 15, 2025  •  118 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly status update and discussion on Medley Interlisp development Key Takeaways New Primer chapters added on file browser and variable bindings/scope Bibliography work progressing well on staging site File system/naming issues being investigated, particularly for Unicode support Clipboard functionality on online.interlisp.org may need re-testing Topics Primer Updates Abhik added new chapters on file browser and variable bindings/scope Considering adding historical photos to humanize the content Need to figure out Gitbook setup for publication Planning to use primer.interlisp.org subdomain Key Bindings Documentation Suggestion to add basic key binding cheat sheet, possibly as T-Edit document Larry has spreadsheet comparing key bindings across systems Need to balance providing useful defaults vs. context-specific bindings Bibliography Progress Bill made updates to author formatting on staging site Considering what additional metadata to include (tags, publication info) Herb submitted new 1186 advertising flyer to be added File System/Naming Work Ron investigating interfaces between Medley and Unix file systems Challenges with Unicode support, particularly for emoji Need to test both Interlisp and Common Lisp file operations Notecards Manual Frank moved V2 manual into Notecards directory All T-Edit files working in V2, obsolete 1.2 files can be ignored Frank testing Notecards functionality in latest PR Online Clipboard Issue Reports of clipboard issues on online.interlisp.org a few weeks ago Latest build (Oct 8) may have fixed it, but needs re-testing VNC clipboard interaction may complicate things Next Steps Abhik to prepare Primer for next week, investigate Gitbook setup Bill to continue bibliography refinements on staging site Ron to continue file system investigations, test Common Lisp side Frank to work on table of contents generation for IRM files Ryan to re-test clipboard functionality on online.interlisp.org View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, open PRs, and ongoing development efforts. Key Takeaways - Font-related PR (2280) approved after addressing review comments - New UTF-8 file name handling implemented for Mac, needs testing on Windows - Significant increase in Medley Online guest logins (500 in last month) - Progress made on manual formatting and bibliography updates Topics Open PRs and Code Reviews - PR-2280 (font-related) approved after addressing rename request - PR-2292 (Windows-specific changes) approved based on Frank's testing - GitFunds status display updated to show 'C' for changes requested - Discussion on handling PRs with requested changes and approval workflows UTF-8 File Name Handling - Ron implemented UTF-8 file name handling for Mac OS - New functions: M-to-UTF-8-string and UTF-8-to-M-string - Allows creation and viewing of non-ASCII filenames (e.g., Greek characters) - Changes made to Unicode file loading order in system startup - Need to test implementation on Windows and consider handling of combining characters Manual and Documentation Updates - Frank working on table of contents functionality for manuals - Files in Medley-IRM available for editing, though sectioning not fully implemented - Discussion on using IAM index and other DocTools for formatting Medley Online Usage - 31 logins with named users in the last month - 500 guest logins, significantly higher than usual - Potential increase due to recent social media sharing of Medley features Miscellaneous Updates - Steve recovering from kidney stone surgery complications - Interlisp.org now listed in Secretary of State's online database of charities - Organization has about $27,000 in funds, with low monthly AWS spending Next Steps - Test UTF-8 file name handling on Windows - Continue work on manual formatting and bibliography updates - Investigate and potentially implement handling of combining characters in UTF-8 conversion - Monitor Medley Online usage for any significant increases in load - Review and provide feedback on the updated Interlisp Primer

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly October 20, 2025  •  75 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly Medley Interlisp Implementation meeting to discuss progress, open PRs, and ongoing development efforts. Key Takeaways Font-related PR (2280) approved after addressing review comments New UTF-8 file name handling implemented for Mac, needs testing on Windows Significant increase in Medley Online guest logins (500 in last month) Progress made on manual formatting and bibliography updates Topics Open PRs and Code Reviews PR-2280 (font-related) approved after addressing rename request PR-2292 (Windows-specific changes) approved based on Frank's testing GitFunds status display updated to show 'C' for changes requested Discussion on handling PRs with requested changes and approval workflows UTF-8 File Name Handling Ron implemented UTF-8 file name handling for Mac OS New functions: M-to-UTF-8-string and UTF-8-to-M-string Allows creation and viewing of non-ASCII filenames (e.g., Greek characters) Changes made to Unicode file loading order in system startup Need to test implementation on Windows and consider handling of combining characters Manual and Documentation Updates Frank working on table of contents functionality for manuals Files in Medley-IRM available for editing, though sectioning not fully implemented Discussion on using IAM index and other DocTools for formatting Medley Online Usage 31 logins with named users in the last month 500 guest logins, significantly higher than usual Potential increase due to recent social media sharing of Medley features Miscellaneous Updates Steve recovering from kidney stone surgery complications Interlisp.org now listed in Secretary of State's online database of charities Organization has about $27,000 in funds, with low monthly AWS spending Next Steps Test UTF-8 file name handling on Windows Continue work on manual formatting and bibliography updates Investigate and potentially implement handling of combining characters in UTF-8 conversion Monitor Medley Online usage for any significant increases in load Review and provide feedback on the updated Interlisp Primer View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review project updates, resolve technical issues, and plan community engagement. Key Takeaways - Primer Restructure: The Interlisp Primer will be restructured for better flow, using established Lisp books (e.g., Practical Common Lisp) as a guide. - GitHub CLI Fix: The gh issue view command error (issue #2325) is caused by an outdated gh CLI version (2.45) installed via apt. The fix is to install the latest version (2.82.1) via brew or direct download. - Game Jam Demo: Ryan will create a game for the Autumn Lisp Game Jam. The team will add a feature to the online environment to load and run the game's Lisp source file directly, providing a simple, interactive demo. - Bibliography Data Cleanup: The bibliography page is blocked by data errors in Zotero (e.g., incorrect author formats). Matt and Bill require edit access to clean the source data, as coding workarounds are inefficient. Topics Documentation & Website Updates - Gitbook Primer: - Goal: Publish the Primer on Gitbook, potentially integrating the Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) for a unified, searchable site. - Feedback: The current structure is confusing for new users. - Problem: Jumps between concepts (atoms, lists, functions) without a clear, logical progression. - Solution: Restructure the introduction based on established Lisp books. - Engineering Computer Museum: - Action: Ping Stephen Jones for an update on their exhibit and collaboration request. - GitHub Repo Cleanup (Issue #11.12): - Decision: Rename obsolete repos with an obsolete- prefix instead of deleting them, preserving history without cluttering the main list. - Admin Resource List (Issue #1542): - Goal: Create a central list of admins, access levels, and credentials. - Storage: A private GitHub repo is the preferred option for better access control than a shared drive. - Bibliography Page: - Progress: Bill is building out individual bibliography entries. - Blocker: Data errors in Zotero (e.g., incorrect author formats, stray text in abstracts) prevent accurate rendering. - Action: Matt and Bill need edit access to Zotero to clean the source data. Technical Deep Dives - GitHub Projects Migration: - Status: The organization was automatically migrated to the new GitHub Projects. - Issue: The gh issue view command fails with a deprecation warning (issue #2325). - Root Cause: An outdated gh CLI version (2.45) from apt is the problem. The latest version (2.82.1) works correctly. - Filename Encoding (Windows/WSL): - Context: A bug fix for GitFunds (related to underscores in filenames) raised questions about filename encoding on Windows/WSL. - Hypothesis: WSL and Cygwin handle UTF-8/UTF-16 conversion automatically, making a simple UTF-8 approach sufficient. - Action: Experiment with non-ASCII filenames on Windows/WSL to validate the hypothesis. - Snap Issues (Ubuntu): - Problem: Ryan's Ubuntu setup has issues with Medley opening Snap-installed browsers. - Diagnosis: Frank suspects a Snap-related environment variable issue. The gh CLI team also advises against Snap installs due to runtime problems. Community & Outreach - Autumn Lisp Game Jam: - Plan: Ryan will create a simple game (Hungarian ring puzzle) for the jam to showcase Medley. - Demo Strategy: Provide a Lisp source file, not a full image, for users to load and run in the online environment. - Action: Add a feature to the online environment to load an init file from a URL, enabling simple, interactive demos. - "Zen of Interlisp" Idea: - Concept: A set of aphorisms to capture the spirit and idioms of Interlisp, similar to Python's "Zen." - Examples: "Managed is better than unmerged," "Windows are streams." - Action: Paolo will open a GitHub issue to collect ideas. Next Steps - Abhik: - Continue work on the Gitbook Primer; publish in one week. - Open a GitHub issue to collect "Zen of Interlisp" aphorisms. - Ron: - Ping Stephen Jones at the Engineering Computer Museum. - Fix the local gh CLI installation. - Experiment with non-ASCII filenames on Windows/WSL to test encoding. - Paolo: - Update issue #1542 with the private repo proposal for admin resources. - Bill: - Push bibliography updates to the staging site for review. - Matt: - Get edit access to Zotero to clean bibliography data. - Ryan: - Create a game for the Autumn Lisp Game Jam. - Frank: - Investigate adding a URL-based init file loader to the online environment. - Larry: - Investigate public availability of Xerox Quintus Prologue documents.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly October 22, 2025  •  117 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review project updates, resolve technical issues, and plan community engagement. Key Takeaways Primer Restructure: The Interlisp Primer will be restructured for better flow, using established Lisp books (e.g., Practical Common Lisp) as a guide. GitHub CLI Fix: The gh issue view command error (issue #2325) is caused by an outdated gh CLI version (2.45) installed via apt. The fix is to install the latest version (2.82.1) via brew or direct download. Game Jam Demo: Ryan will create a game for the Autumn Lisp Game Jam. The team will add a feature to the online environment to load and run the game's Lisp source file directly, providing a simple, interactive demo. Bibliography Data Cleanup: The bibliography page is blocked by data errors in Zotero (e.g., incorrect author formats). Matt and Bill require edit access to clean the source data, as coding workarounds are inefficient. Topics Documentation & Website Updates Gitbook Primer: Goal: Publish the Primer on Gitbook, potentially integrating the Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) for a unified, searchable site. Feedback: The current structure is confusing for new users. Problem: Jumps between concepts (atoms, lists, functions) without a clear, logical progression. Solution: Restructure the introduction based on established Lisp books. Engineering Computer Museum: Action: Ping Stephen Jones for an update on their exhibit and collaboration request. GitHub Repo Cleanup (Issue #11.12): Decision: Rename obsolete repos with an obsolete- prefix instead of deleting them, preserving history without cluttering the main list. Admin Resource List (Issue #1542): Goal: Create a central list of admins, access levels, and credentials. Storage: A private GitHub repo is the preferred option for better access control than a shared drive. Bibliography Page: Progress: Bill is building out individual bibliography entries. Blocker: Data errors in Zotero (e.g., incorrect author formats, stray text in abstracts) prevent accurate rendering. Action: Matt and Bill need edit access to Zotero to clean the source data. Technical Deep Dives GitHub Projects Migration: Status: The organization was automatically migrated to the new GitHub Projects. Issue: The gh issue view command fails with a deprecation warning (issue #2325). Root Cause: An outdated gh CLI version (2.45) from apt is the problem. The latest version (2.82.1) works correctly. Filename Encoding (Windows/WSL): Context: A bug fix for GitFunds (related to underscores in filenames) raised questions about filename encoding on Windows/WSL. Hypothesis: WSL and Cygwin handle UTF-8/UTF-16 conversion automatically, making a simple UTF-8 approach sufficient. Action: Experiment with non-ASCII filenames on Windows/WSL to validate the hypothesis. Snap Issues (Ubuntu): Problem: Ryan's Ubuntu setup has issues with Medley opening Snap-installed browsers. Diagnosis: Frank suspects a Snap-related environment variable issue. The gh CLI team also advises against Snap installs due to runtime problems. Community & Outreach Autumn Lisp Game Jam: Plan: Ryan will create a simple game (Hungarian ring puzzle) for the jam to showcase Medley. Demo Strategy: Provide a Lisp source file, not a full image, for users to load and run in the online environment. Action: Add a feature to the online environment to load an init file from a URL, enabling simple, interactive demos. "Zen of Interlisp" Idea: Concept: A set of aphorisms to capture the spirit and idioms of Interlisp, similar to Python's "Zen." Examples: "Managed is better than unmerged," "Windows are streams." Action: Paolo will open a GitHub issue to collect ideas. Next Steps Abhik: Continue work on the Gitbook Primer; publish in one week. Open a GitHub issue to collect "Zen of Interlisp" aphorisms. Ron: Ping Stephen Jones at the Engineering Computer Museum. Fix the local gh CLI installation. Experiment with non-ASCII filenames on Windows/WSL to test encoding. Paolo: Update issue #1542 with the private repo proposal for admin resources. Bill: Push bibliography updates to the staging site for review. Matt: Get edit access to Zotero to clean bibliography data. Ryan: Create a game for the Autumn Lisp Game Jam. Frank: Investigate adding a URL-based init file loader to the online environment. Larry: Investigate public availability of Xerox Quintus Prologue documents. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review PRs, sync on project status, and discuss future work. Key Takeaways - MCCS File Naming PR (RMK131) Approved: This PR enables Medley to correctly handle Unicode filenames (e.g., Greek letters) on Windows and WSL, resolving a long-standing compatibility issue. - Critical Bug Found in RMK131: A follow-up test revealed that expunge and del file commands fail for Unicode filenames, requiring an immediate fix before the PR can be merged. - GitFunds PR (2321) Approved: This PR improves Git integration by treating the clone directory as a standard Unix device, simplifying the workflow and fixing a bug where new directories were not created for copied files. - New Initiatives: Future work will focus on extending MCCS to support combining characters and creating a "runnable screenshots" feature for the online interpreter to improve documentation and museum demos. Topics MCCS File Naming PR (RMK131) - Problem: Medley could not correctly handle Unicode characters in filenames on Windows and WSL. - Solution: PR RMK131 implements MCCS encoding for file operations, enabling proper translation between Medley's internal strings and the host OS's filesystem. - Testing: - Initial Success: Tests confirmed correct handling of underscores and Greek letters (e.g., Lambda) in filenames, including creation, listing, and renaming. - Critical Failure: expunge and del file commands failed for these Unicode filenames on both Windows and Mac, indicating a bug in the deletion logic. - Status: Approved pending a fix for the deletion bug. GitFunds PR (2321) - Problem: The GWC command (Git Working Copy) created clutter in the clone directory by retaining Medley's internal version numbers, which are irrelevant to Git. - Solution: The PR treats the clone directory as a standard Unix device, preventing GWC from adding version numbers. - Additional Fixes: - Interprets Git's "copy" operation as an "add" to ensure new directories are created. - Adds the function name to the PRC comparison window title for better context. - Status: Approved. Other PRs Reviewed - PR 2322 (Which Key Utility): Adds documentation and more info (key number) for the keyboard testing tool. Approved. - PR 2323 (Edit Font Bug Fix): Fixes a bug in the font bitmap editor where changes were not saved correctly. Approved. - PR 2324 (Doc Cleanup): Moves T-Edit-specific documentation from the modernized doc. Approved. - PR 2326 (TIAIDA Window Placement): Improves TIAIDA's initial window placement heuristics. Approved. Project Updates & Future Work - Bibliography Cleanup: - Progress: Bill added taxonomy and author filtering; Matt fixed typos and improved abstract formatting. - Data Quality: The Zotero source has inconsistent author names (e.g., "Bobro DG" vs. "Bobro Daniel"). - Future: Create issues for enhancements like displaying contributor types and normalizing author names. - HTML Stream MCCS Migration: Herb will update the HTML stream implementation to use MCCS for font metrics and Unicode mappings. - Kubuntu shell open Bug: Frank is investigating a bug where shell open fails on Kubuntu. The issue is specific to the create process stream path, which differs from the working chat shell path. A potential workaround is to call applications directly instead of using xdg-open. - "Runnable Screenshots" Feature: - Goal: Create a feature for the online.interlisp.org interpreter to load a specific state from a URL, enabling interactive examples in documentation and museum demos. - Implementation: The init file will fetch a script from a URL (e.g., GitHub) and execute it. Next Steps - Ron: - Fix the expunge and del file bug in RMK131 and request re-approval. - Merge approved PRs: 2321, 2322, 2323, 2324, 2326. - Create an issue for combining character support. - Matt: - Re-test RMK131 on Windows after the fix. - Create issues for bibliography enhancements. - Herb: - Begin HTML stream MCCS migration. - Share converted email files with Larry via Google Drive. - Frank: - Continue investigating the Kubuntu shell open bug. - Scope the "runnable screenshots" feature. - Larry: - Publish the Primer to a GitHub.io site with a custom URL.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly October 27, 2025  •  104 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Purpose Review PRs, sync on project status, and discuss future work. Key Takeaways MCCS File Naming PR (RMK131) Approved: This PR enables Medley to correctly handle Unicode filenames (e.g., Greek letters) on Windows and WSL, resolving a long-standing compatibility issue. Critical Bug Found in RMK131: A follow-up test revealed that expunge and del file commands fail for Unicode filenames, requiring an immediate fix before the PR can be merged. GitFunds PR (2321) Approved: This PR improves Git integration by treating the clone directory as a standard Unix device, simplifying the workflow and fixing a bug where new directories were not created for copied files. New Initiatives: Future work will focus on extending MCCS to support combining characters and creating a "runnable screenshots" feature for the online interpreter to improve documentation and museum demos. Topics MCCS File Naming PR (RMK131) Problem: Medley could not correctly handle Unicode characters in filenames on Windows and WSL. Solution: PR RMK131 implements MCCS encoding for file operations, enabling proper translation between Medley's internal strings and the host OS's filesystem. Testing: Initial Success: Tests confirmed correct handling of underscores and Greek letters (e.g., Lambda) in filenames, including creation, listing, and renaming. Critical Failure: expunge and del file commands failed for these Unicode filenames on both Windows and Mac, indicating a bug in the deletion logic. Status: Approved pending a fix for the deletion bug. GitFunds PR (2321) Problem: The GWC command (Git Working Copy) created clutter in the clone directory by retaining Medley's internal version numbers, which are irrelevant to Git. Solution: The PR treats the clone directory as a standard Unix device, preventing GWC from adding version numbers. Additional Fixes: Interprets Git's "copy" operation as an "add" to ensure new directories are created. Adds the function name to the PRC comparison window title for better context. Status: Approved. Other PRs Reviewed PR 2322 (Which Key Utility): Adds documentation and more info (key number) for the keyboard testing tool. Approved. PR 2323 (Edit Font Bug Fix): Fixes a bug in the font bitmap editor where changes were not saved correctly. Approved. PR 2324 (Doc Cleanup): Moves T-Edit-specific documentation from the modernized doc. Approved. PR 2326 (TIAIDA Window Placement): Improves TIAIDA's initial window placement heuristics. Approved. Project Updates & Future Work Bibliography Cleanup: Progress: Bill added taxonomy and author filtering; Matt fixed typos and improved abstract formatting. Data Quality: The Zotero source has inconsistent author names (e.g., "Bobro DG" vs. "Bobro Daniel"). Future: Create issues for enhancements like displaying contributor types and normalizing author names. HTML Stream MCCS Migration: Herb will update the HTML stream implementation to use MCCS for font metrics and Unicode mappings. Kubuntu shell open Bug: Frank is investigating a bug where shell open fails on Kubuntu. The issue is specific to the create process stream path, which differs from the working chat shell path. A potential workaround is to call applications directly instead of using xdg-open. "Runnable Screenshots" Feature: Goal: Create a feature for the online.interlisp.org interpreter to load a specific state from a URL, enabling interactive examples in documentation and museum demos. Implementation: The init file will fetch a script from a URL (e.g., GitHub) and execute it. Next Steps Ron: Fix the expunge and del file bug in RMK131 and request re-approval. Merge approved PRs: 2321, 2322, 2323, 2324, 2326. Create an issue for combining character support. Matt: Re-test RMK131 on Windows after the fix. Create issues for bibliography enhancements. Herb: Begin HTML stream MCCS migration. Share converted email files with Larry via Google Drive. Frank: Continue investigating the Kubuntu shell open bug. Scope the "runnable screenshots" feature. Larry: Publish the Primer to a GitHub.io site with a custom URL. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review weekly progress, discuss technical challenges, and plan project next steps. Key Takeaways - Raw XNS Networking Achieved: Nick enabled raw XNS networking on macOS/FreeBSD by implementing a polling workaround for macOS's broken SIGIO support on BPF. This bypasses the Dodo server, simplifying network setup. - New "Museum Mode" for Demos: Frank added a start= URL parameter to online/guest to load custom Lisp files on startup, enabling self-contained demos. A new shell.wget function allows these scripts to fetch files from the web. - File Versioning Conflict Identified: A core conflict was found between Medley's DSK device (which treats the unversioned file as the latest) and Unix file operations, which can create versioned files that Medley then ignores. - Primer Domain Finalized: The Medley Primer is now live at primer.interlisp.org. This frees up docs.interlisp.org for a future landing page and avoids an extra click for users. Topics Networking: Raw XNS Implementation - Nick enabled raw XNS networking on macOS and FreeBSD using libpcap and BPF. - Problem: macOS's BPF implementation does not support SIGIO for asynchronous I/O, causing Medley's network handler to miss packets. - Solution: A polling workaround was implemented, calling the Ethernet handler every 20,000 microinstructions to check for data. - Status: Packets can be sent between machines. An NS Echo server is being adapted from Bill Van Melle's 1980s PUP code. - Future Work: - Dodo Server: Herb will investigate updating the Dodo server's Java-based libpcap dependency to support raw XNS. - Startup Delay: Enabling raw XNS adds a ~5-second startup delay while Medley waits for a PUP address from a gateway. "Museum Mode" for Demos - Frank implemented a "museum mode" for online/guest to run self-contained demos. - Mechanism: The start= URL parameter loads a URI-encoded Lisp file at the end of the online init process. - Example: A demo using the Kinetic app is available in the Snapshots discussion group. - New Utility: shell.wget was added to download files from the web within startup scripts. - Limitation: It lacks error handling, as the underlying C subr does not return the shell exit code. File System & Versioning Conflicts - The shell.wget work revealed a conflict between Medley's DSK device and Unix file operations. - Medley's DSK Device Logic: - Accessing a file without a version number (e.g., DSK:FOO) always retrieves the highest version. - Creating a new version (e.g., DSK:FOO~3~) automatically links it to the unversioned name. - The Conflict: - A Unix command (like wget) creates a file (e.g., foo~2~). - Medley's DSK device then ignores this file, as it's not linked to the unversioned name. - Medley will create a new version (e.g., foo~3~) and link that to foo, effectively hiding the Unix-created file. - Solution: The Lisp code must create the file via DSK first to ensure proper version linking, then pass its Unix path to the external command. Packages & Symbol Management - The team discussed using packages for better code organization, using T-Edit as a potential test case. - Motivation: - Cleaner code by removing repetitive module prefixes (e.g., T-EDIT.). - Improved developer workflow by reducing typos. - Challenges: - Symbol Persistence: Symbols are not garbage collected, so loading many packages could exhaust memory. - whereis Database: The whereis database needs to handle symbols from packages that are not currently loaded. - Compatibility: Package-ifying a core module like T-Edit could break other code that relies on its global symbols. - Proposed Solution: Create a "file package" type that allows the whereis database to locate package definitions on disk, enabling on-demand loading. Project Admin & Updates - Medley Primer Domain: The Primer is now live at primer.interlisp.org. This frees docs.interlisp.org for a future landing page. - Ellie's Talk: Ellie will give an extended presentation on the Medley project for World Digital Preservation Day (Nov 7). - GitFunds Update: Ron updated GitFunds to preserve the original version of a file during a copy operation, enabling accurate comparisons. - PDF Generation: The team discussed ensuring generated PDFs use the correct title (from the source file) instead of a temporary filename. Next Steps - Herb: - Change the Medley Primer domain to primer.interlisp.org. - Move relevant publications into the "bibliography" collection for Bill Stumbo's online bibliography. - Investigate updating the Dodo server's libpcap dependency for raw XNS support. - Frank: - Update shell.wget to create files via the DSK device first, resolving the versioning conflict. - Add a disclaimer to the Medley desktop for "museum mode" demos. - Ron: - Finalize and document the image file and printing changes. - Merge the Kinetic PR. - Paolo: - Create a GitHub Discussion on better integrating packages with the file system. - Larry: - Create a GitHub Issue to refactor the main Medley README, removing content that overlaps with the Primer and website.

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November 03, 2025  •  125 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Post World Digital Preservation Day announcement w/ link to event page; footnote Ellie’s talk Larry Masinter-lisp Fix XNS NS Echo server to deliver packets to NS socket Nick Briggs Review NoteCards remote database code for NS protocol Frank Halasz Investigate returning shell exit status via process stream EOF Nick Briggs Fix Unix-file-name to return nil for non-existent input files Ron Kaplan Update shell.wget to create DSK file first; link unversioned to highest version Frank Halasz Move miscategorized papers into 'exported to bibliography' collection Herb Jellinek Create GitHub issue: streamline Medley README; remove Primer/website overlap Larry Masinter-lisp Approve/merge Ron’s GitFunds/XCCS PRs Larry Masinter-lisp Merge Frank’s Kinetic close-window PR Larry Masinter-lisp Verify PDF title metadata for PDF streams; update ps2pdf if needed Ron Kaplan Test NIT file load w/ new PDF stream; report issues Ron Kaplan Draft plan to package T-Edit; identify external symbols Ron Kaplan Create GitHub Discussion: packages + file-package integration Paolo Amoroso Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review weekly progress, discuss technical challenges, and plan project next steps. Key Takeaways Raw XNS Networking Achieved: Nick enabled raw XNS networking on macOS/FreeBSD by implementing a polling workaround for macOS's broken SIGIO support on BPF. This bypasses the Dodo server, simplifying network setup. New "Museum Mode" for Demos: Frank added a start= URL parameter to online/guest to load custom Lisp files on startup, enabling self-contained demos. A new shell.wget function allows these scripts to fetch files from the web. File Versioning Conflict Identified: A core conflict was found between Medley's DSK device (which treats the unversioned file as the latest) and Unix file operations, which can create versioned files that Medley then ignores. Primer Domain Finalized: The Medley Primer is now live at primer.interlisp.org. This frees up docs.interlisp.org for a future landing page and avoids an extra click for users. Topics Networking: Raw XNS Implementation Nick enabled raw XNS networking on macOS and FreeBSD using libpcap and BPF. Problem: macOS's BPF implementation does not support SIGIO for asynchronous I/O, causing Medley's network handler to miss packets. Solution: A polling workaround was implemented, calling the Ethernet handler every 20,000 microinstructions to check for data. Status: Packets can be sent between machines. An NS Echo server is being adapted from Bill Van Melle's 1980s PUP code. Future Work: Dodo Server: Herb will investigate updating the Dodo server's Java-based libpcap dependency to support raw XNS. Startup Delay: Enabling raw XNS adds a ~5-second startup delay while Medley waits for a PUP address from a gateway. "Museum Mode" for Demos Frank implemented a "museum mode" for online/guest to run self-contained demos. Mechanism: The start= URL parameter loads a URI-encoded Lisp file at the end of the online init process. Example: A demo using the Kinetic app is available in the Snapshots discussion group. New Utility: shell.wget was added to download files from the web within startup scripts. Limitation: It lacks error handling, as the underlying C subr does not return the shell exit code. File System & Versioning Conflicts The shell.wget work revealed a conflict between Medley's DSK device and Unix file operations. Medley's DSK Device Logic: Accessing a file without a version number (e.g., DSK:FOO) always retrieves the highest version. Creating a new version (e.g., DSK:FOO~3~) automatically links it to the unversioned name. The Conflict: A Unix command (like wget) creates a file (e.g., foo~2~). Medley's DSK device then ignores this file, as it's not linked to the unversioned name. Medley will create a new version (e.g., foo~3~) and link that to foo, effectively hiding the Unix-created file. Solution: The Lisp code must create the file via DSK first to ensure proper version linking, then pass its Unix path to the external command. Packages & Symbol Management The team discussed using packages for better code organization, using T-Edit as a potential test case. Motivation: Cleaner code by removing repetitive module prefixes (e.g., T-EDIT.). Improved developer workflow by reducing typos. Challenges: Symbol Persistence: Symbols are not garbage collected, so loading many packages could exhaust memory. whereis Database: The whereis database needs to handle symbols from packages that are not currently loaded. Compatibility: Package-ifying a core module like T-Edit could break other code that relies on its global symbols. Proposed Solution: Create a "file package" type that allows the whereis database to locate package definitions on disk, enabling on-demand loading. Project Admin & Updates Medley Primer Domain: The Primer is now live at primer.interlisp.org. This frees docs.interlisp.org for a future landing page. Ellie's Talk: Ellie will give an extended presentation on the Medley project for World Digital Preservation Day (Nov 7). GitFunds Update: Ron updated GitFunds to preserve the original version of a file during a copy operation, enabling accurate comparisons. PDF Generation: The team discussed ensuring generated PDFs use the correct title (from the source file) instead of a temporary filename. Next Steps Herb: Change the Medley Primer domain to primer.interlisp.org. Move relevant publications into the "bibliography" collection for Bill Stumbo's online bibliography. Investigate updating the Dodo server's libpcap dependency for raw XNS support. Frank: Update shell.wget to create files via the DSK device first, resolving the versioning conflict. Add a disclaimer to the Medley desktop for "museum mode" demos. Ron: Finalize and document the image file and printing changes. Merge the Kinetic PR. Paolo: Create a GitHub Discussion on better integrating packages with the file system. Larry: Create a GitHub Issue to refactor the main Medley README, removing content that overlaps with the Primer and website.

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Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and blockers. Key Takeaways - Network Stack Autoconfig Failure: The network stack fails to autoconfigure on fresh sysouts because it doesn't install the required ZIP packet filter, blocking XNS services like PupLookup. - T-Edit Rendering Bug: A bug causes text in read-only T-Edit windows to appear underlined, as if selected. The issue is triggered by a full-window T-Edit-Delete and persists until a user click clears the state. - Keyboard Key Mapping Conflict: The "Del" key's action is inconsistent across apps (T-Edit, TTYN, Sketch) due to a conflict between modern expectations (delete forward) and historical Medley behavior (delete word backward). - Museum Mode Package Loading: Museum Mode's dynamic script loading is blocked by a package system limitation: a script cannot reference a symbol from a package that hasn't been fully loaded yet. Topics Network Stack Autoconfiguration - Problem: The network stack fails to autoconfigure on fresh sysouts (built without Ethernet enabled) because it doesn't install the required ZIP packet filter. - Impact: Blocks XNS services like PupLookup and NS Echo User. - Finding: The ether-event-fun is called, but the critical \ns-init function (which installs the filter) is not reliably executed. - Workaround: Manually install the filter to enable services. - PupLookup Progress: A working PupLookup implementation now runs on macOS and FreeBSD, successfully answering XNS requests. - PCAP Simplification: The PupLookup code could be adapted to create a simple C-based raw XNS-to-Dodo NetHub translator, replacing the complex Java PCAP layer. - PCAP Autoconfig Challenges: - Linux: Requires separate code from BSD standards for datalink layer info. - Solaris: Does not provide the datalink address via standard APIs. - macOS: Requires Wireshark installation to get the chmod-bpf startup script, enabling non-root access to the Ethernet interface. T-Edit Rendering Bug - Problem: Text in read-only T-Edit windows appears underlined, as if selected. - Trigger: The bug occurs after a full-window T-Edit-Delete followed by a T-Edit-String-Change (or stream print). - Symptoms: - Redisplay thickens lines, suggesting an off-by-one rendering error. - A user click clears the underlining, confirming a selection state issue. - Hypothesis: The T-Edit-Delete operation implicitly sets a selection state that isn't cleared on subsequent redraws. Keyboard Key Mapping Conflict - Problem: The "Del" key's action is inconsistent across applications. - Conflict: - Modern Expectation (T-Edit): Delete character forward. - Historical Medley (TTYN, Sketch): Delete word backward (via Ctrl-W). - Root Cause: The DEL and DELETE key names are synonyms for key 46, but this physical key doesn't exist on most modern keyboards. The Delete key on a Mac laptop maps to Lisp's Backspace (key 15), while Fn-Delete maps to key 13, which is currently bound to Ctrl-W. - Proposed Solution: 1. Distinguish Keys: Map key 13 to a unique character code (e.g., Rub-Out) instead of Ctrl-W. 2. App-Specific Behavior: Let each application (T-Edit, TTYN, Sketch) define its own action for this new code. - Rationale: This approach provides a clean distinction for applications while maintaining modern behavior in T-Edit. Museum Mode & Package Loading - Progress: Museum Mode now includes a /demo/login path for persistent user sessions and a /demo/guest path for anonymous access. - Problem: A dynamic start script (which wgets and compiles Paolo's Hexdump tool) fails to load because it cannot reference the INSPECS:HEX-DUMP symbol. - Root Cause: The script is interpreted before the INSPECS package is fully loaded, so the symbol HEX-DUMP does not yet exist within that package. - Workaround: The script uses INTERN to create the symbol, which is a fragile solution. - Correct Solution: Use FIND-SYMBOL to get a reference to the symbol by name after the package is loaded. - Alternative: The Hexdump tool could export a start function directly into the IL package to avoid this issue. Next Steps - Ron: Investigate the T-Edit underlining bug, starting with Paolo's Hexdump tool repo. - Ron: Implement the proposed keyboard mapping change to distinguish the "Del" key (key 13) from Ctrl-W. - Frank: Update Museum Mode's start script to use FIND-SYMBOL for dynamic package loading. - Frank: Add a URL input field to the standard run-medley screen to enable user-defined start scripts. - Herb: Capture and share the Jeff Schrager talk from the Kaltura platform.

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November 10, 2025  •  122 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Check if LDE Ether root helper works on Linux/macOS Nick Briggs Clone Paolo's hexdump repo; investigate T-Edit selection/underline/thick-line bug Ron Kaplan Update museum-mode start script for Paolo's hexdump; use FIND-SYMBOL; add start-script URL field Frank Halasz Capture Jeff Schrager Kaltura talk via QuickTime; post link Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and blockers. Key Takeaways Network Stack Autoconfig Failure: The network stack fails to autoconfigure on fresh sysouts because it doesn't install the required ZIP packet filter, blocking XNS services like PupLookup. T-Edit Rendering Bug: A bug causes text in read-only T-Edit windows to appear underlined, as if selected. The issue is triggered by a full-window T-Edit-Delete and persists until a user click clears the state. Keyboard Key Mapping Conflict: The "Del" key's action is inconsistent across apps (T-Edit, TTYN, Sketch) due to a conflict between modern expectations (delete forward) and historical Medley behavior (delete word backward). Museum Mode Package Loading: Museum Mode's dynamic script loading is blocked by a package system limitation: a script cannot reference a symbol from a package that hasn't been fully loaded yet. Topics Network Stack Autoconfiguration Problem: The network stack fails to autoconfigure on fresh sysouts (built without Ethernet enabled) because it doesn't install the required ZIP packet filter. Impact: Blocks XNS services like PupLookup and NS Echo User. Finding: The ether-event-fun is called, but the critical \ns-init function (which installs the filter) is not reliably executed. Workaround: Manually install the filter to enable services. PupLookup Progress: A working PupLookup implementation now runs on macOS and FreeBSD, successfully answering XNS requests. PCAP Simplification: The PupLookup code could be adapted to create a simple C-based raw XNS-to-Dodo NetHub translator, replacing the complex Java PCAP layer. PCAP Autoconfig Challenges: Linux: Requires separate code from BSD standards for datalink layer info. Solaris: Does not provide the datalink address via standard APIs. macOS: Requires Wireshark installation to get the chmod-bpf startup script, enabling non-root access to the Ethernet interface. T-Edit Rendering Bug Problem: Text in read-only T-Edit windows appears underlined, as if selected. Trigger: The bug occurs after a full-window T-Edit-Delete followed by a T-Edit-String-Change (or stream print). Symptoms: Redisplay thickens lines, suggesting an off-by-one rendering error. A user click clears the underlining, confirming a selection state issue. Hypothesis: The T-Edit-Delete operation implicitly sets a selection state that isn't cleared on subsequent redraws. Keyboard Key Mapping Conflict Problem: The "Del" key's action is inconsistent across applications. Conflict: Modern Expectation (T-Edit): Delete character forward. Historical Medley (TTYN, Sketch): Delete word backward (via Ctrl-W). Root Cause: The DEL and DELETE key names are synonyms for key 46, but this physical key doesn't exist on most modern keyboards. The Delete key on a Mac laptop maps to Lisp's Backspace (key 15), while Fn-Delete maps to key 13, which is currently bound to Ctrl-W. Proposed Solution: Distinguish Keys: Map key 13 to a unique character code (e.g., Rub-Out) instead of Ctrl-W. App-Specific Behavior: Let each application (T-Edit, TTYN, Sketch) define its own action for this new code. Rationale: This approach provides a clean distinction for applications while maintaining modern behavior in T-Edit. Museum Mode & Package Loading Progress: Museum Mode now includes a /demo/login path for persistent user sessions and a /demo/guest path for anonymous access. Problem: A dynamic start script (which wgets and compiles Paolo's Hexdump tool) fails to load because it cannot reference the INSPECS:HEX-DUMP symbol. Root Cause: The script is interpreted before the INSPECS package is fully loaded, so the symbol HEX-DUMP does not yet exist within that package. Workaround: The script uses INTERN to create the symbol, which is a fragile solution. Correct Solution: Use FIND-SYMBOL to get a reference to the symbol by name after the package is loaded. Alternative: The Hexdump tool could export a start function directly into the IL package to avoid this issue. Next Steps Ron: Investigate the T-Edit underlining bug, starting with Paolo's Hexdump tool repo. Ron: Implement the proposed keyboard mapping change to distinguish the "Del" key (key 13) from Ctrl-W. Frank: Update Museum Mode's start script to use FIND-SYMBOL for dynamic package loading. Frank: Add a URL input field to the standard run-medley screen to enable user-defined start scripts. Herb: Capture and share the Jeff Schrager talk from the Kaltura platform.

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Meeting Purpose Review open PRs and sync on current development progress. Key Takeaways - PRs Approved: 2331 (Kit Funds UI), 2357 (Background Yield), and 2360 (BDF Font Reader) were approved for merge. - PRs in Draft: 2343 (wget/curl utility) is in draft to add curl support for cross-platform compatibility. 2358 (Sketch/S-Edit keybindings) requires more testing and separation of font changes. - Network Stack Blocked: Progress on the network stack is blocked by two issues: Lisp code duplicating self-sent packets and a persistent bug in the interrupt handler that prevents new packets from being processed. - Font Strategy Debate: The team is debating font strategy (early vs. late binding). Early binding creates large, complete fonts but avoids runtime pauses, while late binding loads glyphs on demand but can cause delays. Topics PR Review - 2331 (Kit Funds UI): Approved. A low-dependency, UI-only change tested by Paolo. - 2343 (wget/curl utility): In draft. - Problem: The wget dependency limits use to Linux, as it's not standard on macOS or FreeBSD. - Solution: Frank will add a curl fallback and move the utility to a new online-utils package to clarify its purpose. - 2357 (Background Yield): Approved. A minor cleanup. - 2358 (Sketch/S-Edit keybindings): Requires more work. - Problem: Paolo's tests show unexpected behavior, including Shift-L inserting Control-U. The PR also mixes font changes with keybinding logic. - Action: Paolo will request Ron review the test report and separate the font changes. - 2360 (BDF Font Reader): Approved. - Rationale: Merging now unblocks Matt's subsequent font-related PRs, as they can then be based directly on master. - 2375 (Prompt Window Overlap): Approved. - Rationale: Paolo's tests confirmed the fix works across multiple applications (InSpecs, Info, Notecards). Development Updates - Network Stack (Nick): - Issue 1: Packet Duplication - Cause: Lisp code assumes the hardware can't hear itself and duplicates self-sent packets onto the input queue. This is false for PCAP/NetHub interfaces. - Fix: Either add a flag to the Lisp code or modify the Mako layer to filter these packets. - Issue 2: Interrupt Handling Failure - Cause: The interrupt-being-handled bit is not being cleared correctly. - Effect: The Mako layer thinks an interrupt is still active and refuses to process new packets, blocking all network activity. - Resource: Nick has XNS Courier compiler definitions (C code) from SunOS 4, which could be useful for Dodo development. - Online Demo Mode (Frank): - The demo mode is ready on the dev server, with documentation. - Production Release: Blocked by the wget dependency in the InSpecs demo. Frank will either wait for PR 2343 or use a temporary fix. - StartScript Feature: Now available via advanced options on the Run Medley page, allowing users to specify a script URL. - Font & HTML Stream (Matt & Herb): - Font Strategy Debate: - Early Binding: Creates large, complete fonts at load time. - Pro: Avoids runtime pauses for glyph loading. - Con: Can be inefficient; font metrics are fixed, limiting flexibility. - Late Binding: Loads glyphs on demand. - Pro: More flexible; allows for dynamic font stacks. - Con: Causes noticeable pauses when new glyphs are encountered. - BDF File Encoding Bug: The otf2bdf converter writes files in ISO-8859-1, not UTF-8. Medley's default MCCS reader misinterprets characters like the underscore (_) as a back arrow (←), causing file-not-found errors. - HTML Stream: Herb is integrating Ron's font changes, which require updates to font and charset descriptors. - Medley Primer (Herb): - Ellie's review is complete. Avic will integrate the feedback, which is not expected to contain showstoppers. The Primer is on track for announcement. - University of Alberta Student Meeting: - Larry and Herb will meet with a student interested in a retrocomputing project. They will report back on Wednesday. Next Steps - Frank: - Update PR 2343 with curl fallback and move to online-utils package. - Release online demo mode to production, using a temporary fix for the wget dependency if PR 2343 is delayed. - Herb: - Retrieve AWS SSH key files from the OIO.Support S3 bucket to access the online server. - Larry: - Merge approved PRs: 2331, 2357, 2360. - Paolo: - Request Ron review the test report and separate font changes in PR 2358. - Add a recurring agenda item for the University of Alberta student project. - Ron: - Merge approved PRs: 2375.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

November 17, 2025  •  91 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Update PR 2331: merge Kit Funds Compare Directory Paolo Amoroso Update PR 2323: add curl fallback, temp-file copy; move to online-utils; test Linux Frank Halasz Approve PR 2357: background yield Nick Briggs Request Ron split PR 2358: separate font changes from rubout/backspace Paolo Amoroso Merge PR 2360: read-bdf MCCS→XCCS Larry Masinter-lisp Fix Mako Ethernet interrupt handling (handled bit reset) Nick Briggs Set up Dodo XNS testbed; run sample XNS programs Nick Briggs Find GitHub build script for Emscripten/WASM Docker image Frank Halasz Add Herb Jellinek's SSH key to online server authorized_keys Frank Halasz Download OIO.Support SSH keys from S3; configure SSH Herb Jellinek (2) Add agenda item: report on U of Alberta student meeting Paolo Amoroso Make LDFLG a free variable; remove sysload; use load-comp Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review open PRs and sync on current development progress. Key Takeaways PRs Approved: 2331 (Kit Funds UI), 2357 (Background Yield), and 2360 (BDF Font Reader) were approved for merge. PRs in Draft: 2343 (wget/curl utility) is in draft to add curl support for cross-platform compatibility. 2358 (Sketch/S-Edit keybindings) requires more testing and separation of font changes. Network Stack Blocked: Progress on the network stack is blocked by two issues: Lisp code duplicating self-sent packets and a persistent bug in the interrupt handler that prevents new packets from being processed. Font Strategy Debate: The team is debating font strategy (early vs. late binding). Early binding creates large, complete fonts but avoids runtime pauses, while late binding loads glyphs on demand but can cause delays. Topics PR Review 2331 (Kit Funds UI): Approved. A low-dependency, UI-only change tested by Paolo. 2343 (wget/curl utility): In draft. Problem: The wget dependency limits use to Linux, as it's not standard on macOS or FreeBSD. Solution: Frank will add a curl fallback and move the utility to a new online-utils package to clarify its purpose. 2357 (Background Yield): Approved. A minor cleanup. 2358 (Sketch/S-Edit keybindings): Requires more work. Problem: Paolo's tests show unexpected behavior, including Shift-L inserting Control-U. The PR also mixes font changes with keybinding logic. Action: Paolo will request Ron review the test report and separate the font changes. 2360 (BDF Font Reader): Approved. Rationale: Merging now unblocks Matt's subsequent font-related PRs, as they can then be based directly on master. 2375 (Prompt Window Overlap): Approved. Rationale: Paolo's tests confirmed the fix works across multiple applications (InSpecs, Info, Notecards). Development Updates Network Stack (Nick): Issue 1: Packet Duplication Cause: Lisp code assumes the hardware can't hear itself and duplicates self-sent packets onto the input queue. This is false for PCAP/NetHub interfaces. Fix: Either add a flag to the Lisp code or modify the Mako layer to filter these packets. Issue 2: Interrupt Handling Failure Cause: The interrupt-being-handled bit is not being cleared correctly. Effect: The Mako layer thinks an interrupt is still active and refuses to process new packets, blocking all network activity. Resource: Nick has XNS Courier compiler definitions (C code) from SunOS 4, which could be useful for Dodo development. Online Demo Mode (Frank): The demo mode is ready on the dev server, with documentation. Production Release: Blocked by the wget dependency in the InSpecs demo. Frank will either wait for PR 2343 or use a temporary fix. StartScript Feature: Now available via advanced options on the Run Medley page, allowing users to specify a script URL. Font & HTML Stream (Matt & Herb): Font Strategy Debate: Early Binding: Creates large, complete fonts at load time. Pro: Avoids runtime pauses for glyph loading. Con: Can be inefficient; font metrics are fixed, limiting flexibility. Late Binding: Loads glyphs on demand. Pro: More flexible; allows for dynamic font stacks. Con: Causes noticeable pauses when new glyphs are encountered. BDF File Encoding Bug: The otf2bdf converter writes files in ISO-8859-1, not UTF-8. Medley's default MCCS reader misinterprets characters like the underscore (_) as a back arrow (←), causing file-not-found errors. HTML Stream: Herb is integrating Ron's font changes, which require updates to font and charset descriptors. Medley Primer (Herb): Ellie's review is complete. Avic will integrate the feedback, which is not expected to contain showstoppers. The Primer is on track for announcement. University of Alberta Student Meeting: Larry and Herb will meet with a student interested in a retrocomputing project. They will report back on Wednesday. Next Steps Frank: Update PR 2343 with curl fallback and move to online-utils package. Release online demo mode to production, using a temporary fix for the wget dependency if PR 2343 is delayed. Herb: Retrieve AWS SSH key files from the OIO.Support S3 bucket to access the online server. Larry: Merge approved PRs: 2331, 2357, 2360. Paolo: Request Ron review the test report and separate font changes in PR 2358. Add a recurring agenda item for the University of Alberta student project. Ron: Merge approved PRs: 2375.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review recent projects and plan the new Medley Primer announcement. Key Takeaways - Game Jam Success: Ryan's game jam entry successfully drove Medley adoption by providing a simple source file and clear instructions, proving the value of low-friction onboarding. - Primer Launch Set: The new Medley Primer will launch publicly on December 1st. Feedback will be managed in the main Medley GitHub repo using a dedicated "Primer" project to centralize all issues. - Critical Bug Found: The ARC-TAN2 function crashes when its x argument is zero, blocking common geometry calculations. A fix is required. - Networking Challenge: Supporting multiple Medley instances on one machine requires a virtual networking solution (e.g., a "Medley Bridge") to assign unique MAC/PUP addresses, as the core system cannot manage this. Topics Lisp Game Jam Debrief - Ryan's game jam entry was a success, driving Medley adoption by providing a single source file and clear instructions, which users found easy to load and run. - Key Insight: Low-friction onboarding is critical for attracting new users. - Usability Issue: Ryan struggled to move functions between files, highlighting a gap in his knowledge of the environment's tools. - Solution: Use the Manager package (by Danny Bobrow, Larry Masinter, and others) for advanced file and definition manipulation. - Performance: Bit-blitting is fast due to Nick's SDL wrapper, which handles dirty rectangles. - Note: The X server is likely faster as it can use shared memory, while SDL requires converting 1-bit bitmaps to 8-bit. New Medley Primer Announcement - The new primer will launch on December 1st. - Announcement Plan: - Website: Update the homepage, news page, and documentation page. - Socials: Post on Lobsters, Hacker News, and the Retrocomputing Forum. - Feedback Workflow: - All primer feedback will be managed in the main Medley GitHub repo. - A new "Primer" project will be created to categorize these issues. - Rationale: Centralizes all project issues and avoids ambiguity between system and documentation bugs. - Editing Access: Paolo has read-only access to the Gitbook editor. Full edit access is needed to manage content and internal references. Bibliography Updates - Process: Request changes to bibliography entries by opening an issue in the main Medley GitHub repo and tagging the "bibliography" project. - Rationale: This simple process is sufficient for infrequent change requests. - Display Logic: Public notes from Zotero are not currently displayed on the website. This is a future enhancement. Networking: Multiple Medley Instances - Problem: Running multiple Medley instances on one machine is difficult because they share the same physical MAC address, causing network conflicts. - Use Case: Essential for developing multi-workstation systems (e.g., Colab) on a single screen. - Proposed Solution: Create a "Medley Bridge" script to set up virtual network interfaces with unique MAC/PUP addresses for each instance. - Rationale: This keeps the networking logic outside the core Maiko C code, which is not portable. - Implementation: The script would pass the virtual interface name and MAC address to Medley's startup command. ARC-TAN2 Bug - Bug: The ARC-TAN2 function crashes when its x argument is zero. - Impact: Blocks common geometry calculations (e.g., finding the angle for a vertical line). - Solution: Rewrite the Interlisp version to handle the zero-x case, or wrap the correct Common Lisp implementation. - Action: Nick will use the MasterScope database to find all callers of ARC-TAN2 to assess the impact of a fix. General Development Updates - Matt: Working on BDF font support; found bugs in T-Edit (Shift-click for italic toggling fails) and the T-Editor-Breeves list. - Bill: Improving date filtering on the website; refactoring CSS to use standard Hugo methods. - Frank: Completed the "museum mode" feature; moved the wget function to the online image and added curl as a fallback. - Paolo: Debugging screen corruption in a custom window caused by horizontal scrolling after a reshape. Next Steps - Herb: Reschedule meeting with the University of Alberta undergrad. - Paolo: - Notify Abic of the December 1st primer launch. - Submit a PR for website updates (homepage, news, docs) for the launch. - Secure full edit access to the Gitbook primer editor. - Larry: Create the "Primer" project in the main Medley GitHub repo. - Nick: - Investigate the "Medley Bridge" concept for virtual networking. - Use MasterScope to find all callers of ARC-TAN2. - Ryan: File a bug report for the ARC-TAN2 issue. - Frank: Check in the "museum mode" feature to the online service. - All: Explore the Manager package for improved file editing.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly November 19, 2025  •  114 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review recent projects and plan the new Medley Primer announcement. Key Takeaways Game Jam Success: Ryan's game jam entry successfully drove Medley adoption by providing a simple source file and clear instructions, proving the value of low-friction onboarding. Primer Launch Set: The new Medley Primer will launch publicly on December 1st. Feedback will be managed in the main Medley GitHub repo using a dedicated "Primer" project to centralize all issues. Critical Bug Found: The ARC-TAN2 function crashes when its x argument is zero, blocking common geometry calculations. A fix is required. Networking Challenge: Supporting multiple Medley instances on one machine requires a virtual networking solution (e.g., a "Medley Bridge") to assign unique MAC/PUP addresses, as the core system cannot manage this. Topics Lisp Game Jam Debrief Ryan's game jam entry was a success, driving Medley adoption by providing a single source file and clear instructions, which users found easy to load and run. Key Insight: Low-friction onboarding is critical for attracting new users. Usability Issue: Ryan struggled to move functions between files, highlighting a gap in his knowledge of the environment's tools. Solution: Use the Manager package (by Danny Bobrow, Larry Masinter, and others) for advanced file and definition manipulation. Performance: Bit-blitting is fast due to Nick's SDL wrapper, which handles dirty rectangles. Note: The X server is likely faster as it can use shared memory, while SDL requires converting 1-bit bitmaps to 8-bit. New Medley Primer Announcement The new primer will launch on December 1st. Announcement Plan: Website: Update the homepage, news page, and documentation page. Socials: Post on Lobsters, Hacker News, and the Retrocomputing Forum. Feedback Workflow: All primer feedback will be managed in the main Medley GitHub repo. A new "Primer" project will be created to categorize these issues. Rationale: Centralizes all project issues and avoids ambiguity between system and documentation bugs. Editing Access: Paolo has read-only access to the Gitbook editor. Full edit access is needed to manage content and internal references. Bibliography Updates Process: Request changes to bibliography entries by opening an issue in the main Medley GitHub repo and tagging the "bibliography" project. Rationale: This simple process is sufficient for infrequent change requests. Display Logic: Public notes from Zotero are not currently displayed on the website. This is a future enhancement. Networking: Multiple Medley Instances Problem: Running multiple Medley instances on one machine is difficult because they share the same physical MAC address, causing network conflicts. Use Case: Essential for developing multi-workstation systems (e.g., Colab) on a single screen. Proposed Solution: Create a "Medley Bridge" script to set up virtual network interfaces with unique MAC/PUP addresses for each instance. Rationale: This keeps the networking logic outside the core Maiko C code, which is not portable. Implementation: The script would pass the virtual interface name and MAC address to Medley's startup command. ARC-TAN2 Bug Bug: The ARC-TAN2 function crashes when its x argument is zero. Impact: Blocks common geometry calculations (e.g., finding the angle for a vertical line). Solution: Rewrite the Interlisp version to handle the zero-x case, or wrap the correct Common Lisp implementation. Action: Nick will use the MasterScope database to find all callers of ARC-TAN2 to assess the impact of a fix. General Development Updates Matt: Working on BDF font support; found bugs in T-Edit (Shift-click for italic toggling fails) and the T-Editor-Breeves list. Bill: Improving date filtering on the website; refactoring CSS to use standard Hugo methods. Frank: Completed the "museum mode" feature; moved the wget function to the online image and added curl as a fallback. Paolo: Debugging screen corruption in a custom window caused by horizontal scrolling after a reshape. Next Steps Herb: Reschedule meeting with the University of Alberta undergrad. Paolo: Notify Abic of the December 1st primer launch. Submit a PR for website updates (homepage, news, docs) for the launch. Secure full edit access to the Gitbook primer editor. Larry: Create the "Primer" project in the main Medley GitHub repo. Nick: Investigate the "Medley Bridge" concept for virtual networking. Use MasterScope to find all callers of ARC-TAN2. Ryan: File a bug report for the ARC-TAN2 issue. Frank: Check in the "museum mode" feature to the online service. All: Explore the Manager package for improved file editing. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review progress, debug issues, and align on font system strategy. Key Takeaways - Performance Bug: A recent slowdown in keyboard/mouse responsiveness is likely caused by a missing cause interrupt call in background yield. This call may have been a workaround for a deeper issue in the Mako keyboard handler. - Font System Overhaul: The font system is being simplified by removing legacy logic (e.g., DOS 8.3 filename support) and standardizing on the Medley Font Format (.mff). This will improve performance and maintainability. - New Primer Release: The new Medley Primer is ready for release. The apps.online.interlisp.org button will be updated to link to the new version. - PR Status: PR #2358 (ETH VARs) requires further testing. PR #2383 (Sketch charsets) is blocked by #2358. The load-up-lfg script PR was moved to Draft due to age and likely incompatibility. Topics Performance Slowdown - Problem: Recent keyboard and mouse input is less responsive for some users. - Hypothesis: A missing cause interrupt call in background yield prevents the system from waking up to process input events. - Rationale: The call may have been a workaround for a deeper bug in the Mako keyboard handler, which might not be signaling interrupts correctly. - Test: A user experiencing the issue will re-add the cause interrupt call to background yield to confirm if it resolves the slowdown. Font System Overhaul - Goal: Simplify the font system by removing complex, legacy logic to improve performance and maintainability. - Legacy Issues: - Inconsistent Lookups: The system performs up to 32 file system lookups for a single font request, caused by trying to support multiple directory structures and filename conventions. - Ambiguous Functions: fonts-available (checks for file existence) and font-exists (checks for successful creation, including coercions) have subtle, confusing differences. - DOS 8.3 Support: Code for DOS 8.3 filenames adds complexity that may no longer be necessary. - Solution → Standardize on Medley Font Format (.mff): - Action: Modify ReadBDF to write only .mff files, removing support for the old "strike" format. - Rationale: .mff files are efficient, load character sets on demand, and support arbitrary properties. - Implementation: The MedleyFont directory already contains converted fonts, so the change is a matter of updating initialization variables to point only to the new format. - Font Coercion Strategy: - Problem: The system's automatic bold/italic transformations (skewing, adding pixels) destroy the fixed-pitch property of fonts. - Decision: Defer a final strategy until the full set of BDF-derived fonts is available. - Potential Solution: For fixed-pitch fonts, prioritize finding a glyph with the correct width, even if it means using a smaller height. This could be pre-computed offline. - Version Control: - A font-compare function exists in internal-font-debug to compare font descriptors, which could be adapted for version control purposes. General Updates & PRs - Ron: - Fixed a font lookup bug where font-create failed on fonts without a face component in their name. - Updated the Sketch PR to make forward-delete commands no-ops, as Sketch's string manipulation is complex. - Matt: - Reworking ReadBDF to write only .mff files. - Herb: - Fixing an HTML-stream issue where font-create was rejecting HTML font requests. - Noted that modern browsers use generic font names (e.g., mono, serif) and handle their own text rendering, often independent of the OS. - Paolo: - Debugger Clarification: Confirmed that help is a function call, so OK or GO (which continue the current computation) are invalid. RETURN is required to return from the help function. - Repainting: Investigating scroll-by-repaint and reshape-by-repaint. The table-browser was suggested as a good example of how to implement efficient, region-based repainting. - Larry: - Releasing the new Medley Primer and updating the apps.online.interlisp.org link. Next Steps - Larry: Release the new Medley Primer and update the apps.online.interlisp.org link. - Paolo: - Test the cause interrupt fix for the performance slowdown. - Complete testing of Ron's ETH VARs PR (#2358). - Ron: Fix issues in the Sketch character set PR (#2383), which is blocked by #2358. - Matt: Continue reworking ReadBDF to write only .mff files. - Team: Discuss the annual report during the Wednesday meeting.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly November 24, 2025  •  91 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Purpose Review progress, debug issues, and align on font system strategy. Key Takeaways Performance Bug: A recent slowdown in keyboard/mouse responsiveness is likely caused by a missing cause interrupt call in background yield. This call may have been a workaround for a deeper issue in the Mako keyboard handler. Font System Overhaul: The font system is being simplified by removing legacy logic (e.g., DOS 8.3 filename support) and standardizing on the Medley Font Format (.mff). This will improve performance and maintainability. New Primer Release: The new Medley Primer is ready for release. The apps.online.interlisp.org button will be updated to link to the new version. PR Status: PR #2358 (ETH VARs) requires further testing. PR #2383 (Sketch charsets) is blocked by #2358. The load-up-lfg script PR was moved to Draft due to age and likely incompatibility. Topics Performance Slowdown Problem: Recent keyboard and mouse input is less responsive for some users. Hypothesis: A missing cause interrupt call in background yield prevents the system from waking up to process input events. Rationale: The call may have been a workaround for a deeper bug in the Mako keyboard handler, which might not be signaling interrupts correctly. Test: A user experiencing the issue will re-add the cause interrupt call to background yield to confirm if it resolves the slowdown. Font System Overhaul Goal: Simplify the font system by removing complex, legacy logic to improve performance and maintainability. Legacy Issues: Inconsistent Lookups: The system performs up to 32 file system lookups for a single font request, caused by trying to support multiple directory structures and filename conventions. Ambiguous Functions: fonts-available (checks for file existence) and font-exists (checks for successful creation, including coercions) have subtle, confusing differences. DOS 8.3 Support: Code for DOS 8.3 filenames adds complexity that may no longer be necessary. Solution → Standardize on Medley Font Format (.mff): Action: Modify ReadBDF to write only .mff files, removing support for the old "strike" format. Rationale: .mff files are efficient, load character sets on demand, and support arbitrary properties. Implementation: The MedleyFont directory already contains converted fonts, so the change is a matter of updating initialization variables to point only to the new format. Font Coercion Strategy: Problem: The system's automatic bold/italic transformations (skewing, adding pixels) destroy the fixed-pitch property of fonts. Decision: Defer a final strategy until the full set of BDF-derived fonts is available. Potential Solution: For fixed-pitch fonts, prioritize finding a glyph with the correct width, even if it means using a smaller height. This could be pre-computed offline. Version Control: A font-compare function exists in internal-font-debug to compare font descriptors, which could be adapted for version control purposes. General Updates & PRs Ron: Fixed a font lookup bug where font-create failed on fonts without a face component in their name. Updated the Sketch PR to make forward-delete commands no-ops, as Sketch's string manipulation is complex. Matt: Reworking ReadBDF to write only .mff files. Herb: Fixing an HTML-stream issue where font-create was rejecting HTML font requests. Noted that modern browsers use generic font names (e.g., mono, serif) and handle their own text rendering, often independent of the OS. Paolo: Debugger Clarification: Confirmed that help is a function call, so OK or GO (which continue the current computation) are invalid. RETURN is required to return from the help function. Repainting: Investigating scroll-by-repaint and reshape-by-repaint. The table-browser was suggested as a good example of how to implement efficient, region-based repainting. Larry: Releasing the new Medley Primer and updating the apps.online.interlisp.org link. Next Steps Larry: Release the new Medley Primer and update the apps.online.interlisp.org link. Paolo: Test the cause interrupt fix for the performance slowdown. Complete testing of Ron's ETH VARs PR (#2358). Ron: Fix issues in the Sketch character set PR (#2383), which is blocked by #2358. Matt: Continue reworking ReadBDF to write only .mff files. Team: Discuss the annual report during the Wednesday meeting. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Finalize the Primer release plan and review project status. Key Takeaways - Primer Launch Set for Dec 1: The Primer will launch in beta with a new GitHub project and issue template for feedback. - Annual Report Drafted by AI: Bill will use AI (Claude, Copilot) to draft the annual report, leveraging the 5th anniversary as a narrative hook. - Font System Overhaul: A bug in Inspect Code (triggering a PDF error) is driving a plan to simplify the font system by removing device-specific font class settings. - Performance Fix Identified: A recent UI slowdown was traced to removing a high-frequency cause interrupt call; SIG-IO will be implemented to restore responsiveness. Topics Primer Release Plan (Dec 1) - Goal: Launch the Primer in beta by December 1. - Launch Tasks: - Announce on social media. - Add a preface noting the beta status and feedback process. - Create a GitHub issue template for feedback. - Ownership: - Bill: Create the GitHub "Primer" project. - Paolo: Create the issue template. - Abhik: Resolve outstanding comments and write the beta preface. Annual Report - Goal: Publish the 5th annual report by mid-December. - Strategy: - Narrative: Use the 5th anniversary as a hook to reflect on past accomplishments and future goals. - Drafting: Bill will use AI (Claude, Copilot) to generate a draft from the provided outline. - Content: Keep it concise, avoiding repetition of details already in the project wiki. Social Media Poll Results - Context: A Mastodon poll (173 votes) asked about Lisp experience. - Results: - 30%: Do not use Lisp. - ~50%: Have used Lisp for >3 years. - Analysis: The poll reached a wider audience than just the Medley community, likely inflating the "don't use Lisp" figure. The results suggest the community is composed mostly of experienced Lisp users. Roundtable: Technical Updates - Performance: - Problem: A recent UI slowdown was caused by removing a high-frequency cause interrupt call from the background yield. - Solution: Implement SIG-IO on macOS/FreeBSD to process keyboard input asynchronously. A simulate async interrupts flag will provide responsiveness on Windows. - Font System: - Problem: Inspect Code fails with an "illegal font family" error when the default printer is set to PDF. - Root Cause: The font-create function is called with the default-font variable (a font class), which doesn't resolve correctly for the PDF device. - Proposed Solution: Simplify the font system by removing device-specific font class settings. The system will instead use a single font specification and a generic coercion mechanism to approximate it for all devices. - Website: - Filter by Year: Bill is refining the feature. Paolo reported a Firefox bug (a tooltip appearing on hover after clicking out of the field), which Bill will investigate on a Linux machine. - Envos Mail Preservation: - Status: Eleanor Young has converted all but 5 of Eric Holtman's Envos mail folders to inbox format. - Blocker: The 5 remaining folders are likely damaged and require manual repair before they can be reviewed in the ePad tool. - Student Funding: - Status: Larry is arranging funding for more undergraduate CS students at the University of Alberta to work on Medley projects. Next Steps - Bill: Create the "Primer" GitHub project. - Paolo: Create the Primer feedback issue template. - Abhik: Resolve Primer comments and write the beta preface (due Dec 1). - Bill: Investigate the "Filter by Year" bug on Linux. - Ron: Investigate the Inspect Code font error and the proposed font system simplification. - Herb: Repair the 5 damaged Envos mail folders.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly November 26, 2025  •  97 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Finalize the Primer release plan and review project status. Key Takeaways Primer Launch Set for Dec 1: The Primer will launch in beta with a new GitHub project and issue template for feedback. Annual Report Drafted by AI: Bill will use AI (Claude, Copilot) to draft the annual report, leveraging the 5th anniversary as a narrative hook. Font System Overhaul: A bug in Inspect Code (triggering a PDF error) is driving a plan to simplify the font system by removing device-specific font class settings. Performance Fix Identified: A recent UI slowdown was traced to removing a high-frequency cause interrupt call; SIG-IO will be implemented to restore responsiveness. Topics Primer Release Plan (Dec 1) Goal: Launch the Primer in beta by December 1. Launch Tasks: Announce on social media. Add a preface noting the beta status and feedback process. Create a GitHub issue template for feedback. Ownership: Bill: Create the GitHub "Primer" project. Paolo: Create the issue template. Abhik: Resolve outstanding comments and write the beta preface. Annual Report Goal: Publish the 5th annual report by mid-December. Strategy: Narrative: Use the 5th anniversary as a hook to reflect on past accomplishments and future goals. Drafting: Bill will use AI (Claude, Copilot) to generate a draft from the provided outline. Content: Keep it concise, avoiding repetition of details already in the project wiki. Social Media Poll Results Context: A Mastodon poll (173 votes) asked about Lisp experience. Results: 30%: Do not use Lisp. ~50%: Have used Lisp for >3 years. Analysis: The poll reached a wider audience than just the Medley community, likely inflating the "don't use Lisp" figure. The results suggest the community is composed mostly of experienced Lisp users. Roundtable: Technical Updates Performance: Problem: A recent UI slowdown was caused by removing a high-frequency cause interrupt call from the background yield. Solution: Implement SIG-IO on macOS/FreeBSD to process keyboard input asynchronously. A simulate async interrupts flag will provide responsiveness on Windows. Font System: Problem: Inspect Code fails with an "illegal font family" error when the default printer is set to PDF. Root Cause: The font-create function is called with the default-font variable (a font class), which doesn't resolve correctly for the PDF device. Proposed Solution: Simplify the font system by removing device-specific font class settings. The system will instead use a single font specification and a generic coercion mechanism to approximate it for all devices. Website: Filter by Year: Bill is refining the feature. Paolo reported a Firefox bug (a tooltip appearing on hover after clicking out of the field), which Bill will investigate on a Linux machine. Envos Mail Preservation: Status: Eleanor Young has converted all but 5 of Eric Holtman's Envos mail folders to inbox format. Blocker: The 5 remaining folders are likely damaged and require manual repair before they can be reviewed in the ePad tool. Student Funding: Status: Larry is arranging funding for more undergraduate CS students at the University of Alberta to work on Medley projects. Next Steps Bill: Create the "Primer" GitHub project. Paolo: Create the Primer feedback issue template. Abhik: Resolve Primer comments and write the beta preface (due Dec 1). Bill: Investigate the "Filter by Year" bug on Linux. Ron: Investigate the Inspect Code font error and the proposed font system simplification. Herb: Repair the 5 damaged Envos mail folders. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review progress on key features and resolve critical user-facing issues. Key Takeaways - Performance Fix: Reverted a background-yield change that caused severe slowdowns (e.g., 6 clicks for one action). The fix is now live on master and Medley Online. - Font Progress: The BDF font reader is ready for review. The immediate strategy is to use it to fill in missing glyphs for existing fonts, not to support high-DPI displays, which is a more complex problem. - Networking Progress: Made progress on multi-instance networking but found a major bug: the Lisp-side Ether code incorrectly disables the network interface (NS) immediately after initializing it. - New Student Project: Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) will start on Dec 17th, working on the Gabriel Benchmarks. This project is ideal for an intro student as it is self-contained. Topics Performance & Input Lag - Problem: A recent change to background-yield (commit 4297DD) caused severe input lag, making Medley almost unusable. - Root Cause: The timer interrupt frequency is too low, especially with background-yield enabled, causing the system to check for X events only about once per second. - Immediate Workarounds: - Set background-yield to NIL (uses one full CPU core). - Start Medley with --timer 1000 (default is 10,000). - Solution: The change was reverted in PR #2396. The fix is now live on master and Medley Online. Font System & BDF Reader - BDF Reader Status: The BDF font reader is ready for review. - Deliverables: Two sample Medley font files (unifont-jp-16, noto-sans-20) and corresponding font-sampler PDFs are attached to the PR. - Issue: unifont-jp places glyphs in empty MCCS positions. This may be a bug in the Unicode mapping tables or a correct reflection of the font's data. - Font Deployment Strategy: - Phase 1 (Immediate): Use the BDF reader to fill in missing glyphs for existing fonts (e.g., Classic, Modern). This improves current documents and simplifies font coercion. - Phase 2 (Later): Support high-DPI displays. This is a complex problem requiring a larger screen bitmap, which would break the current memory map and layout. - T-Edit Briefs Issues: - Bug: Some entries reference only a character name, which is not looked up correctly. - Bug: Duplicate entries exist (e.g., = for reversible reaction and non-breaking hyphen). - Bug: The abbreviation parser has issues with longest/shortest match logic and M-dashes. Networking & Multi-Instance Support - Progress: Can now run multiple Medley instances on one machine with separate hardware addresses using OS-specific virtual Ethernet interfaces (e.g., macOS utun, Linux veth). - Lisp-Side Bug: The Ether code has a critical bug: it calls NSInit to bring up the network interface but then immediately turns it off. - Impact: This prevents the network from working correctly. - Workaround: Manually call NSInit or a restart function in a user's init file. - Self-Hearing Issue: The Lisp-side Ether code makes a copy of every sent packet for its receive queue, assuming hardware can't hear itself. - Problem: This overwhelms the system when using virtual interfaces (PCAP) that do hear themselves. - Solution: Add a flag to disable this self-copying behavior. - Ancillary Tools: - XNS-to-PUP-Mapper: A C program that uses PCAP and SQLite to map MAC addresses to PUP numbers. - Location: These tools will be placed in the Mako repo and built using CMake. Primer & Student Project - Primer Update: The new Primer is now live. - Action: Approved and merged all remaining PRs to complete the announcement (website updates, old Primer deletion). - Student Project: Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) will start on Dec 17th. - Project: Gabriel Benchmarks. - Rationale: This project is self-contained and ideal for an introductory student learning Lisp and Medley internals. Next Steps - Ron: - Review BDF reader PR (#2395) and provide feedback. - Test Sketch PR (#2358) and notify the team when ready to merge. - Coordinate with Herb to resolve Gitbook access and font issues. - Matt: - Fix typos in BDF reader docs based on Ron's feedback. - Add a row-major option to font-sampler. - Document T-Edit briefs issues for Nick. - Nick: - Investigate the Ether code bug (disabling NS after init). - Add a flag to the Ether code to disable self-copying of sent packets. - Place ancillary networking tools in the Mako repo and update CMake. - Herb: - Coordinate with Ron to resolve Gitbook access and font issues. - Onboard Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) for the Gabriel Benchmarks project. - Larry: - Reverted the background-yield change in PR #2396, which is now merged.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly December 01, 2025  •  121 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Email Ron Kaplan to schedule Gitbook/fonts sync Larry Masinter-lisp Approve/merge remaining Primer PRs Larry Masinter-lisp Create issue re: slowdown workarounds (timer, background-yield, SIGIO) Ron Kaplan Write note on Unifont/MCCS mapping; send to Ron Kaplan Matt Heffron Add column-major option to Font Sampler Matt Heffron Send T-Edit briefs examples (char-name-only, duplicates, non-breaking hyphen) to Ron Kaplan Matt Heffron Review BDF PR; send comments to Matt Heffron; approve on fixes Ron Kaplan Run trace-in-file-p for font lookups; document behavior Ron Kaplan Test Sketch PR 2358; send ready-to-merge note Ron Kaplan Merge PR 2385 and 2386 Larry Masinter-lisp Merge PR 2392 Nick Briggs Fix typos in MEDLI-5 PDF docs Matt Heffron Merge background-yield revert PR Larry Masinter-lisp Add CMake build for XNS-to-PUP mapper; place scripts in appropriate repo Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review progress on key features and resolve critical user-facing issues. Key Takeaways Performance Fix: Reverted a background-yield change that caused severe slowdowns (e.g., 6 clicks for one action). The fix is now live on master and Medley Online. Font Progress: The BDF font reader is ready for review. The immediate strategy is to use it to fill in missing glyphs for existing fonts, not to support high-DPI displays, which is a more complex problem. Networking Progress: Made progress on multi-instance networking but found a major bug: the Lisp-side Ether code incorrectly disables the network interface (NS) immediately after initializing it. New Student Project: Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) will start on Dec 17th, working on the Gabriel Benchmarks. This project is ideal for an intro student as it is self-contained. Topics Performance & Input Lag Problem: A recent change to background-yield (commit 4297DD) caused severe input lag, making Medley almost unusable. Root Cause: The timer interrupt frequency is too low, especially with background-yield enabled, causing the system to check for X events only about once per second. Immediate Workarounds: Set background-yield to NIL (uses one full CPU core). Start Medley with --timer 1000 (default is 10,000). Solution: The change was reverted in PR #2396. The fix is now live on master and Medley Online. Font System & BDF Reader BDF Reader Status: The BDF font reader is ready for review. Deliverables: Two sample Medley font files (unifont-jp-16, noto-sans-20) and corresponding font-sampler PDFs are attached to the PR. Issue: unifont-jp places glyphs in empty MCCS positions. This may be a bug in the Unicode mapping tables or a correct reflection of the font's data. Font Deployment Strategy: Phase 1 (Immediate): Use the BDF reader to fill in missing glyphs for existing fonts (e.g., Classic, Modern). This improves current documents and simplifies font coercion. Phase 2 (Later): Support high-DPI displays. This is a complex problem requiring a larger screen bitmap, which would break the current memory map and layout. T-Edit Briefs Issues: Bug: Some entries reference only a character name, which is not looked up correctly. Bug: Duplicate entries exist (e.g., = for reversible reaction and non-breaking hyphen). Bug: The abbreviation parser has issues with longest/shortest match logic and M-dashes. Networking & Multi-Instance Support Progress: Can now run multiple Medley instances on one machine with separate hardware addresses using OS-specific virtual Ethernet interfaces (e.g., macOS utun, Linux veth). Lisp-Side Bug: The Ether code has a critical bug: it calls NSInit to bring up the network interface but then immediately turns it off. Impact: This prevents the network from working correctly. Workaround: Manually call NSInit or a restart function in a user's init file. Self-Hearing Issue: The Lisp-side Ether code makes a copy of every sent packet for its receive queue, assuming hardware can't hear itself. Problem: This overwhelms the system when using virtual interfaces (PCAP) that do hear themselves. Solution: Add a flag to disable this self-copying behavior. Ancillary Tools: XNS-to-PUP-Mapper: A C program that uses PCAP and SQLite to map MAC addresses to PUP numbers. Location: These tools will be placed in the Mako repo and built using CMake. Primer & Student Project Primer Update: The new Primer is now live. Action: Approved and merged all remaining PRs to complete the announcement (website updates, old Primer deletion). Student Project: Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) will start on Dec 17th. Project: Gabriel Benchmarks. Rationale: This project is self-contained and ideal for an introductory student learning Lisp and Medley internals. Next Steps Ron: Review BDF reader PR (#2395) and provide feedback. Test Sketch PR (#2358) and notify the team when ready to merge. Coordinate with Herb to resolve Gitbook access and font issues. Matt: Fix typos in BDF reader docs based on Ron's feedback. Add a row-major option to font-sampler. Document T-Edit briefs issues for Nick. Nick: Investigate the Ether code bug (disabling NS after init). Add a flag to the Ether code to disable self-copying of sent packets. Place ancillary networking tools in the Mako repo and update CMake. Herb: Coordinate with Ron to resolve Gitbook access and font issues. Onboard Kabir Gupta (UAlberta) for the Gabriel Benchmarks project. Larry: Reverted the background-yield change in PR #2396, which is now merged.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Modernize Medley's printing system for online use. Key Takeaways - Printing Overhaul: A new "Browser" printer device will route output to a local browser, making "hard copy" functional for online users. This requires an internal web server in each online image to serve the generated files. - Font System Modernization: The new font.checkargs function and coerce-font-spec abstraction simplify font handling by centralizing argument validation and device-specific font mapping. - Code Quality & Performance: The calls function will be updated to sort its output for readability, while preserving the original order for internal comparisons. A major performance bottleneck in write-to-string was identified and will be addressed. - PRs Approved: PRs #2395 (PDF changes) and #2399 (Font Sampler) are ready for approval, pending minor updates. Topics Modernizing the Printing System - Goal: Enable "hard copy" functionality for online users who lack physical printers. - Solution: Create a virtual "Browser" printer device. - This device will generate output (HTML, PDF, PNG) and open it in the user's local browser. - Users can set "Browser" as their default printer in their init file. - Architecture: The system will be refactored to separate file conversion from the SendFileToPrinter process. - Rationale: This prevents applications like T-Edit from needing to know the capabilities of every possible output device. - New Flow: SendFileToPrinter will use a hook (ConvertFileToTypeForPrinter) to request the correct format from the application. - Online Implementation: - Challenge: The local browser cannot directly access files on the remote AWS server. - Solution: Run a lightweight web server (e.g., Nginx) inside each online Medley Docker image to serve the generated files. - Security: Each image gets a unique port, but cross-user access remains a potential concern. Font System Refinements - font.checkargs Function: Centralizes font argument validation, simplifying code by removing redundant checks. - It returns a complete font-spec or a compatible font-descriptor. - Note: It does not default size or family, which is a key difference from Matt's BDF font code. - coerce-font-spec Abstraction: Maps a generic font-spec to a specific font for a given device (e.g., mapping a terminal font to an HTML-compatible font). - BDF Font Sampler (#2399): - Bug: Displaying to a nil image stream causes crashes for Ron and a borderless window for Matt. - Root Cause: The issue is in ImageStream, not FontSampler. - Enhancement: Add an option to generate small, Google Fonts-style samples for quick previews. Code Quality & Performance - calls Function: - Problem: The function's output order is inconsistent, hindering readability. - Conflict: Sorting for readability could break internal comparisons (e.g., get-funds-compare) that rely on the original order as a signature. - Resolution: The function will be updated to sort its output for user-facing tools like MasterScope, while preserving the original order for internal comparisons. - write-to-string Performance: - Problem: write-to-string is inefficient, creating a new stream object for each call. - Impact: This caused a user's Advent of Code solution to run very slowly. - Solution: Use lower-level functions (e.g., from BigNum) to get character sequences directly, bypassing stream overhead. - setq-values Macro: Matt is investigating implementing this CLTL2 macro, which allows destructuring assignment to multiple places. Infrastructure & Documentation - Ethernet Interfaces: Nick has working scripts for creating fake Ethernet interfaces on macOS and FreeBSD, with Linux support pending. - Primer Updates: Herb is revising the Primer to improve clarity, including adding guidance on case sensitivity. - unix-telnet Module: The module's function unix-tcp-chat-open now executes ssh as a hack, replacing its original RSH/Telnet functionality. Next Steps - Frank: Create a GitHub issue for the online HTML server. - Herb: Update HTML Stream code to use the new coerce-font-spec abstraction. - Matt: - Update PR #2395 to set font-char-encoding during creation, then request approval. - Investigate implementing the setq-values macro. - Nick: - Finalize fake Ethernet interface scripts for Linux. - Break down the large Ethernet code changes into smaller, logical commits. - Ron: - Rework the calls function PR to sort output for users while preserving original order for internal tools. - Continue refactoring the printing system to separate conversion from sending.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

December 08, 2025  •  106 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Create GitHub issue for Medley Online HTML server; start implementation Frank Halasz Add case-sensitivity note to Primer intro Herb Jellinek Finish Linux fake-Ethernet setup scripts Nick Briggs Review font.checkargs for defaulting; email Matt re: BDF-string defaults Ron Kaplan Rework calls sorting: keep C-code order; sort user/MasterScope Ron Kaplan Update PR 2395: set font-char-encoding at creation; then Ron/Nick approve Matt Heffron Re-test Font Sampler (PR 2399); if fails, open ImageStream issue Nick Briggs Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Modernize Medley's printing system for online use. Key Takeaways Printing Overhaul: A new "Browser" printer device will route output to a local browser, making "hard copy" functional for online users. This requires an internal web server in each online image to serve the generated files. Font System Modernization: The new font.checkargs function and coerce-font-spec abstraction simplify font handling by centralizing argument validation and device-specific font mapping. Code Quality & Performance: The calls function will be updated to sort its output for readability, while preserving the original order for internal comparisons. A major performance bottleneck in write-to-string was identified and will be addressed. PRs Approved: PRs #2395 (PDF changes) and #2399 (Font Sampler) are ready for approval, pending minor updates. Topics Modernizing the Printing System Goal: Enable "hard copy" functionality for online users who lack physical printers. Solution: Create a virtual "Browser" printer device. This device will generate output (HTML, PDF, PNG) and open it in the user's local browser. Users can set "Browser" as their default printer in their init file. Architecture: The system will be refactored to separate file conversion from the SendFileToPrinter process. Rationale: This prevents applications like T-Edit from needing to know the capabilities of every possible output device. New Flow: SendFileToPrinter will use a hook (ConvertFileToTypeForPrinter) to request the correct format from the application. Online Implementation: Challenge: The local browser cannot directly access files on the remote AWS server. Solution: Run a lightweight web server (e.g., Nginx) inside each online Medley Docker image to serve the generated files. Security: Each image gets a unique port, but cross-user access remains a potential concern. Font System Refinements font.checkargs Function: Centralizes font argument validation, simplifying code by removing redundant checks. It returns a complete font-spec or a compatible font-descriptor. Note: It does not default size or family, which is a key difference from Matt's BDF font code. coerce-font-spec Abstraction: Maps a generic font-spec to a specific font for a given device (e.g., mapping a terminal font to an HTML-compatible font). BDF Font Sampler (#2399): Bug: Displaying to a nil image stream causes crashes for Ron and a borderless window for Matt. Root Cause: The issue is in ImageStream, not FontSampler. Enhancement: Add an option to generate small, Google Fonts-style samples for quick previews. Code Quality & Performance calls Function: Problem: The function's output order is inconsistent, hindering readability. Conflict: Sorting for readability could break internal comparisons (e.g., get-funds-compare) that rely on the original order as a signature. Resolution: The function will be updated to sort its output for user-facing tools like MasterScope, while preserving the original order for internal comparisons. write-to-string Performance: Problem: write-to-string is inefficient, creating a new stream object for each call. Impact: This caused a user's Advent of Code solution to run very slowly. Solution: Use lower-level functions (e.g., from BigNum) to get character sequences directly, bypassing stream overhead. setq-values Macro: Matt is investigating implementing this CLTL2 macro, which allows destructuring assignment to multiple places. Infrastructure & Documentation Ethernet Interfaces: Nick has working scripts for creating fake Ethernet interfaces on macOS and FreeBSD, with Linux support pending. Primer Updates: Herb is revising the Primer to improve clarity, including adding guidance on case sensitivity. unix-telnet Module: The module's function unix-tcp-chat-open now executes ssh as a hack, replacing its original RSH/Telnet functionality. Next Steps Frank: Create a GitHub issue for the online HTML server. Herb: Update HTML Stream code to use the new coerce-font-spec abstraction. Matt: Update PR #2395 to set font-char-encoding during creation, then request approval. Investigate implementing the setq-values macro. Nick: Finalize fake Ethernet interface scripts for Linux. Break down the large Ethernet code changes into smaller, logical commits. Ron: Rework the calls function PR to sort output for users while preserving original order for internal tools. Continue refactoring the printing system to separate conversion from sending.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Finalize the annual report plan and review project progress. Key Takeaways - Annual Report Plan: The AI-generation experiment is paused due to data-scraping issues. The team will now write the report manually in Google Docs, focusing on high-level themes for a non-technical audience. - Printer/Clipboard Architecture: A new issue will be created to decouple printer types from file formats (e.g., Postscript, PDF). This will enable a general "browser printer" and a unified clipboard interface using the printer architecture. - Unicode Strategy: Prioritize implementing combining characters (e.g., accents) over emojis. The proposed solution is a UI-driven input method (e.g., dead keys) that inserts a single, pre-composed character, simplifying internal representation and search. - Bibliography Cleanup: Eleanor is reviewing bibliography issues and will use a list of all author names from Bill to canonicalize entries and resolve inconsistencies. Topics Annual Report Strategy - AI Generation Paused: The experiment is on hold. - Reason: Difficulty scraping Google Groups data (no API, complex screen scraping). - Decision: Write the report manually to ensure timely completion. - New Workflow: - Platform: Google Docs for collaborative drafting → Hugo for final publication. - Content: Focus on high-level themes and project goals (e.g., lowering barrier to entry, maintainability) for a non-technical audience. - Deliverable: A shorter, summarized report with links to GitHub for details. - 50th Anniversary Section: - Content: A timeline of major Interlisp milestones and key contributors. - Format: A visual timeline was suggested. - Release Date: Will be set after the draft is complete. Printer & Clipboard Architecture - Problem: The system conflates printer types (destinations) with file formats (content), making it hard to add new destinations like a "browser printer." - Solution: Decouple the concepts. - Printer Type: A destination (e.g., "browser," "local CUPS," "clipboard"). - File Format: The content type (e.g., HTML, PDF, PNG). - Benefit: Enables a unified clipboard interface where copy/paste operations use the printer architecture, allowing for content negotiation (e.g., copying a snapshot as a PNG). Unicode: Combining Characters vs. Emojis - Priority: Combining characters (e.g., accents) over emojis. - Rationale: Emojis are a moving target and would require constant updates to MCCS. - Proposed Solution for Combining Characters: A UI-driven input method (e.g., dead keys like Option-E on Mac) that inserts a single, pre-composed character. - Benefit: Simplifies internal representation and search, as the document contains the final character, not a sequence of base + accent. Project Updates - Herb: Progressing on HTML stream; needs guidance from Ron on correct font class setup. - Eleanor: Working on the email archive in ePath and reviewing bibliography issues. - Ryan: Using Advent of Code to test Medley's Common Lisp compatibility, providing valuable "newcomer" feedback. - Paolo: Confirmed T-Edit and Image Objects were developed concurrently (1982–83) via Sibalski's resume. - Larry: Funded an undergraduate student at the University of Alberta to join the project. Next Steps - Paolo: Create a Google Doc for the annual report draft and update the GitHub issue with high-level themes. - Larry: Create a GitHub issue to formalize the printer/clipboard architecture discussion. - Bill: Provide Eleanor with a list of all author names from the bibliography for canonicalization. - Herb & Ron: Connect offline to discuss the correct font class setup for HTML stream.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly December 10, 2025  •  100 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Finalize the annual report plan and review project progress. Key Takeaways Annual Report Plan: The AI-generation experiment is paused due to data-scraping issues. The team will now write the report manually in Google Docs, focusing on high-level themes for a non-technical audience. Printer/Clipboard Architecture: A new issue will be created to decouple printer types from file formats (e.g., Postscript, PDF). This will enable a general "browser printer" and a unified clipboard interface using the printer architecture. Unicode Strategy: Prioritize implementing combining characters (e.g., accents) over emojis. The proposed solution is a UI-driven input method (e.g., dead keys) that inserts a single, pre-composed character, simplifying internal representation and search. Bibliography Cleanup: Eleanor is reviewing bibliography issues and will use a list of all author names from Bill to canonicalize entries and resolve inconsistencies. Topics Annual Report Strategy AI Generation Paused: The experiment is on hold. Reason: Difficulty scraping Google Groups data (no API, complex screen scraping). Decision: Write the report manually to ensure timely completion. New Workflow: Platform: Google Docs for collaborative drafting → Hugo for final publication. Content: Focus on high-level themes and project goals (e.g., lowering barrier to entry, maintainability) for a non-technical audience. Deliverable: A shorter, summarized report with links to GitHub for details. 50th Anniversary Section: Content: A timeline of major Interlisp milestones and key contributors. Format: A visual timeline was suggested. Release Date: Will be set after the draft is complete. Printer & Clipboard Architecture Problem: The system conflates printer types (destinations) with file formats (content), making it hard to add new destinations like a "browser printer." Solution: Decouple the concepts. Printer Type: A destination (e.g., "browser," "local CUPS," "clipboard"). File Format: The content type (e.g., HTML, PDF, PNG). Benefit: Enables a unified clipboard interface where copy/paste operations use the printer architecture, allowing for content negotiation (e.g., copying a snapshot as a PNG). Unicode: Combining Characters vs. Emojis Priority: Combining characters (e.g., accents) over emojis. Rationale: Emojis are a moving target and would require constant updates to MCCS. Proposed Solution for Combining Characters: A UI-driven input method (e.g., dead keys like Option-E on Mac) that inserts a single, pre-composed character. Benefit: Simplifies internal representation and search, as the document contains the final character, not a sequence of base + accent. Project Updates Herb: Progressing on HTML stream; needs guidance from Ron on correct font class setup. Eleanor: Working on the email archive in ePath and reviewing bibliography issues. Ryan: Using Advent of Code to test Medley's Common Lisp compatibility, providing valuable "newcomer" feedback. Paolo: Confirmed T-Edit and Image Objects were developed concurrently (1982–83) via Sibalski's resume. Larry: Funded an undergraduate student at the University of Alberta to join the project. Next Steps Paolo: Create a Google Doc for the annual report draft and update the GitHub issue with high-level themes. Larry: Create a GitHub issue to formalize the printer/clipboard architecture discussion. Bill: Provide Eleanor with a list of all author names from the bibliography for canonicalization. Herb & Ron: Connect offline to discuss the correct font class setup for HTML stream. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Reviewing progress on Ethernet, the new web server, and the hardcopy system redesign. Key Takeaways - New Web Server: A new Python-based HTTP server for webfiles is live on Medley Online. It requires a password to prevent unauthorized access, as ports are guessable. - Ethernet Progress: Nick is preparing a test branch for the Solaris Ethernet port. The design for handling multiple VM instances on one machine will use external OS-level virtual bridges. - Hardcopy System Redesign: Ron is overhauling the hardcopy system to separate file creation from printer output. The goal is a declarative, format-agnostic system using a conversion table. - Pseudo Host Integration: The pseudo-host mechanism, currently a separate load, will be integrated into the base system (full) due to its stability and utility. Topics Medley Online Web Server - A new Python HTTP server is live on Medley Online, serving files from the webfiles directory (usually logindir/webfiles). - Port Mapping: HTTP server runs on port 43xxx for a Medley instance on port 3xxx. - Functions: online.webfileurl generates a file's URL; online.openwebfile opens it in a browser. - Security Concern: The server is currently unpassworded, making files accessible to anyone who can guess a user's sequentially assigned port. - Resolution: Frank will add a password, likely reusing the existing SFTP password. This will be embedded in the URL path or as a query parameter. - Bug: On the production server, online.openwebfile disconnects the Medley session. This is likely due to an outdated deployment and will be fixed after Frank's final review. Hardcopy System Redesign - Ron is redesigning the hardcopy system to separate file creation from printer output, simplifying the current complex, menu-driven code. - New Model: A declarative system using a conversion table. - Example: A request for a PDF from a region → convert region to bitmap → convert bitmap to PDF. - Scaling Logic: The group debated where scaling should occur. - Option A (File Creation): Embed scaling info in the file (e.g., PostScript) at creation. - Option B (Printer Driver): Apply scaling at the final print stage. - Decision: The team will investigate the Java printing API (designed by Bob Sproul) for a proven model. Ethernet & Timer Updates - Solaris Port: Nick is preparing a test branch for the Solaris Ethernet port. - Known Issues: Requires a Clearinghouse service; EtherEventFund needs fixing; a loop-avoidance hack for zero-address machines must be removed. - Multi-Instance Networking: To run multiple Medley instances on one machine, the recommended solution is external OS-level virtual bridges. - Rationale: This avoids packet collision issues that arise when multiple raw Ethernet processes share a single interface. - Timer Interrupts: Larry confirmed that OS async interrupts can directly set IRQ_stack_check and IRQ_stack_end variables. - Rationale: This is necessary for long-running Lisp functions (e.g., ASSOC) to be interruptible and is safe despite potential race conditions. Pseudo Host & Documentation - Pseudo Host Integration: The pseudo-host mechanism will be moved into the base system (full). - Rationale: It is stable, useful, and compatible with Common Lisp pathnames. - Documentation Gap: The define-record macro (from XCL-Extras) is documented only in old release notes, not the main IRM. - Resolution: The team discussed adding an alias or prefix-removal feature to define-record to simplify field access. Next Steps - Nick: - Create the Solaris Ethernet test branch. - Share scripts for building virtual network topologies. - Frank: - Add a password to the HTTP server. - Fix URL generation to handle full paths and different slash types. - Update shell-open to use the new online web server functions. - Larry: - Create a PR for the recursive coerce-font-spec function. - Ron: - Begin the hardcopy system redesign, separating file creation from printer output. - All: - Consider proposing a talk on SpinPro/PepPro for the "Retro AI" workshop. - Meeting Schedule: No meeting on Dec 24 (Christmas Eve). Larry will likely miss the Dec 22 meeting.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly December 15, 2025  •  110 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Reviewing progress on Ethernet, the new web server, and the hardcopy system redesign. Key Takeaways New Web Server: A new Python-based HTTP server for webfiles is live on Medley Online. It requires a password to prevent unauthorized access, as ports are guessable. Ethernet Progress: Nick is preparing a test branch for the Solaris Ethernet port. The design for handling multiple VM instances on one machine will use external OS-level virtual bridges. Hardcopy System Redesign: Ron is overhauling the hardcopy system to separate file creation from printer output. The goal is a declarative, format-agnostic system using a conversion table. Pseudo Host Integration: The pseudo-host mechanism, currently a separate load, will be integrated into the base system (full) due to its stability and utility. Topics Medley Online Web Server A new Python HTTP server is live on Medley Online, serving files from the webfiles directory (usually logindir/webfiles). Port Mapping: HTTP server runs on port 43xxx for a Medley instance on port 3xxx. Functions: online.webfileurl generates a file's URL; online.openwebfile opens it in a browser. Security Concern: The server is currently unpassworded, making files accessible to anyone who can guess a user's sequentially assigned port. Resolution: Frank will add a password, likely reusing the existing SFTP password. This will be embedded in the URL path or as a query parameter. Bug: On the production server, online.openwebfile disconnects the Medley session. This is likely due to an outdated deployment and will be fixed after Frank's final review. Hardcopy System Redesign Ron is redesigning the hardcopy system to separate file creation from printer output, simplifying the current complex, menu-driven code. New Model: A declarative system using a conversion table. Example: A request for a PDF from a region → convert region to bitmap → convert bitmap to PDF. Scaling Logic: The group debated where scaling should occur. Option A (File Creation): Embed scaling info in the file (e.g., PostScript) at creation. Option B (Printer Driver): Apply scaling at the final print stage. Decision: The team will investigate the Java printing API (designed by Bob Sproul) for a proven model. Ethernet & Timer Updates Solaris Port: Nick is preparing a test branch for the Solaris Ethernet port. Known Issues: Requires a Clearinghouse service; EtherEventFund needs fixing; a loop-avoidance hack for zero-address machines must be removed. Multi-Instance Networking: To run multiple Medley instances on one machine, the recommended solution is external OS-level virtual bridges. Rationale: This avoids packet collision issues that arise when multiple raw Ethernet processes share a single interface. Timer Interrupts: Larry confirmed that OS async interrupts can directly set IRQ_stack_check and IRQ_stack_end variables. Rationale: This is necessary for long-running Lisp functions (e.g., ASSOC) to be interruptible and is safe despite potential race conditions. Pseudo Host & Documentation Pseudo Host Integration: The pseudo-host mechanism will be moved into the base system (full). Rationale: It is stable, useful, and compatible with Common Lisp pathnames. Documentation Gap: The define-record macro (from XCL-Extras) is documented only in old release notes, not the main IRM. Resolution: The team discussed adding an alias or prefix-removal feature to define-record to simplify field access. Next Steps Nick: Create the Solaris Ethernet test branch. Share scripts for building virtual network topologies. Frank: Add a password to the HTTP server. Fix URL generation to handle full paths and different slash types. Update shell-open to use the new online web server functions. Larry: Create a PR for the recursive coerce-font-spec function. Ron: Begin the hardcopy system redesign, separating file creation from printer output. All: Consider proposing a talk on SpinPro/PepPro for the "Retro AI" workshop. Meeting Schedule: No meeting on Dec 24 (Christmas Eve). Larry will likely miss the Dec 22 meeting. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development and project status. Key Takeaways - Networking Startup Fixed: Nick identified and fixed the root cause of networking failures—missing NSInit and EtherEventFun calls that were dropped during a code refactor. - Ethernet Flag Added: The Medley script will get a -E flag to simplify Ethernet setup, passing a raw MAC/interface string directly to the LDE executable. - Printing Subsystem Refactor: Ron is refactoring the printing subsystem to clarify its ontology of sources (windows, bitmaps) and streams (PDF, PS), aiming for a cleaner, two-step workflow. - Font Color Abstraction: The team is debating removing color fields from font definitions, as they are likely an obsolete optimization from 8-bit hardware and conflict with modern display stream color settings. Topics Networking Startup Fix - Problem: Networking failed to initialize on startup. - Root Cause: A code refactor that converted a startup file to a managed Lisp file dropped critical initialization calls. - NSInit and EtherEventFun calls were missing. - The RestartEther call was also affected. - Solution: Nick is restoring the missing calls and analyzing the original startup sequence to understand its rationale. - Rationale: The original code likely used the MakoMovDs mechanism to temporarily uninstall the Ethernet event handler during the LDE init phase (when interrupts are off) to prevent crashes. This mechanism was also affected by the refactor. - Goal: Ensure the PUP network setup does not prompt for user input during automated workflows. Ethernet Script Flag - Problem: The current Ethernet setup process is complex and confusing for users. - Solution: Add a -E flag to the Medley script. - Function: Passes a raw string argument directly to the LDE executable. - Argument Format: A MAC address and interface name (e.g., 00:11:22:33:44:55%en0). - Rationale: The script will not parse or validate the string, as the required format varies by OS (ifconfig, ipadm, dladm). - Action: Document the flag and its usage in the script's help text and a dedicated primer. Printing Subsystem Refactor - Problem: The printing subsystem's ontology is unclear, mixing "image sources" (windows, bitmaps) with "image streams" (PDF, Postscript). - Goal: Refactor the system into a cleaner, two-step workflow: 1. Convert a source to an image file. 2. Send an image file to a printer. - Rationale: This structure would eliminate the need for numerous, confusing coercion functions and simplify the logic for handling default printers and user interaction order. Font Color Abstraction - Problem: Font definitions include color fields (e.g., fore-color), which is an unusual abstraction. - Hypothesis: This is an obsolete optimization from 8-bit color hardware (e.g., Dorado, UFO boards) where fonts could be pre-colorized to avoid per-pixel lookups. - Conflict: This conflicts with the modern approach of setting color via the display stream (DSP color), which allows a single font to be rendered in multiple colors on one screen. - Decision: Investigate if any current code uses these font color fields. - If unused, the fields will be deprecated or removed. - A discussion may be opened to explore the full implications of this change. Other Updates - New Contributor: Peter Farkas, a retired C engineer, will join meetings in the new year to explore contributing. - Hardware Tour: Herb toured the Lawrence Livermore National Ignition Facility, seeing the El Capitan supercomputer (5,000+ nodes, 200 Gbps fabric) and learning it uses Fortran, C++/CUDA, and Python. - Historical Note: James Gosling reported that Warren Teitelman wrote Google's initial ad analytics code in Interlisp, creating a significant maintenance challenge after his passing. Next Steps - Larry: - Add the -E Ethernet flag to the Medley script. - Document Ethernet usage in the script's help and a primer. - Investigate code usage of font color fields to inform a deprecation decision. - Nick: - Continue debugging and restoring the networking startup sequence. - Herb: - Verify local font setup to resolve the Meta-C keybinding issue. - Test the Meta-C issue on the master branch and with a clean init file. - Ron: - Continue refactoring the printing subsystem. - Review and approve the "multi-A-list glitch" PR. - All: - Send any photos of Warren Teitelman to Herb for James Gosling. - Review the draft annual report from Paolo when available.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

December 22, 2025  •  64 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development and project status. Key Takeaways Networking Startup Fixed: Nick identified and fixed the root cause of networking failures—missing NSInit and EtherEventFun calls that were dropped during a code refactor. Ethernet Flag Added: The Medley script will get a -E flag to simplify Ethernet setup, passing a raw MAC/interface string directly to the LDE executable. Printing Subsystem Refactor: Ron is refactoring the printing subsystem to clarify its ontology of sources (windows, bitmaps) and streams (PDF, PS), aiming for a cleaner, two-step workflow. Font Color Abstraction: The team is debating removing color fields from font definitions, as they are likely an obsolete optimization from 8-bit hardware and conflict with modern display stream color settings. Topics Networking Startup Fix Problem: Networking failed to initialize on startup. Root Cause: A code refactor that converted a startup file to a managed Lisp file dropped critical initialization calls. NSInit and EtherEventFun calls were missing. The RestartEther call was also affected. Solution: Nick is restoring the missing calls and analyzing the original startup sequence to understand its rationale. Rationale: The original code likely used the MakoMovDs mechanism to temporarily uninstall the Ethernet event handler during the LDE init phase (when interrupts are off) to prevent crashes. This mechanism was also affected by the refactor. Goal: Ensure the PUP network setup does not prompt for user input during automated workflows. Ethernet Script Flag Problem: The current Ethernet setup process is complex and confusing for users. Solution: Add a -E flag to the Medley script. Function: Passes a raw string argument directly to the LDE executable. Argument Format: A MAC address and interface name (e.g., 00:11:22:33:44:55%en0). Rationale: The script will not parse or validate the string, as the required format varies by OS (ifconfig, ipadm, dladm). Action: Document the flag and its usage in the script's help text and a dedicated primer. Printing Subsystem Refactor Problem: The printing subsystem's ontology is unclear, mixing "image sources" (windows, bitmaps) with "image streams" (PDF, Postscript). Goal: Refactor the system into a cleaner, two-step workflow: Convert a source to an image file. Send an image file to a printer. Rationale: This structure would eliminate the need for numerous, confusing coercion functions and simplify the logic for handling default printers and user interaction order. Font Color Abstraction Problem: Font definitions include color fields (e.g., fore-color), which is an unusual abstraction. Hypothesis: This is an obsolete optimization from 8-bit color hardware (e.g., Dorado, UFO boards) where fonts could be pre-colorized to avoid per-pixel lookups. Conflict: This conflicts with the modern approach of setting color via the display stream (DSP color), which allows a single font to be rendered in multiple colors on one screen. Decision: Investigate if any current code uses these font color fields. If unused, the fields will be deprecated or removed. A discussion may be opened to explore the full implications of this change. Other Updates New Contributor: Peter Farkas, a retired C engineer, will join meetings in the new year to explore contributing. Hardware Tour: Herb toured the Lawrence Livermore National Ignition Facility, seeing the El Capitan supercomputer (5,000+ nodes, 200 Gbps fabric) and learning it uses Fortran, C++/CUDA, and Python. Historical Note: James Gosling reported that Warren Teitelman wrote Google's initial ad analytics code in Interlisp, creating a significant maintenance challenge after his passing. Next Steps Larry: Add the -E Ethernet flag to the Medley script. Document Ethernet usage in the script's help and a primer. Investigate code usage of font color fields to inform a deprecation decision. Nick: Continue debugging and restoring the networking startup sequence. Herb: Verify local font setup to resolve the Meta-C keybinding issue. Test the Meta-C issue on the master branch and with a clean init file. Ron: Continue refactoring the printing subsystem. Review and approve the "multi-A-list glitch" PR. All: Send any photos of Warren Teitelman to Herb for James Gosling. Review the draft annual report from Paolo when available. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review weekly progress and finalize content for the annual report. Key Takeaways - Annual Report Focus: The report will frame key projects (fonts, printing, pseudo-hosts) as modernizing Medley by breaking legacy constraints, such as the XCCS character set and single-machine file systems. - Printing Overhaul (PR #2290): A new PR separates printing and file conversion, enabling a default "window" printer type for direct display and a more robust printer selection logic. - PRs Ready for Merge: Matt's font sampler and define-record arglist PRs are approved. The BDF font PR is also ready after a master branch sync. - Historical Insights: A discussion with James Gosling confirmed the Java VM's bytecode architecture was influenced by the UCSD P-system, not the Interlisp VM. Topics Annual Report Strategy - Goal: Frame recent work as modernizing Medley by breaking legacy constraints. - Key Projects & Their Modernization Rationale: - Fonts: Replaced legacy formats and the XCCS character set with a new architecture. - Why: Enables new font features and consistent character coding. - Printing: Separated printing from file conversion. - Why: Allows independent operation and new output types (e.g., direct display). - Pseudo-hosts: Created a mechanism for abstracting file paths. - Why: Unifies file systems in a multi-machine environment, resolving a key difference from the original single-server Fathom setup. - Content: Paolo's draft is the starting point. Team members will add details to their respective sections. Printing System Overhaul (PR #2290) - Status: Draft PR #2290 from Ron Kaplan. - Core Change: Separates printing from file conversion. - Why: Allows independent operation and enables new output types. - New Default Printer: "window" type. - Why: Enables direct display of content (e.g., HTML) without printing to a physical device. - Improved Printer Selection: Logic now searches the Default Printing List for the first printer that can handle a specific file type, rather than just using the first one. - File Browser Integration: The C command will be updated to open files in T-Edit (for text) or display them in a window (for other types like HTML). - Pseudo-hosts: The LPT printer device is now implemented as a pseudo-host. - Why: A cleaner, more modern implementation for Unix. - Concern (Larry): Potential name collision with old Pup server lookups (e.g., Eris). - Response (Ron): The mechanism is self-contained; lookups only occur for explicitly defined pseudo-hosts. Other Project Updates - Fonts (Matt Heffron): - Font Sampler PR: Ready for merge. - Change: Added a parameter to conditionally exclude character sets that are entirely "slugs" (undefined characters). - define-record Arglist PR: Approved. - Why: Trivial change; tested successfully with Larry's inspects tool. - BDF Font PR: Ready for merge after a master branch sync. - Mail (Herb Jellinek): - Ellie is making good progress on the mail system. - Bibliography (Herb Jellinek): - Zotero Bug: A bug mapping software citations to "book" was fixed with a PR to the Zotero data server. - Alternative: A JavaScript library can be used for server-side citation normalization, but the current system uses Perl. - New Contact: Ron will share the Medley bibliography with Nelson Beebe, who maintains a massive BibTeX database of computer science literature. Historical Context & Discoveries - Unix v4: A Tom's Hardware article notes the recovery and restoration of the only known copy of Unix v4 by Al Caso and Martin Newell. - Interlisp VM vs. Java VM: A discussion with James Gosling clarified the historical lineage of bytecode VMs. - Influence: The Java VM's architecture was directly influenced by the UCSD P-system, not the Interlisp VM. - Lineage: Burroughs 5000 → UCSD P-system → Java VM. - BCPL Emulator Source: The BCPL source code for the Lisp emulator was located in the PARC archives (fugue.6 sources, this PCVL sources.dm). - Significance: Nick Briggs modified this code for the Dorado to support larger virtual memory partitions. Next Steps - Larry: - Fix the recurring calendar invites. - Approve Matt's BDF font PR. - Continue updating the HTML stream to the new font world. - Ron: - Review PR #2290 (Printing Overhaul) with the team. - Sync his T-Editor-Briefs changes with Matt's draft. - Contact Nelson Beebe regarding the Medley bibliography. - Matt: - Sync the BDF font PR with the master branch. - All: - Edit and contribute to the annual report draft.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

December 29, 2025  •  74 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review weekly progress and finalize content for the annual report. Key Takeaways Annual Report Focus: The report will frame key projects (fonts, printing, pseudo-hosts) as modernizing Medley by breaking legacy constraints, such as the XCCS character set and single-machine file systems. Printing Overhaul (PR #2290): A new PR separates printing and file conversion, enabling a default "window" printer type for direct display and a more robust printer selection logic. PRs Ready for Merge: Matt's font sampler and define-record arglist PRs are approved. The BDF font PR is also ready after a master branch sync. Historical Insights: A discussion with James Gosling confirmed the Java VM's bytecode architecture was influenced by the UCSD P-system, not the Interlisp VM. Topics Annual Report Strategy Goal: Frame recent work as modernizing Medley by breaking legacy constraints. Key Projects & Their Modernization Rationale: Fonts: Replaced legacy formats and the XCCS character set with a new architecture. Why: Enables new font features and consistent character coding. Printing: Separated printing from file conversion. Why: Allows independent operation and new output types (e.g., direct display). Pseudo-hosts: Created a mechanism for abstracting file paths. Why: Unifies file systems in a multi-machine environment, resolving a key difference from the original single-server Fathom setup. Content: Paolo's draft is the starting point. Team members will add details to their respective sections. Printing System Overhaul (PR #2290) Status: Draft PR #2290 from Ron Kaplan. Core Change: Separates printing from file conversion. Why: Allows independent operation and enables new output types. New Default Printer: "window" type. Why: Enables direct display of content (e.g., HTML) without printing to a physical device. Improved Printer Selection: Logic now searches the Default Printing List for the first printer that can handle a specific file type, rather than just using the first one. File Browser Integration: The C command will be updated to open files in T-Edit (for text) or display them in a window (for other types like HTML). Pseudo-hosts: The LPT printer device is now implemented as a pseudo-host. Why: A cleaner, more modern implementation for Unix. Concern (Larry): Potential name collision with old Pup server lookups (e.g., Eris). Response (Ron): The mechanism is self-contained; lookups only occur for explicitly defined pseudo-hosts. Other Project Updates Fonts (Matt Heffron): Font Sampler PR: Ready for merge. Change: Added a parameter to conditionally exclude character sets that are entirely "slugs" (undefined characters). define-record Arglist PR: Approved. Why: Trivial change; tested successfully with Larry's inspects tool. BDF Font PR: Ready for merge after a master branch sync. Mail (Herb Jellinek): Ellie is making good progress on the mail system. Bibliography (Herb Jellinek): Zotero Bug: A bug mapping software citations to "book" was fixed with a PR to the Zotero data server. Alternative: A JavaScript library can be used for server-side citation normalization, but the current system uses Perl. New Contact: Ron will share the Medley bibliography with Nelson Beebe, who maintains a massive BibTeX database of computer science literature. Historical Context & Discoveries Unix v4: A Tom's Hardware article notes the recovery and restoration of the only known copy of Unix v4 by Al Caso and Martin Newell. Interlisp VM vs. Java VM: A discussion with James Gosling clarified the historical lineage of bytecode VMs. Influence: The Java VM's architecture was directly influenced by the UCSD P-system, not the Interlisp VM. Lineage: Burroughs 5000 → UCSD P-system → Java VM. BCPL Emulator Source: The BCPL source code for the Lisp emulator was located in the PARC archives (fugue.6 sources, this PCVL sources.dm). Significance: Nick Briggs modified this code for the Dorado to support larger virtual memory partitions. Next Steps Larry: Fix the recurring calendar invites. Approve Matt's BDF font PR. Continue updating the HTML stream to the new font world. Ron: Review PR #2290 (Printing Overhaul) with the team. Sync his T-Editor-Briefs changes with Matt's draft. Contact Nelson Beebe regarding the Medley bibliography. Matt: Sync the BDF font PR with the master branch. All: Edit and contribute to the annual report draft. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development, PRs, and community updates. Key Takeaways - Font System Overhaul: Ron is building a "generic font interface" to abstract font metrics, simplifying development for streams like HTML and resolving long-standing technical debt. - PR #2290 Needs Rigorous Testing: The "hard copy to printer" PR is ready for review. Testers must push its boundaries with edge cases (e.g., images, empty documents) to ensure stability before merging. - Networking Progress: Nick is refining startup to prevent prompts for Puphost numbers and has contributed XNS packet dissectors to Wireshark, improving network debugging. - Bibliography JSON Fix: Matt fixed a bug where empty fields from Zotero's CSL JSON format incorrectly overrode valid data by pre-filtering all empty fields before the merge. Topics Font System Overhaul - Ron is developing a "generic font interface" to abstract font metrics, simplifying development for various image streams (e.g., HTML). - Rationale: This abstraction will resolve significant technical debt related to font handling that has accumulated since Interlisp 10. - Status: Herb is integrating the changes into the HTML stream code, which is in the RMK...hard copy, print branch. Ron has updated the documentation within that branch. PR #2290: Hard Copy to Printer - This PR, which adds printer support, is now ready for review (no longer a draft). - Action: Testers must push the boundaries with edge cases (e.g., images, empty documents) to ensure stability before merging. - Finding: The make-eps-file function generates non-standard PostScript, missing the required %EPSF header. This prevents macOS Preview from recognizing the output as a true EPS image. - Suggestion: An RTF printer might be more useful for integration with modern editors. Networking & Startup - Nick is refining the startup process to prevent prompts for Puphost numbers during loadup while ensuring the system initializes with Ethernet support. - He contributed XNS packet dissectors to Wireshark (in C) to correctly identify packet types and well-known sockets (e.g., PupLookup). - Next: Write full dissectors for all XNS packet types. Bibliography JSON Fix - Matt fixed a bug where empty fields from Zotero's CSL JSON format incorrectly overrode valid data. - Cause: The jq merge process was order-dependent, allowing empty strings to overwrite populated fields. - Solution: A jq pre-filter now removes all empty fields before the merge, ensuring correct data integrity. Community & Project Updates - Interlisp.org Board Meeting: The board met to ratify minutes and continue operations. - Future Meeting Idea: Herb suggested adding brief demos of related tech (e.g., Clojure, MasterScope-like IDEs) to future meetings. - OpenCore Legacy Patcher (OCLP): Herb successfully used OCLP to upgrade his 2017 Mac from Ventura to Sequoia, enabling updates for previously unsupported software. - ARPANET Reconstruction: Paolo explored the project, which is seeking volunteers to reconstruct the culture and community of original nodes, including Xerox PARC. - Evelyn Van Orden Interview: Nick shared a new transcript of an interview with Evelyn Van Orden on Smalltalk's tech transfer from PARC to XeOS, which mentions Interlisp. Minor Issues & Questions - setf with values: The team decided against implementing this non-standard extension, which is complex and has simple workarounds. - File Manager Warnings: Herb reported "unknown variable" warnings when loading the File Manager GUI. Larry will investigate. - Loadup Buttons: Herb asked how to disable documentation buttons in the loadup. Larry pointed to Issue #2400 for a potential solution. Next Steps - Herb: - Investigate disabling loadup documentation buttons (Issue #2400). - Report findings on the File Manager GUI warnings. - Larry: - Create a formal issue for setf with values and close it as "won't fix." - Matt: - Conduct a rigorous review of PR #2290, focusing on edge cases. - Nick: - Share the link to the Evelyn Van Orden interview transcript. - All: - Review PR #2290. - Prepare for the next meeting, which will focus on the annual report.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

January 05, 2026  •  60 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Review Ron's font-changes doc re: keystroke/character/font model mismatch Larry Masinter-lisp Post Evelyn Van Orden interview link in chat; add to bibliography Nick Briggs Schedule dedicated meeting re: annual report Larry Masinter-lisp Create GitHub issue re: SETF into VALUES placeholder; mark 'not now' Larry Masinter-lisp Review Ron's PR #2390 (hard copy/print) w/ edge-case tests Matt Heffron Use MasterScope to find uses of manager.activeflug; add SPECIAL declarations Herb Jellinek Investigate/fix manager.activeflug 'unknown' warnings Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development, PRs, and community updates. Key Takeaways Font System Overhaul: Ron is building a "generic font interface" to abstract font metrics, simplifying development for streams like HTML and resolving long-standing technical debt. PR #2290 Needs Rigorous Testing: The "hard copy to printer" PR is ready for review. Testers must push its boundaries with edge cases (e.g., images, empty documents) to ensure stability before merging. Networking Progress: Nick is refining startup to prevent prompts for Puphost numbers and has contributed XNS packet dissectors to Wireshark, improving network debugging. Bibliography JSON Fix: Matt fixed a bug where empty fields from Zotero's CSL JSON format incorrectly overrode valid data by pre-filtering all empty fields before the merge. Topics Font System Overhaul Ron is developing a "generic font interface" to abstract font metrics, simplifying development for various image streams (e.g., HTML). Rationale: This abstraction will resolve significant technical debt related to font handling that has accumulated since Interlisp 10. Status: Herb is integrating the changes into the HTML stream code, which is in the RMK...hard copy, print branch. Ron has updated the documentation within that branch. PR #2290: Hard Copy to Printer This PR, which adds printer support, is now ready for review (no longer a draft). Action: Testers must push the boundaries with edge cases (e.g., images, empty documents) to ensure stability before merging. Finding: The make-eps-file function generates non-standard PostScript, missing the required %EPSF header. This prevents macOS Preview from recognizing the output as a true EPS image. Suggestion: An RTF printer might be more useful for integration with modern editors. Networking & Startup Nick is refining the startup process to prevent prompts for Puphost numbers during loadup while ensuring the system initializes with Ethernet support. He contributed XNS packet dissectors to Wireshark (in C) to correctly identify packet types and well-known sockets (e.g., PupLookup). Next: Write full dissectors for all XNS packet types. Bibliography JSON Fix Matt fixed a bug where empty fields from Zotero's CSL JSON format incorrectly overrode valid data. Cause: The jq merge process was order-dependent, allowing empty strings to overwrite populated fields. Solution: A jq pre-filter now removes all empty fields before the merge, ensuring correct data integrity. Community & Project Updates Interlisp.org Board Meeting: The board met to ratify minutes and continue operations. Future Meeting Idea: Herb suggested adding brief demos of related tech (e.g., Clojure, MasterScope-like IDEs) to future meetings. OpenCore Legacy Patcher (OCLP): Herb successfully used OCLP to upgrade his 2017 Mac from Ventura to Sequoia, enabling updates for previously unsupported software. ARPANET Reconstruction: Paolo explored the project, which is seeking volunteers to reconstruct the culture and community of original nodes, including Xerox PARC. Evelyn Van Orden Interview: Nick shared a new transcript of an interview with Evelyn Van Orden on Smalltalk's tech transfer from PARC to XeOS, which mentions Interlisp. Minor Issues & Questions setf with values: The team decided against implementing this non-standard extension, which is complex and has simple workarounds. File Manager Warnings: Herb reported "unknown variable" warnings when loading the File Manager GUI. Larry will investigate. Loadup Buttons: Herb asked how to disable documentation buttons in the loadup. Larry pointed to Issue #2400 for a potential solution. Next Steps Herb: Investigate disabling loadup documentation buttons (Issue #2400). Report findings on the File Manager GUI warnings. Larry: Create a formal issue for setf with values and close it as "won't fix." Matt: Conduct a rigorous review of PR #2290, focusing on edge cases. Nick: Share the link to the Evelyn Van Orden interview transcript. All: Review PR #2290. Prepare for the next meeting, which will focus on the annual report.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Sync on Medley development, DOS porting, and new intern onboarding. Key Takeaways - DOS Port Containerization: Prioritized for immediate online deployment (via Docker) over fixing the VESA graphics bug. - T-Edit Line Numbering: Not natively supported; a t-edit-line-numbering user package exists as a possible workaround. - New Intern: Kabir Gupta will port and run Richard Gabriel's benchmarks to quantify Medley's performance gains on modern hardware. - Performance Impact: Modern CPUs cause demos (e.g., Towers of Hanoi) to run too fast and break time-sensitive features, like the debugger's error-delay mechanism. Topics DOS Port & Containerization - Ryan tested Medley's DOS port on various environments: - Microsoft DOS: Ran okay. - DOSBox-X: Ran fine. - FreeDOS: Crashed on graphics window initialization. - VESA Graphics Bug: Using the VESA 102 flag causes screen artifacts (top of window) when dragging boxes. - Decision: Containerize the current VGA-resolution port for immediate online deployment via Docker. Fixing the VESA bug is deferred to get the system into users' hands faster. T-Edit Line Numbering - Paolo asked if T-Edit can programmatically access a document by line number. - Ron explained why this is not a native feature: - Ambiguous "Line": A line's visual position depends on window width and justification, not just hard breaks. - Performance Cost: Real-time line number updates after every edit would be expensive. - Workaround: A t-edit-line-numbering user package exists, though its functionality is unverified. New Intern & Performance Benchmarking - Kabir Gupta (U. of Alberta CS) joins as an intern. - Project: Port and run Richard Gabriel's benchmarks to quantify Medley's performance gains on modern hardware. - Initial Test (SeaTac Benchmark): ~1,000x faster on a MacBook Pro vs. a D-machine. - Performance Side Effects: - Broken Demos: Demos like Towers of Hanoi run too fast to be useful. - Debugger Failure: The debugger's error-delay mechanism (set in milliseconds) is too short for modern CPUs, causing it to fail. - Secondary Goal: Kabir will document his learning process to identify gaps and improve the Medley primer. Next Steps - Ryan: Containerize the DOS port using Docker for online deployment. - Ron & Bill: Revise the draft report's sections on fonts, encoding, anti-edit, and credits. - Kabir: Begin porting and running the Richard Gabriel benchmarks. - All: Finalize the draft report for a tentative release next week.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly January 07, 2026  •  19 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Containerize Medley DOS (VGA-only) for online use Ryan Burnside Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Sync on Medley development, DOS porting, and new intern onboarding. Key Takeaways DOS Port Containerization: Prioritized for immediate online deployment (via Docker) over fixing the VESA graphics bug. T-Edit Line Numbering: Not natively supported; a t-edit-line-numbering user package exists as a possible workaround. New Intern: Kabir Gupta will port and run Richard Gabriel's benchmarks to quantify Medley's performance gains on modern hardware. Performance Impact: Modern CPUs cause demos (e.g., Towers of Hanoi) to run too fast and break time-sensitive features, like the debugger's error-delay mechanism. Topics DOS Port & Containerization Ryan tested Medley's DOS port on various environments: Microsoft DOS: Ran okay. DOSBox-X: Ran fine. FreeDOS: Crashed on graphics window initialization. VESA Graphics Bug: Using the VESA 102 flag causes screen artifacts (top of window) when dragging boxes. Decision: Containerize the current VGA-resolution port for immediate online deployment via Docker. Fixing the VESA bug is deferred to get the system into users' hands faster. T-Edit Line Numbering Paolo asked if T-Edit can programmatically access a document by line number. Ron explained why this is not a native feature: Ambiguous "Line": A line's visual position depends on window width and justification, not just hard breaks. Performance Cost: Real-time line number updates after every edit would be expensive. Workaround: A t-edit-line-numbering user package exists, though its functionality is unverified. New Intern & Performance Benchmarking Kabir Gupta (U. of Alberta CS) joins as an intern. Project: Port and run Richard Gabriel's benchmarks to quantify Medley's performance gains on modern hardware. Initial Test (SeaTac Benchmark): ~1,000x faster on a MacBook Pro vs. a D-machine. Performance Side Effects: Broken Demos: Demos like Towers of Hanoi run too fast to be useful. Debugger Failure: The debugger's error-delay mechanism (set in milliseconds) is too short for modern CPUs, causing it to fail. Secondary Goal: Kabir will document his learning process to identify gaps and improve the Medley primer. Next Steps Ryan: Containerize the DOS port using Docker for online deployment. Ron & Bill: Revise the draft report's sections on fonts, encoding, anti-edit, and credits. Kabir: Begin porting and running the Richard Gabriel benchmarks. All: Finalize the draft report for a tentative release next week.

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Meeting Purpose Review PRs, sync on project status, and resolve key technical issues. Key Takeaways - Hardcopy PR Blocked: The hardcopy PR is blocked by a Unix filename conversion bug. The long-term plan is to replace the external ps2pdf dependency with a native PDF generator to improve reliability and portability. - PR Backlog Cleared: The team reviewed and closed several old draft PRs (e.g., 23-03-2K-Viles, Unpacked Tops 20), clearing the backlog to focus on active work. - New Interlisp File Viewer: Paolo demoed ILC, a new Interlisp file viewer built with Klim on SBCL that provides modern features like mouse-sensitive text and custom syntax highlighting. - Zotero Attachment Policy: The team will resolve the policy for publicly accessible Zotero attachments, which are currently blocked by Zotero's security settings. Topics Hardcopy PR & PDF Generation - Problem: The hardcopy PR is failing due to a bug in converting Medley file paths to Unix filenames for the external ps2pdf utility. - Immediate Fix: Ron will simplify the logic by using the Unix /tmp directory for all intermediate files, avoiding complex path conversions and the slow NoDeerCore filesystem. - Long-Term Solution: Replace the ps2pdf dependency with a native PDF generator written in Lisp. - Rationale: Improves portability (e.g., to Haiku, phones) and reliability by removing the OS-specific dependency. - Feasibility: Matt confirmed this is possible, likely by modifying the existing PostScript driver. - Resource: The CLPDF package was noted as a potential reference. PR Backlog Review - #1527 - send a copyright property on file aid: - Decision: Keep open. The team will define a new copyright/licensing strategy, including a standardized notice (copyright, interlisp.org, and others as marked) and moving license text to the repo's LICENSE file. - #1556 - initial work, adding support for Japanese clips: - Decision: Close. The work is superseded by the planned native PDF driver. - #2056 - move unused files to obsolete: - Decision: Revise. The policy is to move files only after verifying they are truly unused, not just missing from the loadup. Some files (e.g., s-edit-debug) should be moved to an internal directory instead of obsolete. - #23-03-2K-Viles: - Decision: Close PR, keep branch. This is a large, unfinished project to recompile the entire system. It will be added to the project list for future work. - Unpacked Tops 20: - Decision: Delete PR. The current implementation is flaky and will be rewritten to read filenames backward for more deterministic parsing. Project Updates - Annual Report: The report is ready for review. Frank will provide input this afternoon. - Museum Mode: Frank will finish resolving issues with museum mode before returning to the IRM project. - Ethernet Startup: Larry is finalizing the Ethernet startup sequence to prevent prompts for a PUP host number, which would break automated builds. - T-Edit Mouse Selection: Ron is fixing a bug where T-Edit loses the state of the secondary selection when the mouse leaves the window. - ILC (Interlisp File Viewer): Paolo demoed ILC, a new viewer built with Klim on SBCL. - Features: Custom syntax highlighting (e.g., bold function names, italic comments), mouse-sensitive text for re-executing commands, and character substitutions (e.g., <-). - Future Work: Add a file browser pane and search functionality. - Zotero & Documentation: - Problem: Public Zotero libraries block direct links to attached files for security, preventing public access to documents referenced in the bibliography. - Decision: The team must resolve this policy to make all referenced documents publicly accessible. - Idea: Matt proposed a kerning data editor to generate metric kerning information for fonts. Next Steps - Ron: - Fix the hardcopy PR by using /tmp for intermediate files. - Change the hardcopy printer type name from Window to Viewer. - Add inode_high and inode_low to the Lisp side of getfileinfo for reliable file comparison. - Add a sort flag to the calls function to support both deterministic (unsorted) and comparison-friendly (sorted) output. - Larry: - Close PRs 1556, 23-03-2K-Viles, and Unpacked Tops 20. - Matt: - Review the abbreviation PR. - Herb: - Continue work on the HTML stream. - Team: - Define a policy for making Zotero attachments publicly accessible. - Revise PR 2056 to move files to internal or obsolete based on a stricter "unused" criteria. - Add "recompile the whole system" to the project list.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly January 12, 2026  •  193 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Review and update annual report draft Frank Halasz Fix T-Edit page-header/PS2PDF conflict Ron Kaplan Add Lisp-side inode_high/low; then implement same-file check Larry Masinter-lisp Clean up PS/PDF temp-file handling; use /tmp; return Unix path Ron Kaplan Review abbreviation PR Larry Masinter-lisp Add sort-calls option to compiled-code calls; keep unsorted default Ron Kaplan Update hardcopy PR: rename 'Window' to 'Viewer'; add Clipboard; fix bitmap error Ron Kaplan Close PR 23-03 2K-Viles w/ comment linking to compile-all project Frank Halasz Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review PRs, sync on project status, and resolve key technical issues. Key Takeaways Hardcopy PR Blocked: The hardcopy PR is blocked by a Unix filename conversion bug. The long-term plan is to replace the external ps2pdf dependency with a native PDF generator to improve reliability and portability. PR Backlog Cleared: The team reviewed and closed several old draft PRs (e.g., 23-03-2K-Viles, Unpacked Tops 20), clearing the backlog to focus on active work. New Interlisp File Viewer: Paolo demoed ILC, a new Interlisp file viewer built with Klim on SBCL that provides modern features like mouse-sensitive text and custom syntax highlighting. Zotero Attachment Policy: The team will resolve the policy for publicly accessible Zotero attachments, which are currently blocked by Zotero's security settings. Topics Hardcopy PR & PDF Generation Problem: The hardcopy PR is failing due to a bug in converting Medley file paths to Unix filenames for the external ps2pdf utility. Immediate Fix: Ron will simplify the logic by using the Unix /tmp directory for all intermediate files, avoiding complex path conversions and the slow NoDeerCore filesystem. Long-Term Solution: Replace the ps2pdf dependency with a native PDF generator written in Lisp. Rationale: Improves portability (e.g., to Haiku, phones) and reliability by removing the OS-specific dependency. Feasibility: Matt confirmed this is possible, likely by modifying the existing PostScript driver. Resource: The CLPDF package was noted as a potential reference. PR Backlog Review #1527 - send a copyright property on file aid: Decision: Keep open. The team will define a new copyright/licensing strategy, including a standardized notice (copyright, interlisp.org, and others as marked) and moving license text to the repo's LICENSE file. #1556 - initial work, adding support for Japanese clips: Decision: Close. The work is superseded by the planned native PDF driver. #2056 - move unused files to obsolete: Decision: Revise. The policy is to move files only after verifying they are truly unused, not just missing from the loadup. Some files (e.g., s-edit-debug) should be moved to an internal directory instead of obsolete. #23-03-2K-Viles: Decision: Close PR, keep branch. This is a large, unfinished project to recompile the entire system. It will be added to the project list for future work. Unpacked Tops 20: Decision: Delete PR. The current implementation is flaky and will be rewritten to read filenames backward for more deterministic parsing. Project Updates Annual Report: The report is ready for review. Frank will provide input this afternoon. Museum Mode: Frank will finish resolving issues with museum mode before returning to the IRM project. Ethernet Startup: Larry is finalizing the Ethernet startup sequence to prevent prompts for a PUP host number, which would break automated builds. T-Edit Mouse Selection: Ron is fixing a bug where T-Edit loses the state of the secondary selection when the mouse leaves the window. ILC (Interlisp File Viewer): Paolo demoed ILC, a new viewer built with Klim on SBCL. Features: Custom syntax highlighting (e.g., bold function names, italic comments), mouse-sensitive text for re-executing commands, and character substitutions (e.g., <-). Future Work: Add a file browser pane and search functionality. Zotero & Documentation: Problem: Public Zotero libraries block direct links to attached files for security, preventing public access to documents referenced in the bibliography. Decision: The team must resolve this policy to make all referenced documents publicly accessible. Idea: Matt proposed a kerning data editor to generate metric kerning information for fonts. Next Steps Ron: Fix the hardcopy PR by using /tmp for intermediate files. Change the hardcopy printer type name from Window to Viewer. Add inode_high and inode_low to the Lisp side of getfileinfo for reliable file comparison. Add a sort flag to the calls function to support both deterministic (unsorted) and comparison-friendly (sorted) output. Larry: Close PRs 1556, 23-03-2K-Viles, and Unpacked Tops 20. Matt: Review the abbreviation PR. Herb: Continue work on the HTML stream. Team: Define a policy for making Zotero attachments publicly accessible. Revise PR 2056 to move files to internal or obsolete based on a stricter "unused" criteria. Add "recompile the whole system" to the project list.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Finalize the annual report and review project status. Key Takeaways - Annual Report Finalized: The report will omit T-Edit's color infrastructure to avoid overstating user-facing progress and will add a section on the Medley Character Code Schema (MCCS) to highlight a key independence milestone. - University Course Success: Ethan Blanton's course at Buffalo University successfully used Medley for hands-on projects, validating the project's goal of enabling formal education. - Hard Copy Refactor: Ron refactored the hard copy system to fix Unix temp file naming issues and race conditions, simplifying the code by removing no-deer core usage. - GitHub Permissions Bug: A bug prevents assigning issues to team members who haven't commented on them, hindering workflow. Larry will investigate and clean up the organization's member list. Topics Annual Report Finalization - T-Edit Color Support: The section on T-Edit's color support will be removed. - Rationale: The work is foundational infrastructure, not a user-facing feature. Including it risks creating false expectations, as users still cannot edit text in color. - Medley Character Code Schema (MCCS): A section will be added to highlight MCCS as a key innovation. - Rationale: MCCS represents a significant step toward Medley's independence from Xerox's proprietary character encoding. - Copy Editing: Herb will perform the final copy edit after Frank's revisions. - Publication Plan: 1. Frank revises the Google Doc. 2. Herb copy edits and adds MCCS text. 3. Paolo creates a PR to publish the report to the website. 4. Paolo announces the release on social media. - Hugo Page Weights: Paolo will confirm the correct weight value with Bill to ensure the 2025 report appears at the top of the sidebar. University Course & Educational Strategy - Ethan Blanton's course at Buffalo University (Squeak, Medley, GeForce) successfully used Medley for hands-on projects. - Significance: This is the first known university course to use Medley for practical lab work, not just as a historical topic. - Strategic Direction: The project's primary goal is to make Medley accessible for education and historical preservation (e.g., museum mode), not necessarily for widespread commercial use. - Action: Paolo will create a GitHub issue to track writing a formal write-up on this educational success. Project Status Updates - Ron (Hard Copy System): - Refactored the system to fix Unix temp file naming issues and race conditions. - Simplified the code by removing all no-deer core usage for temp files. - Known Issue: The VNC viewer bug (external viewer takes over the desktop) is not fixable within Medley. - Herb (HTML Stream Fonts): - Rebasing HTML Stream's font handling on Ron's new generic font mechanism. - Goal: Use Medley's native font metrics loading, eliminating the need for a custom font format. - Matt (GitHub Permissions): - Reported a bug preventing issue assignment to team members who haven't commented on the issue. - Example: Issue #2427 ("Webup-x fails without clearing the interlock") could not be assigned to Frank. - Action: Larry will investigate and clean up the organization's member list. - Paolo: - Polishing the Interlisp file viewer code for publication. - Noted that Quintus Prologue requires custom microcode and cannot run on current Medley. Next Steps - Frank: Revise the annual report Google Doc. - Herb: Copy edit the annual report and add the MCCS section; notify Paolo when complete. - Paolo: Confirm Hugo page weight with Bill; create a GitHub issue for the educational write-up; publish the annual report PR on Friday. - Larry: Investigate and clean up the GitHub organization member list.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly January 14, 2026  •  81 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Add MCCS mention to annual report; copy-edit; notify Paolo to submit PR and post LispCore note Herb Jellinek Tag Bill in Hugo weights issue re: annual report page order Paolo Amoroso Add Computer Chronicles 1984 AI episode to bibliography Paolo Amoroso Open issue re: write-up on Museum Mode, Interim Computer Museum, Ethan Blanton course, Primer Paolo Amoroso Delete TN draft Matt Heffron Test hardcopy/temp-file workflow across interfaces; report issues to Ron Paolo Amoroso Email Ron re: hardcopy/temp-file questions Herb Jellinek Fix GitHub permissions: add Ryan as reviewer; ensure assignees work Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Finalize the annual report and review project status. Key Takeaways Annual Report Finalized: The report will omit T-Edit's color infrastructure to avoid overstating user-facing progress and will add a section on the Medley Character Code Schema (MCCS) to highlight a key independence milestone. University Course Success: Ethan Blanton's course at Buffalo University successfully used Medley for hands-on projects, validating the project's goal of enabling formal education. Hard Copy Refactor: Ron refactored the hard copy system to fix Unix temp file naming issues and race conditions, simplifying the code by removing no-deer core usage. GitHub Permissions Bug: A bug prevents assigning issues to team members who haven't commented on them, hindering workflow. Larry will investigate and clean up the organization's member list. Topics Annual Report Finalization T-Edit Color Support: The section on T-Edit's color support will be removed. Rationale: The work is foundational infrastructure, not a user-facing feature. Including it risks creating false expectations, as users still cannot edit text in color. Medley Character Code Schema (MCCS): A section will be added to highlight MCCS as a key innovation. Rationale: MCCS represents a significant step toward Medley's independence from Xerox's proprietary character encoding. Copy Editing: Herb will perform the final copy edit after Frank's revisions. Publication Plan: Frank revises the Google Doc. Herb copy edits and adds MCCS text. Paolo creates a PR to publish the report to the website. Paolo announces the release on social media. Hugo Page Weights: Paolo will confirm the correct weight value with Bill to ensure the 2025 report appears at the top of the sidebar. University Course & Educational Strategy Ethan Blanton's course at Buffalo University (Squeak, Medley, GeForce) successfully used Medley for hands-on projects. Significance: This is the first known university course to use Medley for practical lab work, not just as a historical topic. Strategic Direction: The project's primary goal is to make Medley accessible for education and historical preservation (e.g., museum mode), not necessarily for widespread commercial use. Action: Paolo will create a GitHub issue to track writing a formal write-up on this educational success. Project Status Updates Ron (Hard Copy System): Refactored the system to fix Unix temp file naming issues and race conditions. Simplified the code by removing all no-deer core usage for temp files. Known Issue: The VNC viewer bug (external viewer takes over the desktop) is not fixable within Medley. Herb (HTML Stream Fonts): Rebasing HTML Stream's font handling on Ron's new generic font mechanism. Goal: Use Medley's native font metrics loading, eliminating the need for a custom font format. Matt (GitHub Permissions): Reported a bug preventing issue assignment to team members who haven't commented on the issue. Example: Issue #2427 ("Webup-x fails without clearing the interlock") could not be assigned to Frank. Action: Larry will investigate and clean up the organization's member list. Paolo: Polishing the Interlisp file viewer code for publication. Noted that Quintus Prologue requires custom microcode and cannot run on current Medley. Next Steps Frank: Revise the annual report Google Doc. Herb: Copy edit the annual report and add the MCCS section; notify Paolo when complete. Paolo: Confirm Hugo page weight with Bill; create a GitHub issue for the educational write-up; publish the annual report PR on Friday. Larry: Investigate and clean up the GitHub organization member list.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways - Printing System Overhaul: The LPT device's ambiguous @ parsing (fax vs. hostname) and flawed file extension handling (e.g., opening PDFs in a text editor) require a fix to correctly route jobs. - IRM Manual Reconstruction: The Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) is being rebuilt in T-Edit to fix its broken Table of Contents (ToC) and enable future updates, starting with the outdated break package docs. - Font Generation Bug: A repeatable crash during font generation is suspected to be a file descriptor leak, not a VM issue, and will be investigated with lsof and OpenP. - hcfiles Underscore Fix: hcfiles will be fixed by explicitly setting the external-format to UTF-8 when writing index.html, resolving corrupted underscores. Topics Printing System Issues - The LPT device's logic is causing two main problems: - Ambiguous @ Parsing: The system incorrectly assumes any @ in a printer name signifies a fax address, breaking printing to modern network hosts (e.g., printer.local). - Flawed File Extension Handling: When copying a file to LPT Viewer, the temporary file lacks the correct extension (e.g., .pdf), causing the OS to open it in a text editor instead of the intended viewer. - Proposed Fixes: - Fax Logic: Stricter validation in FaxHostnameP will prevent misidentification. If DefaultFaxHost is nil, faxing is disabled. - File Extensions: The open function will be fixed to correctly assign extensions to temporary files, ensuring proper OS routing. - Future Cleanup: The team will consider deprecating or isolating the fax functionality from the core LPT device. IRM Manual Reconstruction - The Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) is being rebuilt to fix its broken Table of Contents (ToC). - Root Cause: Inconsistent source file encodings and a shift from a "tech-like" language to direct T-Edit authoring. - Reconstruction Plan: 1. Standardize Source: Manually re-encode all IRM files in T-Edit. 2. Automate ToC: Build a new mechanism to generate the ToC from a manifest, removing hardcoded chapter numbers to enable flexible reorganization. 3. Update Content: Integrate changes from release notes, starting with the outdated break package documentation. Font Generation Bug - A repeatable crash occurs during font generation, halting after ~16-30 fonts. - Process: A loop calls complete-font for 4 faces x 30 sizes, reading metrics from files. - Investigation: - VM: The VM meter remains stable at 12%, ruling out a simple storage issue. - Hypothesis: A file descriptor leak is suspected. - Action: Herb will use lsof and OpenP to check for unclosed files when the crash occurs. hcfiles Underscore Corruption - File names with underscores are corrupted in the index.html file generated by hcfiles. - Root Cause: The file is opened without an explicit external-format, causing it to default to MCCS instead of UTF-8. - Solution: Explicitly set the external-format to UTF-8 in the open call to ensure correct character encoding. XBM Reader Project - An XBM (X BitMap) reader/writer was proposed as a project for Kabir. - Rationale: XBM is a simple, 1-bit-per-pixel format, making it a good first project to learn the Medley environment. - Implementation Note: The reader must account for Medley's bottom-up bitmap coordinate system. Next Steps - Herb: Investigate the font generation crash using lsof and OpenP. - Frank: Continue IRM manual reconstruction. - Larry: Fix hcfiles underscore corruption by setting the external-format to UTF-8. - Ron: - Implement the stricter FaxHostnameP logic in NSPrint. - Fix the LPT Viewer extension-handling bug. - Push the updated LPT device code. - Paolo: Re-test the online.openwebfile crash with the latest online repo commit.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly January 19, 2026  •  89 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways Printing System Overhaul: The LPT device's ambiguous @ parsing (fax vs. hostname) and flawed file extension handling (e.g., opening PDFs in a text editor) require a fix to correctly route jobs. IRM Manual Reconstruction: The Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) is being rebuilt in T-Edit to fix its broken Table of Contents (ToC) and enable future updates, starting with the outdated break package docs. Font Generation Bug: A repeatable crash during font generation is suspected to be a file descriptor leak, not a VM issue, and will be investigated with lsof and OpenP. hcfiles Underscore Fix: hcfiles will be fixed by explicitly setting the external-format to UTF-8 when writing index.html, resolving corrupted underscores. Topics Printing System Issues The LPT device's logic is causing two main problems: Ambiguous @ Parsing: The system incorrectly assumes any @ in a printer name signifies a fax address, breaking printing to modern network hosts (e.g., printer.local). Flawed File Extension Handling: When copying a file to LPT Viewer, the temporary file lacks the correct extension (e.g., .pdf), causing the OS to open it in a text editor instead of the intended viewer. Proposed Fixes: Fax Logic: Stricter validation in FaxHostnameP will prevent misidentification. If DefaultFaxHost is nil, faxing is disabled. File Extensions: The open function will be fixed to correctly assign extensions to temporary files, ensuring proper OS routing. Future Cleanup: The team will consider deprecating or isolating the fax functionality from the core LPT device. IRM Manual Reconstruction The Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) is being rebuilt to fix its broken Table of Contents (ToC). Root Cause: Inconsistent source file encodings and a shift from a "tech-like" language to direct T-Edit authoring. Reconstruction Plan: Standardize Source: Manually re-encode all IRM files in T-Edit. Automate ToC: Build a new mechanism to generate the ToC from a manifest, removing hardcoded chapter numbers to enable flexible reorganization. Update Content: Integrate changes from release notes, starting with the outdated break package documentation. Font Generation Bug A repeatable crash occurs during font generation, halting after ~16-30 fonts. Process: A loop calls complete-font for 4 faces x 30 sizes, reading metrics from files. Investigation: VM: The VM meter remains stable at 12%, ruling out a simple storage issue. Hypothesis: A file descriptor leak is suspected. Action: Herb will use lsof and OpenP to check for unclosed files when the crash occurs. hcfiles Underscore Corruption File names with underscores are corrupted in the index.html file generated by hcfiles. Root Cause: The file is opened without an explicit external-format, causing it to default to MCCS instead of UTF-8. Solution: Explicitly set the external-format to UTF-8 in the open call to ensure correct character encoding. XBM Reader Project An XBM (X BitMap) reader/writer was proposed as a project for Kabir. Rationale: XBM is a simple, 1-bit-per-pixel format, making it a good first project to learn the Medley environment. Implementation Note: The reader must account for Medley's bottom-up bitmap coordinate system. Next Steps Herb: Investigate the font generation crash using lsof and OpenP. Frank: Continue IRM manual reconstruction. Larry: Fix hcfiles underscore corruption by setting the external-format to UTF-8. Ron: Implement the stricter FaxHostnameP logic in NSPrint. Fix the LPT Viewer extension-handling bug. Push the updated LPT device code. Paolo: Re-test the online.openwebfile crash with the latest online repo commit. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Sync on project status, documentation, and technical issues. Key Takeaways - New Maintainer Primer: A primer for developers (BlizzCore) is needed to document build processes (e.g., Maiko debug) and conventions (e.g., branch naming), preventing repeated onboarding effort. - T-Edit/Sketch Manuals: The T-Edit and Sketch manuals will be published immediately as PDFs in the source tree (Library/T-Edit/Docs), resolving a public access issue and enabling future OCR-based editing. - Dribble File Format: GetFileInfo will be extended to auto-detect external formats by file extension. A performance test will compare MCCS vs. UTF-8 for .dribble files to inform the default format decision. - Hard Copy Merge: The hard copy feature is targeted for a Monday merge. The team will test for final edge cases, acknowledging that minor issues can be fixed post-merge. Topics New Maintainer Primer - Problem: New maintainers (BlizzCore) lack a guide for developer-specific tasks, leading to confusion (e.g., finding the makefile) and repeated onboarding effort. - Solution: Create a primer distinct from the user tutorial. - Content: - Build processes (e.g., Maiko debug) - Common practices (e.g., branch naming conventions) - Common pitfalls (e.g., not loading sysedit before saving) - Ownership: An Alberto student project could provide a valuable "newcomer" perspective. T-Edit & Sketch Manuals - Problem: T-Edit and Sketch manuals are inaccessible in a private Google Drive, blocking public discovery and use. - Decision: Publish the current scanned PDFs immediately. - Rationale: Immediate access is more valuable than waiting for a perfect, merged version. - Location: Place PDFs directly in the source tree (e.g., Library/T-Edit/Docs). - Future Work (OCR & Editing): - Experiment: Test modern OCR (e.g., Acrobat Pro) on the PDFs to gauge text recovery quality. - Goal: Convert OCR output to editable T-Edit files with IRM markup, enabling future updates. - Risk: The T-Edit programmer's interface exposes internal data structures that are now obsolete and can cause GC issues. This will be addressed with guidance for advanced users. Medley README Update - Problem: The main repo's README.md is outdated (3 years), contains obsolete info (e.g., run-medley script), and uses jargon (load up, seize out). - Solution: Refocus the README for developers, deferring user-facing info to the website. - Content: - Brief project intro for users arriving directly from GitHub. - Links to the website for installation/running instructions. - Links to the glossary for jargon. Dribble File Format - Problem: Dribble files lack a consistent external format, causing issues when viewed outside Medley (e.g., wrong characters). - Proposal: Extend GetFileInfo to auto-detect external formats based on file extension. - Mechanism: A mapping (e.g., .dribble → UTF-8) would be stored in GetFileInfo, removing the need for users to specify the format on open. - Performance Test: Compare MCCS vs. UTF-8 performance during a full load-up. - Hypothesis: The conversion overhead is negligible compared to total load-up time (90-95s on a modern PC). - Rationale: If the overhead is low, UTF-8 is the preferred default for its cross-platform legibility. Hard Copy (HC Files) Status - Merge Target: Monday. - Known Issues: - Lisp Source Formatting (Issue #2298): pretty-file-index incorrectly applies bold/italic formatting to Lisp source code in PDFs. - Error Reporting: Herb's HTML-FILES function provides superior error reporting (using unwind-protect) compared to the current HC-FILES, which silently skips problematic files. This improvement will be integrated after the merge. - Font Directory Structure (for Herb): - Rationale: Sketch and other tools query FONTS-AVAILABLE to discover font sizes. - Guidance: Create all possible Medley font files (e.g., "Helvetica 10") for Noto fonts to ensure these queries succeed. - Structure: Use separate subdirectories for imported source files and generated Medley fonts to manage the build pipeline. Next Steps - Larry: - Share the annual report on Reddit. - Copy T-Edit and Sketch PDFs to the source tree and create a PR. - Extend GetFileInfo to map file extensions to external formats. - Paolo: - Create a GitHub issue to track README.md updates. - Herb: - Extract the HTML-FILES function from HTML-STREAM-TEST and share with Larry. - Begin generating Medley font files from Noto fonts. - Ron: - Investigate and fix the Lisp source formatting bug (#2298). - Frank: - Investigate and fix the failed online load-up. - All: - Test the hard copy feature for final edge cases before the Monday merge.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly January 21, 2026  •  85 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Sync on project status, documentation, and technical issues. Key Takeaways New Maintainer Primer: A primer for developers (BlizzCore) is needed to document build processes (e.g., Maiko debug) and conventions (e.g., branch naming), preventing repeated onboarding effort. T-Edit/Sketch Manuals: The T-Edit and Sketch manuals will be published immediately as PDFs in the source tree (Library/T-Edit/Docs), resolving a public access issue and enabling future OCR-based editing. Dribble File Format: GetFileInfo will be extended to auto-detect external formats by file extension. A performance test will compare MCCS vs. UTF-8 for .dribble files to inform the default format decision. Hard Copy Merge: The hard copy feature is targeted for a Monday merge. The team will test for final edge cases, acknowledging that minor issues can be fixed post-merge. Topics New Maintainer Primer Problem: New maintainers (BlizzCore) lack a guide for developer-specific tasks, leading to confusion (e.g., finding the makefile) and repeated onboarding effort. Solution: Create a primer distinct from the user tutorial. Content: Build processes (e.g., Maiko debug) Common practices (e.g., branch naming conventions) Common pitfalls (e.g., not loading sysedit before saving) Ownership: An Alberto student project could provide a valuable "newcomer" perspective. T-Edit & Sketch Manuals Problem: T-Edit and Sketch manuals are inaccessible in a private Google Drive, blocking public discovery and use. Decision: Publish the current scanned PDFs immediately. Rationale: Immediate access is more valuable than waiting for a perfect, merged version. Location: Place PDFs directly in the source tree (e.g., Library/T-Edit/Docs). Future Work (OCR & Editing): Experiment: Test modern OCR (e.g., Acrobat Pro) on the PDFs to gauge text recovery quality. Goal: Convert OCR output to editable T-Edit files with IRM markup, enabling future updates. Risk: The T-Edit programmer's interface exposes internal data structures that are now obsolete and can cause GC issues. This will be addressed with guidance for advanced users. Medley README Update Problem: The main repo's README.md is outdated (3 years), contains obsolete info (e.g., run-medley script), and uses jargon (load up, seize out). Solution: Refocus the README for developers, deferring user-facing info to the website. Content: Brief project intro for users arriving directly from GitHub. Links to the website for installation/running instructions. Links to the glossary for jargon. Dribble File Format Problem: Dribble files lack a consistent external format, causing issues when viewed outside Medley (e.g., wrong characters). Proposal: Extend GetFileInfo to auto-detect external formats based on file extension. Mechanism: A mapping (e.g., .dribble → UTF-8) would be stored in GetFileInfo, removing the need for users to specify the format on open. Performance Test: Compare MCCS vs. UTF-8 performance during a full load-up. Hypothesis: The conversion overhead is negligible compared to total load-up time (90-95s on a modern PC). Rationale: If the overhead is low, UTF-8 is the preferred default for its cross-platform legibility. Hard Copy (HC Files) Status Merge Target: Monday. Known Issues: Lisp Source Formatting (Issue #2298): pretty-file-index incorrectly applies bold/italic formatting to Lisp source code in PDFs. Error Reporting: Herb's HTML-FILES function provides superior error reporting (using unwind-protect) compared to the current HC-FILES, which silently skips problematic files. This improvement will be integrated after the merge. Font Directory Structure (for Herb): Rationale: Sketch and other tools query FONTS-AVAILABLE to discover font sizes. Guidance: Create all possible Medley font files (e.g., "Helvetica 10") for Noto fonts to ensure these queries succeed. Structure: Use separate subdirectories for imported source files and generated Medley fonts to manage the build pipeline. Next Steps Larry: Share the annual report on Reddit. Copy T-Edit and Sketch PDFs to the source tree and create a PR. Extend GetFileInfo to map file extensions to external formats. Paolo: Create a GitHub issue to track README.md updates. Herb: Extract the HTML-FILES function from HTML-STREAM-TEST and share with Larry. Begin generating Medley font files from Noto fonts. Ron: Investigate and fix the Lisp source formatting bug (#2298). Frank: Investigate and fix the failed online load-up. All: Test the hard copy feature for final edge cases before the Monday merge. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review Medley Interlisp development progress and resolve key technical issues. Key Takeaways - Ethernet PR #2290 is ready for merge. It disables PUP/Clearinghouse lookups by default, preventing network errors. Ron will test removing local workarounds (move to leaf device & parse.ns name advice) to validate the fix. - Mouse scroll behavior is inconsistent. Trackpads scroll horizontally/vertically based on movement direction, while a wheel mouse requires the Shift key for horizontal scroll. This is a critical bug, as Shift should be reserved for selection. - pretty-file-index fails on CLTL2 files. The tool errors on package qualifiers (e.g., CL:SYMBOL) because it attempts a full read, not just a syntax parse. A proposed fix is to disable the colon read macro during indexing. - The Hardcopy menu is broken. It has duplicate items, incorrect fonts, and settings that don't persist. This is blocking Ron's work on duplex printing and requires a fix before the feature can be merged. Topics Ethernet & Networking - PR #2290 (Lisp-side changes) is ready for review. - Goal: Disable PUP/Clearinghouse lookups by default to prevent network errors when Ethernet is unavailable. - Impact: Running with the standard Mako build will now behave as if Ethernet is explicitly off. - Ron's Local Workarounds: - Ron added two local workarounds to his setup to suppress network activity: 1. move to leaf device P, of nil to leaf device P 2. Advice on parse.ns name to return nil - Action: Ron will remove these to test if PR #2290 resolves the underlying issue. - Mako-side Ethernet Changes: - Nick is reorganizing the Mako-side Ethernet code. - Testing: Must confirm the changes don't break Dodo (XNS) or Solaris interfaces (PCAP/Streams). - Clearinghouse Emulation: - The new raw Ethernet stack does not support Dodo, as it talks directly to the hardware. - Need: A Clearinghouse emulation is required to run applications like NoteCards. - Path Forward: A small mapper could be written to inject packets into Dodo, or the existing NoteCards server code could be leveraged. Input & Character Handling - Problem: Mouse scroll behavior is inconsistent between trackpads and wheel mice. - Trackpad: Scrolls horizontally/vertically based on movement direction, independent of the Shift key. - Wheel Mouse: Requires the Shift key to scroll horizontally. - Bug: The Shift key should be reserved for selection, not for changing scroll direction. - Root Cause: The system uses a single channel for keyboard and mouse events, causing conflicts. - Action: Larry will investigate the different key codes generated by trackpads vs. wheel mice. Hardcopy & Printing - Problem: The Hardcopy menu is broken. - Issues: - Duplicate "Starting Page Number" items. - Incorrect fonts. - Settings (e.g., page number) that don't persist after applying. - Impact: This bug is blocking Ron's work on the duplex printing feature. - Problem: Postscript files with headings fail ps2pdf conversion. - Root Cause: The Postscript stream generated by Start Page contains a comment (% here we handle headings) that ps2pdf rejects. - Action: Ron will investigate the edit history of Start Page to find the source of the issue. - Problem: Reporting hardcopy status messages (e.g., "5 pages printed") is undefined. - Dilemma: Should the generic hardcopy code print the message, or should it pass a display stream to the individual converters? - Decision: The duplex feature can be merged with this known issue and fixed later. Documentation & Tooling - pretty-file-index Errors: - Problem: The tool fails on files using CLTL2 package qualifiers (e.g., CL:SYMBOL) because it attempts a full read, not just a syntax parse. - Proposed Fix: Disable the colon read macro during indexing. This would treat CL:SYMBOL as a single atom, preserving the source string. - T-Edit Window Defaults: - Problem: New T-Edit windows default to a tiny 200x100 pixel size, which is unusable. - Proposed Fix: Default to a more practical size (e.g., 80 chars wide, 10 lines high) based on the default font. - Museum Mode: - Status: Complete and documented. - Next Step: Create demos using the feature. - Noto Web Fonts: - Status: Herb fixed a bug where a font was being coerced to a non-existent web font. The table-driven code was easily extended to generate the missing font. - Student Mentorship (Kabir): - Herb is mentoring an undergraduate student on Lisp. - Action: Larry needs to approve the proposed milestones for the student. Next Steps - Ron: - Test PR #2290 by removing local network workarounds. - Fix the Hardcopy menu bugs (duplicate items, non-persistent settings). - Investigate the ps2pdf failure caused by the Postscript heading comment. - Larry: - Investigate the mouse scroll inconsistency (trackpad vs. wheel mouse). - Approve the proposed milestones for student Kabir. - Nick: - Complete Mako-side Ethernet changes and test Dodo/Solaris compatibility. - Paolo: - Share the annual report on Reddit. - Team: - Review and approve PR #2290 for merge.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly January 26, 2026  •  70 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review Medley Interlisp development progress and resolve key technical issues. Key Takeaways Ethernet PR #2290 is ready for merge. It disables PUP/Clearinghouse lookups by default, preventing network errors. Ron will test removing local workarounds (move to leaf device & parse.ns name advice) to validate the fix. Mouse scroll behavior is inconsistent. Trackpads scroll horizontally/vertically based on movement direction, while a wheel mouse requires the Shift key for horizontal scroll. This is a critical bug, as Shift should be reserved for selection. pretty-file-index fails on CLTL2 files. The tool errors on package qualifiers (e.g., CL:SYMBOL) because it attempts a full read, not just a syntax parse. A proposed fix is to disable the colon read macro during indexing. The Hardcopy menu is broken. It has duplicate items, incorrect fonts, and settings that don't persist. This is blocking Ron's work on duplex printing and requires a fix before the feature can be merged. Topics Ethernet & Networking PR #2290 (Lisp-side changes) is ready for review. Goal: Disable PUP/Clearinghouse lookups by default to prevent network errors when Ethernet is unavailable. Impact: Running with the standard Mako build will now behave as if Ethernet is explicitly off. Ron's Local Workarounds: Ron added two local workarounds to his setup to suppress network activity: move to leaf device P, of nil to leaf device P Advice on parse.ns name to return nil Action: Ron will remove these to test if PR #2290 resolves the underlying issue. Mako-side Ethernet Changes: Nick is reorganizing the Mako-side Ethernet code. Testing: Must confirm the changes don't break Dodo (XNS) or Solaris interfaces (PCAP/Streams). Clearinghouse Emulation: The new raw Ethernet stack does not support Dodo, as it talks directly to the hardware. Need: A Clearinghouse emulation is required to run applications like NoteCards. Path Forward: A small mapper could be written to inject packets into Dodo, or the existing NoteCards server code could be leveraged. Input & Character Handling Problem: Mouse scroll behavior is inconsistent between trackpads and wheel mice. Trackpad: Scrolls horizontally/vertically based on movement direction, independent of the Shift key. Wheel Mouse: Requires the Shift key to scroll horizontally. Bug: The Shift key should be reserved for selection, not for changing scroll direction. Root Cause: The system uses a single channel for keyboard and mouse events, causing conflicts. Action: Larry will investigate the different key codes generated by trackpads vs. wheel mice. Hardcopy & Printing Problem: The Hardcopy menu is broken. Issues: Duplicate "Starting Page Number" items. Incorrect fonts. Settings (e.g., page number) that don't persist after applying. Impact: This bug is blocking Ron's work on the duplex printing feature. Problem: Postscript files with headings fail ps2pdf conversion. Root Cause: The Postscript stream generated by Start Page contains a comment (% here we handle headings) that ps2pdf rejects. Action: Ron will investigate the edit history of Start Page to find the source of the issue. Problem: Reporting hardcopy status messages (e.g., "5 pages printed") is undefined. Dilemma: Should the generic hardcopy code print the message, or should it pass a display stream to the individual converters? Decision: The duplex feature can be merged with this known issue and fixed later. Documentation & Tooling pretty-file-index Errors: Problem: The tool fails on files using CLTL2 package qualifiers (e.g., CL:SYMBOL) because it attempts a full read, not just a syntax parse. Proposed Fix: Disable the colon read macro during indexing. This would treat CL:SYMBOL as a single atom, preserving the source string. T-Edit Window Defaults: Problem: New T-Edit windows default to a tiny 200x100 pixel size, which is unusable. Proposed Fix: Default to a more practical size (e.g., 80 chars wide, 10 lines high) based on the default font. Museum Mode: Status: Complete and documented. Next Step: Create demos using the feature. Noto Web Fonts: Status: Herb fixed a bug where a font was being coerced to a non-existent web font. The table-driven code was easily extended to generate the missing font. Student Mentorship (Kabir): Herb is mentoring an undergraduate student on Lisp. Action: Larry needs to approve the proposed milestones for the student. Next Steps Ron: Test PR #2290 by removing local network workarounds. Fix the Hardcopy menu bugs (duplicate items, non-persistent settings). Investigate the ps2pdf failure caused by the Postscript heading comment. Larry: Investigate the mouse scroll inconsistency (trackpad vs. wheel mouse). Approve the proposed milestones for student Kabir. Nick: Complete Mako-side Ethernet changes and test Dodo/Solaris compatibility. Paolo:

Share the annual report on Reddit.

Team: Review and approve PR #2290 for merge. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Interlisp Medley development, documentation, and community outreach. Key Takeaways - Google Search Changes: Google's deprecation of its "Global Search" feature is a non-issue, as we already disabled it. This creates an opportunity to improve our local, site-specific search using Google's enhanced tools. - New Font Architecture: A major refactor is underway to modernize the font system. The goal is to support Unicode and modern standards while maintaining backward compatibility with legacy Interlisp code. - Character Encoding Fix: A bug in make-index-htmails was resolved. The fix clarifies that source code must be edited in S-Edit using its native MCCS characters (e.g., F6 for caret), which are then correctly mapped to UTF-8 on output. - New Contributor: Travis Stewart joined the team and will provide valuable feedback on the new user experience, helping to refine the primer and onboarding process. Topics Google Search Engine Update - Problem: Google is deprecating its "Global Search" feature by year-end 2026. - Impact: Minimal. The feature was already disabled due to a previous bug that prevented re-enabling it. - Opportunity: Google's local search capabilities have improved. We can now use them to create a more focused search experience for our own content. - Scope: The search will be restricted to sites we control (e.g., interlisp.org, files.interlisp.org) to ensure result quality. - Action: Bill Stumbo will investigate the new search options (Issue #2453). Font & Character Encoding Architecture - Problem: Modernizing the font system while preserving compatibility with legacy Interlisp code. - Solution: A new font architecture is being developed to support Unicode and modern font standards. - Goal: Minimize device-specific code by centralizing font handling and "coercion" (translating a requested font to a supported one). - Related Fix: A bug in make-index-htmails was resolved. - Issue: A caret character was not rendering correctly in UTF-8 output. - Cause: A misunderstanding of the character encoding workflow. - Fix: Edit source in S-Edit using its native MCCS characters (e.g., F6 for caret). The system then correctly maps these to UTF-8 on output. - Rationale: This workflow is necessary because Interlisp uses MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) internally, which is a modified version of the Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS). Documentation & Outreach - DOS Manual: The final unpublished manual will be added to the DOS repo. - Location: Top-level of the repo. - Filename: Will remain DOS 1993 guide.pdf. - Action: Paolo Amoroso will submit a PR. - European Lisp Symposium (ELS 2026): - Dates: May 11–12, 2026, in Krakow, Poland. - Submission Deadline: March 15, 2026. - Theme: Open, with no specific focus. - Stanford Archive Discovery: Matt Heffron found the E-Mycin manual, which was missing from the Stanford archive. He is now sharing it with BitSavers and Nelson Beebe's AI document archive. Roundtable Updates - Ron Kaplan: - Completed printing architecture mop-up, updating the HPGL driver. - Investigating postponed issues in TIEDA (e.g., secondary selection behavior). - Herb Jellinek: - Moved the obsolete Epson FX80 printer driver to the obsolete directory. - Integrating HTML stream font handling into the new font coercion APIs. - Matt Heffron: - Sharing the discovered E-Mycin manual with other archives. - Continuing code reviews. - Bill Stumbo: - Investigating Google's programmable search engine. - Continuing work on AI-enhanced search. - Paolo Amoroso: - Posted the annual report to Mastodon; will post to Reddit. - Enhanced the Interlisp source file viewer with cd and pwd commands. - Larry Masinter-lisp: - Fixed the make-index-htmails character encoding bug. - Travis Stewart: - Joined the team and will document the new user experience to help improve the primer. Technical Question: String to Symbol Conversion - Problem: How to convert a string like "cl:foo" into the corresponding symbol, handling the package prefix. - Challenge: Standard functions like intern and find-symbol require the package object as a separate argument. - Potential Solution: read-from-string was suggested as a robust method that correctly parses package prefixes and handles edge cases like quoted colons. - Action: Ron Kaplan will post the question to the mailing list for a definitive answer. Next Steps - Paolo Amoroso: - Submit PR to add the DOS manual to the DOS repo. - Post the annual report to Reddit. - Bill Stumbo: - Investigate Google's programmable search engine options (Issue #2453). - Travis Stewart: - Document the new user onboarding experience to help refine the primer. - Ron Kaplan: - Post the string-to-symbol conversion question to the mailing list. - All: - Consider submitting a proposal for ELS 2026 by the March 15 deadline.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly January 28, 2026  •  81 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Interlisp Medley development, documentation, and community outreach. Key Takeaways Google Search Changes: Google's deprecation of its "Global Search" feature is a non-issue, as we already disabled it. This creates an opportunity to improve our local, site-specific search using Google's enhanced tools. New Font Architecture: A major refactor is underway to modernize the font system. The goal is to support Unicode and modern standards while maintaining backward compatibility with legacy Interlisp code. Character Encoding Fix: A bug in make-index-htmails was resolved. The fix clarifies that source code must be edited in S-Edit using its native MCCS characters (e.g., F6 for caret), which are then correctly mapped to UTF-8 on output. New Contributor: Travis Stewart joined the team and will provide valuable feedback on the new user experience, helping to refine the primer and onboarding process. Topics Google Search Engine Update Problem: Google is deprecating its "Global Search" feature by year-end 2026. Impact: Minimal. The feature was already disabled due to a previous bug that prevented re-enabling it. Opportunity: Google's local search capabilities have improved. We can now use them to create a more focused search experience for our own content. Scope: The search will be restricted to sites we control (e.g., interlisp.org, files.interlisp.org) to ensure result quality. Action: Bill Stumbo will investigate the new search options (Issue #2453). Font & Character Encoding Architecture Problem: Modernizing the font system while preserving compatibility with legacy Interlisp code. Solution: A new font architecture is being developed to support Unicode and modern font standards. Goal: Minimize device-specific code by centralizing font handling and "coercion" (translating a requested font to a supported one). Related Fix: A bug in make-index-htmails was resolved. Issue: A caret character was not rendering correctly in UTF-8 output. Cause: A misunderstanding of the character encoding workflow. Fix: Edit source in S-Edit using its native MCCS characters (e.g., F6 for caret). The system then correctly maps these to UTF-8 on output. Rationale: This workflow is necessary because Interlisp uses MCCS (Medley Character Code Standard) internally, which is a modified version of the Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS). Documentation & Outreach DOS Manual: The final unpublished manual will be added to the DOS repo. Location: Top-level of the repo. Filename: Will remain DOS 1993 guide.pdf. Action: Paolo Amoroso will submit a PR. European Lisp Symposium (ELS 2026): Dates: May 11–12, 2026, in Krakow, Poland. Submission Deadline: March 15, 2026. Theme: Open, with no specific focus. Stanford Archive Discovery: Matt Heffron found the E-Mycin manual, which was missing from the Stanford archive. He is now sharing it with BitSavers and Nelson Beebe's AI document archive. Roundtable Updates Ron Kaplan: Completed printing architecture mop-up, updating the HPGL driver. Investigating postponed issues in TIEDA (e.g., secondary selection behavior). Herb Jellinek: Moved the obsolete Epson FX80 printer driver to the obsolete directory. Integrating HTML stream font handling into the new font coercion APIs. Matt Heffron: Sharing the discovered E-Mycin manual with other archives. Continuing code reviews. Bill Stumbo: Investigating Google's programmable search engine. Continuing work on AI-enhanced search. Paolo Amoroso: Posted the annual report to Mastodon; will post to Reddit. Enhanced the Interlisp source file viewer with cd and pwd commands. Larry Masinter-lisp: Fixed the make-index-htmails character encoding bug. Travis Stewart: Joined the team and will document the new user experience to help improve the primer. Technical Question: String to Symbol Conversion Problem: How to convert a string like "cl:foo" into the corresponding symbol, handling the package prefix. Challenge: Standard functions like intern and find-symbol require the package object as a separate argument. Potential Solution: read-from-string was suggested as a robust method that correctly parses package prefixes and handles edge cases like quoted colons. Action: Ron Kaplan will post the question to the mailing list for a definitive answer. Next Steps Paolo Amoroso: Submit PR to add the DOS manual to the DOS repo. Post the annual report to Reddit. Bill Stumbo: Investigate Google's programmable search engine options (Issue #2453). Travis Stewart: Document the new user onboarding experience to help refine the primer. Ron Kaplan: Post the string-to-symbol conversion question to the mailing list. All: Consider submitting a proposal for ELS 2026 by the March 15 deadline. View Meeting →

[Nick Briggs]

Technical Question: String to Symbol Conversion

• Problem: How to convert a string like "cl:foo" into the corresponding symbol, handling the package prefix.

• Challenge: Standard functions like intern and find-symbol require the package object as a separate argument.

• Potential Solution: read-from-string was suggested as a robust method that correctly parses package prefixes and handles edge cases like quoted colons.

• Action: Ron Kaplan will post the question to the mailing list for a definitive answer.

I noticed in internal/PACKAGE-CODE.TEDIT there's a discussion of how the package system gets turned on (and symbols parsed) when you're converting a non-package system to a package system -- might be worthwhile checking if there's anything in there that we should be keeping in mind.

I don't know if this was part of the discussion, or if it matters for the intended application - but cl:read-from-string does require that a package exist before it will parse a name with a package prefix.

-- Nick

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development and project status. Key Takeaways - Networking Priority Shift: Focus is now on reviving legacy PupRPC/XNS protocols over TCP/IP. Rationale: This enables compelling demos of historical applications, which is a higher priority than building new web apps. - HC Files Bug Identified: The hc-files script creates empty PDFs in the root directory during automated builds. Cause: A shell quoting error with ampersands (&) in filenames (e.g., 17-problems-&-errors.tis) prevents files from being processed correctly and placed in the /temp directory. - Character Encoding Refinement: Ron is fixing the character encoding architecture to use the external-format system for all string manipulations (e.g., filenames, environment variables), not just file I/O. This will resolve issues with the underscore (_) vs. left-arrow (←) character mapping. - Student Onboarding: A new CS student is learning the file-package to prepare for running historical Lisp benchmarks, using the project's "museum mode" to provide a clean, reproducible environment. Topics Emulator & C Code Porting - The emulator's C codebase is a complex mix of K&R C and modern C99, supporting 32/64-bit and big/little-endian architectures. - Challenge: Refactoring is difficult due to a lack of a formal specification and a comprehensive test suite. - Example: A hardcoded program counter + 1 cache, documented only in a code comment, illustrates the system's hidden complexities. Networking & Web App Strategy - Problem: A Reddit user asked about building web apps with Medley. - Conclusion: Medley is not an ideal platform for UI-less servers. - Strategic Shift: Prioritize reviving legacy protocols (PupRPC, XNS) over the modern TCP/IP stack. - Rationale: This enables compelling demos of historical applications, which is a higher priority. - Challenge: The TCP/IP code is a confusing mix of raw packet and socket interface implementations. HC Files Bug Investigation - Symptom: Empty PDF files (e.g., medley17996-cards-problems.pdf) appear in the root directory of automated builds. - Cause: A shell quoting error with ampersands (&) in filenames. - Example: notecards.docs.userguidev12/17-problems-&-errors.tis. - Impact: The shell command fails to process the filename correctly, preventing the file from being converted to PDF and placed in the /temp directory. - Why it's specific to CI: The CI workflow copies the entire notecards directory into the build environment, exposing the problematic files. Local runs often omit this step. Character Encoding & External Formats - Problem: Inconsistent character encoding for filenames and environment variables. - Cause: The underscore (_) vs. left-arrow (←) character mapping, a legacy choice made to improve source code readability within Lisp. - Solution: Integrate all string manipulations with the external-format system. - Rationale: This standardizes encoding handling, ensuring consistency between internal Lisp strings and external system interfaces (e.g., get-env). - Load-up Challenge: The full Unicode/UTF-8 system is not available early in the load-up process. - Plan: Use a simple, one-byte format (e.g., ISO-8859-1) during early load-up, then switch to the full UTF-8 system. Student Project: Benchmarks & Museum Mode - Eleanor Young (Grad Student): Analyzing a large email archive on Medley's history and populating the Zotero bibliography. - Kabir Gupta (Undergrad): Onboarding to run historical Lisp benchmarks. - Phase 1: Learn the file-package with a simple source file to avoid the complexity of the original benchmarks. - Phase 2: Run the Bench 1 module. - Method: Use "museum mode" to launch Medley, run the benchmark, and exit, providing a clean and reproducible environment. PR Review & Approval - PR #2418 (Update font lookup): Approved. Cleans up old font-related code and standardizes the font filename lookup. - PR #2471 (Blox-HKB duplicates): Approved. Removes duplicate code. - PR #2468 (Man page lookup): Approved. Updates the man command to open a Finder window for unindexed man pages. - PR #2467 (HPGL printing fix): Approved. Fixes HPGL printing by correctly handling external formats. Next Steps - Ron: - Fix character encoding architecture to use external-format for all string manipulations. - Create a public T-Edit function to extend a selection to a full paragraph. - Frank: - Investigate and fix the hc-files shell quoting bug. - Continue work on the IM manual, focusing on generating a table of contents. - Herb: - Continue guiding Kabir Gupta through the benchmark project, starting with the file-package. - All: - Review and approve PRs #2418, #2471, #2468, and #2467. - Convert PR #2399 to a draft.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly February 02, 2026  •  99 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Instrument HC files in build.yaml; capture logs; debug empty PDFs in root Matt Heffron Run do-hc-files.sh locally on clean clone; verify empty PDFs don't appear Paolo Amoroso Fix external formats: add ISO-8859-1; generalize string recoding; fix exports.all Ron Kaplan Fix HC files: quote & in make-html-by-index-html; quote shell args; route temps to temp/ Frank Halasz Implement external function to extend selection to full paragraphs Ron Kaplan Approve PRs: 2418, 2467, 2468, 2470 Larry Masinter-lisp Update unit tests for PR 2467 (HPGL external format) Paolo Amoroso Convert PR 2399 to Draft Larry Masinter-lisp Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development and project status. Key Takeaways Networking Priority Shift: Focus is now on reviving legacy PupRPC/XNS protocols over TCP/IP. Rationale: This enables compelling demos of historical applications, which is a higher priority than building new web apps. HC Files Bug Identified: The hc-files script creates empty PDFs in the root directory during automated builds. Cause: A shell quoting error with ampersands (&) in filenames (e.g., 17-problems-&-errors.tis) prevents files from being processed correctly and placed in the /temp directory. Character Encoding Refinement: Ron is fixing the character encoding architecture to use the external-format system for all string manipulations (e.g., filenames, environment variables), not just file I/O. This will resolve issues with the underscore (_) vs. left-arrow (←) character mapping. Student Onboarding: A new CS student is learning the file-package to prepare for running historical Lisp benchmarks, using the project's "museum mode" to provide a clean, reproducible environment. Topics Emulator & C Code Porting The emulator's C codebase is a complex mix of K&R C and modern C99, supporting 32/64-bit and big/little-endian architectures. Challenge: Refactoring is difficult due to a lack of a formal specification and a comprehensive test suite. Example: A hardcoded program counter + 1 cache, documented only in a code comment, illustrates the system's hidden complexities. Networking & Web App Strategy Problem: A Reddit user asked about building web apps with Medley. Conclusion: Medley is not an ideal platform for UI-less servers. Strategic Shift: Prioritize reviving legacy protocols (PupRPC, XNS) over the modern TCP/IP stack. Rationale: This enables compelling demos of historical applications, which is a higher priority. Challenge: The TCP/IP code is a confusing mix of raw packet and socket interface implementations. HC Files Bug Investigation Symptom: Empty PDF files (e.g., medley17996-cards-problems.pdf) appear in the root directory of automated builds. Cause: A shell quoting error with ampersands (&) in filenames. Example: notecards.docs.userguidev12/17-problems-&-errors.tis. Impact: The shell command fails to process the filename correctly, preventing the file from being converted to PDF and placed in the /temp directory. Why it's specific to CI: The CI workflow copies the entire notecards directory into the build environment, exposing the problematic files. Local runs often omit this step. Character Encoding & External Formats Problem: Inconsistent character encoding for filenames and environment variables. Cause: The underscore (_) vs. left-arrow (←) character mapping, a legacy choice made to improve source code readability within Lisp. Solution: Integrate all string manipulations with the external-format system. Rationale: This standardizes encoding handling, ensuring consistency between internal Lisp strings and external system interfaces (e.g., get-env). Load-up Challenge: The full Unicode/UTF-8 system is not available early in the load-up process. Plan: Use a simple, one-byte format (e.g., ISO-8859-1) during early load-up, then switch to the full UTF-8 system. Student Project: Benchmarks & Museum Mode Eleanor Young (Grad Student): Analyzing a large email archive on Medley's history and populating the Zotero bibliography. Kabir Gupta (Undergrad): Onboarding to run historical Lisp benchmarks. Phase 1: Learn the file-package with a simple source file to avoid the complexity of the original benchmarks. Phase 2: Run the Bench 1 module. Method: Use "museum mode" to launch Medley, run the benchmark, and exit, providing a clean and reproducible environment. PR Review & Approval PR #2418 (Update font lookup): Approved. Cleans up old font-related code and standardizes the font filename lookup. PR #2471 (Blox-HKB duplicates): Approved. Removes duplicate code. PR #2468 (Man page lookup): Approved. Updates the man command to open a Finder window for unindexed man pages. PR #2467 (HPGL printing fix): Approved. Fixes HPGL printing by correctly handling external formats. Next Steps Ron: Fix character encoding architecture to use external-format for all string manipulations. Create a public T-Edit function to extend a selection to a full paragraph. Frank: Investigate and fix the hc-files shell quoting bug. Continue work on the IM manual, focusing on generating a table of contents. Herb: Continue guiding Kabir Gupta through the benchmark project, starting with the file-package. All: Review and approve PRs #2418, #2471, #2468, and #2467. Convert PR #2399 to a draft.

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Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on project progress, technical challenges, and administrative tasks. Key Takeaways - MCCS vs. UTF-8: A debate emerged over the long-term strategy for MCCS. The current path of preserving MCCS creates ongoing complexity (e.g., font coercion, file positions), while a one-time UTF-8 conversion could eliminate these issues but would be a massive undertaking. - Google Drive Audit: A Google Drive policy change prompted an audit of all folder permissions to ensure sensitive data (e.g., invoices, History Sources) is properly restricted. - Project Updates: Key work includes SEO improvements for interlisp.org, refactoring HTML stream for font coercion, and preparing a simplified Bench 1 for Kabir. - New Project Idea: Paolo is seeking a small-to-medium project for LOOPS to build a meaningful class library, exercise a less-used subsystem, and find bugs. Topics MCCS vs. UTF-8 Strategy - Problem: Preserving MCCS creates ongoing complexity. - Font Coercion: Herb's work on HTML stream requires significant effort to implement font coercions, which can cause subtle layout issues (e.g., non-breaking hyphens rendering with different glyphs). - File Positions: Ron's work on Unix GTM highlights that MCCS run-coding makes file positions unpredictable, a problem UTF-8 also has. - External Tools: MCCS's non-standard characters break simple tools like grep for new users. - Debate: Is the effort to preserve MCCS worth it, or would a one-time conversion to UTF-8 be more efficient? - Pro-Preservation: MCCS reflects the technology of the 1990s, which is part of the project's historical mission. - Pro-Conversion: A one-time cost would eliminate all future MCCS-related complexity and edge cases. - Action: No decision was made, but the team will continue to weigh the trade-offs. Project Updates & Admin - Google Drive Policy Change: - A notification from Google about stricter default file access policies prompted an audit of all folder permissions. - Goal: Ensure sensitive data (e.g., History Sources, invoice depository) is restricted to the correct SCORE members. - The audit can be done before or after the March policy change. - Website & Documentation: - interlisp.org SEO (Bill): - Hiding author tags from search results. - Adding missing meta description tags to bibliography pages. - Future Goal: Link search results directly to the relevant entry on the bibliography page. - GitHub README (Paolo): - Submitting a PR to revise the README with a project overview, a link to the primer, and fixed links. - ICM Partnership (Paolo): - Adding the Interim Computer Museum (ICM) to the "Organizational Partners" page to highlight their work on Medley workstations and "museum mode." - Medley Development & Benchmarks: - Ron: Continuing work on MCCS issues for Unix GTM. - Herb: - Preparing a simplified Bench 1 for Kabir to get him unstuck on benchmark work. - Will have Kabir use a script modeled on the do.hc files to automate benchmark execution. - Will register MCCS and XCCS with IANA, as the contact person is enthusiastic about the idea. - Frank: Fixing a bug in T-Edit and found the recently published documentation in the library/T-Edit-docs folder. - Bibliography & Zotero: - Guidon Reference: Clarified that two Zotero entries are for two different documents (IEEE paper vs. Stanford tech report), not a duplicate. - Emycine Manual: Corrected Bill Van Melle's name to lowercase 'v' in Zotero, noting the cover is incorrect but the internal title page is right. New Project Idea: LOOPS - Paolo's Goal: A new project using LOOPS to build a meaningful class library, exercise a less-used subsystem, and find bugs. - Constraints: Small-to-medium scope; tool-oriented (not puzzles); no modern AI. - Suggestions: Review Steve's LOOPS books or Smalltalk examples for inspiration. Next Steps - Paolo: - Submit PRs for the revised GitHub README and the new ICM partnership section. - Delete the merged Medley for DOS branch. - Continue searching for a suitable LOOPS project. - Bill: - Submit the SEO-focused PR for the bibliography. - Herb: - Finalize and send the simplified Bench 1 to Kabir. - Register MCCS and XCCS with IANA. - Larry: - Notify the ARPANET revival project about Medley's similar historical preservation work. - All: - Conduct a Google Drive permissions audit before or after the March policy change.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly February 04, 2026  •  425 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Submit PR to Medley README: add intro, link primer, fix links, link glossary Paolo Amoroso Add ICM section to interlisp.org Organizational Partners page Paolo Amoroso Submit PR to interlisp.org: add SEO meta description + noindex author tags to bibliography Bill Stumbo Implement in-page search jump to bibliography entries Bill Stumbo Finish Bench 1; send to Kabir Herb Jellinek Register MCCS + XCCS w/ IANA; use better references Herb Jellinek Draft benchmark runner scripts (do.hc + .cm) for Kabir Herb Jellinek Email ARPANET recreation team re: Interlisp parallels Larry Masinter-lisp Add MCCS/XCCS keyboard mapping to primer Larry Masinter-lisp Delete DOS manual branch in DOS repo Paolo Amoroso Review Steve's LOOPS books for project ideas Paolo Amoroso Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on project progress, technical challenges, and administrative tasks. Key Takeaways MCCS vs. UTF-8: A debate emerged over the long-term strategy for MCCS. The current path of preserving MCCS creates ongoing complexity (e.g., font coercion, file positions), while a one-time UTF-8 conversion could eliminate these issues but would be a massive undertaking. Google Drive Audit: A Google Drive policy change prompted an audit of all folder permissions to ensure sensitive data (e.g., invoices, History Sources) is properly restricted. Project Updates: Key work includes SEO improvements for interlisp.org, refactoring HTML stream for font coercion, and preparing a simplified Bench 1 for Kabir. New Project Idea: Paolo is seeking a small-to-medium project for LOOPS to build a meaningful class library, exercise a less-used subsystem, and find bugs. Topics MCCS vs. UTF-8 Strategy Problem: Preserving MCCS creates ongoing complexity. Font Coercion: Herb's work on HTML stream requires significant effort to implement font coercions, which can cause subtle layout issues (e.g., non-breaking hyphens rendering with different glyphs). File Positions: Ron's work on Unix GTM highlights that MCCS run-coding makes file positions unpredictable, a problem UTF-8 also has. External Tools: MCCS's non-standard characters break simple tools like grep for new users. Debate: Is the effort to preserve MCCS worth it, or would a one-time conversion to UTF-8 be more efficient? Pro-Preservation: MCCS reflects the technology of the 1990s, which is part of the project's historical mission. Pro-Conversion: A one-time cost would eliminate all future MCCS-related complexity and edge cases. Action: No decision was made, but the team will continue to weigh the trade-offs. Project Updates & Admin Google Drive Policy Change: A notification from Google about stricter default file access policies prompted an audit of all folder permissions. Goal: Ensure sensitive data (e.g., History Sources, invoice depository) is restricted to the correct SCORE members. The audit can be done before or after the March policy change. Website & Documentation: interlisp.org SEO (Bill): Hiding author tags from search results. Adding missing meta description tags to bibliography pages. Future Goal: Link search results directly to the relevant entry on the bibliography page. GitHub README (Paolo): Submitting a PR to revise the README with a project overview, a link to the primer, and fixed links. ICM Partnership (Paolo): Adding the Interim Computer Museum (ICM) to the "Organizational Partners" page to highlight their work on Medley workstations and "museum mode." Medley Development & Benchmarks: Ron: Continuing work on MCCS issues for Unix GTM. Herb: Preparing a simplified Bench 1 for Kabir to get him unstuck on benchmark work. Will have Kabir use a script modeled on the do.hc files to automate benchmark execution. Will register MCCS and XCCS with IANA, as the contact person is enthusiastic about the idea. Frank: Fixing a bug in T-Edit and found the recently published documentation in the library/T-Edit-docs folder. Bibliography & Zotero: Guidon Reference: Clarified that two Zotero entries are for two different documents (IEEE paper vs. Stanford tech report), not a duplicate. Emycine Manual: Corrected Bill Van Melle's name to lowercase 'v' in Zotero, noting the cover is incorrect but the internal title page is right. New Project Idea: LOOPS Paolo's Goal: A new project using LOOPS to build a meaningful class library, exercise a less-used subsystem, and find bugs. Constraints: Small-to-medium scope; tool-oriented (not puzzles); no modern AI. Suggestions: Review Steve's LOOPS books or Smalltalk examples for inspiration. Next Steps Paolo: Submit PRs for the revised GitHub README and the new ICM partnership section. Delete the merged Medley for DOS branch. Continue searching for a suitable LOOPS project. Bill: Submit the SEO-focused PR for the bibliography. Herb: Finalize and send the simplified Bench 1 to Kabir. Register MCCS and XCCS with IANA. Larry: Notify the ARPANET revival project about Medley's similar historical preservation work. All: Conduct a Google Drive permissions audit before or after the March policy change.

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Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and issues. Key Takeaways - Font System Overhaul: The new font system is ready for its final step: building bitmap fonts from modern sources (e.g., Noto). This will enable consistent rendering across display and hardcopy, unlocking the system's full potential. - MCCS Encoding Standardized: The Medley Character Code Standard (MCCS) will be formally defined to disallow ambiguous run-coding sequences (specifically 255 255 0). This change is critical for enabling fast, sublinear searches like Boyer-Moore. - System String Handling Fixed: Ron's PR #2479 abstracts OS string conversions (e.g., Medley _ to Unix _) into the external-format system. This fixes bugs where Medley couldn't interact with the OS using common characters. - T-Edit Manuals Modernized: Frank is overhauling the IRM to use dynamic numbering and cross-references. He will evaluate the existing T-Max package to avoid duplicating effort. Topics Font System Overhaul - The font system overhaul is complete, but its full value is unrealized. - Current State: - Fonts are now single files per family/size/face, not split by character set. - Old font files remain for backward compatibility via the display-font-directories variable. - Next Step: Build bitmap fonts from modern, publicly available sources (e.g., Noto, GNU Unifont). - Goal: Ensure consistent rendering between display and hardcopy (HTML/Interpress). - Decision: Coordinate font family names with Herb's HTML work to avoid complex coercion rules. - Implementation: Matt has the Interlisp code to build these fonts from BDF rasters. - Cleanup Task: Remove the NS-display-sizes correction, which was a workaround for Interpress printing. This can be done by correcting the underlying font data offline. MCCS Encoding Standardization - The Medley Character Code Standard (MCCS) will be formally defined to be unambiguous. - Problem: The XCCS standard allows two ways to encode 16-bit characters (e.g., Greek Alpha), which prevents fast, sublinear searches like Boyer-Moore. - Solution: MCCS will disallow the ambiguous 255 255 0 run-coding sequence. - The in-seq-code function will signal an error on this sequence, defining it as an illegal MCCS file. - This change will be documented in the IANA registration. - Future: The encoding could be extended to support characters > 16 bits (e.g., emojis) by defining a new run-code sequence. System String Handling Fix (PR #2479) - Ron's PR #2479 fixes bugs where Medley couldn't interact with the OS using common characters like _ (underscore). - Problem: OS calls (e.g., getenv, file names) failed because Medley's internal character codes didn't map correctly to the OS's UTF-8 or ISO-8859-1. - Solution: Abstract string-to-string transformations into the external-format system. - This centralizes the logic, which is recomputed on sysout/load to match the host OS. - The fix required changes across ~16 files and careful handling of the load-up sequence. - Status: The chat interface still uses direct, hardcoded transformations and will be updated later. T-Edit Manual Modernization - Frank is overhauling the Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) to improve maintainability. - Progress: - Replaced hardwired chapter numbers with a dynamic image object for easy reordering. - Created section objects for automatic, multi-level numbering. - Next Step: Implement dynamic cross-chapter references. - Discovery: The T-Max package (in Lispy users T-Max) provides comprehensive manual tools (TOC, indexing, numbering). Frank will evaluate it to avoid duplicating effort. - Page Numbering: Ron proposed a new system using a page-number image object in a heading paragraph. This simplifies formatting by leveraging T-Edit's standard paragraph styles. Other Updates - MasterScope Fix: A bug preventing MasterScope from compiling was fixed. - Cause: An interpreted macro-expansion function encountered the no-bind atom, which the interpreter handles differently than the compiler. - Solution: The PR was merged, resolving the issue. - IANA Registration: Herb is pursuing IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS. - He sent the XCCS spec to Al Casso (Bitsavers) for a stable, public URL. - The MCCS registration will reference XCCS and specify the run-coding restriction. - Medley for DOS: The system runs on a 486 PC with 8MB RAM, but the T-EDIT application has a font issue. The team discussed emulating it in a Docker container for web-based testing. Next Steps - Ron: - Implement the MCCS run-coding restriction (255 255 0 sequence illegal) and update the external-format system. - Review PR #2479 (System String Handling). - Continue work on the new T-Edit page numbering system. - Frank: - Evaluate the T-Max package for the IRM overhaul. - Review Ron's T-Edit PR. - Herb: - Complete the HTML stream implementation. - Draft the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS. - Larry: - Review PR #2479 (System String Handling).

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly February 09, 2026  •  119 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Share Bug Smash link in group chat Travis Stewart Email Bill Van Melle re: EMEICIN source availability Paolo Amoroso Create GitHub issues for font cleanup + NS Display Sizes removal Larry Masinter-lisp Check in font-generation scripts to public repo Herb Jellinek Implement MCCS stability: set stable flag, error on 255 255 0, ensure output avoids it Ron Kaplan Review T-Max docs; decide merge vs custom doc tools Frank Halasz Move folio-pretext/post-text logic to your doc tools code Frank Halasz Close your T-Edit map objects PR; it's merged in Ron's PR 2479 Frank Halasz Send T-Edit typo fix to Ron Frank Halasz Read XCCS String Encoding; draft MCCS IANA registration; coordinate w/ Ron Herb Jellinek Ask Nick for his grep technique; draft 'nick' search script Larry Masinter-lisp Review Ron's external-format PR; run for 1 day; approve Frank Halasz Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and issues. Key Takeaways Font System Overhaul: The new font system is ready for its final step: building bitmap fonts from modern sources (e.g., Noto). This will enable consistent rendering across display and hardcopy, unlocking the system's full potential. MCCS Encoding Standardized: The Medley Character Code Standard (MCCS) will be formally defined to disallow ambiguous run-coding sequences (specifically 255 255 0). This change is critical for enabling fast, sublinear searches like Boyer-Moore. System String Handling Fixed: Ron's PR #2479 abstracts OS string conversions (e.g., Medley _ to Unix _) into the external-format system. This fixes bugs where Medley couldn't interact with the OS using common characters. T-Edit Manuals Modernized: Frank is overhauling the IRM to use dynamic numbering and cross-references. He will evaluate the existing T-Max package to avoid duplicating effort. Topics Font System Overhaul The font system overhaul is complete, but its full value is unrealized. Current State: Fonts are now single files per family/size/face, not split by character set. Old font files remain for backward compatibility via the display-font-directories variable. Next Step: Build bitmap fonts from modern, publicly available sources (e.g., Noto, GNU Unifont). Goal: Ensure consistent rendering between display and hardcopy (HTML/Interpress). Decision: Coordinate font family names with Herb's HTML work to avoid complex coercion rules. Implementation: Matt has the Interlisp code to build these fonts from BDF rasters. Cleanup Task: Remove the NS-display-sizes correction, which was a workaround for Interpress printing. This can be done by correcting the underlying font data offline. MCCS Encoding Standardization The Medley Character Code Standard (MCCS) will be formally defined to be unambiguous. Problem: The XCCS standard allows two ways to encode 16-bit characters (e.g., Greek Alpha), which prevents fast, sublinear searches like Boyer-Moore. Solution: MCCS will disallow the ambiguous 255 255 0 run-coding sequence. The in-seq-code function will signal an error on this sequence, defining it as an illegal MCCS file. This change will be documented in the IANA registration. Future: The encoding could be extended to support characters > 16 bits (e.g., emojis) by defining a new run-code sequence. System String Handling Fix (PR #2479) Ron's PR #2479 fixes bugs where Medley couldn't interact with the OS using common characters like _ (underscore). Problem: OS calls (e.g., getenv, file names) failed because Medley's internal character codes didn't map correctly to the OS's UTF-8 or ISO-8859-1. Solution: Abstract string-to-string transformations into the external-format system. This centralizes the logic, which is recomputed on sysout/load to match the host OS. The fix required changes across ~16 files and careful handling of the load-up sequence. Status: The chat interface still uses direct, hardcoded transformations and will be updated later. T-Edit Manual Modernization Frank is overhauling the Interlisp Reference Manual (IRM) to improve maintainability. Progress: Replaced hardwired chapter numbers with a dynamic image object for easy reordering. Created section objects for automatic, multi-level numbering. Next Step: Implement dynamic cross-chapter references. Discovery: The T-Max package (in Lispy users T-Max) provides comprehensive manual tools (TOC, indexing, numbering). Frank will evaluate it to avoid duplicating effort. Page Numbering: Ron proposed a new system using a page-number image object in a heading paragraph. This simplifies formatting by leveraging T-Edit's standard paragraph styles. Other Updates MasterScope Fix: A bug preventing MasterScope from compiling was fixed. Cause: An interpreted macro-expansion function encountered the no-bind atom, which the interpreter handles differently than the compiler. Solution: The PR was merged, resolving the issue. IANA Registration: Herb is pursuing IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS. He sent the XCCS spec to Al Casso (Bitsavers) for a stable, public URL. The MCCS registration will reference XCCS and specify the run-coding restriction. Medley for DOS: The system runs on a 486 PC with 8MB RAM, but the T-EDIT application has a font issue. The team discussed emulating it in a Docker container for web-based testing. Next Steps Ron: Implement the MCCS run-coding restriction (255 255 0 sequence illegal) and update the external-format system. Review PR #2479 (System String Handling). Continue work on the new T-Edit page numbering system. Frank: Evaluate the T-Max package for the IRM overhaul. Review Ron's T-Edit PR. Herb: Complete the HTML stream implementation. Draft the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS. Larry: Review PR #2479 (System String Handling).

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development, progress, and blockers. Key Takeaways - Zotero Bug Fixed: A Zotero bug mis-categorizing citations as books was fixed by an external PR, resolving a long-standing issue. - MasterScope Overhaul Proposed: A major MasterScope overhaul is proposed to enable precise searches for quoted atoms (e.g., edit where any quotes Foo), a capability currently lacking. - HTML Stream Progress: Herb's HTML Stream is functional again, with font coercions working. The next step is debugging why it isn't reading Medley's font files. - Notecards Revival: Frank has revived ~75% of Notecards, but the collaborative network server is still missing. Finding the source code for key applications like IDE is a priority. Topics Zotero Citation Bug - Problem: Zotero was mis-categorizing some citations as books. - Solution: Abe Jellinek submitted a PR to Zotero's Citation Style Language (CSL) that was recently merged. - Impact: The fix is live, resolving the issue. Herb will update the corresponding internal ticket. Primer Editing Access - Problem: Paolo could not edit the Primer document, despite having "editor" status. - Resolution: Larry granted administrator privileges, which immediately enabled editing access. - Significance: This highlights a non-robust permission system where a user's status (e.g., "editor") doesn't always grant the expected capabilities. Hard Copy Generation & MasterScope - Problem: The hard copy generator fails on many files, producing opaque errors. - Proposed Fix (Larry): A simple fix to report the filename with each error, making failures visible and grep-able. - Long-Term Goal (Ron): A more precise code search tool than grep or current MasterScope. - Use Case: Find all occurrences of a quoted atom, e.g., edit where any quotes Foo. - Rationale: Current tools are either too noisy (grep) or lack the required semantic understanding (MasterScope doesn't index quoted atoms). - Technical Challenges: - Scope: MasterScope's analysis is limited to sysfiles to prevent system state corruption from loading arbitrary code. - VM Size: A comprehensive analysis of all source files may exceed the VM's capacity (currently at 94%). - Merging: MasterScope databases can be merged, offering a potential path to a comprehensive index. HTML Stream & Font Support - Status: Herb's HTML Stream is functional again, successfully performing font coercions (e.g., gotcha → Noto Sans Mono). - Blocker: The stream is not reading Medley's font files. - Hypothesis: The method order for font handling is incorrect, causing the stream to use its own methods instead of Medley's generics. - Next Step: Herb will debug this issue; Ron offered assistance. Notecards Revival - Status: Frank has revived ~75% of the Notecards application. - Missing Feature: The network server for collaborative, shared databases. - Rationale: This was a key requirement from the original CIA contract to enable multi-user access. - Missing Code: Source for key applications built on Notecards, such as the Instructional Design Environment (IDE). - Future Work: Frank plans to find and revive these missing components, potentially by contacting original developers like Kathy Marshall. Next Steps - Herb: - Update the internal ticket for the Zotero citation bug. - Debug the HTML Stream issue with Medley font file reading. - Larry: - Create a GitHub issue to discuss extending MasterScope for quoted atom searches. - Experiment with a comprehensive MasterScope analysis to assess VM impact and package conflicts. - Bill: - Annotate the main bibliography page to enable direct links to individual entries. - Frank: - Review and test Ron's T-Edit PR. - Ron: - Continue awaiting reviews for the MCCS Unix GetEnv and T-Edit PRs.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly February 11, 2026  •  86 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Fix Zotero capitalization/naming issues Larry Masinter-lisp Update our Zotero issue re: Abe’s citation fix Herb Jellinek Fix Primer typo via change request Paolo Amoroso Experiment: run MasterScope on all sources/library; report conflicts Larry Masinter-lisp Create GitHub issue re: MasterScope 'quote' relation Larry Masinter-lisp Debug Medley font support; verify HTML stream uses MedleyFont methods Herb Jellinek Review Ron’s T-Edit PR; merge into current work Frank Halasz Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development, progress, and blockers. Key Takeaways Zotero Bug Fixed: A Zotero bug mis-categorizing citations as books was fixed by an external PR, resolving a long-standing issue. MasterScope Overhaul Proposed: A major MasterScope overhaul is proposed to enable precise searches for quoted atoms (e.g., edit where any quotes Foo), a capability currently lacking. HTML Stream Progress: Herb's HTML Stream is functional again, with font coercions working. The next step is debugging why it isn't reading Medley's font files. Notecards Revival: Frank has revived ~75% of Notecards, but the collaborative network server is still missing. Finding the source code for key applications like IDE is a priority. Topics Zotero Citation Bug Problem: Zotero was mis-categorizing some citations as books. Solution: Abe Jellinek submitted a PR to Zotero's Citation Style Language (CSL) that was recently merged. Impact: The fix is live, resolving the issue. Herb will update the corresponding internal ticket. Primer Editing Access Problem: Paolo could not edit the Primer document, despite having "editor" status. Resolution: Larry granted administrator privileges, which immediately enabled editing access. Significance: This highlights a non-robust permission system where a user's status (e.g., "editor") doesn't always grant the expected capabilities. Hard Copy Generation & MasterScope Problem: The hard copy generator fails on many files, producing opaque errors. Proposed Fix (Larry): A simple fix to report the filename with each error, making failures visible and grep-able. Long-Term Goal (Ron): A more precise code search tool than grep or current MasterScope. Use Case: Find all occurrences of a quoted atom, e.g., edit where any quotes Foo. Rationale: Current tools are either too noisy (grep) or lack the required semantic understanding (MasterScope doesn't index quoted atoms). Technical Challenges: Scope: MasterScope's analysis is limited to sysfiles to prevent system state corruption from loading arbitrary code. VM Size: A comprehensive analysis of all source files may exceed the VM's capacity (currently at 94%). Merging: MasterScope databases can be merged, offering a potential path to a comprehensive index. HTML Stream & Font Support Status: Herb's HTML Stream is functional again, successfully performing font coercions (e.g., gotcha → Noto Sans Mono). Blocker: The stream is not reading Medley's font files. Hypothesis: The method order for font handling is incorrect, causing the stream to use its own methods instead of Medley's generics. Next Step: Herb will debug this issue; Ron offered assistance. Notecards Revival Status: Frank has revived ~75% of the Notecards application. Missing Feature: The network server for collaborative, shared databases. Rationale: This was a key requirement from the original CIA contract to enable multi-user access. Missing Code: Source for key applications built on Notecards, such as the Instructional Design Environment (IDE). Future Work: Frank plans to find and revive these missing components, potentially by contacting original developers like Kathy Marshall. Next Steps Herb: Update the internal ticket for the Zotero citation bug. Debug the HTML Stream issue with Medley font file reading. Larry: Create a GitHub issue to discuss extending MasterScope for quoted atom searches. Experiment with a comprehensive MasterScope analysis to assess VM impact and package conflicts. Bill: Annotate the main bibliography page to enable direct links to individual entries. Frank: Review and test Ron's T-Edit PR. Ron: Continue awaiting reviews for the MCCS Unix GetEnv and T-Edit PRs.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Finalize the MCCS character encoding strategy and review weekly progress. Key Takeaways - PR #2474 Approved: This PR fixes critical OS string handling (e.g., printer names) by masquerading ISO 8859-1 as UTF-8 during startup. - MCCS Encoding Decision: New MCCS files will use a stable 2-byte-per-character encoding for non-ASCII characters. This enables fast, byte-level searches via FilePos, fixing a major limitation of the current ambiguous run-coded format. - GitHub Display Issue: The underscore (_) character, which Medley maps to a non-ASCII code for compatibility with the left-arrow (←) assignment operator, displays as a replacement character (``) in GitHub. A new issue will propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. - T-Edit Read-Only Files: T-Edit's restrictive read-only file handling will be relaxed. Users will be able to edit files and save them under a new name, with the only restriction being an inability to overwrite the original read-only file. Topics MCCS Encoding Ambiguity - Problem: The current MCCS encoding is ambiguous. A single character can have multiple byte representations (e.g., a single byte in a run-coded sequence vs. a 2-byte sequence), which breaks byte-level functions like FilePos and FFilePos. - Solution: Adopt a stable, unambiguous encoding for new MCCS files. - Character Set 0 (ASCII/ISO 8859-1): Remains run-coded (1 byte per character) for space efficiency. - All Other Character Sets: Use a 2-byte sequence (charset byte + character byte). - Rationale: The 2-byte approach is simpler to implement than run-coding, especially for T-Edit. It also avoids the complexity of handling spaces, which would otherwise require frequent character set switching. - Legacy Files: Existing files will be read correctly. The new encoding only applies to files written by the system. PR #2474 & GitHub Display Issue - PR #2474: Approved. Fixes OS string handling by masquerading ISO 8859-1 as UTF-8 during startup. - GitHub Display Issue: The underscore (_) character displays as a replacement character (``) in GitHub. - Cause: Medley maps _ to a non-ASCII code to avoid conflict with the left-arrow (←) assignment operator. GitHub interprets this as an invalid UTF-8 sequence. - Decision: The PR is correct. The display issue is a known limitation of GitHub's UTF-8-only rendering. A new issue will propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. T-Edit Read-Only File Handling - Problem: T-Edit's read-only file handling is too restrictive, preventing users from editing a file and saving it under a new name. - Solution: Relax the read-only restrictions. - Allowed: All edit operations (typing, formatting, find/replace). - Restricted: The Put operation will be blocked if the target file name (ignoring version numbers) is identical to the original read-only file. - Rationale: This allows users to modify and save read-only content to a new location without risking accidental changes to the original source. Font & Display Topics - Font Coverage Tool: Herb updated a tool to identify Unicode characters not covered by specific fonts, prompted by a discussion on using PDF fonts. - PDF Fonts: The goal is to replace the current font faking algorithms (for bold/italic) with complete display font sets derived from external sources like Noto. - T-Edit Layout Bug: Matt reported a bug where T-Edit allows paragraphs wider than the page, causing text to wrap incorrectly into the left margin. Next Steps - Larry: Create an issue to propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. - Larry: Create an issue to document the decision for a 2-byte-per-character MCCS encoding. - Ron: Implement the relaxed read-only file handling in T-Edit, as defined in the relevant issue. - Ron: Document the special handling of rem.cm in shell scripts to prevent confusion. - Ron: Investigate the T-Edit layout bug where paragraphs exceed page width. - Matt: Populate the PDF fonts issue with details on creating a complete display font set.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly February 16, 2026  •  129 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Finalize the MCCS character encoding strategy and review weekly progress. Key Takeaways PR #2474 Approved: This PR fixes critical OS string handling (e.g., printer names) by masquerading ISO 8859-1 as UTF-8 during startup. MCCS Encoding Decision: New MCCS files will use a stable 2-byte-per-character encoding for non-ASCII characters. This enables fast, byte-level searches via FilePos, fixing a major limitation of the current ambiguous run-coded format. GitHub Display Issue: The underscore (_) character, which Medley maps to a non-ASCII code for compatibility with the left-arrow (←) assignment operator, displays as a replacement character (``) in GitHub. A new issue will propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. T-Edit Read-Only Files: T-Edit's restrictive read-only file handling will be relaxed. Users will be able to edit files and save them under a new name, with the only restriction being an inability to overwrite the original read-only file. Topics MCCS Encoding Ambiguity Problem: The current MCCS encoding is ambiguous. A single character can have multiple byte representations (e.g., a single byte in a run-coded sequence vs. a 2-byte sequence), which breaks byte-level functions like FilePos and FFilePos. Solution: Adopt a stable, unambiguous encoding for new MCCS files. Character Set 0 (ASCII/ISO 8859-1): Remains run-coded (1 byte per character) for space efficiency. All Other Character Sets: Use a 2-byte sequence (charset byte + character byte). Rationale: The 2-byte approach is simpler to implement than run-coding, especially for T-Edit. It also avoids the complexity of handling spaces, which would otherwise require frequent character set switching. Legacy Files: Existing files will be read correctly. The new encoding only applies to files written by the system. PR #2474 & GitHub Display Issue PR #2474: Approved. Fixes OS string handling by masquerading ISO 8859-1 as UTF-8 during startup. GitHub Display Issue: The underscore (_) character displays as a replacement character (``) in GitHub. Cause: Medley maps _ to a non-ASCII code to avoid conflict with the left-arrow (←) assignment operator. GitHub interprets this as an invalid UTF-8 sequence. Decision: The PR is correct. The display issue is a known limitation of GitHub's UTF-8-only rendering. A new issue will propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. T-Edit Read-Only File Handling Problem: T-Edit's read-only file handling is too restrictive, preventing users from editing a file and saving it under a new name. Solution: Relax the read-only restrictions. Allowed: All edit operations (typing, formatting, find/replace). Restricted: The Put operation will be blocked if the target file name (ignoring version numbers) is identical to the original read-only file. Rationale: This allows users to modify and save read-only content to a new location without risking accidental changes to the original source. Font & Display Topics Font Coverage Tool: Herb updated a tool to identify Unicode characters not covered by specific fonts, prompted by a discussion on using PDF fonts. PDF Fonts: The goal is to replace the current font faking algorithms (for bold/italic) with complete display font sets derived from external sources like Noto. T-Edit Layout Bug: Matt reported a bug where T-Edit allows paragraphs wider than the page, causing text to wrap incorrectly into the left margin. Next Steps Larry: Create an issue to propose renaming scripts to avoid underscores. Larry: Create an issue to document the decision for a 2-byte-per-character MCCS encoding. Ron: Implement the relaxed read-only file handling in T-Edit, as defined in the relevant issue. Ron: Document the special handling of rem.cm in shell scripts to prevent confusion. Ron: Investigate the T-Edit layout bug where paragraphs exceed page width. Matt: Populate the PDF fonts issue with details on creating a complete display font set. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Discuss documentation, website updates, and technical challenges. Key Takeaways - Documentation: Paolo will contact Jim Mowler (FreeDOS) to propose student projects: converting release notes to KeyEdit format and a general doc reorganization. - Website: The "In Memoriam" page will be updated with one-paragraph bios for each person detailing their Interlisp contributions. Larry will ask Paul McJones to write these. - Font Strategy: The team will generate complete Medley fonts (MRRs) from modern BDFs (e.g., Noto Sans) and deprecate the unreliable "faking" algorithms for bold/italic styles. - Repo Cleanup: The Medley8P repo will be streamlined by moving its obsolete directory to a new, separate repo, reducing the main download size. Topics Documentation & Website Updates - Student Documentation Project - Jim Mowler (FreeDOS) offered to connect technical writing students with open source projects. - Proposed Projects: - Convert release notes to KeyEdit format. - Reorganize existing documentation. - Create a project timeline from the bibliography. - (Private suggestion) Prepare docs for AI use (Bill). - "In Memoriam" Page - The page will be updated to provide context on each person's Interlisp contributions, as obituaries often lack this detail. - Initial Tasks: - Fix broken obituary links (Tietemann, Bober) using the Wayback Machine (Paolo submitted PR). - Write a one-paragraph bio for each person. Larry will ask Paul McJones. - Email Archives in Public Repos - A Loops.mail file in the public Loops repo contains names and addresses. - Decision: No immediate action. The file is in a non-text format (Lafitte mail file), which acts as a de facto obfuscation. The team will await an update from Allie on a larger email archive cleanup project. Font & Character Encoding - Font Faking vs. Complete Fonts - Problem: Medley's "faking" algorithms for bold/italic styles (e.g., skewing) are unreliable, especially for hard copy and accented characters. - Solution: Generate complete Medley fonts (MRRs) from modern BDF files (e.g., Noto Sans) to avoid faking. - Progress: A 72-point Noto Sans MRR is 6MB, and a 92-point Noto Serif Simplified Chinese MRR is 8MB, confirming file size is not a blocker. - Character Encoding Strategy - Problem: Ambiguity from multiple character sets (MCCS, XCCS) complicates file searching and display. - Proposed Solution (Ron): Standardize on UTF-8 for source files. - Method: Change the MCCS external format to use UTF-8 byte sequences for MCCS codes, preserving internal character semantics. - Rationale: This avoids a complex caching system and simplifies the codebase. - Prerequisite: Replace a problematic colon character in DEFINE-FILE-INFO with a control character to ensure valid UTF-8. Repository & Website Maintenance - Medley8P Repo Cleanup - Goal: Reduce the main repo's download size by removing obsolete files. - Plan: Move the obsolete directory to a new, separate repo. - Process: First, move the display-font-directory into obsolete before moving the entire obsolete directory. - Website & Tooling Updates - Bill is updating Hugo and Doxygen (both over a year old), which requires fixing breaking changes from Doxygen's new dark mode implementation. - Bill will also simplify the website's structure and update the README with current versions and update instructions. Next Steps - Paolo: - Contact Jim Mowler to propose student documentation projects (release notes conversion, doc reorganization, timeline). - Larry: - Ask Paul McJones to write one-paragraph bios for the "In Memoriam" page. - Ron: - Investigate the old-fonts and obsolete-fonts directories to identify anything worth retaining before the repo cleanup. - Bill: - Complete the Hugo/Doxygen update and simplify the website structure. - Update the README file with current versions and update instructions. - Team: - Await an update from Allie on the email archive cleanup project.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly February 18, 2026  •  113 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Discuss documentation, website updates, and technical challenges. Key Takeaways Documentation: Paolo will contact Jim Mowler (FreeDOS) to propose student projects: converting release notes to KeyEdit format and a general doc reorganization. Website: The "In Memoriam" page will be updated with one-paragraph bios for each person detailing their Interlisp contributions. Larry will ask Paul McJones to write these. Font Strategy: The team will generate complete Medley fonts (MRRs) from modern BDFs (e.g., Noto Sans) and deprecate the unreliable "faking" algorithms for bold/italic styles. Repo Cleanup: The Medley8P repo will be streamlined by moving its obsolete directory to a new, separate repo, reducing the main download size. Topics Documentation & Website Updates Student Documentation Project Jim Mowler (FreeDOS) offered to connect technical writing students with open source projects. Proposed Projects: Convert release notes to KeyEdit format. Reorganize existing documentation. Create a project timeline from the bibliography. (Private suggestion) Prepare docs for AI use (Bill). "In Memoriam" Page The page will be updated to provide context on each person's Interlisp contributions, as obituaries often lack this detail. Initial Tasks: Fix broken obituary links (Tietemann, Bober) using the Wayback Machine (Paolo submitted PR). Write a one-paragraph bio for each person. Larry will ask Paul McJones. Email Archives in Public Repos A Loops.mail file in the public Loops repo contains names and addresses. Decision: No immediate action. The file is in a non-text format (Lafitte mail file), which acts as a de facto obfuscation. The team will await an update from Allie on a larger email archive cleanup project. Font & Character Encoding Font Faking vs. Complete Fonts Problem: Medley's "faking" algorithms for bold/italic styles (e.g., skewing) are unreliable, especially for hard copy and accented characters. Solution: Generate complete Medley fonts (MRRs) from modern BDF files (e.g., Noto Sans) to avoid faking. Progress: A 72-point Noto Sans MRR is 6MB, and a 92-point Noto Serif Simplified Chinese MRR is 8MB, confirming file size is not a blocker. Character Encoding Strategy Problem: Ambiguity from multiple character sets (MCCS, XCCS) complicates file searching and display. Proposed Solution (Ron): Standardize on UTF-8 for source files. Method: Change the MCCS external format to use UTF-8 byte sequences for MCCS codes, preserving internal character semantics. Rationale: This avoids a complex caching system and simplifies the codebase. Prerequisite: Replace a problematic colon character in DEFINE-FILE-INFO with a control character to ensure valid UTF-8. Repository & Website Maintenance Medley8P Repo Cleanup Goal: Reduce the main repo's download size by removing obsolete files. Plan: Move the obsolete directory to a new, separate repo. Process: First, move the display-font-directory into obsolete before moving the entire obsolete directory. Website & Tooling Updates Bill is updating Hugo and Doxygen (both over a year old), which requires fixing breaking changes from Doxygen's new dark mode implementation. Bill will also simplify the website's structure and update the README with current versions and update instructions. Next Steps Paolo: Contact Jim Mowler to propose student documentation projects (release notes conversion, doc reorganization, timeline). Larry: Ask Paul McJones to write one-paragraph bios for the "In Memoriam" page. Ron: Investigate the old-fonts and obsolete-fonts directories to identify anything worth retaining before the repo cleanup. Bill: Complete the Hugo/Doxygen update and simplify the website structure. Update the README file with current versions and update instructions. Team: Await an update from Allie on the email archive cleanup project. View Meeting →

[Nick Briggs]

It's not as though having CR instead of LF is actually obfuscating anything -- but I'd bet that not a one of the addresses there is still valid.

On Feb 18, 2026, at 11:56, 'Fathom' via Medley Interlisp core <lisp...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

• Email Archives in Public Repos

• • A Loops.mail file in the public Loops repo contains names and addresses.

[Arun Welch]

As someone who’s actually in those emails, I can confirm that none of those addresses exist anymore. It’s mostly Bob (via a ! address that doesn’t exist anymore), John, some folks from Xerox with : addresses, and myself.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways - UTF-8 Loadup Fixed: The make-sys process now correctly loads UTF-8 source files by pre-loading Unicode support into the init.sysout, resolving a critical bug where special characters like ← were corrupted. - Font Generation Progress: Matt generated 3,250 Medley font files from Noto sources, but the process hits a VM storage limit, suggesting a memory leak. A plan was approved to create missing Noto Sans Mono bold/italic variants by modifying existing Noto fonts. - Mako Build on Hold: A new Mako build with libbsd is blocked. The build environment (Ubuntu 20.04) is past its end-of-life, and the new Mako assets are incompatible, requiring an upgrade of the online system. - NOBIND Behavior: The NOBIND symbol's behavior—returning it instead of signaling an error for unbound variables—is a known design choice from the 1980s. A GitHub issue will be created to document this and explore potential debugging improvements. Topics UTF-8 Loadup Fix - Problem: The make-sys process failed to load UTF-8 source files correctly, corrupting special characters like ← (left arrow) and ^ (circumflex). - Root Cause: The Unicode file, which defines UTF-8 support, was loaded after other UTF-8 files (e.g., DWIMIFY) in the load-up-list, causing them to be read with the wrong encoding. - Solution: - Pre-load Unicode support: A new file, Unicode Formats, now defines UTF-8 support and is included in the init.sysout. - Compile tables at build time: Unicode Formats uses an E command to evaluate a script during the init.sysout dump. This script reads the large Unicode mapping tables (10,000+ pairs) and embeds the resulting data structure directly into the file. - Result: The init.sysout now contains all necessary Unicode definitions, allowing the load-up-list to process UTF-8 files correctly from the start. DEFINEFILEINFO Read Table Proposal - Problem: The DEFINEFILEINFO expression at the top of source files uses a non-standard read table to avoid conflicts with the colon character (:), which was an ordinary character in older Interlisp versions. This makes file headers hard to read externally. - Proposal: Incrementally update DEFINEFILEINFO expressions to use the standard Interlisp read table, which interprets : as a package delimiter. - Implementation Plan: 1. When a file is saved, MAKEFILE NEW will write the DEFINEFILEINFO expression using the standard read table. 2. The system's file parser will detect the new format by checking for a colon after the DEFINEFILEINFO keyword. 3. If a colon is present, the parser will use the standard read table for that expression; otherwise, it will use the old read table for backward compatibility. Font Generation & Memory Leak - Progress: Matt generated 3,250 Medley font files from the Noto family, covering all selected variations and sizes. - Issue: The font generation process consistently hits a VM storage limit. - Hypothesis: A memory leak, possibly from objects being held in the font cache or from uncollected circular structures. - Test: A test run reading PDFs without writing font files will help isolate the cause. - Plan for Missing Fonts: - Noto Sans Mono lacks bold and italic variants. - Solution: Create these variants by modifying existing Noto Sans (proportional) fonts. - Method: Generate BDFs from a condensed Noto Sans font, then manually adjust glyph widths and shift bitmaps to fit the monospaced grid. Mako Build & Online System Upgrade - Blocker: A new Mako build with libbsd is ready, but it's incompatible with the online system's outdated Ubuntu 20.04 environment, which is past its end-of-life. - Impact: The new build includes critical fixes for functions like strlcat and strlcpy, which were missing from the old GLIBC. - Action: Frank will provide instructions for testing the new Mako build on the online system, which will likely require an Ubuntu upgrade. NOBIND Symbol Behavior - Issue: The NOBIND symbol is returned instead of an error being signaled when an unbound variable is evaluated. This behavior is a known design choice from the 1980s. - Impact: This can complicate debugging, especially within the LOOPS system. - Action: A GitHub issue will be created to document this behavior and explore potential debugging improvements, such as temporarily forcing an error on NOBIND during development. Career Advice Request - Kabir Gupta, a University of Alberta student, requested informational interviews with the team for career guidance. - Action: All participants agreed to be contacted. Herb will provide Kabir's email address to the group. Next Steps - Ron: - Update the UTF-8 loadup PR for testing. - Create a GitHub issue for the NOBIND symbol behavior. - Frank: - Provide instructions for testing the new Mako build on the online system. - Matt: - Test the font generation process without writing files to isolate the memory leak. - Herb: - Share team emails with Kabir Gupta for informational interviews. - Larry: - Move old fonts to a new obsolete repository.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly February 23, 2026  •  121 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and issues. Key Takeaways UTF-8 Loadup Fixed: The make-sys process now correctly loads UTF-8 source files by pre-loading Unicode support into the init.sysout, resolving a critical bug where special characters like ← were corrupted. Font Generation Progress: Matt generated 3,250 Medley font files from Noto sources, but the process hits a VM storage limit, suggesting a memory leak. A plan was approved to create missing Noto Sans Mono bold/italic variants by modifying existing Noto fonts. Mako Build on Hold: A new Mako build with libbsd is blocked. The build environment (Ubuntu 20.04) is past its end-of-life, and the new Mako assets are incompatible, requiring an upgrade of the online system. NOBIND Behavior: The NOBIND symbol's behavior—returning it instead of signaling an error for unbound variables—is a known design choice from the 1980s. A GitHub issue will be created to document this and explore potential debugging improvements. Topics UTF-8 Loadup Fix Problem: The make-sys process failed to load UTF-8 source files correctly, corrupting special characters like ← (left arrow) and ^ (circumflex). Root Cause: The Unicode file, which defines UTF-8 support, was loaded after other UTF-8 files (e.g., DWIMIFY) in the load-up-list, causing them to be read with the wrong encoding. Solution: Pre-load Unicode support: A new file, Unicode Formats, now defines UTF-8 support and is included in the init.sysout. Compile tables at build time: Unicode Formats uses an E command to evaluate a script during the init.sysout dump. This script reads the large Unicode mapping tables (10,000+ pairs) and embeds the resulting data structure directly into the file. Result: The init.sysout now contains all necessary Unicode definitions, allowing the load-up-list to process UTF-8 files correctly from the start. DEFINEFILEINFO Read Table Proposal Problem: The DEFINEFILEINFO expression at the top of source files uses a non-standard read table to avoid conflicts with the colon character (:), which was an ordinary character in older Interlisp versions. This makes file headers hard to read externally. Proposal: Incrementally update DEFINEFILEINFO expressions to use the standard Interlisp read table, which interprets : as a package delimiter. Implementation Plan: When a file is saved, MAKEFILE NEW will write the DEFINEFILEINFO expression using the standard read table. The system's file parser will detect the new format by checking for a colon after the DEFINEFILEINFO keyword. If a colon is present, the parser will use the standard read table for that expression; otherwise, it will use the old read table for backward compatibility. Font Generation & Memory Leak Progress: Matt generated 3,250 Medley font files from the Noto family, covering all selected variations and sizes. Issue: The font generation process consistently hits a VM storage limit. Hypothesis: A memory leak, possibly from objects being held in the font cache or from uncollected circular structures. Test: A test run reading PDFs without writing font files will help isolate the cause. Plan for Missing Fonts: Noto Sans Mono lacks bold and italic variants. Solution: Create these variants by modifying existing Noto Sans (proportional) fonts. Method: Generate BDFs from a condensed Noto Sans font, then manually adjust glyph widths and shift bitmaps to fit the monospaced grid. Mako Build & Online System Upgrade Blocker: A new Mako build with libbsd is ready, but it's incompatible with the online system's outdated Ubuntu 20.04 environment, which is past its end-of-life. Impact: The new build includes critical fixes for functions like strlcat and strlcpy, which were missing from the old GLIBC. Action: Frank will provide instructions for testing the new Mako build on the online system, which will likely require an Ubuntu upgrade. NOBIND Symbol Behavior Issue: The NOBIND symbol is returned instead of an error being signaled when an unbound variable is evaluated. This behavior is a known design choice from the 1980s. Impact: This can complicate debugging, especially within the LOOPS system. Action: A GitHub issue will be created to document this behavior and explore potential debugging improvements, such as temporarily forcing an error on NOBIND during development. Career Advice Request Kabir Gupta, a University of Alberta student, requested informational interviews with the team for career guidance. Action: All participants agreed to be contacted. Herb will provide Kabir's email address to the group. Next Steps Ron: Update the UTF-8 loadup PR for testing. Create a GitHub issue for the NOBIND symbol behavior. Frank: Provide instructions for testing the new Mako build on the online system. Matt: Test the font generation process without writing files to isolate the memory leak. Herb: Share team emails with Kabir Gupta for informational interviews. Larry: Move old fonts to a new obsolete repository. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review project status, discuss new proposals, and clear the PR queue. Key Takeaways - UTF-8 Support Ready: PR #2512, which adds full UTF-8 support to the Medley load-up, is stable and ready for merge. - Issue Cleanup Initiative: To address the growing backlog of ~580 open issues, reporters will now verify and close their own issues, starting this week. - Repo Restructuring: The obsolete/ directory will be moved to a separate repo to declutter the main Medley repo. A new font-sources repo will also be created for font development assets. - Build System Updates: The libbsd build for Ubuntu 24.04 requires specific flags (-I/usr/include/bsd, -D_DEFAULT_SOURCE) to enable "overlay mode," which correctly includes BSD-specific headers and prevents pointer-size errors. Topics Project & Admin Updates - HTMLStream Fix: A panic in HTMLStream was fixed. - Cause: Incorrectly calling a fgetwith macro on a font spec list instead of the expected car set info object. - Outcome: The fix was pushed to the HTMLStream repo, resolving the crashes. - Student Onboarding: A student, Kabir, is struggling with the distinction between Lisp packages and pseudo-hosts. - Impact: This confusion causes lost setup work between Medley sessions. - Resolution: Herb is providing guidance and resources (e.g., the IRM) to help clarify the concepts. - Documentation & Outreach: - XCCS Spec: To provide a stable, permanent link for IANA, the XCCS spec will be uploaded to the Internet Archive. - Xerox Standards: Herb is contacting Stanford Libraries to locate their collection of Xerox network standards documents. - Fellowship Application: A letter of endorsement was submitted for student Ellie's ACM Computer History Fellowship application, which focuses on the email archive. Issue & PR Management - Problem: The project has ~580 open issues, with many likely fixed but not closed. - Proposed Solution: A quarterly "bug bash" week to focus on issue cleanup. - Immediate Action: All team members will review and close their own open issues, starting this week. - Process Improvement: To prevent future disconnects, all PRs should reference the issues they address (e.g., Addresses #123). Build System & Infrastructure - libbsd Build Fix (Ubuntu 24.04): - Problem: The standard -lbsd flag is insufficient for building on Ubuntu 24.04. - Cause: BSD-specific functions (e.g., stricat) require headers from bsd/string.h, not string.h. Without the correct include path, the compiler defaults to integer arguments, causing 64-bit pointer truncation errors. - Solution: Use specific CMake/compiler flags to enable "overlay mode": - -I/usr/include/bsd - -D_DEFAULT_SOURCE - -lbsd - online.interlisp.org Server Automation: - Goal: Automate server configuration to simplify upgrades from the current Ubuntu 20.04 system. - Tool: Ansible was suggested as a lightweight, SSH-based option. - Status: Frank is developing GitHub Actions to streamline the process of deploying draft Medley releases to the test server. Repo Restructuring & Font Management - Problem: The obsolete/ directory in the main Medley repo clutters the workspace and complicates development. - Solution: Move the obsolete/ directory to a new, separate obsolete repo. - Rationale: This declutters the main repo while preserving the history of the moved files in the new repo. - Future Font Management: - Goal: Create a dedicated font-sources repo for all font development assets (BDFs, PDFs, scripts). - Rationale: This separates active release files from source files needed only for rebuilding fonts. - Status: Ron is developing a new import-fonts package to generalize the font import process. PR Review & Merges - PR #2512 (UTF-8 Load-up): - Status: Stable and ready for merge. - Functionality: Adds full UTF-8 support to the Medley load-up, including compiler modes and a new starter sysout. - PR #2518 (UTF-8 File Converter): - Status: Ready for merge. - Functionality: A utility function to convert individual files to UTF-8. - Side Benefit: The conversion process identifies files with incorrect CL compile file properties, which cause silent compiler failures. - PR #2503 (Move obsolete/): - Status: Approved. - Action: Merging will move the obsolete/ directory to its new repo. - PR #2522 (directorynameP Fix): - Status: Ready for merge. - Functionality: Fixes directorynameP to correctly return true for the top-level core directory. - Other PRs: Several older, minor PRs were closed to clean up the queue. Next Steps - All: Review and close your own open issues this week. - Larry: Merge PRs #2512, #2518, #2503, and #2522. - Larry: Investigate Ansible for server automation. - Ron: Continue developing the import-fonts package. - Frank: Test the libbsd CMake changes on macOS. - Frank: Complete the GitHub Actions for deploying draft releases. - Herb: Upload the XCCS spec to the Internet Archive.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

March 02, 2026  •  107 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Upload XCCS spec to Internet Archive under 'Additional Interlisp-T documents' Herb Jellinek Coordinate team to review/close own open GitHub issues this week; report next meeting Larry Masinter-lisp Update Linux build to use libbsd overlay; test on macOS Larry Masinter-lisp Investigate Ansible for online.interlisp.org config; plan Ubuntu 20.04→24.04 upgrade Larry Masinter-lisp Send Norwegian Consumer Council 'incentivification' video link to Larry Nick Briggs Update fonts PR to move clearly obsolete files to obsolete repo; keep fonts in Medley for now Larry Masinter-lisp Remove Unicode load from read-pdf (now in load-up) Matt Heffron Delete PR #2516 branch locally and on remote Matt Heffron Approve PR #2518 (UTF-8 conversion utility) Larry Masinter-lisp Delete unpack-filename.string w/ COPS20 versions Ron Kaplan Delete pseudo-host optional-arg PR Matt Heffron Delete old local branches and their remote counterparts Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review project status, discuss new proposals, and clear the PR queue. Key Takeaways UTF-8 Support Ready: PR #2512, which adds full UTF-8 support to the Medley load-up, is stable and ready for merge. Issue Cleanup Initiative: To address the growing backlog of ~580 open issues, reporters will now verify and close their own issues, starting this week. Repo Restructuring: The obsolete/ directory will be moved to a separate repo to declutter the main Medley repo. A new font-sources repo will also be created for font development assets. Build System Updates: The libbsd build for Ubuntu 24.04 requires specific flags (-I/usr/include/bsd, -D_DEFAULT_SOURCE) to enable "overlay mode," which correctly includes BSD-specific headers and prevents pointer-size errors. Topics Project & Admin Updates HTMLStream Fix: A panic in HTMLStream was fixed. Cause: Incorrectly calling a fgetwith macro on a font spec list instead of the expected car set info object. Outcome: The fix was pushed to the HTMLStream repo, resolving the crashes. Student Onboarding: A student, Kabir, is struggling with the distinction between Lisp packages and pseudo-hosts. Impact: This confusion causes lost setup work between Medley sessions. Resolution: Herb is providing guidance and resources (e.g., the IRM) to help clarify the concepts. Documentation & Outreach: XCCS Spec: To provide a stable, permanent link for IANA, the XCCS spec will be uploaded to the Internet Archive. Xerox Standards: Herb is contacting Stanford Libraries to locate their collection of Xerox network standards documents. Fellowship Application: A letter of endorsement was submitted for student Ellie's ACM Computer History Fellowship application, which focuses on the email archive. Issue & PR Management Problem: The project has ~580 open issues, with many likely fixed but not closed. Proposed Solution: A quarterly "bug bash" week to focus on issue cleanup. Immediate Action: All team members will review and close their own open issues, starting this week. Process Improvement: To prevent future disconnects, all PRs should reference the issues they address (e.g., Addresses #123). Build System & Infrastructure libbsd Build Fix (Ubuntu 24.04): Problem: The standard -lbsd flag is insufficient for building on Ubuntu 24.04. Cause: BSD-specific functions (e.g., stricat) require headers from bsd/string.h, not string.h. Without the correct include path, the compiler defaults to integer arguments, causing 64-bit pointer truncation errors. Solution: Use specific CMake/compiler flags to enable "overlay mode": -I/usr/include/bsd -D_DEFAULT_SOURCE -lbsd online.interlisp.org Server Automation: Goal: Automate server configuration to simplify upgrades from the current Ubuntu 20.04 system. Tool: Ansible was suggested as a lightweight, SSH-based option. Status: Frank is developing GitHub Actions to streamline the process of deploying draft Medley releases to the test server. Repo Restructuring & Font Management Problem: The obsolete/ directory in the main Medley repo clutters the workspace and complicates development. Solution: Move the obsolete/ directory to a new, separate obsolete repo. Rationale: This declutters the main repo while preserving the history of the moved files in the new repo. Future Font Management: Goal: Create a dedicated font-sources repo for all font development assets (BDFs, PDFs, scripts). Rationale: This separates active release files from source files needed only for rebuilding fonts. Status: Ron is developing a new import-fonts package to generalize the font import process. PR Review & Merges PR #2512 (UTF-8 Load-up): Status: Stable and ready for merge. Functionality: Adds full UTF-8 support to the Medley load-up, including compiler modes and a new starter sysout. PR #2518 (UTF-8 File Converter): Status: Ready for merge. Functionality: A utility function to convert individual files to UTF-8. Side Benefit: The conversion process identifies files with incorrect CL compile file properties, which cause silent compiler failures. PR #2503 (Move obsolete/): Status: Approved. Action: Merging will move the obsolete/ directory to its new repo. PR #2522 (directorynameP Fix): Status: Ready for merge. Functionality: Fixes directorynameP to correctly return true for the top-level core directory. Other PRs: Several older, minor PRs were closed to clean up the queue. Next Steps All: Review and close your own open issues this week. Larry: Merge PRs #2512, #2518, #2503, and #2522. Larry: Investigate Ansible for server automation. Ron: Continue developing the import-fonts package. Frank: Test the libbsd CMake changes on macOS. Frank: Complete the GitHub Actions for deploying draft releases. Herb: Upload the XCCS spec to the Internet Archive.

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Meeting Purpose Review project status, discuss technical issues, and align on next steps. Key Takeaways - Website Fixes: Paolo will fix the broken "Keystrokes" page layout by adding a type: docs metadata clause. Bill will investigate the best way to add sidebars to the 404 page, likely by converting it to a Markdown file with a similar metadata block. - Licensing Decision: Issue #2293 (adding licensing info to the Common repo) is closed. The repo contains files with unclear origins, making a blanket license inappropriate. The existing MIT license covers software, but media assets (e.g., logos) will remain unlicensed for now. - Font System Overhaul: Ron is building a generic font import system, which is exposing and fixing critical bugs in Font and MoveFontCares related to handling non-font files (e.g., .DS_Store) and generating font attributes. - Maiko Build System Update: Frank is refactoring Maiko's build system to integrate libbsd. This requires adopting pkg-config to automatically detect library flags, a change that will improve build reliability and prerequisite detection. Topics Website Fixes - Keystrokes Page Layout (#1962): - Problem: The page is missing sidebars. - Cause: A missing type: docs metadata clause. - Action: Paolo will submit a PR to add the clause and update the table with clearer descriptions (e.g., Ctrl-Y launches old exec) and warnings for OS-captured keys (e.g., Ctrl-Alt-L on Linux). - 404 Page Styling: - Problem: The page lacks sidebars. - Cause: The page is a raw HTML/template file, not a Markdown file with a metadata block. - Action: Bill will research Hugo's custom 404 page support to find the best fix. The goal is to convert the page to Markdown and add the necessary metadata. - "In Memoriam" Page: - Decision: The team rejected Bill's proposed "cards" layout as too cumbersome. - Action: The page will be a simple, single-page list of names with short, respectful paragraphs. Bill will implement this format. Licensing & Standards - Common Repo Licensing (#2293): - Decision: Close the issue. - Rationale: The repo contains files with unclear origins (e.g., a public domain C program, scripts from the project's past), making a single, blanket license inappropriate. - Xerox Standards Documents: - Goal: Locate and archive Xerox standards documents (e.g., Courier, Font Interchange Standard) to preserve project history. - Status: Stanford librarians are searching their archives. - Action: Herb will upload the existing scanned Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS) to archive.org and begin the process of registering it with IANA. Technical Deep Dives - Font System Overhaul (Ron): - Goal: Create a generic font import function with three stages: 1. External format → Medley font data. 2. Medley font data → MCCS (rearranging glyphs). 3. Completion (filling character sets via conversions). - Impact: This work is exposing and fixing critical edge cases, such as FontsAvailable failing on non-font files (e.g., .DS_Store) on macOS. - Maiko Build System Update (Frank): - Goal: Integrate libbsd into the build system. - Challenge: This requires a significant refactor of the makefiles. - Solution: Adopt pkg-config to automatically detect library compiler and linker flags. - Benefit: Improves build reliability and provides clearer error messages when prerequisites are missing. - Horizontal Scrolling Investigation (Paolo): - Problem: Paolo's attempt at native horizontal scrolling results in text corruption. - Alternative: Ron suggested using the LispUsers.ObjectWindow package. - Mechanism: Treat each line of text as a lightweight "image object" within a scrollable window. - Benefit: Handles scrolling automatically, simplifying implementation. - Action: Paolo will investigate ObjectWindow while continuing to debug the native scrolling issue. Next Steps - Paolo: - Submit PR to add type: docs to the "Keystrokes" page. - Update the "Keystrokes" table with clearer descriptions and OS-conflict warnings. - Investigate the LispUsers.ObjectWindow package for scrolling. - Bill: - Research Hugo's custom 404 page support. - Implement the simple, single-page "In Memoriam" layout. - Herb: - Upload the XCCS scan to archive.org. - Begin the IANA registration process for XCCS. - Frank: - Complete the Maiko build system refactor to use pkg-config. - Update CMake and its documentation. - Larry: - Contact James Gosling about the influence of Cedar/PCR on Java's garbage collection.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly March 04, 2026  •  65 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Submit PR to add type: docs to keystrokes page; fix layout Paolo Amoroso Review Doxy/Hugo 404; draft 404 w/ sidebars + clearer wording Bill Stumbo Close Common repo licensing issue 2293 Paolo Amoroso Reformat In Memoriam to simple page; validate/clean AI bios Bill Stumbo Upload XCCS scan to archive.org Herb Jellinek Submit XCCS registration to IANA Larry Masinter-lisp Email James Gosling re: Java GC origins; reference Mastodon thread Herb Jellinek Email James Gosling re: Java GC origins; reference Mastodon thread Larry Masinter-lisp Review Object Window/Image Object for line-based scrolling; report back to Ron Paolo Amoroso Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review project status, discuss technical issues, and align on next steps. Key Takeaways Website Fixes: Paolo will fix the broken "Keystrokes" page layout by adding a type: docs metadata clause. Bill will investigate the best way to add sidebars to the 404 page, likely by converting it to a Markdown file with a similar metadata block. Licensing Decision: Issue #2293 (adding licensing info to the Common repo) is closed. The repo contains files with unclear origins, making a blanket license inappropriate. The existing MIT license covers software, but media assets (e.g., logos) will remain unlicensed for now. Font System Overhaul: Ron is building a generic font import system, which is exposing and fixing critical bugs in Font and MoveFontCares related to handling non-font files (e.g., .DS_Store) and generating font attributes. Maiko Build System Update: Frank is refactoring Maiko's build system to integrate libbsd. This requires adopting pkg-config to automatically detect library flags, a change that will improve build reliability and prerequisite detection. Topics Website Fixes Keystrokes Page Layout (#1962): Problem: The page is missing sidebars. Cause: A missing type: docs metadata clause. Action: Paolo will submit a PR to add the clause and update the table with clearer descriptions (e.g., Ctrl-Y launches old exec) and warnings for OS-captured keys (e.g., Ctrl-Alt-L on Linux). 404 Page Styling: Problem: The page lacks sidebars. Cause: The page is a raw HTML/template file, not a Markdown file with a metadata block. Action: Bill will research Hugo's custom 404 page support to find the best fix. The goal is to convert the page to Markdown and add the necessary metadata. "In Memoriam" Page: Decision: The team rejected Bill's proposed "cards" layout as too cumbersome. Action: The page will be a simple, single-page list of names with short, respectful paragraphs. Bill will implement this format. Licensing & Standards Common Repo Licensing (#2293): Decision: Close the issue. Rationale: The repo contains files with unclear origins (e.g., a public domain C program, scripts from the project's past), making a single, blanket license inappropriate. Xerox Standards Documents: Goal: Locate and archive Xerox standards documents (e.g., Courier, Font Interchange Standard) to preserve project history. Status: Stanford librarians are searching their archives. Action: Herb will upload the existing scanned Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS) to archive.org and begin the process of registering it with IANA. Technical Deep Dives Font System Overhaul (Ron): Goal: Create a generic font import function with three stages: External format → Medley font data. Medley font data → MCCS (rearranging glyphs). Completion (filling character sets via conversions). Impact: This work is exposing and fixing critical edge cases, such as FontsAvailable failing on non-font files (e.g., .DS_Store) on macOS. Maiko Build System Update (Frank): Goal: Integrate libbsd into the build system. Challenge: This requires a significant refactor of the makefiles. Solution: Adopt pkg-config to automatically detect library compiler and linker flags. Benefit: Improves build reliability and provides clearer error messages when prerequisites are missing. Horizontal Scrolling Investigation (Paolo): Problem: Paolo's attempt at native horizontal scrolling results in text corruption. Alternative: Ron suggested using the LispUsers.ObjectWindow package. Mechanism: Treat each line of text as a lightweight "image object" within a scrollable window. Benefit: Handles scrolling automatically, simplifying implementation. Action: Paolo will investigate ObjectWindow while continuing to debug the native scrolling issue. Next Steps Paolo: Submit PR to add type: docs to the "Keystrokes" page. Update the "Keystrokes" table with clearer descriptions and OS-conflict warnings. Investigate the LispUsers.ObjectWindow package for scrolling. Bill: Research Hugo's custom 404 page support. Implement the simple, single-page "In Memoriam" layout. Herb: Upload the XCCS scan to archive.org. Begin the IANA registration process for XCCS. Frank: Complete the Maiko build system refactor to use pkg-config. Update CMake and its documentation. Larry: Contact James Gosling about the influence of Cedar/PCR on Java's garbage collection.

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Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and upcoming changes. Key Takeaways - Submodule PR (2532) is ready for review. It formalizes existing dependencies (Mako, Notecards) as Git submodules, simplifying release workflows but requiring a new Git workflow for developers. - An "unbound character" bug is blocking user interaction. The bug, likely tied to AskUser and inconsistent EOL handling (CR vs. LF), causes errors after simple input like 'N' for "no." - Paolo is developing a text-displaying ImageObject. The CompareSources tool was identified as a key reference for handling multi-line text and font escapes in an ObjectWindow. - The online server is running out of disk space. Frank will automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes and refactor Mako's Linux Makefiles to simplify the build process. Topics Submodule PR (2532) - Goal: Formalize existing dependencies (Mako, Notecards, Bloops) as Git submodules to simplify release workflows and ensure consistent builds. - Impact on Developer Workflow: - New Git Commands: Requires learning git submodule update and related commands. - Commit Management: Medley commits will point to specific submodule commit hashes, not branches. This requires a two-step commit: 1. Commit changes within the submodule's directory. 2. Commit the submodule's new commit hash from the parent Medley directory. - Branching: Submodule branches are independent of the parent Medley branch. - PR Status: - Ready for Review: Frank will test the PR this afternoon. - Required Update: The note-files repo must be added as a submodule of notecards. "Unbound Character" Bug - Problem: A persistent "unbound character" error occurs after user input, blocking interaction in functions like AskUser and SameDeer. - Root Cause (Hypothesis): Inconsistent End-of-Line (EOL) handling. - AskUser uses carecode of EOL, which is CR (13). - The system may be receiving LF (10) from the terminal, leaving it unhandled. - Troubleshooting: - Converting TTYIN to UTF-8 did not fix the issue. - Advising AskUser with clearbuff also failed. - Next Steps: - Convert AskUser to UTF-8 for consistency. - Analyze the intersection of files recently converted to UTF-8 and those using EOL character codes. ImageObject Development - Goal: Create a simple ImageObject to display a text string in an ObjectWindow. - Challenge: The ImageBox function must compute text size independently, as it cannot assume the Display function has already run. - Reference: The CompareSources tool (function: CSBrowser) was identified as a key example. - Why: It handles complex text, including multi-line strings and font escapes, and calculates size dynamically to maintain a consistent baseline. - Mechanism: It captures printed output into a string, then parses it to create CSObjectCreate image objects. Infrastructure & Build Updates - Online Server Disk Space: - Problem: The server is running out of space, primarily due to downloaded Docker images and old user volumes. - Solution: Frank will automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes and investigate increasing disk space. - Mako Build System Refactoring: - Goal: Simplify Mako's Linux Makefiles by creating a common include file. - Why: To eliminate redundant code and simplify maintenance across different Linux targets (e.g., M32 vs. M64 flags). - GitHub Actions Integration: - Frank is working on a feature to allow users to select a specific Mako release for their build. - This will require coordination with the new submodule structure. PR Review & Cleanup - PR 2502 (Delete file fonts): On hold pending Ron's font import work. - PR 2518 (UTF-8 converter): Approved by Larry. - PR 2521 (Font coercion docs): Approved by Larry. - PR 2522 (directory-name-piece bugfix): Trivial fix. - PR 2524 (MCCS font code cleanup): Marked as Draft. - Why: Ron plans to move legacy font recoding logic from MCCS into a new, dedicated file to improve modularity. - PR 2530 (DFV/TF utility): Trivial fix. - PR 2531 (Bootstrap update): Herb will review. Next Steps - Larry: - Update PR 2532 to include note-files as a submodule of notecards. - Mark PR 2524 as Draft. - Frank: - Test PR 2532 to validate the new submodule workflow. - Automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes on the online server. - Ron: - Investigate the "unbound character" bug, focusing on AskUser and EOL handling. - Create a new file for legacy font recoding logic, moving it out of MCCS. - Herb: - Review PR 2531. - Experiment with the new submodule workflow to understand its impact on development.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly March 09, 2026  •  134 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Convert AskUser to UTF-8; test for dangling LF Ron Kaplan Revert local octal-string change; use Nick's version Ron Kaplan Review CS Browser for multi-line image object height/descent Paolo Amoroso Check MongoDB save file location on Ubuntu server Frank Halasz Automate Docker volume cleanup for inactive users Frank Halasz Update submodule PR 2532: add note-files as submodule of notecards Larry Masinter-lisp Test submodule PR 2532; approve/comment Frank Halasz Review git submodule docs Herb Jellinek Define policy for Internal vs Lisp Users; rename files as needed Ron Kaplan Create MCCS-fonts file for legacy recoding; mark PR 2524 draft Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp development progress and upcoming changes. Key Takeaways Submodule PR (2532) is ready for review. It formalizes existing dependencies (Mako, Notecards) as Git submodules, simplifying release workflows but requiring a new Git workflow for developers. An "unbound character" bug is blocking user interaction. The bug, likely tied to AskUser and inconsistent EOL handling (CR vs. LF), causes errors after simple input like 'N' for "no." Paolo is developing a text-displaying ImageObject. The CompareSources tool was identified as a key reference for handling multi-line text and font escapes in an ObjectWindow. The online server is running out of disk space. Frank will automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes and refactor Mako's Linux Makefiles to simplify the build process. Topics Submodule PR (2532) Goal: Formalize existing dependencies (Mako, Notecards, Bloops) as Git submodules to simplify release workflows and ensure consistent builds. Impact on Developer Workflow: New Git Commands: Requires learning git submodule update and related commands. Commit Management: Medley commits will point to specific submodule commit hashes, not branches. This requires a two-step commit: Commit changes within the submodule's directory. Commit the submodule's new commit hash from the parent Medley directory. Branching: Submodule branches are independent of the parent Medley branch. PR Status: Ready for Review: Frank will test the PR this afternoon. Required Update: The note-files repo must be added as a submodule of notecards. "Unbound Character" Bug Problem: A persistent "unbound character" error occurs after user input, blocking interaction in functions like AskUser and SameDeer. Root Cause (Hypothesis): Inconsistent End-of-Line (EOL) handling. AskUser uses carecode of EOL, which is CR (13). The system may be receiving LF (10) from the terminal, leaving it unhandled. Troubleshooting: Converting TTYIN to UTF-8 did not fix the issue. Advising AskUser with clearbuff also failed. Next Steps: Convert AskUser to UTF-8 for consistency. Analyze the intersection of files recently converted to UTF-8 and those using EOL character codes. ImageObject Development Goal: Create a simple ImageObject to display a text string in an ObjectWindow. Challenge: The ImageBox function must compute text size independently, as it cannot assume the Display function has already run. Reference: The CompareSources tool (function: CSBrowser) was identified as a key example. Why: It handles complex text, including multi-line strings and font escapes, and calculates size dynamically to maintain a consistent baseline. Mechanism: It captures printed output into a string, then parses it to create CSObjectCreate image objects. Infrastructure & Build Updates Online Server Disk Space: Problem: The server is running out of space, primarily due to downloaded Docker images and old user volumes. Solution: Frank will automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes and investigate increasing disk space. Mako Build System Refactoring: Goal: Simplify Mako's Linux Makefiles by creating a common include file. Why: To eliminate redundant code and simplify maintenance across different Linux targets (e.g., M32 vs. M64 flags). GitHub Actions Integration: Frank is working on a feature to allow users to select a specific Mako release for their build. This will require coordination with the new submodule structure. PR Review & Cleanup PR 2502 (Delete file fonts): On hold pending Ron's font import work. PR 2518 (UTF-8 converter): Approved by Larry. PR 2521 (Font coercion docs): Approved by Larry. PR 2522 (directory-name-piece bugfix): Trivial fix. PR 2524 (MCCS font code cleanup): Marked as Draft. Why: Ron plans to move legacy font recoding logic from MCCS into a new, dedicated file to improve modularity. PR 2530 (DFV/TF utility): Trivial fix. PR 2531 (Bootstrap update): Herb will review. Next Steps Larry: Update PR 2532 to include note-files as a submodule of notecards. Mark PR 2524 as Draft. Frank: Test PR 2532 to validate the new submodule workflow. Automate the cleanup of old Docker volumes on the online server. Ron: Investigate the "unbound character" bug, focusing on AskUser and EOL handling. Create a new file for legacy font recoding logic, moving it out of MCCS. Herb: Review PR 2531. Experiment with the new submodule workflow to understand its impact on development.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review project status, resolve documentation issues, and align on technical strategy. Key Takeaways - Bibliography Cleanup: Removing 18 non-historical documentation PDFs from the bibliography and testing the PubPDFs repo for deletion, as its content is now redundant with the reports directory. - Git Submodules Adopted: The project is adopting Git submodules to link repos (e.g., Medley to MICO) to specific commits, enabling coordinated changes and stable versioning. - Font System Overhaul: The font import process is being refactored into a multi-phase, offline pipeline to fix incorrect character faking and simplify runtime logic, using a new Unicode character name database for clarity. - Donor Acknowledgement: A process for publicly acknowledging donors on the website will be implemented, with an option for anonymity, to encourage new contributions. Topics Documentation & Bibliography Cleanup - Issue #2493: Bibliography Cleanup - Problem: 18 non-historical documentation PDFs were incorrectly added to the bibliography. - Solution: Remove these 18 entries from the bibliography and the pubPDFs directory. - Rationale: All content is already available in the reports directory, ensuring no information loss. - PubPDFs Repo Redundancy - Problem: The PubPDFs repo is an experimental artifact now superseded by the Files Interlisp Board system. - Solution: Rename the repo to test for broken references. If none are found, delete it. Donor Acknowledgement Process - Issue #2141: Donor Tracking - Goal: Create a process to acknowledge donors publicly on the project website. - Process: - List donors who grant permission. - Include an "Anonymous" option. - Exclude donation amounts to simplify bookkeeping. - Rationale: Public acknowledgement can encourage new and repeat donations, which are needed for project sustainability. Git Submodules Strategy - Decision: Adopt Git submodules to manage dependencies between project repos (e.g., Medley → MICO). - Benefit: Enables coordinated changes and stable versioning by linking a parent repo to a specific commit in a submodule. - Workflow Implications: - Independent Work: Repos can still be worked on independently. - Coordinated Work: Requires updating the parent repo's submodule pointer after a change. - GitFunds Integration: - Initial Plan: Treat submodules as separate projects. - Future Need: PRC (comparison function) may need to handle changes across parent and submodule repos. Font System Overhaul - Problem: The current font import process has incorrect logic for "faking" (bolding/italicizing) characters, leading to suboptimal results. - Solution: Multi-Phase Offline Import - Phase 1: Import all available glyphs from source files. - Phase 2: Fill in missing characters via coercion from a designated fallback font (e.g., Noto Mono). - Phase 3: Fake bold/italic faces only for characters still missing, using the best available regular face. - Goal: Simplify runtime logic by removing the need for find-file calls to locate fonts, as all necessary data will be pre-compiled. - New Tool: Unicode Character Name Database - Purpose: Improve readability and maintainability of font mapping tables. - Action: Herb will generate an S-expression file mapping Unicode code points to their official names (and aliases). - Implementation: Ron will load this into a hash table for use in the font import process. Round Table & Technical Updates - Herb: - Fixed a bug in the HTML stream related to get-karaset stomping a font descriptor field. - Temporarily disabled Medley font support to stabilize the stream. - Investigating RTF support, starting with RTF output via an image stream. - Ron: - Investigating an "unbound character" bug in Ask User related to DWIM spelling correction. - Matt: - Recovered from accidentally deleting a WSL instance. - Will commit ~3,000 recoded BDF-to-Medley font files to a temporary directory for use in the new import process. - Frank: - Completed LibBSD work and refactored Mako's Makefiles for better maintainability. - Paolo: - Clarified image object functions: - copy-function: A programmatic, low-level copy of the object's data structure. - copy-button-event: A user-initiated action (e.g., "copy selection"). - Demonstrated a Z18 disassembler font using OpenType Grip Substitution Tables. Next Steps - Larry: - Rename the PubPDFs repo to test for broken references. - Remove 18 non-historical PDFs from the bibliography and the PubPDFs repo. - Herb: - Generate the Unicode character name database (S-expression file) for Ron. - Ron: - Integrate the Unicode character name database into the font import process. - Finalize the multi-phase font import logic. - Matt: - Commit ~3,000 recoded BDF-to-Medley font files to the fonts/import/bdf/mccs directory. - Paolo: - Add a donor acknowledgement list to the project website. - Post social media reminders about donations. - All: - Adopt the Git submodule workflow for coordinated changes.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly March 11, 2026  •  113 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Clear LIDA disk space Frank Halasz Rename PubPDFs; test refs; delete if no breakage Larry Masinter-lisp Search bibliography for PubPDF refs; update to Files repo Matt Heffron Remove 18 docs-as-PDFs from bibliography and PubPDFs Paolo Amoroso Publish donor list on donate page; include Anonymous; no amounts Paolo Amoroso Post donation reminder on social profiles w/ donate-page link Paolo Amoroso Email Beer re: venue sysout for Gabriel Benchmarks; ask setup/alloc/available Larry Masinter-lisp Email Matt the fonts/import/BDF/MCCS path for recoded BDFs Ron Kaplan Generate and send Unicode name→codepoint S-expr file to Ron Herb Jellinek Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Review project status, resolve documentation issues, and align on technical strategy. Key Takeaways Bibliography Cleanup: Removing 18 non-historical documentation PDFs from the bibliography and testing the PubPDFs repo for deletion, as its content is now redundant with the reports directory. Git Submodules Adopted: The project is adopting Git submodules to link repos (e.g., Medley to MICO) to specific commits, enabling coordinated changes and stable versioning. Font System Overhaul: The font import process is being refactored into a multi-phase, offline pipeline to fix incorrect character faking and simplify runtime logic, using a new Unicode character name database for clarity. Donor Acknowledgement: A process for publicly acknowledging donors on the website will be implemented, with an option for anonymity, to encourage new contributions. Topics Documentation & Bibliography Cleanup Issue #2493: Bibliography Cleanup Problem: 18 non-historical documentation PDFs were incorrectly added to the bibliography. Solution: Remove these 18 entries from the bibliography and the pubPDFs directory. Rationale: All content is already available in the reports directory, ensuring no information loss. PubPDFs Repo Redundancy Problem: The PubPDFs repo is an experimental artifact now superseded by the Files Interlisp Board system. Solution: Rename the repo to test for broken references. If none are found, delete it. Donor Acknowledgement Process Issue #2141: Donor Tracking Goal: Create a process to acknowledge donors publicly on the project website. Process: List donors who grant permission. Include an "Anonymous" option. Exclude donation amounts to simplify bookkeeping. Rationale: Public acknowledgement can encourage new and repeat donations, which are needed for project sustainability. Git Submodules Strategy Decision: Adopt Git submodules to manage dependencies between project repos (e.g., Medley → MICO). Benefit: Enables coordinated changes and stable versioning by linking a parent repo to a specific commit in a submodule. Workflow Implications: Independent Work: Repos can still be worked on independently. Coordinated Work: Requires updating the parent repo's submodule pointer after a change. GitFunds Integration: Initial Plan: Treat submodules as separate projects. Future Need: PRC (comparison function) may need to handle changes across parent and submodule repos. Font System Overhaul Problem: The current font import process has incorrect logic for "faking" (bolding/italicizing) characters, leading to suboptimal results. Solution: Multi-Phase Offline Import Phase 1: Import all available glyphs from source files. Phase 2: Fill in missing characters via coercion from a designated fallback font (e.g., Noto Mono). Phase 3: Fake bold/italic faces only for characters still missing, using the best available regular face. Goal: Simplify runtime logic by removing the need for find-file calls to locate fonts, as all necessary data will be pre-compiled. New Tool: Unicode Character Name Database Purpose: Improve readability and maintainability of font mapping tables. Action: Herb will generate an S-expression file mapping Unicode code points to their official names (and aliases). Implementation: Ron will load this into a hash table for use in the font import process. Round Table & Technical Updates Herb: Fixed a bug in the HTML stream related to get-karaset stomping a font descriptor field. Temporarily disabled Medley font support to stabilize the stream. Investigating RTF support, starting with RTF output via an image stream. Ron: Investigating an "unbound character" bug in Ask User related to DWIM spelling correction. Matt: Recovered from accidentally deleting a WSL instance. Will commit ~3,000 recoded BDF-to-Medley font files to a temporary directory for use in the new import process. Frank: Completed LibBSD work and refactored Mako's Makefiles for better maintainability. Paolo: Clarified image object functions: copy-function: A programmatic, low-level copy of the object's data structure. copy-button-event: A user-initiated action (e.g., "copy selection"). Demonstrated a Z18 disassembler font using OpenType Grip Substitution Tables. Next Steps Larry: Rename the PubPDFs repo to test for broken references. Remove 18 non-historical PDFs from the bibliography and the PubPDFs repo. Herb: Generate the Unicode character name database (S-expression file) for Ron. Ron: Integrate the Unicode character name database into the font import process. Finalize the multi-phase font import logic. Matt: Commit ~3,000 recoded BDF-to-Medley font files to the fonts/import/bdf/mccs directory. Paolo: Add a donor acknowledgement list to the project website. Post social media reminders about donations. All: Adopt the Git submodule workflow for coordinated changes.

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Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress. Key Takeaways - Mako Makefiles Refactored: Frank refactored Mako Makefiles for Linux, Cygwin, and WSL1 to use a common include, enabling automatic compiler detection (GCC/Clang) and simplifying libbsd dependency management. - Font Import Logic Defined: Ron's font import logic will use offline processing and a top-sort algorithm to build complete fonts from sources like Noto Sans. A key decision was made to auto-generate missing font sizes (e.g., Modern 16) to ensure inheritance chains are always complete. - IANA Registration Underway: Herb is drafting the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS to provide official identifiers, which will enable proper content-type headers (e.g., charset=xccs) for legacy documents. - Repo Housekeeping: The team will merge several pending Notecards PRs and standardize .gitattributes files across all repos to prevent file corruption from automatic CRLF conversions on binary files. Topics Mako Makefile Refactor - Goal: Simplify Makefiles and manage the libbsd dependency. - Solution: - Common Include: Refactored Linux, Cygwin, and WSL1 Makefiles to use a common include, drastically reducing file size and repetition. - Auto-Compiler Detection: Added logic to automatically detect and use GCC or Clang, with an override option. - libbsd Dependency: - Required for older Linux distros (e.g., Ubuntu < 24). - New build instructions must include installing libbsd-dev and pkg-config. - Related GitHub Actions Updates: - Updating all actions to Node 24 to resolve deprecation warnings. - Modifying Medley build scripts to allow building against specific Mako releases and deploying draft builds online for testing. - Developing an Ansible script to automate server setup and prevent future space issues. Font Import & Coercion Logic - Goal: Define a robust, offline font import process to create complete Medley fonts from sources like Noto Sans. - Process: 1. Offline Processing: All font construction occurs offline to ensure clean separation from runtime. 2. Top-Sort Coercion: A top-sort algorithm manages inheritance, ensuring dependencies are built first (e.g., Classic → Modern → Helvetica). 3. Faking: Italic/bold faces are faked after all inheritance is complete. - Key Decisions: - Missing Fonts: To resolve inheritance gaps (e.g., Helvetica 16 needing Modern 16), the process will auto-generate missing font sizes. This ensures inheritance chains are always complete. - Space Optimization: For fonts used only for inheritance (e.g., Noto Sans Thai), the Medley font file will be stripped of redundant glyphs (e.g., Character Set 0), storing only unique characters and indirect pointers. - Future Work: - Combining Characters: A design for handling combining characters (e.g., umlauts) is needed. - Unicode BMP: Matt will test importing the full Unicode Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP) into a Medley font. This is blocked by the font descriptor's 256-character set limit, requiring a format extension. Character Set Registration & Naming - IANA Registration: Herb is drafting the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS to provide official identifiers for legacy documents and future source code. - Character Naming: Ron needs shorter, more user-friendly character names than the official Unicode names. - Solution: Herb will augment the current S-expression mapping table with Unicode name aliases and potentially LaTeX math symbol names. Object Window Scrolling Behavior - Problem: Paolo reported two issues with object-window: 1. Content aligns to the bottom, not the top. 2. Horizontal scrolling extends infinitely left of the content. - Cause: The scroll-extent-use property was set to T, which disables extent-based scrolling. - Solution: Changing scroll-extent-use to (limit . limit) fixed the horizontal scrolling. The vertical alignment issue remains under investigation. Repo Housekeeping - Notecards PRs: The team will merge pending PRs (13, 20) and close an obsolete one (1). - .gitattributes Standardization: To prevent file corruption from automatic CRLF conversions, the team will standardize .gitattributes across all repos. - Action: Copy the binary file definitions from the medley repo to notecards, loops, and tests. - WSL Cursor Bug: Matt identified a WSL bug where the mouse cursor fails to change after a system sleep. A test case was submitted to the WSL GitHub repo. Next Steps - Frank: - Update build instructions with new Linux dependencies (libbsd-dev, pkg-config). - Complete GitHub Actions updates (Node 24, Medley build scripts). - Continue developing the Ansible server setup script. - Ron: - Finalize the font import and coercion logic. - Design a strategy for combining characters. - Investigate extending the Medley font format to support the full Unicode BMP. - Herb: - Finalize the XCCS IANA registration draft and circulate for review. - Add a license file to the lafitte-to-mbox converter repo. - Augment the MCCS-to-Unicode mapping table with name aliases. - Matt: - Merge pending PRs in the Notecards repo. - Standardize .gitattributes files across all repos. - Paolo: - Investigate the object-window code to fix the vertical alignment issue.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly March 16, 2026  •  117 mins  •  View Meeting

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Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress. Key Takeaways Mako Makefiles Refactored: Frank refactored Mako Makefiles for Linux, Cygwin, and WSL1 to use a common include, enabling automatic compiler detection (GCC/Clang) and simplifying libbsd dependency management. Font Import Logic Defined: Ron's font import logic will use offline processing and a top-sort algorithm to build complete fonts from sources like Noto Sans. A key decision was made to auto-generate missing font sizes (e.g., Modern 16) to ensure inheritance chains are always complete. IANA Registration Underway: Herb is drafting the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS to provide official identifiers, which will enable proper content-type headers (e.g., charset=xccs) for legacy documents. Repo Housekeeping: The team will merge several pending Notecards PRs and standardize .gitattributes files across all repos to prevent file corruption from automatic CRLF conversions on binary files. Topics Mako Makefile Refactor Goal: Simplify Makefiles and manage the libbsd dependency. Solution: Common Include: Refactored Linux, Cygwin, and WSL1 Makefiles to use a common include, drastically reducing file size and repetition. Auto-Compiler Detection: Added logic to automatically detect and use GCC or Clang, with an override option. libbsd Dependency: Required for older Linux distros (e.g., Ubuntu < 24). New build instructions must include installing libbsd-dev and pkg-config. Related GitHub Actions Updates: Updating all actions to Node 24 to resolve deprecation warnings. Modifying Medley build scripts to allow building against specific Mako releases and deploying draft builds online for testing. Developing an Ansible script to automate server setup and prevent future space issues. Font Import & Coercion Logic Goal: Define a robust, offline font import process to create complete Medley fonts from sources like Noto Sans. Process: Offline Processing: All font construction occurs offline to ensure clean separation from runtime. Top-Sort Coercion: A top-sort algorithm manages inheritance, ensuring dependencies are built first (e.g., Classic → Modern → Helvetica). Faking: Italic/bold faces are faked after all inheritance is complete. Key Decisions: Missing Fonts: To resolve inheritance gaps (e.g., Helvetica 16 needing Modern 16), the process will auto-generate missing font sizes. This ensures inheritance chains are always complete. Space Optimization: For fonts used only for inheritance (e.g., Noto Sans Thai), the Medley font file will be stripped of redundant glyphs (e.g., Character Set 0), storing only unique characters and indirect pointers. Future Work: Combining Characters: A design for handling combining characters (e.g., umlauts) is needed. Unicode BMP: Matt will test importing the full Unicode Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP) into a Medley font. This is blocked by the font descriptor's 256-character set limit, requiring a format extension. Character Set Registration & Naming IANA Registration: Herb is drafting the IANA registration for XCCS and MCCS to provide official identifiers for legacy documents and future source code. Character Naming: Ron needs shorter, more user-friendly character names than the official Unicode names. Solution: Herb will augment the current S-expression mapping table with Unicode name aliases and potentially LaTeX math symbol names. Object Window Scrolling Behavior Problem: Paolo reported two issues with object-window: Content aligns to the bottom, not the top. Horizontal scrolling extends infinitely left of the content. Cause: The scroll-extent-use property was set to T, which disables extent-based scrolling. Solution: Changing scroll-extent-use to (limit . limit) fixed the horizontal scrolling. The vertical alignment issue remains under investigation. Repo Housekeeping Notecards PRs: The team will merge pending PRs (13, 20) and close an obsolete one (1). .gitattributes Standardization: To prevent file corruption from automatic CRLF conversions, the team will standardize .gitattributes across all repos. Action: Copy the binary file definitions from the medley repo to notecards, loops, and tests. WSL Cursor Bug: Matt identified a WSL bug where the mouse cursor fails to change after a system sleep. A test case was submitted to the WSL GitHub repo. Next Steps Frank: Update build instructions with new Linux dependencies (libbsd-dev, pkg-config). Complete GitHub Actions updates (Node 24, Medley build scripts). Continue developing the Ansible server setup script. Ron: Finalize the font import and coercion logic. Design a strategy for combining characters. Investigate extending the Medley font format to support the full Unicode BMP. Herb: Finalize the XCCS IANA registration draft and circulate for review. Add a license file to the lafitte-to-mbox converter repo. Augment the MCCS-to-Unicode mapping table with name aliases. Matt: Merge pending PRs in the Notecards repo. Standardize .gitattributes files across all repos. Paolo: Investigate the object-window code to fix the vertical alignment issue. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review project progress, website issues, and technical challenges. Key Takeaways - ePAD Archive Strategy: The public-facing ePAD "Delivery" module redacts ~99% of content, rendering it useless for research. The team will pursue using the less restrictive "Discovery" module, which only redacts manually flagged items. - Website Analytics Gap: The team lacks 404 error logs, which are critical for identifying broken links and user navigation issues. This data is unavailable on GitHub Pages, prompting a discussion about migrating to a more robust host like Netlify. - Font System Overhaul: The font system is being refactored to simplify complex inheritance logic (e.g., Helvetica-MIR inheriting from Modern) and to support Unicode characters beyond the Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP). - CHM PARC Archive Link: The website will link to the Computer History Museum's (CHM) PARC archive landing page, which requires a click-through license, to respect their access policies. Topics ePAD Archive & Redaction - Goal: Make the Medley email archive navigable in ePAD with a finding aid. - Problem: The public-facing ePAD "Delivery" module redacts ~99% of content, showing only subject words. - Solution: Use the "Discovery" module, which only redacts manually flagged items. - Rationale: Herb's contact with ePAD architect Jochen Farver confirmed this module is suitable for research. - Redaction Scope: - Required: Personal medical/financial info, performance reviews, personnel issues, political meeting details. - Out of Scope: Family issues, social events. - Tooling: Herb's Lafitte to Mbox converter will be linked from the ePAD GitHub page. - Next Step: Ellie will post to the ePAD mailing list to discuss this strategy. Website Maintenance & Analytics - Issue 1388 (Short URLs): Most short URLs are implemented. The /#history fragment link from the CHM site is unfixable via redirects; the CHM should update their link. - Analytics Gap: The team lacks 404 error logs, which are unavailable on GitHub Pages. - Impact: Prevents identifying broken links and popular content areas. - Proposed Solution: Migrate to a host like Netlify, which offers better analytics. - Issue 2541 (Lisp Course Notes): The broken link will be fixed by pointing to the stable URL: interlisp.org/documentation/LispCourse.pdf. - Documentation Cleanup: The static/docs and static/documentation folders need consolidation. - static/docs: Contains only redirect files. - static/documentation: Contains PDFs, zips, and an empty HTML folder. - Document Classification: A "historical" tag will be used for old documents to guide storage and referencing. Font System Overhaul - Problem 1: Complex Inheritance Logic - Example: Helvetica-10-MIR (Medium Italic Regular) does not exist and inherits its slant from the Modern font. - Solution: Simplify the system by pre-computing and storing these "faked" fonts offline. - Problem 2: Unicode BMP Limitation - Issue: The TTF-to-Medley font conversion tool fails on characters outside the Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP), such as emojis. - Root Cause: The tool's source code uses an unsigned short for character encoding, which cannot represent code points >65,535. - Problem 3: XCCS/MCCS Recoding Performance - Challenge: Recoding thousands of XCCS/MCCS characters into Unicode. - Solution: Append new glyph bitmaps to the font file, avoiding expensive in-place manipulation. Project Updates - Ellie: Presented on the Interlisp bibliography at a student conference. - Bill: Updated GitHub Actions for Node.js 24 compatibility. - Frank: Merged Linux makefile PR after review with Gemini Code Review. - Finding: Gemini correctly identified issues but gave contradictory solution suggestions. - Next: Finish GitHub Action for release builds and update build instructions. - Herb: Submitting XCCS registration to IANA; will ask Ron for help with the MCCS submission. - Paolo: Experimenting with object window properties (scroll-extent-use) with no significant progress. Next Steps - Ellie: Post to the ePAD mailing list about using the "Discovery" module. - Paolo: - Fix the broken link for the Lisp Course Notes in Zotero. - Add a link to the CHM PARC archive landing page on the interlisp.org/history page. - Bill: - Investigate getting more data from Google Analytics. - Finalize the GitHub Actions Node.js 24 compatibility PR. - Resume work on the website search feature. - Frank: - Complete the GitHub Action for release builds by next Monday. - Update Micro build instructions. - Herb: - Submit the XCCS registration to IANA. - Request help from Ron for the MCCS submission.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly March 18, 2026  •  93 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review project progress, website issues, and technical challenges. Key Takeaways ePAD Archive Strategy: The public-facing ePAD "Delivery" module redacts ~99% of content, rendering it useless for research. The team will pursue using the less restrictive "Discovery" module, which only redacts manually flagged items. Website Analytics Gap: The team lacks 404 error logs, which are critical for identifying broken links and user navigation issues. This data is unavailable on GitHub Pages, prompting a discussion about migrating to a more robust host like Netlify. Font System Overhaul: The font system is being refactored to simplify complex inheritance logic (e.g., Helvetica-MIR inheriting from Modern) and to support Unicode characters beyond the Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP). CHM PARC Archive Link: The website will link to the Computer History Museum's (CHM) PARC archive landing page, which requires a click-through license, to respect their access policies. Topics ePAD Archive & Redaction Goal: Make the Medley email archive navigable in ePAD with a finding aid. Problem: The public-facing ePAD "Delivery" module redacts ~99% of content, showing only subject words. Solution: Use the "Discovery" module, which only redacts manually flagged items. Rationale: Herb's contact with ePAD architect Jochen Farver confirmed this module is suitable for research. Redaction Scope: Required: Personal medical/financial info, performance reviews, personnel issues, political meeting details. Out of Scope: Family issues, social events. Tooling: Herb's Lafitte to Mbox converter will be linked from the ePAD GitHub page. Next Step: Ellie will post to the ePAD mailing list to discuss this strategy. Website Maintenance & Analytics Issue 1388 (Short URLs): Most short URLs are implemented. The /#history fragment link from the CHM site is unfixable via redirects; the CHM should update their link. Analytics Gap: The team lacks 404 error logs, which are unavailable on GitHub Pages. Impact: Prevents identifying broken links and popular content areas. Proposed Solution: Migrate to a host like Netlify, which offers better analytics. Issue 2541 (Lisp Course Notes): The broken link will be fixed by pointing to the stable URL: interlisp.org/documentation/LispCourse.pdf. Documentation Cleanup: The static/docs and static/documentation folders need consolidation. static/docs: Contains only redirect files. static/documentation: Contains PDFs, zips, and an empty HTML folder. Document Classification: A "historical" tag will be used for old documents to guide storage and referencing. Font System Overhaul Problem 1: Complex Inheritance Logic Example: Helvetica-10-MIR (Medium Italic Regular) does not exist and inherits its slant from the Modern font. Solution: Simplify the system by pre-computing and storing these "faked" fonts offline. Problem 2: Unicode BMP Limitation Issue: The TTF-to-Medley font conversion tool fails on characters outside the Basic Multilingual Plane (BMP), such as emojis. Root Cause: The tool's source code uses an unsigned short for character encoding, which cannot represent code points >65,535. Problem 3: XCCS/MCCS Recoding Performance Challenge: Recoding thousands of XCCS/MCCS characters into Unicode. Solution: Append new glyph bitmaps to the font file, avoiding expensive in-place manipulation. Project Updates Ellie: Presented on the Interlisp bibliography at a student conference. Bill: Updated GitHub Actions for Node.js 24 compatibility. Frank: Merged Linux makefile PR after review with Gemini Code Review. Finding: Gemini correctly identified issues but gave contradictory solution suggestions. Next: Finish GitHub Action for release builds and update build instructions. Herb: Submitting XCCS registration to IANA; will ask Ron for help with the MCCS submission. Paolo: Experimenting with object window properties (scroll-extent-use) with no significant progress. Next Steps Ellie: Post to the ePAD mailing list about using the "Discovery" module. Paolo: Fix the broken link for the Lisp Course Notes in Zotero. Add a link to the CHM PARC archive landing page on the interlisp.org/history page. Bill: Investigate getting more data from Google Analytics. Finalize the GitHub Actions Node.js 24 compatibility PR. Resume work on the website search feature. Frank: Complete the GitHub Action for release builds by next Monday. Update Micro build instructions. Herb: Submit the XCCS registration to IANA. Request help from Ron for the MCCS submission. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review project progress and discuss key technical decisions. Key Takeaways - Font System Overhaul: The font system is being upgraded to support Unicode, requiring an extended MedleyFont format and descriptor. The character representation will be changed from a 24-bit word to a 32-bit fixed-P integer to future-proof against characters larger than 24 bits. - GitHub Actions Enhanced: The build system now allows selecting a specific Myco release for Medley builds and deploying them to a development server, enabling isolated testing of new Myco versions. - Submodule Decision Deferred: The proposal to use Git submodules was tabled. The current flat repo structure will be maintained, as the benefits don't outweigh the disruption to existing workflows. - XCCS IANA Registration Clarified: The XCCS submission to IANA will be clarified to distinguish the character set from its on-disk encoding, which uses shift sequences (e.g., 255 255 0) to represent characters of varying byte lengths. Topics Font System Overhaul for Unicode - Problem: The current font system is limited to 255 character sets, preventing full Unicode support. - Solution: Extend the MedleyFont format and descriptor to handle more than 255 character sets. - Implementation: Ron is developing a new MedleyFont format and descriptor, including a max-charset field to dynamically size the character set array. - Future-Proofing: The character representation will be changed from a 24-bit word to a 32-bit fixed-P integer. - Rationale: This change supports characters larger than 24 bits, which are possible in Unicode (e.g., UCS-4), avoiding future limitations. - Version Bump: A version number bump is likely to simplify the transition and allow for new features like bounds checking in MedleyFont.get-charset. - Development Environment: Ron is creating an isolated font working space to prevent new font development from conflicting with the resident system environment. GitHub Actions & Submodules - Build System Enhancements (Frank): - GitHub Actions now allow selecting a specific Myco release for Medley builds. - Builds can be deployed to a development server for testing, enabling isolated validation of new Myco versions. - All actions were updated to address the Node 20 deprecation. - Submodule Discussion: - Proposal: Use Git submodules to manage repositories (Medley, Myco, NoteCards, etc.) under a single umbrella repo (e.g., Interlisp). - Rationale: This would allow for independent release cycles and reduce download sizes by separating large, stable assets like fonts. - Decision: The proposal was tabled. - Reasoning: The disruption to existing workflows outweighs the perceived benefits. The team will explore alternative solutions for managing assets like fonts. XCCS IANA Registration - Context: Martin Durst (UTF-8 author) requested clarification on the XCCS IANA registration submission. - Key Distinction: The submission must clearly differentiate between the XCCS character set and its on-disk encoding. - Encoding Method: XCCS uses shift sequences (e.g., 255 36) to change the active character set. - Multi-Byte Characters: The encoding supports multi-byte characters using sequences like 255 255 0 (for 16-bit characters) and 255 255 255 0 (for 24-bit characters). - Note: While the machinery for multi-byte characters exists, it is not actively used in current files. Other Project Updates - Object Window Scrolling (Paolo): - Issue: The scroll-extent-user property fails to constrain horizontal scrolling in an object window, unlike vertical scrolling. - Next Step: Investigate the source code for differences in horizontal vs. vertical scrolling logic. - Ethernet Driver (Nick): - The Ethernet driver is being refactored to improve reliability across platforms (Solaris, FreeBSD). - Future Work: Redesign the option parsing for specifying the Ethernet device. - Gabriel Benchmarks (Kabir): - Kabir's contract expires at the end of March. The team is evaluating renewal, noting the high learning curve for newcomers to the project. - Action: Herb recently enabled required pull requests for the Gabriel repo to improve code quality and collaboration. Next Steps - Ron: - Release a PR with the new MedleyFont format and descriptor code. - Investigate the object window horizontal scrolling issue. - Frank: - Document the new GitHub Actions build and deployment features. - Address minor issues #2243 and #2427. - Herb: - Reply to Martin Durst's XCCS questions, clarifying the character set vs. encoding distinction. - Review Kabir's benchmark code. - Herb & Larry: - Discuss Eric Kaltman's email offline.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly March 23, 2026  •  75 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review project progress and discuss key technical decisions. Key Takeaways Font System Overhaul: The font system is being upgraded to support Unicode, requiring an extended MedleyFont format and descriptor. The character representation will be changed from a 24-bit word to a 32-bit fixed-P integer to future-proof against characters larger than 24 bits. GitHub Actions Enhanced: The build system now allows selecting a specific Myco release for Medley builds and deploying them to a development server, enabling isolated testing of new Myco versions. Submodule Decision Deferred: The proposal to use Git submodules was tabled. The current flat repo structure will be maintained, as the benefits don't outweigh the disruption to existing workflows. XCCS IANA Registration Clarified: The XCCS submission to IANA will be clarified to distinguish the character set from its on-disk encoding, which uses shift sequences (e.g., 255 255 0) to represent characters of varying byte lengths. Topics Font System Overhaul for Unicode Problem: The current font system is limited to 255 character sets, preventing full Unicode support. Solution: Extend the MedleyFont format and descriptor to handle more than 255 character sets. Implementation: Ron is developing a new MedleyFont format and descriptor, including a max-charset field to dynamically size the character set array. Future-Proofing: The character representation will be changed from a 24-bit word to a 32-bit fixed-P integer. Rationale: This change supports characters larger than 24 bits, which are possible in Unicode (e.g., UCS-4), avoiding future limitations. Version Bump: A version number bump is likely to simplify the transition and allow for new features like bounds checking in MedleyFont.get-charset. Development Environment: Ron is creating an isolated font working space to prevent new font development from conflicting with the resident system environment. GitHub Actions & Submodules Build System Enhancements (Frank): GitHub Actions now allow selecting a specific Myco release for Medley builds. Builds can be deployed to a development server for testing, enabling isolated validation of new Myco versions. All actions were updated to address the Node 20 deprecation. Submodule Discussion: Proposal: Use Git submodules to manage repositories (Medley, Myco, NoteCards, etc.) under a single umbrella repo (e.g., Interlisp). Rationale: This would allow for independent release cycles and reduce download sizes by separating large, stable assets like fonts. Decision: The proposal was tabled. Reasoning: The disruption to existing workflows outweighs the perceived benefits. The team will explore alternative solutions for managing assets like fonts. XCCS IANA Registration Context: Martin Durst (UTF-8 author) requested clarification on the XCCS IANA registration submission. Key Distinction: The submission must clearly differentiate between the XCCS character set and its on-disk encoding. Encoding Method: XCCS uses shift sequences (e.g., 255 36) to change the active character set. Multi-Byte Characters: The encoding supports multi-byte characters using sequences like 255 255 0 (for 16-bit characters) and 255 255 255 0 (for 24-bit characters). Note: While the machinery for multi-byte characters exists, it is not actively used in current files. Other Project Updates Object Window Scrolling (Paolo): Issue: The scroll-extent-user property fails to constrain horizontal scrolling in an object window, unlike vertical scrolling. Next Step: Investigate the source code for differences in horizontal vs. vertical scrolling logic. Ethernet Driver (Nick): The Ethernet driver is being refactored to improve reliability across platforms (Solaris, FreeBSD). Future Work: Redesign the option parsing for specifying the Ethernet device. Gabriel Benchmarks (Kabir): Kabir's contract expires at the end of March. The team is evaluating renewal, noting the high learning curve for newcomers to the project. Action: Herb recently enabled required pull requests for the Gabriel repo to improve code quality and collaboration. Next Steps Ron: Release a PR with the new MedleyFont format and descriptor code. Investigate the object window horizontal scrolling issue. Frank: Document the new GitHub Actions build and deployment features. Address minor issues #2243 and #2427. Herb: Reply to Martin Durst's XCCS questions, clarifying the character set vs. encoding distinction. Review Kabir's benchmark code. Herb & Larry: Discuss Eric Kaltman's email offline. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Review progress on character sets and font management. Key Takeaways - XCCS Mappings: A bug was found where Medley was rendering "missing" XCCS characters correctly, despite them being absent from the active mapping tables. The cause is outdated "composite" files in the repo; Ron will delete them to establish a single source of truth. - Font Size: Noto font generation created 900MB of Medley font files. Analysis showed ~30% are duplicates, but the proposed "glyph database" solution is too large for Git and requires a new storage strategy. - Font Pipeline: Ron is building an offline font pipeline to create complete, MCCS-recoded fonts. This requires a new Medley font format (v1) to support >256 charsets and a clear definition of how "incomplete" fonts are handled. - Historical Content: A draft of Patrick Domanico's interview with Larry and Frank is available for review before its April 17 publication. Screenshots of the rare BBN Jericho Interlisp environment were also found in a 1988 report. Topics XCCS Character Mapping Bug - Problem: Medley correctly rendered XCCS characters marked "missing" in the mapping files, which should have failed. - Cause: The repo contains outdated "composite" files (e.g., XCCS-0,41-43...) that were superseded by newer, single-charset files. - Mechanism: The build process uses only the single-charset files. The "missing" characters were present in the outdated composites but had since been added to the active tables. - Solution: Ron will delete the outdated composite files to establish a single, authoritative source for all mappings. Noto Font Size & Duplication Analysis - Finding: Generating Noto fonts created 900MB of Medley font files. - Analysis: A duplicate-file finder identified significant glyph duplication. - Total Duplicates: 248,000+ glyphs - Reducible Size: 163,600 glyphs could be removed, saving ~30% of the total. - Proposal: A "glyph database" to store each unique glyph once. - Blocker: The resulting file (~500MB+) is too large for standard Git and would require Git LFS, which the team wants to avoid. - Next Step: Analyze duplication excluding CJK fonts to see if the problem becomes manageable. New Font Pipeline & Format - Goal: Create a reliable, offline font build pipeline. - Process: A multi-stage pipeline transforms source fonts into deployable Medley font files: 1. Import: Convert source files (AC, strike) to a single Medley font file, marking missing charsets as empty. 2. MCCS Recode: Rearrange glyphs to the MCCS encoding. 3. Complete: Fill in missing glyphs via coercion (e.g., inheriting from modern or classic fonts). 4. Fake: Generate synthetic bold/italic variants for fonts that lack them. - Format Change: Medley font format v1 is required to support >256 charsets. This is a breaking change, requiring a v0 reader for legacy files. - Conceptual Issue: How should "incomplete" fonts be handled? - Option A: A font file must be fully instantiated before writing. - Option B: A font file can represent an intermediate state, with nil indicating an uninstantiated charset. - Decision: Option B is implemented to support the iterative build process. The final deployed fonts will always be complete. Historical Content & Benchmarks - Benchmarks: Kabir's contract is complete. The work is well-documented and ready for review. - Book Scan: Herb is preparing a scan of Debra Tater's "A Programmer's Guide to Common Lisp" for the Internet Archive. Nick will provide a 6-page addendum of corrections. - Jericho Interlisp: A 1988 BBN report contains rare screenshots of the Jericho Interlisp environment. - Context: The Jericho was a BBN prototype workstation (1983–84), a period before Xerox D-machines were widely available. Next Steps - Ron: - Delete outdated XCCS composite files from the repo. - Push the font pipeline and Medley font format v1 changes to a branch for testing. - Matt: - Analyze Noto font duplication excluding CJK glyphs. - All: - Review the draft of Patrick Domanico's interview before the April 17 publication.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

March 30, 2026  •  118 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Review progress on character sets and font management. Key Takeaways XCCS Mappings: A bug was found where Medley was rendering "missing" XCCS characters correctly, despite them being absent from the active mapping tables. The cause is outdated "composite" files in the repo; Ron will delete them to establish a single source of truth. Font Size: Noto font generation created 900MB of Medley font files. Analysis showed ~30% are duplicates, but the proposed "glyph database" solution is too large for Git and requires a new storage strategy. Font Pipeline: Ron is building an offline font pipeline to create complete, MCCS-recoded fonts. This requires a new Medley font format (v1) to support >256 charsets and a clear definition of how "incomplete" fonts are handled. Historical Content: A draft of Patrick Domanico's interview with Larry and Frank is available for review before its April 17 publication. Screenshots of the rare BBN Jericho Interlisp environment were also found in a 1988 report. Topics XCCS Character Mapping Bug Problem: Medley correctly rendered XCCS characters marked "missing" in the mapping files, which should have failed. Cause: The repo contains outdated "composite" files (e.g., XCCS-0,41-43...) that were superseded by newer, single-charset files. Mechanism: The build process uses only the single-charset files. The "missing" characters were present in the outdated composites but had since been added to the active tables. Solution: Ron will delete the outdated composite files to establish a single, authoritative source for all mappings. Noto Font Size & Duplication Analysis Finding: Generating Noto fonts created 900MB of Medley font files. Analysis: A duplicate-file finder identified significant glyph duplication. Total Duplicates: 248,000+ glyphs Reducible Size: 163,600 glyphs could be removed, saving ~30% of the total. Proposal: A "glyph database" to store each unique glyph once. Blocker: The resulting file (~500MB+) is too large for standard Git and would require Git LFS, which the team wants to avoid. Next Step: Analyze duplication excluding CJK fonts to see if the problem becomes manageable. New Font Pipeline & Format Goal: Create a reliable, offline font build pipeline. Process: A multi-stage pipeline transforms source fonts into deployable Medley font files: Import: Convert source files (AC, strike) to a single Medley font file, marking missing charsets as empty. MCCS Recode: Rearrange glyphs to the MCCS encoding. Complete: Fill in missing glyphs via coercion (e.g., inheriting from modern or classic fonts). Fake: Generate synthetic bold/italic variants for fonts that lack them. Format Change: Medley font format v1 is required to support >256 charsets. This is a breaking change, requiring a v0 reader for legacy files. Conceptual Issue: How should "incomplete" fonts be handled? Option A: A font file must be fully instantiated before writing. Option B: A font file can represent an intermediate state, with nil indicating an uninstantiated charset. Decision: Option B is implemented to support the iterative build process. The final deployed fonts will always be complete. Historical Content & Benchmarks Benchmarks: Kabir's contract is complete. The work is well-documented and ready for review. Book Scan: Herb is preparing a scan of Debra Tater's "A Programmer's Guide to Common Lisp" for the Internet Archive. Nick will provide a 6-page addendum of corrections. Jericho Interlisp: A 1988 BBN report contains rare screenshots of the Jericho Interlisp environment. Context: The Jericho was a BBN prototype workstation (1983–84), a period before Xerox D-machines were widely available. Next Steps Ron: Delete outdated XCCS composite files from the repo. Push the font pipeline and Medley font format v1 changes to a branch for testing. Matt: Analyze Noto font duplication excluding CJK glyphs. All: Review the draft of Patrick Domanico's interview before the April 17 publication. View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and issues. Key Takeaways - Font Overhaul PR #2555: A draft PR overhauls the font system, adding offline font generation and 16-bit character set support. It is not backward-compatible, requiring old font files to be re-generated. - Keyboard Localization: A plan was set to fix non-US keyboard support, a key blocker for potential contributors like Marco Antoniotti. The fix involves using XKB map on Linux and a custom remapping file on Mac. - Character Set Cleanup: The XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt file will be split into its constituent Fuji Xerox private-use character sets (167–176) to fix a long-standing data integrity issue. - Auto-Load Mechanism: The team is considering a new auto-load mechanism to replace the whereis database for image objects, addressing a bug where the system fails to load required files (e.g., NC Browser Card). Topics Font System Overhaul (PR #2555) - Ron Kaplan submitted a draft PR (#2555) for a major font system overhaul. - Key Changes: - Offline Font Generation: Replaces online, on-the-fly font creation with a more robust offline process. - New import-fonts Tool: A new file (import-fonts.lisp) provides a standardized workflow: Import → Recode to MCCS → Complete → Deploy. - 16-bit Character Set Support: The max-charset field was expanded to 16 bits (from 8), enabling support for up to 65,536 characters. - New medley-font Format: The font file format was updated, breaking backward compatibility. Old files must be re-generated. - Code Cleanup: The font-exists function now takes a single font spec argument, simplifying its interface. - PR Status & Next Steps: - The PR includes ~300 new font files and ~30 code files. - The deleted directory (a local GitFunds artifact) will be removed from the commit history. - The source font files (e.g., AC fonts) will be moved to a separate repository to reduce the main repo's size and history. Character Set Data Cleanup - Problem: The XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt file is a composite of several Fuji Xerox private-use character sets (167–176) and is incorrectly labeled as 166. - Solution: Ron Kaplan will split the file into its original, individual character set files. - Each new file will be named according to its character set number and labeled as "Fuji Xerox Private Use." - The Unicode-format file will be updated to include these new mappings. - Related Issue: The XCCS-JIS.txt file is also a composite and will be programmatically verified against its source files before deletion. Keyboard Localization - Problem: Non-US keyboards (e.g., Italian) do not work correctly, preventing users from typing essential Lisp characters. This is a key blocker for potential contributors like Marco Antoniotti. - Root Cause: The Mako keyboard map has a fixed 112-position limit, and the necessary scan codes are not being passed from the OS. - Solution Plan: - Linux/X11: Use the standard XKB map utility for system-level remapping. - macOS: Implement a custom remapping file, as XKB map is not available. - Testing Plan: 1. Paolo Amoroso will provide a list of scan codes for an Italian keyboard. 2. Herb Jellinek will use a reprogrammable keyboard (QMK/VIA) and Karabiner to simulate the Italian layout and test the custom remapping file on macOS. Auto-Load Mechanism for Image Objects - Problem: Image objects fail to auto-load required files (e.g., NC Browser Card) because they are missing from the whereis database. - Proposed Solution: Create a new auto-load mechanism for image objects, separate from the whereis database. - Model: Similar to Emacs's auto-load feature, where functions are marked with their defining file. - Implementation: Extend image objects with a file-name field or scan directories for auto-loadable functions. - Rationale: The whereis database has other purposes and is not the ideal mechanism for managing image object dependencies. Other Updates - Eleanor Young's Grant Proposal: The proposal to the ACM History of Computing SIG was not funded. Eleanor will now apply for a $1,000 travel award from the Computer History Museum. - Styled Text Copy-Paste: Herb Jellinek is researching cross-platform clipboard APIs for styled text (RTF/HTML). The current pbcopy/pbpaste commands on macOS do not support this. - SIGCIS Conference: Herb Jellinek shared information about the SIGCIS computer history conference in Berkeley in June. Next Steps - Ron Kaplan: - Fix the .gitignore file to exclude the deleted directory and remove it from PR #2555. - Split XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt into individual Fuji Xerox private-use character set files. - Programmatically verify and delete the composite XCCS-JIS.txt file. - Nick Briggs: - Document the testing plan for keyboard localization on macOS. - Paolo Amoroso: - Ask Marco Antoniotti for the specific keyboard issues he encountered. - Provide Nick Briggs with a list of scan codes for an Italian keyboard. - Herb Jellinek: - Execute the keyboard localization test plan on macOS using a reprogrammable keyboard and Karabiner. - All: - Review and merge trivial PRs to ensure no dependencies conflict with PR #2555.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly

April 06, 2026  •  90 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Investigate NoteCards auto-load issue 2504 (NC Browser Card, browser-draw-link-fun); fix H-Rule corruption Frank Halasz Ask Marco Antoniotti re: Italian keyboard issues (X vs SDL) Paolo Amoroso Draft Mac keyboard test procedure; coordinate w/ Paolo (scan codes) & Herb (programmable keyboard) Nick Briggs Search for lost keyboard mapping utilities Matt Heffron Programmatically verify XCCS-JIS.txt vs individual JIS; if identical, delete composite Ron Kaplan Split XCCS_Unknown_Japanese.txt into XCCS 167–176; sample-verify; rebuild Unicode-formats; delete composite Ron Kaplan Add old-format reader to MedleyFont; automate conversion Ron Kaplan Fix .gitignore to ignore 'deleted' dir; remove 'deleted' files locally Ron Kaplan Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and issues. Key Takeaways Font Overhaul PR #2555: A draft PR overhauls the font system, adding offline font generation and 16-bit character set support. It is not backward-compatible, requiring old font files to be re-generated. Keyboard Localization: A plan was set to fix non-US keyboard support, a key blocker for potential contributors like Marco Antoniotti. The fix involves using XKB map on Linux and a custom remapping file on Mac. Character Set Cleanup: The XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt file will be split into its constituent Fuji Xerox private-use character sets (167–176) to fix a long-standing data integrity issue. Auto-Load Mechanism: The team is considering a new auto-load mechanism to replace the whereis database for image objects, addressing a bug where the system fails to load required files (e.g., NC Browser Card). Topics Font System Overhaul (PR #2555) Ron Kaplan submitted a draft PR (#2555) for a major font system overhaul. Key Changes: Offline Font Generation: Replaces online, on-the-fly font creation with a more robust offline process. New import-fonts Tool: A new file (import-fonts.lisp) provides a standardized workflow: Import → Recode to MCCS → Complete → Deploy. 16-bit Character Set Support: The max-charset field was expanded to 16 bits (from 8), enabling support for up to 65,536 characters. New medley-font Format: The font file format was updated, breaking backward compatibility. Old files must be re-generated. Code Cleanup: The font-exists function now takes a single font spec argument, simplifying its interface. PR Status & Next Steps: The PR includes ~300 new font files and ~30 code files. The deleted directory (a local GitFunds artifact) will be removed from the commit history. The source font files (e.g., AC fonts) will be moved to a separate repository to reduce the main repo's size and history. Character Set Data Cleanup Problem: The XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt file is a composite of several Fuji Xerox private-use character sets (167–176) and is incorrectly labeled as 166. Solution: Ron Kaplan will split the file into its original, individual character set files. Each new file will be named according to its character set number and labeled as "Fuji Xerox Private Use." The Unicode-format file will be updated to include these new mappings. Related Issue: The XCCS-JIS.txt file is also a composite and will be programmatically verified against its source files before deletion. Keyboard Localization Problem: Non-US keyboards (e.g., Italian) do not work correctly, preventing users from typing essential Lisp characters. This is a key blocker for potential contributors like Marco Antoniotti. Root Cause: The Mako keyboard map has a fixed 112-position limit, and the necessary scan codes are not being passed from the OS. Solution Plan: Linux/X11: Use the standard XKB map utility for system-level remapping. macOS: Implement a custom remapping file, as XKB map is not available. Testing Plan: Paolo Amoroso will provide a list of scan codes for an Italian keyboard. Herb Jellinek will use a reprogrammable keyboard (QMK/VIA) and Karabiner to simulate the Italian layout and test the custom remapping file on macOS. Auto-Load Mechanism for Image Objects Problem: Image objects fail to auto-load required files (e.g., NC Browser Card) because they are missing from the whereis database. Proposed Solution: Create a new auto-load mechanism for image objects, separate from the whereis database. Model: Similar to Emacs's auto-load feature, where functions are marked with their defining file. Implementation: Extend image objects with a file-name field or scan directories for auto-loadable functions. Rationale: The whereis database has other purposes and is not the ideal mechanism for managing image object dependencies. Other Updates Eleanor Young's Grant Proposal: The proposal to the ACM History of Computing SIG was not funded. Eleanor will now apply for a $1,000 travel award from the Computer History Museum. Styled Text Copy-Paste: Herb Jellinek is researching cross-platform clipboard APIs for styled text (RTF/HTML). The current pbcopy/pbpaste commands on macOS do not support this. SIGCIS Conference: Herb Jellinek shared information about the SIGCIS computer history conference in Berkeley in June. Next Steps Ron Kaplan: Fix the .gitignore file to exclude the deleted directory and remove it from PR #2555. Split XCCS-unknown_japanese.txt into individual Fuji Xerox private-use character set files. Programmatically verify and delete the composite XCCS-JIS.txt file. Nick Briggs: Document the testing plan for keyboard localization on macOS. Paolo Amoroso: Ask Marco Antoniotti for the specific keyboard issues he encountered. Provide Nick Briggs with a list of scan codes for an Italian keyboard. Herb Jellinek: Execute the keyboard localization test plan on macOS using a reprogrammable keyboard and Karabiner. All: Review and merge trivial PRs to ensure no dependencies conflict with PR #2555.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Sync on project progress, resolve blockers, and discuss community engagement. Key Takeaways - Interview Article Blocked: The "Inventing the Future" article is blocked until Frank provides comments for the April 17th deadline. - HC File Formatting Broken: PrettyFileIndex is incorrectly formatting HC files (e.g., excessive bolding), a bug likely linked to recent font/encoding changes. - XCCS Standard Under Review: The XCCS-to-Unicode mapping is being corrected for IANA registration, revealing typos and inconsistencies in the source data. - Community Engagement Proposed: A new "user projects" webpage was proposed to create a permanent, discoverable showcase for community work, solving the problem of social media content being ephemeral. Topics HC File Formatting Bug (Issue 2298) - Problem: PrettyFileIndex is incorrectly formatting HC files, causing issues like excessive bolding and misaligned index entries. - Impact: This bug hinders code browsing, as HC files are more practical than GitHub for files saved with the FAST option, which collapses functions onto single lines. - Hypotheses: - Tab Characters: The PostScript device may be misinterpreting tab characters as 8 spaces, causing alignment issues. - Font Class Corruption: A recent cleanup of redundant font changes in PrettyFileIndex may have introduced the bug. - Debugging Plan: - Trace DSPFONT calls to see if font changes are being reverted correctly. - Test PrettyFileIndex output to a window or HTML stream to isolate the issue from the PDF generation process. XCCS-to-Unicode Mapping & IANA Registration - Goal: Register the Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS) with IANA to provide a stable, documented base for Interlisp's character handling. - Blocker: The source data for the XCCS-to-Unicode mapping is inconsistent and of unknown origin, preventing finalization of the IANA draft. - Findings: - Typos: Matt found and corrected seven XCCS-to-Unicode mapping typos. - Inconsistencies: The mapping includes glyphs not in the 1990 XCCS standard PDF and maps distinct XCCS characters to the same Unicode character. - Unicode Limitations: Unicode lacks direct representations for XCCS concepts like serif/sans-serif variants and some composite characters. - Action Plan: - Source Data: Ron will search for the "Unicode 3.0 book" CD, which may contain the original XCCS2Uni binary file. - IANA Draft: Herb will send the draft with embedded questions to the IANA mailing list to find original XCCS developers. - T-Edit Cleanup: Ron is simplifying T-Edit's character handling by removing legacy XCCS run-code logic, which is no longer relevant with UTF-8. Community Engagement & Social Media - Problem: Social media content is ephemeral, making it difficult for users to discover community projects. - Proposal: Create a "user projects" webpage on the Interlisp site. - Content: A simple HTML table with project thumbnails, descriptions, and GitHub links. - Submission: A submission form would allow users to add their work. - Benefits: - Provides a permanent, discoverable showcase for community projects. - Creates a self-generating source of content for social media. - Normalizes building things with Interlisp, attracting more developers. - Implementation: The page will be seeded with historic projects from sources like Lisp Users and the library. Project Updates - AI Search Integration: Bill is researching how to integrate AI into the browser's search function. - Initial Focus: Connecting AI to the browser before evaluating specific tools like reg. - Key Concern: The cost of using AI services for search. - Saildart Archives: Larry acquired a 2TB copy of the Saildart archives, containing 50GB of raw data from 1973. - Significance: The archive includes historical Interlisp files and private discussions among early Lisp developers. - Parenthesis Matching: The TTY editor's blinking parenthesis feature was discussed. - Origin: The feature was likely adopted from another Lisp system, not invented by Interlisp. - Availability: Its presence depends on terminal capabilities (e.g., VT100) and OS-level cursor control. Next Steps - Paolo: - Remind Frank of the April 17th deadline for the "Inventing the Future" article. - Create a "user projects" page on the Interlisp site. - Herb: - Send the XCCS-to-Unicode IANA draft with embedded questions to the IANA mailing list. - Search for former Xerox OSD developers on LinkedIn. - Ron: - Search for the "Unicode 3.0 book" CD to find the XCCS2Uni binary file. - Continue simplifying T-Edit's character handling code. - Matt: - Hold the XCCS mapping PR until the source files in the Unicode folder are cleaned up. - Larry: - Search personal files for small, interesting Lisp programs to share.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 08, 2026  •  86 mins  •  View Meeting or Ask Fathom Action Items ✨ Email Frank re: Patrick Domenico interview; request review/no comments by Apr 17 Larry Masinter-lisp Find and share broken-package pretty-printing code w/ Larry Herb Jellinek Test PrettyFileIndex to HTML/window stream; trace DSPFONT calls Paolo Amoroso Email Ron Urdu/Farsi XCCS/MCCS mapping issues Matt Heffron Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Sync on project progress, resolve blockers, and discuss community engagement. Key Takeaways Interview Article Blocked: The "Inventing the Future" article is blocked until Frank provides comments for the April 17th deadline. HC File Formatting Broken: PrettyFileIndex is incorrectly formatting HC files (e.g., excessive bolding), a bug likely linked to recent font/encoding changes. XCCS Standard Under Review: The XCCS-to-Unicode mapping is being corrected for IANA registration, revealing typos and inconsistencies in the source data. Community Engagement Proposed: A new "user projects" webpage was proposed to create a permanent, discoverable showcase for community work, solving the problem of social media content being ephemeral. Topics HC File Formatting Bug (Issue 2298) Problem: PrettyFileIndex is incorrectly formatting HC files, causing issues like excessive bolding and misaligned index entries. Impact: This bug hinders code browsing, as HC files are more practical than GitHub for files saved with the FAST option, which collapses functions onto single lines. Hypotheses: Tab Characters: The PostScript device may be misinterpreting tab characters as 8 spaces, causing alignment issues. Font Class Corruption: A recent cleanup of redundant font changes in PrettyFileIndex may have introduced the bug. Debugging Plan: Trace DSPFONT calls to see if font changes are being reverted correctly. Test PrettyFileIndex output to a window or HTML stream to isolate the issue from the PDF generation process. XCCS-to-Unicode Mapping & IANA Registration Goal: Register the Xerox Character Code Standard (XCCS) with IANA to provide a stable, documented base for Interlisp's character handling. Blocker: The source data for the XCCS-to-Unicode mapping is inconsistent and of unknown origin, preventing finalization of the IANA draft. Findings: Typos: Matt found and corrected seven XCCS-to-Unicode mapping typos. Inconsistencies: The mapping includes glyphs not in the 1990 XCCS standard PDF and maps distinct XCCS characters to the same Unicode character. Unicode Limitations: Unicode lacks direct representations for XCCS concepts like serif/sans-serif variants and some composite characters. Action Plan: Source Data: Ron will search for the "Unicode 3.0 book" CD, which may contain the original XCCS2Uni binary file. IANA Draft: Herb will send the draft with embedded questions to the IANA mailing list to find original XCCS developers. T-Edit Cleanup: Ron is simplifying T-Edit's character handling by removing legacy XCCS run-code logic, which is no longer relevant with UTF-8. Community Engagement & Social Media Problem: Social media content is ephemeral, making it difficult for users to discover community projects. Proposal: Create a "user projects" webpage on the Interlisp site. Content: A simple HTML table with project thumbnails, descriptions, and GitHub links. Submission: A submission form would allow users to add their work. Benefits: Provides a permanent, discoverable showcase for community projects. Creates a self-generating source of content for social media. Normalizes building things with Interlisp, attracting more developers. Implementation: The page will be seeded with historic projects from sources like Lisp Users and the library. Project Updates AI Search Integration: Bill is researching how to integrate AI into the browser's search function. Initial Focus: Connecting AI to the browser before evaluating specific tools like reg. Key Concern: The cost of using AI services for search. Saildart Archives: Larry acquired a 2TB copy of the Saildart archives, containing 50GB of raw data from 1973. Significance: The archive includes historical Interlisp files and private discussions among early Lisp developers. Parenthesis Matching: The TTY editor's blinking parenthesis feature was discussed. Origin: The feature was likely adopted from another Lisp system, not invented by Interlisp. Availability: Its presence depends on terminal capabilities (e.g., VT100) and OS-level cursor control. Next Steps Paolo: Remind Frank of the April 17th deadline for the "Inventing the Future" article. Create a "user projects" page on the Interlisp site. Herb: Send the XCCS-to-Unicode IANA draft with embedded questions to the IANA mailing list. Search for former Xerox OSD developers on LinkedIn. Ron: Search for the "Unicode 3.0 book" CD to find the XCCS2Uni binary file. Continue simplifying T-Edit's character handling code. Matt: Hold the XCCS mapping PR until the source files in the Unicode folder are cleaned up. Larry: Search personal files for small, interesting Lisp programs to share.

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[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and challenges. Key Takeaways - New broken-atoms utility fixes pretty-printing errors by intercepting missing-package conditions, enabling correct output for code with undefined packages (e.g., Ryan's Turtle code). - A major package management flaw was identified: compare-sources fails to bind the correct package, rendering diffs unreadable with excessive qualifiers. Fixing this is complex, as it risks corrupting the running image. - A new font strategy will convert legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo) to MCCS. This will fix character search failures (e.g., finding Delta vs. D) but requires updating legacy code that relies on specific character codes. - Notecards integration is blocked by its non-standard file system. The proposed fix is to make MedleyDeer a pseudo-host, allowing Notecards' paths to be defined relative to it. Topics Package Management & File Handling - broken-atoms Utility: - A new utility (broken-atoms.lisp) intercepts missing-package and missing-external-symbol conditions. - Mechanism: Uses handler-bind and restarts (ret-from) to create broken-atom objects, which print correctly without crashing. - Validation: Successfully pretty-printed Ryan's Turtle code, which previously failed due to missing packages. - compare-sources Package Binding Issue: - Problem: compare-sources fails to bind the correct package from a file's defined-file-info. - Result: The diff display shows unreadable, fully-qualified symbols (e.g., BDF::SIZE), even for internal variables. - Challenge: A simple fix (e.g., in-package) risks corrupting the running image, as def-package is not undoable. - Potential Solution: Use copy-bytes to compare text for the diff view, while using get-def for the structural view. - Notecards Integration: - Problem: Integrating Notecards (Issue #2504) is blocked by its non-standard file system, which doesn't use directories. - Impact: This prevents ImageObject from finding Notecards files via get-fund. - Proposed Solution: Make MedleyDeer a pseudo-host. This allows Notecards' paths to be defined relative to MedleyDeer, ensuring they are correctly re-established after a sysout. - Single-Package Workflow: - The workflow guide may include an unnecessary P command with def-package at the top of files. - Rationale: The def-package in defined-file-info is likely sufficient, as it's evaluated during file loading. - Context: This highlights a larger, unsolved problem in Interlisp: the opaque nature of package definitions, which makes tools like gather-exports necessary. Font & Character Set Strategy - New Font Strategy: Convert Legacy Fonts to MCCS: - Decision: Convert legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo, Symbol) to be true MCCS fonts. - Rationale: - Fixes character search failures (e.g., finding Delta vs. D). - Ensures consistent font behavior across the system. - Impact: Requires updating legacy code that relies on specific character codes in these fonts. - XCCS to Unicode Mapping Cleanup: - Finding: The current XCCS mapping files contain errors: - Characters not in the XCCS standard document. - Mappings to deprecated Unicode characters. - Incorrect glyph mappings. - Action: Matt is creating an alternate set of mapping files with comments noting these discrepancies. - Resource: Herb ordered a physical copy of the Unicode 3.0 standard with its CD-ROM to aid in verification. - IANA Registration: - Herb confirmed with Martin Durst at IANA that there is only one official XCCS encoding, resolving a prior ambiguity. Project Admin - Xerox Technical Reports: - Stanford Library is discussing scanning Bill Stumbo's donated reports. - Contingency: If Stanford declines, the team will pay for non-destructive scanning. - JetBrains Subscription: - The team's subscription has expired. Herb is coordinating with JetBrains to renew it. - "Do You Speak Tech" Interview: - Paolo's interview is approved and will be published this Friday. Next Steps - Herb: - Check broken-atoms.lisp into the Lisp users repo. - Follow up with Stanford Library on the Xerox reports. - Coordinate JetBrains subscription renewal. - Frank: - Create a PR for Notecards integration, making MedleyDeer a pseudo-host. - Create a PR to update GitHub Actions with a specific Mako version. - Ron: - File an issue for the compare-sources package binding problem. - Investigate the compare-sources code to identify byte vs. struct dependencies. - Matt: - Continue work on the corrected XCCS mapping files. - Paolo: - Share the "Do You Speak Tech" interview link upon publication. - All: - Discuss the new font strategy for legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo).

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp Implementation weekly April 13, 2026  •  97 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting

Meeting Summary ✨ Meeting Purpose Weekly sync on Medley Interlisp implementation progress and challenges. Key Takeaways New broken-atoms utility fixes pretty-printing errors by intercepting missing-package conditions, enabling correct output for code with undefined packages (e.g., Ryan's Turtle code). A major package management flaw was identified: compare-sources fails to bind the correct package, rendering diffs unreadable with excessive qualifiers. Fixing this is complex, as it risks corrupting the running image. A new font strategy will convert legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo) to MCCS. This will fix character search failures (e.g., finding Delta vs. D) but requires updating legacy code that relies on specific character codes. Notecards integration is blocked by its non-standard file system. The proposed fix is to make MedleyDeer a pseudo-host, allowing Notecards' paths to be defined relative to it. Topics Package Management & File Handling broken-atoms Utility: A new utility (broken-atoms.lisp) intercepts missing-package and missing-external-symbol conditions. Mechanism: Uses handler-bind and restarts (ret-from) to create broken-atom objects, which print correctly without crashing. Validation: Successfully pretty-printed Ryan's Turtle code, which previously failed due to missing packages. compare-sources Package Binding Issue: Problem: compare-sources fails to bind the correct package from a file's defined-file-info. Result: The diff display shows unreadable, fully-qualified symbols (e.g., BDF::SIZE), even for internal variables. Challenge: A simple fix (e.g., in-package) risks corrupting the running image, as def-package is not undoable. Potential Solution: Use copy-bytes to compare text for the diff view, while using get-def for the structural view. Notecards Integration: Problem: Integrating Notecards (Issue #2504) is blocked by its non-standard file system, which doesn't use directories. Impact: This prevents ImageObject from finding Notecards files via get-fund. Proposed Solution: Make MedleyDeer a pseudo-host. This allows Notecards' paths to be defined relative to MedleyDeer, ensuring they are correctly re-established after a sysout. Single-Package Workflow: The workflow guide may include an unnecessary P command with def-package at the top of files. Rationale: The def-package in defined-file-info is likely sufficient, as it's evaluated during file loading. Context: This highlights a larger, unsolved problem in Interlisp: the opaque nature of package definitions, which makes tools like gather-exports necessary. Font & Character Set Strategy New Font Strategy: Convert Legacy Fonts to MCCS: Decision: Convert legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo, Symbol) to be true MCCS fonts. Rationale: Fixes character search failures (e.g., finding Delta vs. D). Ensures consistent font behavior across the system. Impact: Requires updating legacy code that relies on specific character codes in these fonts. XCCS to Unicode Mapping Cleanup: Finding: The current XCCS mapping files contain errors: Characters not in the XCCS standard document. Mappings to deprecated Unicode characters. Incorrect glyph mappings. Action: Matt is creating an alternate set of mapping files with comments noting these discrepancies. Resource: Herb ordered a physical copy of the Unicode 3.0 standard with its CD-ROM to aid in verification. IANA Registration: Herb confirmed with Martin Durst at IANA that there is only one official XCCS encoding, resolving a prior ambiguity. Project Admin Xerox Technical Reports: Stanford Library is discussing scanning Bill Stumbo's donated reports. Contingency: If Stanford declines, the team will pay for non-destructive scanning. JetBrains Subscription: The team's subscription has expired. Herb is coordinating with JetBrains to renew it. "Do You Speak Tech" Interview: Paolo's interview is approved and will be published this Friday. Next Steps Herb: Check broken-atoms.lisp into the Lisp users repo. Follow up with Stanford Library on the Xerox reports. Coordinate JetBrains subscription renewal. Frank: Create a PR for Notecards integration, making MedleyDeer a pseudo-host. Create a PR to update GitHub Actions with a specific Mako version. Ron: File an issue for the compare-sources package binding problem. Investigate the compare-sources code to identify byte vs. struct dependencies. Matt: Continue work on the corrected XCCS mapping files. Paolo: Share the "Do You Speak Tech" interview link upon publication. All: Discuss the new font strategy for legacy fonts (e.g., Hippo). View Meeting →

[Fathom]

Meeting Purpose Sync on project status, bugs, and future initiatives. Key Takeaways - Gabriel Benchmarks: A plan is set to publish Medley's performance on Gabriel benchmarks to attract the history of computing community. Herb will first fix the X11 display error blocking runs. - H-Rule Bug: A critical bug in H-Rule image object loading was traced to a piece table pointer that is off by 4 bytes, causing a read error. Frank will investigate if this offset is consistent across files. - Graffer Lazy Loading: The team will implement a global undefined-function handler to fix Graffer's inability to lazy-load functions (e.g., NCBrowserDrawLink), which currently breaks NoteCards files. - Medli Pseudo-Host: The team will adopt the Medli pseudo-host as a stable designator for fonts and libraries, simplifying environment management and enabling comparisons between different Medley versions. Topics Bug Investigation: H-Rule Image Object Loading - Problem: Loading old NoteCards files (.tEdit) fails with an error in H-Rule.GetFun because the piece table pointer is off by 4 bytes. - Analysis: - The pointer targets byte 17, but the correct data (a number 2) is at byte 20. - The file contains only line feeds (0A), not carriage returns (0D), ruling out a simple CRLF conversion issue. - The GetPieces3 function calculates the text-section pointer by summing piece lengths. A single incorrect length would propagate the error. - Hypothesis: The consistent 4-byte offset suggests a systematic calculation error, possibly related to a tab character or a fixed-size header. Solution: Global Undefined-Function Handler - Problem: Graffer fails when loading NoteCards files because it cannot find functions like NCBrowserDrawLink that are defined in other files. - Current Fix: Frank's PR uses a default function and logs an error, preventing a crash but not solving the root cause. - Proposed Solution: Implement a global handler for undefined-function errors. - Mechanism: When an undefined-function error occurs, the handler will use WhereIs to locate the function's file, load it, and then retry the original call. - Benefits: This provides a generic lazy-loading mechanism, solving the Graffer issue and simplifying future development. System Architecture & Workflow - Medli Pseudo-Host: - Problem: Font paths and library locations are unstable across environments, making sysouts fragile and comparisons difficult. - Solution: Use the Medli pseudo-host as a stable, logical designator for the current Medley installation. - Impact: Simplifies MedleyDeer initialization and enables easy switching between different Medley versions (e.g., release vs. dev clone). - Git Submodules: Larry's plan to convert system components to submodules will not change developer workflow, as it is a top-down change that does not affect the sub-repos themselves. - T-Edit Documentation Styling: - Problem: Maintaining consistent styling in T-Edit documentation files is difficult. - Solution: Use the "copy paragraph looks" feature (Meta+Shift+Middle-Click) to transfer styles between paragraphs. - Future Goal: Implement a full style-sheet system, a feature that was partially developed but never completed. Project Initiatives & Admin - SIGCIS Conference (June 17-18, Berkeley): A potential opportunity to present on Interlisp's social impact (e.g., NoteCards). The deadline for "Work in Progress" drafts is May 17. - Gabriel Benchmarks: - Goal: Publish performance data to attract the history of computing community. - Blocker: Paolo is encountering an X11 display error when running the benchmarks. - Installation/Uninstallation: - Problem: Uninstallation instructions are incomplete. - Clarification: Local installations are uninstalled by deleting the main directory and its sister directories (Myco, NoteCards, Loops). - Joe Becker Contact: Herb will contact Joe Becker to discuss XCCS and early Unicode history. - JetBrains License: The team's all-product license has been renewed for another year. Next Steps - Herb: - Fix the X11 display error blocking Gabriel benchmark runs. - Contact Joe Becker to discuss XCCS and Unicode history. - Frank: - Create a GitHub issue for the Graffer lazy-loading problem. - Investigate the 4-byte offset in H-Rule image object pointers to determine if it is consistent across files. - Larry: - Approve PR #2561. - Approve Ron's three pending PRs (#2554, #2553, #2544). - Matt: - Remove "draft" status from the Unihann XCCS mappings PR. - Paolo: - Add uninstallation instructions to the project documentation.

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Meeting with Interlisp Medley Interlisp External weekly April 15, 2026  •  122 mins  •  View Meeting

Action Items ✨ No action items detected in this meeting Meeting Summary ✨

Meeting Purpose Sync on project status, bugs, and future initiatives. Key Takeaways Gabriel Benchmarks: A plan is set to publish Medley's performance on Gabriel benchmarks to attract the history of computing community. Herb will first fix the X11 display error blocking runs. H-Rule Bug: A critical bug in H-Rule image object loading was traced to a piece table pointer that is off by 4 bytes, causing a read error. Frank will investigate if this offset is consistent across files. Graffer Lazy Loading: The team will implement a global undefined-function handler to fix Graffer's inability to lazy-load functions (e.g., NCBrowserDrawLink), which currently breaks NoteCards files. Medli Pseudo-Host: The team will adopt the Medli pseudo-host as a stable designator for fonts and libraries, simplifying environment management and enabling comparisons between different Medley versions. Topics Bug Investigation: H-Rule Image Object Loading Problem: Loading old NoteCards files (.tEdit) fails with an error in H-Rule.GetFun because the piece table pointer is off by 4 bytes. Analysis: The pointer targets byte 17, but the correct data (a number 2) is at byte 20. The file contains only line feeds (0A), not carriage returns (0D), ruling out a simple CRLF conversion issue. The GetPieces3 function calculates the text-section pointer by summing piece lengths. A single incorrect length would propagate the error. Hypothesis: The consistent 4-byte offset suggests a systematic calculation error, possibly related to a tab character or a fixed-size header. Solution: Global Undefined-Function Handler Problem: Graffer fails when loading NoteCards files because it cannot find functions like NCBrowserDrawLink that are defined in other files. Current Fix: Frank's PR uses a default function and logs an error, preventing a crash but not solving the root cause. Proposed Solution: Implement a global handler for undefined-function errors. Mechanism: When an undefined-function error occurs, the handler will use WhereIs to locate the function's file, load it, and then retry the original call. Benefits: This provides a generic lazy-loading mechanism, solving the Graffer issue and simplifying future development. System Architecture & Workflow Medli Pseudo-Host: Problem: Font paths and library locations are unstable across environments, making sysouts fragile and comparisons difficult. Solution: Use the Medli pseudo-host as a stable, logical designator for the current Medley installation. Impact: Simplifies MedleyDeer initialization and enables easy switching between different Medley versions (e.g., release vs. dev clone). Git Submodules: Larry's plan to convert system components to submodules will not change developer workflow, as it is a top-down change that does not affect the sub-repos themselves. T-Edit Documentation Styling: Problem: Maintaining consistent styling in T-Edit documentation files is difficult. Solution: Use the "copy paragraph looks" feature (Meta+Shift+Middle-Click) to transfer styles between paragraphs. Future Goal: Implement a full style-sheet system, a feature that was partially developed but never completed. Project Initiatives & Admin SIGCIS Conference (June 17-18, Berkeley): A potential opportunity to present on Interlisp's social impact (e.g., NoteCards). The deadline for "Work in Progress" drafts is May 17. Gabriel Benchmarks: Goal: Publish performance data to attract the history of computing community. Blocker: Paolo is encountering an X11 display error when running the benchmarks. Installation/Uninstallation: Problem: Uninstallation instructions are incomplete. Clarification: Local installations are uninstalled by deleting the main directory and its sister directories (Myco, NoteCards, Loops). Joe Becker Contact: Herb will contact Joe Becker to discuss XCCS and early Unicode history. JetBrains License: The team's all-product license has been renewed for another year. Next Steps Herb: Fix the X11 display error blocking Gabriel benchmark runs. Contact Joe Becker to discuss XCCS and Unicode history. Frank: Create a GitHub issue for the Graffer lazy-loading problem. Investigate the 4-byte offset in H-Rule image object pointers to determine if it is consistent across files. Larry: Approve PR #2561. Approve Ron's three pending PRs (#2554, #2553, #2544). Matt: Remove "draft" status from the Unihann XCCS mappings PR. Paolo: Add uninstallation instructions to the project documentation. View Meeting →

[Nick Briggs]

> Solution: Global Undefined-Function Handler
> • Problem: Graffer fails when loading NoteCards files because it cannot find functions like NCBrowserDrawLink that are defined in other files.

> • Current Fix: Frank's PR uses a default function and logs an error, preventing a crash but not solving the root cause.
> • Proposed Solution: Implement a global handler for undefined-function errors.
> • Mechanism: When an undefined-function error occurs, the handler will use WhereIsto locate the function's file, load it, and then retry the original call.
> • Benefits: This provides a generic lazy-loading mechanism, solving the Grafferissue and simplifying future development.

I'm not sure that an always active generic lazy loading mechanism is a great idea -- when you have multiple implementations of a function on different files so that you can load the one you want this could choose one seemingly at random.

>
> System Architecture & Workflow
> • Medli Pseudo-Host:

> • Problem: Font paths and library locations are unstable across environments, making sysouts fragile and comparisons difficult.
> • Solution: Use the Medli pseudo-host as a stable, logical designator for the current Medley installation.
> • Impact: Simplifies MedleyDeer initialization and enables easy switching between different Medley versions (e.g., release vs. dev clone).

I think I'd be happy if {MEDLEY} pointed at the medley directory that the sysout was started from, and got reset as the running system was started (presumably on some collection of AFTERMAKESYS, AFTERSYSOUT, AFTERLOGOUT), or when GREET is run.

I'd still like to see us get to the point where we can "install" a medley system, which is not a git clone, so is much smaller, has the right EXPORTS.ALL and the right WHEREIS.HASH corresponding to the system as installed, has a reasonable "site-init" file that doesn't need too much (normally: none) customization in order for it to find the user's personal init file

> • Git Submodules: Larry's plan to convert system components to submodules will not change developer workflow, as it is a top-down change that does not affect the sub-repos themselves.
It doesn't change the developer workflow for a sub-component, but it changes what you have to do to incorporate a sub-component into a medley release (i.e., update the maiko submodule link to the right version of maiko)

> • T-Edit Documentation Styling:
> • Problem: Maintaining consistent styling in T-Edit documentation files is difficult.
> • Solution: Use the "copy paragraph looks" feature (Meta+Shift+Middle-Click) to transfer styles between paragraphs.
> • Future Goal: Implement a full style-sheet system, a feature that was partially developed but never completed.
>
>
> Project Initiatives & Admin
> • SIGCIS Conference (June 17-18, Berkeley): A potential opportunity to present on Interlisp's social impact (e.g., NoteCards). The deadline for "Work in Progress" drafts is May 17.
> • Gabriel Benchmarks:
> • Goal: Publish performance data to attract the history of computing community.
> • Blocker: Paolo is encountering an X11 display error when running the benchmarks.
> • Installation/Uninstallation:
> • Problem: Uninstallation instructions are incomplete.
> • Clarification: Local installations are uninstalled by deleting the main directory and its sister directories (Myco, NoteCards, Loops).
> • Joe Becker Contact: Herb will contact Joe Becker to discuss XCCS and early Unicode history.
> • JetBrains License: The team's all-product license has been renewed for another year.
>

[Ron Kaplan]

Apart from this idea, we have talked about the need to get rid of multiple definitions of the same function.  Often this is because a temporary, simple version is defined for loadup purposes, until the ultimate one comes in.

I think Larry's gather-info can be used to find these.  We could then incrementally fix them by imposing a policy that only the final version is defined by that name, and others have a qualified name and a MOVD?.  So suppose the final definition of FOO is on file XXX, but there is a temporary definition on file YYY.  Rename the function FOO on YYY as FOO-YYY, say, and add (MOVD? 'FOO-YYY 'FOO) to that file.

[Nick Briggs]

On Apr 16, 2026, at 10:56, Ron Kaplan <ron.k...@post.harvard.edu> wrote:

Apart from this idea, we have talked about the need to get rid of multiple definitions of the same function.  Often this is because a temporary, simple version is defined for loadup purposes, until the ultimate one comes in.

I think Larry's gather-info can be used to find these.  We could then incrementally fix them by imposing a policy that only the final version is defined by that name, and others have a qualified name and a MOVD?.  So suppose the final definition of FOO is on file XXX, but there is a temporary definition on file YYY.  Rename the function FOO on YYY as FOO-YYY, say, and add (MOVD? 'FOO-YYY 'FOO) to that file.

Isn't this essentially the "maiko movds" redefinitions based on the system type that we pulled out some time back?

On Apr 15, 2026, at 5:00 PM, Nick Briggs <nicholas...@gmail.com> wrote:

'm not sure that an always active generic lazy loading mechanism is a great idea -- when you have multiple implementations of a function on different files so that you can load the one you want this could choose one seemingly at random.

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