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Won't complete bootup (gdm3 problem?)
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 2:00:02 PM11/29/13
to
I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm
doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist. Now, when I
boot my computer, after the Nvidia screen shows (I'm running the
drivers downloaded from Nvidia) I get a screen with an unhappy looking
computer graphic in the center and below that the text:
"Oh no! Something has gone wrong.
A problem has occurred and the system can't recover. Please log out
and try again."
There is a button labeled "Log Out" just below that. Logging out and
back in (nor rebooting) does not help.
The problem may have to do with gdm3. When I went to upgrade it
yesterday it wanted to install a lot of stuff I had previously
uninstalled as no longer needed, so I did not upgrade it. I installed
xdm instead, which worked. But I don't know how to configure it and
it did not start the desktop I usually run (Mate) so decided to go
back to gdm3. I did upgrade it (along with installing the additional
packages it required) but now I get the message above.
I booted to recovery a couple of times and tried various things.
Thinking gdm3 may not have been configured correctly I ran
'dpkg-reconfigure gdm3' and get the message "[ ok ] Scheduling reload
of GNOME Display Manager configureation: gdm3". But it still does not
work. I also removed xdm thinking they may conflict, but that didn't
help. I tried dpkg configure -a in case something else was pending,
but there was no output, and I still get the same message as above
when I tried to boot to the desktop. And, finally, after some more
head scratching I ran 'apt-get install gnome', thinking that I was
missing something related to the Gnome environment. Although it
installed a lot of stuff (47 packages, I think), it still stops at the
same message as above.
Other than reinstalling everything from scratch, can anyone offer any
suggestions on how to fix this?
Thanks,
Jon
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doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist. Now, when I
boot my computer, after the Nvidia screen shows (I'm running the
drivers downloaded from Nvidia) I get a screen with an unhappy looking
computer graphic in the center and below that the text:
"Oh no! Something has gone wrong.
A problem has occurred and the system can't recover. Please log out
and try again."
There is a button labeled "Log Out" just below that. Logging out and
back in (nor rebooting) does not help.
The problem may have to do with gdm3. When I went to upgrade it
yesterday it wanted to install a lot of stuff I had previously
uninstalled as no longer needed, so I did not upgrade it. I installed
xdm instead, which worked. But I don't know how to configure it and
it did not start the desktop I usually run (Mate) so decided to go
back to gdm3. I did upgrade it (along with installing the additional
packages it required) but now I get the message above.
I booted to recovery a couple of times and tried various things.
Thinking gdm3 may not have been configured correctly I ran
'dpkg-reconfigure gdm3' and get the message "[ ok ] Scheduling reload
of GNOME Display Manager configureation: gdm3". But it still does not
work. I also removed xdm thinking they may conflict, but that didn't
help. I tried dpkg configure -a in case something else was pending,
but there was no output, and I still get the same message as above
when I tried to boot to the desktop. And, finally, after some more
head scratching I ran 'apt-get install gnome', thinking that I was
missing something related to the Gnome environment. Although it
installed a lot of stuff (47 packages, I think), it still stops at the
same message as above.
Other than reinstalling everything from scratch, can anyone offer any
suggestions on how to fix this?
Thanks,
Jon
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Bob Proulx
Nov 29, 2013, 2:50:01 PM11/29/13
to
Jon N wrote:
> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm
> doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist.
It is okay to mess with things as long as you learn about the system
> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm
> doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist.
through the process. :-)
> Now, when I boot my computer, after the Nvidia screen shows (I'm
> running the drivers downloaded from Nvidia)
> I get a screen with an unhappy looking computer graphic in the
> center and below that the text:
> "Oh no! Something has gone wrong.
> A problem has occurred and the system can't recover. Please log out
> and try again."
> There is a button labeled "Log Out" just below that. Logging out and
> back in (nor rebooting) does not help.
is running just fine. But the GNOME desktop environment has failed to
start.
Now some people might claim that GNOME *is* the operating system. But
don't believe it. It is not. This is proven by the number of people
that use Debian every day but do not have GNOME on the system at all.
> The problem may have to do with gdm3. When I went to upgrade it
> yesterday it wanted to install a lot of stuff I had previously
> uninstalled as no longer needed, so I did not upgrade it. I installed
> xdm instead, which worked.
and kdm are based upon.
If you preferred a pretty one then lightdm is the same but has shiny
styling. I have been using it on systems with a graphical login
manager installed.
> But I don't know how to configure it and
> it did not start the desktop I usually run (Mate) so decided to go
> back to gdm3. I did upgrade it (along with installing the additional
> packages it required) but now I get the message above.
> I booted to recovery a couple of times and tried various things.
your installed gdm/gdm3 is giving you that error then your system is
running perfectly fine. Simply log into it and fix the problems with
GNOME. You do not need to boot a recovery.
Your system will be starting six login terminals on the Linux console.
Choose one of them and log in. One of these:
Cntl-Alt-F1
Cntl-Alt-F2
Cntl-Alt-F3
Cntl-Alt-F4
Cntl-Alt-F5
Cntl-Alt-F6
Any of those will get you to one of the Linux VTs 1 through 6. The X
session will be running on either VT 7 or VT 8. (It should be VT 7
and will be but due to a bug then the second time it will rotate up to
VT 8 and remain there.) Use Cntl-Alt-F7 to return to the graphics
session runing on VT 7. Or use Cntl-Alt-F8 if it is moved to VT 8.
> Thinking gdm3 may not have been configured correctly I ran
> 'dpkg-reconfigure gdm3' and get the message "[ ok ] Scheduling reload
> of GNOME Display Manager configureation: gdm3". But it still does not
> work. I also removed xdm thinking they may conflict, but that didn't
> help.
installed at the same time. The system selects which one to start by
the contents of the /etc/X11/default-display-manager file. It
contains one entry. It contains the path to the display manager to
start. It will point to one of xdm, gdm, gdm3, kdm, lightdm, or other
xdm alternative display manager. I sometimes edit that file manually
and make the string point to a non-existent entry (append .disable) to
temporarily disable things. Then it won't try to start an xdm at boot
time and will display the Linux VT 1.
> I tried dpkg configure -a in case something else was pending,
Good idea. But with the "--configure" not "configure".
> but there was no output, and I still get the same message as above
> when I tried to boot to the desktop. And, finally, after some more
> head scratching I ran 'apt-get install gnome', thinking that I was
> missing something related to the Gnome environment. Although it
> installed a lot of stuff (47 packages, I think), it still stops at the
> same message as above.
components such as gnome-core. Removing gnome won't really remove
core parts. If they weren't marked as manually installed then you
might have them offered as a candidate with 'apt-get autoremove' after
removing the 'gnome' package. But you could always remove them
manually. You can get a list like this:
dpkg -l | grep gnome
> Other than reinstalling everything from scratch, can anyone offer any
> suggestions on how to fix this?
for clues.
If you really have no investment in the system then installing a
pristine image would reset things to a known state. But it is such a
needless waste of time.
If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
correctly and successfully.
Bob
Neal Murphy
Nov 29, 2013, 3:30:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Friday, November 29, 2013 02:44:58 PM Bob Proulx wrote:
> Now some people might claim that GNOME *is* the operating system. But
> don't believe it. It is not. This is proven by the number of people
> that use Debian every day but do not have GNOME on the system at all.
I would say they don't know the difference between an operating system and a
> Now some people might claim that GNOME *is* the operating system. But
> don't believe it. It is not. This is proven by the number of people
> that use Debian every day but do not have GNOME on the system at all.
graphical user interface. Generally speaking, an operating system provides
controlled access to system (hardware) resources. A grahical user interface is
supposed to provide a pleasant and efficient intermediate layer between the
user and the OS; but not all succeed.
User interfaces include front panel switches (ala PDP-10/PDP-11), card
punches, console (command line interface), and graphical. There are even
hybrids. But they certainly are not operating systems, as you said.
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 3:50:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Bob Proulx <b...@proulx.com> wrote:
> Jon N wrote:
>> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm
>> doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist.
>
> It is okay to mess with things as long as you learn about the system
> through the process. :-)
>
>> Now, when I boot my computer, after the Nvidia screen shows (I'm
>> running the drivers downloaded from Nvidia)
>
> (shakes head)
>
>> I get a screen with an unhappy looking computer graphic in the
>> center and below that the text:
>> "Oh no! Something has gone wrong.
>> A problem has occurred and the system can't recover. Please log out
>> and try again."
>
> I think that is GNOME or GDM failing.
>
>> There is a button labeled "Log Out" just below that. Logging out and
>> back in (nor rebooting) does not help.
>
> Your computer has booted the operating system just fine. Your system
> is running just fine. But the GNOME desktop environment has failed to
> start.
Yes, except I haven't used Gnome since Gnome 3 came out. But a lot of
> Jon N wrote:
>> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm
>> doing for the most part. But sometimes I can't resist.
>
> It is okay to mess with things as long as you learn about the system
> through the process. :-)
>
>> Now, when I boot my computer, after the Nvidia screen shows (I'm
>> running the drivers downloaded from Nvidia)
>
> (shakes head)
>
>> I get a screen with an unhappy looking computer graphic in the
>> center and below that the text:
>> "Oh no! Something has gone wrong.
>> A problem has occurred and the system can't recover. Please log out
>> and try again."
>
> I think that is GNOME or GDM failing.
>
>> There is a button labeled "Log Out" just below that. Logging out and
>> back in (nor rebooting) does not help.
>
> Your computer has booted the operating system just fine. Your system
> is running just fine. But the GNOME desktop environment has failed to
> start.
it's components were still installed. I also have Mate, Xfce,
Openbox, Enlightenment, and probably one or two other... uh, desktops,
window managers, etc, installed. I've tried all of them at least
once.
>
> Now some people might claim that GNOME *is* the operating system. But
> don't believe it. It is not. This is proven by the number of people
> that use Debian every day but do not have GNOME on the system at all.
>
>> The problem may have to do with gdm3. When I went to upgrade it
>> yesterday it wanted to install a lot of stuff I had previously
>> uninstalled as no longer needed, so I did not upgrade it. I installed
>> xdm instead, which worked.
>
> xdm is fine. It is the venerable original X Display Manager that gdm
> and kdm are based upon.
>
> If you preferred a pretty one then lightdm is the same but has shiny
> styling. I have been using it on systems with a graphical login
> manager installed.
>
environment I want to load. Normally I use Mate, but xdm didn't offer
any choice and I don't know how to change it. Not that i can
Jon
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 29, 2013, 4:00:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 12:44 -0700, Bob Proulx wrote:
> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
> correctly and successfully.
Confirmed!
> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
> correctly and successfully.
LightDM + Xfce does cause less issues on all distros I tested. I try to
replace Xfce, because it has got some weak points, but I still recommend
Xfce and I don't know if I'll find a DE to replace it, maybe I stay with
Xfce.
GNOME3, Mate, and Cinnamon are no-gos. I suspect Enlightenment will be a
no-go forever too, but I have given up to test it again. If you don't
have high standards, just use a WM or Fluxbox, Ion or something that
lightweight. I'm testing KDE4 again and I also perhaps will take a look
at LXDE again.
My problems with large DEs, such as GNOME and KDE is, that while all DEs
have weak points, the heavy weight DEs like GNOME and KDE tend to make
dependencies hard dependencies, that should be optional and they are so
huge that it's hard to find a culprit, if something does annoy you. A
small DE usually has more optional, than hard dependencies and if
something is bad, it's easy to find and remove.
An example of such a thing that annoys me is a buggy virtual file
thingy. For Xfce it was easy to find and to remove the HDD killer. GVFS
does wake up "green" drives again and again. The same HDD killer is used
by GNOME, but for GNOME it's not an optional, but a hard dependency, so
it's a little bit more work to remove it. KDE has got such a HDD killer
too, but I still need to find it. If I should know what does kill the
HDDs (KIO, Nepomuk or whatever else), then it might be a hard
dependency, maybe easy, but perhaps impossible to remove.
Everything with GTK/GNOME dependencies has got a huge risk to fail. GTK2
is ok, but asking to switch to GTK3 and then the fun begins. each update
then will be a lottery.
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 29, 2013, 4:10:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 15:43 -0500, Jon N wrote:
> The only reason I prefer gdm3 is it gives me options on which
> environment I want to load. Normally I use Mate, but xdm didn't offer
> any choice and I don't know how to change it.
That's not a good reason. A good reason to use GDM3 might be
> The only reason I prefer gdm3 is it gives me options on which
> environment I want to load. Normally I use Mate, but xdm didn't offer
> any choice and I don't know how to change it.
accessibility. I guess Orca (a speech synth) does work with GDM3, if so,
it also makes sense that the dependency chain even does include a sound
server as hard dependency.
I don't know xdm, I'm using LightDM and I guess it can be used with more
or less the same greeters as GDM can be used. So all the options and
flashy appearances should be available too, excepted of some very
special things. I guess there will be no sound, IOW no Orca for LightDM,
but regarding to this, also no hard dependency to a sound server.
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 4:10:02 PM11/29/13
to
can't learn, but I would rather do it when the rest of the system is
working the way I like.
>>> But I don't know how to configure it and
>>> it did not start the desktop I usually run (Mate) so decided to go
>>> back to gdm3. I did upgrade it (along with installing the additional
>>> packages it required) but now I get the message above.
>>
>> Look for errors in your $HOME/.xsession-errors file.
promising. Both not being able to parse, and read, several files:
/home/<username>/.config/autostart/xfce4-notes-autostart.desktop
/home/<username>/.config/autostart/xfce4-settings-helper-autostart.desktop
/home/<username>/.config/autostart/zeitgeist-datahub.desktop
>>
>>> I booted to recovery a couple of times and tried various things.
>>
>> Why boot to recovery? If you are actually getting to the point where
>> your installed gdm/gdm3 is giving you that error then your system is
>> running perfectly fine. Simply log into it and fix the problems with
>> GNOME. You do not need to boot a recovery.
>>
>> Your system will be starting six login terminals on the Linux console.
>> Choose one of them and log in. One of these:
>>
>> Cntl-Alt-F1
>> Cntl-Alt-F2
>> Cntl-Alt-F3
>> Cntl-Alt-F4
>> Cntl-Alt-F5
>> Cntl-Alt-F6
>>
options from GRUB just to save a little time if I know I'm not going
to load a desktop.
>> Any of those will get you to one of the Linux VTs 1 through 6. The X
>> session will be running on either VT 7 or VT 8. (It should be VT 7
>> and will be but due to a bug then the second time it will rotate up to
>> VT 8 and remain there.) Use Cntl-Alt-F7 to return to the graphics
>> session runing on VT 7. Or use Cntl-Alt-F8 if it is moved to VT 8.
VT's, but 7 is blank, and 8 may just have a cursor blinking in the
upper left corner. 1-6 are OK.
>>
>>> Thinking gdm3 may not have been configured correctly I ran
>>> 'dpkg-reconfigure gdm3' and get the message "[ ok ] Scheduling reload
>>> of GNOME Display Manager configureation: gdm3". But it still does not
>>> work. I also removed xdm thinking they may conflict, but that didn't
>>> help.
>>
>> Multiple graphical login managers (X display managers) may be
>> installed at the same time. The system selects which one to start by
>> the contents of the /etc/X11/default-display-manager file. It
>> contains one entry. It contains the path to the display manager to
>> start. It will point to one of xdm, gdm, gdm3, kdm, lightdm, or other
>> xdm alternative display manager. I sometimes edit that file manually
>> and make the string point to a non-existent entry (append .disable) to
>> temporarily disable things. Then it won't try to start an xdm at boot
>> time and will display the Linux VT 1.
>>
>>> I tried dpkg configure -a in case something else was pending,
>>
>> dpkg --configure -a
>>
>> Good idea. But with the "--configure" not "configure".
I did it again, just to make sure the '--' was in there, but it didn't
>>> Thinking gdm3 may not have been configured correctly I ran
>>> 'dpkg-reconfigure gdm3' and get the message "[ ok ] Scheduling reload
>>> of GNOME Display Manager configureation: gdm3". But it still does not
>>> work. I also removed xdm thinking they may conflict, but that didn't
>>> help.
>>
>> Multiple graphical login managers (X display managers) may be
>> installed at the same time. The system selects which one to start by
>> the contents of the /etc/X11/default-display-manager file. It
>> contains one entry. It contains the path to the display manager to
>> start. It will point to one of xdm, gdm, gdm3, kdm, lightdm, or other
>> xdm alternative display manager. I sometimes edit that file manually
>> and make the string point to a non-existent entry (append .disable) to
>> temporarily disable things. Then it won't try to start an xdm at boot
>> time and will display the Linux VT 1.
>>
>>> I tried dpkg configure -a in case something else was pending,
>>
>> dpkg --configure -a
>>
>> Good idea. But with the "--configure" not "configure".
change anything
>>
>>> but there was no output, and I still get the same message as above
>>
>> Then all of the packages successfully configured.
>>
>>> when I tried to boot to the desktop. And, finally, after some more
>>> head scratching I ran 'apt-get install gnome', thinking that I was
>>> missing something related to the Gnome environment. Although it
>>> installed a lot of stuff (47 packages, I think), it still stops at the
>>> same message as above.
>>
>> The "gnome" package is a meta package. It depends upon other
>> components such as gnome-core. Removing gnome won't really remove
>> core parts. If they weren't marked as manually installed then you
>> might have them offered as a candidate with 'apt-get autoremove' after
>> removing the 'gnome' package. But you could always remove them
>> manually. You can get a list like this:
>>
>> dpkg -l | grep gnome
Yes, I figured it was a meta package, but at least, if I was missing
>>> but there was no output, and I still get the same message as above
>>
>> Then all of the packages successfully configured.
>>
>>> when I tried to boot to the desktop. And, finally, after some more
>>> head scratching I ran 'apt-get install gnome', thinking that I was
>>> missing something related to the Gnome environment. Although it
>>> installed a lot of stuff (47 packages, I think), it still stops at the
>>> same message as above.
>>
>> The "gnome" package is a meta package. It depends upon other
>> components such as gnome-core. Removing gnome won't really remove
>> core parts. If they weren't marked as manually installed then you
>> might have them offered as a candidate with 'apt-get autoremove' after
>> removing the 'gnome' package. But you could always remove them
>> manually. You can get a list like this:
>>
>> dpkg -l | grep gnome
something important, it should install any missing packages that are
effecting this.
>>
>>> Other than reinstalling everything from scratch, can anyone offer any
>>> suggestions on how to fix this?
>>
>> Figure out what you broke. Look in your $HOME/.xsession-errors file
>> for clues.
>>
>> If you really have no investment in the system then installing a
>> pristine image would reset things to a known state. But it is such a
>> needless waste of time.
I agree. I have been using this system for about 7 years, recreating
>>> Other than reinstalling everything from scratch, can anyone offer any
>>> suggestions on how to fix this?
>>
>> Figure out what you broke. Look in your $HOME/.xsession-errors file
>> for clues.
>>
>> If you really have no investment in the system then installing a
>> pristine image would reset things to a known state. But it is such a
>> needless waste of time.
it would be one big colossal pain. Actually, I'm buying new equipment
(it's finally time to upgrade) and was looking forward to a new
system. But it will take weeks or more before I get everything set up
again.
>>
>> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
>> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
>> correctly and successfully.
I like Xfce. Since nothing in xsessions-errors really popped out at
>> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
>> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
>> correctly and successfully.
me as an obvious cause so far all can think to do is keep
re-installing things hoping it will fix the problem. Not a very
efficient approach, I admit.
Thanks,
Jon
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 4:40:01 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Ralf Mardorf
<ralf.m...@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 12:44 -0700, Bob Proulx wrote:
>> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
>> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
>> correctly and successfully.
>
> Confirmed!
>
> LightDM + Xfce does cause less issues on all distros I tested. I try to
> replace Xfce, because it has got some weak points, but I still recommend
> Xfce and I don't know if I'll find a DE to replace it, maybe I stay with
> Xfce.
>
> GNOME3, Mate, and Cinnamon are no-gos. I suspect Enlightenment will be a
> no-go forever too, but I have given up to test it again. If you don't
> have high standards, just use a WM or Fluxbox, Ion or something that
> lightweight. I'm testing KDE4 again and I also perhaps will take a look
> at LXDE again.
Enlightenment seems a long way from the heavyweights like Gnome, Mate,
<ralf.m...@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 12:44 -0700, Bob Proulx wrote:
>> If you want to avoid GNOME then I would install either 'xdm' or
>> 'lightdm' and then install 'xfce4'. It is much more likely to operate
>> correctly and successfully.
>
> Confirmed!
>
> LightDM + Xfce does cause less issues on all distros I tested. I try to
> replace Xfce, because it has got some weak points, but I still recommend
> Xfce and I don't know if I'll find a DE to replace it, maybe I stay with
> Xfce.
>
> GNOME3, Mate, and Cinnamon are no-gos. I suspect Enlightenment will be a
> no-go forever too, but I have given up to test it again. If you don't
> have high standards, just use a WM or Fluxbox, Ion or something that
> lightweight. I'm testing KDE4 again and I also perhaps will take a look
> at LXDE again.
etc. Why do you feel that is also a no-go?
> My problems with large DEs, such as GNOME and KDE is, that while all DEs
> have weak points, the heavy weight DEs like GNOME and KDE tend to make
> dependencies hard dependencies, that should be optional and they are so
> huge that it's hard to find a culprit, if something does annoy you. A
> small DE usually has more optional, than hard dependencies and if
> something is bad, it's easy to find and remove.
when I went to upgrade gdm3 it wanted to install Evolution. Why would
a display manager need a desktop program that does email/calendar/etc?
> An example of such a thing that annoys me is a buggy virtual file
> thingy. For Xfce it was easy to find and to remove the HDD killer. GVFS
> does wake up "green" drives again and again. The same HDD killer is used
> by GNOME, but for GNOME it's not an optional, but a hard dependency, so
> it's a little bit more work to remove it. KDE has got such a HDD killer
> too, but I still need to find it. If I should know what does kill the
> HDDs (KIO, Nepomuk or whatever else), then it might be a hard
> dependency, maybe easy, but perhaps impossible to remove.
>
> Everything with GTK/GNOME dependencies has got a huge risk to fail. GTK2
> is ok, but asking to switch to GTK3 and then the fun begins. each update
> then will be a lottery.
Jon
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 4:50:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 4:03 PM, Ralf Mardorf
<ralf.m...@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 15:43 -0500, Jon N wrote:
>> The only reason I prefer gdm3 is it gives me options on which
>> environment I want to load. Normally I use Mate, but xdm didn't offer
>> any choice and I don't know how to change it.
>
> That's not a good reason. A good reason to use GDM3 might be
> accessibility. I guess Orca (a speech synth) does work with GDM3, if so,
> it also makes sense that the dependency chain even does include a sound
> server as hard dependency.
>
> I don't know xdm, I'm using LightDM and I guess it can be used with more
> or less the same greeters as GDM can be used. So all the options and
> flashy appearances should be available too, excepted of some very
> special things. I guess there will be no sound, IOW no Orca for LightDM,
> but regarding to this, also no hard dependency to a sound server.
Well, it was very good (IMHO) when it was gdm2, I really liked it
<ralf.m...@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 15:43 -0500, Jon N wrote:
>> The only reason I prefer gdm3 is it gives me options on which
>> environment I want to load. Normally I use Mate, but xdm didn't offer
>> any choice and I don't know how to change it.
>
> That's not a good reason. A good reason to use GDM3 might be
> accessibility. I guess Orca (a speech synth) does work with GDM3, if so,
> it also makes sense that the dependency chain even does include a sound
> server as hard dependency.
>
> I don't know xdm, I'm using LightDM and I guess it can be used with more
> or less the same greeters as GDM can be used. So all the options and
> flashy appearances should be available too, excepted of some very
> special things. I guess there will be no sound, IOW no Orca for LightDM,
> but regarding to this, also no hard dependency to a sound server.
then. Mostly because I could easily configure it so I didn't even see
it at all (it logged me in automatically). And I use Gnome then also,
which at the time I liked that too.
But, the good news is I am back up and running again. I install
lightDM (thanks for the suggestion!) which did bring me to a log in
prompt. The first time I logged in I accepted the default, which gave
me the 'Oops, Something has gone wrong' screen again. But the next
time I selected Mate and I'm back to my normal desktop.
All this talk about desktops has me thinking of what I will install
when I get my new system. I really like what I think is a traditional
desktop, such as what Gnome2 gave me. I like the idea of some of the
lightweight environments such as Blackbox or Enlightenment, but can't
get used to using them. I did run Xfce for a while, since it's
installed (and hopefully still working) I can switch back and forth
pretty easily so will have to try it again.
Thanks again for your help,
Jon
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Joe
Nov 29, 2013, 5:30:02 PM11/29/13
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On Fri, 29 Nov 2013 16:45:53 -0500
Jon N <jdnan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> All this talk about desktops has me thinking of what I will install
> when I get my new system. I really like what I think is a traditional
> desktop, such as what Gnome2 gave me. I like the idea of some of the
> lightweight environments such as Blackbox or Enlightenment, but can't
> get used to using them. I did run Xfce for a while, since it's
> installed (and hopefully still working) I can switch back and forth
> pretty easily so will have to try it again.
>
The other 'medium-weight' DE to Xfce is LXDE/Openbox, which I slightly
Jon N <jdnan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> All this talk about desktops has me thinking of what I will install
> when I get my new system. I really like what I think is a traditional
> desktop, such as what Gnome2 gave me. I like the idea of some of the
> lightweight environments such as Blackbox or Enlightenment, but can't
> get used to using them. I did run Xfce for a while, since it's
> installed (and hopefully still working) I can switch back and forth
> pretty easily so will have to try it again.
>
prefer, but which has been a little flaky of late, though that is on
sid. I need to shut down from a terminal, as lxsession currently throws
a GTK exception at a shutdown attempt.
It's also a bit of a pain to make the Debian menu tree work in LXDE, but
many people aren't bothered about that. I have it working on my
desktop, but I can't seem to get it on another sid LXDE installation,
and I can't for the life of me see what is different about it. But I
came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
--
Joe
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 29, 2013, 5:30:02 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 16:34 -0500, Jon N wrote:
> Enlightenment seems a long way from the heavyweights like Gnome, Mate,
> etc. Why do you feel that is also a no-go?
During the years I tested it several times and it never was stable when
> Enlightenment seems a long way from the heavyweights like Gnome, Mate,
> etc. Why do you feel that is also a no-go?
I used it.
> Funny you should mention that. One of the things I found odd is that
> when I went to upgrade gdm3 it wanted to install Evolution. Why would
> a display manager need a desktop program that does email/calendar/etc?
install optional dependencies too. Unlikely that the dependency chain
does include Evolution ... but not impossible ;).
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Jeff Bauer
Nov 29, 2013, 5:40:01 PM11/29/13
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On 11/29/2013 05:21 PM, Joe wrote:
> But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
My first experience with Linux and KDE was with a Knoppix live CD. KDE?
> But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
Never. Again.
I boot to a tty prompt, log in, and type "startx" which brings up my
forever faithful ratpoison WM. Between ratpoison and ROX, I'm pretty
much set and not shopping for a DE.
Jeff
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 6:40:02 PM11/29/13
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On Fri, Nov 29, 2013 at 5:37 PM, Jeff Bauer <alie...@charter.net> wrote:
> On 11/29/2013 05:21 PM, Joe wrote:
>>
>> But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
>
> My first experience with Linux and KDE was with a Knoppix live CD. KDE?
> Never. Again.
>
> I boot to a tty prompt, log in, and type "startx" which brings up my forever
> faithful ratpoison WM. Between ratpoison and ROX, I'm pretty much set and
> not shopping for a DE.
>
> Jeff
I tried KDE a couple of time, but I have to admit I found it
> On 11/29/2013 05:21 PM, Joe wrote:
>>
>> But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
>
> My first experience with Linux and KDE was with a Knoppix live CD. KDE?
> Never. Again.
>
> I boot to a tty prompt, log in, and type "startx" which brings up my forever
> faithful ratpoison WM. Between ratpoison and ROX, I'm pretty much set and
> not shopping for a DE.
>
> Jeff
confusing. I felt like I was chasing my tail trying to find things.
Jon
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Jon N
Nov 29, 2013, 6:40:02 PM11/29/13
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On Nov 29, 2013 5:29 PM, "Ralf Mardorf" <ralf.m...@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
>
> On Fri, 2013-11-29 at 16:34 -0500, Jon N wrote:
> > Enlightenment seems a long way from the heavyweights like Gnome, Mate,
> > etc. Why do you feel that is also a no-go?
>
> During the years I tested it several times and it never was stable when
> I used it.
>
> > Funny you should mention that. One of the things I found odd is that
> > when I went to upgrade gdm3 it wanted to install Evolution. Why would
> > a display manager need a desktop program that does email/calendar/etc?
>
> If you used synaptic, it might be, that it was set up to automatically
> install optional dependencies too. Unlikely that the dependency chain
> does include Evolution ... but not impossible ;).
I checked, that option is turned off (which I prefer). But I remembered later that Gnome-session was in the upgrade list also, so it was probably that.
Joe
Nov 29, 2013, 7:20:01 PM11/29/13
to
On Fri, 29 Nov 2013 17:37:55 -0500
Jeff Bauer <alie...@charter.net> wrote:
> On 11/29/2013 05:21 PM, Joe wrote:
> > But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
> My first experience with Linux and KDE was with a Knoppix live CD.
> KDE? Never. Again.
>
I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
Jeff Bauer <alie...@charter.net> wrote:
> On 11/29/2013 05:21 PM, Joe wrote:
> > But I came from Gnome2, and LXDE feels more comfortable than Xfce.
> My first experience with Linux and KDE was with a Knoppix live CD.
> KDE? Never. Again.
>
beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
LXDE for some time now.
> I boot to a tty prompt, log in, and type "startx" which brings up my
> forever faithful ratpoison WM. Between ratpoison and ROX, I'm pretty
> much set and not shopping for a DE.
>
--
Joe
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 30, 2013, 2:50:01 PM11/30/13
to
On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 00:16 +0000, Joe wrote:
> I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> LXDE for some time now.
Yesterday I installed Razor-Qt using KWin to one of my Linux installs.
> I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> LXDE for some time now.
There are issues with the mouse theme and while the install should be in
English only, some Window titles and bottoms are in German, but the
Window content is in English. FWIW, the mouse cursor theme is ok when
the cursor is above the desktop, but when it's above a Window, the
cursor theme changes to an unwanted theme. If there wouldn't bee those
issues, it likely would become my new DE. JFTR, it's a Kubuntu install,
I'll try Razor-Qt with Debian and/or Arch Linux, to see if the issues
are *buntu related.
Regards,
Ralf
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 30, 2013, 3:00:02 PM11/30/13
to
On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 20:43 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 00:16 +0000, Joe wrote:
> > I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> > beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> > LXDE for some time now.
>
> Yesterday I installed Razor-Qt using KWin to one of my Linux installs.
> There are issues with the mouse theme and while the install should be in
> English only, some Window titles and bottoms are in German, but the
^^^^^^^ buttons
> On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 00:16 +0000, Joe wrote:
> > I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> > beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> > LXDE for some time now.
>
> Yesterday I installed Razor-Qt using KWin to one of my Linux installs.
> There are issues with the mouse theme and while the install should be in
> English only, some Window titles and bottoms are in German, but the
> Window content is in English. FWIW, the mouse cursor theme is ok when
> the cursor is above the desktop, but when it's above a Window, the
> cursor theme changes to an unwanted theme. If there wouldn't bee those
> issues, it likely would become my new DE. JFTR, it's a Kubuntu install,
> I'll try Razor-Qt with Debian and/or Arch Linux, to see if the issues
> are *buntu related.
>
> Regards,
> Ralf
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> the cursor is above the desktop, but when it's above a Window, the
> cursor theme changes to an unwanted theme. If there wouldn't bee those
> issues, it likely would become my new DE. JFTR, it's a Kubuntu install,
> I'll try Razor-Qt with Debian and/or Arch Linux, to see if the issues
> are *buntu related.
>
> Regards,
> Ralf
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Neal Murphy
Nov 30, 2013, 3:20:01 PM11/30/13
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On Saturday, November 30, 2013 02:57:13 PM Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 20:43 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 00:16 +0000, Joe wrote:
> > > I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> > > beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> > > LXDE for some time now.
> >
> > Yesterday I installed Razor-Qt using KWin to one of my Linux installs.
> > There are issues with the mouse theme and while the install should be in
> > English only, some Window titles and bottoms are in German, but the
>
> ^^^^^^^ buttons
>
> > Window content is in English. FWIW, the mouse cursor theme is ok when
> > the cursor is above the desktop, but when it's above a Window, the
> > cursor theme changes to an unwanted theme. If there wouldn't bee those
> > issues, it likely would become my new DE. JFTR, it's a Kubuntu install,
> > I'll try Razor-Qt with Debian and/or Arch Linux, to see if the issues
> > are *buntu related.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ralf
That's the only mistake? Gotta say, Debian's voice recognition is much better
> On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 20:43 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > On Sat, 2013-11-30 at 00:16 +0000, Joe wrote:
> > > I haven't tried KDE for a while, and I'm not really interested in a big
> > > beast. I do keep a Knoppix DVD handy for emergencies, but it has used
> > > LXDE for some time now.
> >
> > Yesterday I installed Razor-Qt using KWin to one of my Linux installs.
> > There are issues with the mouse theme and while the install should be in
> > English only, some Window titles and bottoms are in German, but the
>
> ^^^^^^^ buttons
>
> > Window content is in English. FWIW, the mouse cursor theme is ok when
> > the cursor is above the desktop, but when it's above a Window, the
> > cursor theme changes to an unwanted theme. If there wouldn't bee those
> > issues, it likely would become my new DE. JFTR, it's a Kubuntu install,
> > I'll try Razor-Qt with Debian and/or Arch Linux, to see if the issues
> > are *buntu related.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ralf
than most smart phones. I'd hate to see how a smart phone would've garbled
Ralf's text. :D
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Ralf Mardorf
Nov 30, 2013, 4:10:01 PM11/30/13
to
"If there wouldn't bee those issues"
Birds and bees ;). I'm able to make more mistakes, without speech
recognition :D.
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Hendrik Boom
Dec 8, 2013, 1:50:02 PM12/8/13
to
On Fri, 29 Nov 2013 13:59:01 -0500, Jon N wrote:
> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm doing
> for the most part.
There's a good chance it's not your doing. The mailing list archives
> I know I shouldn't mess with things, I really don't know what i'm doing
> for the most part.
suggest a lot of people have had similar ptoblems lately.
My gdm3 failed today.
It gives me a black screen with a few icons in the top left that I can
use for things like check battery status and powering down. Logging in
did not seem to be an option.
I still could log in on a text console (control-alt-F1) and run startx.
But instead of my usual xfce I got gnome3, which I find unusable.
I decide to install another display manager.
I install xdm and reboot. I get to log in, but I seemed to have no
choice of window manger, and again got gnome3.
I install lightdm and reboot. This one gives ma a choice of window
manager. I choose IceWm and my system is again usable.
Don't blame yourself. I suspect it's gdm3. Again. (It screwed up the
upgrade to wheezy on my server, too. But that was almost a year ago, when
gnome wa in shambles. I gather it's better now. It just doesn't seem to
do what I want.)
There must be some way to choose a different window manager using .xinitrc
or .xserverrc or something like that, but I don't know what it is. I
used to, over a decade ago, when you *had* to hand-edit these files to
survive.
-- hendrik
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Ralf Mardorf
Dec 8, 2013, 2:00:01 PM12/8/13
to
On Sun, 2013-12-08 at 19:52 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> On Sun, 2013-12-08 at 18:42 +0000, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> > .xinitrc
>
> ~/.xinitrc could be ignored, regarding to other ways to automatically
> start X, a WM or DE. Using ~/.xinitrc is just one way to do it.
^^^ should be xterm, X already was started when the display
manager's greeter appeared.
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> On Sun, 2013-12-08 at 18:42 +0000, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> > .xinitrc
>
> ~/.xinitrc could be ignored, regarding to other ways to automatically
> start X, a WM or DE. Using ~/.xinitrc is just one way to do it.
^^^ should be xterm, X already was started when the display
manager's greeter appeared.
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Ralf Mardorf
Dec 8, 2013, 2:00:01 PM12/8/13
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On Sun, 2013-12-08 at 18:42 +0000, Hendrik Boom wrote:
> .xinitrc
~/.xinitrc could be ignored, regarding to other ways to automatically
start X, a WM or DE. Using ~/.xinitrc is just one way to do it.
> .xinitrc
~/.xinitrc could be ignored, regarding to other ways to automatically
start X, a WM or DE. Using ~/.xinitrc is just one way to do it.
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