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Mike McClain
Apr 9, 2014, 7:00:01 PM4/9/14
to
The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many directories
in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I deleted them.
Today they're back but I can't tell how they got there. Nothing in
/etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume mandb did it
but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all these directories.
Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many people speak all of
those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having all of them installed?
Is there a config file I can edit to limit which directories are
created?
Thanks,
Mike
--
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possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true."
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in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I deleted them.
Today they're back but I can't tell how they got there. Nothing in
/etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume mandb did it
but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all these directories.
Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many people speak all of
those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having all of them installed?
Is there a config file I can edit to limit which directories are
created?
Thanks,
Mike
--
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true."
--
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Scott Ferguson
Apr 9, 2014, 7:20:02 PM4/9/14
to
On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
> deleted them.
That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
> deleted them.
> Today they're back but I can't tell how they got there.
didn't create a huge problem.
> Nothing in /etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume
> mandb did it but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all
> these directories. Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many
> people speak all of those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having
> all of them installed?
Wouldn't that make it a rhetorical question?
:)
The answer of course is that most people use characters and words from a
number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a lot of space.
You have several options:-
;don't install all languages to start with (be selective during installs
- don't install i18n packages if you don't want internationalization)
;don't install man
;install localpurge, select only the locales you are interested in, use
it to purge other locales
> Is there a config file I can edit to limit which directories are
> created?
installed packages.
> Thanks, Mike -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of
> all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true."
>
>
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Doug
Apr 9, 2014, 8:10:02 PM4/9/14
to
On 04/09/2014 07:14 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
>> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
>> deleted them.
> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
>
> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words from a
> number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a lot of space.
>
>
/snip/
> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words from a
> number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a lot of space.
>
>
The only characters that anyone could reasonably need can be
formed by setting up a Compose key. That will allow you all
the diacritical marks for the Romance languages, the
umlauts and esstset for German, and some of the oddball stuff that
you see in the Scandinavian and Polish languages. It's unlikely that
you're going to need a Cyrillic or East Asian alphabet (of which there
are several--Korean, Japanese, Chinese, Thai, probably more).
The Compose will also give you currency signs and some common
fractions.
(Some word processors have tables of symbols--things you wouldn't
find in any of the locales, like musical flat signs, some mathematical
operators, etc.)
Unless you are going to actually write in a language other than English,
you won't need any locale other than that.
--doug
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Scott Ferguson
Apr 9, 2014, 9:00:01 PM4/9/14
to
On 10/04/14 10:07, Doug wrote:
>
> On 04/09/2014 07:14 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>>> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
>>> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
>>> deleted them.
>> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
> snip/
>>
>> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words
>> from a number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a
>> lot of space.
>>
>>
> /snip/
>
> The only characters that anyone could reasonably need can be formed
> by setting up a Compose key.
Do you have a source for that or is it just an opinion from the
>
> On 04/09/2014 07:14 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>>> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
>>> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
>>> deleted them.
>> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
> snip/
>>
>> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words
>> from a number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a
>> lot of space.
>>
>>
> /snip/
>
> The only characters that anyone could reasonably need can be formed
> by setting up a Compose key.
viewpoint of a particular location?
> That will allow you all the diacritical marks for the Romance
> languages, the umlauts and esstset for German, and some of the
> oddball stuff that you see in the Scandinavian and Polish languages.
> It's unlikely that you're going to need a Cyrillic or East Asian
> alphabet (of which there are several--Korean, Japanese, Chinese,
> Thai, probably more). The Compose will also give you currency signs
> and some common fractions. (Some word processors have tables of
> symbols--things you wouldn't find in any of the locales, like musical
> flat signs, some mathematical operators, etc.)
> Unless you are going
> to actually write in a language other than English, you won't need
> any locale other than that.
But... most people do the "hit Enter" install, and Debian caters for
that sort of "anyone" approach by providing "everything" unless the
installer specifies what locales (as opposed to *character* sets), *and*
choses to purge other locales.
>
> --doug
>
>
Kind regards
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Doug
Apr 10, 2014, 12:30:01 AM4/10/14
to
On 04/09/2014 08:50 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> On 10/04/14 10:07, Doug wrote:
>>
>> /snip/
>>
>> The only characters that anyone could reasonably need can be formed
>> by setting up a Compose key.
> Do you have a source for that or is it just an opinion from the
> viewpoint of a particular location?
>
>
The particular location is the United States. If you are in, say, Japan,
>>
>> /snip/
>>
>> The only characters that anyone could reasonably need can be formed
>> by setting up a Compose key.
> Do you have a source for that or is it just an opinion from the
> viewpoint of a particular location?
>
>
then please ignore.
>> Unless you are going
>> to actually write in a language other than English, you won't need
>> any locale other than that.
> Agreed.
> But... most people do the "hit Enter" install, and Debian caters for
> that sort of "anyone" approach by providing "everything" unless the
> installer specifies what locales (as opposed to *character* sets), *and*
> choses to purge other locales.
>
>> --doug
>>
>>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
>
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>> to actually write in a language other than English, you won't need
>> any locale other than that.
> Agreed.
> But... most people do the "hit Enter" install, and Debian caters for
> that sort of "anyone" approach by providing "everything" unless the
> installer specifies what locales (as opposed to *character* sets), *and*
> choses to purge other locales.
>
>> --doug
>>
>>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
>
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Mike McClain
Apr 10, 2014, 12:30:03 PM4/10/14
to
On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 09:14:39AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
> > The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
> > directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
> > deleted them.
>
> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
Yeah, I've only been maintaining my own *nix system for 16 years.
> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
> > The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
> > directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
> > deleted them.
>
> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
> > Today they're back but I can't tell how they got there.
>
> That's good, it means your "delete what I don't like or understand"
> didn't create a huge problem.
else is not a 'huge' problem.
>From your response I suspect you don't know what triggers the
re-creation of those unneeded directories.
> > Nothing in /etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume
> > mandb did it but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all
> > these directories. Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many
> > people speak all of those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having
> > all of them installed?
>
> Um, didn't *you* install them?
> Wouldn't that make it a rhetorical question?
> :)
did not ask for all those other languages.
> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words from a
> number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a lot of space.
> You have several options:-
> ;don't install all languages to start with (be selective during installs
> - don't install i18n packages if you don't want internationalization)
debconf-i18n 1.5.49
libtext-wrapi18n-perl 0.06-7
and I certainly didn't ask that debconf be international.
> ;don't install man
Get real.
> ;install localpurge, select only the locales you are interested in, use
> it to purge other locales
> > Is there a config file I can edit to limit which directories are
> > created?
>
> locales does that. Install localepurge to limit the locales supported by
> installed packages.
/etc/locale.nopurge contains en en_US.UTF-8
/etc/locale.gen contains en_US.UTF-8 UTF-8
localepurge is triggered by dpkg, has no cron job and makes no mention
of /var/cache/ in it's documentation.
Since you brought it up I ran localepurge from the CL where it
mentions that it looks for /var/cache/localepurge/localelist which I
edited removing all but en_US*.
I ran localepurge again but it still doesn't touch /var/cache/man/{cs,da,es,fr,...
If you know of a way to tell mandb not to recreate these unnecessary
directories I'd like to know about it.
Thanks,
Mike
--
"Education is a man's going from cocksure ignorance to thoughtful uncertainty."
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Brian
Apr 10, 2014, 1:10:02 PM4/10/14
to
On Thu 10 Apr 2014 at 09:15:33 -0700, Mike McClain wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 09:14:39AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> > On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>
> > > Nothing in /etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume
> > > mandb did it but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all
> > > these directories. Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many
> > > people speak all of those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having
> > > all of them installed?
> >
> > Um, didn't *you* install them?
> > Wouldn't that make it a rhetorical question?
> > :)
>
> I installed the whole system so in that manner you are correct but I
> did not ask for all those other languages.
/etc/cron.daily/man-db
> On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 09:14:39AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
> > On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>
> > > Nothing in /etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume
> > > mandb did it but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all
> > > these directories. Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many
> > > people speak all of those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having
> > > all of them installed?
> >
> > Um, didn't *you* install them?
> > Wouldn't that make it a rhetorical question?
> > :)
>
> I installed the whole system so in that manner you are correct but I
> did not ask for all those other languages.
> If you know of a way to tell mandb not to recreate these unnecessary
> directories I'd like to know about it.
But after reading
http://www.fifi.org/doc/debian-policy/fhs/fhs.html/fhs-5.2.2.html
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Scott Ferguson
Apr 10, 2014, 9:20:01 PM4/10/14
to
On 11/04/14 02:15, Mike McClain wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 09:14:39AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>>> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
>>> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
>>> deleted them.
>>
>> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
>
> Yeah, I've only been maintaining my own *nix system for 16 years.
By "deleting" files generated by unknown processes? It's system
> On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 09:14:39AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
>> On 10/04/14 01:44, Mike McClain wrote:
>>> The other day I noticed my computer clutteres up with many
>>> directories in /var/cache/man/ for languages I don't speak so I
>>> deleted them.
>>
>> That was a mistake. You're new to this "sysadmin" stuff right? ;)
>
> Yeah, I've only been maintaining my own *nix system for 16 years.
administration, just not as I know it - but it's your system, so you
don't have to worry about employers, insurers and industry best
practices. But clearly you know all the answers.
>
>>> Today they're back but I can't tell how they got there.
>>
>> That's good, it means your "delete what I don't like or understand"
>> didn't create a huge problem.
>
> I've never created such a problem that I had to re-install, anything
> else is not a 'huge' problem.
>> From your response I suspect you don't know what triggers the
>> re-creation of those unneeded directories.
>
>>> Nothing in /etc/cron/* says anything about recreating them. I assume
>>> mandb did it but can't tell what initiated the recreation of all
>>> these directories. Nor can I see any need, I don't imagine very many
>>> people speak all of those 23 languages. What is the purpose of having
>>> all of them installed?
>>
>> Um, didn't *you* install them?
>> Wouldn't that make it a rhetorical question?
>> :)
>
> I installed the whole system so in that manner you are correct but I
> did not ask for all those other languages.
result of the one-size-fits-all metapackage system designed to mostly
work in most situations.
Specifically *not* asking for them takes a bit of work, e.g. installing
debconf-english instead of debconf-i18n, starting with a very minimal
system and installing (and configuring) localepurge before installing
additional packages.
>
>> The answer of course is that most people use characters and words from a
>> number of languages. Those extra man pages don't take up a lot of space.
>
> The fact that I like enchiladas doesn't mean I need spanish man pages.
>
>> You have several options:-
>> ;don't install all languages to start with (be selective during installs
>> - don't install i18n packages if you don't want internationalization)
>
> I didn't, the only packages installed that mention 'i18n' are:
> debconf-i18n 1.5.49
> libtext-wrapi18n-perl 0.06-7
> and I certainly didn't ask that debconf be international.
will help, but it's easier to do before most packages are installed.
>
>> ;don't install man
>
> Get real.
your own questions and save bandwidth.
<snipped>
Regards
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Mike McClain
Apr 11, 2014, 12:00:02 PM4/11/14
to
On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 11:16:11AM +1000, Scott Ferguson wrote:
<snip>
Mike
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<snip>
>
> Unless you specifically don't ask for them, that's what you get - it's a
> result of the one-size-fits-all metapackage system designed to mostly
> work in most situations.
>
> Specifically *not* asking for them takes a bit of work, e.g. installing
> debconf-english instead of debconf-i18n, starting with a very minimal
> system and installing (and configuring) localepurge before installing
> additional packages.
>
> Unless you specifically don't ask for them, that's what you get - it's a
> result of the one-size-fits-all metapackage system designed to mostly
> work in most situations.
>
> Specifically *not* asking for them takes a bit of work, e.g. installing
> debconf-english instead of debconf-i18n, starting with a very minimal
> system and installing (and configuring) localepurge before installing
> additional packages.
>
> # apt-get install debconf-english localepurge
> will help, but it's easier to do before most packages are installed.
>
Thank you, I suspect that was the info I needed.
> will help, but it's easier to do before most packages are installed.
>
Mike
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