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Isn't KDE Live ISO accompanied by an ultra-light Windows Manager, like OpenBox is with LXDE?

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Susmita/Rajib

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May 29, 2023, 2:20:06 AM5/29/23
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My dear illustrious Leaders and Senior Members of the Debian Users Mailing List,

For more than one week, I have hopped from one forum to another,
beginning from LXDE, OpenBox, Arch and then Manjaro in search of a
solution to my problem posted on the thread:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2023/05/msg00909.html

Eventually, I figured that since LXDE and OpenBox original niches are
now dying and the development, stalled, I should change my DE and have
a WM more customisable and the development, more vibrant than that of
and for LXDE or OpenBox respectively.

The problem with these two environment and manager respectively is
that even if a GUI package is installed, there is no guaranty that a
menu entry would be generated mandatorily within the menu list. For
example, I installed `hardinfo` today, but the menu-list wasn't
updated with a respective menu-item. "System Profiler and Benchmark",
until I logged off and then back on to OpenBox.

>From Manjaro forum I was recommended that KDE Plasma is the ideal DE
where menus are fully customisable.

I downloaded the Manjaro KDE live ISO and used it. But it doesn't have
a WM like openbox. I came to know after I posted the experience on the
Manjaro forum.

So, is the Debian KDE live ISO by default Plasma? Is the menu fully
customisable, like they said it is in Manjaro?

Finally, is there a lightweight Windows Manager in KDE so that I could
use the WM most of the time to preserve (or not unnecessarily waste)
system resources, only to return to KDE if system administration is
required?

I have checked the package list in either of the ISOs of KDE, free and non-free:
debian-live-11.7.0-amd64-kde+nonfree.packages
debian-live-11.7.0-amd64-kde.packages
Wasn't able to figure out any.

Finally, is the complete customisability of KDE menu fully extended to
the Windows Manager added to KDE, if it at all exists within the
Debian KDE set up?

I am driven by the need to get over LXDE+OpenBox environment that is
dying, if not already dead.

Best wishes,
Rajib
Etc.

Joe

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May 29, 2023, 4:10:06 AM5/29/23
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On Mon, 29 May 2023 11:30:52 +0530
"Susmita/Rajib" <bkpsu...@gmail.com> wrote:


>
> The problem with these two environment and manager respectively is
> that even if a GUI package is installed, there is no guaranty that a
> menu entry would be generated mandatorily within the menu list. For
> example, I installed `hardinfo` today, but the menu-list wasn't
> updated with a respective menu-item. "System Profiler and Benchmark",
> until I logged off and then back on to OpenBox.
>
> >From Manjaro forum I was recommended that KDE Plasma is the ideal DE
> >
> where menus are fully customisable.
>
As are they in Xfce, and everywhere else that uses the standard
freedesktop.org menu.

To make it easy, I use the Gnome package alacarte:

$ apt-cache show alacarte
Package: alacarte
Version: 3.44.2-1
Installed-Size: 534
Maintainer: Debian GNOME Maintainers
<pkg-gnome-...@lists.alioth.debian.org> Architecture: all
Depends: python3:any, gnome-menus (>= 3.5.3), python3-gi,
gir1.2-gtk-3.0, gir1.2-gmenu-3.0 (>= 3.5.3), gir1.2-glib-2.0,
gir1.2-gdkpixbuf-2.0
Description-en: easy GNOME menu editing tool
Alacarte is an easy-to-use menu editor for GNOME that can add and edit
new entries and menus. It works with the freedesktop.org menu
specification and should work with any desktop environment that uses
the spec. Description-md5: ea89a81c038b7864336ed55a2783b93b
Multi-Arch: foreign
Homepage: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/alacarte
Tag: admin::configuring, implemented-in::python, interface::graphical,
interface::x11, role::program, scope::utility, suite::gnome,
uitoolkit::gtk, use::configuring, x11::application
Section: utils
Priority: optional
Filename: pool/main/a/alacarte/alacarte_3.44.2-1_all.deb
Size: 84176
MD5sum: b7c49c1a6438bb32755d1a67d06d7455
SHA256: 32d1be88bd9f52c540ea3f6d7c10ac2b92a47ecbb78a6fee0ac5e4837b913977


To use alacarte ('Main Menu' under Settings) with one of the minor
applications that don't have an automatic desktop menu (and you may
find that your menu has an 'Other' entry which lists all these) then
you need to find its executable with whereis.

$ whereis hardinfo
hardinfo: /usr/bin/hardinfo /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/hardinfo
/usr/share/hardinfo /usr/share/man/man1/hardinfo.1.gz

The /usr/bin/.. or /usr/sbin/.. is the one you want, enter this into
alacarte in your chosen category e.g. system.

If you want an icon for it, you'll need to find a suitable one and use
alacarte to select it.

--
Joe

Roger Price

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May 29, 2023, 4:20:07 AM5/29/23
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On Mon, 29 May 2023, Susmita/Rajib wrote:

> My dear illustrious Leaders...

Certainly not me.

> Finally, is there a lightweight Windows Manager...

Xfce4 ?

Roger

Susmita/Rajib

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May 29, 2023, 6:52:18 AM5/29/23
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From: Joe <jo*@***ing.com>
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 09:09:25 +0100
Message-id: <[🔎] 20230529090...@jrenewsid.jretrading.com>
In-reply-to: <[🔎]
CAEG4cZWO3XhhA6nYxVPNoexq...@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you, Mr. Joe, for replying to my post:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2023/05/msg01077.html

[ ... ]
... I use the Gnome package alacarte: ...
[ ... ]

I have begun to dislike Gnome when it switched over to wayland desktop
environment. I don't like it. My best preference is a start menu ⟶
sub-menu ⟶ sub-sub-menu ⟶ ... ⟶ Program. Which is why I preferred
LXDE. But no longer.

[ ... ]
... If you want an icon for it, you'll need to find a suitable one and
use alacarte to select it. ...
[ ... ]

I know how to make a menu-item creating/editing the respective file
ending with filename .desktop in the /usr/share/applications directory
and the rest.

I have solved the autorun scripts and commands problem recently. The
solution is in this forum here:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2023/05/msg00792.html

My objective is also to add customised menu on the right-click
drop-down menu-list in LXDE's pcmanfm or any other file manager by
right-clicking on a clear area of a desktop. The issue has been
brought to the debian-user list members in:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2023/05/msg00909.html

Susmita/Rajib

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May 29, 2023, 8:40:06 AM5/29/23
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From: Roger Price <nor...@rogerprice.org>
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 10:13:44 +0200 (CEST)
Message-id: <[🔎] 7411bfa2-f0a4-404e...@rogerprice.org>
In-reply-to: <[🔎]
CAEG4cZWO3XhhA6nYxVPNoexq...@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you, Mr. Price, for your reply.
[ ... ]
Xfce4 ?
[ ... ]

But xfce4 is a complete desktop environment like LXDE, not a WM. So
far as I know. Please educate me if you know it is otherwise.

Pierre Tomon

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May 29, 2023, 12:10:12 PM5/29/23
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"Susmita/Rajib" <bkpsu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Isn't KDE Live ISO accompanied by an ultra-light Windows Manager, like
>OpenBox is with LXDE?
IIRC you wan use KWin alone (without Plasma).

>I am driven by the need to get over LXDE+OpenBox environment that is
>dying, if not already dead.
Yes Openbox is no more maintained, but it's stable.
Maybe you should try another X11 WM:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_X_window_managers

>I have begun to dislike Gnome when it switched over to wayland desktop
>environment. I don't like it. My best preference is a start menu ⟶
>sub-menu ⟶ sub-sub-menu ⟶ ... ⟶ Program. Which is why I preferred
>LXDE. But no longer.
You can have a look at jgmenu: https://packages.debian.org/jgmenu

Susmita/Rajib

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May 29, 2023, 10:30:06 PM5/29/23
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Mr. Zmudzinski has written to me with his suggestions. He said that he
is banned from mailing lists. I am uncertain whether someone can be
banned from posting. Mailing Lists don't ban anyone from posting. One
could at best have to subscribe in order to post.

Could the List Maintainers please look into the matter and apprise me
of the situation here.

To Mr. Zmudzinski: I will carefully consider your suggestions. Thank
you for sharing your insights off-list.

Best wishes,
Rajib
Etc.



---------- Received message ----------
From: Chuck Zmudzinski <brchu***@aol.com>
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 12:18:43 -0400
Subject: Re: Isn't KDE Live ISO accompanied by an ultra-light Windows
Manager, like OpenBox is with LXDE?
To: Susmita/Rajib <bkpsu...@gmail.com>

On 5/29/23 2:00 AM, Susmita/Rajib wrote:
> My dear illustrious Leaders and Senior Members of the Debian Users Mailing List,
>
[ ... ]
>
> I am driven by the need to get over LXDE+OpenBox environment that is
> dying, if not already dead.
>
[ ... ]


Hello Rajib,

Did you try LXQT?

https://lxqt-project.org/

https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/lxqt

https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/debian-live-11.7.0-amd64-lxqt.iso

https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/11.7.0-live+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/debian-live-11.7.0-amd64-lxqt+nonfree.iso

I never tried the Debian live LXQT images, but I have installed the
LXQT meta package
alongside GNOME as an alternative to LXDE and it works well and comes
with OpenBox.

LXQT is built on qt5 which is the same underlying GUI toolkit that KDE
uses but is more
lightweight than KDE. It is similar to LXDE which I used to use but I
switched to LXQT
because I perceived it to be under more active development than LXDE.

P.S. I am not able to reply to you on-list because I was banned from
Debian mailing lists
by our illustrious Debian leaders for allegedly trolling, but I think
they made a mistake
about that because I am not a troll and just wanted to help out and
express my opinion
on some things as a Debian user but they censored my opinion by
banning me. A few of
our illustrious Debian leaders use their power to censor minority
viewpoints, unfortunately.

Kind regards,

Chuck

Timothy M Butterworth

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May 29, 2023, 10:30:06 PM5/29/23
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Have you tried LXQT it replaced LXDE.
 
You can have a look at jgmenu: https://packages.debian.org/jgmenu



--
⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Debian - The universal operating system
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://www.debian.org/
⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀

Susmita/Rajib

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May 29, 2023, 10:30:06 PM5/29/23
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From: Pierre Tomon <pierret***@ik.me>
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 18:04:30 +0200
Message-id: <[🔎] 4QVL265...@smtp-3-0000.mail.infomaniak.ch>

[ ... ]
You can have a look at jgmenu: https://packages.debian.org/jgmenu
[ ... ]

Thanks. But:
Error: Dependency is not satisfiable: libc6 ( >= 2.34 needed)

Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)

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May 29, 2023, 10:40:05 PM5/29/23
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> (...)
> I have begun to dislike Gnome when it switched over to wayland desktop
> environment. I don't like it. (...)

Rajib. In the future, all most GUI desktop(s) will run under Wayland. So
i suggest that you have to adapt to change, IMHO.


Sincerely, Byung-Hee

--
^고맙습니다 _布德天下_ 감사합니다_^))//

Pierre Tomon

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May 30, 2023, 3:00:07 AM5/30/23
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"Susmita/Rajib" <bkpsu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> [ ... ]
>You can have a look at jgmenu: https://packages.debian.org/jgmenu
> [ ... ]
>
>Thanks. But:
>Error: Dependency is not satisfiable: libc6 ( >= 2.34 needed)
The package is only available on testing and unstable, wait a few days
for the Bookworm release.

debia...@howorth.org.uk

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May 30, 2023, 7:50:07 AM5/30/23
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Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희) <soye...@doraji.xyz> wrote:
> > (...)
> > I have begun to dislike Gnome when it switched over to wayland
> > desktop environment. I don't like it. (...)
>
> Rajib. In the future, all most GUI desktop(s) will run under Wayland.
> So i suggest that you have to adapt to change, IMHO.

It won't be for a considerable time yet, if at all, so there's no need
to opt for the pain now if he doesn't want.

Nicolas George

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May 30, 2023, 8:10:05 AM5/30/23
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to...@tuxteam.de (12023-05-30):
> > > Rajib. In the future, all most GUI desktop(s) will run under Wayland.
> > > So i suggest that you have to adapt to change, IMHO.
> I'm still hoping I give up on computers before that happens ;-)

The most likely is that Freedesktop will introduce something that
obsoletes Wayland and something that obsoletes that thing that obsoletes
Wayland before the move to Wayland is complete.

Regards,

--
Nicolas George

to...@tuxteam.de

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May 30, 2023, 8:10:05 AM5/30/23
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I'm still hoping I give up on computers before that happens ;-)

Cheers
--
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Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)

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May 30, 2023, 8:30:06 AM5/30/23
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Thanks! You are right.

Also i'm using old things such as old smartphone(s) made by LG, and old
book <<TCPL -- The C Programing Language 2nd Editon>>, and old Tractor
(my day job is farmer in South Korea).

By the way, really i like Gnome Desktop ^^^

to...@tuxteam.de

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May 30, 2023, 8:30:06 AM5/30/23
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I think that's called "leapfrogging". Having successfully avoided
pulseaudio up to now [1], I'm seriously looking into pipewire...

Cheers

[1] in spite of stubborn applications: firefox, I'm looking at you.
--
tomás
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to...@tuxteam.de

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May 30, 2023, 8:30:07 AM5/30/23
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On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 09:20:47PM +0900, Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희) wrote:

[...]

> Also i'm using old things such as old smartphone(s) made by LG, and old
> book <<TCPL -- The C Programing Language 2nd Editon>>, and old Tractor
> (my day job is farmer in South Korea).

Farmers are the most important people: they feed us. A close second: cooks.

Cheers
--
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debia...@howorth.org.uk

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May 30, 2023, 1:00:07 PM5/30/23
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<to...@tuxteam.de> wrote:
> On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 02:04:01PM +0200, Nicolas George wrote:
> > to...@tuxteam.de (12023-05-30):
> > > > > Rajib. In the future, all most GUI desktop(s) will run under
> > > > > Wayland. So i suggest that you have to adapt to change,
> > > > > IMHO.
> > > I'm still hoping I give up on computers before that happens ;-)
> >
> > The most likely is that Freedesktop will introduce something that
> > obsoletes Wayland and something that obsoletes that thing that
> > obsoletes Wayland before the move to Wayland is complete.
>
> I think that's called "leapfrogging". Having successfully avoided
> pulseaudio up to now [1], I'm seriously looking into pipewire...

You're braver than I am. Let me/us know how it goes.

> Cheers
>
> [1] in spite of stubborn applications: firefox, I'm looking at you.

Using apulse solves that for me for now :)

Jeffrey Walton

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May 30, 2023, 1:10:06 PM5/30/23
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Truckers get my vote for second.

Jeff

to...@tuxteam.de

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May 30, 2023, 2:50:06 PM5/30/23
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On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 05:58:01PM +0100, debia...@howorth.org.uk wrote:
> <to...@tuxteam.de> wrote:

[avoiding pulseaudio...]

> > [1] in spite of stubborn applications: firefox, I'm looking at you.
>
> Using apulse solves that for me for now :)

You got it :)

Cheers
--
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