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Choice of Desktop environment at install time using netinst CD.
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Rick Thomas
Feb 25, 2013, 10:20:01 PM2/25/13
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With the amd64 netinst CD I have found a spot in the maze of helpful
"expert" options offered when the CD first boots that lets me choose
which Desktop Environment will be installed later on by tasksel. This
is really nice because it means I don't have to have a separate (and
much larger) CD image for each DE I might want to install.
Unfortunately, the PowerPC[*] netinst installer has nothing comparable.
How difficult would it be to provide an optional target (analogous to
"install" and "expert") in the yaboot configuration file, that defines
the preferred Desktop Environment?
Or failing that, can the instructions be changed (similar to the
"video=ofonly" instruction) to tell people about a boot-time option to
set the preferred DE?
Best of all, of course, would be to have tasksel provide a menu option
to let the user pick at runtime whether to use gnome or kde or xfce or
whatever, but that's been discussed before.
Just thinking...
Rick
[*] Having only tried the PowerPC and amd64 installers, I don't have
any data on other architectures. Does anybody know how, for example,
SPARC or MIPS handle this problem?
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Steve McIntyre
Feb 26, 2013, 5:50:03 PM2/26/13
to
Rick Thomas wrote:
>
>With the amd64 netinst CD I have found a spot in the maze of helpful
>"expert" options offered when the CD first boots that lets me choose
>which Desktop Environment will be installed later on by tasksel. This
>is really nice because it means I don't have to have a separate (and
>much larger) CD image for each DE I might want to install.
>
>Unfortunately, the PowerPC[*] netinst installer has nothing comparable.
>
>How difficult would it be to provide an optional target (analogous to
>"install" and "expert") in the yaboot configuration file, that defines
>the preferred Desktop Environment?
>
>Or failing that, can the instructions be changed (similar to the
>"video=ofonly" instruction) to tell people about a boot-time option to
>set the preferred DE?
>
>Best of all, of course, would be to have tasksel provide a menu option
>to let the user pick at runtime whether to use gnome or kde or xfce or
>whatever, but that's been discussed before.
>
>Just thinking...
>
>Rick
>
>[*] Having only tried the PowerPC and amd64 installers, I don't have
>any data on other architectures. Does anybody know how, for example,
>SPARC or MIPS handle this problem?
Basically, we put a lot of effort in for the isolinux-based x86 boot
>
>With the amd64 netinst CD I have found a spot in the maze of helpful
>"expert" options offered when the CD first boots that lets me choose
>which Desktop Environment will be installed later on by tasksel. This
>is really nice because it means I don't have to have a separate (and
>much larger) CD image for each DE I might want to install.
>
>Unfortunately, the PowerPC[*] netinst installer has nothing comparable.
>
>How difficult would it be to provide an optional target (analogous to
>"install" and "expert") in the yaboot configuration file, that defines
>the preferred Desktop Environment?
>
>Or failing that, can the instructions be changed (similar to the
>"video=ofonly" instruction) to tell people about a boot-time option to
>set the preferred DE?
>
>Best of all, of course, would be to have tasksel provide a menu option
>to let the user pick at runtime whether to use gnome or kde or xfce or
>whatever, but that's been discussed before.
>
>Just thinking...
>
>Rick
>
>[*] Having only tried the PowerPC and amd64 installers, I don't have
>any data on other architectures. Does anybody know how, for example,
>SPARC or MIPS handle this problem?
menus to give the options here. I've added code to debian-cd to
convert those same menus into grub format for UEFI x86 booting. AFAIK
none of the other arches have that support. If you'd like to play with
yaboot and see if you can get it to play ball, I doubt anybody would
be averse to adding that as a feature. :-)
To be honest, it may be too late for Wheezy, but I guess it depends on
how big the changes would be.
--
Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. st...@einval.com
"It's actually quite entertaining to watch ag129 prop his foot up on
the desk so he can get a better aim." [ seen in ucam.chat ]
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Rick Thomas
Feb 27, 2013, 1:10:02 AM2/27/13
to
Is it as simple as appending something like "desktop=xfce" to the boot
command line?
If so, maybe it could be as simple as adding a couple of sentences to
the text in /install/boot.msg ...
I'll see if that works. If it does, I'll suggest some wording for the
message.
On Feb 26, 2013, at 2:47 PM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> If you'd like to play with
> yaboot and see if you can get it to play ball, I doubt anybody would
> be averse to adding that as a feature. :-)
command line?
If so, maybe it could be as simple as adding a couple of sentences to
the text in /install/boot.msg ...
I'll see if that works. If it does, I'll suggest some wording for the
message.
On Feb 26, 2013, at 2:47 PM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> If you'd like to play with
> yaboot and see if you can get it to play ball, I doubt anybody would
> be averse to adding that as a feature. :-)
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Steven Chamberlain
Feb 27, 2013, 6:30:02 AM2/27/13
to
Hi,
On 27/02/13 06:04, Rick Thomas wrote:
> Is it as simple as appending something like "desktop=xfce" to the boot
> command line?
Actually yes, that should work; the install media for GNU/Hurd and
kFreeBSD are doing exactly this.
Regards,
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On 27/02/13 06:04, Rick Thomas wrote:
> Is it as simple as appending something like "desktop=xfce" to the boot
> command line?
kFreeBSD are doing exactly this.
Regards,
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Rick Thomas
Feb 28, 2013, 4:30:03 AM2/28/13
to
On Feb 27, 2013, at 3:25 AM, Steven Chamberlain wrote:
> On 27/02/13 06:04, Rick Thomas wrote:
>> Is it as simple as appending something like "desktop=xfce" to the
>> boot
>> command line?
>
> Actually yes, that should work; the install media for GNU/Hurd and
> kFreeBSD are doing exactly this.
Here's my proposed patch -- Add the following to /install/boot.msg :
The following desktop environments are available: gnome, kde, xfce and
lxde. The default is gnome. If you prefer a different one, append
"desktop=<your choice>". E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce
desktop environment, type
"expert desktop=xfce" at the "boot:" prompt.
Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report?
Thanks!
Rick
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Rick Thomas
Mar 3, 2013, 4:00:02 AM3/3/13
to
On Feb 26, 2013, at 2:47 PM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> Basically, we put a lot of effort in for the isolinux-based x86 boot
> menus to give the options here. I've added code to debian-cd to
> convert those same menus into grub format for UEFI x86 booting. AFAIK
> none of the other arches have that support. If you'd like to play with
> yaboot and see if you can get it to play ball, I doubt anybody would
> be averse to adding that as a feature. :-)
>
> To be honest, it may be too late for Wheezy, but I guess it depends on
> how big the changes would be.
I'm quite impressed with the effort you-all have put in on isolinux
> menus to give the options here. I've added code to debian-cd to
> convert those same menus into grub format for UEFI x86 booting. AFAIK
> none of the other arches have that support. If you'd like to play with
> yaboot and see if you can get it to play ball, I doubt anybody would
> be averse to adding that as a feature. :-)
>
> To be honest, it may be too late for Wheezy, but I guess it depends on
> how big the changes would be.
and grub for x86.
The yaboot bootloader for PowerPC doesn't have so much flexibility, so
if it is to be done, it has to be done brute force. Fortunately,
brute force works in this case.
All that's necessary to allow people to set the preferred desktop at
install time is to add the following couple of sentences to /install/
boot.msg :
The following desktop environments are available:
gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
If you prefer a different one, append
"desktop=<your choice>"
The following desktop environments are available:
gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
If you prefer a different one, append
"desktop=<your choice>"
E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
environment, type
"expert desktop=xfce"
at the "boot:" prompt.
Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
environment, type
"expert desktop=xfce"
at the "boot:" prompt.
Thanks!
Rick
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Steve McIntyre
Mar 3, 2013, 10:00:01 AM3/3/13
to
On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 02:52:50PM +0000, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Ahh, hmmm. It should probably be modified appropriately at runtime, in
fact, so we say the right thing on each variant of the CD. I'll tweak
it to do that now.
"Because heaters aren't purple!" -- Catherine Pitt
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>On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 12:56:10AM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>>
>> The following desktop environments are available:
>> gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
>> If you prefer a different one, append
>> "desktop=<your choice>"
>> E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
>> environment, type
>> "expert desktop=xfce"
>> at the "boot:" prompt.
>>
>>Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
>
>The message there comes from debian-cd, so I'm simply adding it now.
>>
>> The following desktop environments are available:
>> gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
>> If you prefer a different one, append
>> "desktop=<your choice>"
>> E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
>> environment, type
>> "expert desktop=xfce"
>> at the "boot:" prompt.
>>
>>Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
>
Ahh, hmmm. It should probably be modified appropriately at runtime, in
fact, so we say the right thing on each variant of the CD. I'll tweak
it to do that now.
"Because heaters aren't purple!" -- Catherine Pitt
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Steve McIntyre
Mar 3, 2013, 10:00:01 AM3/3/13
to
On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 12:56:10AM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>>
>>
>>To be honest, it may be too late for Wheezy, but I guess it depends on
>>how big the changes would be.
>
>I'm quite impressed with the effort you-all have put in on isolinux
>and grub for x86.
>
>The yaboot bootloader for PowerPC doesn't have so much flexibility,
>so if it is to be done, it has to be done brute force. Fortunately,
>brute force works in this case.
OK, cool!
>>how big the changes would be.
>
>I'm quite impressed with the effort you-all have put in on isolinux
>and grub for x86.
>
>The yaboot bootloader for PowerPC doesn't have so much flexibility,
>so if it is to be done, it has to be done brute force. Fortunately,
>brute force works in this case.
>All that's necessary to allow people to set the preferred desktop at
>install time is to add the following couple of sentences to /install/boot.msg
>:
>
> The following desktop environments are available:
> gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
> If you prefer a different one, append
> "desktop=<your choice>"
> E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
> environment, type
> "expert desktop=xfce"
> at the "boot:" prompt.
>
>Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
The message there comes from debian-cd, so I'm simply adding it now.
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Steve McIntyre
Mar 3, 2013, 10:10:02 AM3/3/13
to
On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 02:58:54PM +0000, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 02:52:50PM +0000, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>>On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 12:56:10AM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>>>
>>> The following desktop environments are available:
>>> gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
>>> If you prefer a different one, append
>>> "desktop=<your choice>"
>>> E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
>>> environment, type
>>> "expert desktop=xfce"
>>> at the "boot:" prompt.
>>>
>>>Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
>>
>>The message there comes from debian-cd, so I'm simply adding it now.
>
>Ahh, hmmm. It should probably be modified appropriately at runtime, in
>fact, so we say the right thing on each variant of the CD. I'll tweak
>it to do that now.
Gah. Looking further, at the moment I don't see how (if at all) the
>On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 02:52:50PM +0000, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>>On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 12:56:10AM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>>>
>>> The following desktop environments are available:
>>> gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
>>> If you prefer a different one, append
>>> "desktop=<your choice>"
>>> E.g. to do an expert install with the xfce desktop
>>> environment, type
>>> "expert desktop=xfce"
>>> at the "boot:" prompt.
>>>
>>>Would it help if I submit a wishlist bug report? If so, which package?
>>
>>The message there comes from debian-cd, so I'm simply adding it now.
>
>Ahh, hmmm. It should probably be modified appropriately at runtime, in
>fact, so we say the right thing on each variant of the CD. I'll tweak
>it to do that now.
powerpc boot stuff passes through any of the kernel boot options to
specify a default task. Rick, what happens if you try with kde CD#1
right now? Does it actually do KDE, or does it still default to Gnome?
I'm glad you're thinking of things here, it's been a while since we've
had many people interested in ppc stuff like this! :-)
"You can't barbecue lettuce!" -- Ellie Crane
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Rick Thomas
Mar 3, 2013, 4:50:01 PM3/3/13
to
On Mar 3, 2013, at 7:03 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>
> Gah. Looking further, at the moment I don't see how (if at all) the
> powerpc boot stuff passes through any of the kernel boot options to
> specify a default task. Rick, what happens if you try with kde CD#1
> right now? Does it actually do KDE, or does it still default to Gnome?
was this:
Boot the "netinst" installer CD.
Enter at the "boot:" prompt
expert desktop=xfce
Answer all the questions until it gets to running tasksel.
Leave the "desktop" task checked.
Watch it install xfce4.
Be happy.
At one point in this process I switched to the F2 console and typed
"cat /proc/cmdline" and saw the "desktop=xfce" phrase there.
Does that help?
Rick
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Rick Thomas
Mar 3, 2013, 4:50:02 PM3/3/13
to
Just to be clear -- What you want me to do is download and burn the
RC1 KDE CD#1 install CD.
Boot it.
Take the default "install" option at the "boot:" prompt.
Look at the /proc/cmdline from a text console during the install
process.
Wait til it gets to running tasksel.
Leave "desktop task" checked.
Watch and see what desktop it installs.
Report back here.
Right?
Enjoy!
Rick
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Steve McIntyre
Mar 3, 2013, 8:10:02 PM3/3/13
to
On Sun, Mar 03, 2013 at 01:46:06PM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>On Mar 3, 2013, at 7:03 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>>
>>Gah. Looking further, at the moment I don't see how (if at all) the
>>powerpc boot stuff passes through any of the kernel boot options to
>>specify a default task. Rick, what happens if you try with kde CD#1
>>right now? Does it actually do KDE, or does it still default to Gnome?
>>
>>I'm glad you're thinking of things here, it's been a while since we've
>>had many people interested in ppc stuff like this! :-)
>
>I'll try it.
>
>Just to be clear -- What you want me to do is download and burn the
>RC1 KDE CD#1 install CD.
>
>Boot it.
>
>Take the default "install" option at the "boot:" prompt.
>
>Look at the /proc/cmdline from a text console during the install
>process.
>
>Wait til it gets to running tasksel.
>
>Leave "desktop task" checked.
>
>Watch and see what desktop it installs.
>
>Report back here.
>
> Right?
That's exactly correct, yes! :-)
>On Mar 3, 2013, at 7:03 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
>>
>>Gah. Looking further, at the moment I don't see how (if at all) the
>>powerpc boot stuff passes through any of the kernel boot options to
>>specify a default task. Rick, what happens if you try with kde CD#1
>>right now? Does it actually do KDE, or does it still default to Gnome?
>>
>>I'm glad you're thinking of things here, it's been a while since we've
>>had many people interested in ppc stuff like this! :-)
>
>I'll try it.
>
>Just to be clear -- What you want me to do is download and burn the
>RC1 KDE CD#1 install CD.
>
>Boot it.
>
>Take the default "install" option at the "boot:" prompt.
>
>Look at the /proc/cmdline from a text console during the install
>process.
>
>Wait til it gets to running tasksel.
>
>Leave "desktop task" checked.
>
>Watch and see what desktop it installs.
>
>Report back here.
>
> Right?
Thanks for helping with this, it's great!
Google-bait: http://www.debian.org/CD/free-linux-cd
Debian does NOT ship free CDs. Please do NOT contact the mailing
lists asking us to send them to you.
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Rick Thomas
Mar 5, 2013, 4:00:03 AM3/5/13
to
ro ramdisk_size=10240 desktop=kde --
It installed kde as expected.
I'm not sure what the "--" is all about. It was not present when I
installed with the "netinst" CD and typed
expert desktop=xfce
at the "boot:" prompt. As noted, that installed xfce4. So the -- may
not be strictly necessary.
Take a look at the stuff in /install/yaboot.conf on the install CDs.
I think that's where all this is originating from.
Hope it helps!
Rick
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Steve McIntyre
Mar 7, 2013, 3:20:02 AM3/7/13
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On Tue, Mar 05, 2013 at 12:49:54AM -0800, Rick Thomas wrote:
>
> # cat /proc/cmdline # in the F2 console during the installation
> ro ramdisk_size=10240 desktop=kde --
>
>It installed kde as expected.
>
>I'm not sure what the "--" is all about. It was not present when I
>installed with the "netinst" CD and typed
> expert desktop=xfce
>at the "boot:" prompt. As noted, that installed xfce4. So the --
>may not be strictly necessary.
>
>Take a look at the stuff in /install/yaboot.conf on the install CDs.
>I think that's where all this is originating from.
OK, cool. Thanks for confirming. I've taken your text, tweaked
>
> # cat /proc/cmdline # in the F2 console during the installation
> ro ramdisk_size=10240 desktop=kde --
>
>It installed kde as expected.
>
>I'm not sure what the "--" is all about. It was not present when I
>installed with the "netinst" CD and typed
> expert desktop=xfce
>at the "boot:" prompt. As noted, that installed xfce4. So the --
>may not be strictly necessary.
>
>Take a look at the stuff in /install/yaboot.conf on the install CDs.
>I think that's where all this is originating from.
slightly, and added it into debian-cd. I've also added some code to
work out the default desktop so we can list that. I'm building a
weekly powerpc set right now with the changes in - please test and
make sure all works OK?
I can see the code looks ok from here, but I don't have easy access to
a powerpc machine to be able to check that text fits on screen
correctly, silly things like that...
Welcome my son, welcome to the machine.
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Rick Thomas
Mar 8, 2013, 3:00:02 AM3/8/13
to
OK,
Sounds great!
I'll give it a try on a couple of old Macs over the weekend.
Enjoy!
Rick
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/A1DF3E26-E920-405A...@pobox.com
Sounds great!
I'll give it a try on a couple of old Macs over the weekend.
Enjoy!
Rick
Rick Thomas
Mar 11, 2013, 7:30:02 AM3/11/13
to
I tried it on a MacPro G5 (64-bit) with the "netinst" CD. At the
"boot:" prompt I entered "install desktop=xfce", then answered the
usual questions and watched it happily install xfce.
So that works.
I have an xfce-CD1 CD that I intend to try with "install
desktop=gnome" and see which desktop (xfce or gnome, or both?) it
installs. The problem that I foresee here is the the yaboot.conf file
on the xfce-CD1 already has its own clause <append="desktop=xfce --">
which may conflict with the user's.
I'll report on that later.
We may have to figure out how to only include the extra instructions
(about desktops) on the netinst CDs, which would be no real loss,
because all the other desktops have dedicated CD1's of their own.
I haven't tried it on a G4 (32-bit) machine yet. I'll report on that
later, too.
Thinking about 64-bit vs 32-bit, I don't think the code that prints
the "boot:" prompt (and the preceding boot.msg file) is aware of the
bit-width of the hardware. So we may have to either make the added
text more comprehensive to warn the user about "install desktop=kde"
vs "install32 desktop=kde", or find some other way of dealing with the
problem.
Which raises the question of do we dare make boot.msg any longer? It
may already be too long -- long enough that most folks won't bother to
read all of it, and miss something important.
An alternate approach would be to refer folks to the appropriate
section of the installation manual, where there should be a fully
comprehensive discussion of the available boot options and why you
might want to use them. Something like this:
The following desktop environments are available:
gnome, kde, xfce and lxde. The default is gnome.
If you prefer a different one, append
"desktop=<your choice>"
<URL>
Enjoy!
Rick
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