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Replacement for raspPi
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Keith Bainbridge
Sep 7, 2021, 6:50:02 AM9/7/21
to
G'day
I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
H64B?
I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
translate to their SBC?
Thanks
Background.
I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi. Not
even root has access. So I'm out of raspberry as quick as possible.
I'm in the process of writing debian to a SDcard in the hope that that
will let me get on.
Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
sources.list last year.
All the best
Keith Bainbridge
keith.bain...@gmail.com
I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
H64B?
I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
translate to their SBC?
Thanks
Background.
I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi. Not
even root has access. So I'm out of raspberry as quick as possible.
I'm in the process of writing debian to a SDcard in the hope that that
will let me get on.
Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
sources.list last year.
All the best
Keith Bainbridge
keith.bain...@gmail.com
Reco
Sep 7, 2021, 8:50:03 AM9/7/21
to
Hi.
On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
> translate to their SBC?
I'd suggest [1], but I'm unsure about the completeness of hardware
support of the current Debian stable.
Or [2], but given the current state of Mesa's panfrost it would be
rough, and this SBC has its share of issues with built-in USB.
But without a specific requirement probably the best way is to direct
you to the list like [3]. You can probably expect working UART, USB and
Ethernet from the most of SBCs there.
> Background.
> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi.
IMO that's expected from fuse.
> Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
> sources.list last year.
I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
Reco
[1] https://www.khadas.com/product-page/edge-v
[2] https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-n2-with-4gbyte-ram-2/
[3] https://linuxgizmos.com/150-open-spec-community-backed-linux-sbcs-under-200/
On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
> translate to their SBC?
support of the current Debian stable.
Or [2], but given the current state of Mesa's panfrost it would be
rough, and this SBC has its share of issues with built-in USB.
But without a specific requirement probably the best way is to direct
you to the list like [3]. You can probably expect working UART, USB and
Ethernet from the most of SBCs there.
> Background.
> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi.
> Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
> sources.list last year.
Reco
[1] https://www.khadas.com/product-page/edge-v
[2] https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-n2-with-4gbyte-ram-2/
[3] https://linuxgizmos.com/150-open-spec-community-backed-linux-sbcs-under-200/
Andrew M.A. Cater
Sep 7, 2021, 11:40:03 AM9/7/21
to
On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
is that they are cut down to a price point rather than being built to a
quality standard. "Raspberry Pi-alike" GPIO pins don't transfer to
automagically being able to run an add on in the same way you would on a
Raspberry Pi, for example, and some manufacturers appear to produce
a large range of almost identical looking boards where you can't rely on them
_actually being identical.
I'd single out Odroid as being very highly priced by comparison but
also very well built: the problem is that the boards take a while to
be fully supported on non-vendor kernel and in vanilla Debian - and by
that stage, the board may be out of production.
Pine's RockPi with 4G of memory seems to work quite well and be relatively
well supported.
Factor in cases, eMMC and so on as well, if you want them. A lot of the
boards do not hve a custom made case and some of them will be non-standard
shapes/sizes.
All the very best, as ever,
Andy Cater
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 7, 2021, 8:10:02 PM9/7/21
to
On Tue, 7 Sep 2021 15:46:22 +0300
Reco <recov...@enotuniq.net> wrote:
>>IMO that's expected from fuse.
But even root couldn't chown. I don't recall this difficulty with
Reco <recov...@enotuniq.net> wrote:
>>IMO that's expected from fuse.
raspberryOS before. Do you mean that fuse is not correctable? \
What woukd happen if I removed the 'pi' user account?
This is why I started a new thread.
0447 667 468
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 7, 2021, 8:10:02 PM9/7/21
to
>> Hi.
>>
>>On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
>>> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
>>> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does
>>> this translate to their SBC?
>>
>>I'd suggest [1], but I'm unsure about the completeness of hardware
>>support of the current Debian stable.
>>Or [2], but given the current state of Mesa's panfrost it would be
>>rough, and this SBC has its share of issues with built-in USB.
>>
Thanks for these suggestions.
>>
>>On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
>>> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
>>> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does
>>> this translate to their SBC?
>>
>>I'd suggest [1], but I'm unsure about the completeness of hardware
>>support of the current Debian stable.
>>Or [2], but given the current state of Mesa's panfrost it would be
>>rough, and this SBC has its share of issues with built-in USB.
>>
>>But without a specific requirement probably the best way is to direct
>>you to the list like [3]. You can probably expect working UART, USB
>>and Ethernet from the most of SBCs there.
>>
found a few candidates, which I'll weed out with the help of Andrew's
words of wisdom.
>>
>>> Background.
>>> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
>>> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
>>> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi.
>>
>>IMO that's expected from fuse.
I'm changing this to a new thread.
>>> Background.
>>> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
>>> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
>>> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi.
>>
>>IMO that's expected from fuse.
>>
>>
>>> Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
>>> sources.list last year.
>>
>>I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
>>
>>Reco
>>
>>[1] https://www.khadas.com/product-page/edge-v
>>[2] https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-n2-with-4gbyte-ram-2/
>>[3]
>>https://linuxgizmos.com/150-open-spec-community-backed-linux-sbcs-under-200/
>>
morning, after a couple of very callenging cryptics. Not completed by a
long shot.
0447 667 468
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 8, 2021, 8:00:02 AM9/8/21
to
On Tue, 7 Sep 2021 15:35:35 +0000
"Andrew M.A. Cater" <amac...@einval.com> wrote:
>>On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
>>> G'day
>>>
>>> I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
>>> H64B?
>>>
>>> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
>>> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does
>>> this translate to their SBC?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>
"Andrew M.A. Cater" <amac...@einval.com> wrote:
>>On Tue, Sep 07, 2021 at 08:32:14PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
>>> G'day
>>>
>>> I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
>>> H64B?
>>>
>>> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
>>> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does
>>> this translate to their SBC?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>
>>You'll have seen the pointer to 100+ SBCs. The problem with many of
>>them is that they are cut down to a price point rather than being
>>built to a quality standard. "Raspberry Pi-alike" GPIO pins don't
>>transfer to automagically b
Good to know. I haven't ventured into GPIO in the 5 years I've been
>>them is that they are cut down to a price point rather than being
>>built to a quality standard. "Raspberry Pi-alike" GPIO pins don't
>>transfer to automagically b
working with the pi. I use it mainly for back up drives, and
occasional browsing while I'm in an on-line meet
>>
>>I'd single out Odroid as being very highly priced by comparison but
>>also very well built: the problem is that the boards take a while to
>>be fully supported on non-vendor kernel and in vanilla Debian - and by
>>that stage, the board may be out of production.
>>
I'd prefer to stick to debian based. I keep reading the debian how to
>>I'd single out Odroid as being very highly priced by comparison but
>>also very well built: the problem is that the boards take a while to
>>be fully supported on non-vendor kernel and in vanilla Debian - and by
>>that stage, the board may be out of production.
>>
set up network, but clearly I'm missing something somewhere as I
haven't gotten it working yet. Boots ok. I can't use a wire to
connect to the modem - it's too far awa
>>Pine's RockPi with 4G of memory seems to work quite well and be
>>relatively well supported.
Thank you. As it happens I was looking at this the other night.
>>relatively well supported.
>>
>>Factor in cases, eMMC and so on as well, if you want them. A lot of
>>the boards do not hve a custom made case and some of them will be
>>non-standard shapes/sizes.
necessary bits, they often get to the price of a low end laptop. I have
wondered a few times why I don't move that way.
>>
>>All the very best, as ever,
Mauricio Tavares
Sep 8, 2021, 8:20:02 AM9/8/21
to
On Wed, Sep 8, 2021 at 7:51 AM Keith Bainbridge <keit...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>Factor in cases, eMMC and so on as well, if you want them. A lot of
> >>the boards do not hve a custom made case and some of them will be
> >>non-standard shapes/sizes.
>
> It's amazing. The boards look reasonably priced, but when you add on the
> necessary bits, they often get to the price of a low end laptop. I have
> wondered a few times why I don't move that way.
>
I know people who have bought (used) those
> >>
> >>Factor in cases, eMMC and so on as well, if you want them. A lot of
> >>the boards do not hve a custom made case and some of them will be
> >>non-standard shapes/sizes.
>
> It's amazing. The boards look reasonably priced, but when you add on the
> necessary bits, they often get to the price of a low end laptop. I have
> wondered a few times why I don't move that way.
>
Dell/Lenovo/Supermicro Mac Mini-sized computers for that very reason:
at what price point you are using a SBC just for the sake of using a
SBC when a Mini-sized Linux-running computer would be a more capable
device at a similar price?
Andrew M.A. Cater
Sep 8, 2021, 6:30:03 PM9/8/21
to
memory and a good selection of I/O, 1G Ethernet and the potential for eMMC
storage. The RockPro has even more.
The other thing that's missing from the Raspberry Pi range is a good RTC
- a real time clock is not just a nice to have.
Diederik de Haas
Sep 8, 2021, 7:00:03 PM9/8/21
to
On donderdag 9 september 2021 00:21:27 CEST Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
> DRAT - I mistyped - the Rock64 and the RockPro64? - the Rock64 has 4G of
> memory and a good selection of I/O, 1G Ethernet and the potential for eMMC
> storage. The RockPro has even more.
I'd suggest going for the RockPro64 instead of the Rock64.
> DRAT - I mistyped - the Rock64 and the RockPro64? - the Rock64 has 4G of
> memory and a good selection of I/O, 1G Ethernet and the potential for eMMC
> storage. The RockPro has even more.
I have (several) Rock64's and several things don't work (as well) as one would
expect. Hopefully some things can still be improved over time.
Things seem better on the HW side with the RockPro64 and it's more powerful.
Before buying f.e. some PCIe card, it's wise to first ask/check on the forum
(f.e.) whether the device you want to buy will actually work properly. Several
do, but not all of them.
And you likely also want to buy some cooling device/case for it.
peter green
Sep 9, 2021, 12:10:03 AM9/9/21
to
On 07/09/2021 11:32, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> G'day
>
> I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
> H64B?
>
> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
> translate to their SBC?
>
> Thanks
>
> Background.
> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi. Not
> even root has access.
So you had a problem with sshfs permissions, rather than investigate
> G'day
>
> I've been following the recent thread Subject: Re: Debian on Pine64
> H64B?
>
> I'm looking for suggestions for a new SBC, please. Ideally something
> more than 2M RAM. I see that a few a happy with Pine laptops. Does this
> translate to their SBC?
>
> Thanks
>
> Background.
> I've just set up a new SDCard with raspberryOS. Set myself up as a
> user, and set root passsword. When I sshfs to my laptop, the mount
> point AND all subdirectories are owned exclusively buy user pi. Not
> even root has access.
said problem (e.g. https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/59685/sshfs-mount-sudo-gets-permission-denied )
you chose to blame the Raspberry Pi.
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 9, 2021, 3:40:03 AM9/9/21
to
And part of why I am contemplating a low end laptop. Another
consideration is that I can remove the monitor and keyboard from my
overcrowded desk.
--
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 9, 2021, 4:50:02 AM9/9/21
to
On 9/9/21 13:57, peter green wrote:
Not even root has access.
> So you had a problem with sshfs permissions, rather than investigate
> said problem (e.g.
> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/59685/sshfs-mount-sudo-gets-permission-denied
> )
> you chose to blame the Raspberry Pi.
>
Well, I've used sshfs from vbox's to host many, many times, without an
Not even root has access.
> So you had a problem with sshfs permissions, rather than investigate
> said problem (e.g.
> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/59685/sshfs-mount-sudo-gets-permission-denied
> )
> you chose to blame the Raspberry Pi.
>
issue.
I'll look at your suggestions next time I have RaspOS running.
--
0447 667 468
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 9, 2021, 6:30:02 AM9/9/21
to
On 9/9/21 13:57, peter green wrote:
Not even root has access.
> So you had a problem with sshfs permissions, rather than investigate
> said problem (e.g.
> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/59685/sshfs-mount-sudo-gets-permission-denied
> )
> you chose to blame the Raspberry Pi.
>
> So you had a problem with sshfs permissions, rather than investigate
> said problem (e.g.
> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/59685/sshfs-mount-sudo-gets-permission-denied
> )
> you chose to blame the Raspberry Pi.
>
Well, I've used sshfs from vbox's to host many, many times, without an
issue.
I'll look at your suggestions next time I have RaspOS running.
Later: Thankyou. That has allowed me to edit files, but the files are
issue.
I'll look at your suggestions next time I have RaspOS running.
still owned by user pi. VERY odd
--
0447 667 468
Keith Bainbridge
Sep 9, 2021, 6:30:03 AM9/9/21
to
On 7/9/21 22:46, Reco wrote:
>> Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
>> sources.list last year.
> I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
My vscode sources list reads ### Disabled by raspberrypi-sys-mods ###
>> Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
>> sources.list last year.
> I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
Interesting . Perhaps this is because I have installed only CLI?
--
0447 667 468
Reco
Sep 9, 2021, 2:20:02 PM9/9/21
to
Hi.
On Thu, Sep 09, 2021 at 08:11:43PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> On 7/9/21 22:46, Reco wrote:
> > > Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
> > > sources.list last year.
> > I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
>
> My vscode sources list reads ### Disabled by raspberrypi-sys-mods ###
> Interesting . Perhaps this is because I have installed only CLI?
I did "apt purge raspberrypi-sys-mods", mainly because that particular
package betrayed me in the past by introducing vscode.list. And doing it
the worst way possible - instead of providing the file as a part of the
package, it was created by postinst script of raspberrypi-sys-mods.
But, discussing RaspiOS is considered off-topic and inappropriate here,
so that's my last contribution in this subthread.
Reco
On Thu, Sep 09, 2021 at 08:11:43PM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> On 7/9/21 22:46, Reco wrote:
> > > Some will recall the discussion around raspberry adding a MS repo to
> > > sources.list last year.
> > I've "installed" fresh RaspiOS recently and they're still doing it.
>
> My vscode sources list reads ### Disabled by raspberrypi-sys-mods ###
> Interesting . Perhaps this is because I have installed only CLI?
package betrayed me in the past by introducing vscode.list. And doing it
the worst way possible - instead of providing the file as a part of the
package, it was created by postinst script of raspberrypi-sys-mods.
But, discussing RaspiOS is considered off-topic and inappropriate here,
so that's my last contribution in this subthread.
Reco
Reco
Sep 9, 2021, 2:20:03 PM9/9/21
to
Hi.
On Wed, Sep 08, 2021 at 09:44:46AM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> But even root couldn't chown. I don't recall this difficulty with
> raspberryOS before. Do you mean that fuse is not correctable? \
I meant something different.
sshfs by design is a complex frontend to scp.
Regardless of which user runs sshfs on RPi (or any OS for that matter),
remote "part" of sshfs (i.e. - your laptop filesystem(s)) is limited by
which user you're using to connect it to the remote host.
For instance, a local (for RPi) root is writing to sshfs mounted on a
RPi, yet sshfs is setup like this:
sshfs user@laptop:/ /mnt
And it's expected that actual reads and writes that are happening on a
laptop are limited to whatever directories and files "user" is able to
read and write on the "laptop". And unless remote user is root, chowning
files or directories is forbidden.
If you need more complex behaviour for file sharing, I suggest you to
explore NFS. It is not that hard to learn if you limit it to sec=sys and
NFSv4.
Samba will fit this role too, but it takes somewhat strong stomach to
setup and use Samba. YMMV.
> What woukd happen if I removed the 'pi' user account?
In the scenario above that would change nothing. For sshfs (or any
fuse-based filesystem for that matter) is does not really matters who
the local user is, all that matters is which user and where exactly
reads and writes are happening.
> This is why I started a new thread.
Frankly, this subthread belongs to debian-user, there's nothing
ARM-specific here.
In the case of further questions regarding sshfs or network filesystems
in general I suggest you to start a new thread at debian-user.
Reco
On Wed, Sep 08, 2021 at 09:44:46AM +1000, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> But even root couldn't chown. I don't recall this difficulty with
> raspberryOS before. Do you mean that fuse is not correctable? \
sshfs by design is a complex frontend to scp.
Regardless of which user runs sshfs on RPi (or any OS for that matter),
remote "part" of sshfs (i.e. - your laptop filesystem(s)) is limited by
which user you're using to connect it to the remote host.
For instance, a local (for RPi) root is writing to sshfs mounted on a
RPi, yet sshfs is setup like this:
sshfs user@laptop:/ /mnt
And it's expected that actual reads and writes that are happening on a
laptop are limited to whatever directories and files "user" is able to
read and write on the "laptop". And unless remote user is root, chowning
files or directories is forbidden.
If you need more complex behaviour for file sharing, I suggest you to
explore NFS. It is not that hard to learn if you limit it to sec=sys and
NFSv4.
Samba will fit this role too, but it takes somewhat strong stomach to
setup and use Samba. YMMV.
> What woukd happen if I removed the 'pi' user account?
fuse-based filesystem for that matter) is does not really matters who
the local user is, all that matters is which user and where exactly
reads and writes are happening.
> This is why I started a new thread.
ARM-specific here.
In the case of further questions regarding sshfs or network filesystems
in general I suggest you to start a new thread at debian-user.
Reco
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