Milestone Debian Junior Live System

[Stefan Kropp]

Hello,

I think it would be very helpful and an important milestone to
push a first "easy" Debian Junior Live System into Debian
experimental.

* We can use the BTS to send bugs and wishlists
* We have all tools / processes of Debian's packaging system

I have created two new repositories in the debian-jr-team on
salsa [1].

# debian-junior-desktop

The idea of the Debian Junior Desktop project [2] is to put all
files / scripts / docs / applications which are requited to
provide a Desktop for our kids. Currently it's based on IceWM
Windows Manager [3]. I have added
Depends: ${misc:Depends}, junior-config, icewm
to the control file.

There is not much in the package, yet.
----------------------------------------------------------------
dpkg -c ../debian-junior-desktop_0.0.1_amd64.deb
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/debian-junior-desktop/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/debian-junior-desktop/icewm/
-rw-r--r-- root/root 113 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/debian-junior-desktop/icewm/menu
-rw-r--r-- root/root 14 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/debian-junior-desktop/icewm/preferences
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/doc/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-desktop/
-rw-r--r-- root/root 170 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-desktop/changelog.gz
-rw-r--r-- root/root 442 2021-12-25 14:16 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-desktop/copyright
----------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sure we will have more ideas which should be added to the
Desktop environment.

# debian-junior-live-system

The second package is the Debian Junior Live System [4]. This
package contains the files which are required to build the live
system via live-build [5]. With those files everybody can build
an own live system.

----------------------------------------------------------------
dpkg -c ../debian-junior-live-system_0.0.1_amd64.deb
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/auto/
-rw-r--r-- root/root 63 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/auto/build
-rw-r--r-- root/root 138 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/auto/clean
-rw-r--r-- root/root 154 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/auto/config
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/
-rw-r--r-- root/root 23 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/keys
-rw-r--r-- root/root 2645 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/menu
-rw-r--r-- root/root 9162 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/preferences.gz
-rw-r--r-- root/root 34 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/theme
-rw-r--r-- root/root 210 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/.config/icewm/toolbar
-rw-r--r-- root/root 11 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/includes.chroot_after_packages/home/user/README.txt
drwxr-xr-x root/root 0 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/package-lists/
-rw-r--r-- root/root 452 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/build/config/package-lists/debianjr-desktop.list.chroot
-rw-r--r-- root/root 198 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/changelog.gz
-rw-r--r-- root/root 431 2022-06-04 03:51 ./usr/share/doc/debian-junior-live-system/copyright
----------------------------------------------------------------

With the commands lb config and lb build is it possible to build
the Debian Junior Live System.

# Ready for the milestone?

I think it looks nice and I should create the ITPs in wnpp.
_______________
< Are we ready? >
---------------
\
\
___
{~._.~}
( Y )
()~*~()
(_)-(_)

# Next steps

As soon as debian-junior-desktop is in Debian, we can remove some
files from the live system and use it from the desktop env.
Step-by-step we can improve the desktop and the live system. We
should also check what we can do with the blends user roles [6].

[1] https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team
[2] https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-desktop
[3] https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/icewm
[4] https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-live-system
[5] https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/live-build
[6] https://blends.debian.org/blends/ch06.html#userroles

--
Stefan

[Andreas Tille]

Hi,

from having a quick view on your suggestions it sounds sensible to me.
It would be great if *real* users of Debian Jr (which I'm not) would
comment on this.

Thanks a lot for reviving Debian Jr

Andreas.

--
http://fam-tille.de

[Stefan Kropp]

Hello all,

yesterday, I have filled the ITP Bugs for both packages:

ITP: debian-junior-desktop -- Debian Junior Desktop environment
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012463

ITP: debian-junior-live-system -- Debian Junior Live System
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012465

In this evening I have prepared the packages on salsa;
https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-desktop
https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-live-system

* debian-junior-live-system (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=low
* debian-junior-desktop (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=medium
* The current status is in master and debian/master
* The debian/changelog has been updated to the ITP Bug
* The debian/control has been updated with a "small" description
* The current status is tagged with version 0.0.1

lintian says for both packages:
W: debian-junior-live-system: improbable-bug-number-in-closes 1012465
W: debian-junior-live-system source: newer-standards-version 4.6.1 (current is 4.5.1)

[Andreas Tille]

Hi Stefan,

Am Wed, Jun 08, 2022 at 07:12:34PM +0000 schrieb Stefan Kropp:
>
> ITP: debian-junior-desktop -- Debian Junior Desktop environment
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012463
>
> ITP: debian-junior-live-system -- Debian Junior Live System
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012465
>
> In this evening I have prepared the packages on salsa;
> https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-desktop
> https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-live-system
>
> * debian-junior-live-system (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=low
> * debian-junior-desktop (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=medium
> * The current status is in master and debian/master

Do you have any reason to maintain two branches? I'd just go
with master (debian/ is redundant, isn't it?)

> * The debian/changelog has been updated to the ITP Bug

For new packages I'd use

* Initial release. (Closes: #1012463)

as only entry in changelog. The initial release is the one where
future changelogs are refering to.

I admit I do not see any reason to create a *separate*
debian-junior-desktop package. It could be included into the
debian-junior package by using the Blends framework. If you have no
idea how to do this I'd happily provide a patch.

In principle we intended to include a live-system creator also into
the blends-dev framework but this has not happened yet. If you want
to gain synergy effects for the future we should talk about this on
debian...@lists.debian.org.

> * The debian/control has been updated with a "small" description
> * The current status is tagged with version 0.0.1

> lintian says for both packages:
> W: debian-junior-live-system: improbable-bug-number-in-closes 1012465

Please upgrade your lintian to the version from unstable.

> W: debian-junior-live-system source: newer-standards-version 4.6.1 (current is 4.5.1)

That issue is not yet fixed in lintian.

Kind regards

Andreas.

--
http://fam-tille.de

[Stefan Kropp]

Hello Andreas,

On Do, 2022-06-09 15:03:41, Andreas Tille wrote:
> Am Wed, Jun 08, 2022 at 07:12:34PM +0000 schrieb Stefan Kropp:
> >
> > ITP: debian-junior-desktop -- Debian Junior Desktop environment
> > https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012463
> >
> > ITP: debian-junior-live-system -- Debian Junior Live System
> > https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1012465
> >
> > In this evening I have prepared the packages on salsa;
> > https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-desktop
> > https://salsa.debian.org/debian-jr-team/debian-junior-live-system
> >
> > * debian-junior-live-system (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=low
> > * debian-junior-desktop (0.0.1) experimental; urgency=medium
> > * The current status is in master and debian/master
>
> Do you have any reason to maintain two branches? I'd just go
> with master (debian/ is redundant, isn't it?)

I saw some projects which are using debian/* and upstream/* Those
projects are using quilt-format. I thing for Debian Junior
native-format should be fine. For me it's fine to go head with
master, only. I will delete debian/master.

> > * The debian/changelog has been updated to the ITP Bug
>
> For new packages I'd use
>
> * Initial release. (Closes: #1012463)
>
> as only entry in changelog. The initial release is the one where
> future changelogs are refering to.

OK

> I admit I do not see any reason to create a *separate*
> debian-junior-desktop package. It could be included into the
> debian-junior package by using the Blends framework. If you have no
> idea how to do this I'd happily provide a patch.

Nice, I didn't know. Did I miss it in
https://blends.debian.org/blends/ ? If we are able to use the
blends framework, we should try. I just saw the blend-role(8),
blend-update-menus(8), blend-user(8) in the documentation, but I
have no idea how this will work. I would be happy if you can

provide a patch.

> In principle we intended to include a live-system creator also into
> the blends-dev framework but this has not happened yet. If you want
> to gain synergy effects for the future we should talk about this on
> debian...@lists.debian.org.

Sure. I will drop a mail to start a discussion.

> > * The debian/control has been updated with a "small" description
> > * The current status is tagged with version 0.0.1
>
> > lintian says for both packages:
> > W: debian-junior-live-system: improbable-bug-number-in-closes 1012465
>
> Please upgrade your lintian to the version from unstable.
>
> > W: debian-junior-live-system source: newer-standards-version 4.6.1 (current is 4.5.1)
>
> That issue is not yet fixed in lintian.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Andreas.
>
> --
> http://fam-tille.de
>

--
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