wide - wider - widest etc

[Fantaw Tesema]

Hey folks,

Do we have a short and elegant form for wide - wider - widest, strong - stronger - strongest etc in Amharic like in English? I know we have a long form of it in Amharic.

ሰፊ - በጣም ሰፊ - እጅግ በጣም / እጅግ ሰፊ ወዘተ ከማለት ይልቅ እንደ እንግሊዘኛው አጭርና አንድ ቃል አባባል አለን?
እንደ እንግሊዘኛው የሚተጣጠፍ  አባባል ቢኖረን እንደት ቆንጆ ነበር!!!!

If there isn't, what can we do about it? I think we should do something about it. Any idea? Shall we create some easy to understand, elegant and consistent names? I know this may create a great discussion....  //FT

[Eyob Fitwi]

Hi Fantaw,

Unfortunately this limitation comes with the language's natural grammar. We don't have comparative forms. It's an English feature. We're going to have to go the inconvenient way.

ሰፊ - ይበልጥ ሰፊ - ከሁሉም ሰፊ/፣ እያልን መሄድ ይኖርብናል።

Best regards,
Eyob

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[Fantaw Tesema]

Thanks for your swift answer Eyob!

I agree about the language's natural grammar. I understand what you're saying.

May be it is a silly question, but can we do something about it? Can we give it a time and discussion to create comparative forms?
Many none English languages have adopted the English form. //FT

[Eyob Fitwi]

Hi Fantaw,

It's not silly at all, and I think your attempt to seek alternatives just in case is a good approach. Looking out for every option before we hastily make a decision is something we should prefer.

It's just that in this case I don't think we are able to come up with viable alternatives. But if there is someone who can give suggestions I'm all ears. Perhaps we can give it some time for all involved to chime in.

Best regards,
Eyob

[Fantaw Tesema]

Thanks again,

Then we wait and hope there may come suggestions and ideas. In the mean time I can continue with other words for WP.

BR

FT

[Fantaw Tesema]

Hey Belay,
I am not a doctor. About the English words comparative grammar, I was just wondering and asking. That is because we do not have a short form of it in Amharic. For example in English one can say, small - smaller - smallest <> big - bigger - biggest. We do not have a short, consistent and standard way of saying in Amharic. Have we? So I did not say to change any thing, but wondering if we could create or make it better. That is it. 

Belay, in my opinion, you are always safe if you explain the situation or what is asked. If am doing it the wrong way, so explain me. Believe me, there is no need to transform the question to some thing else. And I do not know what you mean by this: "ቢያንስ ቢያንስ የአሁን አገዛዝ ድጋፍ ከሌልህ የምትወድቅ መሰለኝ።"  And it is not true about the colonial complexion, I have never thought about that, may be you think about it. Am just doing my best, and when I have questions I ask. This is partly am eager to know and partly everybody here knows what is going on (we discuss).  

Well, English is may be a difficult language or worst language to be emulated, but it is used in most systems. As a result, we like it or not, we try to translate it (for ex. WP), so my question, for ex. was when English is small - smaller - smallest <> big - bigger - biggest, what can we do in Amharic, not to change but create or make a better translation. //FT

Best regards

www.tatariw.net
Beautiful Thinking!  -  ቆንጆ አስተሳሰብ!

On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 8:22 AM, Belay Tekalign <belayt...@gmail.com> wrote:

አቶ (ዶክተር) ፋንታው ይህ የቋንቋ ቅያሬ ዘይቤ አልተመቸኝም ። ቢያንስ ቢያንስ የአሁን አገዛዝ ድጋፍ ከሌልህ የምትወድቅ መሰለኝ ። እኔ እንደምውቀው አንተ ውጭ ነህ ። ብዙ ነገር ስለ ኢትዮጵያ ያሉት በትዝታ ነው ። አሁን በእንግሊዘኛ ስለ ቅጽያው እናውራ ፡ English is the worst language to be emulated. It is built by Norman Saxons who are French and who are derived from the Norsemen. Latin wanted to diffuse some sense to it but after the 11th century it is all a mess. That is why you don't the correct way to pronounce a word. In contrast the Nine Saints put Sabean in reverse, changed some letters, omitted some and translated the bible. The book of Henock is stil a heritage not because we tried to put a comparative in the tradition of the English. 

I am going to stop here because it amazes me such a poor language like English could be your example. Perhaps it is a colonial complexion.

[Belay Tekalign]

Dear Fantaw:

I read what I wrote last night and it is horrible and insulting. I don't mind being removed and I absolutely apologize for my aggression. Having said that, I think in Amharic we use a standard በጣም comparative and እጅግ በጣም for superlative. I don't see a need to change that. To change a language either one should have both physical (government) and intellectual (universities) power. English is not consistent when applying comparative and superlative adjuectives. I remember a a kid  from high school who used to call beautifulest (as in You are the beautifulest girl on the planet) for a girl he wants to befriend. Let us stick to በጣም for comparative and እጅግ በጣም for superlative. እጅግ በጣም ። በጣም ሰፊ ቤት ነው ። ያ ልጅ እጅግ በጣም ረዥም ነው ።

ከይቅርታ ጋር ።

በላይ ።

p.s. See attached.

[Fantaw Tesema]

That is fine Belay!

Thanks for the suggestion and attachment. I think we also, in a way have similar way of saying as the English attachment says. In my experience we do not always say ጥሩ፣ በጣም ጥሩ ና እጅግ በጣም ጥሩ as the three examples below: 

1) For ex. we say ቆንጆ፣ በጣም ቆንጆ ና ውብ/እጅግ በጣም ቆንጆ። ጥሩ ንግግር፣ በጣም ጥሩ ንግግር ና እጅግ በጣም ጥሩ ንግግር። ጎበዝ > በጣም ጎበዝ > እጅግ በጣም ጎበዝ። ወዘተ።
እዚህ ላይ እጅግ በጣም ከማለት እጅግ ብቻ ማለት ይበቃል?

2) ምሳሌ፤ ጨለማ > ጨለም ያለ > በጣም ጨለማ። ይህ ጥሩ ይመስለኛል። ጥቁር፣ ጠቆር ያለ፣ በጣም ጥቁር እንልስ የለም ወይ?
እዚህ ላይም ይበልጥ ጨለማ፣ ከሁሉም ጨለማ /ወይም/ በጣም ጨለማ፣ እጅግ በጣም ጨለማ ማለት ትክክል አይመስለኝም?

3) On the other hand, I think, we say  ትንሽ > አነስ ያለ > በጣም ያነሰ። ትልቅ > ተለቅ ያለ > ከሁሉም ትልቅ። ግዙፍም ይባላል። 
ሰፊ > ሰፋ ያለ > ከሁሉም ሰፊ። ጠባብ > ጠበብ ያለ > ከሁሉም ጠባብ።
እነዚህ የመሳሰሉት ላይ ለምሳሌ እጅግ ማለት የቱን ያህል እንደሚስማማና ለማለትም የተለመደ መሆኑ እርግጠኛ አይደለሁም። ምክንያቱም ለምሳሌ በትንሽና በበጣም ትንሽ መካከል የሆነ መጠን መኖር አለበት። ለምሳሌ ልብስ ለመግዛት ስንለካ የመጀመሪያው ከጠበበን "ሰፋ ያለ" ልሞክር እንላለን እንጂ "በጣም ሰፊ" ትክክል አይሆንም። በኔ አስተያየት " xxxx ያለ" የምንለው የተለመደ ይመስለኛል። ብዙ ነገሮችላይ ይገባል።

ለምሳሌ ስለ ሶስት ገመዶች እርዝመት ብናወራ እንኳን አጭሩን ለመተው "ረዘም ያለውን" ምረጥ እንላለን። ረዢሙን ለመተው ደግሞ "አጠር ያለውን" ምረጥ እንላለን።  ከሶስቱ በእርዝመት የሚበልጠውን ለመውሰድ ደግሞ "ከሁሉም ረጅሙን" ምረጥ እንላለን።  "ከሁሉም" የሚለው የእዮብ ሃሳብ ሲሆን ትክክል ይመስለኛል። "ይበልጥ ረጅም" በሚለው ፋንታ ግን "ረዘም ያለ" ቢሆን የተለመደና የተሻለ ይመስለኛል። የገመዱ ምሳሌ ላይም ይበልጥ ረጅም ወይም ይበልጥ አጭር ካልን እንግዳ ነገር ነው የሚል አስተያየት አለኝ። "ረዘም ያለ" ካልን ግን ቀላልና የተለመደ ይመስለኛል።   

እንደምታዩት፤
ሀ) ሶስታችንም የተለያዩ  አስተያየቶች አሉን። 
ለ) እንግሊዘኛው ማወዳደሪያ ውል እንደሌለው ሁሉ (የበላይ ተያያዥ) አማርኛውም ውል የለውም። 
ሐ) ይህንን ጉዳይ ላነሳ የቻልኩት "Wider" ን ለመተርጎም WP ላይ ስላጋጠመኝ ነው። ለጊዜው "ሰፋ ያለ" ብዬ ተርጎሜዋለሁ። ከላይ በምሳሌም እንደጠቀስኩት "ሰፊ፣ ሰፋ ያለ፣ በጣም ሰፊ" ከሚለው ሃሳብ በመነሳት ነው። ከ "በጣም ሰፊ" የሚበልጥ መጠን አለ የሚል ጥያቄ ሊያስነሳ ይችላል። ለማንኛውም በሰፊና በበጣም ሰፊ መካከል የሆነ መጠን መኖር አለበትና ፤ "ሰፊ" ካልን በኋላ "በጣም ሰፊ" ካልን ትክክል መሆኑን እጠራጠራለሁ። 
አስተያየት? ምን ይመስላችኋል?

BR //FT

 

Best regards

www.tatariw.net
Beautiful Thinking!  -  ቆንጆ አስተሳሰብ!