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Dec 13, 2013, 6:29:52 PM12/13/13
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cookiemonster
- Newbie
- Posts: 10
I am a university student and over the last month I have been learning how to use the Rapman 3D touch and Kisslicer as I am not a fan of Axon. My knowledge of how to use Kisslicer has now exceeded my tutors so I decided to make a guide in order to keep the knowledge i have acquired, one problem i found was if you know NOTHING about Reprapping the learn curve is very steep.
I have gone through most the options in kisslicer (some of them i don't understand so i steered clear of as inexperienced users wont be using them) and tried to simplify the language on what these settings mean and how they work. I need to take the guide to the printers on tuesday morning so i was wandering if some of you wouldn't mind have a look and seeing if you can see any glaring mistakes as i would hate to feed miss-information to other students ( I am also thinking of posting it on here once i am finished so other newbies can get some use from it)
I know its not much notice but my deadline is looming!
BIG thanks to all that have helped new amended version is done
I have gone through most the options in kisslicer (some of them i don't understand so i steered clear of as inexperienced users wont be using them) and tried to simplify the language on what these settings mean and how they work. I need to take the guide to the printers on tuesday morning so i was wandering if some of you wouldn't mind have a look and seeing if you can see any glaring mistakes as i would hate to feed miss-information to other students ( I am also thinking of posting it on here once i am finished so other newbies can get some use from it)
I know its not much notice but my deadline is looming!
BIG thanks to all that have helped new amended version is done
Kisslicer Guide.pdf (388.52 kB - downloaded 139 times.)« Last Edit: May 09, 2013, 07:46:41 AM by cookiemonster »
lonesock (Jonathan)
- KISSlicer Developer
- Administrator
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1042
- Alibre -> KISSlicer -> RapMan 3.1
Hey, idiots don't use KISSlicer! [8^)
I'll take a look. I did notice in the filename there is an extra 's' in KISSlicer.
thanks,
Jonathan
I'll take a look. I did notice in the filename there is an extra 's' in KISSlicer.
thanks,
Jonathan
*A2TD : "Added to the ToDo list"
cookiemonster
- Newbie
- Posts: 10
It would be amazing if you could have a look (as i'm not sure anyone knows it better)
lol that will be edited on final publication,
lol that will be edited on final publication,
damienb
- Newbie
- Posts: 17
Nice synthesis document 
I learned a few stuff reading it (smells like more tuning sessions coming...)
Would be great if KS wizards could infuse their science to get a very complete guide.
Thanks for your work!
Cheers
I learned a few stuff reading it (smells like more tuning sessions coming...)
Would be great if KS wizards could infuse their science to get a very complete guide.
Thanks for your work!
Cheers
http://exploreideasdaily.wordpress.com/
My blog on 3D Printing, 3D Scanning and other loosely related topics...
My blog on 3D Printing, 3D Scanning and other loosely related topics...
RobW
- Jr. Member
- Posts: 62
- 3DTouch dual head
Sure, I'll take a crack at proof-reading that (both for grammar and spelling, and for accuracy of content).
Page 6:
"Any option with an * before it is a more advanced more complicated options" is not particularly coherent. Do you mean "Any option with an * before it is a more advanced option"?
Page 8:
You're missing the "Paths" option, which I find to usually be much more useful than "model+paths".
You should mention that "Slice" turns into "Save" after slicing, and that you do need to click "Save" to create the gcode file.
White box next to G-code: "Shows you material usage an time estimate" - "an" should be "and".
Show settings: Should have a comma before "or", I believe.
Setting level: Some part-of-speech disagreement. Replace with "Choose level of control over settings. This prevents you from changing certain complicated settings if you choose beginner or intermediate"
Speed slider: Add a period after "job"
Page 9:
You say to move the slider to the left to increase fill density, and to the left to decrease fill density. the second one should be "right".
Page 10:
Number of loops: "a loop is a pass along the perimeter of the object and relates to skin thickness and extrusion width." I think you're missing the bolded "and" or at least some punctuation at the same location.
Extrusion width: This is a prescriptive, not descriptive, setting. You may have gotten 0.6 from an Axon print, but as long as the value is >= the nozzle diameter (0.5mm for the 3DTouch, I believe), you should be fine. There's a lot more math involved for optimal extrusion width, but the upshot is that for the 3DTouch, you can print at 0.5-0.7mm, and 0.5 is usually good.
Loops go from inside to perimeter: "inside out rather then outside in" - should be "than".
Wipe: Should mention when the nozzles are wiped clean by this option. I don't know right off-hand, but the information is on the forum.
Infill slider: "Vase" produces a hollow item with no top surface, but is otherwise normal. Your guide could imply that it only prints a single loop.
Jitter: Incoherent. I suggest "Causes each layer to start at a random location to hide seam lines. The value defines what range of angles it can start at."
You also don't have any documentation of the slider above the jitter field, even a "stay away from this".
I need to get back to work now, but I'll go through the rest of the guide this evening. It certainly looks like something that could be adapted into an official users guide (basic version, as opposed to an advanced version with all the details of each setting) if you and Jonathan are interested.
PS. Did you know that adding three hyphens in a row to a post apparently causes the server to throw an error when you try to post?
Page 6:
"Any option with an * before it is a more advanced more complicated options" is not particularly coherent. Do you mean "Any option with an * before it is a more advanced option"?
Page 8:
You're missing the "Paths" option, which I find to usually be much more useful than "model+paths".
You should mention that "Slice" turns into "Save" after slicing, and that you do need to click "Save" to create the gcode file.
White box next to G-code: "Shows you material usage an time estimate" - "an" should be "and".
Show settings: Should have a comma before "or", I believe.
Setting level: Some part-of-speech disagreement. Replace with "Choose level of control over settings. This prevents you from changing certain complicated settings if you choose beginner or intermediate"
Speed slider: Add a period after "job"
Page 9:
You say to move the slider to the left to increase fill density, and to the left to decrease fill density. the second one should be "right".
Page 10:
Number of loops: "a loop is a pass along the perimeter of the object and relates to skin thickness and extrusion width." I think you're missing the bolded "and" or at least some punctuation at the same location.
Extrusion width: This is a prescriptive, not descriptive, setting. You may have gotten 0.6 from an Axon print, but as long as the value is >= the nozzle diameter (0.5mm for the 3DTouch, I believe), you should be fine. There's a lot more math involved for optimal extrusion width, but the upshot is that for the 3DTouch, you can print at 0.5-0.7mm, and 0.5 is usually good.
Loops go from inside to perimeter: "inside out rather then outside in" - should be "than".
Wipe: Should mention when the nozzles are wiped clean by this option. I don't know right off-hand, but the information is on the forum.
Infill slider: "Vase" produces a hollow item with no top surface, but is otherwise normal. Your guide could imply that it only prints a single loop.
Jitter: Incoherent. I suggest "Causes each layer to start at a random location to hide seam lines. The value defines what range of angles it can start at."
You also don't have any documentation of the slider above the jitter field, even a "stay away from this".
I need to get back to work now, but I'll go through the rest of the guide this evening. It certainly looks like something that could be adapted into an official users guide (basic version, as opposed to an advanced version with all the details of each setting) if you and Jonathan are interested.
PS. Did you know that adding three hyphens in a row to a post apparently causes the server to throw an error when you try to post?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 12:55:03 PM by RobW »
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
Jitter: Incoherent. I suggest "Causes each layer to start at a random location to hide seam lines. The value defines what range of angles it can start at."
I'd suggest a bit more in descriptive text, with a couple of examples to remove ambiguity, and eliminating the ending preposition:
"Causes each layer to start at a random location around the perimeter to hide seam lines. The value defines the maximum angle limit of distribution. 0 Starts each layer at the same point. 10 Limits the layer starts to within a 10 degree angle around the perimeter. 360 Distributes layer start points anywhere along the perimeter."
Quote
PS. Did you know that adding three hyphens in a row to a post apparently causes the server to throw an error when you try to post?
Yikes, I'll stay away from that one. Thanks.
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
Yes, there are a number of "then"s that should be changed to "than"s. "Then" is generally a time relationship. "Than" is a choice or alternative. The "than" in the ABS and Nylon descriptions are correct. The "then" in the PLA description is not.
Quite a few sentences do not have their closing periods and the sentence following does not have an initial capital. This leads to ambiguity, misunderstanding and is generally difficult to read.
There are a number of instances of "you" that should be changed to "your". The first paragraph on the opening page has one.
Materials:
I'll take these one or two spreads at a time, so as not to lose my work from not having saved.
Quite a few sentences do not have their closing periods and the sentence following does not have an initial capital. This leads to ambiguity, misunderstanding and is generally difficult to read.
There are a number of instances of "you" that should be changed to "your". The first paragraph on the opening page has one.
Materials:
- All temperatures are dependent upon the manufacturer and each color from a particular manufacturer.
- ABS: BfB ABS normally prints at 260C. The type that I get from ProtoParadigm (manufacturer unknown at this point) prints best at 225C-240C. It gets really gooey at 250C+, where the BfB ABS is happy up there.
- PLA: BfB PLA normally prints at 195C. NatureWorks, also from ProtoParadigm, prints well anywhere between 195C-215C. Clear prints best in the upper half of that range while White prints best in the lower half, so the range should be widened.
- Typos:
- Nylon: "that good for gears" should be "that is good for gears"
- "stringyier" should be "stringier"
- "its requires a different bed" should be "it requires a different bed"
- "to high" should be "too high"
- The color guide (should be called by its name--there are two) does not always show when a model is loaded. The way it is written implies that it does. Only when a model has errors does the Mesh Error Key pop up. Both the Path Color Key and Mesh Error Key are available at any time in the Help menu but the latter is the only one that displays on its own, and then only when errors are detected in the model.
- Not necessarily good advice to imply that Netfabb will fix most modeling errors. Many times, it introduces more than it fixes; if indeed it finds any at all that are actually there. More often than not, it takes manual mesh repair to get a bad model ready for sound slicing. This has been covered quite a bit here on the forum. So, I'd suggest:
"If KISSlicer finds errors in your model, applications such as Netfabb or Meshlab may be able to fix them, but it often requires manual repairs to properly prepare bad models for slicing."
"When you are happy with your model and the colours you can close the colour guide." should then just come out. When the model is good, the Mesh Error Key won't show at all. One should never"be happy with those colors".
I'll take these one or two spreads at a time, so as not to lose my work from not having saved.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 03:53:03 PM by PenskeGuy »
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
Home Page
Period after "screen", Cap "I" on "it" to begin a new sentence.
Models+Paths: "Shows the model and the print paths (allows you to check what will be printed prior to print controlled by path slider)"
could be better written as:
"Shows the model and the print paths in a rotatable 3D display. This allows you to check what will be printed prior to print; controlled by the Path % and Z Value sliders."
Paths: "Displays the paths in a zoomable orthogonal overhead view, also controlled by the Path % and Z Value sliders."
White box next to G-code: "then" > "than".
Setting level: "Setting level" > "Settings Level".
"Choose level of control over settings it prevent you change certain settings if you choose beginner or intermediate" >
"Choose level of control over settings. This prevents you from changing advanced settings if you choose Beginner or Medium."
Speed slider; Work on punctuation, sentence structure and capitalization. It's all run together. I could write it for you but working it out is a good thing.
Style:
"thickness this" > "thickness. This"
"Due to how the machine is built you can generate unwanted Z Ribbing in your print if you don?t pick a Z height of the right multiple of the Z height adjustment thread"
I haven't found this to be the case. Further, the "right multiple" isn't explained. I'd just eliminate the sentence and () altogether, as the latter is covered in the table.
I'm gonna take a break...
Period after "screen", Cap "I" on "it" to begin a new sentence.
Models+Paths: "Shows the model and the print paths (allows you to check what will be printed prior to print controlled by path slider)"
could be better written as:
"Shows the model and the print paths in a rotatable 3D display. This allows you to check what will be printed prior to print; controlled by the Path % and Z Value sliders."
Paths: "Displays the paths in a zoomable orthogonal overhead view, also controlled by the Path % and Z Value sliders."
White box next to G-code: "then" > "than".
Setting level: "Setting level" > "Settings Level".
"Choose level of control over settings it prevent you change certain settings if you choose beginner or intermediate" >
"Choose level of control over settings. This prevents you from changing advanced settings if you choose Beginner or Medium."
Speed slider; Work on punctuation, sentence structure and capitalization. It's all run together. I could write it for you but working it out is a good thing.
Style:
"thickness this" > "thickness. This"
"Due to how the machine is built you can generate unwanted Z Ribbing in your print if you don?t pick a Z height of the right multiple of the Z height adjustment thread"
I haven't found this to be the case. Further, the "right multiple" isn't explained. I'd just eliminate the sentence and () altogether, as the latter is covered in the table.
I'm gonna take a break...
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
Support:
Support [deg] slider: "form" > "from"
Actually, I'd write this as: "Controls the limit at which support is produced beneath angled overhanging surfaces. Surfaces having angles from vertical that are less than this value will receive no support."
Support Z-Roof [mm]: "Limit how high support gets built up to if to deactivate this feature set to -1" >
"Limit how high support is built. To deactivate this feature, set to -1."
Sheath Main Support: "This option joins the sparse support together make a more solid bed to build onto but makes it much harder to remove from the model"
Not exactly. Check the tooltip again.
Inflate Support: Two sentences. Indicate them.
Gap: The gap is horizontal only.
Raft: Indicate sentence endings/beginnings.
Inflate Raft: Actually, it only extends in X and Y; doesn't make it thicker. Bed Roughness does that. The tooltip should be modified as well.
That's it for a while.
Support [deg] slider: "form" > "from"
Actually, I'd write this as: "Controls the limit at which support is produced beneath angled overhanging surfaces. Surfaces having angles from vertical that are less than this value will receive no support."
Support Z-Roof [mm]: "Limit how high support gets built up to if to deactivate this feature set to -1" >
"Limit how high support is built. To deactivate this feature, set to -1."
Sheath Main Support: "This option joins the sparse support together make a more solid bed to build onto but makes it much harder to remove from the model"
Not exactly. Check the tooltip again.
Inflate Support: Two sentences. Indicate them.
Gap: The gap is horizontal only.
Raft: Indicate sentence endings/beginnings.
Inflate Raft: Actually, it only extends in X and Y; doesn't make it thicker. Bed Roughness does that. The tooltip should be modified as well.
That's it for a while.
RobW
- Jr. Member
- Posts: 62
- 3DTouch dual head
Continuing, avoiding duplicates of things PenskeGuy has already covered (except that I'm pointing out specific then/thans and mashed-together sentences):
Page 12:
Support Slider: "maxium" should be "maximum"
Raft: As PenskeGuy said, indicate teh sentence beginning/ends. Also "produced" in the skirt sentence should probably be "produces". Possibly make it a bulleted list of raft types and uses?
Prime pillar: Separate sentences (I think there's a sentence break after hte parenthetical statement). "insure" should be "ensure". Also, in my opinion the description of what it does (builds a pillar, which I would describe as "the same height as the tallest part" rather than "a cylinder for each layer") should go before the why to use it.
Page 13:
"Cost of print can be calculated in you way out a print"
Did you perhaps mean "Cost of printing can be calculated if you weigh a print"?
Copy material button: Separate sentences. Fix spelling of "recommend".
Delete material: "Also" should not be capitalized. "Materials" should only be capitalized if you do so everywhere you refer to a collection of settings for a given plastic type.
Page 14:
Separate sentences and add periods to the intro sentences. Also, there's a "then" that should be "than".
Diameter: Not sure if the double-l in "callipers" is a British spelling. My dictionary lists it as a valid alternate, but I've only ever seen the single-l spelling.
First layer: "then" should be "than", "printer" should be "printed".
Keep warm: Separate sentences.
Fan cool sliders: "then" should be "than"
Fan Z: Either split into multiple sentences, or add "as" after "slower". Either way, I'm pretty sure you need a comma between "cooling' and "resulting".
Min layer: Consider adding a warning that the print head never leaves the print, so this is counterproductive for very narrow prints, and a prime pillar may be more useful.
Flow tweak: Not accurate. Unless PenskeGuy or some other expert disagrees, I'd suggest something like "Flow rate adjustment factor for unusual materials or print heads. Should generally be kept very close to 1."
Min/Max: The way you have these described implies that they use different units. (@other advanced users: Am I right in remembering that these are absolute limits that KS will never exceed, or were those elsewhere?)
Prime: The comma goes after the parentheses, not before.
Suck: "mm" should probably be "plastic (in mm)", otherwise there is some unpleasant plurality disagreement.
Page 16:
Fix the punctuation and sentence separation in the opening text.
Number of Extruders: Separate sentences.
Loop/solid infill overlap: "close"->"much the"?
Bed center: Until we get a British English translation, the setting title is "Bed center". You've been consistent with American vs. British spellings so far, so don't give up now! :-)
Also, I really don't know what you're getting at with "not all printers at the same". More elaboration would be useful.
In the "copy/delete" note, I think you meant "multiple", not "multiplex".
Page 18:
Second sentence, you almost certainly meant "affect", not "effect".
Extruders and Object: Separate sentences.
Fast: I think you meant to have the "Lower quality and Slow ? higher quality" in the Options column, rather than Explanations. Also, I'll let PenskeGuy confirm this, but the 3DTouch doesn't really like such high values for sparse infill- it isn't good for the machinery to rattle around that fast, even if you set the infill type to Rounded.
Solid infill and support: What were you trying to say when you typed "high desist support"? Density? I don't think that's really accurate, but I'll let someone else verify that your descriptions are good.
Sparse infill: The trailing "at" should be deleted.
Page 19:
"reckomend" should be "recommend".
Page 20:
I'd add an initial bullet point under "unexpected behaviour" that says "You are probably wrong about having correct settings." I personally have never had anything go non-catastrophically wrong if I have my settings correct. Also, move this to the bottom of the page, as it's really a catch-all for anything that isn't covered elsewhere.
Poor layer adhesion would be a good place to mention Sublime's recommendation of keeping the (extrusion width)/(layer height) ratio above 1.5.
Excessive Stringing: You mentioned "gap" and "trigger" separately earlier, so there may be some confusion. I'd say "check destring jump and trigger in material settings".
Under "decrease temperature", "to low" should be "too low", and there needs to be at least a comma in there somewhere.
Z-Ribbing:
The first bullet is missing too many words and too much punctuation to qualify as a sentence.
The second bullet could possibly be made clearer. Perhaps replace "and" with a sentence break?
Also, each of the heads should either have no trailing punctuation, or a trailing colon (I'd go for no punctuation). A mix of "none" and "trailing semicolon" just looks bad.
Page 12:
Support Slider: "maxium" should be "maximum"
Raft: As PenskeGuy said, indicate teh sentence beginning/ends. Also "produced" in the skirt sentence should probably be "produces". Possibly make it a bulleted list of raft types and uses?
Prime pillar: Separate sentences (I think there's a sentence break after hte parenthetical statement). "insure" should be "ensure". Also, in my opinion the description of what it does (builds a pillar, which I would describe as "the same height as the tallest part" rather than "a cylinder for each layer") should go before the why to use it.
Page 13:
"Cost of print can be calculated in you way out a print"
Did you perhaps mean "Cost of printing can be calculated if you weigh a print"?
Copy material button: Separate sentences. Fix spelling of "recommend".
Delete material: "Also" should not be capitalized. "Materials" should only be capitalized if you do so everywhere you refer to a collection of settings for a given plastic type.
Page 14:
Separate sentences and add periods to the intro sentences. Also, there's a "then" that should be "than".
Diameter: Not sure if the double-l in "callipers" is a British spelling. My dictionary lists it as a valid alternate, but I've only ever seen the single-l spelling.
First layer: "then" should be "than", "printer" should be "printed".
Keep warm: Separate sentences.
Fan cool sliders: "then" should be "than"
Fan Z: Either split into multiple sentences, or add "as" after "slower". Either way, I'm pretty sure you need a comma between "cooling' and "resulting".
Min layer: Consider adding a warning that the print head never leaves the print, so this is counterproductive for very narrow prints, and a prime pillar may be more useful.
Flow tweak: Not accurate. Unless PenskeGuy or some other expert disagrees, I'd suggest something like "Flow rate adjustment factor for unusual materials or print heads. Should generally be kept very close to 1."
Min/Max: The way you have these described implies that they use different units. (@other advanced users: Am I right in remembering that these are absolute limits that KS will never exceed, or were those elsewhere?)
Prime: The comma goes after the parentheses, not before.
Suck: "mm" should probably be "plastic (in mm)", otherwise there is some unpleasant plurality disagreement.
Page 16:
Fix the punctuation and sentence separation in the opening text.
Number of Extruders: Separate sentences.
Loop/solid infill overlap: "close"->"much the"?
Bed center: Until we get a British English translation, the setting title is "Bed center". You've been consistent with American vs. British spellings so far, so don't give up now! :-)
Also, I really don't know what you're getting at with "not all printers at the same". More elaboration would be useful.
In the "copy/delete" note, I think you meant "multiple", not "multiplex".
Page 18:
Second sentence, you almost certainly meant "affect", not "effect".
Extruders and Object: Separate sentences.
Fast: I think you meant to have the "Lower quality and Slow ? higher quality" in the Options column, rather than Explanations. Also, I'll let PenskeGuy confirm this, but the 3DTouch doesn't really like such high values for sparse infill- it isn't good for the machinery to rattle around that fast, even if you set the infill type to Rounded.
Solid infill and support: What were you trying to say when you typed "high desist support"? Density? I don't think that's really accurate, but I'll let someone else verify that your descriptions are good.
Sparse infill: The trailing "at" should be deleted.
Page 19:
"reckomend" should be "recommend".
Page 20:
I'd add an initial bullet point under "unexpected behaviour" that says "You are probably wrong about having correct settings." I personally have never had anything go non-catastrophically wrong if I have my settings correct. Also, move this to the bottom of the page, as it's really a catch-all for anything that isn't covered elsewhere.
Poor layer adhesion would be a good place to mention Sublime's recommendation of keeping the (extrusion width)/(layer height) ratio above 1.5.
Excessive Stringing: You mentioned "gap" and "trigger" separately earlier, so there may be some confusion. I'd say "check destring jump and trigger in material settings".
Under "decrease temperature", "to low" should be "too low", and there needs to be at least a comma in there somewhere.
Z-Ribbing:
The first bullet is missing too many words and too much punctuation to qualify as a sentence.
The second bullet could possibly be made clearer. Perhaps replace "and" with a sentence break?
Also, each of the heads should either have no trailing punctuation, or a trailing colon (I'd go for no punctuation). A mix of "none" and "trailing semicolon" just looks bad.
lonesock (Jonathan)
- KISSlicer Developer
- Administrator
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1042
- Alibre -> KISSlicer -> RapMan 3.1
I printed it out, started making notes, get back on and boom, I'm already 10 posts back. [8^)
Looking great everyone!
Some random thoughts:
Jonathan
Looking great everyone!
Some random thoughts:
- Would you be willing to make the text a Google Doc? You could allow the current thread contributors as editors
- What if you made it a 3-column version: Control | Tooltip | Notes. I can generate the 1st 2 columns from inside the program.
- You might want to remove your username from the screenshots
- Some info that might be good before getting to the settings:
- Placing the INI files
- Initial start asks about the user's experience level
- a quick overview of the Model Tab (and the right-click context menu)
Jonathan
*A2TD : "Added to the ToDo list"
cookiemonster
- Newbie
- Posts: 10
WOW! there is ALOT of corrections to be made it would appear i will try and sort this out sunday and monday and hopefully have a clearer and more accurate guide as a result. thanks foor all the reply i will try and address as many of the problems as possible (and yes i realize my grammar and punctuation tend to be lacking i will do my best to sort these out)
cookiemonster
- Newbie
- Posts: 10
I printed it out, started making notes, get back on and boom, I'm already 10 posts back. [8^)
Looking great everyone!
Some random thoughts:thanks,
- Would you be willing to make the text a Google Doc? You could allow the current thread contributors as editors
- What if you made it a 3-column version: Control | Tooltip | Notes. I can generate the 1st 2 columns from inside the program.
- You might want to remove your username from the screenshots
- Some info that might be good before getting to the settings:
- Placing the INI files
- Initial start asks about the user's experience level
- a quick overview of the Model Tab (and the right-click context menu)
Jonathan
yeah im happy to make it a google doc but i have no idea how, and i have no clue what an INI file is? or about the quick overview model tab, i'm happy to open this up to people that understand this better then i do as i said i only have been useing Rapman and Kisslicer for 3 weeks so i am a novice at best im really glad that people seem to be responding so well to a break down of the options though and i accept i may not be describing them as eloquently as they could be
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 08:25:38 PM by cookiemonster »
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
Prime pillar: Separate sentences (I think there's a sentence break after hte parenthetical statement). "insure" should be "ensure".
I had something for Prime Pillar but nuked it for something better and never put it in.
Also, in my opinion the description of what it does (builds a pillar, which I would describe as "the same height as the tallest part" rather than "a cylinder for each layer") should go before the why to use it.
Actually, the description is not what it does. It does the things mentioned but also, because of its fast feed rate, performs a wipe of the nozzle in every direction on the nozzle surface prior to the head returning to the part. "A cylinder for each layer" is really incorrect. If that were the case, the bed would be full of cylinders by the time the part was done. It is a cylinder for each material nested concentrically to form a column as tall as the part at a separate location on the bed.
Diameter: Would be more correct to say: "This value is a core basis upon which KISSlicer computes all flow rates." Yes, this does make a better print but without this information, the description is less educational as to how KISSlicer works. It is this approach that sets KISSlicer apart.
Min layer: Consider adding a warning that the print head never leaves the print, so this is counterproductive for very narrow prints, and a prime pillar may be more useful.
Good point.
Flow tweak: Not accurate. Unless PenskeGuy or some other expert disagrees, I'd suggest something like "Flow rate adjustment factor for unusual materials or print heads. Should generally be kept very close to 1."
Actually, Flow Tweak is for all materials; even different colors of the same material. Each should be calibrated individually.
Min/Max: The way you have these described implies that they use different units. (@other advanced users: Am I right in remembering that these are absolute limits that KS will never exceed, or were those elsewhere?)
Yes, they are absolute limits. Setting them incorrectly can mess up a lot of other calculations, as they are also basic to the flow computation and resultant feed rates. But, *Min is wrong. They are indeed the same units and that unit is volume per second.
IMO, the explanations should be at least slightly different from the existing tooltips in the application. That which is entered here, should expand upon the tooltips. This will provide more information to the reader, which is what a guide is, or should be, all about. Plunking down nearly the same text doesn't serve to erase an ambiguity in a user's mind if something isn't exactly clear in an abbreviated form like tooltips. As an example, Min Jump and Trigger don't go far enough to inform.
Printer:
3D Touch has 1, 2 or 3 extruders.
Bed Size: That is not a 3D Touch set of dimensions. They vary, depending upon the number of extruders.
Bed center: Until we get a British English translation, the setting title is "Bed center". You've been consistent with American vs. British spellings so far, so don't give up now! :-)
No he hasn't. (Colour) I've been letting it slide, since this seems to be an assignment (that we are writing/polishing), so is primarily aimed at a British audience. Otherwise, it seems that there might not be much point in printing copies and having a deadline. I'm going with it because we need to do this anyway and put it up on the (now empty) Wiki.
Z-settle: Incorrect. This is really only useful on printers where the bed moves in Z. During a hop or triggered Z-lift, the bed moves down then up again by this amount. If it moved the way it is described, the purpose would be defeated.
Z-offset: I think you mean "connection", not "conjecture". "Negative values move the bed and nozzle closer to each other. USE WITH CAUTION OR NOZZLE COULD BE DRIVEN INTO THE BED." should be added, here.
Firmware: "check firmware type is set to BFB and move on" Capitalize "Check". I'm not sure that 3D Touches have PWM fans. I have had way better luck turning that checkbox off and letting them cycle, so "moving on" isn't necessarily true.
Printer Continued:
I'm almost certain that a "reprap 3d touch" doesn't exist. Nor does a Rapman 3D Touch. A RapMan is a RapMan. A 3D Touch is a 3D Touch. They're different. Let's get the name of the printer correct and consistent. They've both already been discontinued, which is bad enough, and I don't want either of them to go into oblivion because their names got munged.
"You have to assign a material to an extruder, if you change materials in an extruder you must change it
here. The speed settings are an important variable that can create numerous flaws in a print and effect
other factors."
These two sentences should be separate paragraphs. This sounds like the material chosen for an extruder somehow can have detrimental influence on a print. Speeds are on a separate tab, because they are global; independent of other factors.
I'll let PenskeGuy confirm this, but the 3DTouch doesn't really like such high values for sparse infill- it isn't good for the machinery to rattle around that fast, even if you set the infill type to Rounded.
Exactly correct. My settings are:
Fast - Lower Quality
Perimeter = 30
Solid Infill and Support = 40
Sparse Infill = 16
Slow - Higher Quality
Fast - Lower Quality
Perimeter = 4
Solid Infill and Support = 10
Sparse Infill = 10
These give a better range when moving the Quality Slider.
Additionally, the Perimeter Speed is for the... Perimeter. A Perimeter is the outer-most Loop only. Inner Loops print at increasingly higher feed rates up to the Solid Infill speed.
Solid infill and support: What were you trying to say when you typed "high desist support"? Density? I don't think that's really accurate, but I'll let someone else verify that your descriptions are good.
It isn't accurate. Chosen density of the support has nothing to do with it.
Agree on the deletion of the ending preposition "at" in Sparse Infill.
G-code Tabs:
"There are more advanced tabs that allow you to enter specific G-coding I would not reckomend adjusting
these without good reason or unless you have experience"
"There" > should be "These". As it is, it sounds like there are more that you are not showing. "reckomend" has already been addressed. I'd take out "without good reason" altogether. Noobs will have "good reason" and not know what they are doing.
"Gcoding" > "G-coding" ion all instances.
*Prt G-code ? you can apply specific G-coding to parts (not needed most of the time)
Actually, the Ptr G-codes are needed most of the time. Users should be directed to just hit the Defaults button to insert the correct Printer G-code variables for their chosen firmware and type within that firmware if that applies.
Note that Jonathan's abbreviation for the tab title is "Ptr G-code", not "Prt".
Troubleshooter: (over here, it's one word)
Page 20:
I'd add an initial bullet point under "unexpected behaviour" that says "You are probably wrong about having correct settings." I personally have never had anything go non-catastrophically wrong if I have my settings correct. Also, move this to the bottom of the page, as it's really a catch-all for anything that isn't covered elsewhere.
Agreed. And, settings have always been the problem. Rebooting the printer never fixed a print. If the printer isn't responding properly at all (won't read a flash drive, won't Home, etc.), that is another situation but fixing a print isn't one of them.
Under "decrease temperature", "to low" should be "too low", and there needs to be at least a comma in there somewhere.
"Too low and you can damage the head." should be a separate sentence.
However, "WARNING: you should print at lowest possible temperature of consistent extrusion and good adhesion but the lower the temperature the more work the extruder is doing." Isn't a hard, fast rule.
Generally, prints should be done at the correct temperature for every given material and feed rate. Just like in photography, there is only one correct exposure. The "lowest possible" is not it. Each material needs to be calibrated to learn what its sweet spot is. There is no overall rule.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 09:23:38 PM by PenskeGuy »
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
WOW! there is ALOT of corrections to be made it would appear i will try and sort this out sunday and monday and hopefully have a clearer and more accurate guide as a result. thanks foor all the reply i will try and address as many of the problems as possible (and yes i realize my grammar and punctuation tend to be lacking i will do my best to sort these out)
Looking forward to the revised issue.
cookiemonster
- Newbie
- Posts: 10
Rob W and PenskeGuy thanks a lot for all the work, and as you may of gathered spelling and punctuation isn't really my specialty.
I have tried to balance and address all the issues raised above and for Rob W, I have made the titles the American spellings, but hey im british the explanations are the british spelling
and any 3d touch parameters i talk of i mean specifically for my printer if this goes onto be something more they can be adjusted or removed
I'm adding in the " extrusion width ? layer height to above 1.5" thing under poor adhesion but i don't actually understand it so maybe you can give me an example that would clear it up for me and i can put that in?
and to Peneskyguy any ambiguous explanations were probably due to my lack of understanding of what they do, (specifically the Min/Max factors).
Also i would like to add in an explanation of difference between sparse infill and solid but i don't know what the difference is, could you help?
and to check you rote "indicate" a lot I assume that meant capitalize first word of sentance but i have not heard the term word used like that before?
I have tried to balance and address all the issues raised above and for Rob W, I have made the titles the American spellings, but hey im british the explanations are the british spelling
and any 3d touch parameters i talk of i mean specifically for my printer if this goes onto be something more they can be adjusted or removed
I'm adding in the " extrusion width ? layer height to above 1.5" thing under poor adhesion but i don't actually understand it so maybe you can give me an example that would clear it up for me and i can put that in?
and to Peneskyguy any ambiguous explanations were probably due to my lack of understanding of what they do, (specifically the Min/Max factors).
Also i would like to add in an explanation of difference between sparse infill and solid but i don't know what the difference is, could you help?
and to check you rote "indicate" a lot I assume that meant capitalize first word of sentance but i have not heard the term word used like that before?
PenskeGuy
- Hero Member
- Posts: 1231
- Any Day I Learn Something New Is A Good Day
I have tried to balance and address all the issues raised above and for Rob W, I have made the titles the American spellings, but hey im british the explanations are the british spelling
That is just going to look unprofessional. Choose one.
and any 3d touch parameters i talk of i mean specifically for my printer if this goes onto be something more they can be adjusted or removed
Good idea to remove if they aren't really universal.
Also i would like to add in an explanation of difference between sparse infill and solid but i don't know what the difference is
Solid is... solid. No space between adjacent paths. The extrusion generated with it should be without holes or gaps.
There are two kinds of Sparse. I have a question posed to Jonathan on this at present.
Sparse Infill is generated as an internal support structure to transition between Stacked Sparse Infill and Solid Infill or Loops that will form a top surface.
Stacked Sparse Infill is the one chosen by the Infill density slider. The lower the % that is chosen, the farther apart the paths become.
and to check you rote "indicate" a lot I assume that meant capitalize first word of sentance but i have not heard the term word used like that before?
Yes. Sentence endings and beginnings are "indicated" by a period after the last word, followed by a space, followed by a Capital letter on the first word of the next sentence. Without these "indicators", sentences run together and words that do not have any direct relationship can be read as being in the same sentence and having a relationship with each other; when they actually do not. This very often changes the meaning of the thought.
Most times, the thought just doesn't make any sense. The reader is then forced to re-read, perhaps multiple times, to try to figure out what sounds as if it might be what the writer intended before proceeding. Wastes a lot of time and effort needlessly.
Especially when writing a manual, you need to be as clear and unambiguous as possible or you are not helping your readers but, instead, confusing them.
RobW
- Jr. Member
- Posts: 62
- 3DTouch dual head
I have tried to balance and address all the issues raised above and for Rob W, I have made the titles the American spellings, but hey im british the explanations are the british spelling
That is just going to look unprofessional. Choose one.
I personally like having items quoted from the user interface match the user interface (especially when said user interface is shown on the same page), but I see your point. cookiemonster: If you go for one spelling type, stick with British spellings for this version, as you're less likely to slip up and miss a few, and your main target audience is British.
and any 3d touch parameters i talk of i mean specifically for my printer if this goes onto be something more they can be adjusted or removed
Good idea to remove if they aren't really universal.
I'd say stick with the 3D Touch-specific version for now, as that's what you're using at your school, and then make a more general version later.
Rob65
- Newbie
- Posts: 23
- SolidWorks-> KISSlicer -> Creatr & building custom
This looks nice.
Even if one already knows a bit about KISSlicer, this also defines a number of terms that are useful.
I do have some remarks, I browsed through previous posts but did not see these being mentioned:
1) On page 7 you mention the "option ribbon", showing the tabs, page 9 & 11 call the items "Style option" and "Support option" and on 13 you use "Material tab".
Since these are tabs, why not just call them all tab.
I'm Dutch so not too sure about conventions but we call the this with the name a "tab" and the part below (where all the options are given) the "tab sheet"
2) Page 10: layer thickness. Should be less than the nozzle width, I have seen 80% of the nozzle width being mentioned as max. layer thickness on the reprap forum. Making layers thicker may result in delamination. Might be worth mentioning.
3) Page 13-14: you are hopping around the screen describing the options. I would describe the options in a logical order (main options first, then destring options, then fan/cooling etc.
4) Some typos I just noticed on the last pages: "Kempton tape" is "Kapton Tape" and "the layer bellow" should be "the layer below"
5) Glossary:
- Hot end: that part where the filament is being heated and extruded.
- Micro stepping: a way to control the stepper motor to create more than the 200 steps/rev that a stepper motor physically has.
(It also applies for the X and Y axis that are driven by belts and is not related to the threaded rods).
- Z ribbing: you could mean two things here:
First of all, due to the use of standard threaded rods not being completely straight you could mean the Z wobble (build plate moving in the XY plane) but that's mostly called Z wobble.
Second is that you mean the ribbing that is the result of the oval shape of the extrusion.
I prefer Z wobble.
One last thing that's just optical: in Adobe Reader XI the font you use in your heading shows up very funny when looking at the document on screen. It is almost like the characters are not places on one line but on a wobble.
Rob
Even if one already knows a bit about KISSlicer, this also defines a number of terms that are useful.
I do have some remarks, I browsed through previous posts but did not see these being mentioned:
1) On page 7 you mention the "option ribbon", showing the tabs, page 9 & 11 call the items "Style option" and "Support option" and on 13 you use "Material tab".
Since these are tabs, why not just call them all tab.
I'm Dutch so not too sure about conventions but we call the this with the name a "tab" and the part below (where all the options are given) the "tab sheet"
2) Page 10: layer thickness. Should be less than the nozzle width, I have seen 80% of the nozzle width being mentioned as max. layer thickness on the reprap forum. Making layers thicker may result in delamination. Might be worth mentioning.
3) Page 13-14: you are hopping around the screen describing the options. I would describe the options in a logical order (main options first, then destring options, then fan/cooling etc.
4) Some typos I just noticed on the last pages: "Kempton tape" is "Kapton Tape" and "the layer bellow" should be "the layer below"
5) Glossary:
- Hot end: that part where the filament is being heated and extruded.
- Micro stepping: a way to control the stepper motor to create more than the 200 steps/rev that a stepper motor physically has.
(It also applies for the X and Y axis that are driven by belts and is not related to the threaded rods).
- Z ribbing: you could mean two things here:
First of all, due to the use of standard threaded rods not being completely straight you could mean the Z wobble (build plate moving in the XY plane) but that's mostly called Z wobble.
Second is that you mean the ribbing that is the result of the oval shape of the extrusion.
I prefer Z wobble.
One last thing that's just optical: in Adobe Reader XI the font you use in your heading shows up very funny when looking at the document on screen. It is almost like the characters are not places on one line but on a wobble.
Rob
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