Unretained whining - read at your risk

[Davide Ardizzoia]

Why, oh why, we can't save speed settings with style profile to prevent user to print thin ABS layer at thick PLA speed ?
Even slicers powerful as a doorstep have it... why KS doesn't do it ?
IF you move the speed slider, you affect ALL THE STYLES: does it make any sense ?!?


Finished whining.
Davide Ardizzoia

[frozen...@yahoo.com]

Why is it exactly that there all all these people that want KS to do what other slicers do? If KS doesn't do what you want......use some other slicer.

[Davide Ardizzoia]

Just because it's natural to evolve & improve.

You probably keep printing same item tipology and you are happy with it.

In a service business, the same printer prints 0.05mm ABS layers, then it may switch to 0.3mm PLA.

It's a PITA to slice something and discover you had kept the wrong speed AFTER the raft of a large part.

Some regards,
Davide Ardizzoia

[Tarjei Knapstad]

I agree with you Davide. Speed settings are also affected by the size and geometry of the object being printed, so this would give you the opportunity to make "ABS 0.05 Simple", "ABS 0.05 Complex" etc. styles. The Tantillus calculator is an excellent tool which would also be nice to integrate directly into KS :)

http://www.tantillus.org/Expert_calc.php

--

Tarjei

On Tuesday, September 2, 2014 9:56:03 AM UTC+2, Davide Ardizzoia wrote:

Just because it's natural to evolve & improve.

You probably keep printing same item tipology and you are happy with it.

In a service business, the same printer prints 0.05mm ABS layers, then it may switch to 0.3mm PLA.

It's a PITA to slice something and discover you had kept the wrong speed AFTER the raft of a large part.

Some regards,
Davide Ardizzoia









Il giorno lunedì 1 settembre 2014 23:53:07 UTC+2, frozen...@yahoo.com ha scritto:

[frozen...@yahoo.com]

I've been printing for over 2 year and I am an advanced printer that actually ALWAYS checks my settings......

Don't assume you know me. Have you ever run a 96 hour plus print? Can you pull off a chain mail print? Do you model your own models or just spit out thingiverse junk?

[funBart]

I'm surprised you don't know each other actually! You are both heavy weight Printista's with extended Kisslicer experience. Davide is a printer-manufacturer, has recently made the new Kisslicer manual and surely isn't a Thingiverse printer. Same as Steve, aka frozen Rabbit, a modeller and printer user taking all to the next level. Please shake hands ;-)

There is a difference in my eyes between new users whining and experienced users as Davide pointing towards some inconsistent use or behavior of Kisslicer. You have to take that absolute seriously in my opinion. Beside that: as an European says he is whining, you can bet he is very serious but won't offend the other to much, by pushing another in the corner. It's a way to be polite actually.

I too have some problems with new users of Kisslicer whining about features of other slicers, but OTOH, it's understandable and you only have to point the way they can get the job done with KS. Another story is the picky attitude by Kisslicer towards non-manifold stl's. New users don't understand that behavior and you have to explain another workflow, or simply suggest other slicer can do that job better.

But I'm with Davide -and have mailed Jonathan about my opinion as well- that there is a certain unlogic in Kisslicer how the UI is arranged and essential features are hidden.

For example: about the speed slider Davide mentioned: I'm actually never use it anymore, because it says nothing. I'm just putting it to max together with the printer speeds for any material I print with. I actually tweaked it with the flow settings under material, and I think Jonathan has actually meant to do this. I have tweaked my main filaments with the max flow they are capable to print with. BUT that setting has a extreme GEEK factor, surely not understandable for new users. 

So, for me, the speed settings are belonging to the Material tab actually and not the Printer or Style tab. Already 3 different points of view! That can't be good!

I think that we have a dispute about how KS should be organised between experienced users of Kisslicer. But only if Jonathan is willing to listen and is willing to implement good ideas, as long they are matching his opinion as well. 

I think Kisslicer is ready to get a makeover, to make it more logical, and more important, KISS again.

Bart

[Davide Ardizzoia]

I apologize for being rude, but geeez, Frozen you have to warm a bit (maybe on one Italian sunny beach).

About fishmerman bragging ("...got a fish larger than yours"): have you ever printed a truck engine cooling fan as a single piece ?
Have you ever printed a racing car air intake ?
Not toys but real working ones (yes, the fan was tested on a real running engine).

:-)

Oh, and if you want to explore the dark side of the Force...


Best Regards
Davide Ardizzoia

[funBart]

Gentleman! Don't let the Dark Internet winning! Act like you are standing next to each other in the pub having a beer together.

I already explained you are both beyond each doubt regarding any size of your Printer or other body-part!

SmallBeerBart

[frozen...@yahoo.com]

"You probably keep printing same item tipology and you are happy with it."

That's what pushed my button.

[Davide Ardizzoia]

If the pub is in my timezone (CET) maybe we could consider it.
If you happen to land at MXP, then I will bring you to several pubs :-)

Best Regards
Davide Ardizzoia

[funBart]

I'm in the same timezone, so count me in ;-)

Now we all have had a beer: I'm curious about your both -and others- reaction about this part I wrote:

For example: about the speed slider Davide mentioned: I'm actually never use it anymore, because it says nothing. I'm just putting it to max together with the printer speeds for any material I print with. I actually tweaked it with the flow settings under material, and I think Jonathan has actually meant to do this. I have tweaked my main filaments with the max flow they are capable to print with. BUT that setting has a extreme GEEK factor, surely not understandable for new users. 

So, for me, the speed settings are belonging to the Material tab actually and not the Printer or Style tab. Already 3 different points of view! That can't be good!

I think that we have a dispute about how KS should be organised between experienced users of Kisslicer. But only if Jonathan is willing to listen and is willing to implement good ideas, as long they are matching his opinion as well. 

I think Kisslicer is ready to get a makeover, to make it more logical, and more important, KISS again.

Bart

[Davide Ardizzoia]

The point is: is it kosher to print high quality and low quality at the same speed ?
Unless you have a material profile that is set up for raw printing (high temperature, high flow) and another one for laser-sharp prints (low flow, lowest possible temperature), I am quite puzzled.

Best Regards
Davide Ardizzoia


 

[lonesock (Jonathan)]

Hi, all!

Programmer of the current User Interface here: YES, this can be a total pain!  Sorry!

I am working on some bug killing, at the moment, but there are a lot of user interface things that need to change, and I have a list.  (Also, every single user of KISSlicer has a list, maybe unpublished, but they have a list.  Because, let's face it, the KISSlicer UI is only mildly better than throwing rocks at the settings...ok, dumb metaphor.  [8^)

So, the plan was:

• feature freeze (for the 1.5 release) - check
• kill known bugs - at least one bug left
• post version 1.5 Beta 1 publicly on the website - was done until Bart found yet another bug [8^)
• While people play with Beta 1, work on documentation
• NOTE: Davide has done a bunch of this!  Davide, may I hijack your work, add some, remove some, and make this the official documentation?  It is already awesome!  I just hope to add some "what was the developer thinking?" insights.  Sorry to hijack this thread, I will post soon on the documentation thread you already started.
• Post beta Docs
• Ask for updated translations (both for KISSlicer itself, and maybe the documentation?  That's a bunch of work, though!)
• Work on user interface
• Fix any bugs found to date in Beta 1
• Release version 1.5 Beta 2
• Work on updating the website and getting an official forum back
• Fix any Beta 2 bugs, and finalize documentation
• Post version 1.5 release, official documentation, and translations, with a live official forum

That was / is the plan.  However, since a huge chunk of the documentation is done, I will be able to switch to the User Interface sooner.  I am a bit worried, since moving things around will impact already-saved profiles.  This isn't as trivial a change as just moving a setting around...it might break working profiles that are brought forward from previous versions of KISSlicer.  Given the current state of the UI, though, it needs to happen...I just will be putting a lot of thought into the changes.

Anyway, sorry to ramble on.  Thanks for the suggestions, guys...I do really appreciate them!

Jonathan

[Davide Ardizzoia]

Jonathan, do whatever you want with my text!
If you don't have time, just throw me your ideas and I will take care to update the manual.
Funbart has the sources, too: feel free to do whatever you want.
Let me know how I can help... if I had more time, would use Scribus to lay down professional looking book.

Best Regards
Davide Ardizzoia

[Jesper Lindeberg]

Looks good to me. :-) I do however have one feature/bug. First the new seam/gap setting is awesome, but it doesn't make much sense to always put the seam on a corner. So please fix it to be on at strait line/side or make a checkbox to switch behavior.

As for translation - I would love to help with danish translation for both interface and manual.

Thanks for the good work.

Jesper

[max72]

Just posting a possible (untested) workaround...

You can have multiple printers..what about having as many identical printers as you need, with the same specs, with the only exeption of speed? 

Multiple material could still be a problem, but while waiting for full GUI revamp, that will cause mayhem and pain, it could be a possible solution.

By the way: I'm in for a beer!

Massimo