a proposal

[Randall Holmes]

This is concrete enough to be Proposed.

I hereby officially suggest the introduction of an infix -zie-

which can be used to merge PA class operators with 

A-zie-B meaning roughly A-and then-B or proceeding from A to B

then replacing each of the compound location operators with

a -zie- form

that is, vuva would be replaced by vuzieva

The rationale has been discussed:  it is part of the general program

of eliminating structure word breaks.

vu, va preda really cannot be construed as meaning the same thing as

vuva preda

This will involve a modest amount of dictionary work.

It also theoretically creates more words, but we dont need to enter any of these into the dictionary unless people start uttering them.

--
Sincerely, Randall Holmes

Any opinions expressed above are not the
official opinions of any person or institution.

[Randall Holmes]

I am comfortable with both of John's remarks.  Proposal 11 certainly can use additional discussion,

and it is already noted that Proposal 7 modifies Proposal 4.  John, if you write a modified text for a unified

proposal, I will remove the old proposals and add the new one with some informative number.

On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 12:02 PM, John Cowan <co...@mercury.ccil.org> wrote:

Randall Holmes scripsit:

> I hereby officially suggest the introduction of an infix -zie- which
> can be used to merge PA class operators with A-zie-B meaning roughly
> A-and then-B or proceeding from A to B

I'd like to explore this further to see if it can be usefully
generalized before we decide on it.

> Proposal 4:  (John Cowan)  Eliminate w as a Loglan vowel.  Added point
> by Randall Holmes:  we still need a  letteral correlated with this
> symbol: Cowan proposes VAO.  Additional related suggestion (proposal
> 4b?) :  similarly eliminate q as a Loglan consonant and introduce
> a letteral word KOI.  For q, Cowan also suggests introduction of an
> alternative pronunciation as an alternative.

[snip]

> Proposal 7 (John Cowan):  Currently GAO is highly restricted: it
> can only be followed by a Ceo or Vfi little word to form a Greek
> uppercase letter.  I propose that it be generalized to allow any
> (morphological) word to follow, thus making the set of letterals
> unbounded.  The meanings of each would be assigned by convention.

I think we should consider these as a single unified proposal.

--
John Cowan <co...@ccil.org>             http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
Today an interactive brochure website, tomorrow a global content
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the box" thinking and formulate key objectives into a win-win game plan
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all-around initiative to drive up the bottom-line. --Alex Papadimoulis

[John Cowan]

Randall Holmes scripsit:

> I am comfortable with both of John's remarks. Proposal 11 certainly can

> John, if you write a modified text for a unified proposal, I will remove
> the old proposals and add the new one with some informative number.

Okay.

(a) The sounds of "x", "q", and "w" to be removed from Loglan. They are
permitted only in names, and a relatively low-frequency sounds in the
world's languages.

(b) The letter "h" to be allowed with either IPA /h/ (its current sound)
or IPA /x/ (the current sound of "x"). This will make life easier
for Spanish, Russian, and Chinese loglanists, who have /x/ in their
languages but not /h/. (Hindi, English, and Japanese have /h/ only,
German has both, French has neither.)

(c) Extension of "geo". Currently it is permitted only before "Ceo"
and "Vfi" words to make Greek upper case letters. It is to be permitted
before any phonological word to make a new word of nurcmapua TAI.

(d) Specific new words of TAI to be added to the dictionary: "geohei" =
x, "geohai" = X, "geokei" = q, "geokai" = Q, "geovei" = w, "geovai" = W,
"geo,alef" = א (Hebrew letter alef). These replace "xei", "xai", "qei",
"qai", "wsi", "wma", and nothing respectively.

Note: The current published PEG grammar does not handle "geo".

--
John Cowan co...@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan
Female celebrity stalker, on a hot morning in Cairo:
"Imagine, Colonel Lawrence, ninety-two already!"
El Auruns's reply: "Many happy returns of the day!"

[John Cowan]

John Cowan scripsit:

> and a relatively low-frequency sounds in the
> world's languages.

For "and a" read "and are".

--
There is no real going back. Though I John Cowan
may come to the Shire, it will not seem co...@ccil.org
the same; for I shall not be the same. http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
I am wounded with knife, sting, and tooth,
and a long burden. Where shall I find rest? --Frodo

[Randall Holmes]

Indeed it does not.  In general, the currently published PEG grammar doesn't handle any letter issues

except the use of TAI letterals as variables (and LII forms).  This is something I will sit down and deal with.

There are no acronyms, for example.

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[John Cowan]

Randall Holmes scripsit:

> In general, the currently published PEG grammar doesn't handle any
> letter issues except the use of TAI letterals as variables (and
> LII forms).

Even as a letteral, "geo" is not handled; this is a simple matter of
adding "'geo'?" to two of the alternatives in the TAI0 rule.

> There are no acronyms, for example.

The current state is known to be unsatisfactory (per Appendix H) and I'll
have some proposals for that if ZAO passes.

--
They do not preach John Cowan
that their God will rouse them co...@ccil.org
A little before the nuts work loose. http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
They do not teach
that His Pity allows them --Rudyard Kipling,
to drop their job when they damn-well choose. "The Sons of Martha"

[Randall Holmes]

Mea culpa

In proposal 7 as originally written you talked about GAO, here about GEO

Which of these do you intend?  Or both?  (to form upper case and lower case forms?)

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[John Cowan]

Randall Holmes scripsit:

> In proposal 7 as originally written you talked about GAO, here about
> GEO Which of these do you intend? Or both? (to form upper case and
> lower case forms?)

"geo" was a typo for "gao"; please fix the proposal. Currently "geo" is the
Greek letter lower case gamma (γ); I am not proposing any change to that.

--
John Cowan co...@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan

The present impossibility of giving a scientific explanation is no proof
that there is no scientific explanation. The unexplained is not to be
identified with the unexplainable, and the strange and extraordinary
nature of a fact is not a justification for attributing it to powers
above nature. --The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. "telepathy" (1913)