An awkward hand for KSU

[chuck and teril swart]

suppose you hold

Ax,xxx,Axxx,AKxx

you open 1c as recommended in the introduction to section B and the auction goes

1c (1H) dble (P)

your bid?

It seems that you must bid 1NT without a heart stop.

Notice that opening 1d doesn't solve the problem (in KSU) since according to B-25 a 2c rebid by opener would be forcing.

[Christopher Monsour]

It's 1N or 2D.

---

From: kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com <kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of chuck and teril swart <chuckte...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 12:56 AM
To: kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com <kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: An awkward hand for KSU

 

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[doug...@aol.com]

There nothing wrong with a forcing 2C (if you opened 1D). The hand = 16.2 KR points, which is sufficient. Partner's Neg Dbl implied a playable spot. You can play a part score in D (possibly a 4-3) or C (should be at least 4-4).

That said, I'd have opened 1C. The choices now are 1N or 2D. I'd choose the latter, as everything about the hand suggests suit play.

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[judyorcarl]

The problem is not specific to KSU.  It is part of the penalty for playing unlimited negative doubles.  In Paleolithic Roth-Stone, the double was limited and carried no shape information. Also, opener's 1NT rebid was not taken seriously. So there was no problem.  They were willing to pay off if 1NT was a silly contract.  But the limited responder could escape.

Here, the best agreement is that 1NT carry no suggestion of stopper in the overcalled suit.  I believe you cannot compromise on the badness message of rebidding the opened minor.

Carl

[David Morgan]

On 4/04/2022 10:58 pm, 'judyorcarl' via The Kaplan-Sheinwold Bidding System wrote:

Here, the best agreement is that 1NT carry no suggestion of stopper in the overcalled suit.  I believe you cannot compromise on the badness message of rebidding the opened minor.

Carl

In Australia, with the proliferation of transfer responses to 1C, expert practice is to play that opener's 1N rebid just shows a BAL hand with no promise of a stopper.  The argument is that:

• we want overcaller rather than advancer on lead;
• whichever partner has the stopper it is appropriately positioned with opener as declarer;
• there is lots of room between 1N and 3N to find out if one of us has a stopper; and
• two-way or transfer checkback still applies.

Adopting the same practice in KSU seems sensible to me.  I'd argue the same is true for transfer responses to 1C as well,

David 

[Fred.]

Per KSU B-25, auctions are "exactly as if a major had been bid"  (I take this to be

as if the auction had gone 1m-(pass)-1M) but with an exception for opener 

rebidding 1M on 3 trump and no stop in the overcall suit.  Thus, opener's rebid is

1NT despite the lack of a heart stop.  2D  from opener would be forcing and 

opener would be stuck if responder bid 3C.  The partnership is unlikely to play

in diamonds if opener rebids 2D, since responder's 3D rebid would be strong.

Since holding 34xx with no heart stop, opener would have rebid 1S, opener 

must either have a 4-card club suit or a heart stop for the 1NT rebid.  Lacking

a heart stop, responder can rebid 2C (4+ trump, constructive) in this context),

or 3C (4+ trump, forcing).  Because opener has denied 5+ spades, 2D

cannot have its normal KSU meaning, and I am going to suggest 4+

diamonds, forcing in its place.

Fred.

On Monday, April 4, 2022 at 1:56:23 AM UTC-4 chuck swart wrote: