1s - 2h

[jerome keslin]

Hi Adam,

I was looking at HTPWB and I read that all new suit responses at the 2 level,  after a major suit opening, showed opening+ hands. However if responder repeated his suit then this was non-forcing.

Do you know why , in KSU, the meaning of the 2h response was changed to 9+?

[Adam Wildavsky]

I don't know. I've had good results using the KSU treatment.

Can you post a copy of the HTPWB page? I'm far away from my copy.

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[jerome keslin]

On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 2:35 AM Adam Wildavsky <ad...@tameware.com> wrote:

I don't know. I've had good results using the KSU treatment.

Can you post a copy of the HTPWB page? I'm far away from my copy.

On Thu, May 02, 2024 at 1:46 AM, jerome keslin <jet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Adam,

I was looking at HTPWB and I read that all new suit responses at the 2 level,  after a major suit opening, showed opening+ hands. However if responder repeated his suit then this was non-forcing.

Do you know why , in KSU, the meaning of the 2h response was changed to 9+?

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[Ronald Kalf]

As we changed from HTPWB to KSU (must have been 1975/76), we assumed because of emphasizing the majors. After all 1S-1N; 2m-2H is awfully wide-ranged if playing 2/1 as (near) gameforcing. We only had the BW-article where AFAIR no reason was given. The team decided to play strictly KSU, but I wasn’t convinced about this part of it.

[Adam Wildavsky]

Great quality - thanks!

I don't think it's a significant difference. The examples show hands with 10 HCP, but AKQxxx and out would surely qualify. KSU was intended as a refresher for Edgar's partners, not a textbook.

On Fri, May 03, 2024 at 12:21 AM, jerome keslin <jet...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 2:35 AM Adam Wildavsky <adam@tameware.com> wrote:

I don't know. I've had good results using the KSU treatment.

Can you post a copy of the HTPWB page? I'm far away from my copy.

On Thu, May 02, 2024 at 1:46 AM, jerome keslin <jetkro@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Adam,

I was looking at HTPWB and I read that all new suit responses at the 2 level,  after a major suit opening, showed opening+ hands. However if responder repeated his suit then this was non-forcing.

Do you know why , in KSU, the meaning of the 2h response was changed to 9+?

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[Christopher Monsour]

2H doesn't promise rebid in KSU, so it's pretty different.  Also, responder's 2N rebid is nonforcing as 1S-2H-2S.

So

1S-2H-2S-P

1S-2H-3H-P

1S-2H-2S-2N-P

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From: kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com <kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Adam Wildavsky <ad...@tameware.com>
Sent: Friday, May 3, 2024 6:40:43 AM
To: kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com <kaplan-s...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: 1s - 2h

 

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[Christopher Monsour]

... are auctions that can happen in KSU but not in the book

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From: Christopher Monsour <cmon...@msn.com>
Sent: Friday, May 3, 2024 6:56:05 AM

[Carl WEISMAN]

The change was made in the second book. Alan Truscott remarked on it in his New York Times column. He said something like they found that too often they were declaring a 5-2 in spades instead of a 5-3 in hearts.

Carl

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[Adam Wildavsky]

Thanks, Carl – most enlightening!

On Sat, May 04, 2024 at 4:51 PM, Carl WEISMAN <judyo...@verizon.net> wrote:

The change was made in the second book. Alan Truscott remarked on it in his New York Times column. He said something like they found that too often they were declaring a 5-2 in spades instead of a 5-3 in hearts.

Carl

On May 2, 2024, at 2:46 AM, jerome keslin <jetkro@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Adam,

I was looking at HTPWB and I read that all new suit responses at the 2 level,  after a major suit opening, showed opening+ hands. However if responder repeated his suit then this was non-forcing.

Do you know why , in KSU, the meaning of the 2h response was changed to 9+?

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[flemnevershowered]

I'd like to point out that the responding hand on p. 74 of HTPWB is a 13.5 on K&R. Almost everyone today would open it and respond a full-throated 2/1 ending up in 4H.

On Sunday, May 5, 2024 at 7:36:00 AM UTC-6 Adam Wildavsky wrote:

Thanks, Carl – most enlightening!

On Sat, May 04, 2024 at 4:51 PM, Carl WEISMAN <judyo...@verizon.net> wrote:

The change was made in the second book. Alan Truscott remarked on it in his New York Times column. He said something like they found that too often they were declaring a 5-2 in spades instead of a 5-3 in hearts.

Carl

On May 2, 2024, at 2:46 AM, jerome keslin <jet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Adam,

I was looking at HTPWB and I read that all new suit responses at the 2 level,  after a major suit opening, showed opening+ hands. However if responder repeated his suit then this was non-forcing.

Do you know why , in KSU, the meaning of the 2h response was changed to 9+?

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[jerome keslin]

Sorry if I misunderstood you, but are you saying that you wish to be in 4 hearts in the pair of hands shown at the bottom of page 74?

On page 72 of HTPWB,after opening a major, if responder bids a new suit at the 2 level, then this will be game forcing only if 1 of the partners bids NT or supports each other's suit subsequently.

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[flemnevershowered]

I'm just saying that almost everyone these days would end in 4H (and probably feel OK about being there, especially at IMPs) -- which, obviously, will require a very favorable layout. OTOH, If the opening hand is A instead of KQ of S, or any one of several still-minimum "without a fit" hands, e.g. JXXXX KT AKx Jxx....  I can't find my copy of SWTWB -- this is troubling -- but I note that in TK-SSOWB, Sheinwold says of the 1S-2H auction "If responder has a hand worth 13 points or more for his 2H bid, he will not pass a minimum rebid by opener, and will usually force with a new suit...He must, of course, avoid merely repeating his hearts." I view the SWTWB layout as unlucky