A.I.'s actual response to Verne's possible 'satirisation' of Nathaniel Hawthorne

[John Lamb]

I thought I would open up a new thread and see if A.I. could provide an answer to the possible satirisation of Nathaniel Hawthorne mentioned in the previous thread, to my amazement it did.

Analyse the two passages below for content and sentence structure. Given the context of both the writings of the authors Jules Verne and Nathaniel Hawthorne, together with their common lived experiences in the United Kingdom, assess the probability that Verne is satirising Hawthorne. 

  Yesterday afternoon J and I went to Birkenhead Park, which I have already described. It so happened there was a large school spending its holiday there; a school of girls of  the lower classes, to the number of a hundred and fifty, who disported themselves on the green under the direction of the schoolmistress and of an old gentleman. It struck me,  as it always has, to observe how the lower orders of this country indicate their birth and station by their aspect and features. In America there would be a good deal of grace  and beauty among a hundred and fifty children and budding girls, belonging to whatever rank of life. But here they had most universally a plebian look, - stubbed, sturdy  figures, round, coarse faces, snub-noses, - the most evident specimens of the brown bread of human nature. They looked wholesome and good enough, and fit to sustain their rough share of life, but it would have been impossible to make a lady out of any one of them. Climate, no doubt, has much to do with diffusing a slender elegance over

 American young womanhood; but something perhaps is also due to the circumstances of classes not being kept apart as they are here.

Nathaniel Hawthorne English Notebooks (1853). 

 At this time the park was crowded. From the tower it looked like an immense basket of flowers. The people were crowding in, grown men and young folks, none of those  little fops which are the shame of the great cities of Europe, but strong well-built adults. Women and girls, most of them in pale straw-coloured dresses, the hue preferred  in the torrid zone, leading little lap dogs in silk coats with chains laced with gold. Here and there these people were following the sandy paths, capriciously winding  among the lawns. Some were reclining on the cushions of electric cars, others were seated on benches sheltered by the trees. Farther off young gentlemen were playing tennis, and cricket, and golf, and also polo, mounted on spirited ponies. Groups of children – American children of astonishing exuberance, among whom originality is so precocious, particularly in the case of the girls – were playing on the grass. Great rejoicings took place in the park, where the sporting events were brought off with  great enthusiasm. The different classes associated together.

Jules Verne The Floating Island 1895. 

Here was the reply of Google Gemini with my comments (for and against) afterwards and the same question put to Grok later. 

[John Lamb]

 

Here is Google Gemini’s answer.

 

Let's break down these two passages and consider the possibility of satire.

Analysis of Content and Sentence Structure

Nathaniel Hawthorne - English Notebooks (1853)

• Content: Hawthorne describes an encounter with 150 schoolgirls of the "lower classes" in Birkenhead Park. His observations are rooted in a clear class-based perspective, remarking on their "plebian look" and contrasting them with American children, whom he believes would exhibit "grace and beauty" regardless of social standing. He attributes these differences to both climate and the segregation of classes in England compared to America.
• Sentence Structure: The passage features relatively long and complex sentences, employing semicolons and parenthetical phrases to elaborate on his observations and reflections. There's a deliberate, almost academic tone, characteristic of a personal journal or observational writing. The language is rich with descriptive adjectives and somewhat formal vocabulary ("disported themselves," "plebian," "stubbed," "diffusing"). The structure allows for nuanced observations and the development of his comparative analysis between English and American society.

Jules Verne - The Floating Island (1895)

• Content: Verne describes a crowded park scene, focusing on the vibrancy and health of "grown men and young folks." He explicitly contrasts them with "little fops" of European cities, highlighting "strong well-built adults." The women and girls wear "pale straw-coloured dresses" and lead "little lap dogs in silk coats with chains laced with gold." Children are described as "American children of astonishing exuberance," particularly the girls. A key point is the emphasis on "the different classes associated together."
• Sentence Structure: Verne’s sentences are also quite descriptive, though perhaps slightly less formal than Hawthorne's. He uses evocative imagery ("immense basket of flowers," "capriciously winding") and lists activities ("playing tennis, and cricket, and golf, and also polo"). The structure builds a picture of an idyllic, harmonious park scene where different activities and social groups blend. The declarative statement "The different classes associated together" serves as a direct counterpoint to class segregation.

Assessment of Satire

To assess the probability of Verne satirizing Hawthorne, we need to consider several factors:

1. Direct Similarities and Contrasts:
   • Setting: Both passages describe a park teeming with people, including children and young women.
   • Observation of People/Classes: Both authors focus on observing the social classes and physical characteristics of the people in the park.
   • National Comparison (Implicit/Explicit): Hawthorne explicitly compares English lower-class girls negatively to American children. Verne, while not explicitly naming England, highlights "American children of astonishing exuberance" and the association of "different classes together," which directly challenges Hawthorne's observations about class segregation and the lack of grace in English lower classes.
   • Physical Descriptions: Hawthorne describes "plebian look, - stubbed, sturdy figures, round, coarse faces, snub-noses." Verne, in stark contrast, describes "strong well-built adults" and "American children of astonishing exuberance, among whom originality is so precocious, particularly in the case of the girls."
2. Authors' Lived Experiences in the UK:
   • Nathaniel Hawthorne: Hawthorne served as the US Consul in Liverpool from 1853 to 1857. His "English Notebooks" are indeed his personal observations during this period. He was known for his critical, often judgmental, observations of English society, particularly regarding class distinctions and their impact on physical appearance and demeanor. He often viewed England through an American lens, highlighting perceived differences.
   • Jules Verne: Verne did visit England, notably Liverpool, at various times. His most significant encounter was in 1859 while travelling to Scotland, where he visited Merseyside, including Birkenhead Park. This means he would have been to the exact same park Hawthorne describes. It's highly probable he would have been aware of or even read Hawthorne's popular "English Notebooks" given his own interest in travel and international settings.
3. Timing: Hawthorne's observations were published in 1853 (though the notebooks were published posthumously in 1870). Verne's The Floating Island was published in 1895. This significant time gap (over 40 years) means Verne would have had ample opportunity to read Hawthorne's work and reflect on it.

 

 

Conclusion on the Probability of Satire

Given these points, the probability that Jules Verne is satirizing Nathaniel Hawthorne is remarkably high.

Here's why:

• Direct Contrasting Descriptions: Verne's passage reads almost like a direct rebuttal to Hawthorne's. Where Hawthorne sees "plebian," "stubbed," "coarse" English girls and laments class segregation, Verne depicts "strong well-built adults," "astonishing exuberance" in American children (especially girls), and explicitly states that "the different classes associated together."
• Shared Location: The fact that Verne describes the same Birkenhead Park, a place he personally visited and where Hawthorne made his critical observations, strengthens the case. It creates a direct, almost scene-for-scene comparison.
• American Idealization: Verne's depiction of the American children and the harmonious mingling of classes aligns with a more idealized, progressive vision that directly contradicts Hawthorne's rather snobbish and class-conscious assessment. The "astonishing exuberance" and "precocious originality" of American girls are a direct counterpoint to Hawthorne's belief that English lower-class girls couldn't be made into "a lady."
• Verne's Style: While not always overtly satirical, Verne often used his travelogues and adventure stories to comment on society, progress, and national characteristics. A subtle literary jab at a well-known contemporary's observations about a shared travel destination fits his intellectual and observational approach.

It appears Verne leveraged a familiar setting and theme (the comparison of national characteristics and social harmony) to subtly challenge, and perhaps even mock, Hawthorne's rather elitist and geographically biased observations from decades prior. It's a clever literary device, using the contrasting ideals of American society (as he depicts it) against Hawthorne's somewhat melancholic and critical view of English class structure.

 

 

Here is Grok’s answer.

 

High probability (around 70-80%) that Jules Verne is deliberately satirizing or at least pointedly contrasting Nathaniel Hawthorne's observations.

Content Analysis

Hawthorne (1853, English Notebooks):

• Focuses on lower-class English schoolgirls in Birkenhead Park.
• Highly class-conscious and physiognomic: describes them as having a "plebeian look" — "stubbed, sturdy figures, round, coarse faces, snub-noses" — the "brown bread of human nature."
• Contrasts this unfavorably with American children/girls, who possess "grace and beauty" across ranks.
• Attributes differences to climate (favoring slender American elegance) and rigid British class separation.
• Tone is observational but judgmental, with a Romantic/American exceptionalist undercurrent. Hawthorne (who lived in England as U.S. consul in Liverpool, 1853–1857) often critiqued English society’s rigidity, aristocracy, and perceived coarseness of the lower orders while idealizing American vitality.

Verne (1895, The Floating Island / Propeller Island):

• Describes a utopian, artificial floating city’s park (explicitly modeled on Birkenhead Park and its surroundings, per historical analyses of Verne’s Wirral inspirations).
• Portrays a harmonious, wealthy, cosmopolitan crowd: strong adults (no "little fops" of European cities), elegant women with lap dogs, sports (tennis, cricket, golf, polo), and especially "American children of astonishing exuberance... originality is so precocious, particularly in the case of the girls."
• Emphasizes class mixing: "The different classes associated together."
• Tone is celebratory and futuristic, typical of Verne’s optimistic techno-utopianism, but with ironic edges (the island is inhabited by millionaires and has satirical elements about wealth and society).

Key Parallels and Inversions:

• Both scenes are set in the same park (Birkenhead → idealized in the floating Milliard City).
• Hawthorne laments the coarseness of lower-class English and praises American grace/exuberance.
• Verne inverts this: highlights elegant, mixed-class society with American children as the epitome of exuberance and precocious originality (echoing Hawthorne’s praise but transplanting it into a perfected, class-fluid environment).
• Hawthorne sees rigid classes as producing "plebeian" stock; Verne shows classes associating freely in a high-tech paradise.
• Verne’s description reads like a deliberate antidote or mockery of Hawthorne’s gloomier, class-bound English observations.

Sentence Structure Analysis

Hawthorne:

• Long, meandering, essayistic sentences with qualifications and asides ("It struck me, as it always has...", "Climate, no doubt... but something perhaps...").
• Dense, reflective prose — typical of his notebooks: personal, moralizing, with Romantic introspection.
• Heavy use of lists for physical description ("stubbed, sturdy figures, round, coarse faces, snub-noses").

Verne:

• More dynamic, panoramic, and list-like in activities ("playing tennis, and cricket, and golf, and also polo").
• Clear, vivid, almost cinematic descriptions — characteristic of his adventure style: broad strokes painting an ideal scene.
• Slightly more formal/ornate in translation, but efficient and enthusiastic compared to Hawthorne’s contemplative density.

The structures differ as expected (notebook vs. novel), but Verne’s park scene feels like a stylized, exaggerated response — turning Hawthorne’s grounded, critical realism into utopian spectacle.

Contextual Probability of Satire

• Shared UK experiences: Hawthorne lived in/near Liverpool (Birkenhead is across the Mersey) and wrote extensively about English life. Verne visited Britain, was influenced by English engineering (e.g., Great Eastern ship), and researched locations like Birkenhead for his novels.
• Verne was well-read in Anglo-American literature and often incorporated real places and subtle cultural commentary. His works frequently satirize European snobbery, American energy, and wealth.
• Direct scholarly/local historical links exist connecting Verne’s Birkenhead-inspired scenes to Hawthorne’s notebooks, with suggestions of deliberate contrast or satire.
• Timing: Hawthorne’s notebooks were published posthumously (1870s); by 1895, they were available. Verne’s novel fits his pattern of playful intertextuality.

Not conclusive proof (no explicit letter or statement from Verne saying "I’m mocking Hawthorne"), but the inversion is too precise — same location, same themes (class, Americans, English character), reversed valence — to be coincidental. It’s classic Verne: using a real English critique as springboard for a French-engineered utopian rebuttal. This is gentle satire via idealization rather than vicious parody.

 

 

My comments. Gemini

 

There is no evidence that I know of that Verne visited Birkenhead Park. This could be something new uncovered by Google Gemini, or Google Gemini hallucinating. Either way it is still useful in either discovering new information or downgrading the conclusion. The other analysis is way better than I could ever come up with because I am not a literary scholar.

My comments. Gemini.

 'Describes a utopian, artificial floating city’s park (explicitly modeled on Birkenhead Park and its surroundings, per historical analyses of Verne’s Wirral inspirations)'.

 This is throwing my own research claims back at me. So, does it totally invalidate the conclusion reached by Grok or can we still learn from it?

Hawthorne lived in Birkenhead not Liverpool between 1853 and 1855.

 Does it strengthen or weaken my theory?

 Will a change in emphasis of the question yield a more definitive result?

 What type of answer will be produced in future if we can filter out my own ‘contamination’

 These are just some thoughts. 

Best John

[Ana Klimchynskaya]

No, seriously, though, why do you care about what AI has to say? If I don't have someone to discuss a question I'm curious with, yes, I could go ask AI. Or a parrot. or a Magic 8 ball. Why do you believe AI spits out anything meaningful? 

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[John Lamb]

It is a relatively new research tool, that is all. Just the same way Google Books was a relatively new tool ten years ago but has been a massive boon (as more books go online) to me in tracing hereto unknown patterns in both history and literature, whether it be the influence of Poe's The Gold Bug on The Mysterious Island, the predominance of Birkenhead in supplying a disproportionate amount of Verne's ships and so on.    

I am bemused as to  why you are asking the question 'Why do you believe AI spits out anything meaningful?'.... I have tried to answer that in the posting above and previous postings, while your comparison of A.I. to a parrot or Magic 8 ball suggests you are a bit of a luddite.

It would be great if you could give an opinion regarding Verne and Hawthorne rather than an opinion of me. 

 

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[Tad Davis]

I have to admit that I use AI four or five times a day, but only ever to gather data. I would never ask it for an opinion. In fact I had to tell one service to stop telling me how brilliant and insightful I was.

 

There's an economic reason behind that. The more it can engage you in followup, the closer you get to having to pay for it (or pay more).

— 
Tad Davis
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[Ana Klimchynskaya]

You're right! I am a luddite! In the original sense of the word: luddites weren't backwards people who were scared of fire and anything new, but rather, were concerned about the devastating effects of a new technology, which left them in abject poverty, destroyed their communities, and destroyed their environment. 

You understand how AI works, yes? It makes things up. It hallucinates. You cannot trust anything it says. It doesn't think. It doesn't know what plagiarism or inspiration or literature is. It's a stochastic parrot that predicts what is the most likely word to follow the word it just spat out. Hence my comparison to a parrot, because that's literally what AI is. It's a stochastic parrot, which, since you're so interested in technology, you may be interested to read about. I despite AI precisely because I understand exactly how it works, and I believe it has very little of actual value to offer. No amount of you quoting what AI said at me is going to convince me of its value, because no matter how confident it sounds, I know it can't be trusted to say anything meaningful. 

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[John Lamb]

Dear Tad, thank you for your reply. Agreed and I respect your view that you would not ask A.I. for an opinion.

       Dear Ana. 

I was merely using A.I. as an additional tool to see if it conjoured up anything new to support or otherwise  my 51 pages of contextual research notes already written and posted re Verne's The Floating Island (this was 51 pages of contextual notes already written either side of the Hawthorne / Verne quotes).  I explained in my post how A.I threw up a possible link worth following but also threw up some of my own research back at me. It was an interesting 84 seconds of my life which gave a small chance of a new lead to support the hundred hours or more of my research into the Floating Island and so has a small chance of being productive. It in part supported strongly a link between Verne and Hawthorne but in part undermined it. I found it quite fascinating. That is my experience...yours may be different.  Best John

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[Tad Davis]

One of the problems with AI detection: it scans for things like colons and em dashes—things I use all the time, because they mirror how I talk. And semicolons too; I've used them liberally in my prose since early high school days—for the same reason.

 

Tad

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[Ana Klimchynskaya]

Indeed. As I've pointed out, many AI detection tools will tell you that Frankenstein (1818) was "most likely written by AI." What nonsense. 

And then querying those dozens of AI agents, aren't you concerned about how much precious and limited drinking water it's using up to give you a "small chance" at a "potential lead"? 

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[John Lamb]

Dear Ana

I always answer any question put to me, so no, I am not concerned about the estimated three drops of water that my A.I. search on Verne's possible satirisation of Hawthorne used up in by my two searches (not dozens). 

If Verne is satirising Hawthorne, (and given the context of the attachment I sent you, I know he is), then A.I. gave a potential explanation in a which I found quite valuable. 

The Frankenstein comparison would only be relevant if the A.I. answer regarding Verne potentially satirizing Hawthorne is also 'nonsense'. The Frankenstein example is a 'caveat' but not a weapon to bludgeon an A.I. answer into irrelevance. 

Now I have answered your question can you please answer mine?

1. Did you actually read my 51 page research attachment  linking the whole of Verne's novel 'The Floating Island' to Birkenhead...so contextualizing the Verne / Hawthorne passages?

2. If so, do you now have any further thoughts on the theory that Verne is satirizing Hawthorne? 

On a final point. Jules Verne is one of the most academically studied authors in world history. In any research on the author this means that all our work covers ground probably covered many times before and so is built upon a "small chance" at a "potential lead". The same goes for practically all advances in technology, medicine etc. That is what makes it so exciting, and I am sorry that you believe I should also curtail looking 100% into all avenues for the moral guilt of a few drops of water. 

 best John 

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[Ana Klimchynskaya]

It's a lot more than a few drops of water. I'm sorry that, in all your excitement about AI, you have overlooked considering the numerous and enormous environmental impacts. 

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[John Lamb]

I am not at all 'excited' about A.I. 

I am sorry that in your excitement about considering the environmental impacts, you continue to overlook Jules Verne.

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[mken...@aol.com]

First of all you’d have to find a contemporary French translation of Hawthorne’s text that Verne could have read. Verne could not read English – that’s a well-known fact. And I’m afraid that even if you find such a translation your theory will remain far-fetched, since there are only slight similarities between the two passages.

Cheers,

Matthias

[John Lamb]

Well, he had decades to find a translator if he wanted to get a bit of satire across.   To say that they are 'slight similarities' is your entirely valid but subjective opinion, but I bet in the whole of literature you will not be able to find another passage  by any Victorian author which muses about a park, young American girls, their appearance and the classes either mingling or not mingling. The irony is that if you wanted to prove me wrong (and this is for Ana's ears rather than your own) you would have to use A.I.   My subjective opinion says they are 'striking similarities' and A.I. (for what it is worth) agrees with me. At the end of the day Matthias, my theory is but a tiny part of my attached (in this thread) 51 page article linking Verne's 1895 novel  The Floating Island with Birkenhead. As I stated to Ana, the Hawthorne reference is contained on page 36.  I asked Ana whether she had read it as a contextual document before giving a comment. She declined to answer. So I ask you,  have you also read the 51 page supporting article which contextualizes the Verne quote? Cheers John 

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[mken...@aol.com]

Hi John,

you say «if you wanted to prove me wrong»…

I’ve quoted it before: An esoteric can claim more nonsense in five minutes than a scientist can disprove in his entire lifetime.

«he had decades to find a translator if he wanted to get a bit of satire across»

That’s just lame. I repeat: First of all you’d have to find a contemporary French translation of Hawthorne’s text that Verne could have read.

… Or prove that Verne privately hired translators that translated texts for him… (that he probably never heard of).

Cheers,

Matthias

[Rafael Ontivero]

El 6 jun 2026, a las 17:01, John Lamb <cads...@gmail.com> escribió:

Well, he had decades to find a translator if he wanted to get a bit of satire across.  

John, throughout my nearly 60 years of reading about Verne I have read some stupid, far-fetched, and forced things, but this one is giving me the biggest laugh. Come on, are you saying that Verne, without knowing the paragraph you're talking about beforehand, had it translated just to write a satire? Did it come to him in a dream? As others have already told you, first find a French edition published before Verne's work, because otherwise your thesis completely falls apart, and you should admit it, drop the subject, and move on. There's no shame in being wrong (years ago I wrote a whole article about Phileas Fogg saying that 'Fogg' meant 'fox' in English and from there I developed an entire laughable theory about what Verne was trying to say and, when they made me see I had been holding the dictionary wrong, I had a good laugh, deleted it, and went on with my life).

Incidentally, and based on what you've been saying, I also ran the text you quote through AI, and it also found a bunch of parallels just as you say, but that doesn't mean Verne did it intentionally, not when Occam is lurking around and, most likely, if certain parallels do exist, it's just a case of two people with the same idea in their heads describing it in a similar way.

That being said, I have always read your comments with relish, but with this last email you have lost whatever credibility you might have had. They aren't telling you straight out because they are academics and owe each other a certain respect, but I am a dilettante who couldn't give a flying fig about what they might think of me, my future as a Vernian researcher with an Anís del Mono label for a diploma (you have to be Spanish to understand that expression) and other such mental wankery, and I'm telling you that if you already had little credibility, you have lost it completely. Stop pushing it, because the more you insist, the more ridiculous you look.

--------

John, a lo largo de mis casi 60 años de leer sobre Verne he leído cosas estúpidas, traídas por los pelos y forzadas, pero esta es una de las que más risa me están causando. A ver, ¿estás diciendo que Verne, sin conocer de antemano el párrafo del que hablas, lo haya hecho traducir solo para escribir una sátira? ¿Lo soñó? Como ya te han dicho, primero encuentra una edición en francés publicada antes que lo de Verne, porque si no tu tesis se desmonta por completo, y deberías reconocerlo, cerrar el tema y a otra cosa, mariposa. Que no pasa nada por haberse equivocado (yo hace años escribí un artículo entero sobre Phileas Fogg en el que decía que Fogg era zorro en inglés y de ahí desarrollé toda una teoría risible sobre lo que Verne quería decir y, cuando me hicieron ver que había sujetado el diccionario mal, me eché unas risas, lo borré y seguí con mi vida).

Incidentalmente, y en base a lo que vienes comentando, yo también pasé por la IA el texto que citas, y también me encontró un montón de paralelismos como bien dices, pero eso no quiere decir que Verne lo hiciera intencionadamente, no cuando Occam anda cerca y, lo más probable, de existir ciertos paralelismos, tan solo se trate de dos personas con la misma idea en la cabeza y describiéndola de forma similar.

Dicho esto, siempre he leído tus comentarios con fruición, pero con este último correo has perdido toda la credibilidad que pudieras tener. Ellos no te lo están diciendo claramente porque son académicos y se deben cierto respeto, pero yo soy un dilettante al que le importa una higa lo que puedan pensar de mi, mi futuro como investigador verniano con una etiqueta de Anís del Mono como título (hay que ser español para entender esa expresión) y demás pajerío mental, y te digo que si ya tenías poca credibilidad, la has perdido totalmente. No insistas porque cuanto más insistes, más ridículo haces.

[John Lamb]

Dear Matthias, once again I have to ask you whether  you have read the attached  51 page article contextualizing the Hawthorne Verne quote? Yes or no?  

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[John Lamb]

Dear Rafael, as with Ana and Matthias, I will ask one question. Have you read the 51 page article (attached previously to this thread) contextualizing the Verne Hawthorne quote? Yes or no?  Maybe, one two or even three of you  between yourself Ana and Matthias will have the good grace to tell me whether this is the case or not. If an author wants to write a whole novel in homage to a town (Birkenhead) then it is not in the realms of impossibility for him to obtain a quote (translated or not) from Nathaniel Hawthorne  - the most famous literary resident of that town - American Consul no less).  Now Rafael, have you read the article before your tirade...methinks not. Best wishes John

[mken...@aol.com]

Hi John, I downloaded it, but I don’t feel like reading it yet. It’s possible I’ll never read it. It’s OK and normal if Birkenhead is dear to your heart, but I’m not so interested in it. And it’s possible that there are more far-fetched theories in your article. Frankly, reading it could feel like a waste of time to me. I have to work, I have translations to do, I have lots of books, magazines and journals to read, I have an article to write…
@ Rafael: Maybe there’s more probability to your fox theory than the Lamb theories. Just kidding!? ;) Look here: web.archive.org/web/20231003040445/https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WesternAnimation/AroundTheWorldInEightyDaysBurbankAnimation
And I think I get the mono joke, since I remember the monos in "Gil Braltar" :D
Cheers,
Matthias

[mken...@aol.com]

Second try to upload the picture:

[Rafael Ontivero]

John,

If you are talking about "Why Birkenhead Fascinated Jules Verne” and or "The ‘Mysterious Island’ in Birkenhead

and the Wirral Peninsula”, yes, I’ve read them. And it seems to me that your arguments are highly far-fetched.

Perhaps you are right and everyone else is wrong, but in that case, pushing the issue is counterproductive. Let the publication settle... and be either forgotten or vindicated.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jules-verne-forum/CAJ0ud42ha4s6BZgfPrtEJzMTpybAyzVTe7creDH-LPcYUVKJnA%40mail.gmail.com.

[John Lamb]

Dear Rafael, no it is not the article on Mysterious Island or why Birkenhead? It was included for Ana in the previous thread entitled 'New Verne annotated' and is at the end of the very last posting (starting Dear Volker) and entitled 'Jules Verne sets his novel 'The Floating Island' in Birkenhead.   Verne himself said 'The town I know best in Great Britain is Liverpool and as I stayed there some time with friends, I was able to study the docks and the Mersey'...but of course you knew that.  So all these insults re the Hawthorne Verne link are from three people who have not even read or admit they can be bothered to the read the contextual evidence around the Verne Hawthorne quote. I have repeatedly asked people to read this before commenting.  If you  read the article, the Hawthorne quote is on page 36. Remember Birkenhead built six of Verne's fictional ships,  that Verne's Voyages Extraordinaires start in Birkenhead with the Forward of Captain Hatteras, and that the fuselage of Captain Nemo's  Nautilus is built in Birkenhead. As a resident of Birkenhead, I know that Verne sets 'The Floating Island' in Birkenhead and the some 30 links in Verne's text, and indeed several illustrations are a homage to Birkenhead and the surrounding Wirral Peninsula. That is how I discovered the similarities between the Verne and Hawthorne quotes because there was context, not through some random relationship previously alleged. It is Verne's satirical add on, that is all. Get back to me if you have more good grace than Matthias and are willing to actually read my research before commenting upon it. 

Do not try to intimidate me with highly insulting vocabulary when you have not even read my evidence. It does you no good. No matter how much you disagree with me, keep it civil. I withdrew from the forum last time because of insulting derogatory behaviour...that will not happen again. Best John

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[Ana Klimchynskaya]

John, 

I, too, don't have the time or inclination to read 51 pages in my spare time; most people don't. If you believe your insights are truly worthwhile, by all means, summarize them in a couple of concise but appealing paragraphs. But if your argument is that we need to read 51 pages of your writing to be convinced of the value of AI....nah. I have better uses of my time. 

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