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essay on Verne scientific errors.

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Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 26, 2025, 10:47:58 PMMar 26
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A few years ago, I read an excellent, detailed essay on Verne scientific errors. The essay was signed y someone at MIT.That's all  I remember but I would be very grateful if someone on the forum could give me a lead tom how to fine this nice essay.

Many thanks in advance, Marie-Hélène


 
Marie-Hélène Huet

Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 27, 2025, 9:06:07 AMMar 27
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Sorry for the typos: it was past midnight when I remembered that I wanted to ask the forum. If someone has other articles on the topic (they must be detailed, if possible) I will be very grateful!


 
Marie-Hélène 
From: 'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2025 22:47
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [JVF] essay on Verne scientific errors.
 

A few years ago, I read an excellent, detailed essay on Verne scientific errors. The essay was signed y someone at MIT.That's all  I remember but I would be very grateful if someone on the forum could give me a lead tom how to fine this nice essay.

Many thanks in advance, Marie-Hélène


 
Marie-Hélène Huet

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William Butcher

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Mar 27, 2025, 7:53:20 PMMar 27
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Dear Marie-Hélène,

Here are a few ideas, as regards the moon diptych.

Lafleur, Laurence J., Popular Astronomy, vol. 50, janvier, avril, juin, août et octobre 1942 [les erreurs de Verne].
Lazos, Panagiotis, « Around the Moon : False scientific ideas in the famous book of Jules Verne », Almagest, International journal of the history of scientific ideas, Turnhout, Brepols, vol. 10, no 1, 2019, p. 92-105.
Martin, Charles-Noël, « Les 9 erreurs de Jules Verne ou les jeux de la mécanique céleste », Science et Vie, Magazine mensuel des sciences et de leurs applications à la vie moderne, vol. 115, no 618, 1969, p. 54-59.
——, « Préface », in « De la Terre à la Lune » et « Autour de la Lune », Lausanne, Rencontre, 1966, p. VII-XVIII [article pionnier sur les « prévisions » et les erreurs].

Bien a toi

bill



From: 'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2025 9:06 PM
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.

quentin skrabec

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Mar 27, 2025, 7:57:30 PMMar 27
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i have serveral here is one  Journeying to the Centre of the Earth: The Scientific Accuracy of Jules Verne’s Writing – Retrospect Journal
Astronomy and astronomers in Jules Verne's novels
New worlds of Jules Verne THIS ONE IS FROM MIT
Quent

quentin skrabec

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Mar 27, 2025, 8:00:58 PMMar 27
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Sorry the last one is not from MIT — i missed filed  quent
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Subject: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.
 
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quentin skrabec

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Mar 27, 2025, 8:55:40 PMMar 27
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Here's another article on Verne's scientific errors  epsc-dps2011-195-1.pdf

quentin skrabec

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Mar 27, 2025, 9:00:12 PMMar 27
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here's another from W. Miller     Quent       The Rehabilitation of Jules Verne in America: From Boy’s Author to Adult’s Author — 1960-2003 by Walter James Miller

On Thursday, March 27, 2025 at 8:00:58 PM UTC-4 quentin skrabec wrote:

Ron Miller

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Mar 27, 2025, 9:07:03 PMMar 27
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Dear Marie-Hélène,

Here are a few ideas, as regards the moon diptych.

Lafleur, Laurence J., Popular Astronomy, vol. 50, janvier, avril, juin, août et octobre 1942 [les erreurs de Verne].
Lazos, Panagiotis, « Around the Moon : False scientific ideas in the famous book of Jules Verne », Almagest, International journal of the history of scientific ideas, Turnhout, Brepols, vol. 10, no 1, 2019, p. 92-105.
Martin, Charles-Noël, « Les 9 erreurs de Jules Verne ou les jeux de la mécanique céleste », Science et Vie, Magazine mensuel des sciences et de leurs applications à la vie moderne, vol. 115, no 618, 1969, p. 54-59.
——, « Préface », in « De la Terre à la Lune » et « Autour de la Lune », Lausanne, Rencontre, 1966, p. VII-XVIII [article pionnier sur les « prévisions » et les erreurs].

Bien a toi

bill



From: 'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2025 9:06 PM
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com

Subject: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.
Sorry for the typos: it was past midnight when I remembered that I wanted to ask the forum. If someone has other articles on the topic (they must be detailed, if possible) I will be very grateful!


 
Marie-Hélène 
From: 'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2025 22:47
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [JVF] essay on Verne scientific errors.
 

A few years ago, I read an excellent, detailed essay on Verne scientific errors. The essay was signed y someone at MIT.That's all  I remember but I would be very grateful if someone on the forum could give me a lead tom how to fine this nice essay.

Many thanks in advance, Marie-Hélène


 
Marie-Hélène Huet
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jacques....@laposte.net

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Mar 28, 2025, 6:41:17 AMMar 28
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This topic is discussed from an astronomer's point of view in my web pages

https://www.lesia.obspm.fr/perso/jacques-crovisier/JV/verne_gene.html

https://www.lesia.obspm.fr/perso/jacques-crovisier/JV/verne_gene_eng.html

It is mainly in French, but I believe this is not a problem for Marie-Hélène.

Jacques Crovisier

‌

 

De : "'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum" <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
A : "jules-ve...@googlegroups.com" <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Envoyé: jeudi 27 Mars 2025 03:48
Objet : Re: [JVF] essay on Verne scientific errors.
 
 
A few years ago, I read an excellent, detailed essay on Verne scientific errors. The essay was signed y someone at MIT.That's all  I remember but I would be very grateful if someone on the forum could give me a lead tom how to fine this nice essay.
 
Many thanks in advance, Marie-Hélène
 
 
 
Marie-Hélène Huet

 

--

Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 28, 2025, 9:30:40 AMMar 28
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 Thank you, Jacques. I have come across your work many times and this link will be very helpful!


Marie-Hélène 
From: jacques.crovisier via Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 28, 2025 06:41
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [JVF] essay on Verne scientific errors.
 

Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 28, 2025, 9:49:12 AMMar 28
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Thank you, Bill and Ron, for these references. I knew some of them, but not all, and I see the question has been explored in detail, and from many perspectives!..

Marie-Hélène 

From: 'Ron Miller' via Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2025 21:07
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.
 

Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 28, 2025, 10:03:19 AMMar 28
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Thank you for this, Quentin, and for all the other very helpful responses to my request. This forum is the best Vernian library!... I am not writing on Verne's errors, but I have been asked about them, and I wanted to have a few leads as well as the names of those who already explored the topic. Merci!...


Marie-Hélène
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2025 20:55

To: Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.
 

James D. Keeline

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Mar 28, 2025, 12:04:59 PMMar 28
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A few examples come to mind but I feel certain they have been mentioned in the articles provided.  I haven't had time to obtain and read them.

The survivability of launching an occupied shell from a cannon (even with some vague hand-waving) is one.

Having a microgravity condition only at some "midpoint" between the Earth and the Moon is another.  It might have been hard for him to imagine that a body that is no longer accelerating after it left the cannon and atmosphere (drag) would be in "free fall".  We have the benefit of 60+ years of seeing video from astronauts in orbit.

The calculations in Topsy Turvy would not work, apparently, but I recall that there was an appendix to try to explain why it did not work.  Even then I am not sure about it because the mathematics is complex.

There is obviously no submarine tunnel for the Nautilus to travel through.  But this is probably more of a plot contrivance than an actual error.

James

quentin skrabec

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Mar 28, 2025, 12:14:08 PMMar 28
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Good point James 

Verne sometimes uses doubtful science to drive his story 
This is from one of my papers
"In Journey to the Center of Earth (1865), Verne was forced to knowingly apply the doubted but popular Hollow-Earth theory and Davy/Faraday volcanic theory to make the story work. He also pulls from Von Humbodlt’s geology as well. Journey to the Center of Earth is a geological debate at one level. Verne uses his characters, professor Lidenbrock and his nephew and fellow explorer, Axel, to embed a scientific discussion for the reader. Davy’s hollow earth versus the theory of temperature increase of the molten core theory as they descend is discussed by Axel and Lidenbrock.[i] In The Adventures of Captain Hatteras (1866), Verne references the hollow earth theory.[ii] In 1877, Verne’s Hector Servadac (Off on A Comet) (1877) used the molten core theory to support the story, supplying heat for his voyagers![iii] Again, in his 1877 novel Underground City, Verne endorses the molten core theory to explain coal formation.[iv]  An 1888 essay by Micheal Verne notes the factual data of a temperature increase by known drilling depths. BUT even here, Micheal holds out the possibility of a hollow earth while favoring the molten core theory.[v] Of course, the hollow earth theory requires a different explanation for volcanic eruptions."

[i] Jules Verne, Journey to the Center of Earth, (William Butcher Translation), Oxford Press, 1992, p. 93
[ii] Jules Verne, The Adventures of Captain Hatteras, 1866, Edouard Riou, Editor,  p. 627
[iii] Juels Verne, Hector Servadac (Off on A Comet) 1877, Amazon Kindle Edition, “Chapter A second Enigma” pp. 69-70 and p. 88  Chapter “Winter Quarters
[iv] Jules Verne, The Underground City (1877), Sarah Crozier Translation, Luath Press, 2005, pp. 16-18
[v] Micheal Verne, Worlds Known and Unknown, Zigzags Through the World of Science, pp.257-258

From: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of James D. Keeline <ja...@keeline.com>
Sent: Friday, March 28, 2025 12:04 PM
To: jules-ve...@googlegroups.com <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>

Ron Miller

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Mar 28, 2025, 12:37:28 PMMar 28
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Regarding the feasibility of the cannon...


I've addressed this issue in a couple of articles. In short, I think that Verne was perfectly aware of the impracticality. To than end, he had a character voice all of the objections that would naturally occur to a 19th century reader...and have them answered by a character of authority. The entire episode of launching the animals was to create a sense of verisimilitude. 

That he used a cannon instead of a rocket was, again, an attempt to create something his readers would believe. Given the state of the art of rocketry at the time he was writing, there is not a single reader who would have accepted the premise of a rocket large enough to reach the moon. On the plus side, Verne was perfectly aware of the fact that rockets would work in a vacuum...a fact that eluded even the New York Times in the early part of the 20th century when it criticized Goddard's experiments.


R



On Fri, 28 Mar, 2025 at 12:05 PM, James D. Keeline <ja...@keeline.com> wrote:
 

Garmt de Vries-Uiterweerd

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Mar 28, 2025, 1:09:01 PMMar 28
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To reply to this particular point:

On Fri, 28 Mar 2025 at 17:05, James D. Keeline <ja...@keeline.com> wrote:
The calculations in Topsy Turvy would not work, apparently, but I recall that there was an appendix to try to explain why it did not work.  Even then I am not sure about it because the mathematics is complex.

The calculations done by Maston in the novel are indeed way off, but this was an intentional plot point. The appendix shows the correct calculations, with all the relevant physics neatly described. This is a brilliant little gem, unique in the Voyages extraordinaires.

(Sorry for hijacking the thread...)
Garmt
 

Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 28, 2025, 7:04:59 PMMar 28
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Yes, and the appendix was re-edited recently under the title Le Titan Moderne  There is a great analysis of Badureau's exchanges with Verne as he was writing the novel. See
(It's one of my favorite novels!)
 
Marie-Hélène 
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Sent: Friday, March 28, 2025 13:08
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Subject: Re: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.
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Marie-Hélène Huet

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Mar 28, 2025, 7:05:05 PMMar 28
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Harpold, Terry Alan

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May 5, 2025, 7:57:13 AMMay 5
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Coming in late to this thread. The Jacques Laskar article that Marie-Hélène links to is a review essay on this excellent book –

 

Badoureau, Albert. Le Titan moderne: Notes et observations remises à Jules Verne pour la rédaction de son roman Sans dessus dessous. Actes Sud, 2005.

 

I’m with MHH, Sans dessus dessous is also among my favorites by Verne.

 

Terry Harpold

Associate Professor of English

Director, Imagining Climate Change

Assistant Director, Astraeus Space Institute

 

https://people.clas.ufl.edu/tharpold/

https://imagining-climate.clas.ufl.edu

https://astraeus.ufl.edu

 

Terry Harpold has separate windings for thought, action, and speech.

 

From: 'Marie-Hélène Huet' via Jules Verne Forum <jules-ve...@googlegroups.com>
Date: Friday, March 28, 2025 at 7:05 PM
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Subject: Re: [JVF] Re: essay on Verne scientific errors.

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