Modfiy date taken including time taken

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JAmes

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Jun 21, 2013, 10:32:11 AM6/21/13
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Is there a way to modify not only "date taken" but also time taken, e.g. in the form "yyyy-mm-dd HH:MM:SS".

I managed to do this in the edit window for "Date taken" even with the error message pop-up window,
but only when I select another image after confirmation of pop-up window. But I think this is a bug.

The additional challenge will be to harmonize the correct transfer/sync of "date/time taken" between IMatch and GeoSetter.
Both tools do support also XMP sidecars, but the exact field description is important. I still have to investigate this.

JPhotoTagger writes e.g. the following in the XMP
(here the time 12.12.14 is written inspite of JPT error message):
and GeoSetter e.g. writes this
  •  <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
  •   xmlns:exif='http://ns.adobe.com/exif/1.0/'>
  •   <exif:DateTimeOriginal>2014-11-11T00:00:00+02:00</exif:DateTimeOriginal>
  •  </rdf:Description>

  •  <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
  •   xmlns:photoshop='http://ns.adobe.com/photoshop/1.0/'>
  •   <photoshop:Category>4095</photoshop:Category>
  •   <photoshop:DateCreated>2014-11-11T00:00:00+01:00</photoshop:DateCreated>
  •  </rdf:Description>

  •  <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
  •   xmlns:xmp='http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/'>
  •   <xmp:ModifyDate>2014-11-11T00:00:00+02:00</xmp:ModifyDate>
  •  </rdf:Description>
With IMatch the read out from XMP sidecars is ok and flexible, but automatic writing is a challenge.

Regards, James

Elmar Baumann

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Jun 21, 2013, 5:00:36 PM6/21/13
to jphototagger-...@googlegroups.com, JAmes
Am 21.06.2013 16:32, schrieb JAmes:
> Is there a way to modify not only "date taken" but also time taken, e.g.
> in the form "yyyy-mm-dd HH:MM:SS".
>
> I managed to do this in the edit window for "Date taken" even with the
> error message pop-up window,
> but only when I select another image after confirmation of pop-up
> window. But I think this is a bug.

Hi James,

the edit fields displaying error messages after edits were done. This is
the case either if another edit field was selected or when the data will
be saved because another image was selected. If you hover the label text
"Date taken" or any other, a tooltip shows you more information, in this
case valid date formats. Btw. an error message prior to an "edit done"
trigger does not make sense, because it would pop up continuously while
typing - the date format can match only at some input positions.

> JPhotoTagger writes e.g. the following in the XMP
> (here the time 12.12.14 is written inspite of JPT error message):
>
> * <rdf:Description rdf:about=""
> * xmlns:Iptc4xmpCore="http://iptc.org/std/Iptc4xmpCore/1.0/xmlns/">
> * <Iptc4xmpCore:DateCreated>2111-06-06 12:12:14</Iptc4xmpCore:DateCreated>
> * </rdf:Description>

The usage intension is for files without EXIF metadata or as workaround
for files with EXIF metadata JPhotoTagger can't read. I use it for my
scanned images taken on film and for all I can't remember the time, in
some cases neither the month nor the day.

> and GeoSetter e.g. writes this
>
> * <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
> * xmlns:exif='http://ns.adobe.com/exif/1.0/'>
> *
> <exif:DateTimeOriginal>2014-11-11T00:00:00+02:00</exif:DateTimeOriginal>
> * </rdf:Description>
>
> * <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
> * xmlns:photoshop='http://ns.adobe.com/photoshop/1.0/'>
> * <photoshop:Category>4095</photoshop:Category>
> *
> <photoshop:DateCreated>2014-11-11T00:00:00+01:00</photoshop:DateCreated>
> * </rdf:Description>
>
> * <rdf:Description rdf:about=''
> * xmlns:xmp='http://ns.adobe.com/xap/1.0/'>
> * <xmp:ModifyDate>2014-11-11T00:00:00+02:00</xmp:ModifyDate>
> * </rdf:Description>
>

This are different namespaces. JPhotoTagger uses for "Date taken" the
"IPTC Core Schema for XMP" specification which maps IPTC tags to XMP
tags. The specification document describes "Iptc4xmpCore:DateCreated" as:

"Designates the date and optionally the time the intellectual content of
the news object was created rather than the date of the creation of the
physical representation.".

And further: "Implementers are encouraged to provide the creation date
and time from the EXIF data of a digital camera to the user for entering
this date for the first time.". JPhotoTagger does this, if it can read
the image file's EXIF. The posted example contains the time which is
only the case when read from Exif, and it's not a good idea, to
overwrite this in "Date taken"; a better approach is, to fix wrong EXIF
dates e.g. with ExifTool and let JPhotoTagger reread the metadata.

Even if JPhotoTagger will write the time into that tag, I don't think,
that an application will use that, because it operates on different
namespaces (you can try that due modifiying the XMP with an text
editor). JPhotoTagger does not write/modify the "photoshop:DateCreated",
"exif:DateTimeOriginal" and "xmp:ModifyDate" tags but it keeps tags
written by other applications.

Regards,
Elmar
--
http://www.elmar-baumann.de/fotografie/

JAmes

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Jun 26, 2013, 6:16:45 PM6/26/13
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Thank you Elmar for detailed explanation,

if I understand well, the date modification by JPT (JPhotoTagger) in sidecars is just a timeline help within JPT, and not intended to be a input source for other software tools, e.g. DAM software.. Correct?

I am also looking for a tool to modify the date of my scanned images. In addition I need to modify the time. Not because I know the exact HH:MM:SS of such images, but because I like to mark all scanned images with the time HH:MM:SS= 00:00:00. I also rename all my images to the format yyyymmdd-HHMM_unique-id.ext and the only chance to realize a specific sorting (e.g. for scanned dia-positives from the same day) is a time sequence 00:01:00, 00:02:00. Luckily this does not happen too often.

I checked GeoSetter, IMatch, IDimager, Lightroom, MediaPro, ExifTool, ... and the situation is really complex. All these tools have bugs or limitations with the date/time function and support of sidecar XMP is partially weak. That means it is difficult to identify which information (embedded or sidecar) is used from such software and what happens in case of conflicts. Finally the support of read-only file formats jpg, dng, ... with xmps sidecars with a lot of tools is very bad. The worst thing happened with Picasa, which even ignores the read-only attribute of jpg files and does edit them!!!

I am already heavily using ExifTool, ImageMagick in msdos batch files together with IMatch for quite a lot of editing and metadata processes. It seems that I have to implement also the date/time modification with batch tools. Apparently the DAM software tools I know, have no real flexible bulk date/time features with a good GUI and are not able to support sidecar xmp for ALL extensions. The number of users with scanned images and corresponding renaming/date/time requirements is apparently also not big enough and will probably decrease and not increase over time.

The consequent 100% xmp sidecar philosophy of JPT is really something I love. I have the impression, that only a few DAM users in the universe do honour and understand this concept.

Regards, James

JAmes

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Jun 26, 2013, 6:22:29 PM6/26/13
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Is it no possible to editin this forum the own postings to correct typing, spelling errors? Do I miss something?
If not, the missing or invisible edit function is a major drawback and the usability of this forum is not good.

James

Elmar Baumann

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Jun 27, 2013, 3:30:48 PM6/27/13
to jphototagger-...@googlegroups.com, JAmes
Am 27.06.2013 00:16, schrieb JAmes:
> if I understand well, the date modification by JPT (JPhotoTagger) in
> sidecars is just a timeline help within JPT, and not intended to be a
> input source for other software tools, e.g. DAM software.. Correct?

Hello JAmes,

yes, that date is used by JPT for the timeline if it can't read the
file's EXIF metadata or if the file does not contain EXIF metadata. But
it's a well defined XMP tag which other applications *should* recognize
if - and only if - EXIF metadata isn't present which has a higher
priority and has to be adjusted if it's wrong (e.g. with ExifTool).

> I am also looking for a tool to modify the date of my scanned images. In
> addition I need to modify the time. Not because I know the exact
> HH:MM:SS of such images, but because I like to mark all scanned images
> with the time HH:MM:SS= 00:00:00. I also rename all my images to the
> format yyyymmdd-HHMM_unique-id.ext and the only chance to realize a
> specific sorting (e.g. for scanned dia-positives from the same day) is a
> time sequence 00:01:00, 00:02:00. Luckily this does not happen too often.

For Windows, I don't know. Such jobs I do with Linux (or with cygwin - a
Unix like environment - under Windows). With "find" I do select the
files and with "touch" I can change the file's timestamp. Both can be
combined "find directory -iname namepattern -exec touch datepattern {}
\;". It's a bit more sophisticated, but renaming can be done similar.
Under Windows I'm using sometimes "Bulk Rename Utility" which has many
renaming options and a preview of the names after renaming and an undo.

> The consequent 100% xmp sidecar philosophy of JPT is really something I
> love. I have the impression, that only a few DAM users in the universe
> do honour and understand this concept.

Yes, especially if I do backups, huge metadata changes resulting in less
modified bytes and not megabytes or gigabytes when embedded into the
image. But other people having other priorities and that's ok and good.

Elmar Baumann

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Jun 27, 2013, 3:33:39 PM6/27/13
to jphototagger-...@googlegroups.com, JAmes
Hi James,

I don't think, that Google does offer that possibility, sometimes I
wished that too. It's similar like the old Usenet, where an artikel once
posted, *may* be rejected but not changed.
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