"GRINSHPUN" What is the meaning of my name?

[btak...@googlemail.com]

Hello!

I would like to know, what is the meaning of my, well my father's
name?
It's "Grinshpun". Well grin is probably green, but shpun? I'ver been
told it's "spider", "metal" etc... But nobody knows exactly.

I would appreciate it very much, if you help m to find out. So would
my father.

Thank you.
Borys A. Takunov

[Dr. Avraham Ben-Rahamiėl Qanaļ]

Boris,

 

        Grinshpun is the Eastern Yiddish pronunciation of Central Yiddish Grinshpon, which itself is the Yiddish version of the German Grünspan, green chip/splinter. The origin of the name goes back to the Rhineland where, before house numbers were introduced, houses were identified by an emblem over the front door. Someone from the house with a green chip over the door was then referred to a Grünspan, someone from the house with a res shield over the door was then referred to as Rothschild, someone from the house with a grapevine over the door was referred to as Weinstock, etc.

 

                                                                                Avraham

[Minden]

> It's "Grinshpun". Well grin is probably green, but shpun? I'ver been
> told it's "spider", "metal" etc... But nobody knows exactly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenspan

Still, that doesn't really explain much - some ancestor was a coppersmith maybe?

Lipman Phillip Minden
--
http://lipmans.blogspot.com

[Minden]

> Grinshpun is the Eastern Yiddish pronunciation of Central Yiddish Grinshpon, which itself is the Yiddish version of the German Grünspan, green chip/splinter. The origin of the name goes back to the Rhineland where, before house numbers were introduced, houses were identified by an emblem over the front door. Someone from the house with a green chip over the door was then referred to a Grünspan, someone from the house with a res shield over the door was then referred to as Rothschild, someone from the house with a grapevine over the door was referred to as Weinstock, etc.
>
> Avraham

Is that an ad-hoc idea (nothing wrong about that) or did you find that somewhere? I'm asking because not only does Grünspan rather mean green patina than green splinter, but the name isn't common among German Jews, rather in Poland.

[Dr. Avraham Ben-Rahamiėl Qanaļ]

The name has its origins from when the Ashkenazim were still living in the Rhineland, i.e., before the expulsion and their migration eastward to Poland, Russia, etc. I learned this from several books on Jewish genealogy and the origin of family names.

 

                                                                                Avraham

[Heinz Leonhard "Leo" Kretzenbacher]

Actually, German "der Grünspan" means verdigris, the green colour layer copper is covered with through oxidization. It ha nothing to do with "der Span" (splinter), but is a corruption of "spanisch grün" (Latin "viride Hispanum").

Grünspan (or forms adapted to vernacular spelling of the countries where Families of that name lived in) is not a rare Ashkenazi surname). Herschel Feibel Grynszpan (with the Polish spelling of the surname), the young Jew who, disgusted by Nazi Germany's expulsion of his family to Poland (which would noty accept them so that they had to camp at the border), shot a German diplomat in Paris on November 7th, 1938. This gave the Nazis a welcome pretense for starting the long prapared November porgoms all over Germany.

Many Ashkenazi surnames are not from the time they were still living in the Rhineland (or, more likely from a linguistic viewpoint than the Loter theory, in the area around Regensburg), but from the late 18th century or the early 19th century, when Central European States such as Austria (in 1787), France (in 1808) or Prussia (in 1812) legislated that Jews had to take surnames in order to be registered "properly" like all citizens (for tax and military services etc.).

Not always were Jews allowed to choose their own surnames. Some legislatons (e.g. in France and Austria) expressly forbade that the surnames had any Jewish connotations (in the intention to make the Jews "true citizens" and equal to non-Jewish citizens). Often anti-semitic bureaucrats would take delight in pushing names with bad connotations in the vernacular on Jewish families. German Colour terms were easy and non-offensive choices for surnames, so Roth, Blau, Gruen, Schwarz, Weiss etc are frequent Jewish surnames. I assume Gruenspan was used as a variation on the ubiquitous Gruen.

Best wishes,

Leo Kretzenbacher


-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: jewish-l...@googlegroups.com im Auftrag von Dr. Avraham Ben-Rahamiël Qanaï
Gesendet: Di 10/7/2008 4:36
An: jewish-languages; Phmi...@arcor.de
Betreff: [Jewish Languages] Re: "GRINSHPUN"  What is the meaning of my name?