Hi Jenkins users,
Today I am happy to announce the open sourcing of a new user experience for Jenkins called Blue Ocean.
We are looking to build an excellent experience around Pipeline and Freestyle jobs with a focus on developer experience - how you as a developer build better automation, easily diagnose failures, integrate with tools like Github, Bitbucket or Slack and onboard new team members. These are goals of the uttermost importance to this project.
We realise that we can’t do this alone and it will take more than just Jenkins developers to make this effort successful. We need to hear from the Jenkins user community about their thoughts on the project, where it is heading and how we can help you hone your craft and build better software using Jenkins.
Today we’ve made the source code available on Github, written a blog post and created a video explaining the project in more detail. We will be posting more updates to both the blog and mailing lists when there are more updates to share.
If you have any questions or comments please reply to this post and I’ll be more than happy to answer any questions you may have :)
Thanks,
James
Thanks,
James
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Today we’ve made the source code available on Github, written a blog post and created a video explaining the project in more detail.
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but make things harder to figure out what is going on.The old way has problems, but it was easy to figure out, and didn't have a lot of these intermediate layers that try to abstract things out,However, at this point in time, I would say that in many ways, the current direction is worse than the old way of doing things with the old Jenkins UI.Hi,The new Jenkins UI looks nice, and will be a big improvement over the existing UI.The original selling point of Jenkins was that even with the simplistic forms-based UI,someone could fill out a relatively simple form, and have a continuous integration pipeline.I have met people who were general devops and scripting people, and could use Jenkins quite nicely.While I understand the motivation for Pipeline (previously known as Workflow), I can't say I'm very happy with the results.Here are some of the pain points I've encountered with Pipeline scripts:I understand that Jenkins is going through a big transition period. Hopefully at the end of the road, things will be much better.
- Other than the most trivial of scripts, you need to be a knowledgable Groovy programmer. For example, to make a global variable, you need to use a @Field. (What?!) Most scripting and devops people that I know don't really know Groovy.
- Documentation for Pipeline scripts isn't that great (although it has definitely been improving). In all honesty, I cannot point a junior scripting person to write a good Pipeline script for developing a build Pipeline.
- The durable task plugin which invokes shell commands on Unix, and batch jobs on Windows goes through an elaborate method for invoking shell commands. It is very, very difficult to grab the exit status of commands, stderr, stdout, etc. For a while, these wrappers would do things like not detect when a command had terminated, etc. (Looks like this has been fixed now)
- It is very hard to figure out how to cancel a running Pipeline job. The UI link to "Click here to cancel" a Pipeline job is hidden in the build output, and often doesn't work.
Craig
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Tyler was nice enough to get out of bed to deploy the change to jenkins.io - should now be readable on any device.
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As the old world will disappear the easy way to create build jobs is still available for the non-experts, but for me the new world of pipeline-as-code, its great because now we can handle the jenkins logic the same well as the rest as our code.
Yes pipeline scripts are code but thats fine because we're developers.
So for me the merge of old and new world is great for all.
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Hi,The new Jenkins UI looks nice, and will be a big improvement over the existing UI.The original selling point of Jenkins was that even with the simplistic forms-based UI,someone could fill out a relatively simple form, and have a continuous integration pipeline.I have met people who were general devops and scripting people, and could use Jenkins quite nicely.While I understand the motivation for Pipeline (previously known as Workflow), I can't say I'm very happy with the results.Here are some of the pain points I've encountered with Pipeline scripts:
- Other than the most trivial of scripts, you need to be a knowledgable Groovy programmer. For example, to make a global variable, you need to use a @Field. (What?!) Most scripting and devops people that I know don't really know Groovy.
- Documentation for Pipeline scripts isn't that great (although it has definitely been improving). In all honesty, I cannot point a junior scripting person to write a good Pipeline script for developing a build Pipeline.
- The durable task plugin which invokes shell commands on Unix, and batch jobs on Windows goes through an elaborate method for invoking shell commands. It is very, very difficult to grab the exit status of commands, stderr, stdout, etc. For a while, these wrappers would do things like not detect when a command had terminated, etc. (Looks like this has been fixed now)
- It is very hard to figure out how to cancel a running Pipeline job. The UI link to "Click here to cancel" a Pipeline job is hidden in the build output, and often doesn't work.
but make things harder to figure out what is going on.The old way has problems, but it was easy to figure out, and didn't have a lot of these intermediate layers that try to abstract things out,I understand that Jenkins is going through a big transition period. Hopefully at the end of the road, things will be much better.However, at this point in time, I would say that in many ways, the current direction is worse than the old way of doing things with the old Jenkins UI.Craig
--On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 3:21 PM, James Dumay <jdu...@cloudbees.com> wrote:Today we’ve made the source code available on Github, written a blog post and created a video explaining the project in more detail. We will be posting more updates to both the blog and mailing lists when there are more updates to share.
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For the record, I have occasionally replied to threads with the same concern below: pipeline jobs require Groovy programming experience. I would much rather see a robust set of gadgets and widgets to choose from. Perhaps some build/release teams are composed of programmers. I am an experienced programmer in several languages, just not Groovy. But most teams are scripters: batch and shell.
Still, the fastest way to CI is picking and choosing standard known build and post build steps. Then maybe proceeding into Groovy for specific, local, requirements,
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Hi,The new Jenkins UI looks nice, and will be a big improvement over the existing UI.
The original selling point of Jenkins was that even with the simplistic forms-based UI,
someone could fill out a relatively simple form, and have a continuous integration pipeline.
I have met people who were general devops and scripting people, and could use Jenkins quite nicely.
While I understand the motivation for Pipeline (previously known as Workflow), I can't say I'm very happy with the results.
Here are some of the pain points I've encountered with Pipeline scripts:
- Other than the most trivial of scripts, you need to be a knowledgable Groovy programmer. For example, to make a global variable, you need to use a @Field. (What?!) Most scripting and devops people that I know don't really know Groovy.
- [...]
Regards,
Nux.
On 27 May 2016 at 07:59, Craig Rodrigues <rod...@freebsd.org> wrote:
Hi,The new Jenkins UI looks nice, and will be a big improvement over the existing UI.
The original selling point of Jenkins was that even with the simplistic forms-based UI,
someone could fill out a relatively simple form, and have a continuous integration pipeline.
I have met people who were general devops and scripting people, and could use Jenkins quite nicely.
While I understand the motivation for Pipeline (previously known as Workflow), I can't say I'm very happy with the results.
Here are some of the pain points I've encountered with Pipeline scripts:
- Other than the most trivial of scripts, you need to be a knowledgable Groovy programmer. For example, to make a global variable, you need to use a @Field. (What?!) Most scripting and devops people that I know don't really know Groovy.
So in my personal opinion, this is a sign of People Doing Things Wrong™
By this I mean that your Jenkinsfile should *not* be doing complex things. You should have shell scripts or equivalent to do the complex functionality. That lets you test each individual step in the phase on local developer machines. Then your pipeline should end up mostly being
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On 27 May 2016 at 07:59, Craig Rodrigues <rod...@freebsd.org> wrote:Here are some of the pain points I've encountered with Pipeline scripts:
- Other than the most trivial of scripts, you need to be a knowledgable Groovy programmer. For example, to make a global variable, you need to use a @Field. (What?!) Most scripting and devops people that I know don't really know Groovy.
So in my personal opinion, this is a sign of People Doing Things Wrong™By this I mean that your Jenkinsfile should *not* be doing complex things. You should have shell scripts or equivalent to do the complex functionality. That lets you test each individual step in the phase on local developer machines. Then your pipeline should end up mostly being
The Jenkins specific tasks should be mostly single purpose and logicless in my view.The complex logic should be testable outside of Jenkins.But building complex logic in groovy "just because it is there" and not "because we cannot do it elsewhere" is the problem my rant is directed at
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