Kosen Judo
.Qzi
I have one small question. If in Japan are schools, which are teaching Kosen
Judo? With "ne-waza" as priority...
I'm wonder if somebody reading that disscusion group :D
Shigeharu TAKENO
".Qzi" <kwan...@ci.onet.pl> wrote:
> I have one small question. If in Japan are schools, which are teaching Kosen
> Judo? With "ne-waza" as priority...
I think there is no lecture of "kosen" style judo in any school,
but some universities have judo clubs doing "kosen" style judo.
For example, Shichitei Judo. "Shichitei" means seven (famous)
universities in Japan, Hokkaido Univ.,Tohoku Univ.,Tokyo Univ.,
Nagoya Univ.,Kyoto Univ.,Osaka Univ.,Kyushu Univ. Judo clubs of
these universities are doing judo by "kosen" judo rule, but the
rule (they call "Shichitei" rule) may be slightly little
different from old "kosen" judo rule. I think the reason why the
"kosen" style judo remains in such universities is that they had
many graduated students of "kosen"s.
# I played it in Osaka Univ.
There are some private judo clubs doing "kosen" judo. For
example, see:
http://www.gws.ne.jp/home/demo2/indexe.html
+========================================================+
Shigeharu TAKENO NIigata Institute of Technology
kashiwazaki,Niigata 945-1195 JAPAN
sh...@iee.niit.ac.jp TEL(&FAX): +81-257-22-8161
+========================================================+
.Qzi
: > I have one small question. If in Japan are schools, which are teaching
Kosen
: > Judo? With "ne-waza" as priority...
:
: I think there is no lecture of "kosen" style judo in any school,
: but some universities have judo clubs doing "kosen" style judo.
So in that clubs people fighting on the ground and in stand up positions??
Or only ne-waza is practise? And how do You think, kosen judo will be still
learn in Your country, or it will slightly "die"?? People in Japan prefer
normal (olimpic) judo, or kosen?
: For example, Shichitei Judo. "Shichitei" means seven (famous)
: universities in Japan, Hokkaido Univ.,Tohoku Univ.,Tokyo Univ.,
: Nagoya Univ.,Kyoto Univ.,Osaka Univ.,Kyushu Univ. Judo clubs of
: these universities are doing judo by "kosen" judo rule, but the
: rule (they call "Shichitei" rule) may be slightly little
: different from old "kosen" judo rule. I think the reason why the
: "kosen" style judo remains in such universities is that they had
: many graduated students of "kosen"s.
: # I played it in Osaka Univ.
: There are some private judo clubs doing "kosen" judo. For
: example, see:
: http://www.gws.ne.jp/home/demo2/indexe.html
Thanks. I live in small coutnry, where kosen dont exist (only normal
"version" of judo), so Im looking for some materials about it.
Big thanks for the answer, and greetings from Poland :)
Shigeharu TAKENO
".Qzi" <kwan...@ci.onet.pl> wrote:
> : I think there is no lecture of "kosen" style judo in any school,
> : but some universities have judo clubs doing "kosen" style judo.
>
> So in that clubs people fighting on the ground and in stand up positions??
Both may be. In our university, we practiced only stand up style
"randori" ("tachi-waza randori"), only ground style "randori"
("ne-waza randori", and no restricted "randori". But main
practice was ground style, and most of us did "ne-waza" at no
restricted "randori".
> Or only ne-waza is practise? And how do You think, kosen judo will be still
> learn in Your country, or it will slightly "die"?? People in Japan prefer
> normal (olimpic) judo, or kosen?
"Kosen" style judo is not a popular in Japan. Most of Japanese
judo player's style is "Kodokan" (normal) judo style. People who
studied "kosen" are very old now, so original "kosen" judo may be
dying. However, some groups (not many), such Shichitei judo club,
are doing "ne-waza" maily judo even now and "kosen" judo video or
DVD are also sold.
http://www.gws.ne.jp/home/demo2/videoe.htm
http://www.queststation.com/catalogue/budo_j02.html
http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000CGAKK/ref=pd_sims_dp__1/249-0362078-9005948
http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00005L9RJ/249-0362078-9005948
(Sorry, Japanese only)
> Thanks. I live in small coutnry, where kosen dont exist (only normal
> "version" of judo), so Im looking for some materials about it.
# Japan is also small ;-)
Of course "ne-waza" is important even in normal version of judo,
and I think it can be learnt "newaza" in every Judo club. In
Japan it is said that "ne-waza" and "tachi-waza" are wheels of a
car, (the "car" means the japanese old car by human effort, which
had only two wheel), and both are need to be more strong.
.Qzi
news:87brp4a...@pc98tak.iee.niit.ac.jp...
: > Or only ne-waza is practise? And how do You think, kosen judo will be
still
: > learn in Your country, or it will slightly "die"?? People in Japan
prefer
: > normal (olimpic) judo, or kosen?
:
: "Kosen" style judo is not a popular in Japan. Most of Japanese
: judo player's style is "Kodokan" (normal) judo style. People who
: studied "kosen" are very old now, so original "kosen" judo may be
: dying. However, some groups (not many), such Shichitei judo club,
: are doing "ne-waza" maily judo even now and "kosen" judo video or
: DVD are also sold.
But why? Look, now where most popular are i.e. brasilian jiu-jitsu, sambo -
ground styles, why in (normal) judo ne-waza isn't popular like stand up
fighting??? Its for people who watching judo in TV? For them ground fighting
is boring?? Or meaby its too difficult to judgement??? (But I dont think so)
How do You think??
: # Japan is also small ;-)
But how many people living in Japan??? ;)
: Of course "ne-waza" is important even in normal version of judo,
: and I think it can be learnt "newaza" in every Judo club. In
: Japan it is said that "ne-waza" and "tachi-waza" are wheels of a
: car, (the "car" means the japanese old car by human effort, which
: had only two wheel), and both are need to be more strong.
Ouuu yes, thats true. But (al least in clubs here) judo is equal stand up
fighting. Ground fighting almost dont exists (only in some academical clubs,
but "tachi-waza" is still most important). So we have good fighters, but
with "only one wheel" ;)
Greetings
--
Krzysztof Kalinski
kwan...@ci.onet.pl
Shigeharu TAKENO
".Qzi" <kwan...@ci.onet.pl> wrote:
> : "Kosen" style judo is not a popular in Japan. Most of Japanese
> : judo player's style is "Kodokan" (normal) judo style. People who
=====
> But why? Look, now where most popular are i.e. brasilian jiu-jitsu, sambo -
> ground styles, why in (normal) judo ne-waza isn't popular like stand up
They are spreading also in Japan, but are not popular as well as
judo in Japan, I think. There are some reasons.
1) Many of Japanese high school and junior high school have
"budo-jo", which is the place to play "judo", "kendo", "karate"
fighting, and have classes of judo (but not so long and many),
hence many of Japanese have experience of judo fight (but most of
them are not so strong of course ;-)). In the class we learn
"Kodokan" style judo.
2) "Kosen" judo game stopped by USA after World War II. After
that judo games started under "Kodokan" association, and have
spreaded judo as sports very widely in the world. Of course,
"ne-waza" is included in "Kodokan" judo, but "tachi-waza" is
more impressive than "ne-waza", so player practiced "tachi-waza"
mainly, and rule have gone toward to such a way.
3) Many of judo club of high school or university are doing
"Kodokan" style judo, which connects to the Olympic game. Most
strong judo player can fight on Olympic stage and he will be the
hero when he wins. Almost all judo player dreams to fight on
Olympic stage, and almost all judo game in Japan is done by
"Kodokan" (or international) rule.
4) Originally "Judo" means "Kodokan" judo by Jigoro Kano. He
combinated some "jiu-jitsu", especially the "tachi-waza" jiu
-jitsu and "ne-waza" jiu-jitsu, and extended to his "Judo". So,
"jiu-jitsu" is not "Judo". So, Japanese may think "Judo" as
"Kodokan" judo usually. "Kosen" judo is also judo, but I heard
there was opposition about their rule.
5) The history of viewing (mainly on TV) of "ne-waza" fighting is
shorter than the one of viewing of "Kodokan" judo for almost all
Japanese.
> fighting??? Its for people who watching judo in TV? For them ground fighting
> is boring?? Or meaby its too difficult to judgement??? (But I dont think so)
> How do You think??
For almost all Japanese, it is more boring and difficult than
"tachi-waza" judo, I think.
> Ouuu yes, thats true. But (al least in clubs here) judo is equal stand up
> fighting. Ground fighting almost dont exists (only in some academical clubs,
> but "tachi-waza" is still most important). So we have good fighters, but
> with "only one wheel" ;)
I think it is not gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood! But
unfortunately it may be true that judo attracts audiences by
"tachi-waza", not "ne-waza" usually (also me until entered to the
judo club of our university).
.Qzi
:: 1) Many of Japanese high school and junior high school have
: "budo-jo", which is the place to play "judo", "kendo", "karate"
: fighting, and have classes of judo (but not so long and many),
: hence many of Japanese have experience of judo fight (but most of
: them are not so strong of course ;-)). In the class we learn
: "Kodokan" style judo.
Tell me, in schools in Japan (high school, junior high school etc.) only
that three martial arts are teaching??? And what about ju-jutsu, aikido
meaby you know? And how is with other martial arts (korean MA, chinese MA,
box, thai box, bjj, savate) in Japan? They' re popular, or not???
Shigeharu TAKENO
".Qzi" <kwan...@ci.onet.pl> wrote:
> :: 1) Many of Japanese high school and junior high school have
> : "budo-jo", which is the place to play "judo", "kendo", "karate"
> : fighting, and have classes of judo (but not so long and many),
> : hence many of Japanese have experience of judo fight (but most of
> : them are not so strong of course ;-)). In the class we learn
> : "Kodokan" style judo.
>
> Tell me, in schools in Japan (high school, junior high school etc.) only
> that three martial arts are teaching??? And what about ju-jutsu, aikido
> meaby you know?
Even if there is the place to play such a "budo" in high school
or junior high school, there may not be the lecture or the club
when the teacher who can teach the kind of "budo".
Most popular "budo" may be judo, because many of sports teacher
have the black belt of judo. (I heard it is the duty to become a
sports teacher.) "Kendo", "karate", "aikido" may also be popular.
But, "kendo" needs some implement ("shinai", woody sword, "men",
mask to protect the face from "shinai", ...), and "karate"
(especially no restricted "karate") often makes injury to
students, they may not be used as the class subject in school
(but exist as club in school). I don't know the example to use
"aikido" as the class subject of school, but I don't know the
reason (few teachers ?).
There exists other kind of "budo" clubs in school. "Naginata",
which use like a lance, is often taught in school for woman,
there some club for "shorinji-kenpo", which is chinese MA,
"sumo", "kyudo", which is Japanese archery, "jukendo", which is
like a combination of "judo" and "kendo". But no "ju-jutsu"
clubs exists in school probably.
I heard the number of people to do "budo" is decreasing,
especially of young age. In Japan, most popular sports club in
school is baseball, nowadays soccer is also very popular. Ball
games are popular, but "budo" is not so, even "judo" is not
more popular than any ball games. I think the reason is for the
bad "budo"'s image, "not smart", "hard", "terrible", "not fun",
...
> And how is with other martial arts (korean MA, chinese MA,
> box, thai box, bjj, savate) in Japan? They' re popular, or not???
There are some of players of "tecondo" (korean MA), but not more
popular than "aikido" or "karate". "Shorinji-kenpo" (chinese MA)
and boxing are popular, but "thai boxing" and "bjj" are not so
yet.