EVA-Unit Head origins?
Nevermann
else. What was it?
James Nevermann II
Terra Strife
one eye, horn, 4 eyes, lanky arms
Nevermann <n...@whidbey.com> wrote in message
news:t3reqsg...@corp.supernews.com...
Olivier Hagué
<as...@evangelion.com> wrote:
>its unofficial but i think it was the barons of hell or something like that.
>one eye, horn, 4 eyes, lanky arms
^^;;;;
Jack Caligari
I found the following on some site ages ago, hope it helps:
Back in medieval days the Judeo-Christians took it upon themselves to
name and categorize all the angels and demons of the afterlife. The ones
of particular interest are the barons of hell.
One baron was said to have a featureless face except for one large eye.
(EVA-00)
The baron of darkness was described as having a large singular horn and
numerous great gnashing teeth.(EVA-01)
Another baron was described as blood red and a face with four eyes and
two mouths.(EVA-02)
The fourth baron was said to be black as pitch and had unnaturally long
arms. (EVA-03)
--
"The basis behind every religion is fear and ignorance." - Marquis de Sade
Minion Control: http://www3.sympatico.ca/john.postma/minion_control.htm
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> Somewhere, I heard that the EVA's head designs were based on something
>> else. What was it?
>
Arrh!! Stop the epidemy!!! >_____<;;;;
Please check your sources... Please... ^^;;;;;
Jack Caligari
What's your problem? I found the infomation a long time ago on some web-site
I lost the address for. I have know idea how correct it is. Either take it
as a possable answer or just rank it as generated fanboy crap and ignore it.
And what the hell does "epidemy" mean?
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
>> Please check your sources... Please... ^^;;;;;
>
>What's your problem? I found the infomation a long time ago on some web-site
>I lost the address for. I have know idea how correct it is. Either take it
>as a possable answer or just rank it as generated fanboy crap and ignore it.
As long as you say that you don't know if it's correct or not because
you didn't chek, I have no problem with this...
>And what the hell does "epidemy" mean?
We were talking about this "barons of hell" stuff a few days ago...
I may be wrong, but it looks like it was made up by some Eva-related
site, and every other Eva site uses this without checking if it's
legit...
This is becoming another "First Impact killed the dinosaurs" or "Tôji
lost an arm" nonsense... ^^;;;;
David Scarlett
news:3a3e8943...@news.noos.fr...
>
> This is becoming another "First Impact killed the dinosaurs" or "Tōji
> lost an arm" nonsense... ^^;;;;
Toji didn't lose an arm?!?
I thought he lost his left arm and leg....... You see him in the hospital
bed and the outline of his body under the sheets is missing an arm and a
leg....
Nevermann
true or not.
As for EVA-04's appearance, it is commonly mistaken for a white paint
job rather than its real silver one. I think that EVA-04 is based off of
the "Angel of Light"- Adam. (Because Adam is pure light...?)
And the MP EVA series, well, I'm not sure where they came from...
Oh, just how many of these 'Barons of Hell' are there?
James Nevermann II
Jack Caligari wrote in message <3A3E5EC3...@sympatico.ca>...
Olivier Hagué
<dsca...@optushome.com.au> wrote:
>Olivier Hagué <o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid> wrote in message
>news:3a3e8943...@news.noos.fr...
>>
>> This is becoming another "First Impact killed the dinosaurs" or "Tōji
>> lost an arm" nonsense... ^^;;;;
>
>Toji didn't lose an arm?!?
Arrrh... -___-;;;;
>I thought he lost his left arm and leg....... You see him in the hospital
>bed and the outline of his body under the sheets is missing an arm and a
>leg....
No. He lost his left leg. And that's _all_.
Olivier Hagué
wrote:
> Hey! I read that same thing years ago! I just wasn't sure if it was
>true or not.
And you are, now?
Jack Caligari
There's no way to check it, the creators will not confirm or deny any of the
religious connections because they want people to draw there own conclusions.
Taryn K.
just not THERE!
--Taryn
"Olivier Hagué" <o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid> wrote in message
news:3a3e9958...@news.noos.fr...
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>There's no way to check it, the creators will not confirm or deny any of the
>religious connections because they want people to draw there own conclusions.
Just check if these "barons of hell" really exist...
That's what I meant...
Jack Caligari
> Hey! I read that same thing years ago! I just wasn't sure if it was
> true or not.
> As for EVA-04's appearance, it is commonly mistaken for a white paint
> job rather than its real silver one. I think that EVA-04 is based off of
> the "Angel of Light"- Adam. (Because Adam is pure light...?)
> And the MP EVA series, well, I'm not sure where they came from...
> Oh, just how many of these 'Barons of Hell' are there?
I couldn't tell ya, I havn't done alot of research on Evangelion yet. Your
best bet is probably to look for information on the Dead Sea Scrolls and the
Kabbala. It should be in there somewhere.
Olivier Hagué
>How can you TELL?
I can tell because:
1) the scenario says so
2) the storyboard says so
3) the Japanese liner notes say so
4) the Newtype Film Books say so
5) the Japanese magazines say so
6) the authors authors say so
I've read _lots_ of stuff about Eva in Japanese books, magazines, and
on Japanese boards... And I've never, _never_, read anything about
Tôji missing an arm.
It's just _wrong_.
Olivier Hagué
I can tell because:
1) the scenario says so
2) the storyboard says so
3) the Japanese liner notes say so
4) the Newtype Film Books say so
5) the Japanese magazines say so
6) the authors say so
I've read _lots_ of stuff about Eva in Japanese books, magazines, and
on Japanese boards... And I've never _ever_ read anything about Tôji
David Scarlett
> On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 23:17:11 GMT, "Taryn K." <ama...@home.com> wrote:
> >How can you TELL?
>
> I can tell because:
> 1) the scenario says so
> 2) the storyboard says so
> 3) the Japanese liner notes say so
> 4) the Newtype Film Books say so
> 5) the Japanese magazines say so
> 6) the authors authors say so
7) Oliver says so
David Scarlett
news:ghA%5.18006$Xx3....@news1.eburwd1.vic.optushome.com.au...
errr, make that Olivier
Terra Strife
Olivier Hagué <o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid> wrote in message
news:3a3e4b9a...@news.noos.fr...
Olivier Hagué
<as...@evangelion.com> wrote:
>phew.... an ok reply from olivier heheeh no flame..no corrections :)
That's because I was getting tired... ^^;;
Seriously, guys... Try the keywords "barons of hell", "horn", and
"arms" on a search engine...
What do you get?
Evangelion sites. Nothing else.
And what do these sites say about the origin of these "barons of hell"
descriptions?
"Oh, some medieval stuff..."
Yeah, right. So specific.
David Scarlett
I've got a "Standard Dictionary of Folklore, Mythology and Legend" here.
There's nothing in it under 'barons...." however there is a huge section on
Semitic mythology....
I might have a look though it, but the damn thing's about the size of a
phonebook.
That reminds me, it does have quite a bit of information of Lilith.....
--
David Scarlett
dsca...@optushome.com.au
http://www.listen.to/artifice/
http://members.optushome.com.au/dscarlett/
Terra Strife
David Scarlett <dsca...@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:FDE%5.18070$Xx3....@news1.eburwd1.vic.optushome.com.au...
SpaceRebel
::Sings::: "I have no face- I am anyounmus.... And in my dreams, I am
anyounmus...."
~Artemis da Spacerebel~
"I can't see myself as a machine forever" -Tina Weymouth
Gender: !FEMALE!
http://harm.beam.at
Scratchbuilt
--
"Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a
sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be
-- or to be indistinguishable from -- self-righteous
sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time."
--Neal Stephenson, Cryptonomicon
Scratchbuilt
--
--Neal Stephenson, Cryptonomicon
Terra Strife <as...@evangelion.com> wrote in message
news:3a3f...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
David Scarlett
that'd really help. Otherwise I could scan it and put the images up on the
internet....
(Probably a breach of copyright, but what's the worst that could happen?)
Scratchbuilt <selurie...@fathat.co.uk> wrote in message
news:b%O%5.15643$T%5.25...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
Jack Caligari
Despite the fact I doubt you've read all the stuff you claim you have,
here's a picture of it:
http://www3.sympatico.ca/john.postma/MutilatedTogi.jpg
1) Why would that shoulder be wrapped up?
2) You can plainly see his shoulder is mostly gone by the position of
where his neck connects to his body.
3) If his arm was still there you would be able to see it sticking out by
the part of his leg that was cut off by the position of his other arm.
Jack Caligari
> OCR? What's that? Does it convert text in images to plain old text? If so
> that'd really help. Otherwise I could scan it and put the images up on the
> internet....
OCR = Optical Character Recognition
Yes it does convert text in images to plain old text. I don't know much about
it since I've never actually used it. It would be easier, and I personally
prefer, to post the scanned imaged up on the internet. OCR's aren't 100%
accurate and some errors may occur.
> (Probably a breach of copyright, but what's the worst that could happen?)
"Come on kids, stick it to the man. MWAHAHAHAHA!" - Duckman
Scratchbuilt
thrown at them with upwards of 99.8% accuracy. Usually you'll find that
scanners are sold with OCR packages as part of the bundle. I'v gone through
five scanners and have five different OCR programs although three of them
are versions of textbridge.
--
"Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a
sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be
-- or to be indistinguishable from -- self-righteous
sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time."
--Neal Stephenson, Cryptonomicon
Jack Caligari <john....@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:3A401320...@sympatico.ca...
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>Despite the fact I doubt you've read all the stuff you claim you have,
Be wrong, I don't care...
Copy/paste from an old post of mine...
-------------------------------------------
"Episode 19
A Part
Cut/62: Tôji no ashi
Gamen dewa, Tôji no hidari ashi ga nakunatteiru yô ni mieru. Dai jű
hachi wa de Entry Plug ga tsubusareta toki ni, ushinatteshimatta no
ka. (Frame/10989)"
(from Neon Genesis Evangelion Genesis 0:10 (LD))
Quick translation...
They say that in the cut 62 of episode 19, you can see on the screen
(gamen dewa), you can see (mieru) that it looks like (yô ni) Tôji's
left leg is missing (Tôji no hidari ashi ga nakutteiru).
He probably lost it (ushinatteshimatta no ka) when his Entry Plug was
destroyed (Entry Plug ga tsubureta toki ni) in episode 18 (dai jű
hachi wa de).
-------------------------------------------
"Yoku mireba
Tôji no kata ashi
Miatarazu"
(from Neon Genesis Evangelion Genesis 0:10 (LD))
Quick translation...
If you take a close look (yoku mireba)
One of Tôji's legs (Tôji no kata ashi)
Is nowhere to be seen (Miatarazu)
(it's a haiku, a sort of japanese poem (you know... 5/7/5...)... ^^ )
-------------------------------------------
"Sangôki Entry Plug yori kyűshutsu sareru Tôji. Kare wa inochi koso
toritometa mono no, hidari ashi o ushinatteshimau. Sono byôsha wa dai
19 wa de no byôin no bed ni yokotawatteiru scene no 1 cut no mi.
Akarasama na hyôgen wa nai."
(from Neon Genesis Evangelion Newtype Film Book 6)
Quick translation...
Tôji being saved (kyűshutsu sareru Tôji) from Eva-03's Entry Plug
(sangôki Entry Plug yori). He's still alive but (kare wa inochi koso
toritometa mono no) he lost his left leg (hidari ashi o
ushinatteshimau). It's shown only during one cut of (sono byôsha wa
.. no 1 cut no mi) the scene in which he is on his bed in the
hospital in episode 19 (dai 19 wa de no byôin no bed ni yokowatteiru
scene). This fact is never clearly stated (akarasama no hyôgen wa
nai).
(the last sentence means they never _say_ that Tôji has lost his
leg... you can check... ^^ )
-------------------------------------------
"Tôji no nesugata o miru to, akiraka ni kare no hidari ashi wa
ushinawareteiru. Kono fushô ni tsuite wa, e conte dankai de no shiji
wa naku, sakuga de no enshutsu shiji ni yoru mono rashii. Nao, kono
dai 19 wa wa ashi o ushinatta Tôji to, honben last de no shogôki
hidari ude no saisei to iu sôhan suru mono o egaki, ningen to Eva no
chigai o meikaku ni miseteiru. Chinami ni genjitsu de no Tôji no tôjô
wa, kono scene ga saigo to naru."
(from Neon Genesis Evangelion Newtype Film Book 7)
Quick translation...
If you look at Tôji on his bed (Tôji no nesugata o miru to), it's
clear that (akiraka ni) his left leg (kare no hidari ashi wa) is
"lost" (ushinawareteiru). It seems that (rashii) the instructions
(shiji) about this mutilation (kono fushô ni tsuite wa) were not on
the storyboards (e conte dankai de no shiji wa naku) but given when
the animation was made (sakuga de no enshutsu shiji ni yoru mono). By
the way (nao), this episode 19 (kono dai 19 wa wa) demonstrates
(miseteiru) clearly (meikaku ni) the difference between humans and
Evas (ningen to Eva no chigai o) by using/showing (egaki) the
opposition between (to iu sôhan suru mono o) Touji's lost leg and
(ashi a ushinatta Tôji to) the regeneration of Eva-01's left arm
(shogôki hidari ude no saisei) by the end of the episode (honben last
de). That scene (kono scene) also (chinami ni) turns out to be the
last one (saigo to naru) with Tôji "in the reality" (gensjitsu de no
Tôji no tôjô wa).
-------------------------------------------
By the end of episode 18, Shinji looks at a monitor and see an injured
Tôji in Eva-03's Entry Plug (you can see the captions: "SUBJECT: 13th
ANGEL - ENTRYPLUG 03 - PILOT: FOURTH C. - CAMERA: NO.012 LEFT -
MAGNIFICATION: x05" on this picture).
And Tôji obviously still has his left arm on it.
-------------------------------------------
In the beginning of episode 19, Hikari talks with in his chamber.
When he looks at the empty bed on his left, and in the last cut of
this scene, you can see that he still has his right arm.
-------------------------------------------
In episode 25', a scene has not been animated, but remains in the
original scenario and on the storyboards. It was suposed to take place
between the one with operators discussing about Nerv's future (cuts 27
to 30) and the one with Misato wondering about Seele's projects in her
car (cuts 42 to 44).
You could see Tôji and Kensuke saying good bye to Shinji before their
evacuation in Germany (Hiakri and other classmates left in the
morning). Kensuke is filming Nerv planes in the sky and Tôji is
playing basketball in a wheeling chair.
He has his two arms. No prothesis. You can see it on cuts 37 to 39
(it's really obvious on cut 38).
(I have no scanner, so you'll have to trust me... or to find the
storyboards... ^^; )
-------------------------------------------
>here's a picture of it:
>
>http://www3.sympatico.ca/john.postma/MutilatedTogi.jpg
I didn't need that, I already have this picture in several books...
As for your interpreation of this picture, you're mistaken.
Deal with it... ^^;
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>Despite the fact I doubt you've read all the stuff you claim you have,
Be wrong, I don't care...
Copy/paste from an old post of mine...
-------------------------------------------
"Episode 19
A Part
Cut/62: Tôji no ashi
Gamen dewa, Tôji no hidari ashi ga nakunatteiru yô ni mieru. Dai jű
hachi wa de Entry Plug ga tsubusareta toki ni, ushinatteshimatta no
ka. (Frame/10989)"
(from Neon Genesis Evangelion Genesis 0:10 (LD))
Quick translation...
They say that in the cut 62 of episode 19, you can see (mieru) on the
screen (gamen dewa) that it looks like (yô ni) Tôji's left leg is
>here's a picture of it:
>
>http://www3.sympatico.ca/john.postma/MutilatedTogi.jpg
I didn't need that, I already have this picture in several books...
Jack Caligari
> On Wed, 20 Dec 2000 01:37:57 GMT, Jack Caligari
> <john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> >Despite the fact I doubt you've read all the stuff you claim you have,
>
> Be wrong, I don't care...
Why didn't you just post this stuff earlier? It's still not very concreat
proof.
> >here's a picture of it:
> >
> >http://www3.sympatico.ca/john.postma/MutilatedTogi.jpg
>
> I didn't need that, I already have this picture in several books...
>
> As for your interpreation of this picture, you're mistaken.
> Deal with it... ^^;
The picture was to better illustrate my point and for any others who may be
interested. I don't believe I am mistaken, the only way to be proven right
or wrong is to ask the creator and that's not going to happen.
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>Why didn't you just post this stuff earlier?
'Cause I had to search for it...
>It's still not very concreat proof.
Not very concreat? ^^;;;;
You're opposing the way you see a picture to the explanations from the
_very guys who did it_! ^^;;
By the way, in the removed sequence of episode 25', Tôji casually
catches the basket ball with his left hand. And according to you, he
has no left arm. Boy is he good.
>The picture was to better illustrate my point and for any others who may be
>interested. I don't believe I am mistaken, the only way to be proven right
>or wrong is to ask the creator and that's not going to happen.
Did you bother to read my previous post?
Where did these explanations about Tôji's injury not being on the
storyboards of episode 19 come from? Take a wild guess...
And this stuff about Tôji's _leg_ mirroring Eva's arm... If Tôji had
lost an arm, wouldn't it be logical to forget about the leg and to
focus on the arm instead?
He _never_ lost an arm.
There is _nothing_ about "Tôji's missing arm" anywhere.
But the liner notes keep talking about his missing left leg. Strange,
isn't it? Even in the parody comics featured in the Japanese Genesis
0:12 video, you can see an unijambist Tôji with his _two_ arms.
It's official, dammit! ^^;;;;
Tôji lost a leg because Sadamoto's (or Anno's? one of the two,
anyway... I'd have to check...) father lost a leg during war.
Is that clear enough for you?
Jack Caligari
> >It's still not very concreat proof.
>
> Not very concreat? ^^;;;;
> You're opposing the way you see a picture to the explanations from the
> _very guys who did it_! ^^;;
Your evidence isn't from the "very guys who did it". It's from articles in the
Newtype books and whoever wrote the stuff on the LD. The storyboards don't
count because they aren't part of the actual story.
> By the way, in the removed sequence of episode 25', Tôji casually
> catches the basket ball with his left hand. And according to you, he
> has no left arm. Boy is he good.
It was cut, if it's not in the final film then it's not part of the official
story.
> >The picture was to better illustrate my point and for any others who may be
> >interested. I don't believe I am mistaken, the only way to be proven right
> >or wrong is to ask the creator and that's not going to happen.
>
> Did you bother to read my previous post?
> Where did these explanations about Tôji's injury not being on the
> storyboards of episode 19 come from? Take a wild guess...
I did read your previous post.
> And this stuff about Tôji's _leg_ mirroring Eva's arm... If Tôji had
> lost an arm, wouldn't it be logical to forget about the leg and to
> focus on the arm instead?
I assume your talking about why they used his leg as an example instead of his
arm. His leg is the only thing you can really see and confirm and what the
audience would actually remeber. You wouldn't even think he lost his arm unless
you really look at the scene so his leg makes a better example.
> He _never_ lost an arm.
> There is _nothing_ about "Tôji's missing arm" anywhere.
> But the liner notes keep talking about his missing left leg. Strange,
> isn't it?
What are the liner notes?
> Even in the parody comics featured in the Japanese Genesis
> 0:12 video, you can see an unijambist Tôji with his _two_ arms.
> It's official, dammit! ^^;;;;
I have no idea what your talking about here. Could you be a little more
specific, or better yet, show me.
> Tôji lost a leg because Sadamoto's (or Anno's? one of the two,
> anyway... I'd have to check...) father lost a leg during war.
That doesn't prove anything except why he had Togi lose his leg. It doesn't
mean Togi didn't lose an arm as well.
> Is that clear enough for you?
As clear as it was before.
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
>> >It's still not very concreat proof.
>>
>> Not very concreat? ^^;;;;
>> You're opposing the way you see a picture to the explanations from the
>> _very guys who did it_! ^^;;
>
>Your evidence isn't from the "very guys who did it". It's from articles in the
>Newtype books and whoever wrote the stuff on the LD.
Yeah, and they made that up, of course... They're very imaginative.
And Gainax is a bunch of morons who can't read the liner notes they're
supervising, according to the credits.
>The storyboards don't
>count because they aren't part of the actual story.
Yeah, right... They gave Tôji his arm back in the storyboards of
episode 25' because it was "just a storyboard"...
Don't be silly, please...
>> By the way, in the removed sequence of episode 25', Tôji casually
>> catches the basket ball with his left hand. And according to you, he
>> has no left arm. Boy is he good.
>
>It was cut, if it's not in the final film then it's not part of the official
>story.
Who drew these storyboards? The authors.
You wanted to know the authors' positions about Tôji's injuries?
Here.
>> And this stuff about Tôji's _leg_ mirroring Eva's arm... If Tôji had
>> lost an arm, wouldn't it be logical to forget about the leg and to
>> focus on the arm instead?
>
>I assume your talking about why they used his leg as an example instead of his
>arm. His leg is the only thing you can really see and confirm and what the
>audience would actually remeber. You wouldn't even think he lost his arm unless
>you really look at the scene so his leg makes a better example.
Why do you think they _explain_ that Tôji lost his leg, in these
books, when there's pictures of this scene on the same pages?
In case you didn't notice it.
So why would they "forget" about Tôji's arm? Especially if they intend
to lay stress on the similitude with Eva's missing arm later on?
>> He _never_ lost an arm.
>> There is _nothing_ about "Tôji's missing arm" anywhere.
>> But the liner notes keep talking about his missing left leg. Strange,
>> isn't it?
>
>What are the liner notes?
Notes on the LD jackets, and included in these jackets.
Lots of them.
Very interesting.
>> Even in the parody comics featured in the Japanese Genesis
>> 0:12 video, you can see an unijambist Tôji with his _two_ arms.
>> It's official, dammit! ^^;;;;
>
>I have no idea what your talking about here.
The "liner notes" included in the Japanese videos are called "Eva Tomo
no Kai" and are filled with essays from the staff and the cast of the
series, inner references, exhaustive informations about the dubbing,
etc. There are two or three parody comics in each volume as well : the
"Goannai Manga", "Ganbare xxx" and "Gaina San".
>Could you be a little more specific,
The drawing I'm talking about is a parody of the '70s manga style
featuring "wild renegade youngsters", with Tôji riding a bike and
saying to Hikari, sitting behind him, "Sorry, iinchô, I can't change
gears anymore...", and her replying "Don't worry, Suzuhara kun... I'll
take care of it for you from now on!!" with a glaring smile.
>or better yet, show me.
Like I said, I don't have a scanner, unfortunately...
I wish I had, since I'm getting tired of repeating the same things
again and again...
While I'm at it, the First Impact isn't related to Noah or the
dinosaurs, the Core and the S² Organ are two different things, the
Children aren't born on the same day and their bithdates have no
relevance, even Shinji's one...
Did I forget something?
>> Tôji lost a leg because Sadamoto's (or Anno's? one of the two,
>> anyway... I'd have to check...) father lost a leg during war.
>
>That doesn't prove anything except why he had Togi lose his leg. It doesn't
>mean Togi didn't lose an arm as well.
Sheesh...
(and it's "Tôji")
>> Is that clear enough for you?
>
>As clear as it was before.
You're in serious denial, pal...
DeusExMachinamTD
I love beyond any other show I've seen, but it's still a SHOW! IT'S FICTIONAL.
NOTHING IS SET IN STONE! Just let it go. Olivier, from all the post I've
seen from you, you might as well be on a play ground screaming "I'm right
because my daddy was the co-creator of episode 4." If he thinks Toji lost a
arm, WHAT IN GODS NAME IS SO WRONG WITH THAT? I personally thing that he did
to. If he didn't then he sleeps with his arm up his butt. But that's just my
opinion, which I am entitled to. Just freaking let it GO. IT'S FICTIONAL
TELEVISION!
::Goes back to lurking.::
Olivier Hagué
(DeusExMachinamTD) wrote:
>Oh my freaking God.....it's a TELEVISION SHOW PEOPLE. Yes, granted a show that
>I love beyond any other show I've seen, but it's still a SHOW! IT'S FICTIONAL.
> NOTHING IS SET IN STONE!
Maybe Shinji is a girl! Who knows?
>Olivier, from all the post I've
>seen from you, you might as well be on a play ground screaming "I'm right
>because my daddy was the co-creator of episode 4."
Excuse me for having access to reliable references.
>If he thinks Toji lost a
>arm, WHAT IN GODS NAME IS SO WRONG WITH THAT?
Just that: it's wrong.
>I personally thing that he did
>to. If he didn't then he sleeps with his arm up his butt. But that's just my
>opinion, which I am entitled to.
I think that Evangelion is a follow-up to the Silverhawks. Now let's
discuss it, shall we? What do you have to say about that?
>Just freaking let it GO. IT'S FICTIONAL
>TELEVISION!
Of course it's a fiction.
But we're on an Evangelion-related newsgroup. What did you expect? A
debate about death penalty?
Olivier Hagué
o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid (Olivier Hagué) wrote:
>While I'm at it, the First Impact isn't related to Noah or the
>dinosaurs, the Core and the S² Organ are two different things, the
>Children aren't born on the same day and their bithdates have no
>relevance, even Shinji's one...
>Did I forget something?
Oh, yeah. Misato didn't kill Kaji.
(how could I forget about that one? ^^;)
Watchman
"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
>
> On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 22:50:40 GMT, "David Scarlett"
> <dsca...@optushome.com.au> wrote:
> >Olivier Hagué <o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid> wrote in message
> >news:3a3e8943...@news.noos.fr...
> >>
> >> This is becoming another "First Impact killed the dinosaurs" or "Tôji
> >> lost an arm" nonsense... ^^;;;;
> >
> >Toji didn't lose an arm?!?
>
> Arrrh... -___-;;;;
Take a deep breath... ;)
>
> >I thought he lost his left arm and leg....... You see him in the hospital
> >bed and the outline of his body under the sheets is missing an arm and a
> >leg....
>
> No. He lost his left leg. And that's _all_.
We believe you!
...honest!
--
'Anyone who isn't confused doesn't really know what's going on'
Watchman
Of course it is possible... er, never mind! ^__^;;
Watchman
"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
>
> On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 23:11:14 GMT, Jack Caligari
> <john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> >There's no way to check it, the creators will not confirm or deny any of the
> >religious connections because they want people to draw there own conclusions.
>
> Just check if these "barons of hell" really exist...
> That's what I meant...
Well, the only time I've ever heard the term "barons of hell" is when people are
talking about DooM!
Olivier Hagué
<str...@SPAMPHOBICwhyalla.net.au> wrote:
>We believe you!
>
>...honest!
Thanks. ^_^;;
Olivier Hagué
<str...@SPAMPHOBICwhyalla.net.au> wrote:
>"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
>> Just check if these "barons of hell" really exist...
>> That's what I meant...
>
>Well, the only time I've ever heard the term "barons of hell" is when people are
>talking about DooM!
That's all I found as well... ^^;
Jack Caligari
> >Your evidence isn't from the "very guys who did it". It's from articles in the
> >Newtype books and whoever wrote the stuff on the LD.
>
> Yeah, and they made that up, of course... They're very imaginative.
> And Gainax is a bunch of morons who can't read the liner notes they're
> supervising, according to the credits.
No, all the stuff written in the liner notes and in the Newtype books are just what
you can easily see. They say he lost his legs, that's obvious. Gainax will read
this, say it's right and aproves it. They don't mention his arm because they either
don't notice or don't know.
> >The storyboards don't
> >count because they aren't part of the actual story.
>
> Yeah, right... They gave Tôji his arm back in the storyboards of
> episode 25' because it was "just a storyboard"...
> Don't be silly, please...
Storyboards change everyday.
> >> By the way, in the removed sequence of episode 25', Tôji casually
> >> catches the basket ball with his left hand. And according to you, he
> >> has no left arm. Boy is he good.
> >
> >It was cut, if it's not in the final film then it's not part of the official
> >story.
>
> Who drew these storyboards? The authors.
> You wanted to know the authors' positions about Tôji's injuries?
> Here.
The authors don't normaly do the storyboards, maybe they did in this case but it
still doesn't matter. Storyboards and ideas change constantly.
> >I assume your talking about why they used his leg as an example instead of his
> >arm. His leg is the only thing you can really see and confirm and what the
> >audience would actually remeber. You wouldn't even think he lost his arm unless
> >you really look at the scene so his leg makes a better example.
>
> Why do you think they _explain_ that Tôji lost his leg, in these
> books, when there's pictures of this scene on the same pages?
> In case you didn't notice it.
Like I said in my last post, it's the most obvious injury and would make a better
comparison.
> So why would they "forget" about Tôji's arm? Especially if they intend
> to lay stress on the similitude with Eva's missing arm later on?
Because it wasn't important to the story.
> >> Even in the parody comics featured in the Japanese Genesis
> >> 0:12 video, you can see an unijambist Tôji with his _two_ arms.
> >> It's official, dammit! ^^;;;;
> >
> >Could you be a little more specific,
>
> The drawing I'm talking about is a parody of the '70s manga style
> featuring "wild renegade youngsters", with Tôji riding a bike and
> saying to Hikari, sitting behind him, "Sorry, iinchô, I can't change
> gears anymore...", and her replying "Don't worry, Suzuhara kun... I'll
> take care of it for you from now on!!" with a glaring smile.
Little parody comics drawn by god knows who is far from official. I don't care if it
was drawn by members of the staff, they may not even know.
> >> Is that clear enough for you?
> >
> >As clear as it was before.
>
> You're in serious denial, pal...
I'm not in serious denial, I'm just waiting for some tangible proof to suport your
claims. So far you've supplied nothing.
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>> >Your evidence isn't from the "very guys who did it". It's from articles in the
>> >Newtype books and whoever wrote the stuff on the LD.
>>
>> Yeah, and they made that up, of course... They're very imaginative.
>> And Gainax is a bunch of morons who can't read the liner notes they're
>> supervising, according to the credits.
>
>No, all the stuff written in the liner notes and in the Newtype books are just what
>you can easily see.
And you say that because...?
>They say he lost his legs, that's obvious.
(his _leg_)
I wonder why they bother, then.
You obviously know nothing about the contents of the Evangelion Film
Books. They're not stating the obvious. Unless you think the working
titles or the references to '70s Japanese TV shows are obvious, of
course.
>Gainax will read
>this, say it's right and aproves it. They don't mention his arm because they either
>don't notice or don't know.
You're just making a fool of yourself, here... ^^;;
>> Yeah, right... They gave Tôji his arm back in the storyboards of
>> episode 25' because it was "just a storyboard"...
>> Don't be silly, please...
>
>Storyboards change everyday.
And here as well... ^^;;
>> Who drew these storyboards? The authors.
>> You wanted to know the authors' positions about Tôji's injuries?
>> Here.
>
>The authors don't normaly do the storyboards,
They do.
Anno did a lot of storyboards himself, as did the other scenarists and
authors of the show.
Just watch the credits.
>maybe they did in this case but it
>still doesn't matter.
>Storyboards and ideas change constantly.
Yeah, sure...
Episode 19 was aired on February 7, 1996, and the storyboards for
episode 25' were done nearly one year later.
Could you explain why the authors would draw Tôji with two arms if he
lost one of them one year earlier? Because they "changed their mind"?
_Nobody_ _ever_ talked about Tôji missing an arm, even back when the
TV show was aired. It's about time you realize this.
>> Why do you think they _explain_ that Tôji lost his leg, in these
>> books, when there's pictures of this scene on the same pages?
>> In case you didn't notice it.
>
>Like I said in my last post, it's the most obvious injury and would make a better
>comparison.
Leg/arm is a better comparison than arm/arm. Right...
And again, what would they just state the obvious, when they have the
opportunity to tell if there was something else? They have enough
space, as well as contacts with the staff.
How did they heard that the instructions about Tôji's injuries were
given in the last minute? They made it up? Or is it possible that it
comes right from the horse's mouth?
Like I said, you just _know nothing_ about the contents of the Film
Books, obviously.
>> So why would they "forget" about Tôji's arm? Especially if they intend
>> to lay stress on the similitude with Eva's missing arm later on?
>
>Because it wasn't important to the story.
But the leg was. Sure...
>Little parody comics drawn by god knows who is far from official.
It's official.
>I don't care if it
>was drawn by members of the staff, they may not even know.
But _you_ know. Of course.
You're opposing what you can see on _one picture_, the way a sheet
looks, to several reliable references from the production itself and
official documents.
Wake up.
I've been around for more than four years, now, reading all I could
about Evangelion. Entire books. Tons of articles. All far more
reliable than anything you can read on Western websites.
And I've _never_ seen anything about Tôji missing an arm.
_Never_.
But they sure talk a lot about his left leg.
>> You're in serious denial, pal...
>
>I'm not in serious denial, I'm just waiting for some tangible proof to suport your
>claims. So far you've supplied nothing.
At one point, you said that concreat proof would have to be supplied
by the authors.
There comes the storyboards, made by the authors themselves.
But "hey, storyboards can change! the authors can change their mind,
after all!"
You're not willing to accept any proof.
You're not willing to change your opinion.
That's called "denial".
Jack Caligari
Olivier Hagué
<john....@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>This is pointless, you're making the same lame excuses.
Yeah, right...
You're wrong.
If you're happy with it, that's fine with me.
David Scarlett
news:3A416F9E...@SPAMPHOBICwhyalla.net.au...
>
> Well, the only time I've ever heard the term "barons of hell" is when
people are
> talking about DooM!
>
Speaking of DooM, I just got the soundtrack to that, it rules! And it's not
MIDI or anything either!
bler
> Maybe Shinji is a girl! Who knows?
Shinji can't be a girl, in magma diver pen^2 noticed something while they
were in the water ;)
Then again.. maybe pen^2 was simply shocked cause Shinji was in fact a
female..
Olivier Hagué
o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid (Olivier Hagué) wrote:
>You're wrong.
'Just got the volume 6 of the manga...
Guess what the Nerv personnel discovers in the Entry Plug of Eva-03,
after the "incident"?
[Spoiler manga?...]
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Like I said earlier, a dead Tôji.
But they also describe his injuries on page 179...
Several cuts at the head... His spleen is in bad shape as well... _One
of his legs is severed_...
And...
And that's all.
You can also see that he still has two arms.
What a surprise.
Of course, you'll tell me that it isn't relevant since the TV series
and the manga are different...
Just a coincidence, eh? Yeah, right...
Andrew Tse
"Olivier Hagué" wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Dec 2000 18:59:51 GMT,
> o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid (Olivier Hagué) wrote:
> >You're wrong.
>
> 'Just got the volume 6 of the manga...
>
> Guess what the Nerv personnel discovers in the Entry Plug of Eva-03,
> after the "incident"?
> [Spoiler manga?...]
Shocking!
Where were his midichlorians then? :-)
Andrew
OnsenMark
o_h...@noos.fr.pasdespameuuuuh.invalid (Olivier Hagué) writes:
Nope. It was the CSM who killed Kaji...
...now, Kenny, on the other hand... ~_O
Mark. 8)
- proud member of the Wakaba Genki Preservation Society and the SDA!
- DSE - Lancers
UtenaCode(1.0) U:4+ F:Wa+Hi+:pSC D:Sa--Na- X:*:a[SC][BR] M:f "Truth"
"Hello, I'm a British person." - Malcolm McDowell, South Park - 'Great
Expectations'
Daniel Fawcett
> >I personally thing that he did
> >to. If he didn't then he sleeps with his arm up his butt. But that's just my
> >opinion, which I am entitled to.
>
> I think that Evangelion is a follow-up to the Silverhawks. Now let's
> discuss it, shall we? What do you have to say about that?
>
Hmmm. Strange. I'd always thought it was a follow up to Superdimensional
Fortress Macross.
Y'know, Adam came out of the SDF-1 when it crashed in 2000. And the Evas
are in fact prototype Valkyries [1]. And Misato's mother is Minmei.
And Gendo Ikari is, in fact, Lars Ulrik (sp?) from Metallica, except in the
confusion of Second Impact he used his vast fortune (won from suing
Napster ^_^) to change his name and, er, ethnic group, moved to Japan
and, er, managed to complete his long term plan for effective world
domination.
[1] Which fits with the anime law that the prototype is always far superior
to the production line model ^_^
--
"The bitterness of one who's left alone"
- Smashing Pumpkins, "Disarm"
Scratchbuilt
--
"Arguing with anonymous strangers on the Internet is a
sucker's game because they almost always turn out to be
-- or to be indistinguishable from -- self-righteous
sixteen-year-olds possessing infinite amounts of free time."
--Neal Stephenson, Cryptonomicon
Andrew Tse <t...@iie.cnam.fr> wrote in message
news:3A43E055...@iie.cnam.fr...