J46 Inner Forestay Retrofit

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Heath Bowden

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Jul 12, 2025, 8:10:27 AMJul 12
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Hello all.  I see that some J46's came with an inner forestay chainplate and removeable stay.  I'm curious if anyone has installed an inner stay as a retrofit.  How possible is this?  With a carbon mast, is the mast ready and able to have an inner stay, halyard sheave, running backstays, etc. added?  For the chainplate, is the deck and bulkhead work extensive?  And, if you've done this work, is it worth it for offshore cruising?  Any leads on a rigger familiar with doing this work?  I talked to a rigger on the East Coast about new standing rigging for a 46 and he seemed skeptical about adding an inner stay on the carbon mast.

Thank you!
Heath 

David Jade

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Jul 12, 2025, 8:26:52 AMJul 12
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I was told by a J Boat dealer that the mast is built differently (reinforced) if the inner stay option was added. It had to be ordered that way from J Boat. 

That said, he told me he always made sure his customers ordered it whether they wanted it or not because it was hard to retrofit as the mast would need carbon reinforcements added. So your mast could have that reinforcement even if the deck hardware is not there. Maybe that was a common practice among dealers. 

As for the deck, there is a large chain plate that connects through the forward bullhead. Probably not too bad to retrofit. 

David                      _/)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

J/49 #19

Shadowfax


On Jul 12, 2025, at 8:10 AM, Heath Bowden <heath....@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello all.  I see that some J46's came with an inner forestay chainplate and removeable stay.  I'm curious if anyone has installed an inner stay as a retrofit.  How possible is this?  With a carbon mast, is the mast ready and able to have an inner stay, halyard sheave, running backstays, etc. added?  For the chainplate, is the deck and bulkhead work extensive?  And, if you've done this work, is it worth it for offshore cruising?  Any leads on a rigger familiar with doing this work?  I talked to a rigger on the East Coast about new standing rigging for a 46 and he seemed skeptical about adding an inner stay on the carbon mast.

Thank you!
Heath 

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David Jade

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Jul 12, 2025, 8:38:34 AMJul 12
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I forgot to add: the inner forestay was a big part of the reason we chose the J/46 for offshore cruising. 

David                      _/)

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On Jul 12, 2025, at 8:26 AM, David Jade <da...@mutable.net> wrote:

 I was told by a J Boat dealer that the mast is built differently (reinforced) if the inner stay option was added. It had to be ordered that way from J Boat. 

Heath Bowden

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Jul 12, 2025, 8:44:49 AMJul 12
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David - thank you.  Do you have any idea how to tell if a mast was built to have an inner stay even if one wasn't installed?  Or would J-Boats have some record of which hull #'s were built this way?  

My wife and I are not J-46 owners yet, but are very interested in the boat and watching for the right one to come along.  We are trying to decide how important having the inner stay is -- right now it's very important in our minds, but that crosses some nice boats off the list.  So, then it's understanding how possible and extensive the retrofit would be.

Thanks for the help!!

_______________________________________________

Heath Bowden


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douglas wilder

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Jul 12, 2025, 9:59:27 AMJul 12
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Loretta hull#2, has the chain plate and mast for an inner forestay.  The hardware had been removed from my boat by the previous owner.  I assumed that adding it back would require adding running back stays.  Other than reaching out to Mr. Hall of Hall Spares, is it possible to run without the running back stays?

 

Doug Wilder

 

 

David Jade

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Jul 12, 2025, 11:42:26 AMJul 12
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I’ve been told by another long time (retired) J Boat dealer (Paul Mikulski here in Annapolis) that the running backstays are only for mainsail shape - not needed for mast support. Could also help with mast pumping in rough conditions though. 

A second j/46 owner (iSea I think) also told me this. He had a permanently rigged inner staysail on a harken roller furler. 

Paul did the Fastnet on a J/46, btw. 

David                      _/)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


On Jul 12, 2025, at 9:59 AM, douglas wilder <douglas....@gmail.com> wrote:



D. Scott Miller

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Jul 12, 2025, 11:48:07 AMJul 12
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Agreed (based on my experience and understanding). I rig a J4 and storm jib on an inner forestay (I added a well-backed deck attachment point forward of the anchor locker) with an anti-twist stay and soft shackles.

 

Have only tested my running backstays in anticipation of reducing mast pumping—but I’ve never had to use them and often don’t rig the runners.

 

So I’ve sailed lots of miles with J4/storm jib rigged on the inner stay with no runners in place—no problems so far!

 

Scott

Resolute J/46 #17

David Jade

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Jul 12, 2025, 11:50:18 AMJul 12
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I would think that you would see the slot in the mast for the J Hook that gets inserted for the stay. It would probably have the black rubber hole plug in there to close it up without the stay rigged up. Ours did as it was never rigged until we added the gear. And it would have a sheave in place as well. It might have that sheave already as a spin pole topping lift but not the slot for the J Hook, so look for both. 

We first looked at a J/46 that did not have one and considered what it would take to add one. A friend/pro rigger thought it was possible but as I mentioned, would require reinforcements to be done. 

In my experience, J Boat does not have records on these boats. But call and talk with Al. Maybe he can guide you. 

David                      _/)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


On Jul 12, 2025, at 8:44 AM, Heath Bowden <heath....@gmail.com> wrote:



S/V Sweet Ruca

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Jul 12, 2025, 12:53:13 PMJul 12
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100% possible. 

Do you need it? No, not for the sailing most do. 

However, if you are venturing days or weeks offshore, the time and place you do need it, the money and time spent will be worth every single penny. It also adds considerable redundancy.

Attached are mast specs from Hall for most J/46's.

If your rigger is skeptical, it's time to find a new one.

Mike Beasley at Jabins in Annapolis did the carbon work on our mast with RigPro Newport (ex Hall, gone now I believe) for the consulting and parts.


--
10-2405.XLS

D. Scott Miller

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Jul 12, 2025, 1:00:30 PMJul 12
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Wow! Great stuff…

 

For us J/46 owners, what other spec files do you have hidden away?

 

From: j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com <j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of S/V Sweet Ruca
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2025 12:53 PM
To: j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [J/4X-owners] J46 Inner Forestay Retrofit

 

100% possible. 

 

Do you need it? No, not for the sailing most do. 

 

However, if you are venturing days or weeks offshore, the time and place you do need it, the money and time spent will be worth every single penny. It also adds considerable redundancy.

 

Attached are mast specs from Hall for most J/46's.

S/V Sweet Ruca

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Jul 12, 2025, 1:29:57 PMJul 12
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Scott, We should sidebar, as I have always meant to reach out to you re the J46.org site. It would be a great place to organize that type of information from all owners.

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Heath Bowden

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Jul 12, 2025, 1:39:25 PMJul 12
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Wow!  Thank you for the reply and attached info/specs!  That is super helpful!  This group is awesome!  

_______________________________________________

Heath Bowden
176 Snowberry Way | Dillon, CO  80435 | USA


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douglas wilder

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Jul 12, 2025, 5:40:39 PMJul 12
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Very nice, data about the boat is always good.

 

Get Outlook for Mac

 

From: j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com <j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of S/V Sweet Ruca <rucas...@gmail.com>
Date: Saturday, July 12, 2025 at 12:53 PM
To: j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com <j4x-owne...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [J/4X-owners] J46 Inner Forestay Retrofit

Bill Bowers

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Jul 12, 2025, 7:38:44 PMJul 12
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Hi Heath,

Confirming Curtis about J4x inner staysails, we are happy caretakers of J42 #3 we bought from Bernie Coyne 10 years ago. 

ConverJence was built in 1996 for a circumnav that never happened.  Carbon mast, boom and pole with twin totally redundant Robertson autopilots. Removeable inner forestay. 

She has raced to Bermuda twice and circled Newfoundland twice. We found for shorthand offshore watchstanding the staysail is superb in the deep reef gnarlies. So much so that we moved the original Harken 1.5 furler to the inner forestay and upgraded to a 2.0 for the 115% Yankee. 

The 100% 9oz genoa staysl sheets to bullet blocks on pendants to new padeyes in the coach roof brow which allow double head closehauled sailing to advantage. Staysail trims to halyard winches under dodger. Has reefing luff fill to be shortened as needed to storm size. Original storm staysail sleeps happily under vee. 

Triple reef main and staysail is a great way to manage the Trinity Bay Westerly gales. 

Cheers

Bill Bowers


Heath Bowden

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Jul 13, 2025, 7:38:32 AMJul 13
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Thank you for the write up Bill - this is exactly the kind of experience and thoughts I was looking for.  
_______________________________________________

Heath Bowden
176 Snowberry Way | Dillon, CO  80435 | USA

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Bill Bowers

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Jul 13, 2025, 8:25:09 AMJul 13
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So welcome Heath.  Also, Curtis is spot on about redundancy. We twisted our headstay top foil section years ago before installing the deflector and had to return from Nova Scotia without headsail.  Actually made an 8’ 2x4 whisker pole for the staysail at Badeck Marine to return in a noreaster. 

Best
Bill

Ed Sitver

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Jul 13, 2025, 5:08:51 PMJul 13
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I have the same info as mentioned by others; some masts came from the factory reinforced for an inner stay.  The carbon fiber mast on my 42 did, in fact, have this reinforcement, allowing me to retrofit an inner stay.  The reinforcement is visible on the mast as a a “bulge.“

I do have the engineering drawings, but they are for a J/42, so probably not relevant to your project. 


I had the work done by David Moffet, who was probably on the team that built my rig (he once told me he probably was the guy who stepped the mast on my boat for the first time). The rigger who actually did the cutting on the mast was also on the Hall Spars team way back when. In other words, I believe my information on the mast structure to be from an extremely reliable source. 

Ed
s/v Ventus
J/42

Dick York

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Jul 15, 2025, 2:36:16 PMJul 15
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Dave et al...
Hall Spars said to me (in 2001) that the J/46 was "one of their stiffer sections".  That is how they were able to deliver masts without inner forestays and not have the rig come down.  

Nonetheless, I would not go to sea without a proper inner forestay, a staysail on it (mine is regular measure with reef tack and clew), and good runners.  

We ran up the bottom of the Red Sea in 35-45, gusts to 55 knots with just the staysail up.  The coral reefs and shipping traffic  made jibing necessary, which was easy with just this rig. The inner forestay and runners all come together at the top spreaders.  Effectively we had a well-supported mast of two-thirds the normal height, with intermediate shrouds, inner forestay and both runners up.  I felt very secure with this rig.  

The day before, we came through the Straits of Bab-el-Mandeb with a triple-reefed main in 30-45. Weather runner was on, as I normally do whenever reefed.  As Hall said, the mast is very stiff and beefy, but the runner protects against any surprise pumping of the stick.  The next day I departed from this sail plan to the staysail described above, as jibing with the triple-reefed main was complex, even though we did chicken-tacks, engine on to assist if required.  Again, the runners directly opposite the inner forestay reduced my concerns about mast pumping or inversion.  

We have used the staysail and double-reefed main when beam or broad reaching  in 30+ too, over the top of Australia and in a small tropical wave mid-Atlantic.  The sail is great and the runners make the boat secure.  Again, a deeply-reefed main plus staysail plus runners means you have a mast and sail plan that tops out near the upper spreader, for a well-supported rig.

We tend to use our number three (105%) when sailing up to 32 AWS or so, but several J/46 owners go to the staysail at lower wind speeds.  I suspect we should have learned to do that, but I would rather not make the sail change.  (We will, but rarely do, furl the 105 in a few rolls.  I hate counting on a furling line since Ned Cabot died falling off his /46 after a snafu with a broken furling line.)

I see that Curtis has a lot of experience using his staysail as the primary headsail.  (He also gets away using it as part of a double-head rig when beam reaching or thereabouts.)  See his Sweet Ruca channel on YouTube.

Maybe I over-explained ..... Sail Safe... Dick



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S/V Sweet Ruca

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Jul 15, 2025, 10:16:28 PMJul 15
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Well said Dick! 

For the OP and those that recently joined, Dick is an original J/46 owner, the first to Circumnavigate on one, and is also the chair of the US Sailing Safety At Sea committee. 


We absorbed much of his advice before setting out on Sweet Ruca. 

Just highlighting an example (among other the many other experienced owners) of the level of knowledge and experience being passed on in the J4x group.



Heath Bowden

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Jul 15, 2025, 10:40:03 PMJul 15
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Curtis - completely agree - this group is incredible.  

Dick - I wanted to thank you for your thorough response and thoughts on my original question.  I enjoyed (marveled?) at your examples from sailing up the Red Sea!

My original question was to help us settle how important the IFS is for us on these boats as we look for one.  And the very informative and experienced responses definitely confirmed that aspect of what we are looking for.

Thank you everyone!
_______________________________________________

Heath Bowden


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Ken austin

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Jul 16, 2025, 5:22:30 PMJul 16
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Pls see my experience below on Mimosa , my 1989 J 40 (approx #86) as I looked into  this for a trip I am on CA to AU. 

I have added further comments on upgrades,  not specific to the thread,  which may be helpful / of interest to wider group.


The quotes  I got were significant for the chain plate reinforce so  I passed but as noted there is a clear avenue to do so w glassing in around fwd bulkhead. 

Re checkstays, I opted to updated them and my rigger  indicated it was  all about support to counter pumping so interesting to hear about sail shape focus. I replaced the inherited two wire check stays  w dyneema and they are soft shackled at the bottom so they can be removed easily when not in use ie portion from mid mast  stays attached but can be held at shroud base and then connected to extension further back on toe rail/ spin block attachments when needed.  Mainly employed when back stay is on , going upwind  and have seas that could cause bouncing and mid mast inversion. 

For general interest, other additions / improvements included :

New Yanmar JH40 engine replacing previous Yanmar. Straight forward , but expensive,  work done  by List Marine Sausalito as even with mid deck hatch removal, lots of labor involved

Addition of Katadyn 40 E Survivor water purifier. Plumbed to new 25 g bladder behind aft head w separate foot pump and nozzle on port sink

Removal of fwd head , and holding tank, to create more storage

Two additional fuel tanks so no need for external fuel cans on deck. One under the stairs (20 g) below replacing trash can and one replaces the aft water tank (30g). Not plumbed to main tank (33) but instead use mobile , small fuel pump when needed to transfer into main tank. Idea copied from various race boats on SF Bay. Total 80+ gallons and burns approx 2/3 gallon at 2000 or close to a gallon / hr at 2600. 

Muir 1250 Storm windlass. All good but should have put battery under  v berth on starboard to offset port listing issue discussed elsewhere

Removed hydraulic back stay and boomvang and replaced with new  Harken self contained hydraulic back stay and spring vang

Replaced various Barient winches w new Lewmar

Added Hydrovane, removed old ST4000 autopilot

Rebuilt steering quadrant and replaced upper and lower bearings (KKMI. In Sausalito) in line w previous comments on this subject) 

Currently under way btw Tahiti and Tonga and additions have been working and appreciated.  The  boat handles the open ocean veey well. 

Looking to sell in AU in Sept in Sydney or back in W Coast dependent on shipping.  If there are  any interested parties with future blue water voyages planned looking for a turn key option, pls be in touch as the boat is now well set up for such travel. 

Best, Ken 

On Jul 12, 2025, at 5:42 AM, David Jade <da...@mutable.net> wrote:

 I’ve been told by another long time (retired) J Boat dealer (Paul Mikulski here in Annapolis) that the running backstays are only for mainsail shape - not needed for mast support. Could also help with mast pumping in rough conditions though. 
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