How to backup ZX-Spectrum floppies?

Mantas

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Jan 12, 2021, 6:22:54 AM1/12/21

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I have 2 floppy disks from a Lithuanian ZX-Spectrum clone. I would like to
make backups (if they are still readable).

I have a 386 with MS-DOS and Win 3.11 and if needed I can connect a 5,25"
drive to WinXP computer.

How should I proceed without damaging the disks:

1.. To make a RAW disk image (and later copy to another disk)

2.. Browse the software/run on an emulator

Thanks!

Theo

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Jan 12, 2021, 5:47:47 PM1/12/21

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Mantas <man...@universe-trinti.lt> wrote:
> I have 2 floppy disks from a Lithuanian ZX-Spectrum clone. I would like to
> make backups (if they are still readable).
>
> I have a 386 with MS-DOS and Win 3.11 and if needed I can connect a 5,25"
> drive to WinXP computer.

Are they 5.25" floppies? Do you know how the drive was connected?

The only Spectrum with a floppy port was the +3.
There were third party interfaces that presumably had an FDC chip.

There was no common Spectrum DOS, so as I understood it every interface
manufacturer did their own thing, with their own on-disc format. Apparently
TR-DOS was popular in the USSR.

My point being you need to know how the interface lays out the
tracks before you can image a floppy.

If it is TR-DOS, there are some tools to make images using a PC here:
https://speccy.xyz/trdos.html

Theo

Mantas

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Jan 13, 2021, 6:22:50 AM1/13/21

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That's how they look: https://photos.app.goo.gl/BHWAm4bg484SWsRPA
Yes, they are 5,25".
The drive is integrated in the same case as ZX-Spectrum clone. The computer
is working, but I want to backup the disks before trying anything.

"Theo" <theom...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote in message
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Giuseppe³

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Jan 13, 2021, 1:56:35 PM1/13/21

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Il 12/01/21 11:42, Mantas ha scritto:

> I have 2 floppy disks from a Lithuanian ZX-Spectrum clone. I would like
> to make backups (if they are still readable).
>
> I have a 386 with MS-DOS and Win 3.11 and if needed I can connect a
> 5,25" drive to WinXP computer.
>
> How should I proceed without damaging the disks:
>
> 1.. To make a RAW disk image (and later copy to another disk)

Using teledisk on a msdos computer and a 360K drive you can take the raw
image og the disk and then create a copy.
Use only the copy into your computer and take the master copy in a safe
place.

Regards
Giuseppe

Giuseppe³

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Jan 13, 2021, 2:01:45 PM1/13/21

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Il 13/01/21 19:56, Giuseppe³ ha scritto:

> Il 12/01/21 11:42, Mantas ha scritto:
>> I have 2 floppy disks from a Lithuanian ZX-Spectrum clone. I would
>> like to make backups (if they are still readable).

I've take a look to the link and saw the disk photo.

A question is: Are these disk DS=Double side QD= Quad density???
I think that with a PC floppy drive you can only read Single or Double
density (180/360K) or High density (1.2M).

Regards
Giuseppe

Giuseppe³

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Jan 13, 2021, 2:09:28 PM1/13/21

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Il 13/01/21 20:01, Giuseppe³ ha scritto:

Looking at these datas:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disk_density

Maybe you can read the QD disk using a 1.2M floppy drive and teledisk,
but the problem will be write the image on a new disk.

Mantas

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Jan 14, 2021, 6:17:20 AM1/14/21

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Unfortunately I have no idea what kind of floppies those are.

"Giuseppe³" <miaooaimATt...@xxx.xxx> wrote in message
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Giuseppe³

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Jan 14, 2021, 1:40:56 PM1/14/21

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Il 14/01/21 12:14, Mantas ha scritto:

> Unfortunately I have no idea what kind of floppies those are.

At the top of the disk label I can read "DS QD".

Is it correct?

If yes them are Double side/Quad density.

I never saw it before :)

Regards

Dino.Baldi

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Jan 15, 2021, 4:56:30 AM1/15/21

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Il giorno giovedì 14 gennaio 2021 alle 19:40:56 UTC+1 Giuseppe³ ha scritto:
> Il 14/01/21 12:14, Mantas ha scritto:

> I never saw it before :)

Ciao,
try to have a look at that:
http://www.vcfed.org/forum/archive/index.php/t-12435.html

Dino
comPVter

Mike Garcia

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Jan 17, 2021, 6:47:36 PM1/17/21

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I would connect it to the winxp
and use DD (Disk Dump) http://www.chrysocome.net/dd
That will create 100% same images from the floppies.

Then I would also do a copy /a (copy /? I think that's how it's done in
DOS) to copy all files into a folder and zip it up.

That's how I did my VC++ 20 disks
https://archive.org/details/MicrosoftVisualStudioC1.01993

----------
http://mgarcia.org/

Mantas

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Jan 18, 2021, 9:27:39 AM1/18/21

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Might be, not sure :)

"Giuseppe³" <miaooaimATt...@xxx.xxx> wrote in message

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Mantas

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Jan 18, 2021, 9:27:40 AM1/18/21

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Thanks, I will try that.

"Mike Garcia" <mi...@mgarcia.nospam> wrote in message
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Theo

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Jan 18, 2021, 5:28:44 PM1/18/21

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Mike Garcia <mi...@mgarcia.nospam> wrote:
> I would connect it to the winxp
> and use DD (Disk Dump) http://www.chrysocome.net/dd
> That will create 100% same images from the floppies.

That doesn't appear to handle floppies with sector numbering or track layout
that isn't the same as DOS uses. For example, I doubt it will handle discs
with sectors numbered from zero (as some retrocomputers do) instead of one
(as DOS does).

Apparently:
https://sinclair.wiki.zxnet.co.uk/wiki/TR-DOS_filesystem
TR-DOS floppies are 40 or 80 track, 16 sectors per track, 256 byte sectors
(it appears to only refer to sectors 1 to 15, so it's unclear how sector
numbering works). I'm not sure how that handles quad-density floppies, but
presumably the same disc layout but with more sectors per track.

Meanwhile, the PC 1.2MB floppy uses 80 tracks, 512 byte sectors, and 15
sectors per track.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_floppy_disk_formats

These formats are incompatible. I think it is possible to program Windows
XP to read a different layout of floppy disc if you install a suitable
driver (it's easier on DOS or Windows 9x), but you won't be able to simply
image them with regular tools.

Theo

Mike Garcia

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Jan 18, 2021, 6:30:44 PM1/18/21

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oh thought I read he has a XP machine...
If it's a DOS/XP issue, maybe making a boot USB/CD/floppy and using linux
will provide the correct drivers for that floppy?

--

Mike Garcia
http://mgarcia.org

Mantas

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Jan 27, 2021, 7:35:23 AM1/27/21

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I can use any OS on PC really.

"Mike Garcia" <mi...@mgarcia.nospam> wrote in message

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MaveRick

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Mar 10, 2021, 2:33:15 AM3/10/21

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Hi Mantas,

I never made copy of Sinclair diskette, but I did on some Olivetti fdd.

At the time the most useful software was the CopyQM that was able to make
(with its BLIND COPY feature) track-by-track copy including hiding sectors,
track zero, and even errors (a way to protect original software) to allow a
perfect replica of the floppy.

The only problem is that it cannot work on windows/emulated environment, as
these are masking the direct access to the hardware, avoiding any “custom”
instruction to the fdd

So only DOS on a x86 machine (286/386/486)

Mantas <man...@universe-trinti.lt> wrote:
> I can use any OS on PC really.
>
>>

Mantas

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Mar 12, 2021, 6:32:43 AM3/12/21

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Hi,

thanks for the info, DOS on 386 is not a problem :)

"MaveRick" <computeli...@gimeil.comm> wrote in message
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