Following Srila Prabhupada's Orders: The Ritviks vs. the ISKCONites

[Pratyatosa]

Following Srila Prabhupada's Orders: The Ritviks vs. the ISKCONites (Quotes, some paraphrased, followed by who is following/accepting or not following/not accepting):

1. "Diacritics henceforward": The Ritviks sometimes do not follow; the ISKCONites usually follow.

On December 31, 1971, Prabhupada ordered that, henceforward (from now on), all of his printed publications, including Back to Godhead magazine, include the Sanskrit diacritics.

2. "Ritvik henceforward": All Ritviks accept; most ISKCONites reject.

On July 9, 1977, Prabhupada ordered that, henceforward (from now on), all initiations within ISKCON, both 1st and 2nd, be performed by whichever ritvik representative of the Acharya is nearest.

3. "Vanaprastha at age 50": Generally speaking, not followed by either group, but followed by a higher percentage of ISKCONites than Ritviks.

How do we take vanaprastha? We follow Srila Prabhupada's divine example: leave home, live alone in a small apartment, and refrain from owning/operating a motor vehicle.

4. "Do not change my books": Generally speaking, accepted by the Ritviks; rejected by the ISKCONites.

5. "Do not edit my lecture tapes": Generally speaking, accepted by both the Ritviks and the ISKCONites.

6. "Do not send your children to karmi school": Followed by a higher percentage of ISKCONites than Ritviks.

7. "Never bathe naked, even when alone": Followed by a higher percentage of ISKCONites than Ritviks.

8. "Natural delivery of child [at home]": Followed by a higher percentage of ISKCONites than Ritviks.

My wife gave birth at the age of fourteen years. She is still living. She is ten years younger than me. So sixty-eight, sixty-nine, she is. She gave birth child at the age of fourteen. In 1918 I was married, and 1921 she gave birth the child, my first son. And she was never unhealthy; neither she had to go to the hospital for maternity hell. Natural delivery of child [at home]. (Morning walk, Geneva, June 8, 1974)

[larry freeman p]

since I 'qualify' as a vanaprastha,
why is it 'necessary' to not drive a motor vehicle?
 

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From: praty...@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2013 06:21:28 -0400
Subject: Following Srila Prabhupada's Orders: The Ritviks vs. the ISKCONites
To: istag...@googlegroups.com

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[Pratyatosa]

On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 7:20 PM, larry freeman p <l...@....net> wrote:

since I 'qualify' as a vanaprastha,
why is it 'necessary' to not drive a motor vehicle?

Good question.

1. Srila Prabhupada never drove a motor vehicle when he was a vanaprastha, so we should follow his example.

2. Vanaprastha means retired: no job/business and no house/property to maintain, so what need is there for a motor vehicle?

3. Operating a motor vehicle is for the sudra (fruitive worker) class.

4. Ask any old person why he still drives and he will tell you, "It's my freedom!" In other words, it's for his own selfish sense gratification. A motor vehicle is a dangerous weapon, and when we get old, our senses are less acute and our reflexes are slower. Therefore, when we drive, we are endangering the lives of others for our own selfish sense gratification. It's like giving a loaded machine gun to a monkey!

5. Walking is good exercise.

6. Not owning/operating a motor vehicle saves a lot of money.

7. While walking to the store/library/hospital/VA clinic/etc. and back, you can chant your rounds, so for devotees, not driving also saves time.

If you live out in the country, and therefore need a motor vehicle to drive into town to get supplies, then you should move into town! Srila Prabhupada never put himself into such a situation. We should follow his divine example!

A some point in your aging process, you may no longer be able to walk, so make sure that you live in a place where there is affordable public transportation available for wheelchair-bound people.

Ys, Ptd

[Spirit Soul]

"It's like giving a loaded machine gun to a monkey!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXcnlie9k8w

--

[rammohan das]

Mail from Rocana to George Smith

Dear George prabhu,

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

I know we have another incoming article or email from you, while I’ll get
to shortly. We’re buried in incoming right now. Meanwhile, on this one…

On, Yasodanandana, we can only speculate about what devotees will or will
not believe, and from whom. From my experience, Krishnakant is the man
who, far more than Yasoda, has had vastly more influence on people to
adopt Rtvik-vada. Yasoda has written very little on the topic, and when
he does, he won’t put his on name to it. He hides behind the skirt of the
‘Prabhupadanugas’ identity. Krishnakant put himself out in a big way,
sent preachers all over the planet preaching his message, not Yasoda’s
message – and there is a significant difference between the two. From
what I can see, it is the Krishnakant version, not the Yasodanandana
version, that the great majority of Rtviks adhere to. Given all that,
wiring Yasodanandana up into his puppet form so I can get his head to nod
‘yes’ doesn’t much interest me.

I agree that we have every reason to fear the contagious spread of
Rtvik-vada. Asiddhanta has plagued the sampradaya through each one of its
branches over time. It is the nature of the material world. So I don’t
want to overly dramatize the important for us, here and now, as being
anything more than it is. We are not special. We are suffering in this
Kali Yuga prisonhouse just like all the conditioned souls who went before
us, even in this sampradaya…. many of whom were perhaps us, in different
bodies.

I agree that Madhu Pandit and ISKCON could just as easily marry themselves
together one day, as not. Both do whatever is politically expedient.
They are equally corrupt. Spoiled fruit from the same rotten tree.

Yes, Madhu Pandit would only debate Rtvik if it were politically helpful
to him. But that is a possible scenario… Given the slew of trouble he’s
gotten himself into, that day could possibly come. There’s a good chance
he’s about to lose his seat of power at Bangalore. He’ll then have to
start over, and he may very well do so by institutionalizing Rtvik all
over the planet, grabbing up the disenfranchised from every corner. If
that happens, there’s probably no stopping it. We’ll only be able to see
what Krsna’s arrangements are, and do what we can.

If Madhu Pandit does go worldwide, you can be sure that he’ll exploit the
Indians, just like ISKCON did. He and his associates are very bigoted and
rascist against the white-bodied devotees. We have ample proof of that.
Look at their new California scene…. all Indians, from what I’ve seen.
Where is Yasodanandana, the king of the West Coast Rtviks? From the
website photos, it doesn’t appear that he even got an invitation to the
opening festivities. Although Madhu Pandit Yasoda and Damaghosa audience
in Bangalore, which they sucked as much notoriety as possible out of, I
don’t believe Madhu Pandit will ever form more than a superficial alliance
with these ‘mellecha white boys’. It’s beneath him.

So all that said, I continue to think that the only thing we can really do
is take our fundamental argument to the individuals, to the grassroots
level. Push them to admit that there is no evidentiary or philosophical
basis for Rtvik-vada. Show them that the Sampradaya Acarya position is
the natural alternative to Rtvik-ism and corrupt ISKCON, and rely on
Supersoul to take it from there.

In the meantime, we’re going to fight like there’s no tomorrow, using the
scant resources we have in hand, and our own limited intelligence and
abilities. But, fight for the sake of fighting. We won’t spend our time,
however, trying to engage men like Yasodanandana, or Puranjana, in debate.
As I recall, not so long ago you weren’t sure about Puranjana, didn’t
realize what a liar and a crazy man he was. (Or maybe I’m confusing you
with someone else…) At any rate, make no mistake, Puranajana is just that
– an absolute lunatic, a pathological liar, and a fraud. And you know who
talks to him, at length, almost daily by phone, consulting with him,
coming up with slanderous arguments together, jacking around and joking
about how to denigrate their enemies? Yasodanandana. For the last 20
years, those two have been thick as thieves. I used to tell myself that
somehow or other, Yasoda associated closely with Puranjana just to be
kind, but he managed to keep his own intelligence and ethics intact. I no
longer believe that. I think they have a twisted, co-dependent
relationship of the worst kind. So I’m not interested in engaging in a
mock battle with either those two. It is a complete waste of time.

I very much appreciate your interest in helping on this front, prabhu. And I’d like to offer some advice. Rather than playing devil’s advocate, posting questions that look like something the Rtviks would come up with – and being a good resemblance, thanks to the lack of logic– I suggest that you instead present yourself straight-on. Begin writing with all your heart and soul. Write as George, the non-Rtvik. Use your realization and intelligence to rebut Rtvik-vada, to defeat the attraction towards Ritvik-ism in any way that you see fit. You often give me advice about my approach. Well, here’s my advice: fashion your own approach. Let us work together, by all means, but let us employ whatever tactics and realizations fit us best. If you’re convinced Rtvik is wrong, then argue against it as effectively as you can muster. And often… not quarterly, not monthly, but weekly. If you think the ‘no living guru needed’ hybrid has merit, then argue that and defend it. (I’ll challenge you as time permits.) For my part, I’m not yet ready to begin that frontal assault. It is next in line, after The Final Order is defeated, as best we can do that.

That’s all I know for now, prabhu.
Hoping this finds you well,

Your servant,
Rocana dasa 11/14/2011 10:59:53 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time