Bogus ISKCON Astrologer Syamasundara Dasa debunked: Sri Lanka IS THE LANKA OF RAMAYANA

[BhaktaRobin]

Hari Bol,

please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Shyamasundara Dasa (an so called ISKCON Astrologer) was again proven false in this nice article:

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/06-16/editorials13979.htm

I have some experience with this guy myself.

When I was suffering from a severe health problem he told me to do fire sacrifices for 10000US$, which is totally rediculous.

He never told me about the inexpensive/free remedies like Narayana Kavacha given by Srila Prabhupada in the SB!

Despite the fact that Srila Prabhupada was against astrology, these ISKCON astrologers fool the innocent neophytes with their charlatan business.

Here is the proof Srila Prabhupada was against astrology: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUtSme0pY6E

I have experienced myself that the so called astrologers and Brahmanas of ISKCON are just cheating people and in Kali Yuga, you can not trust a Brahmana like in other Yugas.

This is the lessons many devotees will have to learn, if they want to survive in this Kali Yuga and give up blind faith into the Brahmana class.

Ys

Bhakta Robin

[Pratyatosa]

I talked with Shyamasundara Dasa, the "always wrong about everything Vedic astrologer" at the 55th Street temple in NYC back in 1980, when the GBC was in a panic to sell it. He was predicting that there would be nuclear war "very soon" and that NYC would be a prime target! "After all, that's what Srila Prabhupada predicted, right?" Therefore, I suspect that he was part of the reason why the GBC was in such a hurry to sell it.

Ys, Ptd

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[Jack Eskildsen]

 I have always liked that verse about the Narayana Kavacha. I have read several of the stories in Srimad Bhagavatam that says just by reading and reciting it your life will be successful and you will return back to Godhead. I am thankful to Srila Prabhupada for going through the trouble of distributing his books to us fallen people of the Kali-yuga.

[sugriv...@gmail.com]

According to this article http://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/adp/ashtamangala_deva_prasna_1.html he was in India from 1980-83 and not in NYC. Looks like you need to get your RAM replaced. (-:

[sugriv...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, June 4, 2016 at 3:23:45 PM UTC+5:30, BhaktaRobin wrote:

Hari Bol,

please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Shyamasundara Dasa (an so called ISKCON Astrologer) was again proven false in this nice article:

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/06-16/editorials13979.htm

I have some experience with this guy myself.

When I was suffering from a severe health problem he told me to do fire sacrifices for 10000US$,

I had remedies prescribed by him and they also cost about 10,000 but not dollars but Indian rupees. which is about US$150. And he didn't do the sacrifices  he just prescribed them  you find whoever you want to do them for you. If you can't find someone then he pointed me to the chief priest in Srirangam who charged me about 10,000 rupees = $150. So I don't really know what you are talking about.


 

which is totally rediculous.

He never told me about the inexpensive/free remedies like Narayana Kavacha given by Srila Prabhupada in the SB!

Then why did you go to him then? Why didn't you just medicate yourself?
 

Despite the fact that Srila Prabhupada was against astrology,

Hmm out of the hundreds of quotes by Prabhupada on astrology only 2-3 are negative. It is discussed in this article http://bvks.com/reader/vaisnava_culture_etiquette_and_behavior/astrology/


 

[BhaktaRobin]

HariBol,

pamho AGTSP

The reason is always the same: EXPLOIT AND CHEAT TO MAKE THAT HONEY, THAT IS CALLED MONEY

BVKS is another unauthorized Guru, who is just interested in exploiting new devotees, who read Srila Prabhupadas books and are unaware of the Ritvik order.

Astrologers and false Gurus are both praying on the ISKCON Devotees, to suck out their money.

Yes he doesn't ear anything on the Yagnas(I never said that), he also told me about Murari Bhatta, the very nice Priest from Sri Rangam.

If you watch the video I uploaded, you well learn, that Srila Prabhupada was 100% against astrology for devotees.

There was another Srila Prabhupada Memory, where one devotee purchased a Rahu Kavacha from one astrologer and Srila Prabhupada was against it...

Do whatever you like, I did my duty and warned innocent people to not get ripped off by the "Brahmins" of the age of Kali!

Ys

Bhakta Robin

[bhaktasa...@gmail.com]

Hare Krsna Bhakta Robin Prabhu

Yes, you are 100% correct, I Truely accept your words....this whole world is full of cheating and cheated

[Gab]

This guy Shyamasundara Dasa is obnoxious, rude and intolerant at so many levels.  He is probably the last person God would communicate with.  He is just a terrible person, imo.  When communicating by email, if he does not like your reply, he threatens to report to "your service provider".  Really?  This dude has read the replies but because he does not agree with what he reads, he threatens?  To a service provider?  Are we still in the 80s?  And to add to that he is a so called "man of god"?  Give me a break.  What a waste of Oxygen :)

[Pratyatosa]

"...he was in India from 1980-83 and not in NYC." But it doesn't say exactly when in 1980 he when to India. For all we know, he might have been in NYC for most of that year, right?

In any case, it looks like Krishna tricked him into using a bogus system of astrology (sidereal). Casting an astrological horoscope is a science, pure and simple. When it comes to science, which country is near the bottom of the barrel? India! This can be proven by the fact that only one out of hundreds of scientific Nobel prizes have been won by an Indian on Indian soil! For that reason alone, it should be obvious that the Tropical (Western) system of astrology is correct! Obviously, the sidereal system of astrology is just a childish attempt, on the part of a few foolish Indian "astrologers," at oneupmanship over the Western astrologers! Here's proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiGrAwe78-A

[Radha Ramana]

I think you are mistaken if you think that Vic is propagating Western astrology. This is simply another school of Vedic astrology that uses tropical rasis. It still uses the nakshatras sidereally with a slightly different ayanamsa. All the other techniques give by Jamini and Parashara are still used. Vedic astrology has much more sophisticated techniques and is therefore much better at making predictions than Western astrology.

@Bhakta Robin Did the Narayana Kavacha solve your health issues?

  

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[Pratyatosa]

"A slightly different ayanamsa?" Obviously, Vic uses an ayanamsa of ZERO!

[Radha Ramana]

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

[Pratyatosa]

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

[rainer hahn]

Ayanāṃśa – or where exactly does the sidereal zodiac begin?

"The weakest point of so-called “Vedic” astrology is that it cannot say where exactly the sidereal zodiac has its zero point. This question is of central importance because without a well-founded zero point there can be no correct positions of the planets in zodiac signs, lunar mansions, and other subdivisions of the ecliptic. And without these there can be no correct astrological chart interpretations and predictions. Again, the history of “Vedic” astrology can show us how serious and unsolved this problem is.

https://www.astro.com/astrology/in_vedic2_e.htm

[Radha Ramana]

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

[rainer hahn]

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

[Radha Ramana]

The star's orbit is not changing, the star is orbiting around the galactic centre. The point is that the position of the star is not fixed. It's orbit is fixed.

On 7 Jan 2019 10:34 am, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 8:36 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 3:38 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 7:50 PM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

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[rainer hahn]

Prabhupada: "The sun is rising exactly in time, astronomically. The astronomical watch is one ten-thousandth part of a second. It is so accurate. You'll find everything is going on."

If there is no change of time in the rising of the sun, then why should other planets change time?

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 9:38 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The star's orbit is not changing, the star is orbiting around the galactic centre. The point is that the position of the star is not fixed. It's orbit is fixed.

On 7 Jan 2019 10:34 am, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 8:36 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 3:38 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 7:50 PM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

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[Radha Ramana]

I thought were talking about stars not planets

On 7 Jan 2019 12:53 pm, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

Prabhupada: "The sun is rising exactly in time, astronomically. The astronomical watch is one ten-thousandth part of a second. It is so accurate. You'll find everything is going on."

If there is no change of time in the rising of the sun, then why should other planets change time?

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 9:38 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The star's orbit is not changing, the star is orbiting around the galactic centre. The point is that the position of the star is not fixed. It's orbit is fixed.

On 7 Jan 2019 10:34 am, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 8:36 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 3:38 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 7:50 PM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

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[Pratyatosa]

Radha Ramana: "The dasa system is based on the nakshatras...and is very important for predictive astrology."

Except for the fact that a female "Vedic" astrologer, in the spring of 2016, predicted that Trump would win, when it comes to world events, I haven't seen any evidence that  ISKCON's "Vedic" astrologers are able to predict much of anything! How can "astrologers" who are too stupid to tell whether someone is a Scorpio rising or a Sagittarius rising be any good at interpreting the more subtle aspects of astrology, such as the nakshatras?

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 6:01 PM Price <andrew...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are planets according to veda. There is only one "star" being the sun. 

[rainer hahn]

your question is whether celestial bodies  change the way they move and thus there has to be ayanamsa, making adjustments. Prabhupada says no, everything happens exactly in time without any change.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayanamsa

On Tue, Jan 8, 2019 at 12:01 AM Price <andrew...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are planets according to veda. There is only one "star" being the sun. 

On Tuesday, 8 January 2019 00:48:51 UTC+13, Radha Ramana wrote:

I thought were talking about stars not planets

On 7 Jan 2019 12:53 pm, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

Prabhupada: "The sun is rising exactly in time, astronomically. The astronomical watch is one ten-thousandth part of a second. It is so accurate. You'll find everything is going on."

If there is no change of time in the rising of the sun, then why should other planets change time?

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 9:38 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The star's orbit is not changing, the star is orbiting around the galactic centre. The point is that the position of the star is not fixed. It's orbit is fixed.

On 7 Jan 2019 10:34 am, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 8:36 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 3:38 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 7:50 PM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

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[Radha Ramana]

It has already been established that ISKCON's astrologers are mistaken in their calculations of the rasis( and nakshatras IMHO). I don't know what point your trying to make.

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[Radha Ramana]

Prabhupada never made any comment about Ayanamsa. All celestial bodies are moving in their orbits including stars, "exactly in time without any change" and ayanamsa is simple used to calculate the change of the stars in their orbits, "exactly in time without any change ". 

I have said all I wish to say on the topic, so I won't be replying to any further points. 

[Radha Ramana]

As far as Vedic astrology is concerned Nakshatras(stars) and Grahas(planets) have different effects. It can be clearly observed that stars don't rotate around  the Sun, whether they reflect the light of the sun like a planet or are self-luminous like a star is irrelevant to this discussion. 

On Tue, Jan 8, 2019 at 1:01 AM Price <andrew...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are planets according to veda. There is only one "star" being the sun. 

On Tuesday, 8 January 2019 00:48:51 UTC+13, Radha Ramana wrote:

I thought were talking about stars not planets

On 7 Jan 2019 12:53 pm, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

Prabhupada: "The sun is rising exactly in time, astronomically. The astronomical watch is one ten-thousandth part of a second. It is so accurate. You'll find everything is going on."

If there is no change of time in the rising of the sun, then why should other planets change time?

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 9:38 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The star's orbit is not changing, the star is orbiting around the galactic centre. The point is that the position of the star is not fixed. It's orbit is fixed.

On 7 Jan 2019 10:34 am, "rainer hahn" <raine...@gmail.com> wrote:

In order to determine whether the stars are changing their orbit, this might be a speculation.  Prabhupada never said like that. Prabhupada rather says repeatedly that all celestial bodies move exactly in time. "We can see practically that universal affairs, how things are being managed. Exactly in the right time, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, and they're working exactly to the time. In this season, the sun will stay during daytime so many hours. Exactly we find. Not that this year he's staying from six to six, and next year he's not appearing. No. There is no question of accidents. The same date, same month, and the same appearance of the sun and the moon. Everything."

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 8:36 AM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

The surya-siddhanta gives coordinates for the stars but a lot of the coordinates are inaccurate now because the stars themselves are actually moving relative to the galactic center. You also have procession of the equinoxes on earth which has moved the stars from earth's perspective, which was at zero ayanamsa 1700 years ago to almost one rasi today. The original tropical vedic school calculates ayanamsa using the galactic center(not the star citra), since it is the only truly fixed point, and the middle of mula(root) nakshatra, it also divides the 27 segments along the equator rather than elliptic, as traditionally done, since the movement of the stars has nothing to do with the movement of the sun along the elliptic. The result is an ayanamsa slightly different than Lahiri, but more astronomically accurate, at least according to the opinion of this school of thought.

The nakshatras are described as the 27 wives of the moon. The moon governs our mind and how things grow in our lives, so the nakshatras give 27 flavors of how things grow, so it can give a lot information about a persons character. The dasa system is based on the nakshatras(you may have heard someone say "I'm in Rahu dasa" etc) and is very important for predictive astrology. The nakshatras are also intrinsic to muhurta(auspicious time) calculations. The nakshatras and planets are conscious entities that have a lot of influence on our lives.  

I don't know of any prominent vedic astrologers that use zero ayanamsa, it wouldn't make sense astronomically. 

On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 3:38 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

Stars are in exact positions, so how can there be any controversy about the value of the ayanamsa when it comes to "star based calculations?"

Are there any Vedic astrologers who use an ayanamsa of zero when it comes to Nakshatras? If so, how well does it work?

Are there any that simply ignore the Nakshatras?

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 7:50 PM Radha Ramana <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ayanamsa is zero for the rasis but is still used for Nakshatras, since procession of equinox must still be accounted for in star based calculations. All the Dasa systems use Nakshatras.

https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2015/12/14/which-ayanamsha-brief/

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[Pratyatosa]

Radha Ramana Prabhu, is English your 2nd language or what? It's called "REVOLVE around the Sun!"

Also, Vedic astrologers are supposed to be brahmins, which means that they are not allowed to charge for their services. In other words, as soon as they charge one penny for their services, they automatically drop down to the merchant class, and, therefore, can no longer be called genuine Vedic astrologers, right?

[rainer hahn]

yes, these astrologers are fully business oriented.  As soon you quote Prabhupada on false gurus: "Guru na sa syāt. This is the injunction. "No rascal should become a guru unless he can save his disciples from the cycle of birth and death." In other words, anyone who wants to become guru, if he cannot teach his disciples how to surrender, govinda-caraṇa-dvayam, anāśritya, how to take shelter of the lotus feet of Govinda, he should not become guru. That is cheating. That is cheating." (Los Angeles, July 3, 1972)

They delete such quotes as,  "doing damage to business, doing harm to our business".

[rainer hahn]

According to Western Astrology, ISKCON leaders look like gangsters, hoodlums, and drug addicts.  According to Vedic Astrology, where everything is counted backwards 23 degrees,  they look like poets and philosophers. This might explain why Western Astrology is rejected. Actually, anybody who questions their Vedic Astrology is considered an aparadhi.

On Wed, Jan 9, 2019 at 4:04 AM Pratyatosa <praty...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Vichal Gajapersad]

Hari Bol Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances, All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

I also see within ISKCON (Syamasundara, Nalinikantha, Patitapavana and Abhay Mudra devi dasi) but also outside of it (Vic DiCara, Ryan, Kailasa Candra Dasa and more) who have different opinions.

Even withing ISKCON there is a difference of opinion. Regarding Srila Prabhupada's rising sign for example.

Syamasundara Dasa has posted an updated version of his article: Transcendental horoscope of Srila Prabhupada here : https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/prabhupada/thsp-01.html

What do you think about these?

Thanks again Prabhu,

Hare Krishna,

Vichal

Op dinsdag 8 januari 2019 02:40:05 UTC+1 schreef Pratyatosa:

[Vichal Gajapersad]

Hari Bol Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances, All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

I to am of the opinion that Srila Prabhupada was not very fond of those who are members of ISKCON who practice astrology.

However, he did say that astrology is a science and it is part of the Veda and that Brahmanas are always studiying the Veda.

So, I'd say both sides are correct.

Now regarding your link: http://bvks.com/reader/vaisnava_culture_etiquette_and_behavior/astrology/

This does not work anymore. Could you post again. I would like to have that list.

Also, Syamasundara Dasa Prabhu did release an article recently: The Transcendental horoscope of Srila Prabhupada.

I loved reading it. There is this controversy regarding the rising sign of Srila Prabhupada. It's either Sagittarius or Capricorn.

I find Syamasundara Dasa Prabhu's article very clear and professional.

Hare Krishna,

Vichal

Op dinsdag 13 september 2016 11:31:30 UTC+2 schreef sugri...@gmail.com:

[Radha Ramana]

The parivartana yoga of Mer(practicality) and Venus(women) probably referring to Prabhupada's revolutionary treatment of women in the Vaisnava tradition.

On 10 May 2019 7:57 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ram...@gmail.com> wrote:

According to the tropical zodiac Prabhupada's lagna is Aquarius(assuming his birth time is exactly 16h00). Giving him Moon(devotion) and Mars(character) in the 5th house(devotion). Jupiter(Guru) in 7th(partnership). Sat(authority) in the 10th(achievement). Mer(manager) in 9th(dharma). Sun(soul) in 8th(12th from 9th, purpose of the Guru). Venus(wife) in 8th(destruction). Mer in the 9th is ruling 4 planets and the final depositor in the chart, showing someone who's very practical and balanced in religious affairs. Mer also has a parivartana yoga with Ven in the 8th, showing someone who breaks from tradition.

With Capricorn lagna Prabhupada has only 1 planet in an angle, 2 in a trine and 4 planets in dushtana(inauspicious) houses. Hence why some astrologers wanted to rectify his chart to make it look better. Sidereal astrologers always have to fudge things so that it makes sense.

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[Radha Ramana]

Mer also represents communication so Mer as the final depositor in the 9th(dharma) for an Aquarius lagna make a lot of sense since Prabhupada was a great communicator or preacher of dharma.

[rainer hahn]

Hari Bol,

please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

They recently discovered in a few temples which are older than one thousand years stone carvings of the tropical zodiac, see video link. This means that sidereal zodiac is rather a new invention. Also it seems they keep Srila Bhaktisiddhanta  Maharaja's books on astrology hidden? Some astrologer recently pointed out that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Maharaja used the system of tropical zodiac.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1Ifepa_O-I

ys

Rammohan das

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[Radha Ramana]

Sat being the slowest moving planet in 10th indicates someone who would achieve things later in life but those achievements would be lasting.

[Vichal Gajapersad]

Hari Bol Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances, All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Prabhu, it's like you read my mind. I also became confused about Srila Prabhupada's rising sign because I know astrologers (not personally but through the internet) who are for Sagittarius rising sign and others who are for Capricorn.

I think both sides have presented the arguments well. Still I find Syamasundara's a bit better (but thats because he talks on the technical level). He has updated his article just recently.

I am fixated on subject since 2012. It is confusing as well because I like both Syamasundara, Kailasa Candra as well as Patita Pavana, Abhay Mudra Mata and Nalini Kantha.

Then this year, I came accross Vrajakishora Dasa (Vic DiCara). Now this Prabhu is (for me then) on the level of Syamasundara. Vic DiCara used to be an astrologer using the Sidereal zodiac.

Now he says: Use the Sidereal zodiac for the naksatra's and the Tropical zodiac for the rasis. It does make sense when you consult scripture if you want to know what the start of the zodiac is (Aries).

He has so explained it very professionally as well on his website. I hope Syamasundara can at least respond to the arguments Vic DiCara presents. Also, Vic DiCara comes over as a nice person.

For fun, I also calculated Srila Prabhupada's chart using 16:00 hours as birthtime with Tropical zodiac. And guess what: Aquarius is rising.
I thought, when I post this or ask other about this, I will be declared a crazy man. 

And now Prabhu, you come with it!!! I am going to make a webpage and present all viewpoints and let the readers decide!

Again thanks Prabhu!

Hare Krishna! All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

Op vrijdag 10 mei 2019 20:12:10 UTC+2 schreef Radha Ramana:

The parivartana yoga of Mer(practicality) and Venus(women) probably referring to Prabhupada's revolutionary treatment of women in the Vaisnava tradition.

On 10 May 2019 7:57 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ra...@gmail.com> wrote:

According to the tropical zodiac Prabhupada's lagna is Aquarius(assuming his birth time is exactly 16h00). Giving him Moon(devotion) and Mars(character) in the 5th house(devotion). Jupiter(Guru) in 7th(partnership). Sat(authority) in the 10th(achievement). Mer(manager) in 9th(dharma). Sun(soul) in 8th(12th from 9th, purpose of the Guru). Venus(wife) in 8th(destruction). Mer in the 9th is ruling 4 planets and the final depositor in the chart, showing someone who's very practical and balanced in religious affairs. Mer also has a parivartana yoga with Ven in the 8th, showing someone who breaks from tradition.

With Capricorn lagna Prabhupada has only 1 planet in an angle, 2 in a trine and 4 planets in dushtana(inauspicious) houses. Hence why some astrologers wanted to rectify his chart to make it look better. Sidereal astrologers always have to fudge things so that it makes sense.

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[Vichal Gajapersad]

Prabhu, indeed!

Also, I have checked and I confirm:

Most Prabhu's who have calculated Srila Prabhupada's chart, say that we MUST accept what Srila Prabhupada says.

Srila Prabhupada says that his rasi sign was Maithuna. In India, rasi sign means the sign in which the Moon is placed at birth. Also, Srila Prabhupada said that he was born at 4 PM. (Now the Prabhu's are changing this time so that they get the chart they think is best!)

When you calculate with sidereal zodiac, you get Moon at the end of Taurus. Not Gemini (Maithuna). Capricorn is rising here. 

When you calculate with tropical zodiac, you get Moon IN Gemini. Aquarius is rising here.

I do find it that if you are an experienced astrologer, you can make a nice story for all three versions of Srila Prabhupada's chart thus bewildering the youngsters even more.

What do you think Prabhu?


Op vrijdag 10 mei 2019 21:02:54 UTC+2 schreef Radha Ramana:

Sat being the slowest moving planet in 10th indicates someone who would achieve things later in life but those achievements would be lasting.

On 10 May 2019 8:15 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ra...@gmail.com> wrote:

Mer also represents communication so Mer as the final depositor in the 9th(dharma) for an Aquarius lagna make a lot of sense since Prabhupada was a great communicator or preacher of dharma.

On 10 May 2019 8:01 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ra...@gmail.com> wrote:

The parivartana yoga of Mer(practicality) and Venus(women) probably referring to Prabhupada's revolutionary treatment of women in the Vaisnava tradition.

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[Vichal Gajapersad]

Yes and Aquarius is the original 11th house which means the masses (the public). Srila Prabhupada spread Hari Nama for the public.

And ofcourse Srila Prabhupada communicated on a level which cannot be comprehended!

I used to be a fanatic hindutva follower. I looked at living entities on the bodily platform. Completely neglecting that they also are souls and that the only reason why they are behaving like they are is because they are not familiar with Srila Prabhupada and are not chanting Hare Krishna!!

Now, I want to chant Hare Krishna!!

Hahaha, I mean my entire environment is flabergasted! How can I want to chant Hare Krishna!!

Op vrijdag 10 mei 2019 20:21:23 UTC+2 schreef Radha Ramana:

Mer also represents communication so Mer as the final depositor in the 9th(dharma) for an Aquarius lagna make a lot of sense since Prabhupada was a great communicator or preacher of dharma.

On 10 May 2019 8:01 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ra...@gmail.com> wrote:

The parivartana yoga of Mer(practicality) and Venus(women) probably referring to Prabhupada's revolutionary treatment of women in the Vaisnava tradition.

On 10 May 2019 7:57 pm, "Radha Ramana" <radha.ra...@gmail.com> wrote:

According to the tropical zodiac Prabhupada's lagna is Aquarius(assuming his birth time is exactly 16h00). Giving him Moon(devotion) and Mars(character) in the 5th house(devotion). Jupiter(Guru) in 7th(partnership). Sat(authority) in the 10th(achievement). Mer(manager) in 9th(dharma). Sun(soul) in 8th(12th from 9th, purpose of the Guru). Venus(wife) in 8th(destruction). Mer in the 9th is ruling 4 planets and the final depositor in the chart, showing someone who's very practical and balanced in religious affairs. Mer also has a parivartana yoga with Ven in the 8th, showing someone who breaks from tradition.

With Capricorn lagna Prabhupada has only 1 planet in an angle, 2 in a trine and 4 planets in dushtana(inauspicious) houses. Hence why some astrologers wanted to rectify his chart to make it look better. Sidereal astrologers always have to fudge things so that it makes sense.

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[Vichal Gajapersad]

Hari Bol Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances, All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

I am thankful Prabhu for your response. What a video!! Also the Prabhu in the video talks about that the ancient temples have these carvings and also in places inaccesable and without much light should say a thing or two (hiding information?)

Yes, I also am aware of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Maharaja Prabhupada's books on astology which for some reason does not get published.

The astrologer you mention is Vic DiCara: https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2012/12/07/astounding-evidence-that-bhaktisiddhanta-sarasvati-used-the-tropical-zodiac/

Vic DiCara also analysis the chart here: https://vicdicara.wordpress.com/2012/12/17/fundamental-principles-working-in-the-birth-chart-of-srila-bhaktisiddhanta-sarasvati/

Also Laura Barat has presented an article for the use of tropical zodiac: https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/pdf_versions/english/lara_barat.pdf

Syamasundara does have an article where he presents his counterarguments: https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/response_to_tropical.html

Here Syamasundara provides a direct response about Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Maharaja Prabhupada using the tropical zodiac: https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/bsst_trop/bsst_trop.html

Here are Vic DiCara arguments (on YouTube):
Refutations of Arguments Against the Tropical  
Tropical and/or Sidereal
Tropical Sidereal Debates

Vic DiCara playlists: https://www.youtube.com/user/VicDiCarasAstrology/playlists

Prabhu, regarding the videolink you posted, At https://youtu.be/D1Ifepa_O-I?t=302 (5 mins), the Prabhu says that the Sun is at the centre. 

Does this mean that the ancient thought that the Sun is at the centre of the universe and that all planets revolve around it?

Thanks again Prabhu for your response.

Hare Krishna! All glories to Srila Prabhupada!!

Op vrijdag 10 mei 2019 20:46:33 UTC+2 schreef rmd:

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[Radha Ramana]

I don't see anything particularly tropical about this video. Thought the sculpture was some sort of sun dial where the shadow fell on a specific sign but nothing like that was mentioned. 

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[Sugriva Dasa]

Actually on the page he says he was in India from Feb 1980 - April 83 so not in NYC.

On Monday, December 31, 2018 at 10:47:11 AM UTC-5, Pratyatosa wrote:

"...he was in India from 1980-83 and not in NYC." But it doesn't say exactly when in 1980 he when to India. For all we know, he might have been in NYC for most of that year, right?

In any case, it looks like Krishna tricked him into using a bogus system of astrology (sidereal). Casting an astrological horoscope is a science, pure and simple. When it comes to science, which country is near the bottom of the barrel? India! This can be proven by the fact that only one out of hundreds of scientific Nobel prizes have been won by an Indian on Indian soil! For that reason alone, it should be obvious that the Tropical (Western) system of astrology is correct! Obviously, the sidereal system of astrology is just a childish attempt, on the part of a few foolish Indian "astrologers," at oneupmanship over the Western astrologers! Here's proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiGrAwe78-A

On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 5:31 AM <sugri...@gmail.com> wrote:

According to this article http://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/adp/ashtamangala_deva_prasna_1.html he was in India from 1980-83 and not in NYC. Looks like you need to get your RAM replaced. (-:

On Saturday, June 4, 2016 at 11:45:55 PM UTC+5:30, Pratyatosa wrote:

I talked with Shyamasundara Dasa, the "always wrong about everything Vedic astrologer" at the 55th Street temple in NYC back in 1980, when the GBC was in a panic to sell it. He was predicting that there would be nuclear war "very soon" and that NYC would be a prime target! "After all, that's what Srila Prabhupada predicted, right?" Therefore, I suspect that he was part of the reason why the GBC was in such a hurry to sell it.

Ys, Ptd

On Sat, Jun 4, 2016 at 5:39 AM, BhaktaRobin <robin...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hari Bol,

please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Shyamasundara Dasa (an so called ISKCON Astrologer) was again proven false in this nice article:

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/06-16/editorials13979.htm

I have some experience with this guy myself.

When I was suffering from a severe health problem he told me to do fire sacrifices for 10000US$, which is totally rediculous.

He never told me about the inexpensive/free remedies like Narayana Kavacha given by Srila Prabhupada in the SB!

Despite the fact that Srila Prabhupada was against astrology, these ISKCON astrologers fool the innocent neophytes with their charlatan business.

[Sugriva Dasa]

Established by who? I have seen no evidence of that at all.

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[Sugriva Dasa]

This is complete nonsense.

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[Sugriva Dasa]

On Saturday, May 11, 2019 at 10:50:46 AM UTC-4, Vichal Gajapersad wrote:

 

Then this year, I came accross Vrajakishora Dasa (Vic DiCara). Now this Prabhu is (for me then) on the level of Syamasundara. Vic DiCara used to be an astrologer using the Sidereal zodiac.

)-: Vi DiCara is no where even close. Did you see that article by Shyamasundara where he demolished Vic DiCara and showed that DiCara is a complete fool without mentioning his name https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/bsst_trop/bsst_trop.html

It was clearly a response to DiCara's wild claims. DiCara is intellectually dishonest what more can be said.

 

Now he says: Use the Sidereal zodiac for the naksatra's and the Tropical zodiac for the rasis. It does make sense when you consult scripture if you want to know what the start of the zodiac is (Aries).

Sastras say that first point of Asvini and Mesha are the same so it doesn't make sense at all.

 

He has so explained it very professionally as well on his website. I hope Syamasundara can at least respond to the arguments Vic DiCara presents.

Which arguments?

Did you see this http://www.dandavats.com/?p=10952

 

Also, Vic DiCara comes over as a nice person.

Did you see this? https://corruptersofastrology.wordpress.com/

 

For fun, I also calculated Srila Prabhupada's chart using 16:00 hours as birthtime with Tropical zodiac. And guess what: Aquarius is rising.
I thought, when I post this or ask other about this, I will be declared a crazy man. 

And now Prabhu, you come with it!!! I am going to make a webpage and present all viewpoints and let the readers decide!

Are the readers  competent to decide?

[Sugriva Dasa]

BSST used sidereal system

https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/bsst_trop/bsst_trop.html

On Tuesday, January 8, 2019 at 5:53:33 AM UTC-5, Radha Ramana wrote:

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[Sugriva Dasa]

Doing a postmortum of a chart is one thing, but predicting is another. Can you predict?

[rainer hahn]

to rant and rave is not a strong argument. Ayanamsa turns Scorpionic people into Libra people. According to Tropical Zodiac, many ISKCON leaders have their Moon, Venus, Mercury in Scorpio what is a difficult situation of restructuring from selfishness to focusing on general welfare. Probands easily fall back to go for personal advantage. Leaders should rather have their personal planets in the fourth quadrant.

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[rainer hahn]

but Prabhupada said: "My rasi is Metthuna"

On Wed, Jan 22, 2020 at 2:00 AM Sugriva Dasa <sugriv...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[rainer hahn]

yes, but Prabhupada says,  I was born September 1, 1896, Tuesday at about 4:00 in the afternoon. My rasi is Metthuna." What is tropical zodiac

On Wed, Jan 22, 2020 at 2:00 AM Sugriva Dasa <sugriv...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Radha Ramana]

Prabhupada rising sign is the verge of Aquarius if you subtract 1 min his lagna is Capricorn which gives him a 9th 10th raja yoga as well as a rare Parijata Yoga.

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[Radha Ramana]

Evidence of tropical zodiac 

When the sun passes through the five signs beginning with Vṛścika [Scorpio], the duration of the days decreases [until Capricorn], and then gradually it increases month after month, until day and night become equal [in Aries].

SB 5.21.5

The word ayana means "path" or "going." The six months when the sun moves toward the north are called uttarāyaṇa, or the northern path, and the six months when it moves south are called dakṣiṇāyana, or the southern path. These are mentioned in Bhagavad-gītā (8.24-25). The first day when the sun begins to move north and enter the zodiacal sign of Capricorn is called Makara-saṅkrānti, and the first day when the sun begins to move south and enter the sign of Cancer is called Karkaṭa-saṅkrānti. On these two days of the year, one should perform the śrāddha ceremony.
Sb 7.14.20p

Makara sankranti is at the solstice in Dec not in Jan

Letter to Jay Krishna Thakura -- Vrindaban 6 December, 1975: Regarding your question about my birth. I was born September 1, 1896, Tuesday at about 4:00 in the afternoon. My rasi is Metthuna.

His moon rasi is only Mithuna on the tropical zodiac, sidereally there is no planet in Mithuna.

I don't read books, I read the author. I first see the author to see if he's authentic or not. I am a proof reader. I always see what is right and what is wrong. My father trained me in proofreading, but I am not only a proofreader of the press. I am a proofreader of the world. I proofread men: I see their faults and try to correct them. I am a proofreader of religion also. I have appeared in the karkata lagna (astrologically), so whenever I see anything undevotional I will act like a karkata (a crab). If I see any so-called devotion which is not actually in the true unalloyed spirit, I shall pierce it.

--- "Associates of Śrī Chaitanya", by His Divine Grace Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura Jagad Guru Prabhupada.

Bhaktisiddanta lagna is only Karkata in the tropical zodiac.

@Sugriva Prabhu what evidence do you have? A vague analogy about the nakshatras and rasi being fixed to the wheel of time.

Basically you have nothing.

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[b.vichalg...@gmail.com]

If you call Vic DiCara intellectually dishonest, then use arguments, not one-liners.

You said, sastra says that first point of Ashvini and Mesha are the same. Which sastra says this? Which book? Answer: Have a look at Caitanya Caritamrita where Lord Caitanya's chart is described, case closed!

But regarding the making sense part: When you use your eyes today, then the startingpoint of Ashvini and Mesha are not the same!

Can you elaborate on the above?

I feel that Vic DiCara has a nice presentation with pretty sound arguments.

You said: which arguments?
Did you see this: http://vicdicara.com/tropical_vedic_astrology.php

All I ask, is counter argument Vic DiCara's arguments which he presents very clearly.

Not a SINGLE sidereal astrologer (especially Indians) have countered him. Why is that?

Everything on the internet is to be read. Reading is there to make a reader more competent about a particular subject.

In other words everyone is incompetent, then why are you pointing at others yet not looking in the mirror?

By the way. I am Indian and NOW I do believe in the fact that the starting point of Ashvini and Mesha are the same. But the reason is not logic or proper arguments.

Because Vic DiCara knocks everyone out on logic and argumentation as proven by yourself and every other sidereal astrologer. Again, check the link I posted about the arguments. No one could counter him!

Now I have decided to believe in sastra, because in sastra, Lord Caitanya's birthchart has been described:

In CC – Adi Lila chapter 13, text 89 & 90, where we find about the horoscope of Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu the Golden Avatar:

The explanation of the horoscope given by Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura is that at the time of the birth of Lord Caitanya Mahāprabhu the constellations were situated as follows: Śukra (Venus) was in Meṣa-rāśi (Aries), in the constellation of Aśvinī; Ketu (the ninth planet) was in Siṁha-rāśi (Leo), in Uttaraphalgunī; Candra (the moon) was in Siṁha-rāśi, in Pūrvaphalgunī (the eleventh lunar mansion); Śani (Saturn) was in Vṛścika-rāśi (Scorpio), in Jyeṣṭhā; Bṛhaspati (Jupiter) was in Dhanu-rāśi, in Pūrvāṣāḍhā (Sagittarius); Maṅgala (Mars) was in Makara-rāśi (Capricorn), in Śravaṇā; Ravi (the sun) and Rāhu were in Kumbha-rāśi (Aquarius), in Pūrvabhādrapāda; and Budha (Mercury) was in Mīna-rāśi (Pisces), in Uttarabhādrapāda.. The lagna was Siṁha.

Op woensdag 22 januari 2020 om 02:00:57 UTC+1 schreef sugriv...@gmail.com:

[sugriv...@gmail.com]

This article addresses the Moon in Mithuna point https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/prabhupada/thsp-05.html#c225

The quote about BSST's lagna is wrong. His official chart in the biography has Mithuna Lagna

And BSST used a Sideral zodiac

https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/bsst_trop/bsst_trop.html

Here is another article debunking DiCaras claims

https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/response_to_tropical.html

Basically you have not looked very far.

[sugriv...@gmail.com]

Did you happen to see this analysis which addresses that point quite thoroughly?

https://shyamasundaradasa.com/jyotish/resources/articles/formal_articles/prabhupada/thsp-05.html#c225

[rainer hahn]

Jyothish might work for fortune-telling. This is what interests today's ISKCON following mainly. However, Jyothish has a high failure rate when it comes to partner compatibility for prospective married couples. The many divorces clearly show that the moon compatibility was not right.  Incompatible moons force every marriage to the divorce court. The same with astrological character analysis. There are now thousands of celebrity horoscopes online but when you convert these horoscopes to Vedic astrology they are just plain wrong.

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[Pratyatosa Das ACBSP]

Casting a Western astrology horoscope is a purely scientific, technical process, but then the stupid Indian "Brahmins," after using the exact same computer programs that the Western astrologers use, ruin everything by throwing in the completely unscientific "ayanamsa" fudge factor! If they are so concerned about some arbitrary star patterns, then why don't they make the astrological signs different sizes in order to correspond to the vastly different sizes of these star patterns? Even a child can understand that it doesn't make any sense! This is why Indians never win any scientific Nobel Prizes! No common sense!


PRABHUPĀDA: … So electric is not working? Just see. In the evening, we…, people want light—no light.

JAYAPATĀKĀ: It works the whole day. Only in the evening it goes off.

PRABHUPĀDA: Whole night also. Only evening, when you require it… [laughter] INDIA’S MATERIAL ADVANCEMENT IS ARTIFICIAL. THEY ARE NOT FIT FOR IT. In America, so long no electricity every day, people would become mad. There would have been a revolution. Huh? Is it not?

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Room Conversation – February 16, 1977, Māyāpur

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[BhaktaRobin]

the sideral zodiac is what we can see in the live in the sky. i checked that myself. some the positions of the stars in the sky match the vedic astrology chart.

no idea why the calculations are then wrong. sidereal is what we can see in the universal form every night

I suspect that the important factor is the astrologer not the astrology system. If the supersoul gives the astrologer right insigths he makes correct predictions no matter what system.

Sama Dharma uses a mix of different systems  optimized to the extend of what actually works and not sticking to some system and has good results: https://twitter.com/CashRising/status/1601750420950773760

[BhaktaRobin]

there is a new web app that uses more than the moon in a horscope to give better compatibility matches. the astrologers shows in the video presentation that it actually works with live couples. it is free in the basic version:

Vedic Astrologer simon chokoisky Free web app to check astrological compatibility kundali matching

Marriage compatibility free web app
Dilanu App - Sign In
https://www.dilanu.com/
Web App Tutorial:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwY40eCkP6c
More videos about compatibility astrology on simon youtube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVw3x8jR_TE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o255T6t2OSQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1Ut4oZ5x0w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euo6rImBma8

[Pratyatosa Das ACBSP]

So what are you saying? That Western astrologers are stupid and Vedic astrologers are smart? No way! Why aren't Western astrologers switching to your superior system? The truth is, not even one Western astrologer is convinced by your sentimental, unscientific argument!

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[Bhakta Robin]

No I never said western astrologers are stupid.

There are many great western astrologer on astrolada youtube channel for example.

I suspect the system does not matter, it is the supersoul and astrologer that counts.

I am not for or against any system. Simon also did some tweaks and research to make compatibility analysis work better than in classical vedic astrology. watch his tutorial video posted above

I have seen good and bad astrology predictions, so I think people should experiment and see what astrologic technology actually works like Sama Dharma did for financial astrology(he is very acurate using a mixture):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l54IWJIsiEo

https://www.youtube.com/@TheFinancialAstrologer/videos

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[Pratyatosa Das ACBSP]

You "suspect?" The fact is that Western astrology is a completely scientific system that doesn't depend on Supersoul! "Vedic astrology," on the other hand, is a completely unbonified, unscientific concoction that's simply a distraction. In other words, Vedic astrologers are stupid, stupid, stupid!

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[rainer hahn]

Ayanāṃśa – or where exactly does the sidereal zodiac begin, i.e. the zero point? That's a huge question mark.  The greatest problem of so-called "Vedic" astrology is that it cannot explain exactly where the sidereal zodiac begins. This question is of central importance because without answering it correctly, there can be no correct determination of the position of the planets according to the signs of the zodiac, their fine subdivisions, and lunar mansions. And without these,  correct astrological statements, especially astrological forecasts, are impossible. Most Indian astrologers today work with the so-called "Lahiri Ayanāṃśa", which was introduced as a standard in 1956 on the occasion of the Indian calendar reform, on the recommendation of the Calcutta-born astronomer and astrologer Nirmala Chandra Lahiri, who was a member of the reform committee. The Lahiri-Ayanāṃśa is defined in such a way that the starting point of the sidereal Aries and the lunar mansion Aśvinī is exactly opposite the fixed star Citrā, with Citrā itself lying exactly in the middle of the lunar mansion Citrā of the same name. Allegedly this Ayanaṃśa had the value 0 in the year 285 AD, so that in this year the sidereal and the tropical zodiac coincided with each other. Where does this sidereal zodiac, fixed to Spica, come from? Unfortunately, it cannot be proven with certainty in Indian sources.  Indian astrologers make contradicting statements about the starting point of the "Vedic" zodiac. Some astrologers assume the star Spica at 0° Libra, but its position for other stars is in blatant contradiction. Other vedic astrologers take the starting point of all planetary cycles and the zero point of the Zodiac closer to the star Revatī (ζ Piscium). The zodiac thus defined would deviate from the Lahiri zodiac by almost 4°. In other words, the sidereal positions of the planets for a natal chart have an uncertainty of several degrees. The introduction of the Lahiri standard has also resulted in heavy disputes. Even today, followers of the various Ayanāṃśas polemicize violently against each other. And not without good reason, because for astrological work, uncertainties of up to 4° are of course unacceptable.

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[Bhakta Robin]

Western degree theory

Astrology Update:

Putin prolongs his power 

  

In the text The World War 3 published in Nedeljni Telegraf (22 June 2005.), which can be found on the website in Serbian and English, I wrote, among other things, that the then Russian President Putin would try to prolong his stay in power: 

”In addition, the present Russian President Putin (07.10.1952.) has the Sun (power, supreme position) conjunction Saturn (extended term of office), which could indicate that his term of office will be extended....” 

  

This was also an easy prediction. 

He was born with Leo Ascendant. The ruler of his Ascendant (his intention, action), the Sun (to be in power), is in conjunction with Saturn, the planet symbolising the extension of something and remaining at the same position – in this case, presidential position. Firstly he was elected Prime Minister (10th house in Aries - economy), and now, the rumour has it that he would be elected President with six-year term of office. https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/nikola/tacneprognoze.htm

Text entitled America – the End of an Empire, which is published 

on this website, contains, for the time being, 

three accurate prognoses 

  

1. At the end of December, the text America-the End of an Empire was put on this website. It contained the forecast about SANCTIONS that will be imposed on America by the rest of the world. On March 1, one of the news was that Europe imposed TRADE sanctions on America..... Naturally, it is just the beginning... 

  

"...In the horoscope of America, the 10th house describes the way they try to rule the whole world and similarly, the way they LOOSE the power over the entire world. This house begins in the sign of Libra (diplomacy, alliance, association), meaning that the Americans will loose their supremacy after ALL OTHER COUNTRIES MAKE AN ALLIANCE AGAINST America; Saturn (sanctions) in their 10th house, tells us that all the rest of the world will IMPOSE SANCTIONS ON THEM; thus, they lose their leading position as a result of diplomatic activities and alliance of other countries against them. These activities include: expulsion of embassies from (almost) all countries in the world; denying civil and military airplanes the clearance to land in many countries in the world; denying American citizens visa for almost all countries in the world; imposing boycott of American products …" 

  

2. In the speech in which the President of Russia addressed his people after the monstrous terrorist attack in Beslan in which children were cruelly murdered, he said: 

” Russia has been attacked… terrorism is just a tool for them to achieve their goals …” 

 

 There is also a sentence in the text: 

…Thus, we come to the true SENSE of » current danger of terrorism in the world “…ATTACK ON RUSSIA DISGUISED AS TERRORISM …” 

  

3. Checnian (?) terrorists placed 20 million dollar bounty on Russian President Putin’s head … 

 

There is a sentence in the text: 

…Thus, Russian President Putin is in danger (Pluto at the 22nd degree) of being murdered while in power (Leo)… 

 As far as I know, so far there have been FIVE attempted assassinations of the President Putin... 

  

"America-End of an Empire" Integral text 

 https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/nikola/tacneprognoze.htm

Russia at war in 2008 

  

In the beginning of December 2007, I gave an interview to the magazine Treće Oko regarding the events that will take place in Russia in the following 2008. One part of the prediction was accurate while the other was wrong: 

  

Magazine Treće Oko, 4 December 2007 issue 469 

  

War between Russia and Ukraine 

  

All because of the black gold 

’’ – In the horoscope of the new Russia which was founded on 12 June 1990 in Moscow at 9h 45min GMT, in the seventh house symbolising the relations with other countries there is Mars, the planet of war, in Aries which also symbolises war. This means that the new Russian state, in its existence, will inevitably wage wars . Mars square Uranus and Neptune in Capricorn indicate that Russia will be at war with the former Soviet countries which gained independence – most likely with Ukraine because Uranus means separation. 

Stojanović states that Mars aspecting Neptune tells us that the reason for the conflict will be oil and oil pipeline because Neptune symbolises ’’black gold’’. 

- As the solar horoscope of each country shows whether such country is at war or not, there are many indications that Russia will enter the inevitable war with Ukraine in the spring of 2008. The horoscope of new Russia for the next year contains a pronounced aspect which indicates the tendency to restore its former territories to its possession. 

Our collocutor says that this war is somehow „necessary“ to the world and that it is backed up by America.“ 

  

Therefore, it is true that Russia enters the war in 2008. The cause for the war is oil and it will restore the former Soviet territories to its possession and behind this war is America. However, it is not true that this is the war with Ukraine which takes place in the spring. 

  

To make an accurate prediction it is necessary to have the precise horoscope of every country (I don’t think that the time of the foundation of the new Russian state - 9h45min GMT – is accurate). 

As for Ukraine, I used the horoscope found in the book of D. Campion with the Ascendant at the 8th degree of Capricorn. Therefore, Mars of the new Russia in Aries (war) is in the exact square with the Ascendant (territory) of Ukraine, which certainly brings about the conflict between these two countries. The issue is whether this horoscope of Ukraine is accurate... https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/nikola/tacneprognoze.htm

Best Serbian Astrologer Nikola Stojanovic REST IN PEACE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C9X6QEG4JU

https://www.astrolada.com/courses/astrology-esoteric/new-prediction-with-solar-returns.html

This serbian man is the best astrologer I know. He is dead now

https://www.astrolada.com/courses/astrology-esoteric/the-secrets-of-zodiac-degrees.html

https://www.astrolada.com/courses/astrology-esoteric/what-in-astrology-gives-the-richest-people.html

if you want to study the art. this serbian astrologer was the best

https://youtu.be/AUoLG46Kgbo

Nikola Stojanovic's last prediction before his death: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6W-yftGbYY

outer planets: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8c4ixdsHjE

remedies(which is a lot better in the vedic system like temples in india to do pujas) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBegkwwXKC4

his website is still running after his death, but some pictures do not work: https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/

his correct predictions: https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/nikola/tacneprognoze.htm

America-The End of an Empire USA However, their Mars has one unfavourable aspect i.e. square with Neptune which will prevent them from achieving their goal. In astrology, Neptune rules ESPIONAGE, which means that their enemies will always be informed about their military plans; Neptune symbolises HIDING. Thus, every American enemy able to hide will win the war. The only war Americans have lost in the recent history is the VIETNAM WAR. In that war the Vietnamese were able to perfectly hide in their dense jungles; 

( similarly, during the Kosovo war, the great Serbian General Pavkovic successfully put out of sight our military hardware and staff –maybe this is the major reason for the Hague Tribunal wanting him); Neptune also symbolises GERILLA WAR, and the Vietnamese chose the right military tactics to beat Americans. Neptune also symbolises VIRUSES, BACTERIA… In astrology, the entire mankind receives the DIVINE ENERGY from Neptune and every army having the true belief in GOD is able to win the war against Americans. In addition, Neptune means SECRET. So, a nation possessing SECRET armament will also beat Americans. To conclude, a nation utilising the ENTIRE symbolic of NEPTUNE in war against America will prevent it from achieving its goal – supremacy over the entire world. 

The nation which is in its genetic horoscope born under the sign of PISCES ruled by Neptune is RUSSIA. 

  

Conflict with Russia 

  

A sportsman friend of mine told me once when we discussed the global politics»…Well, sooner or later, it’s going to reach the FINALS…«..he certainly felt that an open conflict is bound to happen between America and Russia. This is supported by the horoscope of America. Their Mars (war) squares (clash) Neptune (Russia). It has been already openly discussed by the Americans. For some time now, a STRATEGIST Zbignjev Bzerzinski on his geopolitical lectures has been stating that »..Russia has too huge a territory …global centre will be in Euro-Asia… and the like...« The way this conflict will start can be seen in the horoscope of the new Russian state. 

  

Horoscope of Russia, Putin 

  

New Russian State was founded on June 12, 1990 in Moscow at 9:45 GMT. It was born under the sign of Gemini, Ascendant Virgo. The Ascendant of a country describes its territory and the future of this territory. Virgo Ascendant rules all FRAGMENTATION processes, which means that Russian territory (Ascendant) is about to be fragmented (Virgo). In its seventh house (relations with other countries, cooperation, conflict, war) Russia has MARS (war) in Aries (war), which means that it will CERTAINLY be at war with a country (countries). The cusp of its seventh house (war) begins at Pisces, which means that this war will start bearing the symbolic of Pisces (concealed, underhand, terrorism). Writing this text, I’ve just heard that a bomb had exploded in the very centre of Moscow …Everything begins with an introduction...Their Mars (war) in the seventh house (war) squares (conflict) Neptune (something concealed, terrorism) and Uranus (bomb, explosion, shells, aviation), which tells us that Russia is going to be attacked STEALTHILY, by TERRORISM, BOMBS and SHELLS, allegedly used by TERRORISTS. 

  

Thus, we reach the true SENSE of »current danger of terrorism in the world «…ATTACK ON RUSSIA IN THE FORM OF TERRORISM. 

  

In December 1999, in the Russian parliament magazine called Russian Federation, I published my forecast that Russia is in great danger »…at the end of 2003 and beginning of 2004, Moscow will be in a big danger from ATOMIC BOMB…«.At the time, this text looked like science fiction, but now one can almost see the outlines of this scenario that had been designed a long time ago. I made this forecast after a serious and meticulous work, analysing the horoscopes of America, Russia and Russian President Putin. The horoscopes of the foundation of a country and its President are essential for everything that the country will undergo in its existence. Russian president Putin was born under Libra, on October 7, 1952. (30E15, 59N55,), birth time

unknown. According to the American astrologers, Putin was born with the Scorpio Ascendant, while Russian astrologer Timashev (whose opinion I support) thinks that Putin was born with the Leo Ascendant. Regardless of his true Ascendant, Putin has Pluto (death) in Leo (power, authority, President) at the twenty-second degree which, according to my theory on degrees, has the symbolic of - to kill, to be killed - as well as Uranus (bomb) at the eighteenth degree of Cancer which is, according to my theory on zodiac degrees, the worst degree in zodiac circle – DIABOLIC DEGREE. This degree was EXTREMELY active when ATOMIC BOMB was dropped on HIROSHIMA! That was on August 6,1945. Hiroshima (132E27, 34N24), 8:16:40, -09:00 JST –09:00.! At that moment, the Ascendant was at the eighteenth degree of Virgo, while the Moon (people, mankind), with Saturn (misery, sorrow, sadness), was at the eighteenth degree of Cancer – exactly the same place where Putin has Uranus (bomb)! 

  

Thus, the life of the Russian president Putin is in danger (Pluto at the twenty-second degree) while in power (Leo), and there is a considerable likelihood that he will have the same fate as the citizens of Hiroshima! 

  

In comparative horoscope of America and Russia, America has Mars (war, attack, conflict) conjunction Russian Sun (power, authority, domination), which indicates that America will attempt to prevent the EXPANSION OF RUSSIAN INFLUENCE by WAR. 

In the comparative horoscope of America and Putin, Putin has four planets (Sun-power, domination), Saturn (limitation, inhibition), Neptune, and Mercury in the tenth house of America’s horoscope, which means that by his activities Putin will greatly SUPRESS the American power (tenth house). Out of ten planets in Putin’s horoscope, four are in Libra (diplomacy), which means that carrying out his diplomatic activities Putin will try to GREATLY harm America. https://www.astrologyinserbia.com/e/nikola/amerika_krajimperije.htm

Source:

https://t.me/astrologyupdate/632

Bhakta Robin <bhaktar...@gmail.com> schrieb am Fr., 10. März 2023, 09:18:

If this is so why do the planets visibly appear in the sky at night at the positions they are forcasted by sidereal zodiac? 

There is also babylonian astrology.

The famous western astroliger nikolas stojanovic did may videos on astrolada youtube about his degree theory.

So in my opinion astrologers should experiment an see what actually works no matter which system.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/istagosthi/CAHVYU7DN-656raS%2BH8LShOPJmtgd%3DHrCQYnG_1cVOo%2B9UOSYVQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Bhakta Robin]

If this is so why do the planets visibly appear in the sky at night at the positions they are forcasted by sidereal zodiac? 

There is also babylonian astrology.

The famous western astroliger nikolas stojanovic did may videos on astrolada youtube about his degree theory.

So in my opinion astrologers should experiment an see what actually works no matter which system.

rainer hahn <raine...@gmail.com> schrieb am Fr., 10. März 2023, 07:32:

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[Pratyatosa Das ACBSP]

According to Western astrology, the positions of the fixed stars in the sky are completely meaningless! That's why I call them "arbitrary!":

arbitrary - existing or coming about seemingly at random or by chance or as a capricious and unreasonable act of will

 

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[Bhakta Robin]

You mean according to vedic astrology the fixed stars are arbitrary? (typo in your last post)

I was talking about the planets and houses. If you look into the sky at night you see the planets in the houses they are in as per siderial/vedic zodiac.

I never looked into the fixed stars. Some prediction tools like aspects, conjunctions should work anyways, because they are the same in both systems.

Did you ever hear about the Kala vedic astrology software? They use a tropical zodiac

https://www.vaultoftheheavens.com/VOTH_ChartCreator/Welcome.aspx

https://vedic-astrology.net/Kala/Kala-Software.asp

https://vedic-astrology.net/FreeClasses/Ayanamsa-and-Rasis.mp3

  "Rasis and the Zodiac are generally considered to be a very simple aspect of astrology, with little room for mystery. However, the world is divided in its interpretation of exactly how to calculate a Rasi. The Greeks, Persians, Egyptians and the modern world of Europe along with its offspring in the Americas consider a Rasi to be a thirty degree arc of the ecliptic as measured from the Vernal Equinox (the position of the Sun as it crosses the equator on the first day of spring). This is known as the Tropical Zodiac. The East Indians, on the other hand, consider a Rasi to likewise be a thirty degree arc of the ecliptic, but as measured from some fixed point of the starry heavens. This is known as the Sidereal Zodiac. This difference in thought is a serious handicap to astrology as a science. While some astrologers have the tolerance to accept both views as there being “many paths,” and “more ways than one to skin a cat,” the astrologer with a critical and scientific mind will appreciate the need for the definitions of astrology to be accurately defined and there being precise and scientific methods of astrological practice which are replicable and worth following as compared to sloppy methods which are no better than imaginative guesswork. Though the intuitive astrologer can have skilled and enviable “guesswork,” his use of astrology does not fulfill the scientific requirements of replicability and techniques that can be passed down to students."   

" PREDICTIVE ACCURACY OF ASTROLOGERS Most Vedic Astrologers claim Vedic Astrology to be 90% accurate. Yet only half of these astrologers predicted the last presidential election correctly. Is it the fault of the Astrology or the Astrologer? To its credit, Vedic Astrology makes use of Nakshatra Dasas, which allow the astrologer to see what planet is most significantly influencing the life at any given time. Simply knowing this helps an astrologer tremendously. For instance, staying up late in a motel room with an Indian astrologer with both of us laying in our individual beds and staring at the ceiling the conversation naturally turned to astrology. He asked me what Dasa I was in, to which I replied that I had just started the Moon Dasa. Before Moon Dasa is Sun/Venus Dasa, so he replied, “so in Sun/Venus you broke up with a woman?” To which I had, unfortunately, to answer yes. He made this prediction without seeing my horoscope, just knowing the Dasa. So many predictions can be made simply by the fact of knowing the Nakshatra Dasa, which are calculated sidereally from the Nakshatra of the Moon. There are also, many, many other techniques in vogue in India that are dependent only upon Nakshatras which provide accurate readings with out even examining a horoscope of Rasis."

" These days, most Western Astrologers refrain from prediction and concentrate on character instead. Not long ago, however, Western Astrologers concentrated on predictions, just as do the Vedic Astrologers and there are records of many fantastic predictions made by Western Astrologers. I have also seen predictive centered modern Western Astrologers make wonderful predictions and I have also seen them color the predictions with the qualities of the Rasis. But I have also seen them fail miserbly just as many times. When they fail, do they fail because their Zodiac is incorrect? Or do they fail because the do not use Varga charts and Nakshatras? The point is that Astrologers fail more often then they would like to admit. If we consider this in the light of the possibility that Vedic, Persian, Greek, and any astrology that uses twelve signs of the Zodiac to be the same system that is fragmented with different cultures having maintained different parts of a larger original system, then the failings of astrologers are explained. Just as an auto mechanic can not be expeted to repair any and all problems a vehicle may have with an incomplete toolbox, astrologers will miss and make mistakes so long as they are working with only the incomplete Western, Greek, Persian or Vedic Toolbox, when what they need is the complete Astrologer’s Toolbox. If such a toolbox exists, which it would seem it does due to the similarities of the different cultural systems of astrology, then we can only bring it together once the correct Zodiac, whether Tropical or Sidereal, is proven. So any astrologer with the desire to work towards the perfection of astrology, should have an interest in discovering the correct Zodiac"

Source: https://vedic-astrology.net/Articles/Mystery-of-the-Zodiac.pdf

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[Bhakta Robin]

" CONCLUSION If the Tropical Zodiac is the correct Zodiac for erecting horoscopes, one theory of how the difference in Zodiac use could have come about is that the Hindu Astrologers, who emphasized Nakshatras due to their importance in the religious and daily life of the Hindu, began to ignore precession when the vernal equinox (0 degrees Tropical Aries) lined up with the beginning of Asvini and upon the vernal equinox beginning to precess backwards through the Nakshatras, they erroneously continued to calculate Aries Rasi from the beginning of Asvini Nakshatras. If the Sidereal Zodiac is the correct Zodiac for erecting horoscopes, one theory of how the difference in Zodiac use could have come about is that as the vernal equinox (0 degrees tropical Aries) moved towards Asvini (0 degrees Sidereal Aries) the Greeks, becoming attached to the Solar Months, which are tropical and named after Aries, etc. forgot about the Sidereal Rasis. There is evidence of the Greeks knowing of precession from 300 BC to the present, while there is evidence that the Indians lost the knowledge of precession during the 1st - 5th centurys AD, during which time the Vernal equinox was close to the beginning of Asvini, so there is a greater likelihood that the Indians made the error. Thus the student of astrology should be aware of the corundum that astrology is today. Someone desiring the true knowledge of astrology must approach it with devotion, an inquiring mind and the faith that one’s desire for knowledge will be answered. This means to learn, to study, and to test that which one learns and studies. Only through doing so will we be able to practice astrology in its full glory. Unfortunately, most students of astrology approach it in a “religious” fashion. They listen, they believe and they truly do not know because they have not tested it in a through and scientific fashion. This attitude does nothing for astrology. In respect to the “Mystery of the Zodiac,” this means to learn astrological techniques fully and then to test the Zodiacs. This presents a problem, for without knowing the correct Zodiac, how can one be sure of the techniques? And if without being sure of the techniques, how can one test the Zodiac? It is a tedious matter of making small steps in both directions which allow the astrologer to slowly approach the truth. We cannot, unfortunately, reley on the available ancient texts, as there are too many ambiguities present in them. The ancient texts can only be relied upon to encourage us to test the Zodiacs ourselves and make up our own minds. With computers being available to us, we can test this better than any astrologers of the past 2000 years, better than any astrologers existing from the time that this problem of the Zodiacs originated. In respect to testing which Zodiac is correct, it is the details of the Zodiac that have to be examined. If a person is tall, we would expect the Lagna and Lagna lord of the Rasi and Trimsamsa to be in the large Rasis (Aries, Leo and Capricorn), if a person is small, we would expect small and slender Scorpio. If a person purchases a vehicle in Moon/Venus Dasa, both Zodiacs may, somehow, reveal the purchase of the vehicle. However, one Zodiac will specify a red vehicle while the other a blue vehicle. If the vehicle is red or blue, we have our answer, if the vehicle is neither red nor blue, then some other principle is out of order, perhaps the Ayanamsa is incorrect or the incorrect Dasa is being applied, and thus the Dasa was not Moon/Venus but actually something else. Tediously working through horoscope in this manner will help reveal which Zodiac is correct for erecting a horoscope."

Am Fr., 10. März 2023 um 18:40 Uhr schrieb Bhakta Robin <bhaktar...@gmail.com>:

Page 10

" After determining the Nakshatras of the planets, Surya Siddhanta moves on to determine the Ayanamsa, the difference between sidereal and Tropical Zodiacs. The Ayanamsa is added to the positions so far determined to convert the planetary positions to tropical positions. Once the tropical positions are determined, Surya Siddhanta provides the calculations for determining declinations and, most importantly, the Lagna. These things can only be calculated with the Tropical Zodiac and are impossible to calculate with the Sidereal Zodiac. Whereas the modern procedure is to calculate the Lagna with the help of the Tropical Zodiac and then convert it to a sidereal position, Surya Siddhanta converts the positions of the planets to tropical and then calculates the Lagna. Nowhere does Surya Siddhanta then state to convert the derived tropical Lagna to a sidereal Lagna, the Lagna remains as it is as a tropical Lagna. This would seem to support that the Tropical Zodiac is to be used for erecting horoscopes, unless the reader is meant to “obviously” convert the Lagna to a sidereal Lagna. Furthermore, in all the calculations that can only be calculated with tropical positions, such as declination and the Lagna, Surya Siddhanta uses the same 12 Rasis with the same names, but starting with Aries at the Vernal Equinox instead of Aries at the beginning of Asvini. No wonder the correct Zodiac is confused. An unbiased study of the Surya Siddhanta reveals greater importance given to the tropical Rasis, at least in the context of Solar months. Since it does not clearly state, “Use this or that for erecting a horoscope.” it would be presumptuous to lay claim to the Tropical Zodiac or the Sidereal Zodiac being the correct Zodiac for astrological use without further investigation."

[Bhakta Robin]

Page 10

" After determining the Nakshatras of the planets, Surya Siddhanta moves on to determine the Ayanamsa, the difference between sidereal and Tropical Zodiacs. The Ayanamsa is added to the positions so far determined to convert the planetary positions to tropical positions. Once the tropical positions are determined, Surya Siddhanta provides the calculations for determining declinations and, most importantly, the Lagna. These things can only be calculated with the Tropical Zodiac and are impossible to calculate with the Sidereal Zodiac. Whereas the modern procedure is to calculate the Lagna with the help of the Tropical Zodiac and then convert it to a sidereal position, Surya Siddhanta converts the positions of the planets to tropical and then calculates the Lagna. Nowhere does Surya Siddhanta then state to convert the derived tropical Lagna to a sidereal Lagna, the Lagna remains as it is as a tropical Lagna. This would seem to support that the Tropical Zodiac is to be used for erecting horoscopes, unless the reader is meant to “obviously” convert the Lagna to a sidereal Lagna. Furthermore, in all the calculations that can only be calculated with tropical positions, such as declination and the Lagna, Surya Siddhanta uses the same 12 Rasis with the same names, but starting with Aries at the Vernal Equinox instead of Aries at the beginning of Asvini. No wonder the correct Zodiac is confused. An unbiased study of the Surya Siddhanta reveals greater importance given to the tropical Rasis, at least in the context of Solar months. Since it does not clearly state, “Use this or that for erecting a horoscope.” it would be presumptuous to lay claim to the Tropical Zodiac or the Sidereal Zodiac being the correct Zodiac for astrological use without further investigation."

Am Fr., 10. März 2023 um 18:19 Uhr schrieb Bhakta Robin <bhaktar...@gmail.com>:

[rainer hahn]

It would be interesting to know what Ayanamsha ISKCON astrologers are using. Raman Ayanamsha or Lahiri Ayanamsha? When reading the comments of some Vedic astrologers there seems lot of confusion:

Deepak Sridhar: "I have personally tried, traditional Lahari, Chitrapaksha Ayanamsha and Raman Ayanamsha. I also did try Pushyapaksha Ayanamsha on a few charts. What I understood is, you can predict by using any Ayanamsha, if your intuition is good! Good jyothisha practice would also definitely help. The most interesting Ayanamsha for me is Raman. Personally speaking, I am almost convinced that this Ayanamsha works well."
Ramesh Ram: "In my experience, Lahiri Ayanamsa is highly erroneous. Analysis by Raman Ayanamsa gives exact results. Lahiri was neither an astrologer nor an astronomer."
Addittya Tamhankar: "By far - Raman and Yukteshwar Ayanamsha is the most accurate. Both are close as far as the Ayanamsha degree is considered. I remember that BV Raman had specifically mentioned that anywhere between 19 degrees to 22 degrees Ayanamsha works well. You can always map Raman or Yukteshwar Ayanamsha with your Vishomtarri Dasha and find which fits in - though you need to have proper knowledge of mapping your life events with the Ayanamsha you apply."
Shrivata: "I believe Lahiri Ayanamsha is not accurate, so the trial and error method has to be used to understand what the situation is."

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[b.vichalg...@gmail.com]

Hari Bol all!!,

Here a couple of video's (courtesy of Vic DiCara) showing:

The sky in one day: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dZ2Z8JwNF8

Do our eyes confirm a sidereal zodiac?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-yWypMN9bQ

Is Ashvini the first naksatra?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1dDqbVr8xI

Here a complete list regarding this subject: https://www.youtube.com/@VicDiCarasAstrology/search?query=sidereal

From a personal perspective, I like Vic DiCara's scientific explanation.

Take care.

Hare Krishna!

Your servant,

Vichal

Op vrijdag 10 maart 2023 om 21:18:09 UTC+1 schreef rainer hahn:

[Bhakta Robin]

Save us some time

What is his conclzsion sidereal or tropical?

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/istagosthi/33b5e18f-ddec-48c8-8798-3b2f6e000a2bn%40googlegroups.com.

[Pratyatosa Das ACBSP]

PROOF WESTERN TROPICAL ASTROLOGY WORKS:

If a child is conceived when the moon is in a male sign (Aries, Gemini, Leo, Libra, Sagittarius, or Aquarius) then that child will be a boy. If the child is conceived when the moon is in a female sign (Taurus, Cancer, Virgo, Scorpio, Capricorn, or Pisces), then the child will be a girl. I read this in an astrology book. My own experience is that this always holds true, and it serves as a very powerful tool for controlling the sex of our future children. But this only works using Western astrology, not the Hindu astrology being practiced by ISKCON's "Vedic astrologers!"

HOW CAN THE STARS, WHICH ARE LIGHT-YEARS AWAY FROM US, HAVE ANY EFFECT ON US? IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE!

IF INDIAN ASTROLOGERS ARE SO CON ABOUT SOME ARBITRARY STAR PATTERNS, THEN WHY DON'T THEY MAKE THE SIGNS OF THE ZODIAC DIFFERENT SIZES TO CORRESPOND TO THE VASTLY DIFFERENT SIZES OF THOSE STAR PATTERNS???

[b.vichalg...@gmail.com]

He is for the tropical zodiac.

In CC – Adi Lila chapter 13, text 89 & 90, where we find about the horoscope of Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu the Golden Avatar:

Here in the purport it said: Śukra (Venus) was in Meṣa-rāśi (Aries), in the constellation of Aśvinī; Vic DiCara says that Aries starts when the Sun crosses equator when beginning uttarayana. It is not necesarry that the start of Ashivini is also the start of Aries (this differs due to precession). This is called Ayanamsha.

What was then the true position of Ashvini in 1486 according to Vic DiCara?

Anyway, why dive into this subject matter (and astrology) so deeply? Just dive into the Names, Forms, Passtimes of Krishna, His incarnations and His devotees (Srimad Bhagavatam and Caitanya Caritamrta).

I got the information from (we use pratyaksa and anumana for this knowledge, best way to get knowledge is through sabda, the sastras like Srimad Bhagavatam and Caitanya Caritamrta):

See link: https://www.vicdicara.com/tropical_vedic_astrology.php

And underneath a little summary, you can read his complete presentation on his website (link above).

He says that the twelve signs are not stars (or groups of stars); but are mathematical divisions of space derived from the interplay between the Sun and Moon.

Further he explains about who else besides him has also declared that the zodiac - even the "zodiac of India" - is intrinsically tropical, and not sidereal.

First, we have the Vedas themselves, which used astrology to determine the correct time to perform important and sacred endeavors ("yajña"). Mostly they relied on 27 sidereal nakshatras, but whenever they utilized a 12-fold division, they did so in relation to solstice and equinox (i.e. they utilized only the tropical 12-fold division).

Next, we have the astronomical sections of the Purāṇas, along with the Indian astronomical and astrological classics like Sūrya Siddhānta and Bṛhat Parāśara Hora Śāstra. As shown above, these unequivocally and uniformly define the zodiac as a solstice/equinox phenomenon - i.e. "tropical." (see above for exact quotes)

This being the case, can we expect at least several more contemporary Indian thinkers to question the adoption of the sidereal zodiac? Yes, many. he mentions those he knows of.

Classical astrologers such as Varāha Mihira and Aryabhata spoke in favor of a tropical zodiac. Aryabhata did so in the first statement of the fourth chapter of his book, Aryabhatiya. Varāha Mihira did so in Bṛhatsaṁhita (3.1-3) and Pañcasiddhāntikā (3.21 & 32) where he noted that the solstices are the markers for the beginning of Cancer and Capricorn, and these drift through the nakshatras over time, but the tradition developing around him was ignoring this in favor of just keeping things the same.

Since most do not really care about 27 naksatra's and are looking for the 12 signs and its interpretation for their lives (dharma, artha, kama), Vic DiCara quotes from sastra and scientifically provides proof. It strikes to me that why there is no Indian (Vedic) astrologer who can counterargument him? I think there was one but now I cannot seem to find the video. Still when using intelligence, Vic DiCara kind of came on top for me. The Indian was more standard talk (which I also knew from other astrologers)

Anyway. Srila Prabhupada said not to dive to deep into astrology. Because astrology deals with dharma, artha, kama etc (the purusharthas, which are in the 3 modes). Devotees must focus on the parampurusharta (pure goodness = Krishna Consciousness).

If you want to

There are many astrologers who can talk/explain beautifully. This proofs that when one does not use material knowledge into service of Krishna or His devotees, then one gets bewildered. What I like about Vic DiCara is that he is a devotee. Yet others like Syamasundara Dasa and Bhabajeet Khalita (Exotic Astrology) are also devotees and they use sidereal. Listening to both is inspiring (Vic DiCara and Bhabajeet Khalita). Still it is better to dive into Srimad Bhagavatam (the sastra).

Hare Krishna.

Your servant,

Vichal

Op dinsdag 21 maart 2023 om 16:58:44 UTC+1 schreef Bhakta Robin: