Re: [installdir]/isp/*.xml file Vs online ISPdb
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David Ascher
Dec 15, 2009, 12:25:09 PM12/15/09
to John Roberts, ISP Configuration Database
On 12/15/09 12:28 AM, John Roberts wrote:
> From what I can see, the idea of online ISPdb is applicable to BIG
> telco type ISPs (minimum hundreds of thousands of users) and other
> gmail / hotmail type service providers.
>
> I just can't see how it could scale to handle hundreds of thousands of
> small / micro ISPs / Web Designers offering email services to their
> business clients using a personalized email address.
>
> With current ISPdb that would mean I submit per micro ISP client (one
> for each domain) + ISPdb admin verification (human??) of data supplied.
>
> Maybe autoconfig / ISPdb wasn't initially thought of for this
> scenario, but if there is something that works easily, it helps get
> Thunderbird into the SME market.
>
> I think these smaller ISPs would be better served going the local
> isp/xml file route. Editing XML and packaging shouldn't be a problem
> for the service provider prior to distribution.
1) I agree that for the large number of "long-tail" ISPs, submitting one
file per domain isn't going to work. That was about getting both the
"short head" and the eager users engaged.
2) for the long tail of ISPs, there are two approaches:
a) long term, I'd like to automate the creating and repackaging
Thunderbird w/ XML files for distribution by small ISPs, using something
like byob.mozilla.com. I'd like to make it so that it's easy to get
right, hard to get wrong, and ideally keeps good things like digital
signatures for installers working. I think we can also address some of
the use cases of the old MCD/autoconfig system at some point.
b) shorter term, there is an effort to allow ISPs to directly control
that information via DNS records. I think the tracking bug for that is
527802 -- Rob actually has a patch, but he hasn't posted it. It'd be
good to get feedback from ISPs as to whether the approach Rob is going
ahead with would work for them.
Rob, can I get you to update the bug (or point us to the right bug if I
have the wrong number)?
--david
> From what I can see, the idea of online ISPdb is applicable to BIG
> telco type ISPs (minimum hundreds of thousands of users) and other
> gmail / hotmail type service providers.
>
> I just can't see how it could scale to handle hundreds of thousands of
> small / micro ISPs / Web Designers offering email services to their
> business clients using a personalized email address.
>
> With current ISPdb that would mean I submit per micro ISP client (one
> for each domain) + ISPdb admin verification (human??) of data supplied.
>
> Maybe autoconfig / ISPdb wasn't initially thought of for this
> scenario, but if there is something that works easily, it helps get
> Thunderbird into the SME market.
>
> I think these smaller ISPs would be better served going the local
> isp/xml file route. Editing XML and packaging shouldn't be a problem
> for the service provider prior to distribution.
1) I agree that for the large number of "long-tail" ISPs, submitting one
file per domain isn't going to work. That was about getting both the
"short head" and the eager users engaged.
2) for the long tail of ISPs, there are two approaches:
a) long term, I'd like to automate the creating and repackaging
Thunderbird w/ XML files for distribution by small ISPs, using something
like byob.mozilla.com. I'd like to make it so that it's easy to get
right, hard to get wrong, and ideally keeps good things like digital
signatures for installers working. I think we can also address some of
the use cases of the old MCD/autoconfig system at some point.
b) shorter term, there is an effort to allow ISPs to directly control
that information via DNS records. I think the tracking bug for that is
527802 -- Rob actually has a patch, but he hasn't posted it. It'd be
good to get feedback from ISPs as to whether the approach Rob is going
ahead with would work for them.
Rob, can I get you to update the bug (or point us to the right bug if I
have the wrong number)?
--david
John Roberts
Dec 15, 2009, 1:44:52 PM12/15/09
to David Ascher, ISP Configuration Database
El 12/15/2009 06:25 PM, David Ascher escribi�:
I will be implementing a similar approach to a), which I would be happy
to share, and that I hope to have running when other projects allow.
The idea is a "personalized" version of byob built and hosted by "long
tail" ISPs / Enterprise IT depts for their own clients / users.
I've seen it's easy to unpack, add custom files (eg isp/*.xml), and
repack and this process could be scripted so that my customers (for
example) could download a package that already knows the servers for
their domain. They just add name, username and password, and they are up
and running.
Obviously I would host this myself on my secure server (so my customers
are safe). I beleive the type of ISP / Enterprise I refer to all have
"similar" tech skills and resources (or alternatives), so I think it
would be more of a documentation task than anything else.
When I get this running I'll let you know and will happily to share
scripts, concepts, etc
Regards
John
to share, and that I hope to have running when other projects allow.
The idea is a "personalized" version of byob built and hosted by "long
tail" ISPs / Enterprise IT depts for their own clients / users.
I've seen it's easy to unpack, add custom files (eg isp/*.xml), and
repack and this process could be scripted so that my customers (for
example) could download a package that already knows the servers for
their domain. They just add name, username and password, and they are up
and running.
Obviously I would host this myself on my secure server (so my customers
are safe). I beleive the type of ISP / Enterprise I refer to all have
"similar" tech skills and resources (or alternatives), so I think it
would be more of a documentation task than anything else.
When I get this running I'll let you know and will happily to share
scripts, concepts, etc
Regards
John
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