Terra preta soils

[arclein]

Hi

I did a post describing a method of producing terra preta soils using
only primative stick agriculture. Their principle option was to use
corn stover and I show how.

I am hesitant about other feed stocks in general been as forgiving as
corn stover, but that has to be shaken out through practice. I also
describe a modified incinerator design to utilize a full range of
biomass in later posts.

The astounding revelation is that the Indians sustained continuous
agriculture in the Amazon for centuries.

See my post at:http://globalwarming-arclein.blogspot.com/2007/07/
carbonizing-corn-in-field.html

This has turned out to be my most popular post to date. Enjoy the
site.

[Daniel Nagengast]

"arclein"

Thanks. The URL took me to a Page Not Found screen on eBlogger.

Dan

Dan Nagengast
785-748-0959
785-748-0609 fax
nage...@earthlink.net
www.kansasruralcenter.org

[Mel Landers]

Hi Dan,

 

Try the link again. It may work this time. I was able to get into it.

 

mel

Daniel Nagengast <nage...@earthlink.net> wrote:

---

Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Mel Landers]

Hi,

 

arclein wrote:

Their principle option was to use corn stover and I show how.

Thank you for sharing this idea. This is very helpful.

 

Having grown Maize for a number of decades now, I can attest to what you have stated about its stacking capacity. I also know the difficulty in utilizing Maize stumps if you don't burn them. (not that I ever thought to do so)

 

The Amazon Basin can grow an amazing amount of biomass in a short period of time.

(I have attached a photo I took four decades ago, when I introduced slash and mulch methods to the Urarina of Peru. It shows the abundance of biomass left on the soil after cutting tropical kudzu.) But, maize is a challenge to grow in that environment. The fact that maize pollen is so common attests value of dark earth soils and their ability to retain nutrients.

 

It makes sense that, women would long ago have turned to firing their pots in order to increase their strength and longevity. The clays in the upper Amazon Basin are high in sand. The area is one big flood plain with continual deposition of sand. If the same is true in the lower Amazon, their pots likely needed firing. I have also attached a photo of an Urarina woman making a pot. Notice the grey color of the clay. The pot I brought back with me had a very rough texture, due to the sand.

 

Why not turn to maize stumps to produce a high temperature fire. Place that fire under the soil, in an impromptu dirt oven, and you have maize charcoal. It would be easily powdered and once your soils started improving, it would have been plentiful as well. It is a short step ahead to do the process specifically for soil improvement. If anyone doubts that they might do this, they need to read the information written up by Suzanna Hecht on the practices of the Kayapo.

 

Here is a type of biomass that is even plentiful in the temperate zone. O.K.....I can hear Bob thinking....But, how can I stack the Maize stumps from a whole section of land. That is where a large scale pyrolysis retort comes in. But, here in Nicaragua and in many other maize growing regions of the world. Stacking by hand makes good sense.

 

Nicaraguan producers already think I'm crazy for wanting the grass they cut off the fields in preparation for plowing. Now they will think I am totally insane for requesting their maize stumps as well. This should be interesting! Thanks again!

 

mel

arclein <arc...@gmail.com> wrote:

---

Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.

[Jacky Foo]

On 20/08/07, arclein <arc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>I did a post describing a method of producing  terra preta soils using
>only primative stick agriculture.  Their principle option was to use

>corn stover and I show how......(cut)....

>See my post at:
> http://globalwarming-arclein.blogspot.com/2007/07/carbonizing-corn-in-field.html

Hi arclein
I checked your profile at http://www.blogger.com/profile/05942529252160087271 but found no "real name" and therefore I address you as "arclein".

I have not made charcoal nor charred materials before and therefore I ask you.

Q: have you tested your idea of "carbonizing corn in the field" as described ( Wednesday, July 4, 2007) in the link provided above ? or is there a drawing of what you described anywhere ?
>...the Indians in the Amazon likely created windrows that they
>then lightly buried and set afire.

Your idea sounds very logical if the Amazonians were making charred materials (from corn stalks with their roots intact). But did they make charred materials to fertilise their soils or was charred materials simply a by-product of their burning away of agricultural wastes (corn stalk and tapioca stems) ? . (your message of Friday, July 6, 2007 "Those amazonian soils" in  http://globalwarming-arclein.blogspot.com/2007_07_01_archive.html)  .

Given that we now want to make charred materials and we have corn stalks with their roots intact, the idea of stacking a windrow of two rows of corn stalks with their roots to form the outside walls is a good one. 

So let's say I have 5 acres of corn where I could get 50 tons of stover. I have no machinery (nor container to make a kiln), just bare hands of the workers e.g. in Kenya.
How big (length and height) would this single windrow be ?
What materials can I use to make the outer wall ?
...etc

regards
jacky

[arclein]

However they began doing this, the rewards were immediate inasmuch as
the soil retained fertility that would have completely disappeared in
perhaps three years. The volume of corn stover made this possible on
the whole growing area so that there was no lack of biochar even at
the very beginning.

Right now, we are speculating. I would actually build a circle with
the roots on the outside and see if it is possible to build a beehive
shape as an experiment. I would leave a central chimney, probably
because I had to, and fill the bottom of it with a well stamped mass
of biowaste. Once the beehive had reached the point of almost been
closed off, I would throw a large mass of coals into the chimney and
then fill the chimney with corn stover and dirt.

Then I would stand by and shovel dirt on any breakthrough for the next
few hours.

We can try other methods of stacking once we have a little
experience. And no, noone has done this yet and I am keen to see how
it goes.

regards

arclein

On Aug 20, 10:27 pm, "Jacky Foo" <jacky....@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 20/08/07, arclein <arcl...@gmail.com> wrote:>I did a post describing a method of producing terra preta soils using

> >only primative stick agriculture. Their principle option was to use
> >corn stover and I show how......(cut)....
> >See my post at:
>

> http://globalwarming-arclein.blogspot.com/2007/07/carbonizing-corn-in...
>
> Hi arclein
> I checked your profile athttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05942529252160087271but found no "real name"

> and therefore I address you as "arclein".
>
> I have not made charcoal nor charred materials before and therefore I ask
> you.
>
> Q: have you tested your idea of "carbonizing corn in the field" as described

> (Wednesday, July 4, 2007) in the link provided above ? or is there a drawing

[Mel Landers]

Hi everyone,

 

This sounds like a good start. I see that Jacky may have the means to give it a try. I hope we have a positive report soon. Are you going to be able to try this Jacky?

 

I cannot at this time, because the maize is srill green here.

 

mel

arclein <arc...@gmail.com> wrote:

However they began doing this, the rewards were immediate inasmuch as
the soil retained fertility that would have completely disappeared in
perhaps three years. The volume of corn stover made this possible on
the whole growing area so that there was no lack of biochar even at
the very beginning.

Right now, we are speculating. I would actually build a circle with
the roots on the outside and see if it is possible to build a beehive
shape as an experiment. I would leave a central chimney, probably
because I had to, and fill the bottom of it with a well stamped mass
of biowaste. Once the beehive had reached the point of almost been
closed off, I would throw a large mass of coals into the chimney and
then fill the chimney with corn stover and dirt.

Then I would stand by and shovel dirt on any breakthrough for the next
few hours.

We can try other methods of stacking once we have a little
experience. And no, noone has done this yet and I am keen to see how
it goes.

regards

arclein

On Aug 20, 10:27 pm, "Jacky Foo" wrote:
> On 20/08/07, arclein wrote:>I did a post describing a method of producing terra preta soils using

---

Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search.

[Jacky Foo]

On 22/08/07, Mel Landers <agr...@yahoo.com> wrote: 
>This sounds like a good start. I see that Jacky may have the
>means to give it a try. I hope we have a positive report soon.
>Are you going to be able to try this Jacky?
>I cannot at this time, because the maize is srill green here.

If all goes well, I will be in Kenya for a year from March 2008 but may make a short trip for another study in Nov/Dec 2007 (pending funding). I will have the opportunity along the travel route to visit one or two charcoal kilns to learn more about how they do it there first.

In Cambodia the smaller kilns are made of mud and often near the site where wood is available. Bags of charcoal are then carried to the market and sold. Often these are one-time use kilns since such operations are "illegal" in forest reserves. So their methods are also simple.  The larger ones are legal and operators would buy wood from people who scavenge from forest reserves. The overall effect is negative since trees are not replaced.

regards
jacky

[arclein]

One of the unfortunate effects of huge international development
budgets is that they get used in reforestration, since these are easy
to justify and execute. Five years later it is all charcoal.

On Aug 21, 10:25 pm, "Jacky Foo" <jacky....@gmail.com> wrote:

[Mel Landers]

Hi all,

 

Jacky brings up an important point here. When people cut down the forest to produce charcoal, the trees are often not replaced. Anyone doing this process should use renewable biomass.

 

mel

Jacky Foo <jack...@gmail.com> wrote:

---

Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

[Mel Landers]

Hi,

 

I repeat what I said in my last responce about deforestation. True development enables people to improve, not to destroy.

 

mel

arclein <arc...@gmail.com> wrote:

One of the unfortunate effects of huge international development
budgets is that they get used in reforestration, since these are easy
to justify and execute. Five years later it is all charcoal.

On Aug 21, 10:25 pm, "Jacky Foo" wrote:

> On 22/08/07, Mel Landers wrote:
>
> >This sounds like a good start. I see that Jacky may have the
> >means to give it a try. I hope we have a positive report soon.
> >Are you going to be able to try this Jacky?
> >I cannot at this time, because the maize is srill green here.
>
> If all goes well, I will be in Kenya for a year from March 2008 but may make
> a short trip for another study in Nov/Dec 2007 (pending funding). I will
> have the opportunity along the travel route to visit one or two charcoal
> kilns to learn more about how they do it there first.
>
> In Cambodia the smaller kilns are made of mud and often near the site where
> wood is available. Bags of charcoal are then carried to the market and sold.
> Often these are one-time use kilns since such operations are "illegal" in
> forest reserves. So their methods are also simple. The larger ones are
> legal and operators would buy wood from people who scavenge from forest
> reserves. The overall effect is negative since trees are not replaced.
>
> regards
> jacky

---

Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links.