Kunch

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sibdas ghosh

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Feb 8, 2010, 9:12:53 AM2/8/10
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These bright coloured fruits( red and black) are known in Bengali as
Kunch. Earlier time they were used to weigh gold- each weighs one
Rati. Do all seeds have the same weight?
DSCF0052.JPG
DSCF0051.JPG

figtree

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Feb 8, 2010, 9:14:49 AM2/8/10
to efloraofindia
Forgot to mention, photo taken on 13th Jan, '10 , Pingla- Midnapore

>  DSCF0052.JPG
> 62KViewDownload
>
>  DSCF0051.JPG
> 80KViewDownload

Satish Phadke

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Feb 8, 2010, 9:29:27 AM2/8/10
to figtree, efloraofindia
Abrus precatorius
A climber ...discussed earlier also. Leaves are edible.


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mani nair

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Feb 8, 2010, 10:02:27 AM2/8/10
to Satish Phadke, figtree, efloraofindia
Yes all the seeds weigh same. I don't know whether leaves are edible,
but the seeds are poisonous to humans. Looks very beautiful.

On 2/8/10, Satish Phadke <phadke...@gmail.com> wrote:
> *Abrus precatorius*


> A climber ...discussed earlier also. Leaves are edible.
>
> On 8 February 2010 19:44, figtree <sibda...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Forgot to mention, photo taken on 13th Jan, '10 , Pingla- Midnapore
>>
>> On Feb 8, 7:12 pm, sibdas ghosh <sibdasgh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > These bright coloured fruits( red and black) are known in Bengali as
>> > Kunch. Earlier time they were used to weigh gold- each weighs one
>> > Rati. Do all seeds have the same weight?
>> >
>> > DSCF0052.JPG
>> > 62KViewDownload
>> >
>> > DSCF0051.JPG
>> > 80KViewDownload
>>
>> --
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>> "efloraofindia" group.
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Dr. Pankaj Kumar

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Feb 8, 2010, 10:11:18 AM2/8/10
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I assume the plant is poisonous. Even the seed coat, or colour is
poisonous. First time ever I have heard that leaves are edible. Dont
try this at home :)....
Regards
Pankaj

shubhada nikharge

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Feb 8, 2010, 10:34:21 AM2/8/10
to Dr. Pankaj Kumar, efloraofindia
Dr. Pankajji,
Although the seeds are poisonous, the leaves are edible. i have eaten them.
they are very commonly used in 'paan' by the panwala, i believe.

Marathi local name : गुंज
Cheers,
Shubhada


"I am only one; but still I am one. I cannot do everything, but still I can do something; I will not refuse to do the something I can do."



From: Dr. Pankaj Kumar <sahani...@gmail.com>
To: efloraofindia <indian...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, 8 February, 2010 8:41:18 PM
Subject: [efloraofindia:27398] Re: Kunch
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Pardeshi S.

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Feb 8, 2010, 10:47:06 AM2/8/10
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Yes the leaves are used as flavoring agent in Paan. however the seeds
are poisonous, i e. six seeds taken at a time can lead to death.

Regards
Satish Pardeshi

On Feb 8, 8:34 pm, shubhada nikharge <shubhada_nikha...@yahoo.co.in>
wrote:


> Dr. Pankajji,
> Although the seeds are poisonous, the leaves are edible. i have eaten them.
> they are very commonly used in 'paan' by the panwala, i believe.
> Marathi local name : गुंज
> Cheers,
> Shubhada
>
> "I am only one; but still I am one. I cannot do everything, but still I can do something; I will not refuse to do the something I can do."
>
> ________________________________

> From: Dr. Pankaj Kumar <sahanipan...@gmail.com>


> To: efloraofindia <indian...@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Mon, 8 February, 2010 8:41:18 PM
> Subject: [efloraofindia:27398] Re: Kunch
>
> I assume the plant is poisonous. Even the seed coat, or colour is
> poisonous. First time ever  I have heard that leaves are edible. Dont
> try this at home :)....
> Regards
> Pankaj
>
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Neil Soares

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Feb 8, 2010, 11:53:09 AM2/8/10
to Pardeshi S., indian...@googlegroups.com
Hi,
 Toxicology is  part of the 2nd M.B.B.S.curriculum - 10 CRUSHED seeds are lethal.
                  With regards,
                    Neil Soares.

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Pinki

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Feb 8, 2010, 11:18:15 PM2/8/10
to efloraofindia
there is some supersticious thing attached to these seeds also. that
if seeds are kept at home or are thrown into someones house, a tiff/
fighting erupts in that house especially between husband and
wife....this really doesnt happen...Can try this at home...

Alok

On Feb 8, 8:53 am, Neil Soares <drneilsoa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>  Toxicology is  part of the 2nd M.B.B.S.curriculum - 10 CRUSHED seeds are lethal.
>                   With regards,
>                     Neil Soares.
>

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Pankaj Oudhia

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Feb 9, 2010, 12:35:16 AM2/9/10
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I have observed that such stories are associated with many plants so that one can not plant it in home garden and surroundings. In this way the chance of accidental consumption of poisonous plants like Abrus can be avoided. In my state Gloriosa is known as Jhagadhin and it is believed that its presence in home garden results in family tension. As you know Gloriosa was once assocaited with LTTE as alternate source of poison in suicide capsules.

 Due to this belief the people in Chhattisgarh keep Gloriosa at bay. Unfortunately nothing has been associated with poisonous (exotic) Jatropha and as result due to Jatropha poisoning thousands of children are reaching to hospital. It has taken lives of five children in India.

Pankaj Oudhia  

Antaryami Kaushik

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Feb 9, 2010, 8:06:27 AM2/9/10
to Pankaj Oudhia, efloraofindia
Yes it is commonly also called as 'ratti' and due to the same weight of all seeds it was used to measure the weight of the Gold. In the past the purity of the gold is also calculated on this basis ratti and masa. Thanks and regards. 
--
Antaryami Kaushik
Sri Ganganagar (Rajasthan)

Ninad Raut

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Feb 10, 2010, 6:58:14 AM2/10/10
to efloraofindia
Hello,
Nice information by Antaryami ji, which I was waiting to hear.
I have even heard that Rati or Gunj is also known as Gold-smith Gunj,
because of the same property that Antaryami ji mentioned [seeds were
taken in use by Gold smiths in the past to weigh the Gold] Hence,
searched for literature on this and found very few
1. http://www.sizes.com/units/seeds_Abrus.htm ,
2. http://uel-iis-dev.uel.ac.uk/lss/ebooks/documents/cd3/TaverniersTravelsinIndia-Vol-I.pdf

But the weight given in both references are differs drastically from
each other.
Also, As Shubhda ji said, leaves are used in Paan and known as Hari
patti, which tastes sweet in first bite.
Whereas Root is adulterated with Glycerhiza glabra or commonly known
as Liquorice or Jeshthimadh / Jeshthimadhu or Yashtimadhu. It is
also known as Indian Wild Liquorice.
According to Ayurvedic Pharmacopoeia of India seeds are also use in
baldness.
Other actions or uses are: uterine stimulant, abortifacient besides
being toxic.
Seeds contain abrin, a toxalbumin, indole derivatives, anthocyanins,
sterols, terpens, whereas root and leaves contains precol, abrol,
glycyrrhizin and alkaloids such as abrasine and precasine. Root also
contains triterpenoids abruslactone A, methyl abrusgenate and
abrusgenic acid. (Khare ed. Indian Medicinal plants 2007). Presence
of different chemical compounds may be a reason of poisonous seeds and
edible root and leaves.


Many Regards

Ninad B. Raut
JRF, WII


On Feb 9, 6:06 pm, Antaryami Kaushik <antaryamikaushi...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Yes it is commonly also called as *'ratti'* and due to the same weight of


> all seeds it was used to measure the weight of the Gold. In the past the

> purity of the gold is also calculated on this basis *ratti and masa. *Thanks
> and regards.* *


>
> On 2/9/10, Pankaj Oudhia <pankajoud...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > I have observed that such stories are associated with many plants so that
> > one can not plant it in home garden and surroundings. In this way the chance
> > of accidental consumption of poisonous plants like Abrus can be avoided. In
> > my state Gloriosa is known as Jhagadhin and it is believed that its presence
> > in home garden results in family tension. As you know Gloriosa was once
> > assocaited with LTTE as alternate source of poison in suicide capsules.
>
> >  Due to this belief the people in Chhattisgarh keep Gloriosa at bay.
> > Unfortunately nothing has been associated with poisonous (exotic) Jatropha
> > and as result due to Jatropha poisoning thousands of children are reaching
> > to hospital. It has taken lives of five children in India.
>
> > Pankaj Oudhia
>

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> Sri Ganganagar (Rajasthan)- Hide quoted text -

promila chaturvedi

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Feb 10, 2010, 8:19:55 AM2/10/10
to antaryami...@gmail.com, pankaj...@gmail.com, indian...@googlegroups.com

 I thought that the seeds of Adenanthera pavonina were used by jewelers, which is known as ratti.
Promila

Date: Tue, 9 Feb 2010 18:36:27 +0530
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:27472] Re: Kunch
From: antaryami...@gmail.com
To: pankaj...@gmail.com
CC: indian...@googlegroups.com

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Gurcharan Singh

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Feb 10, 2010, 8:46:46 AM2/10/10
to promila chaturvedi, antaryami...@gmail.com, pankaj...@gmail.com, indian...@googlegroups.com
Promila ji
I could find the following names for Adenanthera pavonnia, (but not the "Ratti" which is used for Abrus precatorius):

Sans: kunchandana. Beng: Rakta, kambal. Mar: Thorligunj, Manjadi. Tam: Anikundumani. Tel: Bandi, guruvenda. Kan: Manjetti. English: Coral wood, Red wood, Red sandalwood tree, Saga seed tree. The attractive red seeds have been used as beads in jewellery, leis and rosaries. They were also used in ancient India for weighing gold. The seeds are curiously similar in weight. Four seeds make up about one gramme. In fact the name "saga" is traced to the Arabic term for "goldsmith". The seeds were eaten in Melanesia and Polynesia and the people there called it the "food tree". The seeds were roasted before eating. Elsewhere they are boiled. In Java, they are roasted, shelled, then eaten with rice. They are said to taste like soy bean. The raw seeds are toxic and may cause intoxication. Studies show the cooked seed to be rich in oil and proteins and easily digested by both humans and livestock.

-- 
Dr. Gurcharan Singh
Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

promila chaturvedi

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Feb 10, 2010, 10:56:23 AM2/10/10
to sing...@gmail.com, antaryami...@gmail.com, pankaj...@gmail.com, indian...@googlegroups.com
Dear Prof. Gurucharan Ji,
though the word ratti is not used but the account is given in The Trees of Calcutta by A.P.Benthall-
The seeds are much used by jeweller and goldsmiths as measure of weight, because they are said very constantly in weigh precisely 4 grains each. They are also worn as ornaments and are often set in gold.

Promila 

Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2010 19:16:46 +0530
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:27521] Re: Kunch
From: sing...@gmail.com
To: landd...@hotmail.com
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