Stuffing Box shaft seal

[Napoleon]

Hi Folks
I just recently purchased my first sailboat a 1985 N26C #171 last
summer and in the survey it was suggested to "Replace rubber hose
connection between stuffing box and stern tube" This is a yellow
colored hose about 6" long with 4 hose clamps. Has anyone changed this
hose? If so can you tell me what size and make this hose is? Any hints
on changing procedures would be appreciated. I have pictures but don't
know how to place them on discussion group but I can email them to
your address if need be. The engine is a Westerbeke 21 direct drive

Reg Coombs
"Summer Wind"
1985 N26C #171
Holyrood, NL., Ca

[mpas...@ct.metrocast.net]

The Dorade boxes on my NS33 are in need of refinishing. It would be easier to take them off and do it at home. Has anyone attempted this? I think I may be openning a can of worms and might regret it. They seem to be mounted with some pretty strong adhesive. Any advice?
Michael Passero
NS33. #42
New London, CT
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

[wb]

Michael,

I removed the one on my 30 last summer -- as you say, the adhesive was
pretty strong and I eventually got impatient (like maybe after 2 minutes)
and forced it. It did, however, glue back together nicely and it was very
easy to finish on a proper work surface.

Good luck,

Bill Baxter
Persistence NS30 #507
Kingston ON

[helen dakin]

I have a NS 33, No 7 which I acquired in October. In the fall, while under the winter cover I removed the foward dorade boxes as well as the the foward deck organizers which are underlain by a teak strip curved to match the coach house deck curvature. All were sealed at the deck by a flesh coloured rubber sealant/adhesive which I worked through with a putty knife, a bit of muscle and a lot of patience.This boat has had relatively light use and is in very good shape and virtually all is the way Hinterhoeller factory installed the fittings etc. I chose not not pry up but rather, work carefully to cut the sealant and not the overlying wood surface. The remnant sealant is easily removed. 

 

By the way, with the boat came the Hinterhoeller toollbox with a pair of curious tools, made of cast aluminum with open ends like a cresent wrench, fixed and smooth ( not adjustable). There is no tooth on the inside curve of the cresent shaped end ( and it does not appear that there ever was). I do not know what purpose these items are intended to serve. Assuming that they were Hinterhoeller-supplied with the boat when new, anyone with a idea on the purpose of these items?

 

Ken Dakin

NS33 #7

Ancaster Ontario

[mpas...@ct.metrocast.net]

Ken,
Perhaps the wrenches are to adjust the shaft log. Thanks for sharing your experience with the Dorade boxes. I'm dealing with a black sealant and I dread the thought that it may be something extremely tough like 5200.
Michael Passero NS33 #42

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

---

From: helen dakin <dak...@gmail.com>

Sender: ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com

Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 22:01:56 -0500

To: <ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com>

ReplyTo: ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: Dorade box

[Reg Coombs]

The Tools you are talking about are most likely for the stuffing box, for tightening or undoing the packing gland, one wrench to hold the other to tighten.
 
I don't know how my question on Stuffing Box shaft seal got mixed with your Dorade Box.

 Reg Coombs
"Summer Wind"
1985 N26C #171
Holyrood, NL., Ca

---

Subject: Re: Dorade box
To: ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com
From: mpas...@ct.metrocast.net
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 03:17:41 +0000

[Philip R. LeVine]

I refinished my dorades on the boat and put on a new teak top because the
lucite top had a hole bigger than the new stainless cowl vents I replaced
the ugly plastic ones which came with the boat. They had turned black and I
cleaned each one with a whole bottle of appropriate cleaner and they turned
black again within a few weeks. The dorades came out beautifully and I now
have twenty coats of varnish on them. I put tape on the bottom on the
no-skid and sanded carefully near the bottom.
Phil LeVine, MeSays, San Pedro, CA

--------------------------------------------------
From: <mpas...@ct.metrocast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 5:19 PM

To: <ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Dorade box

> The Dorade boxes on my NS33 are in need of refinishing. It would be

[Reg Coombs]

Here's a few pictures of the stuffing box and the hose I'm talking about
 
> Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 16:25:54 -0800

> Subject: Stuffing Box shaft seal

> From: coom...@hotmail.com
> To: INA-Nonsuch-Di...@googlegroups.com

[Philip R. LeVine]

The funny tools are for adjusting the packing gland. Leave them in the special tool box and treasure them. You should also be sure there is a square hole screw driver in that box.

From: helen dakin

Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 7:01 PM

To: ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com

 

Subject: Re: Dorade box

[Joseph L. Tierney]

Reg:
Looks like the hose was leaking and was repaired with self-sealing tape.
I know of no other way to replace that hose than to disconnect and pull the shaft back. Tough job; I have never done it myself. I had yard do it. I hope that's an option for you. If not, start looking for a friend with real experience.
Joe Tierney  Allegro NS33 #64 Annapolis, MD

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[Joe Valinoti]

As I've stated before, your best friend in this job is to start early with a good penetrant and vibration from a brass hammer for the coupling and stuffing box.  I believe you may have to pull the prop to have the shaft clear the rudder.  Penetrant and a hammer will not work there.  You need a proper puller.  Lots of auto parts stores will loan or rent a tool for this purpose.

Joe Valinoti
S/V IL Gatto NS30U #221 (1984)
Sea Harbour Yacht Club
Oriental, NC

 

  

 

        ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ (\_~ ~ (\_~ ~ (\_~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~                   

[Mike]

Don't know if it works on a 26 NS. But, when I converted BIANKA to electric propulsion I had to cut the shaft back. I was able to pull the shaft and prop from the boat in one piece past the rudder and then reinstall it.   Mike BIANKA 1986 30U http://biankablog.blogspot.com --- On Thu, 2/10/11, Joe Valinoti <joes...@gmail.com> wrote:

[don...@aol.com]

Hi Reg,

 

Assuming your stuffing box, shaft and coupling are the same as my 26C, here's how I did it last year. My shaft is slightly offset from center line of boat and I have a 2 bladed prop, so there is no need to pull the prop to clear rudder. (unless a large diameter 3 blade prop ?) I don't think it has to go that far back anyway. I also assume that the boat is out of the water. Forget about hammers and wheel pullers. Instead, procure a tubing cutter and 2-3 ft of 1/2" electrical steel tubing (EMT) (Not rigid conduit)  Memory is fuzzy, but 3/4" EMT will work better if it is of slightly smalled OD than your shaft. The space on the 26 to do this work this precludes an NFL lineman from doing the job.

 

1. Loosen the packing nut on the stuffing box

 

2. Loosen nuts from 4 bolts holding coupling sections together. When you back nuts out to about the last 1 to 1-1/2 threads,  measure the distance between the coupling halves w shaft pulled back. (about 3/4"?)

 

3. Remove safety wire and square headed set screw on the shaft half of the coupling

 

5.Using the distance previously measured, cut a section of the EMT just slightly shorter. The tubing cutter makes a nice square cut.

 

6. Slide the piece of EMT between the coupling halves, position it in line with the the shaft, then tighten the nuts evenly. As nuts re tightened, the shaft will be pressed part way out of the coupling. Remove the nuts completely, pull shaft back as far as possible, and measure that space between flanges.

 

7. Cut a second piece of EMT, about the lenght of the second  measurement .remove the first piece of EMT and replace w second piece. Tighten nuts again, shaft will be pressed out further.

 

8  Repeat this process, using progressively longer sections of EMT, till shaft is pressed out of the coupling half. Coupling half is put aside, (Save the square stock in the keyway shaft). push shaft back into stuffing box. Clamps on stuffing box are removed and stuffing box pulled out of hose.

 

9. Remove the other clamps, then the hose. If it is necessary to cut the hose for removal, measure the length of the hose first. I cut a piece of heater hose (radiator hose) of the same diameter and length as original. 

 

10. The assembly process is now reversed . While shaft and coupling are separated they both should be cleaned, including the keyways and key stock, and lubricated, This will aid in getting the shaft back into the coupling. The nuts/bolts, EMT pieces are of no help in getting shaft into coupling, It has to be done by hand, with some slight tapping. Assemble w the keystock in the slots to assure alignment of keyways. Remember to check for leaks when boat is launched.

 

Note. As long as shaft can be removed w/o rudder interference, this would be a good time to consider replacement of the cutlass bearing on the strut.

 

Good Luck on the  project

 

Al Donaghy

 

N26C 19

Swansea MA

[Reg Coombs]

Thanks Al
Sounds like good procedure, great advice. Yes mine is a folding prop on an offset shaft which greatly simplifies the job. I am going to change cutlass bearing while I 'm at it.
 
Thanks

Reg Coombs
 "Summer Wind"
1985 N26C #171
Holyrood, NL., Ca

---

To: ina-nonsuch-di...@googlegroups.com

Subject: Re: Stuffing Box shaft seal

From: don...@aol.com
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 14:20:38 -0500

[Jim]

Michael, I removed my dorade box last Spring. Used a wide thin putty knife to work away at the sealant which appeared to me to be 5200 or 5400. I used a soft mallet to help the putty knife along and took likely 30-40 minutes to remove it. There was no damage to the box. The excess on the deck came off pretty easily. There are some pieces of aluminum angle iron once you take off the plexiglas top. While I had the box at home I did put the screws back in the coach roof with a little sealant to prevent any water from our infamous Spring Showers from getting in. Once I was ready to re-install I masked off around the box on the coach roof to make cleanup after using 5400 to reseal the box in place again.

Jim Chamberlain
Oakville

[Jim Willison]

Michael remove the lucite top take out the screws holding the dorade
box to the deck and cut the sealant by using a piece of fine strong
wire like guitar string or stainless fishing leader wire working it
back and forth in a sawing motion under the dorade box.You can hook a
piece of dowel rod on each end of the wire to use as small handles
this works very well for cutting sealant.

Jim Willison
36 Gone Away

On Feb 10, 4:13 pm, Jim <jim.chamberl...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> Michael, I removed my dorade box last Spring. Used a wide thin putty knife to work away at the sealant which appeared to me to be 5200 or 5400.  I used a soft mallet to help the putty knife along and took likely 30-40 minutes to remove it.  There was no damage to the box. The excess on the deck came off pretty easily. There are some pieces of aluminum angle iron once you take off the plexiglas top. While I had the box at home I did put the screws back in the coach roof with a little sealant to prevent any water from our infamous Spring Showers from getting in. Once I was ready to re-install I masked off around the box on the coach roof to make cleanup after using 5400 to reseal the box in place again.
>
> Jim Chamberlain
> Oakville
>

[K. Wilderspin]

I had the same problem, leaks through the flexible part of the stuffing box.  The replacement part was 1 3/4 inch neoprene hose.  I wasn't competent or brave enough to do it myself.  The yard did it with the boat in the water, and without removal of a large fixed 3 bladed prop.

 

Ken Wilderspin

Rosie

N26C 82

Kingston, ON

 

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[Thor Powell]

Al's procedure is the one I used to remove the shaft, however I just
used 1/4 sockets as spacers vs. cutting material for the job. I found
I needed several different bolt lengths as the space to work was so
tight. It took most of a day to get it off.

But the fun was not over. Getting it all back is just as much fun. My
shaft flange is an "interference" fit, it is exactly the diameter of
the shaft plus about a 1000nd. So you need to heat the coupling to
expand the joint and cool the shaft to shrink it. Otherwise it will
not fit together.

I used a map-gas torch with a 400 degree welding crayon ( welding
supply store) to tell me when it was hot enough. I had immersed the
shaft in dry ice ( ice cream manufacturer) for a morning before hand.
With a friend inside doing the heating, and another standing by with a
fire extinguisher. two of us outside waited for the call and at the
right moment removed the shaft from the dry ice, cleaned off the
frost, and slid her in and tapped it home with a rubber mallet. You
have one shot and maybe a minute before she contracts / expands beyond
redemption.

It took two tries. The shaft key fell off on the first try, Murphy is
always at work it seems. Can only get the key on the shaft from the
inside as it will not get through the rubber hose area.

A dry run before cooling and heating helps to refine the process.

Dry ice / map gas requires gloves, safety glasses and overalls as both
can cause very nasty burns. Cold beer ( Sleeman's) at the end of the
job was essential.

Those hoses should be replaced, a leak there could ruin your day for
sure. Buck Algonquin carries the hose in multiple one foot sections. I
do not know of another manufacturer for these hoses. Going to all
this work you should also check the shaft for trueness and have the
flange squared to the shaft while it is all apart.. Any machine shop
should be able to do this for you.

You will need to realign the shaft flange to the transmission +- 6mm

Cheers

Thor

[Reg Coombs]

Thanks everyone for great advice on changing Stuffing Box shaft seal.
This is a great group confirms that I made the right decision on buying a Nonsuch for my first family sailboat
 
Al and Thor: as a millwright I understand your procedure and advice completely especially the part about the Sleeman's

Reg Coombs

"Summer Wind"
1985 N26C #171

Holyrood, NL. Canada 

> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 09:41:09 -0800

> Subject: Re: Stuffing Box shaft seal

> From: thor....@gmail.com
> To: INA-Nonsuch-Di...@googlegroups.com

[Thor Powell]

I made a mistake ... the shaft to transmission tolerance is 4
thousands not 6 mm

[Reg Coombs]

Thanks 
 
 
> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 12:48:10 -0800

> Subject: Re: Stuffing Box shaft seal
> From: thor....@gmail.com
> To: INA-Nonsuch-Di...@googlegroups.com
>

[Simon Gardner]

We are looking to charter a boat in Croatia and are wondering if anyone out there has ever done any recent sailing in Adriatic Sea.

Simon Gardner

#138 “Simon Sez”

[Mike]

Simon:   No experience in the Adratic but, would love to hear about your experience when you get back.   Mike Girardo --- On Tue, 2/15/11, Simon Gardner <boats...@sympatico.ca> wrote:

[Reg Coombs]

Simon
Lets us know any Information you dig up on sailing the Adratic especialy the price of charters, Thinking this would be great place for family vacation in the future.
Cheers

Reg Coombs
"Summer Wind"
1985 N26C

Holyrood, NL
 

---

Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 05:17:19 -0800
From: biank...@verizon.net

[golde...@talktalk.net]

If you manage to organise it I hope you have a great time but don't forget to make good notes and take lots of pictures for an Update article in the future!
Cheers
Sue Walker
Update Editor

[John Zinner]

The last week of May into the first week of June in 2007, my admiral and I and another couple, close cruising friends, sailed the islands off the Dalmatian Coast of Croatia for a week, after having driven along the Coast by land during the prior week. We chartered with The Moorings out of their Northern Croatian base, now at Agana, on a one way sail to Dubrovnik. We sailed the boat ourselves with the assistance of a "first mate," a young man, certified captain, who guided us to the best islands and anchorages,and helped us navigate the language and culture. I cannot say too much about this magnificent cruise and I recommend it to all who enjoy this kind of sailing trip. In short, it was out and out magnificent. By the way, I believe this is the better side of the Adriatic for many reasons, including the Croatian government's conscientious attention to the environment and especially water quality. For details, I would be happy to communicate off the list with anyone who is interested in details.

                                                                                                        John Zinner
                                                                                                        POLARIS NS30U
                                                                                                        Annapolis