View this page "IS_lship_08"
Dean
doc with line breaks...need feedback so we can get this to Dr. Dave
Click on http://groups.google.com/group/imsa-karate-club/web/IS_lship_08
- or copy & paste it into your browser's address bar if that doesn't
work.
Dean
not apply to IMSA Karate Club. I'd like some input on the whole
thing, and taking out/leaving in those items in particular. Thanks!
Amanda
"Don't punish people who don't win (use your judgment--students can
probably handle a few pushups, but don't make it excessive)"
my take on how this is applicable:
instead of only some people doing pushups: everyone does! :)
hmm. these are good. can we add to them: [you should have a healthy
amount of common sense]? cuz that's assumed too... but this is for
imsa...
Dean
"Respond to new situations with common sense." ? Or did you want
something that really came out and said "use common sense at all
times" ?
Amanda
Bullets that we may want to remove:
As you enter the Dojo, greet those who are present, acknowledging the
instructor prior to the others.
I don't know if this formality is necessary...especially since there
are only like...5-10 people at practices, right?
-----
hmm. if there is always a designated "instructor"... and it wouldn't
hurt to say hi or bow to everyone when you see them...
____________________________
To ask a question of an instructor or senior, get his/her attention
politely, wait for acknowledgment, and preface your question with
"onegai shimasu" ("please teach me"). After you have received the
requested answer or help, bow and say "arigato."
Did we decide to do anything with the formalizing of question/answer
protocol?
----
i don't think we decided anything, but to me this seems really really
formal.
------------------------------------------------------
It is polite to offer a student of higher rank to enter or exit the
Dojo before you.
Um...again with the not really having a Dojo and not really having a
bunch of students that are really high rank. I still think students
should bow as they enter/exit the practice area (yay formality).
--------
how bout just, have respect for everyone else, moreso if they're
higher rank than you.
--------------------------------------
Once lined up, stand in Yoi, then move into seiza (kneeling position)
upon the cue given by the instructor and execute the following series
of bows, saying "onegai shimasu" before class or "arigato gozaimasu"
after class, except the bow to the shomen.
Shomen ni rei (bow to the front of the Dojo)
Hata ni rei (bow to the American flag)
Sempai, Sensei, or Renshi ni rei (bow to whomever is leading the
class)
Shihan ni rei (bow to the head instructor of the Dojo)
We only really bow to the instructor of each class...it might be
worthwhile to throw in a bow to Sensei or O-Sensei Nagamine...but we
don't have to do all the Shomen and Hata stuff...
----
hmm. we're gonna get a flag and a pic for i-s right? if we leave those
w/ dr. D, maybe then we leave that up to the club how formal they want
to be?
---------------------------------------
During mokuso (a quiet moment of reflection and mental preparation),
the sound of your breathing should be audible only to yourself.
We don't mokuso, but it wouldn't be a bad idea to start. Again,
concurrence needed from all of us.
----
i concur! i like mokuso. @ beginning & end of class...
what our class does (i dunno how yours does it) is we bow right after
mokuso, so bowing into and out of class is done right after reflection/
meditation... which is kinda nice.
------------------------------------------------
Do not walk between the instructor and the class. If it is necessary
to go to the front of the room when people are lined up in seiza
facing the shomen, walk behind the row you are sitting in, then go to
either side of the room, and proceed from there. When passing by a row
of seated fellow students, hold your right (sword) arm out with the
palm open to signify respect and peaceful intent.
I don't think this is a huge issue either, as there aren't lots of
times when 1) a class is large enough for this to be a problem, or 2)
a student has to walk through the front of the room or whatnot.
-----
yah, it makes a lot of sense, it's just common courtesy not to walk in
front of people. but specifically mandating this might be a bit too
much.
--------------------------------------
An example Karate Creed (from Academy of Traditional Karate,
http://www.traditional-karate.com):
I am positive.
I avoid drugs and other harmful things.
I am disciplined.
I respect myself and others.
I only use myu Karate to protect myself.
Think positive!
What is the significance of each line of the Karate Creed? How does
it help in Martial Arts (and life?)
I think this is a useful exercise, but I may be the only one. Humor
me: try to complete the exercise, then we can discuss what we all
thought about it and if we think it's worthwhile. Remember, these are
potential instructors we're training (not just to teach at IMSA KC,
but giving them a head start to teach outside of IMSA when they
graduate).
----
this sounds like institutionalization, and like something that would
include things like imsa goals and how they apply to karate. so... my
general vote is no.
i understand why it would be good... but they're not going to take it
seriously. i think bringing up points like this for discussion... or
like, showing what drugs do to reaction time or something, is a lot
more applicable ( i mean, think of the biology!) than just saying,
memorize these rules and repeat them!
Dean
> politely, wait for acknowledgment, and preface your question with
> ----
> i don't think we decided anything, but to me this seems really really
> formal.
It is really formal...depends on how formal we want Intersession to
be.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> It is polite to offer a student of higher rank to enter or exit the
> Dojo before you.
> --------
> how bout just, have respect for everyone else, moreso if they're
> higher rank than you.
> --------------------------------------
I'm okay with making it more general, but sometimes it helps to point
out specific things that show respect/show disrespect--I think we're
at a point where we can 'sense' respectful/disrespectful behavior, but
I don't think we were always like that. Guidelines help for
beginners, but I'm open to talk about it more.
> Shomen ni rei (bow to the front of the Dojo)
> Hata ni rei (bow to the American flag)
> Sempai, Sensei, or Renshi ni rei (bow to whomever is leading the
> class)
> Shihan ni rei (bow to the head instructor of the Dojo)
>
> We only really bow to the instructor of each class...it might be
> worthwhile to throw in a bow to Sensei or O-Sensei Nagamine...but we
> don't have to do all the Shomen and Hata stuff...
> ----
> hmm. we're gonna get a flag and a pic for i-s right? if we leave those
> w/ dr. D, maybe then we leave that up to the club how formal they want
> to be?
> ---------------------------------------
Agreed--we can't make them do anything. I like that.
> ------------------------------------------------
Yay Mokuso!
> Do not walk between the instructor and the class...
> -----
> yah, it makes a lot of sense, it's just common courtesy not to walk in
> front of people. but specifically mandating this might be a bit too
> much.
> --------------------------------------
> An example Karate Creed (from Academy of Traditional Karate,http://www.traditional-karate.com):
> I am positive.
> I avoid drugs and other harmful things.
> I am disciplined.
> I respect myself and others.
> I only use myu Karate to protect myself.
> Think positive!
> What is the significance of each line of the Karate Creed? How does
> it help in Martial Arts (and life?)
>
> I think this is a useful exercise, but I may be the only one. Humor
> me: try to complete the exercise, then we can discuss what we all
> thought about it and if we think it's worthwhile. Remember, these are
> potential instructors we're training (not just to teach at IMSA KC,
> but giving them a head start to teach outside of IMSA when they
> graduate).
> ----
> this sounds like institutionalization, and like something that would
> include things like imsa goals and how they apply to karate. so... my
> general vote is no.
> i understand why it would be good... but they're not going to take it
> seriously. i think bringing up points like this for discussion... or
> like, showing what drugs do to reaction time or something, is a lot
> more applicable ( i mean, think of the biology!) than just saying,
> memorize these rules and repeat them!
You didn't read what I said! Try the exercise first, then give your
feedback. The students don't have to memorize it...I said it was a
'sample' Karate Creed. It has nothing to do with
institutionalization, and I have no idea what "IMSA goals" you're
talking about--whatever they were, they weren't around when I was, or
they didn't stick. All it requires is some thinking; it's just like
having them interpret "There is no First Attack in Karate" or various
other nuggets of Karate wisdom. The idea is "Why are these things
something that a Karate school might stress? How are the ideas
they're based on positively affect the martial artist (and
individual)?"
When you finish that, if you still don't like it, we can talk some
more.
Dean
questions?
For instance:
Building off the habits point..."Name one bad habit that you are going
to change, and how you are going to do it."
There are others we can do, but it's a nice way to tie in life skills
with Karate. someday maybe we'll even teach Karate-Do.
mivil
"onegai shimasu" ("please teach me"). After you have received the
requested answer or help, bow and say "arigato." "
what flag? and what do u want us [the club] to do with it?
"Do not walk between the instructor and the class. If it is necessary
to go to the front of the room when people are lined up in seiza
facing the shomen, walk behind the row you are sitting in, then go to
either side of the room, and proceed from there. When passing by a row
of seated fellow students, hold your right (sword) arem out with the
palm open to signify respect and peaceful intent."----ppl will know
this after the first day, so i dont think its necessary.
During class, when the instructor demonstrates a technique for
practice, you should kneel quietly and attentively on one knee (hiza)
or sit in seiza."----- i get it, but do we do that? can't we just
stand there?
"During mokuso (a quiet moment of reflection and mental preparation),
the sound of your breathing should be audible only to yourself. "----
like doing this especially at the end ^_^
Dean
etiquette section). Please Comment.
Amanda
it up again, (and mivil- the club stuff DOESN'T need to be as formal
as i-s, it's alright :-p)
if we decide that we don't like how they're taking it, or that respect
is lacking or something, we up it again, make them show respect
through their words, hoping it will become a habit to be polite.
hmmmm. maybe we should talk about the respect stuff? on the first day?
specially cuz of gm. so like, in the afternoon... we can talk about
what different ranks really mean and respect and dojo and stuff like
that. cuz in the morning we just want to tell them *what* to do, in
the afternoon we can talk about *why*... i also don't really want to
introduce us beyond, like, names and you'd better listen to us cuz
we're teaching. then go into more detail in the afternoon... cuz then
we have more time in the am to tell them our "dojo rules" in brief...
and get started.
**
mivil: a lot of traditional schools (like if you remember cynthia's
dad's tkd school) have a flag that they hang up, and sometimes bow to,
out of respect. and a lot of them also have a picture of the style's
founder-- shotokan schools will have funakoshi, ours would be a
picture of nagamine (the d00d who wrote the book). we're going to try
to print and frame a pic of him, and hang it up. we also want to get a
flag. so, we'll let you guys keep them and it's up to you whether you
want to hang them up when you practice or not.
**
imsa karate creed "exercise"... :
1. pass on the right, like cars
2. i sleep on weekends when i get the chance
3. i don't eat teh cafeteria food (i eat healthy stuff)
4. ...
i can't think of anything that's not either common sense or
rididculous. sorry :-\
**
hnn. yeah. the habit question might work pretty well ("i curl my
wrists","i don't stand wide enough","i look at my feet" i assume you
mean these and not "i pick my nose") add it to those discussion/
pages...
Amanda
If you arrive late for class, bow into the Dojo, and warm up in the
back of the room with jumping jacks and push-ups and sit-ups until the
instructor gives you permission to join the class.
-> do we want this? or some other set of warm ups (i mean, if
someone's late to our class, i kinda want them to run a few laps, do a
few pushups, and stretch if we're done with that already)
Affirm the instructor's instructions with a loud "osu!" when
appropriate.
-> "yes sir" or "yes ma'am" or "hai" or whatever we decide are also
appropriate, right? it's always nice to have a few options.
Bow upon rising from seiza to a standing position. Bow before moving
in a direction indicated by your instructor.
-> "when in doubt, bow" but also, when standing up, don't use your
hands... it's sloppy.
If you are leading a group or single student, do not make more than
one correction per step. Resist the urge to correct every Student in
the group after only one step. By teh time you get to the last
person, the first one is already bored and forgotten what you told
them. In short, don't talk too much.
-> correct spelling of "teh"
->hehe and no. 10, and all the stuff about enthusiasm and stuff. i
think that's something we do alright at @i-s. but... i totally see
where it's good for me not to complain as much as i do.
In their enthusiasm to do a good job, new instructors tend to over-
explain and over-correct.
-> we should prolly decide ahead of time about how well we want to
make sure everyone can do stuff... i mean, i know we automatically
figure it out somehow, but we either get bogged down correcting
something like how to make a fist (which is sooo important!) or we let
them get away with stuff that they prolly shouldn't be doing... maybe
we want to make a list of things that are necessary to do and things
that are more secondary... like, that higher level students *have* to
do but only to correct on the lower belts if everything else is good
and then some advanced stuff to correct if the higher belts have the
other stuff down too? cuz if we're all on the same page, correcting
the same things (which, i bet if the three of us each made lists
they'd be pretty similar, but still would have some differences) then
we won't confuse them as much (cuz we'd get rid of those
differences)... i hope that makes a little bit of sense.
What is the difference between Authority and Influence as teaching
methods? Different balances are required for different age/student
groups--what is your teaching style? (Hint: Authority is more of an
absolute, command presence--very easy for natural leaders (and for
teaching those younger or with admittedly less experience). Influence
is more subtle, and more helpful (rather than commanding), usually
more accepted by peers than 'authority.')
->hmm. i see this as being important... it's soo important to just be
a good role model, maybe even more than anything else.
Pattern Interrupts - If you lose control of the class, do not yell or
lose self-control--you will only hurt them (and their perception of
you). Instead:
* Focus Clap (you clap a number of times, and they respond
the same number--vary claps to 'mix it up')
* "Yoi!"
* The "wave"
* "Spotlighting" - have a great student demo to the class
Other Interrupts:
* Double-thumbs-up
* (name) you're awesome!
* High fives
* Pat on the back (pat yourself on the back)
-> some of these are more applicable to the club stuff and some are
more applicable to the i-s stuff, we may want to think about the
distinction
Dean
Gunderson (as soon as we iron out the details, probably mid-December-
ish), especially if it seems in the morning like there might be
issues. Maybe a quickie in the morning on "bow here, bow to us, bow
to your parter, etc." and in the afternoon be like "so this guy's had
a ton of experience, put in his time, and has come here for free as a
personal favor...you need to treat him with respect and courtesy,
because he's doing a big favor for you, as well" or somethign like
that, talk about his expereince, and talk about why it's important to
respect those we want to learn from (I bet Dr. Dave will get a kick
out of that).
Would we want a JP flag and/or a US flag? We bow to a US flag in our
dojo as a sign of respect to all those who have come before us and who
protect our nation, but I could see bowing to both as well. We could
just get two of those medium sized flags on the dowels, cross them and
put them in a picture frame to hang up on the wall or something.
>**
>imsa karate creed "exercise"... :
>1. pass on the right, like cars
>2. i sleep on weekends when i get the chance
>3. i don't eat teh cafeteria food (i eat healthy stuff)
>4. ...
>
>i can't think of anything that's not either common sense or
>rididculous. sorry :-\
>
understanding what I'm talking about. For instance:
1. (think positive) It's always important to have a positive
attitude. Without a positive attitude it is difficult to lead a
fulfilling and happy life, and it will be difficult to take on new
challenges as well as grow.
2. (I avoid drugs and other harmful things) Avoiding drugs and
harmful things is all about protecing yourself from self-destructive
behavior. Karate develops the physical,( spiritual,) and
mentalabilities of the practitioner, but things like drugs, or alcohol
abuse, or even just a bad attitude can put that hard work in
jeopardy. Furthermore, it is not only hazardous to your health, but
is very easy to become addicted to some substances, creating a self-
destructive cycle. #2 is intended to defend against this. (crappy
last sentence, sorry)
3. (i am disciplined) Reinforcing self-discipline is a must in the
martial arts (and in life!). Without discipline an individual will
have a difficult time buckling down and working hard for a goal, or
persevering through adversity in order to accomplish something (for
instance, working for his or her black belt). In life, if an
individual is unable to control his or her voice and actions, it is
possible to put great things into jeopardy, including job (yelling at
a boss), quality of life (getting into a fight and injuring the other
person-->jail, or being sued, or both), and physical safety (road
rage).
etc...
>**
>hnn. yeah. the habit question might work pretty well ("i curl my
>wrists","i don't stand wide enough","i look at my feet" i assume you
>mean these and not "i pick my nose") add it to those discussion/
>pages...
strictly Karate and not involve the -Do part, the above is fine. It
will also get them to look more critically at their form. I took this
question from a homework assignment for one of the leadership classes,
and my bad habit was not being grateful to my parents as much as I
should be. Then again, we also stress 'living by the creed' in our
Dojo as well--which makes me feel like it's legit Karate-Do. Which is
exciting! But I don't have any illusions about turning IMSA into a
perfect reflection of my Dojo. In a lot of ways it's impractical.
But we should discuss that...I'm going to forward your comments to
Cynthia, along with mine.
> If you arrive late for class, bow into the Dojo, and warm up in the
> back of the room with jumping jacks and push-ups and sit-ups until the
> instructor gives you permission to join the class.
>
> -> do we want this? or some other set of warm ups (i mean, if
> someone's late to our class, i kinda want them to run a few laps, do a
> few pushups, and stretch if we're done with that already)
warm-ups we decide are appropriate. Or we could say "warm-up with
appropriate exercises (you can do push-ups, sit-ups, jumping jacks, or
run laps if you're in the gym, etc.)"
> Affirm the instructor's instructions with a loud "osu!" when
> appropriate.
>
> -> "yes sir" or "yes ma'am" or "hai" or whatever we decide are also
> appropriate, right? it's always nice to have a few options.
Dojo :-P But yes, I think Hai should be okay. I don't know about the
Yes, Sir or Yes, Ma'am. I'd prefer if we could get them always
responding in Japanese--it will help them get in the mindset. Of
course, if they aren't comfortable saying Hai or Osu (they should get
it pretty quick) they should default to Sir and Ma'am...and we should
tell them how they should always refer to GM Gunderson as "Sir" or
"GM..." or "Sensei" or whatnot.
> Bow upon rising from seiza to a standing position. Bow before moving
> in a direction indicated by your instructor.
>
> -> "when in doubt, bow" but also, when standing up, don't use your
> hands... it's sloppy.
collapses the lines or has us all Shugo from seiza, I've finally
started getting the bowing, then moving thing. It's pretty
cool...looks cool too ;-)
> If you are leading a group or single student, do not make more than
> one correction per step. Resist the urge to correct every Student in
> the group after only one step. By teh time you get to the last
> person, the first one is already bored and forgotten what you told
> them. In short, don't talk too much.
> -> correct spelling of "teh"
past, though my mind gets fuzzy if we go back too far (like...2005 I
don't remember, but I still recall '06 and '07 (IS of sickness)).
It's just soooo easy to nitpick...and such a bad experience for the
students...
> ->hehe and no. 10, and all the stuff about enthusiasm and stuff. i
> think that's something we do alright at @i-s. but... i totally see
> where it's good for me not to complain as much as i do.
remember a few practices when either the instructor or myself (if I
was teaching) was just in a crappy mood or something, and would lead a
really ho-hum class. Leave your baggage at the door, and do Karate
hardcore! (rhyme!)
> In their enthusiasm to do a good job, new instructors tend to over-
> explain and over-correct.
>
> -> we should prolly decide ahead of time about how well we want to
> make sure everyone can do stuff... i mean, i know we automatically
> figure it out somehow, but we either get bogged down correcting
> something like how to make a fist (which is sooo important!) or we let
> them get away with stuff that they prolly shouldn't be doing... maybe
> we want to make a list of things that are necessary to do and things
> that are more secondary... like, that higher level students *have* to
> do but only to correct on the lower belts if everything else is good
> and then some advanced stuff to correct if the higher belts have the
> other stuff down too? cuz if we're all on the same page, correcting
> the same things (which, i bet if the three of us each made lists
> they'd be pretty similar, but still would have some differences) then
> we won't confuse them as much (cuz we'd get rid of those
> differences)... i hope that makes a little bit of sense.
list we currently have...)?
> What is the difference between Authority and Influence as teaching
> methods? Different balances are required for different age/student
> groups--what is your teaching style? (Hint: Authority is more of an
> absolute, command presence--very easy for natural leaders (and for
> teaching those younger or with admittedly less experience). Influence
> is more subtle, and more helpful (rather than commanding), usually
> more accepted by peers than 'authority.')
>
> ->hmm. i see this as being important... it's soo important to just be
> a good role model, maybe even more than anything else.
important things for an instructor...it gives you a chance to look at
how you teach, rather than just teaching all the time and not thinking
about it.
> Pattern Interrupts - If you lose control of the class, do not yell or
> lose self-control--you will only hurt them (and their perception of
> you). Instead:
>
>
> more applicable to the i-s stuff, we may want to think about the
> distinction
its final form within the next few weeks so we can send it to Dr.
Dave...he still has to print them all and bind them, 'member?
Amanda
> dojo as a sign of respect to all those who have come before us and who
> protect our nation, but I could see bowing to both as well. We could
> just get two of those medium sized flags on the dowels, cross them and
> put them in a picture frame to hang up on the wall or something.
bleachers or something, cuz frames are expensive. i was thinking about
those ones that are (about..? i'm not too sure about size exactly) 2ft
by 3 ft or so.. either just the us flag or both, depending on how
traditional like we wanna be. i'm cool with just the us one, maybe we
should put this one to cynthia?
redundant.
> >hnn. yeah. the habit question might work pretty well ("i curl my
> >wrists","i don't stand wide enough","i look at my feet" i assume you
> >mean these and not "i pick my nose") add it to those discussion/
> >pages...
>
> Oh...I was thinking a bad habit in general...but if we want to keep it
> strictly Karate and not involve the -Do part, the above is fine. It
> will also get them to look more critically at their form. I took this
> question from a homework assignment for one of the leadership classes,
> and my bad habit was not being grateful to my parents as much as I
> should be. Then again, we also stress 'living by the creed' in our
> Dojo as well--which makes me feel like it's legit Karate-Do. Which is
> exciting! But I don't have any illusions about turning IMSA into a
> perfect reflection of my Dojo. In a lot of ways it's impractical.
> But we should discuss that...I'm going to forward your comments to
> Cynthia, along with mine.
her... i dunno if she's even seen it, cuz i've never heard her
comments about it.
> > Affirm the instructor's instructions with a loud "osu!" when
> > appropriate.
>
> > -> "yes sir" or "yes ma'am" or "hai" or whatever we decide are also
> > appropriate, right? it's always nice to have a few options.
>
> "Osu!" is less to remember...and will make our IS sound more like a
> Dojo :-P But yes, I think Hai should be okay. I don't know about the
> Yes, Sir or Yes, Ma'am. I'd prefer if we could get them always
> responding in Japanese--it will help them get in the mindset. Of
> course, if they aren't comfortable saying Hai or Osu (they should get
> it pretty quick) they should default to Sir and Ma'am...and we should
> tell them how they should always refer to GM Gunderson as "Sir" or
> "GM..." or "Sensei" or whatnot.
cynthia said something about "yes ma'am" and "yes sir"...
> > Bow upon rising from seiza to a standing position. Bow before moving
> > in a direction indicated by your instructor.
>
> > -> "when in doubt, bow" but also, when standing up, don't use your
> > hands... it's sloppy.
>
> Haha. I just think this is neat because now whenever the instructor
> collapses the lines or has us all Shugo from seiza, I've finally
> started getting the bowing, then moving thing. It's pretty
> cool...looks cool too ;-)
about bowing in the past, so if we want it to work we have to make it
a habit ourselves :-p
> > Pattern Interrupts - If you lose control of the class, do not yell or
> > lose self-control--you will only hurt them (and their perception of
> > you). Instead:
>
> > -> some of these are more applicable to the club stuff and some are
> > more applicable to the i-s stuff, we may want to think about the
> > distinction
>
> Well, we should think about it now. We probably want to get this in
> its final form within the next few weeks so we can send it to Dr.
> Dave...he still has to print them all and bind them, 'member?
we might want to do something with all of it actually, specifying
which stuff applies hardcore to club and which stuff is more of a
suggestion, but stuff that's more important for i-s. then again, if we
don't make a distinction and then sit down and talk about this stuff
with anyone who gets a copy, go through it and point out stuff, give
them highlighters and tell them to make notes as we discuss it, invite
them to share their opinions and experiences and questions, they'd
prolly get more out of it and it's less work for us ahead of time...
with this stuff--
lose self-control--you will only hurt them (and their perception of
you). Instead:
the same number--vary claps to 'mix it up')
there might not be enough ppl at club for this to be applicable
* "Yoi!"
-->good anywhere!
* The "wave"
--> hummm....
presence of mind to do it correctly
Other Interrupts:
-->these all look pretty all purpose to me.