copyright issues? arduino commercially

[Shawn McCombs]

If I was to make a control system with a arduino clone for my company, and we use to monitor some of our systems in the field, would that be illegal? O.o

Also what if we used the rasberry pi, would it be the same issues?

[Eric Merrill]

Why would that be illegal? Its all open hardware, and even if it wasn't, they don't place use restrictions on it.

On Aug 5, 2012 4:59 PM, "Shawn McCombs" <0thei...@gmail.com> wrote:

If I was to make a control system with a arduino clone for my company, and we use to monitor some of our systems in the field, would that be illegal? O.o

Also what if we used the rasberry pi, would it be the same issues?

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[Alan Evans]

Its clear as mud isn't it? http://opensource.org/faq/

I think the Arduino clone hardware at the heart of the system wouldn't
be the problem. You'd be free to make shields of your own design and
make them proprietary. Pay close attention to "of your own design" if
you based it on an existing shield whose designs were open source you
might run into problems.

Where I think it gets even more interesting is when you start
considering the software you've written. What do licenses for the
Arduino bootloader, processing, libraries (Wire, EPROM, SPI, SD, etc)
look like?

The good news is that most open source projects (hardware and software
alike) don't intend to prevent people from making a living. They just
intend for you to share and give credit where its due when using or
extending someone else's work.

There are plenty of 'hardware' vendors that use open source
extensively. Network devices (home and enterprise grade), printers,
TVs, multi-media devices, PHONES and all manner of other gadgets are
built on Linux.

That's my 2¢, no refunds!

-Alan

[Shawn McCombs]

Thanks everyone, this gives me more security in trying this. 

What about FCC standards on the shields?

[Krunal Desai]

FCC and CE certification costs quite a bit of money, so that will all be up to you. You'll have to find a lab and pass emissions/immunity/etc. 

I sincerely hope by "Arduino-based" you guys are still rolling your own PCBs, etc and not duct-taping some shields together. I paid for my last two semesters of school by re-doing "Arduino projects"; there is engineering involved in going from hobby Arduino project to a commercial/field device.

--khd (mobile)

On Aug 5, 2012, at 12:03, Shawn McCombs <0thei...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks everyone, this gives me more security in trying this. 

What about FCC standards on the shields?

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[Kyle Creyts]

don't most of these things hinge on whether you are selling the
product rather than making something for internal use, as well?

--
Kyle Creyts

Information Assurance Professional
BSidesDetroit Organizer

[Shawn McCombs]

Krunal, thanks for the advice, but I don't really understand whether I have to have it certified.

Also by engineering do you mean making pcbs with eagle and having them fabricated? Because if so, then yes I do plan to do that. 

Currently we use industrial controller and monitoring system. The issue with is the cost, and the company being bought out. So the boss is having me build one. 

[Krunal Desai]

No problem; you just need to budget for certification, if it's needed. For reference, I paid UL about $15k for Class A CE certification for a device. I don't remember how much FCC cost on top of that.

And yep, that's pretty much what I meant by engineering. Take into account standards (IPC, etc), all applicable commercial regulations, temperatures, RoHS, etc. A lot of things that are "good enough" for hobbyists may not cut it for you and your company.

--khd (mobile)

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[Andrew Meyer]

On Aug 5, 2012, at 15:47, Shawn McCombs <0thei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Krunal, thanks for the advice, but I don't really understand whether I have
> to have it certified.

You have to have it certified if you want to sell it to markets that
require certifications. If you are making a one-off (or even a small to
moderate run) for internal use, you probably do not need to bother
getting the certs--no one is going to sue you if the thing catches fire
or affects TV reception if it is your own product used internally.

--
Andrew G. Meyer
<agm...@gmail.com>

If there are two or more ways to do something,
and one of those ways can result in a catastrophe,
then someone will do it.
--Edward A. Murphy, Jr., 1949

[Shawn McCombs]

Alright thanks everybody, this information helped me a lot. I appreciate your time.

[Roger S]

Ah, be a little careful if you are planning to use this for industrial
control. You want VERY reliable systems for that, and the licensing
for a lot of software specifically says that it's not for use in
medical or other critical systems. Arduinos are not "hardened" for
industrial use and the software sometimes does fail. I've had to
reload my sketches on boards sometimes after they inexplicably went
haywire. So if you are controlling anything that could result in
injury when something goes wrong, be very careful. With respect to
the FCC comments, you also need to be careful about emitting RF
interference that might affect other equipment nearby. Even if you're
not going to sell it, if you're going to deploy many of these to your
company's facilities, you should do some testing for interference.

[Shawn McCombs]

What if I programmed the atmel in C would that stop the sketch issues? 

I don't plan on adding much more than a few atmels, relays, a usb port, and screw terminals to the board, how much radiant energy could it possibly put off?

Also does anyone know of a system that already has I/O built with 21+  5v inputs and 5+ outputs with 120v relays? I need it to communicate through serial to a pc. Today I was told to use something already made if possibly, they didn't want to take responsibly if it caught fire. :/ So like a good worker I'm going to look for a few days for one is prebuilt. 

Thanks everyone.

[Krunal Desai]

On Aug 7, 2012, at 13:39, Shawn McCombs <0thei...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't plan on adding much more than a few atmels, relays, a usb port, and screw terminals to the board, how much radiant energy could it possibly put off?

What are your clocks/crystals? Also, you might have to pass immunity
testing, but this is all only if you need certification.

> Also does anyone know of a system that already has I/O built with 21+ 5v inputs and 5+ outputs with 120v relays? I need it to communicate through serial to a pc. Today I was told to use something already made if possibly, they didn't want to take responsibly if it caught fire. :/ So like a good worker I'm going to look for a few days for one is prebuilt.

I imagine NI has something like this, if you're willing to pay. So
would a lot of other industrial automation vendors.

--kid

[Shawn McCombs]

Yeah, I looked at NI today. They want more than we are already paying.. O.O Any thing cheaper?