How do you see life? what is your point of view?
Lior Caspi
you believe in god? Why or why not? Do you believe there is a reason
why we are here? if so what is your opinion?
I know that those questions might not be answered, but I would like to
know what is each's opinion
JohnnyOnTheSpot
39.3a...@posting.google.com>...
Consciousness is like fire, it's not a thing by itself, it's just
reference to a physical reaction in the brain. When that reaction is
not occuring nothing seems to exist, so unconsiousness effectively
doesn't exist, and therefor neither does death, so you can't die
except in the perception of others which realy doesn't matter anyway.
I have no personal proof that I never existed outside of the
perception of others or that I will die outside of the perception of
others so if I ask myself why do I exist now and not before or after
it seems more likely to me that I did exist before and will after than
the likelyhood that this 74 year projected lifespan is an inexplicable
fluke, a one time shot at existance and a miraculous bubble of
oppurtunity that amounts to nothing. It seems far more likely that
life is basicly a video game, each person is equivelent to a 25¢, god
is at the controls and upon our earth death we retract back into the
corner of god's brain from which we came, and then we as god stick
another quarter in and try to do better as someone else, or maybe the
same person all over again.
Jerry Story
39.3a...@posting.google.com>...
About God:
----------
There ain't no God. At least not in the sense of an infinite Being who
created the cosmos. The best book I ever read about God is "Atheism:
The Case Against God" by George Smith.
There is perhaps slightly better than zero probablity that
extraterrestrial creatures visited Earth and ancient civilizations
mistook them as gods. The Coast to Coast radio show has lots of stuff
like that.
It is perhaps conceivable that among the stars there are species that
are so advanced that to us they would seem to be god-like beings.
About "reason why we are here":
------------------------------
If by "reason" you mean "purpose", that's your choice. You get to
choose what your purpose is.
If by "reason", you mean "our origin", the most popular theory on that
is about six million years ago there was an ancestor and one branch
produced chimps and another branch produced humans.
kasia
2e7...@posting.google.com>...
Surely there is GOD and it is as obvious to me as the fact that I
exist.I am not the follower of any particular religious group ,but
drawing the logical conclusions from the numerous observations of
the life on the Earth I think it is really unwise and thoughtless to
state that there is no God as such.If we look at human being and
realize that it is in fact a machine which (when it is healthy)works
so well and is so logically organized we have to admit that to create
such a machine one had to have a really big brain.And I believe that
his brain belongs to a certain person whose power and possibilities
are beyond the understanding of a common human being.
Robert J. Kolker
kasia wrote:
> Surely there is GOD and it is as obvious to me as the fact that I
> exist.I am not the follower of any particular religious group ,but
> drawing the logical conclusions from the numerous observations of
> the life on the Earth I think it is really unwise and thoughtless to
> state that there is no God as such.
There is little evidence of any kind and no convincing overwhelming
evidence at all for the existence of a single person who created the
entire Kosmos. The seeming design of the kosmos may be humans connecting
the dots and being overwhelmed by the pattern they have created.
As of this writing, people of the show-me and I-doubt-it school have the
better case.
Bob Kolker
amanayin
> I am interested in knowing what is your point of view about life.
Do you believe in god? Why or why not?
Does it matter you will do what you want to do weather you believe
in GOD or not.
Do you believe there is a reason why we are here?
If i was to beleive in GOD we were created soley for his or her ammusment
For what else is creation for, but to ammuse one's self
If you don't beleive in GOD their is no real resons it just is.
Then you could ask where did GOD come from? If you can answer that
you've half way there to being free.
Work that one out!!!!!!
Maurice Willey
news:1c1ad9e8.03102...@posting.google.com:
>
> Surely there is GOD and it is as obvious to me as the fact that I
> exist.I am not the follower of any particular religious group ,but
> drawing the logical conclusions from the numerous observations of
> the life on the Earth I think it is really unwise and thoughtless to
> state that there is no God as such.If we look at human being and
> realize that it is in fact a machine which (when it is healthy)works
> so well and is so logically organized we have to admit that to create
> such a machine one had to have a really big brain.And I believe that
> his brain belongs to a certain person whose power and possibilities
> are beyond the understanding of a common human being.
This is the Argument from Design, for a very long time it was one of the
strongest arguments for the existence of a supreme mind, who organized
and maintained the rules of design and order.
The power of Darwin's theory of evolution, and why it was and still is
so bitterly opposed by person's of religious persuasion, is that it
removes the necessity for a supreme being to impose order and design
upon creation. Evolutionary theory shows how innumerable tiny
perturbations by organisms exercising choice inevitably leads to better
and better designs. What is hidden when you look at the smoothly
functioning world of living beings, intricately working together, are
the trillions and trillions and trillions of dead creatures who each
advanced the 'design' of creation by the success or failure of their
lives in the struggle to procreate and have their progeny become
successful. The end result is magnificent, the process is unadulterated
slaughter.
The engine of design in the living universe is individual organisms
choosing to act within the confines of their natures. Good choosers
propogate and spread their characteristics, poor choosers die off and
their poor characteristics die with them.
The efficacy of Darwinian evolution for explaining the appearance of
design in the living world has killed the Argument from Design as an
argument for the necessity of a deity. This would be so even if the
theory were invalidated in some aspect. A good text to understand this
argument is Daniel Dennett's "Darwin's Dangerous Idea."
There is a second deeper sense of order that some persons mean when they
speak of the design of the universe, it is the argument that the natural
laws are so perfectly fashioned that there must be some great power that
controls and holds the world to make it behave in such an orderly
fashion. This is sort of an extension of Bishop Berkeley's idealism -
that creation is all held in the mind of God, who in the process gives
it orderliness. However, most modern thinkers reject such a necessity
on the basis that there is no other way for things to be. While we can
imagine magical and mysteriously contradictory events, in the real world
a thing cannot be and not-be in the same aspect at the same time. It
doesn't require explanation or compulsion, because there is no other way
for things to be. This is the Law of Identity (A is A) that gets
bruited about here so often.
A corollary of the Law of Identity is the Law of Causality, which holds
that all events have causes. This is a corollary of the Law of Identity
because it is held that since things cannot be and not-be in the same
aspect at the same time, a change in some aspect must be brought about,
it has to have a cause. Objectivists believe that the Law of Identity
and the Law of Causality are all that is needed to provide order to the
universe.
Cheers,
Maurice Willey
Paul Robinson
> Lior Caspi wrote:
>
> > I am interested in knowing what is your point of view about life.
>
> Do you believe in god?
Yes.
> Why or why not?
Because I have always believed in myself.
> Does it matter you will do what you want to do weather you believe in GOD
> or not.
I always do what I want since I'm God I can get away with it.
> Do you believe there is a reason why we are here?
Yes, but if I told you I'd have to kill you.
> If i was to beleive in GOD we were created soley for his or her ammusment
> For what else is creation for, but to ammuse one's self
That's exactly why I created the universe, I wanted some friends.
> If you don't beleive in GOD their is no real resons it just is.
I have always believed in myself, therefore there must be a God because if
there wasn't how could I believe in myself if I did not exist.
> Then you could ask where did GOD come from?
I didn't 'come from' anywhere. I simply am. If you go far enough forward
into the future, you get to yesterday. The universe is circular.
--
Paul Robinson "Above all else... We shall go on..."
"...And continue!"
"If the lessons of history teach us anything it is
that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us."
JohnnyOnTheSpot
710$Oz4.607738@rwcrnsc54>...
> As of this writing, people of the show-me and I-doubt-it school have the
> better case.
If by better case you mean no case at all, because there is also no
evidence that any god, or the possible god, would leave evidence of
his being that we could observe, so the lack of evidence of a god
doesn't do anything to make it's existance less likely.
Hood
opinion, this is feeble because no one ever changes his conclusions in
result of the outcomes of this sort of discussions.
The statement "the design is so grand that it has to originate from a
perfect mind or a divine entity" is exactly why religion was brought
into existence. It is the lack of a reasonable explanation for
something natural. Religious people always agree with science up to
the point where science has not gone yet. The things still unexplained
are the things that their so called god keeps secret.
The statement that god would never reveal his identity or show his
presence is as ludicrous as believing that david copperfield's tricks
(the famous illusionist) are real. It's an assumption based on
absolutely nothing. Sheer razzle-dazzle!
If you want to believe anything, believe that there is an explanation
for everything and that man will reveal all. Trust the human mind,
that which is our tool of survival, the one thing that has lead us to
great heights and will lead us higher and higher, if applied properly.
Focus on reality and stop wasting time on what-ifs and
there-might-be's.
And another thing; that alien theory is the sort of theory that people
make up in a split second. I had a theory once, thinking that our
milyway is an atom in a large entity and we were just a part of a much
larger universe. As a kid, this was my way of explaining the
unexplainable. Religion is a natural urge for mankind but that's all
it is. It comes forth from the will to be able to explain all. And we
will!
Hood.
Gargantua
disregard my answer if you find it offensive in
any way.
Thanks
Paul Robinson <postm...@paul.washington.dc.us> wrote in message news:<3F9
5DAD6.7...@paul.washington.dc.us>...
> amanayin wrote:
>
> > Lior Caspi wrote:
> >
> > > I am interested in knowing what is your point of view about life.
> >
> > Do you believe in god?
>
> Yes.
Contradiction ?
Can the most complex system evaluate himself without the
benefit of an outside observer / tools ?
Does "believe" change the measurement ?
God complex ?
> > Why or why not?
>
> Because I have always believed in myself.
Good does not need to belive in himself since
believing is less then knowing.
> > Does it matter you will do what you want to do weather you believe in GOD
> > or not.
>
> I always do what I want since I'm God I can get away with it.
That may not be true in all cases.
If God exist , the simple fact of existence will create rule
sets , which however changeable must taken in to equation.
You imply that fact.
Can God create a copy of himself ?
God wishes , he does not have the need for wanting.
> > Do you believe there is a reason why we are here?
>
> Yes, but if I told you I'd have to kill you.
Yes. God is limited by physical bounds.
No matter what kind of universe you are in it , Digital , Holographic , Phy
sical,
Quantum ,multiple or "zero point" some of the rules that apply to the univ
erse
fabric will apply to God too.
God will remain God only as much as will continue to be non interfering .
When that rule is change God becomes just another supreme being.
> > If i was to beleive in GOD we were created soley for his or her ammusment
> > For what else is creation for, but to ammuse one's self
>
> That's exactly why I created the universe, I wanted some friends.
Probably not.
" The point of absolute knowledge equals dead. In order to evade for
ever the point of absolute knowledge God had to create "intelligent" life,
in an symbiotic manner."
http://www.mlab.uiah.fi/~eye/mediaculture/noise.html
> > If you don't beleive in GOD their is no real resons it just is.
>
> I have always believed in myself, therefore there must be a God because if
> there wasn't how could I believe in myself if I did not exist.
Believing does not prove anything, thinking may prove something
from time to time , only scientifically proven knowledge can prove anything.
We live in an changing universe , there might be a reason to that.
However the reason may go behind our power of comprehension today .
> > Then you could ask where did GOD come from?
>
> I didn't 'come from' anywhere. I simply am. If you go far enough forward
> into the future, you get to yesterday. The universe is circular.
As circular as an Mobius ring ?
How is that compatible with Big Bang and bauble universes ?
Where was God before Big Bang ?
Answer that and you may have a clue .
Robert J. Kolker
JohnnyOnTheSpot wrote:
> If by better case you mean no case at all, because there is also no
> evidence that any god, or the possible god, would leave evidence of
> his being that we could observe, so the lack of evidence of a god
> doesn't do anything to make it's existance less likely.
The lack of evidence moves the matter from the realm of fact to the
realm of belief. The lack of evidence favors the unbelievers. One should
not believe anything unless he has a reason for believing it. Facts,
evidence, would go a long way to provide reasons.
Since the question of God's existence cannot be resolved empirically, it
can be dismissed as irrelevant.
Bob Kolker
amanayin
> How is that compatible with Big Bang and bauble universes ?
> Where was God before Big Bang ?
> Answer that and you may have a clue .
amanayin writes:
Was there ever a big bang?
And what was there before GOD?
And if you know what was before these two questions
That is where all things come from No one and any thing
can escape it!! and all things return unto it.
JohnnyOnTheSpot
mZ5.412@attbi_s54>...
> JohnnyOnTheSpot wrote:
>
> > If by better case you mean no case at all, because there is also no
> > evidence that any god, or the possible god, would leave evidence of
> > his being that we could observe, so the lack of evidence of a god
> > doesn't do anything to make it's existance less likely.
>
> The lack of evidence moves the matter from the realm of fact to the
> realm of belief. The lack of evidence favors the unbelievers.
It only favors unbelievers in proprtion to the necessity that god be
demonstratable through worldy evidence, and since there is no
necessity of worldy evidence for a god to exist, the lack of evidence
doesn't favor unbelievers one way or another. It's important to point
that out because you'd say you have favored status on the subject but
the fact remains you can no more disprove it than anyone can prove it.
> One should
> not believe anything unless he has a reason for believing it. Facts,
> evidence, would go a long way to provide reasons.
If the belief causes harm to unconsenting others, then it's as bad as
anything that causes harm to unconsenting others , but if I or anyone
else just wants to assume there is a god for our own personal use than
there is no good reason why I shouldn't believe whatever I feel like
believing. If it causes me to ruin my life that's my problem. I'd
rather trust my feelings about the uknowable than be like Objectivists
and look at life purely in terms of observable and material values.
Feelings are a natural part of nature as much as reason is. I have no
reason to assume my feelings about such things are wrong just because
they are feelings.
> Since the question of God's existence cannot be resolved empirically, it
> can be dismissed as irrelevant.
Only in terms of things that are resolved impirically.
Free
If you dont see something it doesnt mean that it doesnt exist.For
example have you ever seen a Black Holes atoms ...But you believe that
they exist.You can ask :"But there are ppl who saw atoms and black
holes with tools?" .and also there are ppl who see the existence of
someone who created this world with the eyes of Science and
Logic.There are ppl who saw Gabriel and angels.Why dont you believe in
them ? You want to see God with ur eyes.But you dont even wanted to
see atoms with ur eyes.
If you believe that this complex world with beautiful laws is a result
of fluky nature I r wrong.
Gargantua
btinternet.com>...
> Gargantua wrote:
>
> > How is that compatible with Big Bang and bauble universes ?
> > Where was God before Big Bang ?
> > Answer that and you may have a clue .
>
> amanayin writes:
> Was there ever a big bang?
> And what was there before GOD?
Your questions are complementary to the questions I have raised.
> And if you know what was before these two questions
Yes ,
> That is where all things come from No one and any thing
> can escape it!! and all things return unto it.
Define nothing or in your words "No one and any thing" , you may find that
not such a simple task.
However , at least as I see the situation you may missed the idea
here and jump to the end.
The main idea is that if God exist he probably had no other choice
but to create "intelligent" life .By observing this life ,intelligence
life been unpredictable in some aspects, he may evade the point of absolute
knowledge .The point in which he knows all present , past and future .
___________________________________________
> > If i was to beleive in GOD we were created soley for his or her ammusment
> > For what else is creation for, but to ammuse one's self
>
> That's exactly why I created the universe, I wanted some friends.
Probably not.
" The point of absolute knowledge equals dead. In order to evade for
ever the point of absolute knowledge God had to create "intelligent" life,
in an symbiotic manner."
http://www.mlab.uiah.fi/~eye/mediaculture/noise.html
_______________________________________________
Probably only answering and understanding the symbiosis will provide
an basis for an inquiry in the later questions.
Tom S.
"Free" <bdaw...@anadolu.edu.tr> wrote in message
news:ccb315d1.03102...@posting.google.com...
> To those who dont belive in God:
> If you dont see something it doesnt mean that it doesnt exist.For
> example have you ever seen a Black Holes atoms ...But you believe that
> they exist.
Because the forces, conditions, and other REAL entitites ARE KNOWN as well
as how they interrelate.
These factors have been proven time and again.
On the other hand, "god" is a nebulous term that means nothing.
>You can ask :"But there are ppl who saw atoms and black
> holes with tools?" .and also there are ppl who see the existence of
> someone who created this world with the eyes of Science and
> Logic.
Wrong! Non-sequitur!
>There are ppl who saw Gabriel and angels.Why dont you believe in
> them ? You want to see God with ur eyes.But you dont even wanted to
> see atoms with ur eyes.
> If you believe that this complex world with beautiful laws is a result
> of fluky nature I r wrong.
Your logic and ability to find relationships is absolutely NON-EXISTENT!!
Tom
--
"If government organized mass relief is the crutch
of a society crippled by proletarianism and
enmassment, then we should direct all our efforts
to being able to do without this crutch. This is true
progress, from whatever point of view we look at
it. It can be measured by our success on steadily
widening the area of individual and voluntary group
providence at the expense of compulsory public
providence." -- Wilhelm Ropke
hillsidebeatz
9.03102023...@posting.google.com>...
Different Point of Views; perspectives of other people's Boxes.
My views on life are simply as you put it, but a view on life cannot
be a simple text of some sort. I must continue its style of thinking
and apply it to the real world. The threading of these two is
crucial.
I must discover my interest and goals, then apply it to what I know;
interests such as music and art in my case are prioritized! I must
not forget about survival; it changes the way one thinks. Information
is what threads all this together for me; it is my fuel for the next
level!? Whatever that may be!
I don't know what a 'chip' is when people say "I have a chip on my
shoulder!", but whoever first said it must have known what they were
talking about; it also must be understood by those around that person.
I could easily understand this by thinking of everyone as a box with
information in it, and lots of it too! Thinking out my box is key for
me, because I could get more out of what ever I want; information in
the box is only the information you want to see (I can at least
picture it a bit, but schemas are too different to see the exact
picture of the original). Different piont of views is my model; I keep
it broad to continuously fuel my brain!
jenn
thinking and what color I am? Tell me what going to happen within a
years time. YOU CANNOT!!!! YOU NEED TO GO GET ON SOME MEDICATION AND
GET HELP!!!!! ALSO PICK UP A REAL GOOD BOOK, IT'S CALLED THE
BIBLE.....