Can anyone recommend...
OSWald
after being a long time fan of R. Strauss. Anyway, I was hoping someone
could recommend some recordings of other operas which might further my
introduction to Wagner. I have heard excerps from Tannhauser and Parsifal
which I very much enjoyed. I would appreciate any responses.
Jeff
la...@my-dejanews.com
Here are some non-controversial (I hope :) recordings of some Wagner operas.
All of them are my personal favourites, but I think you should listen to them
before you'll purchase them or at least get some responses from other people
too
Ivan
Tannhauser: Sinopoli with Domingo, Baltsa, Studer on DG Lohengrin: Kempe with
Thomas, Ludwig, Dieskau on EMI Ring des Nibelungen: Solti with Nillson,
Windgassen, Hotter, Ludwig etc on Decca Tristan und Isolde : Boehm with
Nillson, Windgassen, Ludwig on DG Meistersinger von Nuernmberg: Sawalisch
with Weikl, Studer, Heppner on EMI Parsifal: Solti with Kollo, Frick,
Dieskau, Ludwig on Decca
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Agnieszka Fulinska
: In article <F5DR1.448$MA2.3...@newsfeed.slurp.net>,
: "OSWald" <jpl...@planetdirect.com> wrote:
:> I have just recently been introduced to Wagner through Tristan und Isolde
:> after being a long time fan of R. Strauss. Anyway, I was hoping someone
:> could recommend some recordings of other operas which might further my
:> introduction to Wagner. I have heard excerps from Tannhauser and Parsifal
:> which I very much enjoyed. I would appreciate any responses.
:> Jeff
: Here are some non-controversial (I hope :) recordings of some Wagner operas.
: All of them are my personal favourites, but I think you should listen to them
: before you'll purchase them or at least get some responses from other people
: too
: Ivan
: Tannhauser: Sinopoli with Domingo, Baltsa, Studer on DG Lohengrin: Kempe with
: Thomas, Ludwig, Dieskau on EMI Ring des Nibelungen: Solti with Nillson,
: Windgassen, Hotter, Ludwig etc on Decca Tristan und Isolde : Boehm with
: Nillson, Windgassen, Ludwig on DG Meistersinger von Nuernmberg: Sawalisch
: with Weikl, Studer, Heppner on EMI Parsifal: Solti with Kollo, Frick,
: Dieskau, Ludwig on Decca
I would vote for Lohengrin with Abbado, Jerusalem, Studer, I love it. As for
the rest I think I agree. Although Karajan's Tristan is great, too.
Agnieszka
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--
-----------------------------------------------------------
Agnieszka Fulinska
Jagellonian University, Institute of Polish Philology
ul. Golebia 16, Pl-31-007 Krakow, tel./fax +48.12.422.05.54
http://www.filg.uj.edu.pl/~afulin
Axel Reichert
> Here are some non-controversial (I hope :) recordings of some Wagner operas.
>
> Tannhauser: Sinopoli with Domingo, Baltsa, Studer on DG
Non-controversial about the fact that Domingo's german is horrible.
(-;
But I agree with your other recordings.
Bye!
--
Axel Reichert -- http://mt.mpie-duesseldorf.mpg.de/people/reich/
Bertolt Götte
operas.
>
>Tannhauser: Sinopoli with Domingo, Baltsa, Studer on DG
Don`t buy this, it is horrible!! Sinopli is boring, Domingo dull and even
Studer and Baltsa are far from the best versions of their roles. Better is
Solti, Wien, Decca or Konwitschny, Berlin, EMI or even Haitink,
BayerischerRundfunk, EMI or ...
>Lohengrin: Kempe with Thomas, Ludwig, Dieskau on EMI
Fantastic!
>Ring des Nibelungen: Solti with Nillson, Windgassen, Hotter, Ludwig etc on
>Decca
Good advice, but I wouldn`t start with 16 hours.
>Tristan und Isolde : Boehm with Nillson, Windgassen, Ludwig on DG
O.k., but I like C. Kleiber more - with the best orchestra -, and
Furtwängler first - if it weren't mono.
>Meistersinger von Nuernmberg: Sawalisch with Weikl, Studer, Heppner on EMI
na ja ..., it's alright, but I'd prefer Karajan (Dresden, EMI) or Kubelik
(Bayer. Rundfunk) as first recordings.
>Parsifal: Solti with Kollo, Frick, Dieskau, Ludwig on Decca.
No! Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1962, Phillips - don`t mind the sometimes
coughing audience, it's the music, that matters.
Bertolt
la...@my-dejanews.com
Axel Reichert <re...@mpie-duesseldorf.mpg.de> wrote:
> >
> > Tannhauser: Sinopoli with Domingo, Baltsa, Studer on DG
>
> (-;
>
> But I agree with your other recordings.
It may disturb you as a native speaker, but as for me he sings great and I
like his kind of "strange" pronounciation :-)
Ivan
Axel Reichert
[Domingo's Tannhaeuser]
> It may disturb you as a native speaker, but as for me he sings great and I
> like his kind of "strange" pronounciation :-)
He always sounds like singing Puccini, does he? (-;
Because in Wagner's operas the text is very important and I am a
native speaker, I am really disturbed by his pronounciation. For song
recitals like "Winterreise" a perfect pronounciation is taken for
granted. Why should one judge opera singers differently?
Happy listening!
Benjamin Maso
Hollander: Steinberg on Naxos. Excellent and dead cheap.
Tannhauser: Sawallisch Philips. Not the best sung, but by far the most
exciting.
Lohengrin: Kubelik DGG of Sawallisch Philips.
Ring: Bohm - Philips
Meistersinger - Kubelik on EMI (by far the best stereo recording)
Tristan - Bohm with Nilsson and Windgassen DGG
Parsifal - Knappertbusch (1962) Philips
General rule:1. Live recordings are to be preferred, esepcially from
Bayreuth.
2. Avoid the omnipresent Rene Kollo. The first time sometimes acceptable.
The nth time unbearable.
Benjo Maso
OSWald wrote in message ...
OSWald
Thanks,
Jeff
Ari P Seitsonen
"Bertolt Götte" <goe...@ruf.uni-freiburg.de> writes:
> >Meistersinger von Nuernmberg: Sawalisch with Weikl, Studer, Heppner on EMI
>
> na ja ..., it's alright, but I'd prefer Karajan (Dresden, EMI) or Kubelik
> (Bayer. Rundfunk) as first recordings.
Just my humble opinion: I have the Meistersinger by von Karajan from
Bayreuth 1951 (Festspielneuer"offnung) and like it a lot (the other
one I have is the Kubelik, not bad either), already the first notes of
the Ouverture make me excited. That it's mono and live doesn't bother
me at all, or is it difficult to get hold on: my copy is issued by
ARKADIA. For 60 DM it was many times worth of its price... :*)
(Normal price per 4 CD Wagner operas in Germany is about or over 100 DM)
Anyone else has opinions on this? Of course I would immediately
change Gundula Janowitz from Kubelik to be Eva, but Elisabeth
Schwarzkopz is certainly not bad either.
Greetings,
apsi
--
-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-
Ari P Seitsonen
La Sapienza / Roma Fritz-Haber-Institut der MPG / Berlin
E-mail: Ari.P.S...@iki.fi / a...@iki.fi
WWW: http://www.iki.fi/~aps
Marco
Tannhäuser: Sinopoli on DG
Lohengrin: Kubelik DG or Kempe EMI
Ring: Janowski on RCA (extremely cheap!!)
Tristan: Furtwängler EMI or Karajan EMI
Meistersinger: Kempe EMI or Kubelik live 1967
Parsifal: Karajan DG
Marco
Axel Reichert
> Ring: Janowski on RCA (extremely cheap!!)
... but not worth even the low price IMHO because of Altmeyer's
Bruennhilde and Adam's Wotan. Compare Altmeyer and Adam directly to
Nilsson and London/Hotter in the Solti Ring.
> Parsifal: Karajan DG
IMHO Sotin is quite good. I think that the quality of van Dam's
performance varies too much. And I just cannot stand Hofmann's
musical-like singing. (-;
Bye!
Marco Mazzocchi
look for the conductor rather than for the voices. Karajan is such a
genius in this work, that I bear Hofmann's strangled voice. Solti's
voices are big enough, that's for sure, but his conducting does not show
what's important for me (and, I take it, also for Wagner himself, if he
took the burden of writing so much interesting tematic material).
Regarding this aspect you might want to visit the Wagner on the Web
Message Board and check my message "Solti's Ring, some question" at
http://www.zazz.com/wagner/messages/306.html for some conducting
blunders on Solti's part.
Domingo's German is awful but to me the pleasure of Sinopoli's
conducting is worth bearing with his voice (incidentally, as a native
speaker, Domingo's Italian is not that great either...)
Axel Reichert wrote:
> IMHO Sotin is quite good.
Couldn't it be Kurt Moll?
Ciao!!
Marco Mazzocchi
Axel Reichert
> you might want to visit the Wagner on the Web
> Message Board and check my message "Solti's Ring, some question" at
> http://www.zazz.com/wagner/messages/306.html for some conducting
> blunders on Solti's part.
Yes. I will check the points you mentioned.
> (incidentally, as a native speaker, Domingo's Italian is not that
> great either...)
That's interesting. His French is not that great either (compare his
Hoffmann with Gedda's), so perhaps he should concentrate on Spanish
opera? (-;
> > IMHO Sotin is quite good.
>
> Couldn't it be Kurt Moll?
Oh sorry, mea culpa, mixed that up with Levine's Parsifal, also with
Hofmann, not as musical-like, but his voice in worse state. Moll is
really good not only in this recording but also live.
Agnieszka Fulinska
: I tend to agree with you but in Wagner if I have to choose I tend to
: look for the conductor rather than for the voices. Karajan is such a
: genius in this work, that I bear Hofmann's strangled voice. Solti's
: voices are big enough, that's for sure, but his conducting does not show
Well, Karajan did some recordings with great voices as well, e.g. Tristan
with Helga Dernesch who is IMHO the most sensual Isolde in the history (even
though personally I prefer Nilsson in the Boehm recording) and his Ring has
a good enough selection of voices too. But as I am no expert in the art of
conducting and obly have basic musical education, I just can tell that
Karajan is a bit too "sterile" to me, and lacks that Dionysian aspect that
Wagner's music has. Solti is for me much better in that respect. Maybe I'm
also partly influenced by his statements and performance in the BBC
documentary "The Golden Ring" - when he speaks about the Funeral March, I
believe that he lives with the music.
BTW I do not agree that one may suffer a bad voice for a good conducting; in
fact not even one bad voice for another good. I'vegot highlights from an EMI
recording of the Ring with Bernard Haitink (I do not comment on the details
of the
conducting which doesn't seem anything brilliant to me) which I bought
because of Cheryl Studer as Sieglinde, Kiri Te Kanawa as the Waldvogel and
Siegfried Jerusalem as Siegfried - but I cannot stand Brunnhilde (blame me,
I'm just in my office and forgot the surname, Eva is the first name) and
never listen the disk to the end.
Agnieszka
Agnieszka Fulinska
: speaker, Domingo's Italian is not that great either...)
I once heard Victoria de los Angeles (a Spaniard again ;->) sing Chopin and
several English/German singers sing Gorecki and Penderecki (BTW he uses
Wagner in his works very nicely) in Polish. I'm afraid nothing can equal
that. It's not bad - it's hardly comprehensible and you keep asking yourself
whether this is really the text you know.
A.
Marco Mazzocchi
Agnieszka Fulinska wrote:
> BTW I do not agree that one may suffer a bad voice for a good conducting; in
> fact not even one bad voice for another good.
Ideally, I agree with you. I wish there were more recordings that have great
cast, great conductor, great orchestra, and, since we are at it, great recording
quality. But, you’ll agree with me, there’s not many such recordings around. I
think we have to adjust to what we get and give in on certain aspects and be
exigent on others, trying to look for those features that are most important for
us and trying to forget those that are not. A recording in which you don’t have
to suffer a bad singer or an incompetent conductor is almost a miracle and, as
such, extremely rare if not impossible. For instance, to me Kempe’s
Meistersinger are marred by the presence of F. Frantz as Sachs and I’m not that
crazy about Grümmer, either. Do you think I should reject the recording as a
whole because of that? Since I cannot live without Kempe and his orchestra I
suffer Frantz and Grümmer with dignity. Particularly in huge works like the
Ring, it’s almost impossible to find the perfect cast in every role. When this
happens we are usually disappointed by the conductor or by the primitive
recording quality or else. To me Solti’s Ring is greatly sung but lacks on the
conducting aspects. For others it might be different.
Ciao!
Marco Mazzocchi
Edward A. Cowan
> I have just recently been introduced to Wagner through Tristan und Isolde
> after being a long time fan of R. Strauss. Anyway, I was hoping someone
> could recommend some recordings of other operas which might further my
> introduction to Wagner. I have heard excerps from Tannhauser and Parsifal
> which I very much enjoyed. I would appreciate any responses.
> Jeff
Hollander - Konwitschny/Fischer-Dieskau (Berlin Classics)
- Krauss/Hotter (Preiser) (this one is from 1944)
Tannhaeuser - Try to find the Bayreuth video from 1978, cond. (Sir)
Colin Davis, with Spas Wenkoff in the title-role and Gwyneth Jones as
both Venus and Elisabeth. Despite a slightly deconstructionist
production, the performance "works" and is well-sung. Watch for Franz
Mazura as an unforgettable Biterolf!
Lohengrin - Kempe/Thomas/Gruemmer (EMI)
(Try to get a copy of last season's Met broadcast with Ben Heppner;
avoid that tenor's commercial recording, however, as the female singers
are dreadful.)
Tristan und Isolde - Furtwaengler/Flagstad (EMI)
- Beecham/Flagstad/Melchior (*not* the botched EMI
but another label) (this one is from 1937 -- incredible!)
Die Meistersinger - Kempe (EMI) (mono) or Solti/CSO (London) (not his
earlier recording!)
Ring - Begin with Solti, but you need also the Furtwaengler/Rome (EMI)
(the Scala Ring with WF will have to wait), Krauss/Bayreuth 1953
(Foyer). Be certain to locate a copy of Die Walkuere with
Furtwaengler/VPO (EMI), as that performance is far better than the one
in the Rome set. Also indispensable (IMHO) are the following recordings
of Die Walkuere: Leinsdorf/Vickers/Nilsson (London, began as RCA);
Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1968 (incredible cast: Hotter, Varnay, Vickers,
Rysanek, Gorr).
Parsifal - Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1951 (Teldec)
- Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1964 (Arkadia)
Both are indispensable, unforgettable. My preference, a difficult
choice, is the 1964 because of its cast: Vickers, Ericson, Hotter.
Hope this helps.
-- E.A.C.
Charles E. Muntz
eac...@anet-dfw.com (Edward A. Cowan) wrote:
> OSWald <jpl...@planetdirect.com> wrote:
>
> > I have just recently been introduced to Wagner through Tristan und Isolde
> > after being a long time fan of R. Strauss. Anyway, I was hoping someone
> > could recommend some recordings of other operas which might further my
> > introduction to Wagner. I have heard excerps from Tannhauser and Parsifal
> > which I very much enjoyed. I would appreciate any responses.
> > Jeff
>
> Hollander - Konwitschny/Fischer-Dieskau (Berlin Classics)
> - Krauss/Hotter (Preiser) (this one is from 1944)
Dorati on London with George London in the title role - you can almost
inhale the salty air.
> Tannhaeuser - Try to find the Bayreuth video from 1978, cond. (Sir)
> Colin Davis, with Spas Wenkoff in the title-role and Gwyneth Jones as
> both Venus and Elisabeth. Despite a slightly deconstructionist
> production, the performance "works" and is well-sung. Watch for Franz
> Mazura as an unforgettable Biterolf!
Haven't scene this film. For a compact disc, try Solti with Christa
Ludwig as Venus.
> Lohengrin - Kempe/Thomas/Gruemmer (EMI)
An excellent choice.
> Tristan und Isolde - Furtwaengler/Flagstad (EMI)
> - Beecham/Flagstad/Melchior (*not* the botched EMI
> but another label) (this one is from 1937 -- incredible!)
Karl Bohm offers stereo and a better supporting cast than Furtwangler, on
three discs at midprice it is probably a better first choice (but I am
certainly not disputing the greatness of Furtwangler)
> Die Meistersinger - Kempe (EMI) (mono) or Solti/CSO (London) (not his
> earlier recording!)
Also Kubelik from 1967 on Calig is excellent. Any of the three.
> Ring - Begin with Solti, but you need also the Furtwaengler/Rome (EMI)
> (the Scala Ring with WF will have to wait), Krauss/Bayreuth 1953
> (Foyer). Be certain to locate a copy of Die Walkuere with
> Furtwaengler/VPO (EMI), as that performance is far better than the one
> in the Rome set. Also indispensable (IMHO) are the following recordings
> of Die Walkuere: Leinsdorf/Vickers/Nilsson (London, began as RCA);
> Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1968 (incredible cast: Hotter, Varnay, Vickers,
> Rysanek, Gorr).
I'd spend a lot of time getting acquainted with Solti before plunging into
Furtwangler's Rome recording, which has hideous, suffocating sound, and a
poor orchestra. Krauss is very good (and dirt cheap) but is plagued by
little flaws such as missed or misspoken lines and a badly botched forging
scene in Siegfried. The Leinsdorf is good, and I am sure I would like it
much better if the sound weren't so overly resonant. It is out of print
in the US, but it turns up occasionally as an import.
> Parsifal - Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1951 (Teldec)
> - Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1964 (Arkadia)
> Both are indispensable, unforgettable. My preference, a difficult
> choice, is the 1964 because of its cast: Vickers, Ericson, Hotter.
I know that the 51 is out of print, I do not know about the 64. The 62 on
Philips would be my choice, but it is also out of print. The Solti on
London has an excellent cast all the way through and is an excellent
substitute for the Kna if you can't find it.
Charlie Muntz
--
Charles E. Muntz
cem...@mail.eclipse.net
cmu...@swarthmore.edu
Justin Won
>> Hollander - Konwitschny/Fischer-Dieskau (Berlin Classics)
>> - Krauss/Hotter (Preiser) (this one is from 1944)
>
> Dorati on London with George London in the title role - you can almost
> inhale the salty air.
I have the Konwitschny/FD. Very good although I don't think
Fischer-Dieskau is the most convincing Dutchman. The Senta was also
poor as I recall. The Klemperer is a classic. The Nelsson recording is
also a very good recording with a good Dutchman and an excellent
Daland in Matti Salminen. Senta's performance is not what you would
consider beautiful but it is a very intense performance that is very
effective. BTW both the Klemperer and the Nelsson are the original
version of the score.
> Haven't scene this film. For a compact disc, try Solti with Christa
> Ludwig as Venus.
Agreed, the Solti is very good. I also have the Sawallisch/Windgassen
which is a wierd amalgram of the Paris and Dresden versions. Windgassen
is not very good here but Grace Bumbry is an excellent Venus. Still
Solti is the recommendation.
>
>> Lohengrin - Kempe/Thomas/Gruemmer (EMI)
>
> An excellent choice.
I actually don't like this recording that much. The Solti is well
conducted and the VPO are superb but Domingo and Norman sound out of
place although they do give beautiful performances. I do like the
Kubelik because Janowitz is a beautiful Elsa but Jones is a bit extreme
and Kubelik never achieves the same beauty as Solti.
>
>> Tristan und Isolde - Furtwaengler/Flagstad (EMI)
>> - Beecham/Flagstad/Melchior (*not* the botched EMI
>> but another label) (this one is from 1937 -- incredible!)
>
> Karl Bohm offers stereo and a better supporting cast than Furtwangler, on
You know, I have trouble spending $70 on a mono recording that EMI has
issued for decades. Furtwangler gives a beautiful account but I think
that even the principal cast is weaker than Boehm's. Flagstad is
not at her best even with Schwarzkopf's help and Suthaus is no better
than Windgassen in my opinion. If Boem is issued as a budget DG
original, this really should be a budget release too.
Sorry for the ranting. I agree with Charles; the Bohm is an intense
experience. My favorite of them all. The Furtwangler is a great
contrast in interpretation but still not worth the big money. The other
alternative is the Karajan for Dernesch's very vulnerable Isolde.
>
>> Die Meistersinger - Kempe (EMI) (mono) or Solti/CSO (London) (not his
>> earlier recording!)
>
> Also Kubelik from 1967 on Calig is excellent. Any of the three.
>
The Kubelik is great for its vocal preformances although I have
reservations about the conducting. The Solti/CSO has a great cast but
lacks any shred of spontaneity. My favorite is probably the one most
people badmouth - the Karajan/Dresden. Everyone thinks that Karajan
throws a wet blanket over the opera with his conducting. I disagree; I
think that the performance has a beautiful relaxed flow which matches
the comedy and tragedy of the opera perfectly. Donath and Kollo are
excellent and the Dresden orchestra rivals the VPO in their performance
of this opera.
>> Ring - Begin with Solti, but you need also the Furtwaengler/Rome (EMI)
Agreed begin with Solti and go from there. The Furtwangler Walkure is
great though.
>> Parsifal - Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1951 (Teldec)
>> - Knappertsbusch Bayreuth 1964 (Arkadia)
>> Both are indispensable, unforgettable. My preference, a difficult
>> choice, is the 1964 because of its cast: Vickers, Ericson, Hotter.
>
> I know that the 51 is out of print, I do not know about the 64. The 62 on
> Philips would be my choice, but it is also out of print. The Solti on
> London has an excellent cast all the way through and is an excellent
> substitute for the Kna if you can't find it.
>
I would also recommend the Karajan/BPO just for Kurt Moll's
performance. The best Gurne that I have heard. Unbelievable.
Unfortunately the rest of the cast doesn't measure up except for the
chorus and the Blumenmadchen. The conducting approaches the extreme but
Karajan does pull off some very beautiful moments.
J Won
Thor Even Brenden
issued on Myto or Reiner conducting 1950 with Hotter and Varnay issued on
Arlecchino or Sawallisch conducting 1959 with London and Rysanek.
Justin Won <jus...@MIT.EDU> skrev i artikkelen
<71q0fi$k...@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>...
gggg gggg
> My $.02 :)
> >> Hollander - Konwitschny/Fischer-Dieskau (Berlin Classics)
> >> - Krauss/Hotter (Preiser) (this one is from 1944)
> >
> > Dorati on London with George London in the title role - you can almost
> > inhale the salty air.
> I have the Konwitschny/FD. Very good although I don't think
> Fischer-Dieskau is the most convincing Dutchman. The Senta was also
> poor as I recall. The Klemperer is a classic. The Nelsson recording is
> also a very good recording with a good Dutchman and an excellent
> Daland in Matti Salminen. Senta's performance is not what you would
> consider beautiful but it is a very intense performance that is very
> effective. BTW both the Klemperer and the Nelsson are the original
> version of the score.
> > Haven't scene this film. For a compact disc, try Solti with Christa
> > Ludwig as Venus.
> Agreed, the Solti is very good. I also have the Sawallisch/Windgassen
> which is a wierd amalgram of the Paris and Dresden versions. Windgassen
https://groups.google.com/u/1/g/rec.music.opera/c/cNr6l86kqSE