Othello: Who is the real criminal?
Bruce Fenton
definitly be found guilty and Iago's actions would
have little or no bearing on the outcome of a
trial. If not for the actions Iago took with
killing Roderigo and conspiring to kill Cassio he
would have committed no crime.
From a moral point of view however I believe the
criminal is certainly Iago. Perhaps somtimes the
worst criminals and villans are those who corrupt
good people- perhaps within legal boundaries.
In article <4i8mes$5...@status.gen.nz> Grant Taylor
wrote:
>I am pondering the question of whether the real
criminal in Othello is
>not Iago, but Othello himself. Any opinions and
arguments on this issue?
>
Bruce Fenton
http://www.af.com/af.html
William J. Ryan
>
> I am pondering the question of whether the real criminal in Othello is
> not Iago, but Othello himself. Any opinions and arguments on this
> issue?
>
>
> mike
Mike and Grant:
It's an interesting question. I suppose the traditional answer would be
Iago, for goading the dusky General into killing fair Desdemona. But what
of Othello? Is anyone ever so overwhelmed by emotions that he or she cannot
stop him/herself? Was the murder an act of will or was Othello literally out
of control, driven by a rage so terrible he could not retreat? Jean Paul
Sartre and the existentialists would answer, "no," that Othello chose to
murder his wife and was, therfore, guilty. I'm inclined to favor the
Sartrean viewpoint.
Besides, I would have wanted more evidence before throttling her.
I wonder if we could get a woman's point of view?
Will
Grant Taylor
Lisa
as the fact that he is a military man trained to depend on the judgment of other males leads
to his self destruction. The fact that Iago easily manipulates Othello suggests Othello's
lack of confidence in his own judgment.
Lisa
Lisa
Lisa
Lisa
Lisa
William Wall
a dolt that he misjudges everybody. Certainly a real
military leader would possess instinctive knowledge of the
character of the men around him. He may not know women, but
he certainly would have known Casio and Iago
Bill
Lisa
and depend on the judgment of other men.
Lisa
Gerry Horton
people, or of the tradition that approves of adulterous wives being
punished by death, administered by the state or by their husbands?
If the latter, I suspect that the proportion of women who think this
death sentence just is about the same as the proportion of slaves who
approved of runaways being whipped to death.
"Else she'll betray more men" is a really ugly excuse.
Carrie Pruett
ONE real criminal. Can't they both be guilty? In a legal
sense, Othello is certainly guilty although a court which new
all the facts would, IMO, be justified in considering Iago an
accomplice -- his actions might be viewed in the same light as
hiring a hitman.
Anyway, the question of who is more morally
culpable is interesting ("Is it the tempter or the tempted who sins
most? WS wrote somewhere else), but there is no reason that
they can't both be real criminals.
Carrie
--
Many a peer of England brews livelier liquor than the Muse,
And malt does more than Milton can to justify God's ways to man.
-A. E. Housman
Carrie Pruett
But who DOES understand Iago? Even Emilia is fooled to some
extent. If trusting Iago is a failure of judgment, everyone in
the play is guilty. As for Cassio, is there any evidence to
suggest that he is NOT the kind of person who would become
involved with his general's wife?
William J. Ryan
Gerry:
I'm the one who asked for a woman's point of view. Up to that point no women
had responded. Since the discussion involved the responsibility for
Desdemona's murder, and we men all seemed to agree that Othello, although
goaded by Iago, was nevertheless guilty, I was curious to see if a woman
might offer a different, and perhaps more interesting, opinion. Of course it
is wrong to strangle your mate. I'm sure we're all civilized enough to agree
to that.
As it is, some more people have entered the discussion and raised some
interesting issues. One of these involves Othello's limitations as a
"military man." Are generals always that capable of judging the character of
men? I think as far as bravery and leadership goes, a good General should
always be able to judge the quality of his lieutenants. But what does it
mean to be brave in battle? Does that automatically enoble one? Can a
leader be brave and true against an enemy, yet later turn viciously against
his own commander? I think history is repleat with examples of that sort of
thing. And as for Commanders themselves, removed as they are from everyday
life, living in a world where their word is obeyed absolutely, how well do
they fare when faced with real life, with situations they cannot control?
Will
Carlos Dhabhar
: I agree that Othello is a "dolt." However, Othello is a military man
: Lisa
Ya but I thought Othello is a "leader" not one of the "lead"....for
example if you are a Private in the military your main objective is to
excute the function poised at you...but if you are a Captain or a General
you have to rely on yourself and keep in mind that others are looking to
you for strength...you can not go blindly into the fray hoping that the
intel that you have been given is valid otherwise you may end up going
home in a nice pine suitcase. Besides to my understanding in today's
military establishment they train soldiers to support each other but at
the same time be trained to go in alone....as in the old saying hope for
the best prepare for the worst.......is this really off base or....?
Carlos
Carlos Pourushasp Dhabhar
1010 - 25th St. NW Apt #605
Washington D.C. 20037
202-965-3101
email: shan...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu
One advantage of talking to yourself is that you know at least somebody's
listening.
JLowoodliv
tend to look at the play from a twentieth century perspective. It's worth
bearing in mind that Shakespeare was not a twentieth century writer and
that, in fact, he was imitating some of the traditions of the ancient
Greeks. In _Othello_, he was creating a tragic hero, who followed in the
tradition of tragic heroes in that he was a near-perfect man (not half
god, but we can't have everything) who had a tragic flaw -- which can be
seen as either his passion for his wife or his blind trust of Iago (or a
combination of the two, I suppose); personally, I believe it is the
former. Whether he was true to life as a successful military man is not
the issue; rather, it is the unfolding of this flaw and how it destroys
all that he has won/earned that is important to him.
Jenny
anthony m. vervoort
That certainly seems a popular interpretation. However, I don't see Othello
as so much a tragic hero, nor Othello the play as so much a classical tragedy.
The character of Othello, while he does have some similarities with the
classical tragic hero, seems to be drawn more from the adulescens (young lover)
and miles gloriosus (braggart soldier) of the comedies of Plautus. The play
itself seems to me more like one of those comedies gone bad. Iago plays the
part of the servus callidus (clever servant) and is truly the central character
of the play, setting everything into action with his plots and schemes.
Desdemona fills the role traditionally filled by the meretrix (prostitute).
I have never particularly liked the play, which in my opinion is the weakest
of the "big four" tragedies, but this connection with the Roman comedic
tradition makes it a bit more interesting to me.
If anybody's interested, I have a paper on this subject, along with some of
my other Shakespeare essays, at http://www.antfarm.org/~falstaff/Papers/
-anthony vervoort
fals...@antfarm.org