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Another preview of Obamacare...
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Gary Heston
Feb 2, 2013, 11:00:03 PM2/2/13
to
Since he wants us to have what the British have:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2272508/Only-THREE-managers-dock-NHS-scandal-1-200-unnecessary-deaths.html#axzz2Jo8Tv0ux
And the IRS released an estimate this past week that insurance for a
family of four will cost $21,000 per year--in 2016.
Gary
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2272508/Only-THREE-managers-dock-NHS-scandal-1-200-unnecessary-deaths.html#axzz2Jo8Tv0ux
And the IRS released an estimate this past week that insurance for a
family of four will cost $21,000 per year--in 2016.
Gary
MikeC
Feb 3, 2013, 9:38:30 AM2/3/13
to
http://www.midstaffspublicinquiry.com/
Making this current will be hard to do as this example is all too common
when management restricts what compassion dictates.
"Staff there have been blamed for the �unnecessary� deaths of up to
1,200 people because they put targets and cost-cutting ahead of
patients� needs."
Sounds like you don't trust groups of people whose income and status are
tied to reducing costs and hitting financial targets. These normal
'market forces' drive us all, large or small, rich or poor re: Adam Smith.
Was it the top down management or the weakness of the whistle blower
provisions in this case, or both, what do you think?
"It comes as an official inquiry into the scandal, led by Robert Francis
QC, will publish its final report on Wednesday. It is expected to
recommend major NHS reforms, including controls to identify and remove
bad managers, and an improved training programme for nurses and assistants."
BTW, any benefits program will have these and similar problems when
faced with similar input, wouldn't you say?
Isn't the solution to these issues better management and enforcement, or
were you looking to change basic human needs and the means the
government has always used to force personal responsibility upon those
who shed blame?
---
The folks at NIHCM have this to say re your IRS paragraph.
http://nihcm.org/publications/health-care-spending
It is a more expansive look at what you are eluding to in your second
paragraph detailing some of the facts and such.
"Spending for Private Health Insurance in the United States.
http://nihcm.org/component/content/article/326-publications-health-care-spending/722-spending-for-private-health-insurance-in-the-united-states
excerpt...
"The total cost of health care for a typical family with
employer-sponsored coverage has more than doubled in the past decade to
nearly $21,000 per year, outpacing both inflation and income growth.
Skyrocketing health care costs are already straining budgets and could
jeopardize the availability of affordable coverage under the ACA. This
brief examines trends in premiums and cost-sharing in the group and
non-group markets, how premium dollars are spent by insurers, which
sectors are driving premiums upward, and the importance of price
increases in explaining spending growth. By Julie Schoenman, PhD, NIHCM
Foundation, January 2013."
see also:
http://nihcm.org/component/content/article/121-publications-expert-voices/699-the-challenges-of-pricing-health-insurance-for-the-2014-exchanges
Mike C
Greg Bacon
Feb 9, 2013, 7:18:59 AM2/9/13
to
MikeC wrote
: Old news, what? http://www.dh.gov.uk/health/category/francis-inquiry/
aid, relief, or other benefits free of charge (or at very low
cost) to those whom they serve, resources are finite. Red Cross,
United Way, the American Heart Association, Goodwill, Habitat for
Humanity, Make-A-Wish Foundation, and all the rest would like to
serve every possible beneficiary.
No one question's the staff's and volunteers' compassion, but at
some point management *must* enforce restrictions. Otherwise, the
organizations would run out of resources and serve no one. They
have to find a balance.
An NHS foundation trust is not a charity, but it must deal with
scarcity, a basic driver in economics, just like everyone else.
I am not defending the actions of Mid Staffordshire's decision
makers. My point here is the breathless lamentation above is a
meaningless tautology.
: "Staff there have been blamed for the 'unnecessary' deaths of up to
You can't have it both ways. The Mid Staffordshire trust is subject
to authorization and regulation by NHS's independent regulator.
Assuming the allegations are true, they did it under Monitor's
monitoring. Who will watch the watchmen?
According to Wikipedia[1], "Foundation Trusts are considered mutual
structures akin to co-operatives, where local people, patients and staff
can become members and governors and hold the Trust to account."
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_foundation_trust
This is not some band of robber barons. All the stakeholders can
have a seat at the table. At least in theory. Socialism looks great
on paper!
: Was it the top down management or the weakness of the whistle blower
Third-party payer is a bad system. At zero cost, there can never be
enough to satisfy demand. The rivers of tax money to be diverted
and captured distorts the entire healthcare system. Welfare cheats
game the system. Without price competition by providers and price
sensitivity by consumers, the only question is whether the
"insurance" covers it, and, if so, back up the truck.
(Here, the scare quotes are legitimate. Insurance is a transfer of
risk. NHS and the like are welfare giveaways.)
Having removed all downward pressure on prices, costs must rise, and
indeed they have mightily. State management will restrict what
compassion dictates by cutting funding. Administrative management will
restrict what compassion dictates by cutting benefits to match.
The inevitable end result is a third-world rationing scheme.
: "It comes as an official inquiry into the scandal, led by Robert Francis
Where are the calls for reform and penalties to the regulator that
allowed the alleged offenses to take place?
: Isn't the solution to these issues better management and enforcement, or
find mutually beneficial ways to improve each other's lives.
[...]
Greg
: Old news, what? http://www.dh.gov.uk/health/category/francis-inquiry/
: http://www.midstaffspublicinquiry.com/
:
: Making this current will be hard to do as this example is all too common
: when management restricts what compassion dictates.
Even with a charitable organization whose purpose is to provide
:
: Making this current will be hard to do as this example is all too common
: when management restricts what compassion dictates.
aid, relief, or other benefits free of charge (or at very low
cost) to those whom they serve, resources are finite. Red Cross,
United Way, the American Heart Association, Goodwill, Habitat for
Humanity, Make-A-Wish Foundation, and all the rest would like to
serve every possible beneficiary.
No one question's the staff's and volunteers' compassion, but at
some point management *must* enforce restrictions. Otherwise, the
organizations would run out of resources and serve no one. They
have to find a balance.
An NHS foundation trust is not a charity, but it must deal with
scarcity, a basic driver in economics, just like everyone else.
I am not defending the actions of Mid Staffordshire's decision
makers. My point here is the breathless lamentation above is a
meaningless tautology.
: "Staff there have been blamed for the 'unnecessary' deaths of up to
: 1,200 people because they put targets and cost-cutting ahead of
: patients' needs."
:
: Sounds like you don't trust groups of people whose income and status are
: tied to reducing costs and hitting financial targets. These normal
: 'market forces' drive us all, large or small, rich or poor re: Adam Smith.
Why did you use scare quotes around market forces?
: Sounds like you don't trust groups of people whose income and status are
: tied to reducing costs and hitting financial targets. These normal
: 'market forces' drive us all, large or small, rich or poor re: Adam Smith.
You can't have it both ways. The Mid Staffordshire trust is subject
to authorization and regulation by NHS's independent regulator.
Assuming the allegations are true, they did it under Monitor's
monitoring. Who will watch the watchmen?
According to Wikipedia[1], "Foundation Trusts are considered mutual
structures akin to co-operatives, where local people, patients and staff
can become members and governors and hold the Trust to account."
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_foundation_trust
This is not some band of robber barons. All the stakeholders can
have a seat at the table. At least in theory. Socialism looks great
on paper!
: Was it the top down management or the weakness of the whistle blower
: provisions in this case, or both, what do you think?
The lesson here is you can't regulate your way out of a bad system.
Third-party payer is a bad system. At zero cost, there can never be
enough to satisfy demand. The rivers of tax money to be diverted
and captured distorts the entire healthcare system. Welfare cheats
game the system. Without price competition by providers and price
sensitivity by consumers, the only question is whether the
"insurance" covers it, and, if so, back up the truck.
(Here, the scare quotes are legitimate. Insurance is a transfer of
risk. NHS and the like are welfare giveaways.)
Having removed all downward pressure on prices, costs must rise, and
indeed they have mightily. State management will restrict what
compassion dictates by cutting funding. Administrative management will
restrict what compassion dictates by cutting benefits to match.
The inevitable end result is a third-world rationing scheme.
: "It comes as an official inquiry into the scandal, led by Robert Francis
: QC, will publish its final report on Wednesday. It is expected to
: recommend major NHS reforms, including controls to identify and remove
: bad managers, and an improved training programme for nurses and assistants."
:
: BTW, any benefits program will have these and similar problems when
: faced with similar input, wouldn't you say?
Yes. You can't regulate your way out of a bad system.
: recommend major NHS reforms, including controls to identify and remove
: bad managers, and an improved training programme for nurses and assistants."
:
: BTW, any benefits program will have these and similar problems when
: faced with similar input, wouldn't you say?
Where are the calls for reform and penalties to the regulator that
allowed the alleged offenses to take place?
: Isn't the solution to these issues better management and enforcement, or
: were you looking to change basic human needs and the means the
: government has always used to force personal responsibility upon those
: who shed blame?
Far better would be for people to cooperate freely and peacefully to
: government has always used to force personal responsibility upon those
: who shed blame?
find mutually beneficial ways to improve each other's lives.
[...]
Greg
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