Japanese bank account for non-resident

[Shannon Spears]

Hello all, I've been lurking here for a while but this is my first post.

I've been working as a freelance J to E translator for about a year with non-Japanese agencies but I want to try working with Japanese clients as well. Unfortunately, many of the agencies I have contacted only pay their translators through a 振込み to a Japanese bank account. I looked into getting a personal account, but it appears that you need to have at least a gaijin card and mine is long expired. There seem to be some business account options but I do not know much about how trustworthy those services are or exactly how much they cost.

That is why I have come to ask for your expertise, as I figured someone has probably faced this issue before.

よろしくお願いします。

---
Shannon Spears
JP>EN Medical Translator

[Fred Uleman]

I was recently asked the same question by a non-translator. My internet searching suggested that an alien registration card was needed. But the bank I went to and asked said this person will only need an inkan and personal identificationk -- with the clear statement that a passport would suffice for personal identification and the AR card is not needed. (This assumes you are here at least long enough to open the account.)

- -- --- ---- ----- ---- --- -- -
Fred Uleman in Tokyo

[martha mcclintock]

Wow Fred, that is completely contrary to all that I have heard from SMBC and other banks regarding non-resident accounts. 

Two years ago I jumped through the most amazing hoops to establish a non-resident company account for my Australian company at SMBC with my Jpn accountant acting as my "dairi-nin", holder of the passbook and the account address. 

The only way it would work was to set it up as passbook account. They allow no internet access because it is an overseas account holder, and my "dairi-nin" has to do all transactions via paper with company bank seal at the bank teller window. All international wires out of the account have to be individually requested on paper with seal, there is no way to set up an auto wire every month, etc.

Also massive hassles that required signing statements that no transfers out of the account will go to Iran, NK, etc, and rules about money laundering. 

Fred, what did the bank plan to use for the "account address" for this non-resident account? An overseas address? or do they require a "dairi-nin" with address in Japan?

IF someone does actually get this "no AR" method to work for an non-resident individual account at a "normal Japanese bank", please post that information here, particularly which bank allows it and what was required. 

Thanks,

Martha J. McClintock

Melbourne Australia

 

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[Geoffrey Trousselot]

Regarding SMBC

I don't normally put down companies, but I personally think SMBC is the worst bank for foreigners. I have even had staff at SMBC recommending that other banks may provide better services. I perceive it to be antiquated in its systems and focused on providing services to a domestic customer base that they don't expect to have much dealings with the international world. I would not recommend SMBC if you don't live in Japan. They like to ring up and confirm every single detail, and when something needs to be changed, there is so much red tape to go through. I don't know any sane banks to suggest though. It is possible that they are all like that. If anyone knows of a Japanese bank that allows overseas transfers by one-click Internet banking, it might be worth recommending it. It is also necessary for the ATM card to be internationally compliant.

==============

Geoffrey Trousselot @ a fatigued SMBC customer

[Fred Uleman]

The person who was asking me will be in Tokyo later this year and we will see if the process actually works as explained. And yes, I will report back.

Because I assumed an AR card at least was needed, I asked explicitly. And was explicitly told no. The only other concern was that the person should be able to understand Japanese, since there are some things they have to explain when setting up the account and they can only explain them in Japanese. (I said his Japanese-speaking wife would be with him and that seemed to be enough. Note that this was at the end, so the fact of having a Japanese-speaking wife did not seem to be a factor in what was needed to open the account. They would have been just as happy with me there as the interpreter.)

This was counter to everything I had assumed, and I am very curious to see how much is true and how much was simply ignorance on the part of the person I talked with. So I interim-report it here and suggest it be taken with considerable salt for now.

- -- --- ---- ----- ---- --- -- -

Fred Uleman @ but it's what I was told

[Loren Seely]

In fact, I opened a Sumitomo account without an AR, and having only lived in Japan a few months, back in '87. It was back in the days of crazy land speculation and my new employer was a prized bank customer that was buying up buildings in Ikebukuro, so the local Sumitomo branch set up my account without hardly a question. So it is possible, even back then, if the bank chooses to. However, seven years later, when I moved again to Japan, the same bank, the same branch, insisted it was impossible.

Loren Seely

--

[David J. Littleboy]

>From: martha mcclintock

>
>Wow Fred, that is completely contrary to all that I have heard from SMBC
>and other banks regarding non-resident accounts.
>
>Two years ago I jumped through the most amazing hoops to establish a
>non-resident company account for my Australian company at SMBC with my Jpn
>accountant acting as my "dairi-nin", holder of the passbook and the account
>address.

Japanese banks tend to be rather stuffy, officious, obnoxious. I do all my
banking with SMBC, and have to work hard to not go postal every time I have
to deal with them.

One might have an easier time of it at, say, Shinsei Bank, which is is a
rather different beast, and, according to a friend who deals with them,
quite reasonable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinsei_Bank

>Also massive hassles that required signing statements that no transfers out
>of the account will go to Iran, NK, etc, and rules about money laundering.

On the other hand, it may not be all the bank's fault. The US has been
getting fussier about these sorts of things over the last few years.

--
David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

[Sandra Ogata]

Saturday, October 12, 2013 3:06 AM, Shannon Spears wrote:

 

>….many of the agencies I have contacted only pay their translators through a 振込み to a Japanese bank account. I looked into getting a >personal account, but it appears that you need to have at least a gaijin card and mine is long expired.

My experience of this is a bit different. I lived in Japan for 10 years and when I left, I kept 2 accounts open with Mitsubishi Tokyo UFJ (then just Tokyo Mitsubishi). I had it set up with internet banking and had clients pay into that account and then used Lloyds bank for international transfers, as they had the cheapest fees. This worked a charm until earlier this year when they changed the international funds transfer regulations in Japan. Everyone wanting to do international transfers (even existing Japanese and foreign clients) had to re-register for the service. As a non-resident foreigner, I was meant to supply a current gaijin card or similar. This I did not have. This led to a long series of phone calls with the bank. To cut a very long story short, I was lucky enough to have renewed my Japanese driver’s licence last time I was in Japan (a long-winded, painful process that I was reconsidering on whether to ever do again until this problem arose), so between that and my registered address being that of my parents-in law, the local branch has agreed to accept a copy of my Japanese driver’s licence and have made an exception in permitting me to do this by post rather than going in to the counter in person.

I am waiting on the forms to finalise this, so will have to report back on whether it works or not, but it looks like a matter of just getting the right person and persisting. OR it may be that I have in-laws there and Japanese ID with their address on it...

Part of my argument was also to look at my transaction history and see that I was sending it to myself and that I was paying taxes on it in Australia as per the agreement between the 2 countries.

HTH

 

Sandra Ogata

Brisbane, Australia

 

[martha mcclintock]

thanks to everyone who has chimed in on this one with their different experiences. 

It seems this complete raising of the drawbridge on such is all in the past few years, with the moneylaundering charges against HSBC etc spooking every bank in the world, and the tougher UN sanctions against NK and Iran making more banks take note, along with the US requirement about reporting US citizen interest in foreign bank accounts, etc. Which of course just reinforced the already systemetized xenophobia in all the "normal Japanese" banks.

About 3 years ago i had people i know in Japan approach various banks, who all rejected out of hand the idea of a non-resident company account, and it was only through my accountant going to her branch of SMBC and twisting arms and acting as my dairi-nin etc, that got them to agree to it. TONS of teeth-sucking awkwardness when I finally met said bankers in person in May 2012,  and they made me sign all the "i am not a money-launderer" statements, but they opened the account and it is up and working, and while a pain and their international wire fees are usurious, it is functional. 

I too had been using the SMBC internet banking/Lloyds system since I left Japan in 2004 and was lucky to have this new system in place when Lloyds pulled the plug.

I think that SMBC is probably no worse than any of the others, it is all a case of finding functional staff at a functional branch and working with them, holding their hands and not screaming, through the difficult bits.

I also explored the whole idea of multi-currency accounts at HSBC, Citibank, etc, and you need to be a MUCH bigger banking customer than I am for such to work, and it also still means that the more luddite of my customers would have to deal with a "strange" banking setup different than standard furikomi between Japanese city banks.

Yes, Fred, we all await further reports when this no AR account opening concept is tested with a real case later in the year!

thanks,

Martha J. McClintock

Melbourne, Australia

[Stephen Suloway]

> Yes, Fred, we all await further reports when this no AR account opening concept is tested with a real case later in the year!

I'd LOVE to know where I might be able to establish an internationally/electronically accessible account when I'm in Tokyo for IJET 2014, if there are any options for a non-credentialed gaijin.

My major J bank, successor to the major where I opened my 普通 account in 1981 (which I used heavily until 2000), will barely speak with me when I visit, because I don't have an address in Japan. No online access. Deposits there are a blind savings account until I walk up to their ATM during my occasional visits to Japan.

In 2001 when I wanted to open an account at Citibank (at the time the only bank in Japan allowing withdrawals from branches outside the country), the roving 受付 guy wouldn't let me in the door without a work visa. Haven't tried anywhere else since.

If you are currently well documented in Japan, I advise maximizing your local bank relationship and services while you can. That didn't occur to me during my time there as an employee and freelancer.

I did convince one of my regular agencies to set up PayPal payment, which apparently requires registration of a credit card belonging to the agency or its 代表人 (and re-registration when the card expires). Fortunately they value my services enough to keep this open, and in the end it may not be much more hassle for them than a normal furikomi. Some other agencies I work regularly with already had PayPal. Of course I regret the PayPal fees as much as any transfer fees....

Regards,
Stephen

~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Stephen Suloway

[Fred Uleman]

Report:

So the friend came to Japan and we went to the bank (Resona) to open the account. Had the passport and wanted to ask what kind of inkan was acceptable (have to be in English script or have to be in kana or don't care or what). At which point the story changed.

Inkan design doesn't matter. But passport and inkan are not enough. Have to have an alien registration card and a visa that is good for at least six months. (Passport is to show the visa.)

Huh? That's not what I was told. I was told passport and inkan was enough, and it was very clear at the time that this was a non-Japanese passport we were talking about. Even checked because I was skeptical, and was assured passport and inkan were enough. What gives?

Profuse apologies, but no relenting.

So apologies from me too for having passed along the misleading information.

[Makoto Sakamoto]

An open letter sent to KONO Yohei by President of Nadeshiko Action
has been translated and uploaded on the following web site:
　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　 　　　
http://jpnso.blogspot.jp/2013/11/an-open-letter-sent-to-kono-yohei-by.html

Please feel free to broadcast this text via any means, provided that the
above-
mentioned URL be referred to.

◆「河野談話」にかかわる河野洋平氏に対する「公開質問状」◆

なでしこアクション代表、山本優美子氏の原本を、某氏が英文に
翻訳し上記サイトで公開しておられます。ぜひご覧くだい。

山本氏の承認を得ていますので、どうぞご自由に「拡散」なさって
ください。ただし、出典としての上記サイトのURLを付記願います。

坂元 誠 拝 saka...@e-mail.jp
JAT member

<eof>

[Andreas Rusterholz]

I won't comment on this issue, but you sign as JAT member.

Does this really reflect the official position of JAT?

 

Andreas Rusterholz

 

2013年11月15日金曜日 8時01分40秒 UTC+9 Mak Sakamoto:

[Jon LeFlore]

This does seem like a veeeery hot-button issue to post on this forum. If the purpose of this post isn't translation-related (and I'm guessing it's not), can we at least get an OT label on the thread topic?

Thanks,

Jon LeFlore

[Mark Spahn]

This does seem like a veeeery hot-button issue to post on this forum. If the purpose of this post isn't translation-related (and I'm guessing it's not), can we at least get an OT label on the thread topic?

Thanks,

Jon LeFlore

- - - - - - - - -

 

A hot-button issue for this forum?  No more so than the Armenian genocide.

But if this post is not translation-related, we can *make* it translation-related by considering the translation.  We do not have the original Japanese text, so we'll have to critique the English, both as rhetoric and as English.  A few points...

 

- What Nadeshiko Action is, is not explained.

- The upper- and lowercasing of surnames and given names, respectively, is non-standard, as is the practice (in English) of stating the surname first, as in "KONO Yohei".

- "would-be former comfort women":  This is a non-standard use of "would-be", which usually means "wannabe but didn't succeed".  Here, the idea to be expressed is (probably) "women who claim to have been comfort women".  How is this best expressed in English?

- "There is no such evidence found by not only the South Korean government but also the Japanese government."  An interesting ambiguity.  There might be such evidence found by one of these governments but not by the other.

- Reference is made to "the so[-]called Kono Speech", but no link is provided.  This lack of a proper citation makes for unpersuasive writing, as if the writer wants to make it difficult for the reader to check the facts.

- "Why the heck innocent Japanese children are bashed because of disinformation?!"  The punctuation "?!" is childish, as is the "the heck" (not "the hell") choice of words, and this is not the correct word order for a question.  More importantly, who bashed what children where and when, and what was the disinformation that caused this bashing?  And does "bashing" mean mere verbal criticism, or cudgeling to death?

- All in all, this is not very clear or persuasive writing.  On the other hand, you have to start somewhere, and maybe getting your story out is more important than smooth PR wording.

-- Mark Spahn  (West Seneca, NY)

 

 

[Ray Roman]

Might there be an ethical duty to refrain from furthering the aims of a propagandist?

Ray Roman J.D.

Japanese to English legal translation

japane...@gmail.com

On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 11:33 AM, Mark Spahn <mark...@verizon.net> wrote:

. . . How is this best expressed in English?

[Wolfgang Bechstein]

Andreas Rusterholz wrote:

> I won't comment on this issue, but you sign as JAT member.
> Does this really reflect the official position of JAT?

Since there is absolutely no vetting of JAT general membership, and no
mention of any administrative position is made, simply signing as a JAT
member has no meaning at all (and seems to be used mostly in cases where
the poster wishes to assume some kind of official mantle or status where
in reality there is none).

If in fact that were the official position of JAT, I for one would
terminate my membership immediately.

Wolfgang Bechstein

[Fred Uleman]

I am confident this is not from JAT. It is simply from someone who is a member -- someone who, as far as I know, is not now and has never been in any official position in JAT.

- -- --- ---- ----- ---- --- -- -

Fred Uleman, also a JAT member

[Mick Corliss]

Wolfgang,

Well put. I share your sentiments (below).

The words "tempest" and "teacup" spring to mind.

"Since there is absolutely no vetting of JAT general membership, and no
mention of any administrative position is made, simply signing as a JAT

member has no meaning at all."

Further OT, I might suggest having the English cleaned up to leave a better impression on site visitors.

MC

[Paul at Honyaku Plus]

Hi Shannon,

Honyaku Plus (http://Honyaku-plus.com) pays overseas translators using PayPal for amounts less than 100,000 yen (for higher amounts, flat bankwire fees are cheaper). Some translators prefer us to hold their money until it reaches a reasonable sum that makes the fees insignificant as a percentage of the transaction.

Paul Flint
Director at Honyaku Plus

[Doreen Simmons]

But if we clean up the English, aren't we associating ourselves with a tendentious claim and helping it to look more respectable? 

Not many years ago, when some elderly Korean ladies came to Japan to insist they they had, indeed, been forced to be "comfort women", they staged a silent demonstration outside the gates of the National Diet, wearing Korean costumes appropriate to their age. They demanded nothing except respect. When I passed them I simply stopped, turned to face them. and bowed deeply. They bowed back, though less deeply. We are all entitled to our own opinions, but I personally got the distinct impression that those ladies were the real thing. 

Doreen Simmons

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[Gururaj Rao]

This is just to sound a warning about PayPal.

Twice in the past two years, about 25 dollars each were withdrawn (without my consent) by some unknown person from my account through PayPal.  These amounts, however, were repaid by PayPal to me. - I don't know how Paypal handled the person who managed to withdraw the amounts from my account; maybe they just wrote the amounts off. I have since closed down my PayPal account.

Gururaj Rao 

Technical Translator

Gardening Blog: http://japanesegarden.wordpress.com

[Jens Wilkinson]

> On 2013/11/15, at 22:03, Doreen Simmons <doree...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> But if we clean up the English, aren't we associating ourselves with a tendentious claim and helping it to look more respectable?
>

It seems like a hit-and-run post to me. I doubt the author will be back to explain why this was posted to a translation list. As far as I can see this was not a request for advice regarding translation.

Jens Wilkinson

[Mark Spahn]

But if we clean up the English, aren't we associating

ourselves with a tendentious claim and helping it to

look more respectable?  ...

[moving anecdote; thanks]. 

Doreen Simmons

- - - - - - - - - - -

 

No, and maybe.

Translation is a bidness, in which the translator

need not agree with the text he is translating, and

everyone realizes this (insofar as they realize that

a translator must have been involved at all). 

I would have no qualms about translating for

http://takarapatch.com/ 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iskra (Искра)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_St%C3%BCrmer 

http://www.shafiifiqh.com/maktabah/relianceoftraveller.pdf ,

even section o1.2(4) (that's "oh", not zero), which

is very honor-killingly Abrahamic.

 

But irony abounds.  A laissez-faire translator may

through his translation business come to learn  

something that he decides to work against.

[Herman]

On 11/15/2013 09:35, Mark Spahn wrote:
> But if we clean up the English, aren't we associating
> ourselves with a tendentious claim and helping it to
> look more respectable? ...
> [moving anecdote; thanks].
> Doreen Simmons
> - - - - - - - - - - -
> No, and maybe.
> Translation is a bidness, in which the translator
> need not agree with the text he is translating, and
> everyone realizes this (insofar as they realize that
> a translator must have been involved at all).

While it is true that, from the standpoint of a professional translator,
the act of translating a document does not necessarily imply agreement
with its content, that would not be the case from the standpoint of an
average person. Thus, insofar as a translator as such is to become
associated with or known for anything, it will likely be for the things
he or she has translated.

Herman Kahn

[Laurie Berman]

On Nov 14, 2013, at 9:57 PM, Ray Roman wrote:

Might there be an ethical duty to refrain from furthering the aims of a propagandist?

A tricky question. That would eliminate a huge amount of government and corporate PR work--and quite a bit of "journalism" as well. There goes my break and butter! (That said, I wouldn't touch this one with a ten-foot pole.)

Laurie Berman

[Mark Spahn]

> While it is true that, from the standpoint of a professional translator,
> the act of translating a document does not necessarily imply agreement
> with its content, that would not be the case from the standpoint of an
> average person. Thus, insofar as a translator as such is to become
> associated with or known for anything, it will likely be for the things he
> or she has translated.
> Herman Kahn

Herman,
Your remarks raise a question which I do not know the answer to:
In what percentage of translations does the reader of the
translation know (much less care) who the translator was?
I imagine this proportion is near-zero for patents and advertising.
Commercial translators may gain reputations, but among translation
agencies rather than among translation readers.
And even with literary translations, the translator's reputation
depends on how well the translation is done, not on the content
of what was translated. I doubt that the translators of
"Mein Kampf" suffered from their association with this work.
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/mein-kampf-the-ford-translation-adolf-hitler/1017745820?ean=9780977476077
offers a brief comparison of several translations.

[Herman]

Lets say you are applying for a job to translate material in the field
of chemistry, and your resum� is filled with 50% chemical texts and 50%
Hitlerian texts. That may help your case, for instance, if the
prospective employer is an anti-Semite, and may harm your case if the
employer is a Jew, and may have no bearing in many other instances.

Herman Kahn

[Fred Uleman]

There are some things I will do for free, some things I will do for enough money, and some things I will not do

That said, the things I will do for money can include getting information out so other people can bash it.

[Shannon Spears]

Thanks to everyone for their input on this problem and to Fred for following up about his in-person investigation!

I will keep on investigating and update you if I find a good solution.

---
Shannon Spears
JP>EN Medical Translator