Protranslating

[Michael Fletcher]

Dear Yakkers:

 

I hope this finds everyone well.

 

A company in Florida posted a job offer for Japanese to English translation of responses to a web page today. The original job offer did not state anything related to rates. I received a response from the company stating that they had clientele in the Fortune 500 and that they were looking to relieve some of the pressure off of in house translators. However, they offered a rate of $10 per hour to do the translation as you have to use the software of their client and it is not very easy to count the words using the software in question. They are also indicating this as something to begin to build a relationship. Before doing anything else, I asked what their regular rate for Japanese to English translation was. I received an answer back of $0.08 per English word. This is better than the $10 per hour for the current project but still extremely low.

 

The name of the company is Protranslating out of Miami Florida. Does anyone have experience working with them?

 

I kind of get the feeling that this is their first foray into Japanese to English translating. I am trying to decide whether or not to simply say that I am not interested or to politely indicate that both rates are really outside of what is normal for the Japanese to English industry.

 

Has anyone every heard of them?

 

Thanks,

 

Michael

[jmarc...@comcast.net]

Michael Fletcher asked,

Dear Michael,

I have not heard of them, but this sounds suspiciously like a job that I got several e-mails about (probably by having my e-mail address harvested from ProZ) in January or so. I checked and heard the same spiel about the software, low rate, etc. I declined.

Others may have a different opinion, but my own take is always be careful when (1) an agency asks you to do something for a low rate because it is a new end client; or (2) an agency asks you to accept a low rate because they are "building relationships" or some other such vague formulation. Usually it is just a way to make it seem like the rate being paid is a temporary measure, when in fact it is a long-term strategy for getting more work. The rate is unlikely ever to go up down the road.

An example: A Chinese > English project that I was approached about last September used this strategy - new client, relationship building, etc. - to get a dozen people to do a mass of work, with very quick turnarounds, for a law firm handling a big lawsuit. Then the agency stiffed almost everyone involved; despite the low rate, it has still not paid a lot of the translators (original terms were 45 days after invoicing). One translator posted a negative report about the agency on the Internet, and she has since been notified by the agency in question that she won't be paid until she removes her negative post! In other words, the agency does not pay on time or even bother to respond to inquiries about non-payment, so one of the translators complains about it on a payment practices forum, and then this complaint becomes a reason not to pay! There must be a name for this kind of tautology, though I would have to thumb carefully through my copy of Aristotle's "Logic" to find it!

Anyway, proceed with caution.

My two bits,

[James Gregory]

I communicated with someone at this company today as well about the same job. I got pretty much to the same place you did and they would not tell me how many words they expected for the hour. I decided either they really didn't know what they were doing or it was a scam, and in either case wasn't worth my time.

Very best,

James

--
James Gregory
ジェイムズ・グレゴリー
jagre...@gmail.com

[Andy Lausberg]

Hi Michael,

I responded to a similar offer by the company last December, except at that time, the offer was $20 hour. The added spiel about the rate and the job was that it would help them to determine 'the quality and reliability' of myself as a translator. Whenever there is an offer for low rates with the promise of lots more future work, building a good relationship with some clients, or such, I mentally assign the offer to that same place I preserve for genital enlargement advertisements.

Unsurprisingly, I never heard back from them when I suggested that $20 an hour does not seem to be an appropriate rate if they are indeed after quality and reliability.

Oh, and by the way, the PM suggested that $20 / hour works out to around $0.08 per word.

I guess they have been getting lots of excellent responses, if they could drop from $20 to $10. But I wonder what happened to the time / word ratio?

I suggest you politely indicate your view on rates. Sometimes I think they just don't have a clue.


Andrew Lausberg, B.A., Grad. Dip.
Korean, Japanese and English Translation
laus...@oceanreach.org
61-4-6656-9621 (Australia)

[Andy Lausberg]

On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 11:41 AM, Andy Lausberg <andyla...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Michael,

 Whenever there is an offer for low rates with the promise of lots more future work, building a good relationship with some clients, or such, I mentally assign the offer to that same place I preserve for genital enlargement advertisements.

 I guess this is not entirely true. I have never actually responded to an enlargement advertisement... <g>

[Megumi Matsumoto]

I actually applied this job. I was told I was hired on the day I
applied, so I signed their contract papers and sent W9 including, of
course, SSN. Then no response from them. I asked them again whether I
got hired or not, they told me I am hired YESTERDAY. Then no messages
from them again about their project but to ask me to send W9 again
though I have already sent it on Monday. So I asked them what is going
on, then they finally told me the job has been filled and you are not
hired... though they told me I was hired yesterday. Now I am worried
they just wanted my info or not. I see their company has got A+ on BBB
but it seems like this company is a sort of scam.

[Joseph Kei Nagai]

I would not sign a W9 for new agents until it's time to pay me. I would
also add a confidentiality clause on their bib-disclosure agreement
which usually is designed only to protect their confidential information.

Joseph Kei Nagai

[Fred Uleman]

But if they said you were hired -- do you have that in writing -- perhaps you can file for some kind of severance pay? <g>

Large numbers of people were sort-of-hired (内定) in Japan when companies were hoping things would get better and then the naitei was cancelled before they started work. And the minimum amount (reported in the media) to settle such claims has been about a million yen.

--
Fred Uleman, translator emeritus

[Megumi Matsumoto]

This job is not in Japan. It's the company called ProTranslating
located in FL. They told me I am hired then next day they told me I am
not hired. They kept asking me to sign and send W9, so I had to do it
but like the comment above, I shouldn't have done that until it's time
to get paid. They also asked me to change my IE settings to start my
work, changing my security settings and so on. Like other people are
mentioning above, they ask you to use their method/software to count
words or something like that. It was totally an useless effort and
time that I had to do it. No explanation or message at all about it
after that too...

[Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven]

-On [20100312 02:58], Megumi Matsumoto (megu...@gmail.com) wrote:
>They also asked me to change my IE settings to start my work, changing my
>security settings and so on.

And here the IT guy wakes up. Do you have those instructions around still,
because changing (most likely lowering) those settings from the defaults
can really open your Windows computer to a lot of pain and hurt due to
malware and other unpleasant programs.
This is sounding more and more like a phishing or information scam.

--
Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven <asmodai(-at-)in-nomine.org> / asmodai
イェルーン ラウフロック ヴァン デル ウェルヴェン
http://www.in-nomine.org/ | http://www.rangaku.org/ | GPG: 2EAC625B
Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness...

[jmarc...@comcast.net]

Jeroen wrote about Protranslating:

> This is sounding more and more like a phishing or information scam.

No, Jeroen, I think it is a job. The company just reposted this same job the other day on ProZ yet again. I think the company's problem is the issue of having to pay someone to do it. Maybe if Megumi agrees to work for three bowls of gruel per day, and promises not to ask for a second helping, she will get "rehired". Again.


John Marchioro

[Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven]

-On [20100312 13:26], jmarc...@comcast.net (jmarc...@comcast.net) wrote:
>No, Jeroen, I think it is a job. The company just reposted this same job the
>other day on ProZ yet again.

OK, I guess that's good to know. You just cannot be too careful with this
sort of thing. Especially given how easily you can wind up with malware
nowadays with changed security settings.

Thanks for letting me/us know.

--
Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven <asmodai(-at-)in-nomine.org> / asmodai
イェルーン ラウフロック ヴァン デル ウェルヴェン
http://www.in-nomine.org/ | http://www.rangaku.org/ | GPG: 2EAC625B

The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way
its animals are treated.

[jmarc...@comcast.net]

I wrote:

>No, Jeroen, I think it is a job. The company just reposted this same job the
>other day on ProZ yet again.

And Jeroen replied:

OK, I guess that's good to know. You just cannot be too careful with this
sort of thing. Especially given how easily you can wind up with malware
nowadays with changed security settings.

Actually, this is standard fare, Jeroen. There are several Indian companies (for example, Edinsense or whatever it is called) that are bombarding ProZ with the exactly same job announcements all the time. I assume that the point is to search for people who are willing to work for still lower wages than the companies' current freelancers are willing to accept, just as this Protranslating job (now out there for over 2 months) is now being re-posted with the wage cut in half. Protranslating probably found people willing to do it for $20/hour back in January; now they are seeing if they can find others willing to do it for less. My take, at any rate.


John Marchioro

[Fred Uleman]

Re:
>> This is sounding more and more like a phishing or ...
> I think it is a job. The company just reposted this same ...

If it were phishing, they would want to phish as widely as possible. Wouldn't they? How does the fact that they reposted it indicate that it is not phishing?

[jmarc...@comcast.net]

Fred asked about Protranslating:

If it were phishing, they would want to phish as widely as possible. Wouldn't they? How does the fact that they reposted it indicate that it is not phishing?

Fred,

It could be. But this is a real company, with a real office in Miami (I think). And based on the lengthy e-mails (two, both unsolicited, with considerable detail about the project, including a URL to download the software required for the project if I remember correctly) that I got back in January, I would bet that this is just a high-volume, low-wage project that this agency is desperately looking to have cranked out by warm bodies with minimum pulses and heartbeats. At this point the PMs are probably out trying to press-gang unsuspecting tourists on Miami Beach.

This is not that uncommon, either. Law firms are always looking for low wage labor for tedious screening work for Japanese docs, then billing the client some ridiculous hourly wage and pocketing the difference. The results are predictable as well: Lousy wages, lousy work.


John M.

[Jon LeFlore]

For what it's worth, I've done work for this company and had absolutely no problem with them.  They pay on time, they're great to work with, and they give an hourly rate because of the type of system they use for translating (anybody know Ascribe?).  The system makes it hard to break down per word because it functions vaguely like translation memory, but not enough to be useful, only enough to make word counts pointless...

Does this help at all?

[Sheryl]

Jon,

 

I have worked in Ascribe frequently over the past several years and have always based my work rate on word count. It is very easy to do by downloading the output as an Excel file. I would suspect that they ask for an hourly rate because it works out cheaper for them that way.

 

Sheryl Hogg

 

Subject: Re: Protranslating