Legal Representation
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Paul Cooper (HKN Beta Epsilon Alumni)
Feb 13, 2008, 3:02:28 PM2/13/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
During our last discussion at Beta Epsilon we were very interested in
possibly pursuing legal representation for the student groups during
this merger process. We feel that this may have two potential
benefits.
First with our own legal council we may be able to pressure Nationals
into providing us with the information we need to make an informed
decision on the merger. I think that we can all agree that Nationals
has failed to provide us with transparency in this process which is
completely unacceptable and very unsettling. Also if it turns out
that our interpretation of their current financial situation is
correct and Nationals is not in financial trouble we may have other
legal avenues to stop this merger.
Second legal representation will help protect us from Nationals trying
to subvert the Constitution. One of our members discovered a clause
in the Constitution that allows Nationals to make any changes they see
fit if they are solely for financial reasons. This clause and
possibly others may allow Nationals to still merge even if we vote
down the merger, especially if we do not have our own legal team to
protect us.
We were wondering if others think that this is something we should
pursue. Also we were looking for suggestions on how we could find
legal council especially considering we do not have a huge budget to
fund a legal team. We have tried contacting the legal services
available at our school and they do not help with student groups.
possibly pursuing legal representation for the student groups during
this merger process. We feel that this may have two potential
benefits.
First with our own legal council we may be able to pressure Nationals
into providing us with the information we need to make an informed
decision on the merger. I think that we can all agree that Nationals
has failed to provide us with transparency in this process which is
completely unacceptable and very unsettling. Also if it turns out
that our interpretation of their current financial situation is
correct and Nationals is not in financial trouble we may have other
legal avenues to stop this merger.
Second legal representation will help protect us from Nationals trying
to subvert the Constitution. One of our members discovered a clause
in the Constitution that allows Nationals to make any changes they see
fit if they are solely for financial reasons. This clause and
possibly others may allow Nationals to still merge even if we vote
down the merger, especially if we do not have our own legal team to
protect us.
We were wondering if others think that this is something we should
pursue. Also we were looking for suggestions on how we could find
legal council especially considering we do not have a huge budget to
fund a legal team. We have tried contacting the legal services
available at our school and they do not help with student groups.
Wes Allen (Beta Alum)
Feb 13, 2008, 4:13:58 PM2/13/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
If we are looking for legal representation, surely there is an HKN
alum who would be willing to help out. If not, there may be some
legal group that would be willing to work with us pro bono. Worst
case scenario is we solicit funds from concerned chapters/alum and
hire legal representation.
I guess the question is if this is necessary and, if so, when it
should be done. I have no answers to those two questions other than
to say if the merger is voted down by the chapters but the BoG still
goes through with it, we will have to find some way to stand our
ground.
On Feb 13, 3:02 pm, "Paul Cooper (HKN Beta Epsilon Alumni)"
alum who would be willing to help out. If not, there may be some
legal group that would be willing to work with us pro bono. Worst
case scenario is we solicit funds from concerned chapters/alum and
hire legal representation.
I guess the question is if this is necessary and, if so, when it
should be done. I have no answers to those two questions other than
to say if the merger is voted down by the chapters but the BoG still
goes through with it, we will have to find some way to stand our
ground.
On Feb 13, 3:02 pm, "Paul Cooper (HKN Beta Epsilon Alumni)"
Daniel Aguiar
Feb 13, 2008, 7:35:19 PM2/13/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
I'm sure that if all the concerned chapters banded together, they
could afford the reduced rates, though having an HKN alum be our
lawyer would be ideal. I'm behind any of these options, and it makes
a lot of sense.
Dan
Beta Chapter Treasurer
could afford the reduced rates, though having an HKN alum be our
lawyer would be ideal. I'm behind any of these options, and it makes
a lot of sense.
Dan
Beta Chapter Treasurer
Beta Chapter Advisor
Feb 13, 2008, 10:22:56 PM2/13/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
We have one recent past-President who is in Law School at the moment.
I've
asked some of the members to contact her to see if she has any
ideas.
Unfortunately, the other Beta Chapter alums I know who are lawyers are
all
in Patent Law. Still, one or more might be able to help us out by
pointing us
to an appropriate individual. Check with your advisors/alums!
-tmt
I've
asked some of the members to contact her to see if she has any
ideas.
Unfortunately, the other Beta Chapter alums I know who are lawyers are
all
in Patent Law. Still, one or more might be able to help us out by
pointing us
to an appropriate individual. Check with your advisors/alums!
-tmt
Eddie Pettis (Beta Chapter)
Feb 13, 2008, 10:26:56 PM2/13/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
On Feb 13, 10:22 pm, Beta Chapter Advisor <ttalav...@gmail.com> wrote:
> We have one recent past-President who is in Law School at the moment.
> I've asked some of the members to contact her to see if she has any
> ideas.
I have asked Lindsay Kile at IUPUI to check out the Google Group. I
> We have one recent past-President who is in Law School at the moment.
> I've asked some of the members to contact her to see if she has any
> ideas.
have not made any specific requests regarding representation.
Beta Chapter Advisor
Feb 22, 2008, 2:36:59 PM2/22/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
Just to let everyone know, Beta Chapter is now in contact with a
lawyer and Purdue alum who has worked with non-profit organizations in
the past and might be able to help us. We'll let everyone know if it
appears we have a case or if we are out of luck.
-tmt
lawyer and Purdue alum who has worked with non-profit organizations in
the past and might be able to help us. We'll let everyone know if it
appears we have a case or if we are out of luck.
-tmt
Eddie Pettis (Beta Chapter)
Feb 22, 2008, 3:24:07 PM2/22/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
> One of our members discovered a clause
> in the Constitution that allows Nationals to make any changes they see
> fit if they are solely for financial reasons. This clause and
> possibly others may allow Nationals to still merge even if we vote
> down the merger, especially if we do not have our own legal team to
> protect us.
Could you please indicate which clause this is? We haven't been able
> in the Constitution that allows Nationals to make any changes they see
> fit if they are solely for financial reasons. This clause and
> possibly others may allow Nationals to still merge even if we vote
> down the merger, especially if we do not have our own legal team to
> protect us.
to find it.
Paul Cooper (HKN Beta Epsilon Alumni)
Feb 23, 2008, 2:30:27 PM2/23/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
So I contacted the person that pointed out the clause in our last
meeting on the subject. It turns out he was using the 1993
constitution not the 2002 constitution. Sorry for any confusion.
There is a similar clause in the 2002 constitution but it is not
nearly as strongly worded and would be harder to justify:
ARTICLE XI
Section 2. Duties.
The Executive Council shall manage the funds of the Association in
conformity with fiscal policies established by The Board.
Sorry for any wasted time but at least it seems much less likely that
the Board could use some clause to proceed with the merger if the vote
is not for the merger.
Please let me know if you have any other questions or concerns.
Thanks
Paul
On Feb 22, 3:24 pm, "Eddie Pettis (Beta Chapter)"
meeting on the subject. It turns out he was using the 1993
constitution not the 2002 constitution. Sorry for any confusion.
There is a similar clause in the 2002 constitution but it is not
nearly as strongly worded and would be harder to justify:
ARTICLE XI
Section 2. Duties.
The Executive Council shall manage the funds of the Association in
conformity with fiscal policies established by The Board.
Sorry for any wasted time but at least it seems much less likely that
the Board could use some clause to proceed with the merger if the vote
is not for the merger.
Please let me know if you have any other questions or concerns.
Thanks
Paul
On Feb 22, 3:24 pm, "Eddie Pettis (Beta Chapter)"
Beta Chapter Advisor
Mar 4, 2008, 11:19:44 PM3/4/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
Just wanted to let everyone know that this issue (legal
representation) has not been dropped. Beta Chapter has received some
enlightening feedback, but no recommendations as of yet. I believe
that once the Friday meeting has taken place, we will be able to focus
our questions and identify the best legal plan of action, if such is
truly necessary.
representation) has not been dropped. Beta Chapter has received some
enlightening feedback, but no recommendations as of yet. I believe
that once the Friday meeting has taken place, we will be able to focus
our questions and identify the best legal plan of action, if such is
truly necessary.
Andrew Muehlfeld (Alpha - UIUC)
Mar 6, 2008, 11:54:37 AM3/6/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
I just returned from a meeting with one of the University of Illinois-
UC's attorneys. My main question was: If we vote down the merger, is
there anything that could legally prevent the Board of Governors from
executing the merger anyway? He assured me that the constitution is a
legally binding document. Any attempt to enter a contract with IEEE,
without member approval, would be an "ultravires action", legal speak
for acting outside of your legal authority. He said that no
organization, including IEEE, would ever move forward with a contract
if we simply provide notice that doing so is illegal. In short the
BoG will be unable to move forward without our approval. And concerns
that they could do otherwise, have been alleviated.
UC's attorneys. My main question was: If we vote down the merger, is
there anything that could legally prevent the Board of Governors from
executing the merger anyway? He assured me that the constitution is a
legally binding document. Any attempt to enter a contract with IEEE,
without member approval, would be an "ultravires action", legal speak
for acting outside of your legal authority. He said that no
organization, including IEEE, would ever move forward with a contract
if we simply provide notice that doing so is illegal. In short the
BoG will be unable to move forward without our approval. And concerns
that they could do otherwise, have been alleviated.
Darren Lo (Mu Chapter Corresponding Secretary Sp 2008)
Mar 6, 2008, 1:18:09 PM3/6/08
to HKN/IEEE merger
Thanks for checking into that Andrew, it is reassuring. Now we just
have to make sure that the chapters are aware of all the issues and
that votes are counted equitably (like we don't want abstaining votes
to count as supporting votes).
-Darren
On Mar 6, 8:54 am, "Andrew Muehlfeld (Alpha - UIUC)"
have to make sure that the chapters are aware of all the issues and
that votes are counted equitably (like we don't want abstaining votes
to count as supporting votes).
-Darren
On Mar 6, 8:54 am, "Andrew Muehlfeld (Alpha - UIUC)"
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