Seal hunt

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Bill 2

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Apr 1, 2005, 3:05:40 PM4/1/05
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Why are people so opposed to this? A lot of cattle, poultry, and hogs are
raised for the sole purpose of being killed for food, what's so bad about
hunting a non-endangered species of animal, that isn't even being farmed?
They are free range.

I don't even think they are close to being cute.


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Bill 2

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Apr 1, 2005, 3:40:21 PM4/1/05
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"NOMAN" <No...@noman.org> wrote in message
news:kvar4150t7k1id52k...@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 20:05:40 GMT, "Bill 2" <as...@asdf.asdf> wrote:
>
> <snip>

>
>>
>>I don't even think they are close to being cute.
>>
>
> They always spoke well of you.... :-)


Obviously never saw me.


Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 1, 2005, 4:19:30 PM4/1/05
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I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal
clubbing! Plenty of people would come for it, plus it would
help cut back on cod predation.

Seriously though - the clubbing seems cruel, and there is
video of seal pups being skinned alive which is barbaric,
but for anyone who eats meat at all, protesting that is
totally hypocritical.

As carnivores we tend to kill and eat animals. The raising
and killing is often inhumane and barbaric, but that's just
the way we are.

Cheers,
John

badmanbelair

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Apr 1, 2005, 4:22:53 PM4/1/05
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Would it make you feel better if they were stabbed to death?
"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
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Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 1, 2005, 4:32:59 PM4/1/05
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badmanbelair wrote:

> Would it make you feel better if they were stabbed to death?

Me? I really don't care what happens to them although in
general I am opposed to causing animals and people needless
suffering... I think most people are. I couldn't care less
whether or not there's a seal hunt.
Cheers,
John

Bill 2

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Apr 1, 2005, 5:06:52 PM4/1/05
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"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
news:CVi3e.125560$ZO2.13541@edtnps84...
> Bill 2 wrote:
>> Why are people so opposed to this? A lot of cattle, poultry, and hogs are
>> raised for the sole purpose of being killed for food, what's so bad about
>> hunting a non-endangered species of animal, that isn't even being farmed?
>> They are free range.
>>
>> I don't even think they are close to being cute.
>
> I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal clubbing! Plenty
> of people would come for it, plus it would help cut back on cod predation.
>
> Seriously though - the clubbing seems cruel, and there is video of seal
> pups being skinned alive which is barbaric, but for anyone who eats meat
> at all, protesting that is totally hypocritical.

If you club them right, one hit will immediatly render them unconsious,
quite humane. Yes there are people who follow improper procedure, but you
get that in the livestock industry. My point is that how can they protest
the seal hunt, but not anything else (other than the real hardcore
protesters that portest anything).

> As carnivores we tend to kill and eat animals. The raising and killing is
> often inhumane and barbaric, but that's just the way we are.

We're actually onmivores, we eat both meat and plants.


Rudy

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Apr 1, 2005, 5:08:38 PM4/1/05
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I can provide the hacky picks,,, thats the name of the clubs we used in
newfoundland.

seals eat their weight in codfish per day,,, overfishing contributed to the
loss of the fishery,,, but so did the big cut back on the seal hunt when
Green Peace raised hell back in the late 70's early 80's. More seals = less
fish

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
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Rudy

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Apr 1, 2005, 5:10:37 PM4/1/05
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i'd love a meal of flippers right now,,,,, yumm
better than chicken


"Rudy" <alligat...@gmail.com> wrote in message
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Canso

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Apr 1, 2005, 6:05:56 PM4/1/05
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"I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal
clubbing! Plenty of people would come for it, plus it would
help cut back on cod predation."

The cull of the pups is not going on anymore according to the news last
night. The Seal Hunters are after the media to stop using the footage in
news reels as it distorts the reality. Media sensationalism rears it ugly
head again.

badmanbelair

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Apr 1, 2005, 6:26:17 PM4/1/05
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I wonder if its anything like throwing kittens against brick walls ?
"Canso" <piratesden@@@gmail.comMOM> wrote in message
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Friar Donk

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Apr 1, 2005, 7:37:47 PM4/1/05
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In a day long remembered, Rudy wrote:

> I can provide the hacky picks,,, thats the name of the clubs we used
> in newfoundland.
>
> seals eat their weight in codfish per day,,, overfishing contributed
> to the loss of the fishery,,, but so did the big cut back on the seal
> hunt when Green Peace raised hell back in the late 70's early 80's.
> More seals = less fish
>

Actually cod are too fast for seals which is why cod only accounts for 3%
of their diet. They mainly eat squid, herring, sculpin, halibut and varied
crustaceans. If cod was their main food source, how are the seals still
flourishing now that the cod stocks are near zero? One would expect the
seal population to decline dramatically.

More seals = less fish = less seals = more fish = more seals = less
fish....


--
The Good Friar

Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 1, 2005, 10:15:09 PM4/1/05
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The reality is that it's a brutal, bloody killing fest.
Cheers,
John

badmanbelair

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Apr 2, 2005, 11:05:24 AM4/2/05
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All fishing and animal farming is a"brutal, bloody killing fest" . What are
you having for supper tonight?

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message

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Vrad

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Apr 2, 2005, 11:51:07 AM4/2/05
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> "Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
> news:17o3e.155920$fc4.129900@edtnps89...
>> Canso wrote:
>>> "I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal
>>> clubbing! Plenty of people would come for it, plus it would
>>> help cut back on cod predation."
>>>
>>> The cull of the pups is not going on anymore according to the news last
>>> night. The Seal Hunters are after the media to stop using the footage in
>>> news reels as it distorts the reality. Media sensationalism rears it
>>> ugly head again.
>>
>> The reality is that it's a brutal, bloody killing fest.
>> Cheers,
>> John
>
Most people have a problem with this because the rest of the seal is just
left there. They are not being killed for food. Then there is the fact
that it is a baby animal that is defenseless. I agree with keeping the
populations down. I just don't agree with the hitting over the head part.
They can put down a cat in under 3 seconds with a needle. How about coming
up with a more humane way then a blow to the head that doesn't always result
in instant death. That I believe is the part that most don't agree with.
At least when reading alot of animal rights information that is one of the
main things being argued.

Vrad


badmoonrising

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Apr 2, 2005, 1:35:09 PM4/2/05
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The claim that these seals are responsible for the depletion of fish stocks
is the biggest crock of shit. The seals were here long before the sealers
and if they were responsible there would be no fish left - period..
No, its the blame game as usual, they say this "industry" is worth 16
million, hell the gov't probably spends thay much promoting it and fostering
it and it's a drop in a barrel compared to what they waste every day on
other b.s. programs.
The overfishing by these greedy bastards along with the gutless inability to
stop the europeans, is what caused the fish decline plain and simple, call a
spade a spade for Christ's sake.


Bob

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Apr 2, 2005, 1:44:39 PM4/2/05
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Vrad wrote:

I was listening to Quirks and Quarks today and the subject
of killing methods for seals was discussed. Whereas
shooting, if the bullet hits the right spot, can stop brain
functions (pain and feeling) in 3 to 15 seconds, the blow to
the head accomplishes the same effect in 1 sec, confirmed by
EEG studies and it is much more accurate than other methods.
As for using a needle, a cat weighs, 2 - 3 kg, a baby seal
10-20 kg. it would require a much bigger dose, bigger
needle. I can't see someone running over ice floes
recharging a needle and waiting 30 sec or a minute for the
animal to lose consciousness.
Death is not a pretty sight at the best of times - try
visiting your local slaughterhouse where a good shooter can
down 500-2000 animals a day with a blast to the head while
the animal is locked in a cage.
It then becomes your supper. The kosher way is done by
cutting the throat, but that takes more talent and a very
strong arm.

Bob

Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 2, 2005, 3:55:01 PM4/2/05
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badmanbelair wrote:
> All fishing and animal farming is a"brutal, bloody killing fest" . What are
> you having for supper tonight?

Try to keep up with the discussion. That was my point -
people who eat meat have no legitimate reason to oppose a
seal hunt for instance. It's hypocritical.

Cheers,
John

Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 2, 2005, 3:57:29 PM4/2/05
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badmoonrising wrote:


Maybe that's valid, but keep in mind that humankind has
upset the balance of various predator/prey relationships
that it's likely not that simple.

The polar bear for instance was once known simply as "the
white bear" because its range was far south of polar regions.

We are slaughtering great sharks at an alarming rate too.

The ice cap is melting.

Etc...

Cheers,
John

badmanbelair

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:09:55 PM4/2/05
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It would be alot easier to "keep up with the discussion" if you didn't post
so much verbal diarrhea. If "people who eat meat have no legitimate reason
to oppose a
seal hunt . It's hypocritical" was your point why didn't you just say that
in the first post ?

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message

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badmanbelair

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:11:10 PM4/2/05
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Oh yeah ..... cheers, badmanbelair :-)
"badmanbelair" <badman...@eastlink.ca> wrote in message
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oldtrout

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:26:27 PM4/2/05
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For many years that is how they killed cattle on the farms.

One minute you are standing there stroking its' head and
looking into those big brown eyes and then WHAM, hit between
the eyes with a sledge hammer.

oldtrout

Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:32:25 PM4/2/05
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badmanbelair wrote:
> It would be alot easier to "keep up with the discussion" if you didn't post
> so much verbal diarrhea. If "people who eat meat have no legitimate reason
> to oppose a
> seal hunt . It's hypocritical" was your point why didn't you just say that
> in the first post ?

Here's the third folloup post in the discussion. It's my
first post.

"I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal
clubbing! Plenty of people would come for it, plus it would
help cut back on cod predation.

Seriously though - the clubbing seems cruel, and there is

video of seal pups being skinned alive which is barbaric,
but for anyone who eats meat at all, protesting that is
totally hypocritical.

As carnivores we tend to kill and eat animals. The raising
and killing is often inhumane and barbaric, but that's just
the way we are."

It's not so much a case of me having verbal diarrhea as it
is a case of you not having followed the thread.

Cheers,
John

oldtrout

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:36:13 PM4/2/05
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And a lot of blood for blood pudding.

One time they hung chickens upside down on a convener belt
and used a "Hooked knife" to cut it throat from inside. and
all the blood drained out. Now the electrocute them and they
don't bleed properly. Haven't you noticed all the congealed
blood in the wings and more so the thighs in all chicken
lately. That has turned a LOT of people off of chicken.

oldtrout

>
> Bob

badmanbelair

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:42:18 PM4/2/05
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ummmm....... I know you are but what am I?

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
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Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 2, 2005, 4:50:51 PM4/2/05
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badmanbelair wrote:
> ummmm....... I know you are but what am I?

Well you're not making any sense for one thing.

Cheers,
John

Friar Donk

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Apr 2, 2005, 7:07:51 PM4/2/05
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In a day long remembered, Foghorn Leghorn wrote:

> badmanbelair wrote:
>> All fishing and animal farming is a"brutal, bloody killing fest" .
>> What are you having for supper tonight?
>
> Try to keep up with the discussion. That was my point -
> people who eat meat have no legitimate reason to oppose a
> seal hunt for instance. It's hypocritical.
>
> Cheers,
> John
>
>

I eat plenty o' meat but I'm still trying to find justification for the
seal hunt. It's been proven that the number of seals have little to do
with the fishery depletion, seal meat is regarded as nasty tasting by most
people and there's a ban in some of our larger trading partners on seal
pelts.

You can't compare seals to cattle or pigs, which are domesticated animals
bred for the sole purpose of being slapped on the grill. Killing 60 000
seals for little other reason than for the sheer joy of whacking them with
pointy sticks is like killing 60 000 immobile coyotes with shovels claiming
they eat too many apples.

Comparing it to hunting deer is not the same thing either. You just can't
walk up to a dear and club it on the noggin repeatedly as it tries to
waddle away, it takes skill and patience, plus it's not a govenment
sanctionned culling of the herd. You're hunting a deer to with intents to
eat the whole thing, and you only kill one if you're lucky.

--
The Good Friar

oldtrout

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Apr 2, 2005, 7:08:49 PM4/2/05
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Foghorn Leghorn wrote:
> badmanbelair wrote:
>
>> It would be alot easier to "keep up with the discussion" if you didn't
>> post so much verbal diarrhea. If "people who eat meat have no
>> legitimate reason to oppose a
>> seal hunt . It's hypocritical" was your point why didn't you just say
>> that in the first post ?
>
>
> Here's the third folloup post in the discussion. It's my first post.
>
> "I think we should make it a new tourism activity - seal clubbing!
> Plenty of people would come for it, plus it would help cut back on cod
> predation.
>
> Seriously though - the clubbing seems cruel, and there is video of seal
> pups being skinned alive which is barbaric,

I am not saying that some of the pups may have been skinned
while still alive but... as anyone will tell you that has
witnessed the deaths of various animals by various methods
the muscle spasms of a "dead" animal can often be taken as
the animal is not dead. I would suggest that is many cases
of "seals being skinned alive" is just that.

oldtrout

oldtrout

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Apr 2, 2005, 7:14:45 PM4/2/05
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badmanbelair wrote:
> ummmm....... I know you are but what am I?

I bet the smartest neurologists, neuropsychologists, and
psychiatrists in the world couldn't answer that.

oldtrout

badmanbelair

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Apr 2, 2005, 7:47:19 PM4/2/05
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Good comeback! Your wife must have typed that one.
"oldtrout" <no-...@home.ca> wrote in message
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Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 2, 2005, 10:43:24 PM4/2/05
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Friar Donk wrote:
> In a day long remembered, Foghorn Leghorn wrote:
>
>
>>badmanbelair wrote:
>>
>>>All fishing and animal farming is a"brutal, bloody killing fest" .
>>>What are you having for supper tonight?
>>
>>Try to keep up with the discussion. That was my point -
>>people who eat meat have no legitimate reason to oppose a
>>seal hunt for instance. It's hypocritical.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>John
>>
>>
>
>
> I eat plenty o' meat but I'm still trying to find justification for the
> seal hunt. It's been proven that the number of seals have little to do
> with the fishery depletion, seal meat is regarded as nasty tasting by most
> people and there's a ban in some of our larger trading partners on seal
> pelts.

It's not about justification - the point I am making is that
sometimes the killing of seals is cruel, and sometimes the
killing of meat animals is just as cruel. It's not a perfect
process in either case. Also, the way meat animals are
raised is often disgusting.

So to protest the seal hunt because animals are being killed
cruelly, while being a consumer of factory farmed meat, is
hypocritical.


> You can't compare seals to cattle or pigs, which are domesticated animals
> bred for the sole purpose of being slapped on the grill. Killing 60 000

That doesn't make it any easier on the cattle or pigs when
they are slaughtered. They don't feel better about being
killed because they were bred for slaughter.

> seals for little other reason than for the sheer joy of whacking them with
> pointy sticks is like killing 60 000 immobile coyotes with shovels claiming
> they eat too many apples.

The seals are killed for pelts and for seal meat which is
sold by sealers for money they use to survive. It's not all
that different. I don't believe they do it just for
something to do.


> Comparing it to hunting deer is not the same thing either. You just can't
> walk up to a dear and club it on the noggin repeatedly as it tries to
> waddle away, it takes skill and patience, plus it's not a govenment
> sanctionned culling of the herd. You're hunting a deer to with intents to
> eat the whole thing, and you only kill one if you're lucky.

I agree that deer hunting is probably a lot less likely to
cause suffering than commercial slaughter and sealing.

Cheers,
John

Message has been deleted

Vrad

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Apr 3, 2005, 8:52:15 AM4/3/05
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"oldtrout" <no-...@home.ca> wrote in message
news:76E3e.161841$fc4.80319@edtnps89...

I know. You don't live in Nova Scotia and not go to a farm or two. I once
went to a boyfriend's Aunts for a weekend. Well... little did I know it was
chicken time. It was nasty but I helped once they were dead to remove
feathers and then later to removed insides. I think dumping the bowels was
the worst. *gag* but it had to be done. I was a pair of hands so I helped.
I seen alot on farms here and there.

I wasn't saying I was against it. I really don't know much about the
sealing industry. I don't see anyone posting they've done it. But it is
like any industry that involves the harvesting of meat or fur. It's not
pleasant and someone has to do it. And like in any industry there are those
better at it than others. There are those that take pride in a job well
done were the animal suffers nothing. And those who don't care a rats butt
and just get it done whether the animal suffers or not.

I am a full omnivore and love my steak. Thankfully there is someone out
there willing to do the job. Whether I could or not would depend on how
much I wanted that steak. LOL Let's be honest. How many could do it. Not
everyone is a hunter. I seen a full grown man all proud of his deer kill
try to hang it and slice it's throat. He turned after cutting it and threw
up. For some reason he didn't think there would be that much blood. Not
everyone has the ability.

Today's society doesn't have to do the things that society did have to do
years ago. With grocery stores and the like. People aren't involved in
that aspect of life. So it becomes something no one thinks about. You
don't sit at the supper table enjoying that pork roast thinking about how it
was slaughter. You think. mmmm wonder what the wife put in it to make it
taste so good. :)

Vrad


Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 3, 2005, 9:11:23 AM4/3/05
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Vrad wrote:


> I wasn't saying I was against it. I really don't know much about the
> sealing industry. I don't see anyone posting they've done it. But it is
> like any industry that involves the harvesting of meat or fur. It's not
> pleasant and someone has to do it.


That's the thing about sealing though... it's not really for
food. Seals are killed almost exclusively for the pelts and
the carcasses are left on the ice. There's a minor amount of
meat taken but that's generally not the rule.


> And like in any industry there are those
> better at it than others. There are those that take pride in a job well
> done were the animal suffers nothing. And those who don't care a rats butt
> and just get it done whether the animal suffers or not.

This is true. It's probably the same in deer hunting, farm
animal care, and maybe in war as well.


> I am a full omnivore and love my steak. Thankfully there is someone out
> there willing to do the job. Whether I could or not would depend on how
> much I wanted that steak. LOL Let's be honest. How many could do it. Not
> everyone is a hunter. I seen a full grown man all proud of his deer kill
> try to hang it and slice it's throat. He turned after cutting it and threw
> up. For some reason he didn't think there would be that much blood. Not
> everyone has the ability.
>
> Today's society doesn't have to do the things that society did have to do
> years ago. With grocery stores and the like. People aren't involved in
> that aspect of life. So it becomes something no one thinks about. You
> don't sit at the supper table enjoying that pork roast thinking about how it
> was slaughter. You think. mmmm wonder what the wife put in it to make it
> taste so good. :)

The fact we don't personally slaughter our food isn't
necessarily good. One thing that bothers ame about
commercially packaged meat is the recent news about how cows
are fed dead cow parts to make them grow fatster.

WTF? Cows are ruminants; grain and grass eaters. They
shouldn't be eating waste body parts of other cows. It's
bizarre and unnatural. That's why we have Creutzfeldt-Jakob
disease in people today.

Some people do in fact think about how food animals are
slaughtered, and they think about how far less damaging to
the environment and how resource heavy it is to produce food
meats over vegetables, and they become vegetarians of one
sort or another.

There are a great many vegetarians around. There seem to be
more and more every day. Many young people are chosing a
vegetarian diet.

Cheers,
John

Foghorn Leghorn

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Apr 3, 2005, 9:27:17 AM4/3/05
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Foghorn Leghorn wrote:

> Some people do in fact think about how food animals are slaughtered, and
> they think about how far less damaging to the environment and how
> resource heavy it is to produce food meats over vegetables, and they
> become vegetarians of one sort or another.

This previous sentence should read "Some people do in fact

think about how food animals are slaughtered, and they think

about how far less damaging to the environment it is to
raise and consume vegetable foods, and how resource heavy it

Vrad

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Apr 3, 2005, 9:49:52 AM4/3/05
to

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
news:VaS3e.162678$fc4.5489@edtnps89...

I agree. I have had vegetarians sit at my table and cooked them a special
meal. Didn't stop me from sitting down to eat roast beef though. I have no
worries over both of my kids either. They both love meat. I am afraid I
will never be a vegetarian.

However something like 70% of vegetarians are unhealthy and not because the
life style is unhealthy but because they don't do it properly. When being a
vegetarian and there are many different types. You have a number of checks
and balances of certain foods you must eat. Most do not follow the rules.
By doing so they lack alot of nutrients. For some it is a fad. Those that
are serious do it properly. Becoming a vegetarian or vegan or # of other
differing titles have rules and proper guidelines. Those who do it properly
are just as healthy as an omnivore that does it properly. I have read the
studies. I had a friend who was a supposed vegetarian. She ended up in
hospital because her iron was so low. She was not eating a proper diet.
She is still a vegetarian today but now follows a strict diet. People can
get very sick if they don't do it right.

Vrad


oldtrout

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Apr 3, 2005, 11:49:25 AM4/3/05
to

And were you chicken?

> It was nasty but I helped once they were dead to remove
> feathers and then later to removed insides. I think dumping the bowels was
> the worst. *gag* but it had to be done. I was a pair of hands so I helped.
> I seen alot on farms here and there.

I remember when the store first advertised "Eviscerated
Chicken". Before that the cook had to clean the chicken when
it was brought home from the store. I well remember my
mother saving the eggs that were still in the chicken and
she would put them in a cake or something else she was baking.

>
> I wasn't saying I was against it. I really don't know much about the
> sealing industry. I don't see anyone posting they've done it. But it is
> like any industry that involves the harvesting of meat or fur. It's not
> pleasant and someone has to do it. And like in any industry there are those
> better at it than others. There are those that take pride in a job well
> done were the animal suffers nothing. And those who don't care a rats butt
> and just get it done whether the animal suffers or not.
>
> I am a full omnivore

Funny I pictured you and neat and trim.

>and love my steak. Thankfully there is someone out
> there willing to do the job. Whether I could or not would depend on how
> much I wanted that steak. LOL Let's be honest. How many could do it. Not
> everyone is a hunter. I seen a full grown man all proud of his deer kill
> try to hang it and slice it's throat. He turned after cutting it and threw
> up. For some reason he didn't think there would be that much blood. Not
> everyone has the ability.
>
> Today's society doesn't have to do the things that society did have to do
> years ago. With grocery stores and the like. People aren't involved in
> that aspect of life. So it becomes something no one thinks about. You
> don't sit at the supper table enjoying that pork roast thinking about how it
> was slaughter.

>You think. mmmm wonder what the wife put in it to make it
> taste so good. :)

And you were the cook?

I wonder what the others were thinking.

oldtrout
>
> Vrad
>
>

Holden McGroyne

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Apr 3, 2005, 11:53:18 AM4/3/05
to


I have always believed this too until the past 3 years or so when for
some reason I seemed to come in contact with a lot of vegetarians. Or
maybe more friends became vegetarians.

The people I know range from full vegans who consume no animal
products to vegetarians who might eat a couple of shrimps from time to
time and who consume dairy products.

As far as I can tell they all seem extraordinarily healthy. They are
almost all slim and trim, although oddly some are heavy. I've never
known one to have any obvious health problems related to their diet,
and as far as I can recall they don't seem to complain any more than
anyone else about health issues. When they do it's just normal stuff
like colds and flu, etc.

Years ago, in the back-to-the-land era when people were glued to Rodal
Press organic reading materials, and big clear jars of brown rice and
unbleached whole flour on open shelving signified you had seen the
light, careful planning f vegetarian diets was the hottest topic of
conversation around the home made yoghurt fountain.

Nowadays vegetarians seem so much more relaxed about it. Vegetarianism
is no longer a 'hippy' thing or an oddball way tolive. It's far more
common and mainstream than before and people seem more interested in
the health benefits.

Cheers,
John

oldtrout

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 11:58:26 AM4/3/05
to
Foghorn Leghorn wrote:
> Vrad wrote:
>
>
>> I wasn't saying I was against it. I really don't know much about the
>> sealing industry. I don't see anyone posting they've done it. But it
>> is like any industry that involves the harvesting of meat or fur.
>> It's not pleasant and someone has to do it.
>
>
>
> That's the thing about sealing though... it's not really for food. Seals
> are killed almost exclusively for the pelts and the carcasses are left
> on the ice. There's a minor amount of meat taken but that's generally
> not the rule.

Vrad said "harvesting of meat OR fur".

People can make all kinds of personal choices which is fine
with most people just as long as they are within the legal
and acceptable (whoever decides what that is) standards AND
that they don't try and convert me/us.

Humans are omnivorous. The proof is in the structure of our
teeth.

oldtrout
>
> Cheers,
> John

Bill 2

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 12:53:49 PM4/3/05
to

"Friar Donk" <ROT-13-s...@sevneqbax.bet> wrote in message
news:Xns962CCC70F9C3ERO...@198.161.157.145...

> In a day long remembered, Foghorn Leghorn wrote:
>
>> badmanbelair wrote:
>>> All fishing and animal farming is a"brutal, bloody killing fest" .
>>> What are you having for supper tonight?
>>
>> Try to keep up with the discussion. That was my point -
>> people who eat meat have no legitimate reason to oppose a
>> seal hunt for instance. It's hypocritical.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> John
>>
>>
>
> I eat plenty o' meat but I'm still trying to find justification for the
> seal hunt. It's been proven that the number of seals have little to do
> with the fishery depletion, seal meat is regarded as nasty tasting by most
> people and there's a ban in some of our larger trading partners on seal
> pelts.
>
> You can't compare seals to cattle or pigs, which are domesticated animals
> bred for the sole purpose of being slapped on the grill.

It's OK to raise animals in confinement for the sole purpose of killing
them, but not OK to go in nature and kill an animal in it's natural habitat?

Killing 60 000
> seals for little other reason than for the sheer joy of whacking them with
> pointy sticks is like killing 60 000 immobile coyotes with shovels
> claiming
> they eat too many apples.

They take the pelts. They aren't killed for the sole purpose of killing.

> Comparing it to hunting deer is not the same thing either. You just can't
> walk up to a dear and club it on the noggin repeatedly as it tries to
> waddle away, it takes skill and patience,


Try telling that to the deer that jumped in front of my car. It takes skill
to NOT kill it.


Bill 2

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 12:58:27 PM4/3/05
to

"Bob" <bobr...@yahoo.nospamca> wrote in message
news:NLB3e.26412$w63.1...@news20.bellglobal.com...

I think the appearance of blood adds to people's outrage. Seals are killed
on white snow, which will show blood much easier than any other surface.
Plus the blood will be diluted with water, making it appear as though there
is more blood than there really is.

Plus it's out in the open, not in the privacy of a slaughterhouse.

Foghorn Leghorn

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 1:08:34 PM4/3/05
to
oldtrout wrote:

>>
>>
>> That's the thing about sealing though... it's not really for food.
>> Seals are killed almost exclusively for the pelts and the carcasses
>> are left on the ice. There's a minor amount of meat taken but that's
>> generally not the rule.
>
>
> Vrad said "harvesting of meat OR fur".

In the context of "somebody has to do it". Harvesting fur
from seals is hardly a neccesity.
Cheers,
John

Foghorn Leghorn

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 1:12:48 PM4/3/05
to
oldtrout wrote:

> People can make all kinds of personal choices which is fine with most
> people just as long as they are within the legal and acceptable (whoever
> decides what that is) standards AND that they don't try and convert me/us.
>
> Humans are omnivorous. The proof is in the structure of our teeth.
>
> oldtrout

Have you ever known a vegetarian who tried to 'convert'
someone? I've never met one. It would be annoying.

It's been argued that people eat FAR more meat than we need
and far less grains and plant foods than we should. The
proof is in the rampant increase in people who are grossly
overweight and in the related diseases and health issues.

Cheers,
John

Foghorn Leghorn

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 1:15:02 PM4/3/05
to
Bill 2 wrote:


You're dead right on all of those points. Delivering little
neat parcels of meat on styrofoam trays makes it seem a
little more civilized or something. It 'removes' us from our
food to some extent, and makes it seem less like we are
eating pieces of a dead animal carcass (as delicious as that
can be :-)

Cheers,
John

oldtrout

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 2:26:29 PM4/3/05
to
Foghorn Leghorn wrote:
> oldtrout wrote:
>
>> People can make all kinds of personal choices which is fine with most
>> people just as long as they are within the legal and acceptable
>> (whoever decides what that is) standards AND that they don't try and
>> convert me/us.
>>
>> Humans are omnivorous. The proof is in the structure of our teeth.
>>
>> oldtrout
>
>
> Have you ever known a vegetarian who tried to 'convert' someone? I've
> never met one. It would be annoying.

I have met several that would have lectured me for hours if
I had let them go on that long.

No matter what the cause phanitics are obnoctious.

>
> It's been argued that people eat FAR more meat than we need and far less
> grains and plant foods than we should.

I don'e that that has to be argued as it is a fact.

>The proof is in the rampant
> increase in people who are grossly overweight

Guilty. At least I have stopped eating an equal portion of
fat to my steaks now. (But they aren't as good)

oldtrout

oldtrout

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 3:22:20 PM4/3/05
to

Why would you want to avoid it?

Have knife, Will travel.

oldtrout

G. Wayne Hines

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 3:55:32 PM4/3/05
to
On Sun, 03 Apr 2005 19:22:20 GMT, oldtrout <no-...@home.ca> wrote:

>Bill 2 wrote:
>> "Friar Donk" <ROT-13-s...@sevneqbax.bet> wrote in message
>> news:Xns962CCC70F9C3ERO...@198.161.157.145...
>>
>>

>> Try telling that to the deer that jumped in front of my car. It takes skill
>> to NOT kill it.
>
>Why would you want to avoid it?
>
>Have knife, Will travel.
>
>oldtrout

Mr. Trout:

Depends on what you're driving. The impact of fender on fur can make a
big dent in the vehicle. The trick is to be able to swerve so that you
graze the deer's head enough to kill it, but not seriously damage your
vehicle.

gwh

Message has been deleted

oldtrout

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 7:33:06 PM4/3/05
to

Another with the knowledge. Why do you think so many of the
older 1/2 ton trucks have the spare mounted on the front. It
ain't no cow catcher.

oldtrout
>
> gwh
>

G. Wayne Hines

unread,
Apr 3, 2005, 8:24:06 PM4/3/05
to
On Sun, 03 Apr 2005 23:33:06 GMT, oldtrout <no-...@home.ca> wrote:

>G. Wayne Hines wrote:
>>
>> Depends on what you're driving. The impact of fender on fur can make a
>> big dent in the vehicle. The trick is to be able to swerve so that you
>> graze the deer's head enough to kill it, but not seriously damage your
>> vehicle.
>
>Another with the knowledge. Why do you think so many of the
>older 1/2 ton trucks have the spare mounted on the front. It
>ain't no cow catcher.

A half-ton is no match for a cow. Even larger vehicles have problems.

Back in the 80's when the passenger trains still ran, the train had an
altercation with a cow in the Garland's Crossing area, just outside
Windsor. This was a Friday night and there were 3 of the railliners
coupled together. Those railliners have the motors, transmissions and
a lot of other gear hanging under the floor.

When the train hit the cow, the cow went under the train, seriously
damaging everything under the first unit and causing some damage under
the second unit. The train was able to continue to Kentville, using
the power from the third unit, and the undamaged part of the second
unit.

When the train arrived in Kentville, it was over an hour late. As he
completed the paperwork at the station, the conductor commented "That
must have been a bull we hit because it sure f.....ed the train."

gwh

santos

unread,
Apr 4, 2005, 3:10:03 AM4/4/05
to

"Freedom of Speech" <free2s...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:HeY3e.128235$ZO2.98581@edtnps84...
>
>
> X-No-archive: yes
>
>
> Anyone opposed to the seal are nothing more than a nutbar who thinks
those
> fishermen can get a office job in Newfoundland like in New York,London
or
> Los Angles. These people do not also realize that human beings get food
from
> either something that is an animal or plant and that man is part of the
> food chain like anything else that moves or glows in the ground.
> They really,really need to get a real job

Those poor poor fisherman, who only work a couple months a year and get
large ui cheques the rest of the year, and subsidies on everything they sell
to make sure they make top dollar. I dont think many of them are resorting
to eating seal meat, since they have enough to buy brand new trucks, boats
and houses. Nice to see someone buys into their woeful stories though...

santos


oldtrout

unread,
Apr 4, 2005, 9:19:48 AM4/4/05
to

What animal will do the most damage when hit by a trin?

oldtrout

Holden McGroyne

unread,
Apr 4, 2005, 5:08:06 PM4/4/05
to

That concrete moose over in Cow Bay. Or the giant lobster in Shediac.
John

G. Wayne Hines

unread,
Apr 4, 2005, 8:56:41 PM4/4/05
to
On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 13:19:48 GMT, oldtrout <no-...@home.ca> wrote:

>
>What animal will do the most damage when hit by a trin?

Mr. Trout:

In most cases, any of the larger animals in this area, cows, horses,
moose, will do only minor damage to the front of a locomotive.
Sometimes, if they get underneath the locomotive, they can cause some
damage to brake lines, etc.

gwh

G. Wayne Hines

unread,
Apr 4, 2005, 8:58:18 PM4/4/05
to
On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 21:08:06 GMT, Holden McGroyne <n...@email.plz>
wrote:

>
>That concrete moose over in Cow Bay. Or the giant lobster in Shediac.

Mr. McGroyne:

Are you any relation to Michael Jackson?

gwh

Vrad

unread,
Apr 5, 2005, 7:17:21 AM4/5/05
to

"Holden McGroyne" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
news:9s3051pfqbuvjcp6s...@4ax.com...

Your right but alot of young people proclaim to be a vegetarian of one sort
or another and just jump into it. They don't research. It is like any
other diet. You should know the rules before getting started. Alot of
parents think "Oh they'll get tired of it" and don't help them with it.

I don't know any stats but there are alot of nutrition problems amoung our
kiddies. Being overweight is just the most advertised and news worthy.

Vrad

Vrad


Vrad

unread,
Apr 5, 2005, 9:27:16 AM4/5/05
to

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
news:mqV3e.166036$fc4.84236@edtnps89...

No but somebody has to keep their numbers down. Just killing them and doing
nothing makes no sense. So killing them and using the fur is better.
However some Inuit's still use them for fur and for meat. I watched a show
and the old fella was explaining that the eyeballs are as tasty as a snow
cone when eaten fresh after the kill. *GAG* Actually they suck the juice
out.*double gag* Food is food. Chinese eat cats. Why not eat seal
eyeballs.

Vrad


oldtrout

unread,
Apr 5, 2005, 9:45:05 AM4/5/05
to

The answer is a pig, because of it's mass and being built
close to the ground.

oldtrout

oldtrout

unread,
Apr 5, 2005, 11:13:08 AM4/5/05
to

I was on a Shrimp boat from The Faroe Islands. Their
favorite meal was boiled sheep heads. They cracked them open
with a wooden mauls and ate the contents. The most coveted
piece? The eye balls.

oldtrout

Vrad

unread,
Apr 5, 2005, 4:27:19 PM4/5/05
to

"Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
news:kuV3e.166126$fc4.48394@edtnps89...

John your are so very right. Red meat should not be eaten more than 2X a
week. The most common disease from eating to much red meat. Is
diverticious and attacks of diverticulitious (sp?). Pockets in the bowels
and intestines that get blocked and can cause death if left untreated.
People ate alot more things such as Oatmeal on a daily basis and meat was a
luxury.

Vrad


oldtrout

unread,
Apr 6, 2005, 12:27:26 PM4/6/05
to
Vrad wrote:
> "Foghorn Leghorn" <n...@email.plz> wrote in message
> news:kuV3e.166126$fc4.48394@edtnps89...
>
>>oldtrout wrote:
>>
>>
>>>People can make all kinds of personal choices which is fine with most
>>>people just as long as they are within the legal and acceptable (whoever
>>>decides what that is) standards AND that they don't try and convert
>>>me/us.
>>>
>>>Humans are omnivorous. The proof is in the structure of our teeth.
>>>
>>>oldtrout
>>
>>Have you ever known a vegetarian who tried to 'convert' someone? I've
>>never met one. It would be annoying.
>>
>>It's been argued that people eat FAR more meat than we need and far less
>>grains and plant foods than we should. The proof is in the rampant
>>increase in people who are grossly overweight and in the related diseases
>>and health issues.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>John
>
>
> John your are so very right. Red meat should not be eaten more than 2X a
> week.

Kill joy.

oldtrout

Al Smith

unread,
Apr 7, 2005, 3:41:09 PM4/7/05
to
> No but somebody has to keep their numbers down. Just killing them and doing
> nothing makes no sense. So killing them and using the fur is better.
> However some Inuit's still use them for fur and for meat. I watched a show
> and the old fella was explaining that the eyeballs are as tasty as a snow
> cone when eaten fresh after the kill. *GAG* Actually they suck the juice
> out.*double gag* Food is food. Chinese eat cats. Why not eat seal
> eyeballs.

Seal fur is great for clothing. Looks good, feels good, excellent
water shedding and cold-weather insulation, breaths so you don't
sweat too much in it. Too bad Canadians as a group wouldn't adopt
a seal fur garment as our national symbol. Maybe a seal fur hat
with ear lugs.

Al Smith

unread,
Apr 7, 2005, 3:44:03 PM4/7/05
to
> John your are so very right. Red meat should not be eaten more than 2X a
> week. The most common disease from eating to much red meat. Is
> diverticious and attacks of diverticulitious (sp?). Pockets in the bowels
> and intestines that get blocked and can cause death if left untreated.
> People ate alot more things such as Oatmeal on a daily basis and meat was a
> luxury.

Woops. My bullshit meter just spiked. I doubt eating red meat can
cause bowel problems. Maybe if you ate nothing else at all. But
that is true of any food. The body needs variety. Red meat is an
important source of iron and protein. It's what keeps us from
turning into Hindus and staring at our navels all day long.

Holden McGroyne

unread,
Apr 7, 2005, 6:29:37 PM4/7/05
to
On Thu, 07 Apr 2005 19:44:03 GMT, Al Smith <inv...@address.com>
wrote:

I think the problem is the fat content in most "desireable" red meats
like barbeque steaks etc. Even extra lean ground beef has around 10%
fat. T-bone steaks and other heavily marbled cuts are very high in bad
fats, plus we tend to eat relatively large quantities of red meats. 2
oz per day is plenty.

Cheers,
John

Vrad

unread,
Apr 8, 2005, 8:42:42 AM4/8/05
to

"Al Smith" <inv...@address.com> wrote in message
news:74g5e.11476$Ln.5...@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca...

Diverticulosis and Diverticulitis

There are alot more factors. It is not enough fiber in the diet. Too much
fatty foods. It started in the 1900's. But I am sorry to tell you. That
red meat does in fact play a role in it. It affects most people once they
hit 60 although some alot younger. It is becoming increasly common due to
fast food. My husband's grandmother ended up in hospital with it. Then had
a stroke and ended up on a respirator. She suffered greatly because she
thought she had the flu. It comes down to poor diet. The Canada food guide
is there for a reason. And yes any doctor will tell you eating red meat
more than 2x a week is not good for you. This is only one of the reasons
why.

Vrad


Al Smith

unread,
Apr 8, 2005, 4:27:48 PM4/8/05