Bad Makerfabs "OMRON" relays

Jonathan Kelly

unread,

Oct 14, 2021, 5:31:55 PM10/14/21

to Hermes-Lite

Had a strange intermittent fault on my N2ADR board develop over the week where I'd loose approximately 10dB of receiver sensitivity, this was easily noticeable on the waterfall.

Traced it back to K7. The screen printing on these relays looks poor, a sign of Chinese cloan parts prehaps ? Replaced now working fine.

Anyone else had relays go bad ?

Jonathan G2HFR

Steve Haynal

unread,

Oct 16, 2021, 2:26:47 PM10/16/21

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Jonathan,

Thanks for the report. The relays have been a source of problems on maybe 5-6 boards which I know of. We switched to the Omron relays a few builds ago. Makerfabs is pretty careful about using quality parts. I've actually suggested some sources which they have rejected due to quality concerns.

73,

Steve

kf7o

DL2AOM

unread,

Oct 18, 2021, 4:35:24 PM10/18/21

to Hermes-Lite

Hello Jonathan, I also have this effect, how can I get rid of it?

73 de Matthias DL2AOM

Steve Haynal

unread,

Oct 18, 2021, 9:34:24 PM10/18/21

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Matthias,

You have to replace the relay. Contact me at hermeslite "at" gmail.com about a replacement relay or repair.

73,

Steve

kf7o

Chris Gerber

unread,

Oct 25, 2021, 12:31:21 PM10/25/21

to herme...@googlegroups.com

Hi All

On one of my HL2's I have the same problem. Purchased 15 months ago. It occures only every 10 or 15 times

of coming back from TX to RX showing a drop of around -10dB of the previous set noisefloor.

Its seen on 20m, as this is my working band. Mode Olivia.

I traced the fault back to HL2, but so far, not further inside.

Questions now?

Jonathan, traced it back to K7. What was your working frequency? Did the fault stay fix?

Could it be another relais on the Filterboard, giving the same problem.

This questions because occasionally occuring faults are hard to trace.

I shall observe it longer and pass on further infos here.

Those Omron 3V relais are hard to get around here.

73 Chris HB9BDM

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/b272ca84-6292-4d1a-81a8-4b14bc4d7e01n%40googlegroups.com.

Steve Haynal

unread,

Oct 26, 2021, 12:51:16 AM10/26/21

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Chis,

The relays on the N2ADR board are static between RX and TX except for the LPF relay. Depending on your software that relay may switch the low pass filter in during RX. But you can set software to never switch the LPF in. If you configure it that way and still see the problem, then it is K7 on the HL2. An alternate for the Omron relay is:

EC2-3NU

We used that before switching to the Omron when it became harder to find. I may not have enough data, but my feeling is that there were less problems with that relay.

73,

Steve

kf7o

Vince Vielhaber

unread,

Oct 26, 2021, 12:54:58 AM10/26/21

to herme...@googlegroups.com

I looked up the EC2-3NU and there was zero stock in all the US
distributors that I tried (mouser, digikey, arrow, ...). However, there
was stock of the EC2-3NJ and as close as I could tell the only
difference was lead length and that wasn't very much of a difference.

Vince - K8ZW.

>> gmail.com <http://gmail.com> about a replacement relay or repair.

>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Steve
>> kf7o
>>
>>
>> On Monday, October 18, 2021 at 1:35:24 PM UTC-7 DL2AOM wrote:
>>
>> Hello Jonathan, I also have this effect, how can I get rid of it?
>> 73 de Matthias DL2AOM
>>
>> jonathan....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 14. Oktober 2021
>> um 23:31:55 UTC+2:
>>
>> Had a strange intermittent fault on my N2ADR board develop
>> over the week where I'd loose approximately 10dB of
>> receiver sensitivity, this was easily noticeable on the
>> waterfall.
>>
>> Traced it back to K7. The screen printing on these relays
>> looks poor, a sign of Chinese cloan parts prehaps ?
>> Replaced now working fine.
>>
>> Anyone else had relays go bad ?
>>
>> Jonathan G2HFR
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>> send an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/b272ca84-6292-4d1a-81a8-4b14bc4d7e01n%40googlegroups.com

>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/b272ca84-6292-4d1a-81a8-4b14bc4d7e01n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com

> <mailto:hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com>.

> To view this discussion on the web visit

> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/543c929e-3d18-425e-bc53-f935c853044bn%40googlegroups.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/543c929e-3d18-425e-bc53-f935c853044bn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.

--
Michigan VHF Corporation -- nobucks dot net
K8ZW - http://www.hamradio.fun

Steve Haynal

unread,

Oct 26, 2021, 12:56:06 AM10/26/21

to Hermes-Lite

Yes the J should be fine.

Chris Gerber

unread,

Oct 26, 2021, 4:43:30 AM10/26/21

to herme...@googlegroups.com

Hi Steve

Here the relais setting pics of my three programms in use

Seen the problem with Console.

I am watching it now.

73 Chris

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/543c929e-3d18-425e-bc53-f935c853044bn%40googlegroups.com.

Relais Console.JPG

Relais HPSDR.JPG

Relais Thetis.JPG

Steve Haynal

unread,

Oct 31, 2021, 10:23:19 PM10/31/21

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Chris,

Your settings look good. If you disable the LPF (column 6 if starting from 0, or column 7 is starting from 1) on some other bands like you already do for 160M and the problem goes away, then it is most likely a N2ADR relay. If the problem stays, then it is most likely the HL2 TR.

73,

Steve

kf7o

Mike Brown

unread,

Apr 14, 2022, 3:03:56 PM4/14/22

to Hermes-Lite

Unfortunately my N2ADR board has the same attenuation problem when the high pass filter is in circuit. Neither EC2-3NU nor EC2-3NJ seem to be in stock anywhere. Any other suggestions, other than a new board from Makerfabs?

73

Mike

G4RAA

Duncan Clark

unread,

Apr 14, 2022, 5:38:03 PM4/14/22

to herme...@googlegroups.com

In message <2443f061-7571-414d...@googlegroups.com>,
Mike Brown writes

>Neither EC2-3NU nor EC2-3NJ seem to be in stock anywhere

Has to be Omron?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124075169477?hash=item1ce374d6c5:g:UyIAAOSwZ3t
ePVX2

Also Digikey UK - 796 in stock

Duncan
--
Duncan Clark
G4ELJ

Mike Brown

unread,

Apr 14, 2022, 6:55:51 PM4/14/22

to Hermes-Lite

Thanks Duncan. I don't know whether there are any differences between NEC-Kemet and Omron relays but the wiki photo shows NEC relays. My board has Omron relays. Steve didn't mention why production had switched to Omron but I can't find them listed anywhere, not even on Omron's UK website.

I'm wary about buying from Ebay as there are so many fakes but it may come to that.

I'm not sure what you're seeing at Digikey I'd already checked there and as far as I can see they are still showing '0 stock' of the (Kemet) EC2-3NU and don't seem to recognise the EC2-3NJ (https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/kemet/EC2-3NU/4291108)

If you can find them on the Digikey website could you send a link please?

Best 73

Mike

G4RAA

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/hermes-lite/sksq5-31d30/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/MQOHHIB1PJWiFwya%40ntlworld.com.

Message has been deleted

Bob Edwards

unread,

Apr 27, 2022, 6:33:43 AM4/27/22

to Hermes-Lite

Just as a warning to others: I too am having an issue with HL2 relays with receiver gain varying when going from transmit to receive by up to 12dB. Bumping the enclosure fairly hard clears the problem temporarily. My unit was purchased 24/1/21 from Makerfabs and is fitted with relays marked OMRON 2113N1 G6S-2 3VDC. 'Enabling the filter board' checked or unchecked makes no difference to the problem in 'SDR Console' so it may be the transmit/receive relay on the main board. I've just contacted Makerfabs. Will probably have to replace all the relays - they all look identical.

Bob Edwards

unread,

Apr 27, 2022, 11:45:08 AM4/27/22

to Hermes-Lite

Reason for failure? - (a) Could be fake parts (b) Could be inappropriate contact material for this application (c) Could have been contaminated / damaged by the PCB cleaning process.

I'm thinking of asking an old work colleague if he'd mind taking the boards in and having the relays removed by the production department where I used to work. I don't have that much in the way of desoldering equipment , solder-wick, a manual solder sucker and a flux pen is about it.

Mike Brown

unread,

Apr 27, 2022, 1:21:56 PM4/27/22

to Bob Edwards, Hermes-Lite

Hi Bob, sorry to hear you have a similar problem. I may be completely wrong about this but it is just possible there is a temporary fix.

It took me ages to find a datasheet for the OMRON relays (the datasheet isn't branded OMRON but the product photo shows OMRON on the relays). It looks as though the Kemet relays in the original filter board design & BOM have gold plated contacts but the OMRON ones only have silver. (I haven't checked the HL2 board BOM.) Ideally a wetting current would pass through the HPF in RX mode to keep the contacts from developing a film on them. It looks as though the TRX relay is operating under similar conditions in RX, although would be warmer due to PA proximity so maybe a little less prone to problems.

I'd already tried re-soldering the HPF relay joints to no avail. I'd also made a half-hearted attempt at removal, using a solder sucker to clear solder from the pins, by the time I discovered the relay contact metal issue. I have just resoldered the relay and used a multimeter set to the 200 ohm range to pass a little current through the normally closed contacts of the relay (which I assume are the RX mode contacts). I'd measured the meter output voltage & current with another meter and it puts out about 2.6v at about 0.16mA, so I hoped it just might clear the film. Having put the meter across the contacts a few times I put the filter board back in my HL2 and it is now working fine. I have no way of knowing whether my re-soldering, the multimeter current or dumb luck did the trick of course, nor any idea how long it might last.

I wonder whether a short blast of low power TX RF through the HPF occasionally might help. (Looks like this could easily be done by ticking the appropriate J16 TX box unless the software knows better and inhibits it anyway.) The matching impedance may be off so it could be a bit risky I suppose, although those PA transistors seem very rugged.

Unless I've misread the circuit it looks like it might be possible to pass a little DC current through the TRX relay on the HL2 board by using the RF3 connection and the centre pin of RF2. Both appear to have capacitors in the way of signal paths.

Best 73

Mike

G4RAA

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7793be86-6d42-4b14-8685-0e6833975407n%40googlegroups.com.

Mike Brown

unread,

Apr 29, 2022, 6:42:04 PM4/29/22

to Hermes-Lite

Sadly my temporary fix didn't last. I decided to try to passing low TX power through the HPF filter but both SparkSDR and Thetis seem to block this action. Unfortunately life is very busy at present so I have not had time to investigate further. As I wasn't 100% confident of replacing a relay without damaging the filter board I took the precaution of ordering a new board while they were still available. This arrived and works fine, so I definitely know the problem is with the original filter board and isn't power supply-related.

73

Mike

G4RAA

Juergen Hussels

unread,

Apr 30, 2022, 4:32:51 AM4/30/22

to Hermes-Lite

As silver is not really oxidizing, it's a reaction of hydrogen sulfide with silver, you need to reduce the amount of hydrogen sulfide in the air of your shack.

You may wan't to keep the emissions under control. :-)

To be serious again: thanks for the updates - I will keep an eye on the relays and keep in mind, that there are gold platted variants available. And I will behave myself.

73

Juergen

Mike Brown

unread,

Apr 30, 2022, 3:52:03 PM4/30/22

to Hermes-Lite

I found time to do a few tests and can report the following:

As I suspected, the relay is NOT energised when the HPF is in circuit and no volts are being applied to my relay in this situation. Clearly the problem cannot be due to power or drive circuitry.

I measured the DC resistance between the NC contacts on both sides of the faulty relay. One side measured around 1.5 ohms. The other side varied between 1.5 and 350 ohms. The pinouts are numbered strangely on both the Kemet and G6S datasheets but pins 9 - 10 measured 1.5 ohms, 3-4 measured the variable values.

I measured the same terminals on a good OMRON G6S relay in a new filter board. Both pairs of contacts consistently measured 0.3 ohms.

Finally I measured a new Kemet relay, which allegedly has gold contacts. Both NC contacts measured 0.2 ohms. Some of this will be due to test lead/meter/contact resistance but the difference is clear.

While it may be possible to clean up the contacts in the faulty relay I think I'll be crunching it to pieces, removing the leads from the board and fitting the Kemet relay. I will probably buy a spare in case the TRX relay goes the same way. The LPF relays all pass full RF power so seem less likely to suffer contact problems. (But I had my fingers crossed as I typed that!)

73

Mike

G4RAA

Bob Edwards

unread,

May 1, 2022, 5:38:43 AM5/1/22

to Hermes-Lite

The Multus Proficio sdr is an excellent little 160m-10m radio that uses kemet EC2 12NU relays for filter switching. I've never had contact problems with this radio over the years of use I've given it. Kemet EC2 contacts are specified as silver alloy with gold alloy overlay, so given that experience, I'll be going for EC2 3NU relays - when they're back in stock in the UK in June that is!

The alternative to relay destruction to allow individual pins be desoldered is to make a clamp-on dil desoldering block for your soldering iron. Getting all 8 Pb-free joints hot enough is the key to pulling the relay(s) off gently. I'll be interested in how easily the relays are dismantled apart, though.

Matthew

unread,

May 1, 2022, 6:10:22 AM5/1/22

to Hermes-Lite

I don't want to teach anyone to suck eggs here but...

Trying to remove the relays by unsoldering each pin will likely result in frustration and possible damage to the PCB. If you have a heat gun, I would try to raise the PCB to around 150 deg C for 30 seconds and then a quick blast of hot air at around 350 deg C. The relay should just fall out. If your hot air gun has a wide spread and you are worried about heating other parts, then you can put a baking(aluminum) foil mask around the PCB and cut out a hole just for the relay. This should spread the heat out on areas you don't want to desolder.

Alternatively (and I have just looked at the board to check this approach), flood the relay pins in the underside of the board with lots of solder, bridging the pins, then working the iron between the pools of solder and let gravity drop the relay out. At no point should you have to force/pull the relay out. Clean up with solder braid (and likely some IPA to remove the flux residue). (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jpotpIO1-U). I would recommended this approach out of the two.

73 Matthew M5EVT.

Mike Brown

unread,

May 1, 2022, 9:24:53 AM5/1/22

to Hermes-Lite

Thanks Matthew, very helpful. I'm wary of using my heat gun as the risk of dislodging other components seems high. I'll give the solder puddle suggestion a go though.

73

Mike

G4RAA

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/hermes-lite/sksq5-31d30/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/c259d61d-b957-4f18-9ac2-736a4372ffb7n%40googlegroups.com.

Message has been deleted

DL2AOM

unread,

May 1, 2022, 11:26:40 AM5/1/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hello Steve,
Today I had the K2 relay replaced, as suspected it was defective. The contact resistance was around 200 ohms.
To be on the safe side, we also changed relay K7 on the filter circuit board. Now my HL2 works perfectly. Thank you for your help.
73 de Mat DL2AOM

Mike Brown

unread,

May 3, 2022, 6:50:54 AM5/3/22

to Hermes-Lite

I replaced my filter board's K7 OMRON relay with a shiny new Kemet relay, which seems to be working well.

I used the 'puddle of solder' method to remove the relay but it was difficult linking the coil pins with solder. The puddle ended up covering the entire relay before I could get it to drop out. This was fine as I had the board clamped in a jig but I wouldn't try it unless the board was perfectly level.

Of course when I measure the contact resistance of the old relay it is now fine. Presumably it liked the pins being heated to 250C+...

73

Mike

G4RAA

On Sun, 1 May 2022 at 16:25, DL2AOM <dl2...@online.de> wrote:

Hello Steve,
Today I had the OMRON K2 relay replaced, as suspected it was defective. The contact resistance was around 200 ohms.

To be on the safe side, we also changed relay K7 on the filter circuit board. Now my HL2 works perfectly. Thank you for your help.
73 de Mat DL2AOM

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed50166d5n%40googlegroups.com.

Steve Haynal

unread,

May 14, 2022, 1:36:48 AM5/14/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Group,

Sorry to hear of problems with the OMRON relay. We switched to these a few years ago as they were easier to obtain. There have been more problems with this relay. On paper they had better specs than the older relay. Makerfabs is careful to source quality parts, and I don't think they are counterfeit. Maybe they are just more prone to breaking or more sensitive to heat during assembly.

Replacement part number which are known to work are:

EC2-3NU
EC2-3NJ
G6S-2-Y

The EC2 relays are available on www.aliexpress.com. You can also check www.octopart.com our www.findchips.com for stock.

Is there a volunteer willing to buy 30 or so replacement relays:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1891669531.html

and send them out to people who may need one? I will reimburse expenses from the R&D and repair funds.

73,

Steve
kf7o

bill

unread,

May 14, 2022, 5:23:38 PM5/14/22

to Hermes-Lite

Steve,

I can do that, at least for folks in the United States. I will order thirty and let you know when they arrive.

73 Bill K7WXW

Steve Haynal

unread,

May 14, 2022, 5:25:50 PM5/14/22

to bill, Hermes-Lite

I think JP has already ordered 35.

73,

Steve

kf7o

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e13b63n%40googlegroups.com.

Steve Haynal

unread,

May 15, 2022, 1:04:43 AM5/15/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hi All,

Three people volunteered to help with relay distribution. Bill K7WXW, Vince K8ZW, and JP KC9KKO. I think JP may have already ordered 35 from TTI. I received some private e-mail and some group messages. I suggest we keep discussion on the group so everyone can coordinate. I am happy to work with either of you or all three. I will reimburse for any out of pocket expenses (cost of relays, shipping, handling, packaging, etc.). It is your time you are volunteering (the most valuable contribution) and is most appreciated.

73,

Steve

kf7o

Pencoys

unread,

May 16, 2022, 8:54:42 PM5/16/22

to Steve Haynal, herme...@googlegroups.com

I have ordered 30 EC2-3NU and can supply to group members in Europe/UK
73 Mike G8NXD

<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/c259d61d-b957-4f18-9ac2-736a4372
ffb7n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>>>> .

>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
>>>> Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/hermes-lite/sksq5-31d30/unsubscribe.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
>>>> hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
>>>>
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed5016
6d5n%40googlegroups.com
>>>>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed501
66d5n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>>> .

>>>>
>>> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Hermes-Lite" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e13
b63n%40googlegroups.com
>

<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e1
3b63n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> .

>

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Hermes-Lite" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email
to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/CAPmdav9eLhd_1HLOBmGVr2p47aRiw31T
MWXrnbPdqT5By9%2BY6Q%40mail.gmail.com.

Steve Haynal

unread,

May 17, 2022, 1:04:44 AM5/17/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Mike and JP,

Thanks for volunteering to provide replacement relays, Mike in the UK and EU, and JP in North America. Please let me know your out of pocket expenses and I will reimburse you.

73,

Steve

kf7o

Pencoys

unread,

May 17, 2022, 2:50:11 AM5/17/22

to Franz Schöning, herme...@googlegroups.com

Gm Franz, I have yet to receive the relays from the distributor. If you keep
watching the list I'll announce when they are available. How many do you
need?.

I'm hoping that I'll receive them in about a weeks time and I have to have a
conversation with Steve to establish the distribution parameters, i.e. who
covers postage etc...

I'm afraid patience is the watchword at the moment, but I'm reminded of the
four liverpudlian vultures in the Disney film 'The jungle book' where one
vulture with a beatles haircut says " Forget patience, I want to kill
something"...
73 Mike G8NXD qthr

On 17 May 2022 at 8:27, Franz Schöning wrote:

Hi Mike,

Thanks so much for this. How can i order the relay from you please? Im am
in germany.

Br,
Franz
DO3PBE

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/c259d61d-b957-4f18-9ac2-736a4372
> ffb7n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer

>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/c259d61d-b957-4f18-9ac2-736a4372
ffb7n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> >
> >>>>>> .
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
> >>>> Google Groups "Hermes-Lite" group.
> >>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit

> >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/hermes-lite/sksq5-31d30/unsubscribe
> .
> >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
> >>>> hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
> >>>>
> >>> To view this discussion on the web visit
> >>>>
>
>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed5016
> 6d5n%40googlegroups.com

>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed501
66d5n%40googlegroups.com>
> >>>>
> <
>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed501
> 66d5n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/7186fa37-0f6d-4749-b1f4-003ed501
66d5n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> >
> >>>> .
> >>>>
> >>> --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Hermes-Lite" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> > email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
> > To view this discussion on the web visit
> >
>
>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e13
> b63n%40googlegroups.com
>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e1
3b63n%40googlegroups.com>
> >
> <
>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e1
> 3b63n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer

>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/73638389-85c5-4977-823c-9a9793e1
3b63n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> >
> > .
> >
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Hermes-Lite" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email
> to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
>
>
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/CAPmdav9eLhd_1HLOBmGVr2p47aRiw31T
> MWXrnbPdqT5By9%2BY6Q%40mail.gmail.com.
>

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Hermes-Lite" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to hermes-lite...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/62809FF4.29754.19F69E%40pencoys.g
mail.com
> .
>

Glenn Holt

unread,

May 20, 2022, 10:55:12 AM5/20/22

to pen...@gmail.com, Steve Haynal, herme...@googlegroups.com

Hi Mike,

Could I please order 4 from you?

My email is good on QRZ

Regards

Glenn Holt
G8NOF
07855 959498

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/62809FF4.29754.19F69E%40pencoys.gmail.com.

jpwa...@gmail.com

unread,

May 21, 2022, 7:09:17 PM5/21/22

to Hermes-Lite

Steve, Mike, Vince and Bill,

The replacement relays have arrived Stateside.

..jpw J P Watters

KC9KKO

Morris, IL USA

1E894BC8-D703-4B37-B5C2-5CC4742B3B0D_1_105_c.jpeg

Juergen Sturhahn

unread,

Jun 30, 2022, 12:03:21 PM6/30/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hi Mike,

I have 2 units, one I bought in early 2021, the second one in October 2021. The problem I have is that the noisefloor of the unit I have got from Makerfabs in October 2021 has a noisefloor about 30 dB higher then the unit I have bought earlier, i.e. a drastically reduced sensitivity (same settings of SparkSDR for both devices, same Firmware 73p2, same antenna etc.). Therefore the second device is more or less useless. As I am not an expert at all in doing a failure analysis I wonder if such a huge difference could be caused by a defective relay on the mainboard or not (filter settings make not any difference, the reduction in sensitivity is stable). If so I would like to get a replacement relay as well if this is still possible.

I am adding two pictures I have sent to Makerfabs (the difference in time was caused by the time needed to change the cables from one unit to the other).

Makerfabs was only able to offer to return the unit and reimburse the money I have paid, but they don't want or can't provide any repair as they have told me. As I am not so much interested in getting my money back but more to have a good working second HL II or get the HL II repaired I would appreciate any help I can get from the group.

73

Juergen, DL8LE

ScreenShot_20220622201332.jpeg

ScreenShot_20220622201106.jpeg

Joel Caulkins

unread,

Aug 4, 2022, 11:50:08 AM8/4/22

to Hermes-Lite

Hi all,

I have a MakerFabs kit Hermes Lite II that I think may be exhibiting the bad relays problem. For the last couple of days the background noise will be real low until I press the PTT button a few times and then the volume level comes up to normal, does this sound like a bad relay? Which one on what board? I hope it doesn't require changing all of them.

Joel

N6ALT

Tom Cooleen

unread,

Aug 4, 2022, 11:59:02 AM8/4/22

to Hermes-Lite

I brought a few of the relays at the beginning of the summer from MOUSER. They took around 30 days to deliver, as they were OOS at the time - but wanted a few to have as I have a few of the HL2 / N2ADR kits that I use.

These are like $2 each, and typically either OMRON or KEMET. Not advocating for either brand - but was ordering a few other non-related items, and grabbed these just in case. Looks like they are sitting on stock.

73's

Tom, K2TC

Joel Caulkins

unread,

Aug 12, 2022, 10:07:52 AM8/12/22

to Hermes-Lite

I have gathered some more information that might mean something to someone. My Hermes Lite II works perfectly all day long except...... first thing every morning when apply power to the radio the receiver is attenuated about half, I can hear strong stations and the volume is lower than I left it the day before, all I have to do is just click the PTT once very quickly and everything comes to life and will never do it again until the next power cycle. If the TR relay was going bad you would think it would give some indication throughout the day but it doesn't, works perfect. Anyone have a idea what might be going on here?

Joel

N6ALT

johng...@gmail.com

unread,

Oct 16, 2022, 11:02:06 AM10/16/22

to Hermes-Lite

I have a Hermes Lite 2 with all NEC/Kemet relays and I too am experiencing receive attenuation after transmit. It is intermittent but frequent enough to be very annoying. I have ordered 2 new relays from Mouser and we'll see if the silkcreening on the new relays is the same. The originals don't look crisp to me. More importantly this problem is apparently not limited to Omron.

John

KC9OJV

jpwa...@gmail.com

unread,

Oct 16, 2022, 11:44:57 PM10/16/22

to Hermes-Lite

John,

Attached is a the silkscreen on the relays that I have. I bought a few when we saw that they were getting hard to get.

I can send you a couple if you let me know that is what you need.

..jpw

JP Watters

KC9KKO

Morris, IL

johng...@gmail.com

unread,

Oct 30, 2022, 3:42:34 PM10/30/22

to Hermes-Lite

Thanks for the offer John. Relays are changed and the Hermes Lite is working fine now. I'm slightly suspicious that the originals were clones although I crushed them removing them and the internal parts looked like quality to me but the silkscreen was not as nice as the new ones I installed.

John

KC9OJV

Rolandas LY0NAS

unread,

Dec 2, 2022, 7:59:05 AM12/2/22

to Hermes-Lite

I also have intermittent problem with my T/R relay (OMRON) from HL2 build9. I found temporary solution to use Hermes Lite 2 upside down - this way relay goes to RX mode reliably (relay works under board, not over as usual - so gravity helps).

J P Watters

unread,

Dec 2, 2022, 10:19:12 AM12/2/22

to rol...@gmail.com, Hermes-Lite

Pencoys pen...@gmail.com

..jpw J P Watters

KC9KKO

Morris, IL USA

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/03ee7337-253d-4289-9900-23b4a44e7bb5n%40googlegroups.com.

DJ9FBA Franz

unread,

Feb 16, 2024, 11:25:16 AM2/16/24

to Hermes-Lite

Hello everyone, I bought a Hermeslite 2 with n2adr filterboard from makerfabs a week ago and the filterboard showed that the relays clicked even when changing the band. After two days the clicking noises were no longer audible. Is the filterboard defective. 73 de dj9fba.

DJ9FBA Franz

unread,

Feb 16, 2024, 11:25:16 AM2/16/24

to Hermes-Lite

Hello everyone, I bought a Hermeslite 2 with n2adr filterboard from makerfabs a week ago and the filterboard showed that the relays clicked even when changing the band. After two days the clicking noises were no longer audible. Is the filterboard defective. 73 dedj9fba.

jpwa...@gmail.com schrieb am Freitag, 2. Dezember 2022 um 16:19:12 UTC+1:

Ed Grafton

unread,

Feb 16, 2024, 12:20:45 PM2/16/24

to Hermes-Lite

While playing with settings, you may have changed something. Settings/PA Settings Hermeslite

When changing settings, do you save them to a "Transmit profile" Settings/Transmit/Profile/Save

Ed

Ron Lewkowicz

unread,

Feb 16, 2024, 2:10:18 PM2/16/24

to Hermes-Lite

Have you tested using different SDR software such as Quisk or SparkSDR?

Phil

unread,

Feb 16, 2024, 8:04:35 PM2/16/24

to Hermes-Lite

Just a thought, I had similar problems with a magnetic loop tuner, turned out the relay was clicking and seemed to actuate but in reality the relay coil wasn’t getting enough current to close properly. Amongst the group who had built the tuner some were working correctly but a few experienced the problem. I modified the relay drive circuitry and the problem was solved. Is it possible that the relays aren’t getting sufficient current to properly close?

DJ9FBA Franz

unread,

Feb 18, 2024, 2:01:19 AM2/18/24

to Hermes-Lite

Hello thanks for the quick answer, I contacted makerfabs to find a solution to the problem and moved it to Google groups. How can I test the function of the n2adr filterboard? where can I find the measuring points or test pins? SCL and SDA switches the band selection. Unfortunately?, I don't have an oscilloscope to measure. Maybe this can also be done with a NANOVNA. With SparkSDR and Quisk you don't hear any switching noises from the filter board. You can hear a click of the relay from the Hermes board when you press the PTT when the LED jumps to TX. 73 de dj9fba

John Williams

unread,

Feb 18, 2024, 7:02:29 AM2/18/24

to DJ9FBA Franz, Hermes-Lite

What software are you using?

If Thetis, it will modify the relay selection depending on the status of VFO A and VFO B. It does this to maximize the band selection for receive. It will select the band based on the highest value. Set VFO B to 160M band then vary VFO A to see if the clicking returns. You can open up the dialog for the OC control and see the status of the 7 hardware signals for band selection. As you change bands, and VFO B is set to a low frequency, you will see those values changing during band selection. If VFO B is set to say 10M, on RX you will not see any band signal change for any value on VFO A.

John

From: herme...@googlegroups.com <herme...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of DJ9FBA Franz <dj9...@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2024 1:01 AM
To: Hermes-Lite <herme...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: Re: Bad Makerfabs "OMRON" relays

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/b2d57c60-64c0-4bcc-a3e1-74f3189be55dn%40googlegroups.com.

Mike Lewis

unread,

Feb 18, 2024, 11:13:42 AM2/18/24

to John Williams, DJ9FBA Franz, Hermes-Lite

Have you verified the OC bits pattern for the filter board correctly in each program? It may have changed.

Here it is for Quisk

In SparkSDR filter type field

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/hermes-lite/DM4PR12MB6544CCC421EC54DFA117A441A4522%40DM4PR12MB6544.namprd12.prod.outlook.com.

Steve Haynal

unread,

Feb 18, 2024, 3:14:24 PM2/18/24

to Hermes-Lite

Hello DJ9FBA,

Usually when a relay goes bad, it will affect a single band not all bands. For that reason, I'd pay close attention to what others have said about your OC bits possibly being reset. I'd also carefully check the 20x2 header which connects the HL2 to the N2ADR filter board. There is an i2c connection on that header which must be good for the filter switching to work. The TX/RX relay is independent of that connection.

With Quisk, please tune to 20M and then open the OC filter settings page shared earlier. If you change filter settings for 20M, do you hear relay clicks in real time even during receive? Please try this with the HL2 and N2ADR board removed from the case and send a picture or video. I would consider that a definitive test to distinguish if you have a true hardware problem or a software configuration problem.

73,

Steve

kf7o

DJ9FBA Franz

unread,

Feb 19, 2024, 2:01:30 AM2/19/24

to Hermes-Lite

thanks for inforfmation, this week make i a video .

follwing information gives me sdr console by reading the eeprom is that normal?:

Creating Socket
Socket .......: x00003A0C
Reuseaddr ....: True, ✓
Recv timeout .: 500ms, ✓
Send timeout .: 500ms, ✓
Blocking .....: Enable, ✓

Binding
Address .: 0.0.0.0
Port ....: 20001
Created ......: ✓

Read EEPROM address x06
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x0A
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x0B
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x0C
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x0D
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

⚠ EEPROM is empty

DJ9FBA Franz

unread,

Feb 19, 2024, 3:49:13 AM2/19/24

to Hermes-Lite

write eeprom also error

:

Write EEPROM address x08 = xC0, Call 1 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x08 = xC0, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x08 = xC0, Call 2 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x08 = xC0, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x08 = xC0, Call 3 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x08 = xC0, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x08 = xC0, Call 4 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x08 = xC0, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x08 = xC0, Call 5 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x08
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x08 = xC0, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x09 = xA8, Call 1 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x09 = xA8, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x09 = xA8, Call 2 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x09 = xA8, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x09 = xA8, Call 3 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x09 = xA8, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x09 = xA8, Call 4 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x09 = xA8, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x09 = xA8, Call 5 of 5

Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed
Read EEPROM address x09
Read error 10060, Connection timed out.
Return = x00, status Failed

Write x09 = xA8, Failed ✗

Write EEPROM address x0A = x03, Call 1 of 5