Hermes-Lite 2 Schematics and BOM

[Steve Haynal]

Hi List,

I've started a new page with Hermes-Lite 2 information here. This includes a BOM which I'd appreciate feedback on. (The GitHub wiki table is a bit frustrating as you have to scroll the BOM left to right at the bottom of the page.) I have a set of scripts and simple databases that allow me to specify multiple manufacturers and scrape multiple suppliers with www.octopart.com and then generate BOMs in various formats. The posted BOM prefers only Digi-Key or Mouser. Although the schematics are not 100% complete (some missing components), this BOM should be within $5 dollars of the expected price for those who build a HL2 with Digi-Key/Mouser parts. The total price is a little higher than I'd like, ~$193 without shipping, but it does include everything - enclosure, PA, programmer, etc. Some people will have parts on hand, or find less expensive sources. If we find legitimate suppliers in China for single quantities, I suspect this price can go down to between $160 and $170. I also may sell the parts not available from Mouser or Digi-Key bundled with the PCBs on Tindie so that people only have to order from 2 or 3 sources.

At the bottom of the page are part count totals. At just under 400 components, this will be quite a challenging project to hand build. Maybe we can fix the solder paste mask footprints and have a few steel stencils to share.

At the bottom of the page are pin count totals. Places in China often price small batch assembly by total pin counts. For example, www.elecrow.com charges $0.03 per SMT pin and $0.04 per through hole pin. Such an assembly would cost just under $40 per board in small quantities of 10 to 20 with discounts probably starting at 50 and higher. There is also www.smallbatchassembly.com, but their online instant quote doesn't accept more than 35 line items. Even at 35 line items, assembly is around $100 per board for quantities of 10. I have also used local-to-me ZelPro solutions, but their prices will be higher.

I eventually hope to run batches of 50 or 100 units. This will provide some quantity discount on parts and assembly. I'm hoping that the final price of such units will be in the low $200 range, a bit less than the Red Pitaya but will include PA, filters, enclosure, etc. There will still be some components labeled MTH for manual through hole on the BOM that buyers would have to install to complete the build. For example 30 components if you use toroids for the filter inductors, but closer to 10 if we have SMT inductor alternatives.

How do people feel about these prices? I think the closest competition is the Red Pitaya, which after you add filters, PA and enclosure, would probably be just over $400 total. 

73,

Steve

KF7O

 

[Bill Barnes, N3JIX]

Price is good for how complex it is.  I am very interested.

73, de Bill, N3JIX

[Heikki Ahola]

Hi,

Tks for the description and all the detailed data provided ! As I am vy pleased with my current V1.22 setup, I am also more than interested in the new design. It is good to get rid of the Bemicro dependence. 

Some questions and comments:

1) How many different PCB:s have You planned ? I would imagine that most components are in the main board and the PA in another one.

2) I am mostly interested in the "core" system (AD9866, FPGA, Ethernet, clock etc) as all front end stuff and the PA I can manage on my own.

3) It would be great to have this kind of an option, no enclosure is needed either because I prefer my bigger than compact cabinets (see the Gallery).

4) The idea of preassembled components is fine with me although can manage 0805 size stuff with little pain. It will take time but the winter nights are long up here ! Therefore, personally I would need only the "difficult" components to be preassembled, but  will certainly consider other options, too. 

The price below $200 is reasonable although I would not need all the components listed, but some extras are always good to have !

73 de Heikki (OH2LZI)

[James Ahlstrom]

Hello Steve,

I think the price is very good because so much is included (enclosure, PA).  In my case, I would probably assemble HL2 as an instrument.

BTW, I am going away on a three week trip, so I will disappear for a while.  I am going to Europe, but since it is August, it may be closed.

Jim

N2ADR

[Alan Hopper]

Steve,

As Jim says I think the price is fine considering you are getting a real multi band hf radio. I think you are still in softrock territory in terms of total cost of ownership but with all the ddc/multi receiver goodness.  The more I think about the combined solution the more I like it, the saving on board space and connectors is significant and I believe something that can be used 'as is' is key to general take up. 

Jim,

If you find Europe closed you will be very welcome in the new UK which is very much open!

73 Alan 2E0NNB 

[pascal.v...@gmail.com]

Hi Steve,

I agree with the price. My first 6.3 Softrock with all the necessary  add-on, usb sound card, filters, amplifiers, connectors, wires and boxes has costed much more than 200€. 

Jim : don't forget to visit Brittany coast, we are opened !

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Heikki,

There is one main PCB planned now. Additional better filtering may be on a second board. There will be an option to build this as just an instrument without filters or PA. Having just one board does increase the size (10by15cm versus 10by10cm) and cost (+$1.18 per board) slightly, but I think it is the better compromise versus the expense of two boards with connectors. People who build their own can use whatever enclosure they like. There will be mounting holes on the PCB. I am looking into various options for partial assembly. Once I have any assembly done, it is often not much more to just have most of it assembled. 

73,

Steve

KF7O

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Jim,

If you will be in Munich you can meet up with Claudio and pick up some extra PA test boards!

73,

Steve

KF7O

[James Ahlstrom]

Hello Steve,

No, actually we are going to Ireland for a wedding, then the Republic of Georgia for a birding trip, then Spain on the way home.

Jim

[Glenn P]

Steve, missing from the BOM is the size or smd package of the parts. Is it possible to add this in future.  

It would also be 'nice' to have the BOM in Xcel format so that a sort of values could be undertaken to make sure one orders enough of each part.


glenn

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Glenn,

The SMD package sizes should be in the "Spec" column. You may have to scroll to the left to see it. You can also click on the manufacturer's part number and that will take you to the octopart search page which includes the size. My scripts will eventually generate BOMs various formats, so PDF and Excel will come eventually.

73,

Steve

KF7O

[airp...@gmail.com]

Having recently built a couple of mcHF units as a reference, this looks pretty reasonable. Those are self-contained quadrature rigs on 2 boards using an ARM MCU and display; offhand, I'd say they're comparable in complexity and cost (about $225 per unit, 40-60 hours assembly). Given that this is a DDC design, it's right about where I need it to be.

I missed out on 1.2...once the boards become available, I'd like to try one. It'll get my head into some stuff I really want to learn at a cost I can cope with.

The QFPs will be tricky to attach, though.

</sc>

[Pete Smith N4ZR]

Gosh yes, Steve - I've been trying to get the RP to work as a receiver for CW Skimmer Server (for the RBN), and it has proven to be quite a challenge.  The sensitivity varies by as much as 30 dB from 3.5 to 30 MHx, and I've been told that the input impedance covers a similar range (or maybe it is the same phenomenon, differently experienced.  In any case, it seems inevitable that add-ons will be needed, and I think your all-up cost estimate is, if anything, low.

I'm still hoping that, when you guys finish V 2.0, someone will produce either partially assembled or completely assembled versions, because we would love to make it the default receiver for Reverse Beacons, now that the QS1R seems to be history.

73, Pete N4ZR
Download the new N1MM Logger+ at 
<http://N1MM.hamdocs.com>. Check 
out the Reverse Beacon Network at 
<http://reversebeacon.net>, now 
spotting RTTY activity worldwide. 
For spots, please use your favorite 
"retail" DX cluster.

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[Glenn P]

Steve
I am not seeing Spec column in HermesLiteBOM.pdf

I see Designator Quantity Value/Description Mouser DigiKey Other Total Price Comments

Glenn
vk3pe

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Glenn,

The new current BOM is on a wiki page here. I've removed the old BOMs from google drive and github to avoid confusion. Eventually there will be current BOMs in Excel and PDF format in github.

73,

Steve

KF7O

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Pete,

I'm happy to hear that the HL1.22/CVA9 combination you borrowed worked well when skimming 6-7 bands at 192 kHz. Your report on the Red Pitaya is also interesting. 

How many slice receivers do you like for RBN purposes? The CVA9 you used is capable of 32, but the Cyclone IV on the HL2 will support 3 (4 without TX) easily, and maybe a few more with some work. Do you require only 192 kHz maximum for each slice receiver? Do you have any current or planned requirement for TX? How many units would RBN purchase? What host computer do you typically use? Will Gigabit-only be okay?

If RBN is interested in enough units (10 or more in the low $200 per unit since these would be early models), it may be beneficial to develop a RX-only version (no PA, TX filters, etc.) first and quickly to work out any issues with the new Ethernet, FPGA and power supply, before extending it to include the PA and TX filters. An order of 10+ such boards (after verifying 1 or 2 working prototypes) would let me work out problems with having these built in the Silicon Delta. You could then have additional batches of this RX-only version built in the Silicon Delta in small batches at anytime you like and for a lower direct cost. The time frame for this would hopefully be by the end of the year. What do you think?

73,

Steve

KF7O

[Glenn P]

Steve

https://github.com/softerhardware/Hermes-Lite/tree/v2.0/hardware/hl

Both of the pdf files there bring up a Schematic. No BOM I can see.

Other entries say 'added BOM' or 'removed BOM' but they are .sch files. Am i missing something here?

glenn
vk3pe

[Steve Haynal]

Hi Glenn,

The link in my last post directs people to:

https://github.com/softerhardware/Hermes-Lite/tree/v2.0

There is no BOM file to download; the BOM is part of that page. You may have to scroll down to see it, then scroll the BOM table left or right to see all the columns.

73,

Steve

KF7O

[Glenn P]

thanks Steve....didn't look down the page!   Sorry.

[Steve Haynal]

Just to keep the list up to date, I've private correspondence with Pete regarding this. The summary is that given the cost of the host PC, they are deploying 1 or 2 at a time, not 10+. They do make use of 6-7 slice receivers with the Q1SR. The makers of the Q1SR are planning a next model with better performance and lower cost which should be a good choice for RBN.

73,

Steve

KF7O