I want to build a MURS repeater. Also HAMs save lives.

[Ryan Mcdermott]

tl;dr - I want to build a MURS repeater to interface with Burning Man's 911 system.  How?

Here's a story that happened last year at Burning Man:

The Emergency Services Group at the event runs a 911 system on MURS channel 5.  Black Rock City is a BIG place, with a lot of people and no cell phone coverage, so having something like this available is a pretty big deal.

Last year, I bought a radio specifically for our camp to use for emergencies and put it in a public place with some instructions.

Towards the end of the week, somebody at a camp next door collapsed (possibly due to a heart attack), and somebody from their camp ran over to use the radio (luckily, they knew it was there).

They were able to get somebody on the line, and an ambulance came over and saved the guy's life.  DEFINITELY a success story, and an example of why radios like this, and the skills to use them, are good.

There were, however, some problems.  During build week, I had no problem communicating with ESD (I did a radio check when we first arrived), but after a bunch of structures go built between myself and the receiving station, the link got pretty shitty.  (The people using the radio to call the ambulance in the previous example climbed on top of a shipping container to get a good signal).

This year, I want to explore building a repeater, and placing it on a tall tower in our camp.

I know how repeaters work, but I've never built one, and don't really know where to start.

BUT RYAN THAT IS ILLEGAL!

No, it isn't.  Most (all?) of the rules regarding radio communications go out the window in life-saving situations.  For instance: my equipment is not type-certified for use on MURS, but the FCC allows me to use it anyway if it's a life-or-death situation.  The only concern would be if I was causing harmful interference preventing *other* people from using this system.

[Aaron Hicks]

Have you checked with Burning Man's ESD to see if perhaps they have any thoughts on the subject, seeing as they run communications and dispatch for the event?

http://burningman.org/event/volunteering/teams/emergency-services/

73's, KA3UPL

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[Larry Campbell]

Yea coordinating with them might be a good way to get a location that would not be obstructed by other camps....

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[cpr...@gmail.com]

First things first. The last thing you wish to do is create interference where there was none before.

A malfunctioning or RF leaking repeater, or one that gets stuck keyed can easily kill off a freq or have unintended consequences. MURS Channel 5 as I've read it is considered mission critical and pretty much the easiest way to do emergency comms... Could the issue you had with the radio as it was been helped with a mobile/portable telescoping antenna rig of some sort?

Find out who the hams were last year that went who you know and ask them what they think. Coordination is definitely key, and since I am a crazy mofo, you might want to actually consider proposing some sort of (OMG!) wired or semi wired solution to the emergency hotline problem, perhaps something you can program on people's cell phones to join like a SIP based wifi thing.

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[Will Bradley]

I'd lean towards just an antenna on a tall pole; you need to construct such a thing for your repeater anyway, so might as well just run a wire from the radio to the antenna and be done with it.

I normally wouldn't discourage someone from making, but running a repeater intended for emergencies requires near-constant supervision to make sure there it's not causing a problem (even non-emergency repeater operators tend to listen to them near-constantly for this purpose.)

[Ryan Mcdermott]

Does anybody have any ideas on what color it could be?  Or what I should name it?

/snark

I'd lean towards just an antenna on a tall pole; you need to construct such a thing for your repeater anyway, so might as well just run a wire from the radio to the antenna and be done with it.

I normally wouldn't discourage someone from making, but running a repeater intended for emergencies requires near-constant supervision to make sure there it's not causing a problem (even non-emergency repeater operators tend to listen to them near-constantly for this purpose.)

[cpr...@gmail.com]

Green with a beefy arm. Should be named Trogdor.

[Will Bradley]

Creating a repeater in general is a sweet idea, I just don't want your burn to turn into manning a radio 24/7 or having a life-or-death 911 call NOT go through ;)

Also, repeaters are apparently explicitly prohibited on MURS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-Use_Radio_Service

That said, here is the basic operation of a repeater:

  http://www.hamradioschool.com/introduction-to-uhfvhf-fm-repeaters/

and what seems like a good directory of ways to get started:

  http://www.repeater-builder.com/

One overriding concern during operation is being able to reliably detect when an incoming transmission is happening so that you don't key up dead air and prevent others from using the frequency (repeaters generally broadcast on dedicated frequencies to help with this) and also to prevent cross-talk and leakage between the receive and send parts of the repeater... not to mention just in general testing your gear to make sure it's not causing interference on nearby frequencies.

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[Larry Campbell]

name it stingray...

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 11:36:25 AM UTC-7, Will Bradley wrote:

Creating a repeater in general is a sweet idea, I just don't want your burn to turn into manning a radio 24/7 or having a life-or-death 911 call NOT go through ;)

Also, repeaters are apparently explicitly prohibited on MURS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-Use_Radio_Service

That said, here is the basic operation of a repeater:

  http://www.hamradioschool.com/introduction-to-uhfvhf-fm-repeaters/

and what seems like a good directory of ways to get started:

  http://www.repeater-builder.com/

One overriding concern during operation is being able to reliably detect when an incoming transmission is happening so that you don't key up dead air and prevent others from using the frequency (repeaters generally broadcast on dedicated frequencies to help with this) and also to prevent cross-talk and leakage between the receive and send parts of the repeater... not to mention just in general testing your gear to make sure it's not causing interference on nearby frequencies.

On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 9:22 AM, Ryan Mcdermott <blh...@gmail.com> wrote:

Does anybody have any ideas on what color it could be?  Or what I should name it?

/snark

I'd lean towards just an antenna on a tall pole; you need to construct such a thing for your repeater anyway, so might as well just run a wire from the radio to the antenna and be done with it.

I normally wouldn't discourage someone from making, but running a repeater intended for emergencies requires near-constant supervision to make sure there it's not causing a problem (even non-emergency repeater operators tend to listen to them near-constantly for this purpose.)

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[Frank Velo]

Depending on the radio type you have (that might provide some info) - but - antenna is key.

If its still the "included" antenna from the HT going to a larger whip or external makes a difference. 

With the included whip from my HT I can hit most local repeaters, however, if I'm using the larger whip, I have no issues hitting some repeaters (line of sight) 70 miles away. The only issue I have is with some that are north of south mountain, as I'm tucked up close to the mountain, and thats a pretty big block for me.

On Monday, April 11, 2016 at 2:24:42 PM UTC-7, Ryan McDermott wrote: